Lease Vs Owned. --- Ebay.

[lowspeed]

Can any of the used receiver bought on ebay be anything but owned?

Don't owners need to return they receiver if they are leased and if they don't return them then directv chargers them a purchase price (rendering the box, owned)


So unless a box is stolen, if its used it defaults to owned equipment, no?




--

[bkwest918]

I for one wouldn't buy used gear off ebay for this exact reason.

/b

[lowspeed]

I actually bought a couple before with no problem.... Obviously there's some risk.

[Tom Robertson]

To my knowledge there is no way to be certain if something will end up leased on your account before you buy via ebay. You might be able to verify with DIRECTV if you have a receiver ID, you might not.

You might also have the seller warrant the owned status somehow?

Cheers,
Tom

[lowspeed]

To my knowledge there is no way to be certain if something will end up leased on your account before you buy via ebay. You might be able to verify with DIRECTV if you have a receiver ID, you might not.

You might also have the seller warrant the owned status somehow?

Cheers,
Tom

My point is since leased boxes need to be returned to d* if they don't then they get charged for the full price, making the boxes owned.

So out of elimination, unless the box is stolen or something crazy, by default its owned, if its used.

[Tom Robertson]

There have been times when leased boxes ended up not being returned but rather sold on ebay and activated before the return box would have been processed. The seller is responsible for PPV programming, but buyer for having a leased unit. Don't know what happens to any commitments for either buyer or seller.

Buyer beware.

[CJTE]

If ever you're going to buy equipment off ebay...
1) ask if it is OWNED
2) Get the details. Card Number, and RID. Preferrably pictures.
3) Call your favorite CSR, and tell them straight out: Im looking at a receiver on eBay. I need you to look it up for me and tell me wether the account is in good standing, and wether the box is leased or owned.

They will fight with you.
You are NOT asking for personal information. You are asking about the status of the receiver.


Assuming it all checks out, and you get what you paid for, and its not ****ed up, your good.

Now, the PPVs are tied to the receivers. If you try to activate that receiver on your account and there are unpaid PPVs on the equipment, you will be responsible for paying it off before they can activate it.


Im sure some of you will want to tell me the PPVs are not tied to the receiver...
When IPPV is enabled, and you order PPV's without a phoneline, it doesnt store the information on the access card. It stores the information on the actual receiver, to call home to DTV. If it never calls home, then the receiver is scanned when it gets back to the warehouse. Thats also why there is a limit on how many PPVs can be ordered without calling home.

[lowspeed]

Now, the PPVs are tied to the receivers. If you try to activate that receiver on your account and there are unpaid PPVs on the equipment, you will be responsible for paying it off before they can activate it.


Won't they tell you when you call to activate the box that it has unpaid PPV ?

[lostman72]

Won't they tell you when you call to activate the box that it has unpaid PPV ?

Not always. If the box was never plugged into a phone line it could not report to DTV what was ordered as far as PPV.

[CJTE]

Won't they tell you when you call to activate the box that it has unpaid PPV ?
Not always. If the box was never plugged into a phone line it could not report to DTV what was ordered as far as PPV.

Pretty much...
If its owned, and you call to activate it, you shouldnt have a problem. Probably will require a new access card, and the previous account must be in good standing.

[paulman182]

I have two leased SD receivers and one leased SD DVR, all deactivated, none asked to be returned.

I guess I could sell them on ebay to some unsuspecting soul, but I'd never do that.

[randyk47]

Right now I have two recievers, an H10 and H20, both owned. Bought the H10 from Circuit City along with what was then a new 3 LNB. I got the H20 more recently as a new unit from eBay. The seller was an authorized dealer and gave me all the information I needed to register the unit as owned with D*. A couple of questions from CSR and we were good to go. My yet to be installed HD DVR will be leased directly from D*. Other than having to return leased equipment and not being able to sell it I no longer see any benefit to owning recievers. I used to pass my used equipment down to my in-laws but my wife's parents both passed away and my sister-in-law doesn't have, or want right now, HD. As it is I think I have 2 or 3 old units stuffed away in storage.

[lowspeed]

Right now I have two recievers, an H10 and H20, both owned. Bought the H10 from Circuit City along with what was then a new 3 LNB. I got the H20 more recently as a new unit from eBay. The seller was an authorized dealer and gave me all the information I needed to register the unit as owned with D*. A couple of questions from CSR and we were good to go. My yet to be installed HD DVR will be leased directly from D*. Other than having to return leased equipment and not being able to sell it I no longer see any benefit to owning recievers. I used to pass my used equipment down to my in-laws but my wife's parents both pasted away and my sister-in-law doesn't have, or want right now, HD. As it is I think I have 2 or 3 old units stuffed away in storage.

