Directv installers could not find sat 119 = no dish for me???

[bender73]

hi, i am new here.

2 guys spent 4 hours at my place and they could get satellite 101, but not 119. they even went on my roof and with zero trees, could only get satellite 101. hence, they left. i called Directv and they said they were the only contract company in my area. how could they have a clear shot of the south and southwest, with no trees, and not get me Directv? i am confused.

now i am stuck with charter and no HD TBS for the sox!!!

thoughts?

...oh, and i am new to all this. he had the dish and a little mini-receiver around his neck to find the satellites

the supervisor was stumped, said "oh well" and they left. i know they tried, but i am perplexed.

[memory]

hi, i am new here.

2 guys spent 4 hours at my place and they could get satellite 101, but not 119. they even went on my roof and with zero trees, could only get satellite 101. hence, they left. i called Directv and they said they were the only contract company in my area. how could they have a clear shot of the south and southwest, with no trees, and not get me Directv? i am confused.

now i am stuck with charter and no HD TBS for the sox!!!

thoughts?

...oh, and i am new to all this. he had the dish and a little mini-receiver around his neck to find the satellites

the supervisor was stumped, said "oh well" and they left. i know they tried, but i am perplexed.

there is a very good chance they didnt have the dish skewed like it should have been to 101 and not the 119

[Stewart Vernon]

This should be in the DirecTV forum... since it is regarding DirecTV installation... but that has to bite to have an installer come out that doesn't seem to know what he is doing.

[bender73]

there is a very good chance they didnt have the dish skewed like it should have been to 101 and not the 119

is there a possibility that the edge of the building could have blocked the signal? i live in a townhouse and each unit is pushed back a little. i was thinking that the right-sided unit (more southwesterly) could be blocking the signal of 119. however, they did get 101 with 99% signal. so, i would THINK that would rule-out trees as a problem unless 119 is a lot lower. moreover, they tried the top of my roof (4 level townhouse) with no LOS problems and still could not get 119.

???

[bonscott87]

Lazy installers. Get them out again. If they still suck then I'd work it out with DirecTV to give you a credit toward paying for a *real* installer and not these freebie things. Find a local satellite/home theater company and have them do the install.

[mchaney]

Go to http://www.dishpointer.com and locate your house. You can then select the 119 satellite and it will show you the line of sight right from your very house! If you can confirm that they do have line of sight with no blockages, then one (or both) of two things happened, in order of probability: (1) your installers were idiots, or (2) they had bad equipment that just wasn't picking up the 119. Actually, if (2) is true, then (1) is true by default because they should have been able to detect bad equipment right there on site with their meter.

If you do have line of sight, I suggest calling D* back and asking for a supervisor from the get go. Tell him/her that the last people that came out couldn't even find the satellites and you want a lead tech and a new install date. Trust me, if you want to reduce your hassles, try that. My install was a nightmare and the only way I could get it done was to do half of it myself, label all the wires, and basically have everything so all they had to do was mount the dish and connect the wires... and I still have to go to the D* supervisor/lead tech installer route to get a decent job done.

Best of luck. D* installers really are horrible for the most part, but their content/quality is the best out there.
Mike

[bender73]

they left me with 8 holes (poor first mount), no dish, and the comment "Sometimes we just can't find a signal for no obvious reason."

is satellite 119 more south-westerly than 101? is it lower in the sky? are these guys just not good?

i do have trees and a possible obstruction on the right (edge of home), but they got a fantastic 101 signal. but why could they not get 119 from the darn roof 4 levels high?

[satguy22]

The 119 is the lowes sat of all at 41degrees where 101 is almost at 50 degrees. A tall building next door will block that signal. Most install companys will give you a second opion. Hope this helps.

[code4code5]

They likely didn't set the tilt of the dish as they should have.

