WNJB bad pic quality

[Bill D]

Anyone else with NY locals get WNJB, a PBS station out of NJ I think. The picture quality is basically like an off air antenna. Pretty much unwatchable and I can't find 'This old House' anywhere else, except an antional feed which they give me on my 4900 but not my 721, they say 4900 receiver was grandfathered. I wonder now that I think about it will the 4900 smartcard work on the 721..??

[mdrobnak]

YES!!

It has ghosting bad -- it's "clear" but with ghosts, so they have good signal, but multipath strikes again. :-(

I thought I read in the echostar knowledge base that they use a device that's supposed to kill ghosts..but, apparently not on this channel, lol.

I wonder where the antenna is for it.. I get channel 50 (WNJN) better than 58 (WNJB) -- same programming, different broadcast location. (I'm in Yonkers, NY)

Dunno what dish is going to do about it... When my OTA antenna goes up for HD, I could always run it to all the TVs (though I think cablevision carries NJN now, at a much better pq)....

-Matt

[Bill D]

I thought all must carrys had to send their signal to Dish via fiber??

[sorahl]

It could be NJB too, don't you think? I know when i had cable the picture quality for each of the NJN stations differed.

John

[Bill D]

Well I'm sure that NJB is atleast sending out a quality signal from their Head end, problem I would think is in the way it is being received since I see ghosting and many other OTA signal problems.
If NJB's signal is not strong enough then that is another issue, again I would think with must carry, the station is responsible for getting a quality signal to the provider..
I did talk to Dish adv tech about this, and they will look into supposedly. Figure I will give them another week and take a look..

[Mike123abc]

Stations just have to get the signal to the Dish reception factility. If Dish cannot pick up a station over the air, then they station has to get the signal there by some other means if they want must carry. If they are ghosting bad, it will tell me that Dish is using a regular TV antenna.

[Bill D]

Thats what I thought, must carry means you must also get them a adequate signal. Not that I'm going to but I think I can pick up better reception off a roof antenna..
The reason this is bothering me is that when I got my 721, they wouldn't give me the national PBS, even though my 4900 has it. I called several times and gotten same answer, now that I get local PBS they can't give me national. I do also get WNET, which is fine, but I'd really like national as it has everything that I want..
oh well

[cnsf]

If this is channel 21, then YES!!! I also have the same problems and officially complained.

Dish is definitely using a regular antenna here. PQ seems to be better in the evenings too...another sign it's OTA.

Anyone know how we could go about complaining to get results? besides ceo@echostar.com...

[Bill D]

I think it actually is 58 WNJB..I think 21 is WLIW, can't say I've ever checked that one out but I will.

[digital223]

RE: WNJB
WNJB Channel 58 is a affiliate channel of WNJN which is channel 50. WNJB's transmitter is approx half the power of WNJN if that means anything iI'm not sure.
I am a neubie to E*, and a few days ago dropped DTV and signed onto E*. I sub to AT150 + local channels. What a let down regarding WNJB.
Have identical problems as you are experiencing.
Called E*, their tech told me [after checking??] that the problem is WNJB not E*. I found that hard to believe, so I wrote to WNJB...........that was yesterday.......so for no answer.
The image tears and strong ghosting make it impossible to watch, Off air antenna gave me better reception.
I hope DN or NJB does someting fast. As you know a second dish was required to receive NJB and other pbs channels which are all uhf. BTW users of DTV get all the locals including WNJN in my area on an 18" dish.:confused:

[sorahl]

I know this is not the prevailing sentiment but I really think this is NJB's issue. I have never , even with an antenna, gotten a good picture from them. This station is NOT a WNET or WGBH...

[digital223]

Hey WNJB poor reception viewers.

Everybody writing in regading this problem are forgetting a very important fact .
Satellite tv signals are digital , and digital to me means GHOST and interference free........what happened ???

I received the same exact programming on WNJN [WNJN is the main PBS NJ channel, WNJB is an affiliate, or daughter station of WNJN, both broadcast the same exact programming] via DTV's local channels free preview for the last 3 months, and WNJN was crystal clear. Then why doesn't E* utilize WNJNinsted of WNJB ?
Plus when I signed on for locals with E* they never mentioned a problem with reception for any of their signals. I didn't like that when I found out how poorly NJB is.

[Mark Holtz]

Originally posted by digital223
Everybody writing in regading this problem are forgetting a very important fact .
Satellite tv signals are digital , and digital to me means GHOST and interference free........what happened ???

You are forgetting one critical element... getting the signal to the DBS's point of presence in the first place. That could mean by microwave, fiber optic TV line, or OTA signal. Unless otherwise agreed upon, it is the station's responsibility, not the DBS providers, to provide a good quality source signal at the station's expense. Once the signal is received at the pop, it is then the DBS providers responsibility to get the signal to the uplink facility and send it digitally.

[bryan27]

This is basically what the FCC has ruled in regard to Picture Quality of LIL stations. If a station meets the SIGNAL LEVEL Requirement at the POP the station is done and has met it's reqirement. If the provider is unhappy at the PICTURE QUALITY (IE: ghosts, interference, etc...) it is upto the provider to fix such problems.