When did you get this new H20 ? What did you tell the Rep in order to make it owned?

[randyk47]

I got my H20 about 9 months ago. The eBay seller gave their D* account number and I had the sales invoice. The D* CSR asked me the seller's company name and D* reseller account number. The CSR was nice and explained it really didn't make any difference in terms of what I would pay for a monthly charge for the receiver. In fact, the biggest difference was once the piece of equipment was out of warranty all I had was a "door stop".....at least that's the way I understood it.

[admiral39]

Well, let me offer my 2 cents FWIW. I recently ordered a used R15-300 from an ebayer. All seemed well, until I tried to activate the receiver. First, you can't re-use the Access Card. Those are permanently tied to the accounts that they are originally registered to. No problem I say and they transfer me to Card services. So, I try to order up a new card for the unit. As soon as I give them the Receiver ID, red flags go up all over the place. Apparently this is a leased unit that the owner has to return under their agreement. I cannot do anything with this box other than return it to the seller for a refund or send it back to DirecTV on the seller's behalf.

Anyway, the seller was a nice girl from Florida who was very cooperative and fought with DirecTV as she maintained that she bought the unit from Best Buy years ago. D* would not budge however and lucky for me she was a reputable seller because she refunded my money and let me keep the unit since it was of no use to her.

They really put her through the ringer with the box. First they told her that the unit was leased, then on top of that that her account was in collections. The moral of the story is, as other posters have pointed out, if you buy any D* equipment off of Ebay, get that verification from D* directly that the unit is owned and not leased. Otherwise you've got a fine gray paperweight.

[CJTE]

When did you get this new H20 ? What did you tell the Rep in order to make it owned?

With the protection plan... Owned equipment, replaced with owned equipment.

That old HR10-250 died? Oh, you owned it? And you've got the protection plan? Lets ship out an owned HR20-700 :biggrin:

[dervari]

Im sure some of you will want to tell me the PPVs are not tied to the receiver...
When IPPV is enabled, and you order PPV's without a phoneline, it doesnt store the information on the access card. It stores the information on the actual receiver, to call home to DTV. If it never calls home, then the receiver is scanned when it gets back to the warehouse. Thats also why there is a limit on how many PPVs can be ordered without calling home.

Has this changed? Back in the 'old days' PPV purchases were definitely stored on the access card.

[paulman182]

No offense, but why would anyone buy an R15 off ebay when they are free with the DVR4U2 code, and just $99 otherwise? I got three free ones last year.

[Stuart Sweet]

Would you be willing to say just what receiver models you are looking at on eBay?

[texasbrit]

There are some owned H20 receivers because they were released before the lease program started. There are virtually no owned HR20s. Even the ones you "buy" from Best Buy are leased. So getting an HR20 from an eBay seller is dubious. Some eBay sellers tell you it is a leased box, but as posters have said, it could be on an account in collections or have outstanding PPV charges. Some ebay sellers are dishonest to the point of being fraudulent - as well as tring to sell you a leased box without disclosing that, they will also tell you that owning a box will avoid lease charges, without saying that DirecTV willl charge you an additional receiver charge which is the same as the lease fee.
Getting DirecTV equipment from ebay is very rarely worthwhile. If you are upgrading to HD, DirecTV will install the dish and multiswitch (if you need one) free of charge.

[MikeR7]

I procured a brand new black HR20 on E-bay last spring when they were available for a short time, I knew it would be a leased box, and actually wouldn't want to own it. Had no trouble activating it.

I bought a used HR10-250 late summer on E-Bay, had to buy a new access card from DIRECTV, but other than that it was not a problem, they told me I owned it when I activated it, and it works great.

:)

[lowspeed]

Would you be willing to say just what receiver models you are looking at on eBay?


I ordered 2 H20, payed 100bucks for both (shipped)

[Spike]

I have bought into the lease program through ebay sellers. It can save you up to $100, if you are already a Directv subscriber. When I do so, I make sure that those boxes are factory sealed and I make sure I can call the office of the seller. That way I can make sure that they are who they say they are. I will only buy from an authorized Directv dealer that uses ebay.

I have looked into a few boxes that weren't from authorized dealers before. But those never get very far, because if you ask to do a check on their box's id numbers through Directv, they generally back out of selling their item. There are very very few Directv MPEG4 HD DVR's that are legit for sale items on ebay. That is a fact. If they are selling it to OWN, I am always suspicious!!!

[CJTE]

Has this changed? Back in the 'old days' PPV purchases were definitely stored on the access card.

I didnt know the receiver could write back to the access card...

The way it was explained to me was that there is non-volatile ram inside the receiver that will store PPV information, but it will only store up to 30/so movies before locking up.