[mchaney]

they left me with 8 holes (poor first mount), no dish, and the comment "Sometimes we just can't find a signal for no obvious reason."

is satellite 119 more south-westerly than 101? is it lower in the sky? are these guys just not good?

i do have trees and a possible obstruction on the right (edge of home), but they got a fantastic 101 signal. but why could they not get 119 from the darn roof 4 levels high?

Really, use http://www.dishpointer.com and locate your house. You can look at it from above and it'll draw a line right to your house from the 119 satellite. I just looked at Massachusetts in general and I see that the 119 satellite is just a little more toward west than due SW. Go out there and look directly SW and then look just a little right from that point. The 119 satellite is only 22 degrees above the horizon in that direction so if you have anything at all above the horizon there, that could be the problem.

Mike

[mchaney]

The 119 is the lowes sat of all at 41degrees where 101 is almost at 50 degrees. A tall building next door will block that signal. Most install companys will give you a second opion. Hope this helps.

True for us in Florida. It's only 22 degrees up there in Mass.

Mike

[raoul5788]

True for us in Florida. It's only 22 degrees up there in Mass.

Mike

Correct. It is about 22 degrees elevation and 250 degrees azimuth. Check with a compass and you can likely find a spot on your property to put the dish.

[raoul5788]

they left me with 8 holes (poor first mount), no dish, and the comment "Sometimes we just can't find a signal for no obvious reason."

is satellite 119 more south-westerly than 101? is it lower in the sky? are these guys just not good?

i do have trees and a possible obstruction on the right (edge of home), but they got a fantastic 101 signal. but why could they not get 119 from the darn roof 4 levels high?

I hope they sealed the holes properly! If not, get them back out there to do it.

[clarkbaker]

hi, i am new here.

2 guys spent 4 hours at my place and they could get satellite 101, but not 119. they even went on my roof and with zero trees, could only get satellite 101. hence, they left. i called Directv and they said they were the only contract company in my area. how could they have a clear shot of the south and southwest, with no trees, and not get me Directv? i am confused.

now i am stuck with charter and no HD TBS for the sox!!!

thoughts?

...oh, and i am new to all this. he had the dish and a little mini-receiver around his neck to find the satellites

the supervisor was stumped, said "oh well" and they left. i know they tried, but i am perplexed.



I think you first problem is that your using DirectTV.. :) ... I would go with DishNetwork personally.. particuarily because in the south.. you'll have a clear shot at 61.5 going SouthEast..which may not be in the way.. and 110 and 119 should be clear shots. Besides DirectTV service being the issue.. frankly it sounds like a receiver or equipment issue.. because if you have a clear shot it is really unlikely unless by some wierd reason your inbetween spot beams.. Thats pretty rare but possible. If it is.. just get a larger dish size.. and you should be able to force the issue. Its more likely however that some aspect of the botched installation is the issue.

[TigersFanJJ]

Really, use http://www.dishpointer.com and locate your house. You can look at it from above and it'll draw a line right to your house from the 119 satellite. I just looked at Massachusetts in general and I see that the 119 satellite is just a little more toward west than due SW. Go out there and look directly SW and then look just a little right from that point. The 119 satellite is only 22 degrees above the horizon in that direction so if you have anything at all above the horizon there, that could be the problem.

Mike

I checked out that link. It didn't show my house, just a big empty field. Did I get blown away to Oz? :D

[mchaney]

I checked out that link. It didn't show my house, just a big empty field. Did I get blown away to Oz? :D

Is your house newly built? I think the map is based on Google Earth. If it doesn't show up, maybe the best thing is to just look a few degrees right of SW and see if you see any obstructions taller than about 22 degrees.

Mike

[n3ntj]

hi, i am new here.

2 guys spent 4 hours at my place and they could get satellite 101, but not 119. they even went on my roof and with zero trees, could only get satellite 101. hence, they left. i called Directv and they said they were the only contract company in my area. how could they have a clear shot of the south and southwest, with no trees, and not get me Directv? i am confused.

now i am stuck with charter and no HD TBS for the sox!!!

thoughts?