The FCC has also ruled that it is not the station's responsibility to build a headend. All the station has to do is goto the POP with a simple antenna check the signal level, pack up the antenna and testing equiptment, then leave. The provider then has to put up an antenna, and install any processing equiptment (ghost killers, interference filters etc...). If the station can't get the specified signal level at the POP then the station has to purchase the specialized antenna and pre-amps.

These rulings are from a Boston Station VS DirecTV decision. The FCC has also said that an OTA signal is providing a signal source at the station's expense and that it is not the station's responsibility to build a reception device at the POP.

We know that E* doesn't care about must carry stations and chances are they aren't going to fix the picture quality of a station they don't want to carry and have placed on a side slot in the first place (out of sight out of mind).

[cnsf]

Originally posted by digital223
I found that hard to believe, so I wrote to WNJB...........that was yesterday.......so for no answer.


Can you post the write in information up here?

Thanks.

[Bill D]

It is weird that they don't just take WNJN, that comes in very nice on my father in laws roof antenna

[styxfix]

Six months ago, in the (SF/SJ) bay area CA, we lost a local PBS station (KTEH-54) from San Jose from the local channel line-up because DISH could no longer get a good signal after they moved their antenna. The PBS station can't afford to do a fiber optic line to its head. I hope the same doesn't happen to your market.

[Brett]

New Jersey Network is a state entity, operated by the New Jersey Public Broadcasting Authority. WNJB transmits from Warren Twp. NJ Somerset County and services Central NJ better than Northern NJ or NYC. In Central NJ, WNJB and WNJT come in with a paper clip very clear. Actually, one can pull all 4 NJN stations from Central NJ - Middlesex or Mercer County) and still get the Philly NYC and Allentown stations and in digital too.

According to antennaweb.org, I shall have a chance to get NYC digital channels plus WMBC-DT and I live 80 miles away! antennaweb.org is very accurate for the analog channels and it I could pick up WNJB 58 too.

WMGM the Wildwood NBC affiliate though will be beginning digital broadcasts but their intention is to only serve their city of license Wildwood Atlantic City. So even with digital, I'll have a better chance of picking up New York and North Jersey Allentown and Reading channels than a Southern NJ based channel. I suspect they dont want to cover Southern NJ well, because it will intefere with WCAU 10's coverage and the NBC Network might not renew contract agreeements with them.

It is strange why Dish chose WNJB over WNJN. It could be NJN requested WNJB for carriage on Dish, and WNJN for carriage on DirecTV. Both can be picked up in Northern NJ, just one comes in better over the other most likely.

From what I've been told is at one time (maybe 3 decades ago before I was born), NJN's idea was to have different programming at each location. However NJN doesnt have enough funding to viably do this so all NJNs carry the same programming. All 4 WNJS WNJT WNJB WNJN transmit the same NJN programming except for the legal ID at the top of the hour. Dont get confused with WNJU is T47, Telemundo recently acquired by NBC.

NJN refused to allow DirecTV to retransmit WNJN into Philadelphia DMA and made them carry WNJS also. So DirecTV is carrying NJN twice. I know of no cable system carrying 2 NJN feeds. Many Central NJ systems do carry both NY and Phillly broadcast networks and other stations, but there is differences in local advertising and programming, not just legal IDs on the hour. These cable systems carry only 1 NJN. Unfortunately, DirecTV is not offering both Philly and NYC stations in Central NJ. I suppose DirecTV should reach an agreement with the network broadcasters which request mustcarry on cable and own both sets of locals so Central NJ gets both the NYC and Philly stations. It would make Dish Net be in par with cable for those fans that want both NFL games and can receive the NFL games and newscasts on cable.

Ch. 52 was the first station, so I suppose WNJT would be the flagship. However WNJN reaches more homes and has NJN in the calls itself. NJN's studios remain in Trenton NJ. The NAB considers WNJN to be part of the Philadelphia DMA:
http://www.nab.org/Newsroom/issues/digitaltv/DTVStations.asp
Word to NAB: WNJN is in NY DMA.

According to http://www.dcrtv.net/medianyt.html Ch.58 was originally licensed to Eatontown/Asbury Park area, which is Monmouth County not Middlesex. Maybe Rabbi B French could shed more light on anything else regarding NJN.

[guest]

Evidentally E* or WNJB-tv has listened to all of DBStalk.com's unhappy sbs regarding PQ !
I live in the nyc area and if you haven't checked PQ of Channel 58 WNJB lately; please do so you'll be glad you did .
I would relly like to know who is responsible for the improved PQ E* orWNJB {WNJN}

[guest]

Evidentally E* or WNJB-tv has listened to all of DBStalk.com's unhappy subs regarding PQ !
I live in the NYC area and WNJB's PQ is now up to snuff. If you haven't checked PQ of Channel 58 WNJB lately; please do so you'll be glad you did .
I would really like to know who is responsible for the improved PQ, E* or WNJB {WNJN}