Also, if they were stored on the access card, you could pay $20 for a new access card, rather then who knows how much for PPVs

[randyk47]

Speaking as one of those who bought an H20 off of eBay I'll never do it again, at least not under the present D* leasing policy. At the time I was a bit miffed that D* was going to leasing. Up until then I'd always owned my equipment. It just struck me wrong at the time. I bought it from an authorized D* dealer and paid slightly less than D* was offering. It never crossed my mind to call D* and see if I could negotiate a better price. I also, at the time, didn't understand I was going to pay either a lease fee or an additionally receiver fee whether I owned it or not. In fact, somehow at the time I thought I'd be paying both if it were leased which, of course, has turned out not to be true. At this point I own and have active an H10 and H20. I have an HR20 on the way from D* for basically the shipping and handling so eBay nor any other on line provider was a consideration. As long as I can strike a deal with D* it really doesn't make much difference to me whether I own or lease. I usually keep my equipment until it is obsolete, so much so that I have 3 stored away in my attic for no good reason. I do want to say, as I mentioned in an earlier post, that I bought a new unit from an authorized dealer and had no problem bringing it on line as a owned machine. My reasons for not going that way in the future have nothing to do with a bad experience.

[lowspeed]

Well i got one of the boxes... and guess what it was made 2007... so right away i was saying to myself oh boy.

So when i called directv they told me the box is leased and the people that have it on their account must return it or they will be panelized...

Grr... NOW i need paypal dispute... we'll see how that goes.

[Terry K]

I recently got an HR20 from a friend of mine and D* let me swap the card out of my HR10 to it and life was good. I gave them the RID and serial, and viola in about 5 minutes it was up and running.

[lowspeed]

I recently got an HR20 from a friend of mine and D* let me swap the card out of my HR10 to it and life was good. I gave them the RID and serial, and viola in about 5 minutes it was up and running.

They btw insisted i would need a new card (it didn't come with one) and when i gave them the box id they told me they can't do a thing with it since its linked to another account.

[JohnH]

I got a used HTL-HD recently and had to get a new card. When activated, it showed up as a leased unit on my account, but a few days later it switched to an owned status without any call about it. Now I added a couple of D10s (they were destined for the dump). They show up as leased. Strangely, they had never been activated and will likely remain as leased unless I get upity with them.

BTW: The HTL-HD no longer has upgrade support on the satellites. So, beware, it may not work reliably.

[Tom B]

Well i got one of the boxes... and guess what it was made 2007... so right away i was saying to myself oh boy.

So when i called directv they told me the box is leased and the people that have it on their account must return it or they will be panelized...

Grr... NOW i need paypal dispute... we'll see how that goes.

If you hold on to the box till the penalty is posted to the seller's D* account, then you will be able to activate it as owned.

[Tom B]

They btw insisted i would need a new card (it didn't come with one) and when i gave them the box id they told me they can't do a thing with it since its linked to another account.

It seems to vary depending on what CSR you talk to. always thought that the card could not be moved to another card or account. Then one CSR let me move a card from one box on my account to another. A few months later, when I called to get a new card for a box I bought on ebay, the CSR said I could reuse the existing card. (And, NO, the PPV purchases did not transfer to my account. Everythingon the card was somehow reset.)

[Spike]

Well i got one of the boxes... and guess what it was made 2007... so right away i was saying to myself oh boy.

So when i called directv they told me the box is leased and the people that have it on their account must return it or they will be panelized...

Grr... NOW i need paypal dispute... we'll see how that goes.

Whenever I might buy a used directv receiver from ebay, I ask for the access card number before bidding. If they give it, I call Directv and run an account check based on the card number to see if the account is clean. If there is an unpaid balance, I will not bid on the ebay item. It avoids ebay disputes.

[dodge boy]

I bought a new R15 on ebay and when I activated it I used the card from my Broke R15 (I threw it away) with the access card department and it is owned. I have a few old cards and some "virgin" cards laying around. when I activate new stuff I pull out one of my old ones and keep the new ones sealed.

[lowspeed]

If you hold on to the box till the penalty is posted to the seller's D* account, then you will be able to activate it as owned.

How long does that usually take ?

[lowspeed]

The saga continues... The 2nd auction arrived and i open the box and instead of an H20 it was an H10.

At this point i was flipping out. 2 auctions with duds.


Luckily the guy was honest and he actually mistakenly sent me that instead of another box and he let me keep the H10 and promptly refunded me the entire transaction.

for the 1st one paypal surprisingly sided with me right away and asked me to ship it back once tracking is confirmed i should get a refund.

Let me just summarize the experience this way: "I will never purchase a directv box on ebay."