...oh, and i am new to all this. he had the dish and a little mini-receiver around his neck to find the satellites

the supervisor was stumped, said "oh well" and they left. i know they tried, but i am perplexed.

Was the installer from Ironwood? They have no idea what the heck they are doing because they aren't trained properly, from my experience.

[bender73]

well, i went to that site and it is indeed "possible" that 119 is cut off from the attached townhouse...unless i go on the roof. 101 is more south and 119 is definitely more south-westerly. 119 could be obstructed by the roof of the attached unit.

now, it comes to the problem of using the roof. the condo board allowed me to use the exterior of my unit only, but not the roof. i don't know why since the exterior is more obnoxious looking and there is more chance of damage to wood siding than a roof (i think). Directv is gonna send out a lead tech expert person. in the meantime, i am gonna try and fight for the rights to use the roof.

Ahhhh!!!

[248 F1]

is there a possibility that the edge of the building could have blocked the signal? i live in a townhouse and each unit is pushed back a little. i was thinking that the right-sided unit (more southwesterly) could be blocking the signal of 119. however, they did get 101 with 99% signal. so, i would THINK that would rule-out trees as a problem unless 119 is a lot lower. moreover, they tried the top of my roof (4 level townhouse) with no LOS problems and still could not get 119.???

Read this: http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=63277
use this:
http://www.dishpointer.com/
and this
http://gjullien.fr/satellite.htm

[bender73]

thanks! i have read 2 of those before.

i still think that 119 might be obstructed by my attached neighbor's exterior. this leaves me only the option to mount higher on the roof. this will be a tough sell to the condo board...unless they shy away in defeat if i tell them i will mount a huge 40' pole in my common area. :)

i know that if they have a chance to think about it, they will likely go for the roof over pole option. there is one guy on the board that is tough. you know the type. all about power. it's a friggin condo board!!!

is there any potential dangers of roof-mounting? i need some good ammo for my defense. i think they would be more opposed to side/exterior since it can rot the wood if not treated properly. the roof is less of a problem, no?

[bender73]

here is the view of 119's path. you can see the lip of my neighbor's place that could cause an obstruction.

http://chrisbilodeau.smugmug.com/photos/205203150-L.jpg

[BNUMM]

If the 119 is blocked he will be missing 90% of DishNetworks SD channels.

[BNUMM]

thanks! i have read 2 of those before.

i still think that 119 might be obstructed by my attached neighbor's exterior. this leaves me only the option to mount higher on the roof. this will be a tough sell to the condo board...unless they shy away in defeat if i tell them i will mount a huge 40' pole in my common area. :)

i know that if they have a chance to think about it, they will likely go for the roof over pole option. there is one guy on the board that is tough. you know the type. all about power. it's a friggin condo board!!!

is there any potential dangers of roof-mounting? i need some good ammo for my defense. i think they would be more opposed to side/exterior since it can rot the wood if not treated properly. the roof is less of a problem, no?

The OTARD regulation allows for them to not allow roof mounts.

[bender73]

The OTARD regulation allows for them to not allow roof mounts.

i know. but, their options are a nice clean roof-mount or myself placing a 50 foot pole that clears the roof in my "non-common" area. :)

they can stop me mounting on the roof, but if they want the place to look nice then i don't think they would love the pole idea...something they cannot stop, but will look really ugly.

[aim2pls]

is there a possibility that the edge of the building could have blocked the signal? i live in a townhouse and each unit is pushed back a little. i was thinking that the right-sided unit (more southwesterly) could be blocking the signal of 119. however, they did get 101 with 99% signal. so, i would THINK that would rule-out trees as a problem unless 119 is a lot lower. moreover, they tried the top of my roof (4 level townhouse) with no LOS problems and still could not get 119.

???


101 is at about 32 degree and 119 at 22 degrees here in mass

[mchaney]

here is the view of 119's path. you can see the lip of my neighbor's place that could cause an obstruction.

http://chrisbilodeau.smugmug.com/photos/205203150-L.jpg
Well, looking at that, it looks like you could move the dish just a little more east. That line looks like it is about at the middle of your roof. Plus, if it's clipping the very corner of that roof, that corner ought to be at the same height as the gutter on your roof. Maybe you could get away with one of those mounts that just clears the eaves and puts the dish right above the gutter. Seems like it could be done.

Mike

[bender73]

yea, if the condo board does not allow the roof-mount then i will simply place it on the very front exterior. it won't be pretty, but it's an option that might work. i am trying to mount it in a place that won't stick out like a sore thumb. that said, i have permission to mount it to the exterior of "my" unit. i could put it up on the very front (above the main door), but that will look really tacky. these are my arguments i guess to allow for the roof-mount. thanks.

[bender73]

update...

an "expert" tech that is contracted by Directv came to my place today and basically had it installed in no time without any problem. he never fiddled with bringing the dish up on the ladder or anything. he laughed at the previous techs doing that. he said it's simple math. he went up on a ladder, looked through a little gadget, and said no problem.

he got > 90% on all satellites.

he was really cool and told me that the other installers are used 1st by Directv and cost less. hence, they're young and not experienced.

he kept within the rules of the agreement i had with the condo board and simply looped the cables over the roof to the other side. they won't love it cause they are obvious...but i kept within the rules.

woo hoo!!!

thanks to everyone.

http://chrisbilodeau.smugmug.com/photos/205782750-L.jpg

[bender73]

i don't need a tripod mount do i? i hear many say yes and no. thoughts?

[mexican-bum]

i don't need a tripod mount do i? i hear many say yes and no. thoughts?

My dish is attached very similar to yours and I don't have the 2 monopoles and all is good. It just depends on how sturdy of a place its mounted. On most roof mounts(mounted actually on top of the shingles) they don't hit any studs so the monopoles are necessary, it appears yours is in a stud so will probably be fine.

[joe diamond]

Bender,
22 degrees is really low! (And you could be correct about the building blocking 119.)Then I saw the ground photo.

Here is something to look at. Move the dish out into the lawn with a temp pole until you get the 119. Do this with a standard mast attached to a plank. When you find the spot, install the mast in concrete and repoint the dish. Cover the whole thing with the fiberglass rock that is sold for this purpose. (Google DTV accessories) Dig in the cable. Spend some bucks!

I can't tell what else is in the line of sight from the sat photo. Here in Maryland the el for 119 is around 32 and causes a few problems. 22 degrees is low.

Good luck,

Joe

PS......Having seen the picture, that is what it takes. You may want to go into the attic area above those windows and see if the tech used lag bolts into the sheathing or hit studs. That dish will eventually pull itself out of particle board. Also, the siding is going to have a permanent crunch in it. It could have gone at the soffit end at the corner of the building. That triangle of lumber is stronger and would allow a cable run down and into your basement then out to the prewire and ground blockout back. Or the wire could have gone through the attic.

I would hate it if someone did this kind of second guessing to me.

Joe again

[bender73]

Bender,
22 degrees is really low! (And you could be correct about the building blocking 119.)Then I saw the ground photo.

Here is something to look at. Move the dish out into the lawn with a temp pole until you get the 119. Do this with a standard mast attached to a plank. When you find the spot, install the mast in concrete and repoint the dish. Cover the whole thing with the fiberglass rock that is sold for this purpose. (Google DTV accessories) Dig in the cable. Spend some bucks!

I can't tell what else is in the line of sight from the sat photo. Here in Maryland the el for 119 is around 32 and causes a few problems. 22 degrees is low.

Good luck,

Joe

PS......Having seen the picture, that is what it takes. You may want to go into the attic area above those windows and see if the tech used lag bolts into the sheathing or hit studs. That dish will eventually pull itself out of particle board. Also, the siding is going to have a permanent crunch in it. It could have gone at the soffit end at the corner of the building. That triangle of lumber is stronger and would allow a cable run down and into your basement then out to the prewire and ground blockout back. Or the wire could have gone through the attic.

I would hate it if someone did this kind of second guessing to me.

Joe again

he just came and put the thing up. he was an "expert" installer and according to him, is not used much by Directv because they cost more than the average people. i would hope he knew if he hit studs and would hope he would tell me if he didn't. the bolts are long so i would assume they would hit a solid piece of wood behind the siding, no? now i am worried!

who can i get, besides Directv, to come out and make sure things are done 100% the best way possible?

thanks!

[mexican-bum]

he just came and put the thing up. he was an "expert" installer and according to him, is not used much by Directv because they cost more than the average people. i would hope he knew if he hit studs and would hope he would tell me if he didn't. the bolts are long so i would assume they would hit a solid piece of wood behind the siding, no? now i am worried!

who can i get, besides Directv, to come out and make sure things are done 100% the best way possible?

thanks!

I'm sure he hit a stud or I don't think it would still be up there:D

[bender73]

I'm sure he hit a stud or I don't think it would still be up there:D

really? i am not an expert at homes/building. i am trusting the installers...and i know they can be good/bad. i cannot access that part of the building, but from the other side (small attic), i see the only thing the screws can go through are wood siding and particle board. if he did not hit a stud, would it hold? the studs are small and he never looked for one with a tester or such. he just found a spot and screwed it in. oh boy am i worried...especially since i had to get permission from the condo board and they're still not thrilled about this whole thing.

[joe diamond]

bender,

Sleep well.....Mexican-bum is probably right. If it does move you will know it because you will loose signal. An experienced tech can find the studs by tapping. Or he could have used molly bolts, which expand inside the wall and work ok.The fix is not difficult if that is an attic above the windows.

I only mentioned it because down here in MD the elevation issue is not as critical as yours and we have more options.

Enjoy......but watch it!


Joe

[bender73]

this is what i had to do because the "expert" installer obviously didn't mind hitting only 1 stud WITH 1 SCREW. pathetic. i am so angry at D* and a supervisor ended up taking care of me because of this. they are also coming out to place a monopole today. the installers in my area are terrible.

http://chrisbilodeau.smugmug.com/photos/207816333-L.jpg

[Ext 721]

The 119 is the lowes sat of all at 41degrees where 101 is almost at 50 degrees. A tall building next door will block that signal. Most install companys will give you a second opion. Hope this helps.

dude's in massachusetts....119's more like 20-25 degrees

[joe diamond]

Just saw the interior shot
That is what I was talking about. He missed the stud. There is a test with a piece of wire that will give you stud location. It is taught in cable 101 back in install college.
Now that you are in the attic you could route the cable in and across the attic and back out in a corner nearest the point of entry and get the cable off the roof.
In fairness to the tech......your job has gone off the basic installation chart. Instead of quoting a price to do it right he just "got it done" and moved on.

Hang in there.

Joe

[gunnarliden]

my dad was supposed to have the install today and the tech said he couldn't get a sight line, which seems really weird to me. My guess, like most people here, is that the tech didn't know what he was doing. how do i have him get an "expert" tech? does he call the general D* number and just request an expert, or does he have to find it locally? they said they couldn't do it on the roof b/c it was a shake roof and they could go into attic and build something between the frame so they could drill it in. is it possible to get an expert installer to this, or would he have to do it himself? any ideas? is it risky to go this route with the inside attic frame? BTW, he lives just north of Pittsburgh.

thanks

[bender73]

call D* and tell them you got no LOS and demand (nicely) a senior tech. if you truly cannot get LOS then the senior tech won't be able to do much. however, i had a guy trying to lock on a signal up a ladder with the dish wobbling in his hands! the senior tech got LOS in minutes.