--

[DishCSR]

Has this changed? Back in the 'old days' PPV purchases were definitely stored on the access card.

NO, cjte is slighty mis-informed, (i really hope this person doesn't work in tech support) lol

ippv's are stored on the access card, always have been always will be,,if there is no phone line connected then the access card gets full and therefore would no longer allow ippv's, so customers would get an osd (i believe 733?), propmpting them to call in to directv, the csr should then advise customer that the access card is full (since no recent call back on receiver in question) and to plug in a phone line to "download' the ppv's, and then all will be well again for ippv ordering, the common misconception (even by dtv csr's) is that ippv cannot be utililzed without a phone line connected, this is simply not true, it's just that the access card would get full without a phone line, and the only way for the access card to "empty" itself is to have a ph ln connected again. when a recvr is returned, a ppv recovery is performed on the access card , not the recvr..even if the access card is kept to be used in the replacement recvr , the recovery comes from the access card , never the recvr....not sure where cjte got their info, but it's incorrect...

[CJTE]

NO, cjte is slighty mis-informed, (i really hope this person doesn't work in tech support) lol

ippv's are stored on the access card, always have been always will be,,if there is no phone line connected then the access card gets full and therefore would no longer allow ippv's, so customers would get an osd (i believe 733?), propmpting them to call in to directv, the csr should then advise customer that the access card is full (since no recent call back on receiver in question) and to plug in a phone line to "download' the ppv's, and then all will be well again for ippv ordering, the common misconception (even by dtv csr's) is that ippv cannot be utililzed without a phone line connected, this is simply not true, it's just that the access card would get full without a phone line, and the only way for the access card to "empty" itself is to have a ph ln connected again. when a recvr is returned, a ppv recovery is performed on the access card , not the recvr..even if the access card is kept to be used in the replacement recvr , the recovery comes from the access card , never the recvr....not sure where cjte got their info, but it's incorrect...

Well trip out on that.
I'd suppose that the access cards could have non-volatile memory, similar to the SIM cards you'd find in a phone...

And heyy, Why shouldnt I work in tech support?
I was misinformed, assuming you're correct, I thank you for the information...

BTW, I am a Private technical support "consultant"

[VOLBEAT]

I have an HR20 on the way from D* for basically the shipping and handling so eBay nor any other on line provider was a consideration.

What approach did you use to get that deal, if you don't mind me asking? I've been with them 10 years, always pay my bill on time, and couldn't get 2 CSRs to budge from the $299 tonight. I will not pay that to lease one. I can buy and own one for less. Just curious what you said.

[JLucPicard]

What approach did you use to get that deal, if you don't mind me asking? I've been with them 10 years, always pay my bill on time, and couldn't get 2 CSRs to budge from the $299 tonight. I will not pay that to lease one. I can buy and own one for less. Just curious what you said.
I'd be interested to know how you could buy and own an HR20 for less? And if you can, why don't you go that route?

[randyk47]

Jim - Well, it wasn't easy. A few weeks ago I struck a deal with a D* Retention CSR to get a Slimline and HD DVR for $199.95 plus shipping and handling. When the installer came out it was beyond his capability to install the new dish as it had to be moved to place that was too high, on too steep a roof for his company. Had to cancel both the dish and the HD DVR as I wasn't sure I'd be able to stay with D*. I found an independent installer a couple of weeks later (guy works on transmission towers normally so the location wasn't a problem for him) through a local home theater install company and got a Slimline installed. When I called back to D* to get the HD DVR the Retention CSR was a pill and would only offer the HD DVR for $299.95 plus S&H. I told her I'd gotten a better deal from them 4 weeks earlier but she had kind of a "take it or leave it" attitude and almost, though not quite, accused me of lying as she didn't see any combination of offers that could have gotten me that low. Of course, I'd just spent $400+ out of my own pocket (cost of dish, assorted piece parts, and labor) to get the new dish so I wasn't particularly happy. Asked to speak to a supervisor and got passed to a "Resolution" representative. I explained (in a nice, more or less uncomplaining way) what had happened and allowed as though I thought I'd shown good faith to continue D* by finding my own installer for what I admit was a tricky install. All I really expected, and would have settled for, was the original offer but the rep offered the HD DVR for only the shipping and handling. I'm scheduled to recieve it next Saturday (27 Oct). The HD DVR has already been charged and then credited back to my account with only the S&H charge showing. Now I'm wondering if I'll get the new HR21. :-)

[jsizzle]

Since the leasing program started on march 1, 2006 all receivers that you get from an authorized dealer are leased (Best Buy, Circuit City, Wal*Mart, Costco, Local Dealer-Like, Mike's Dish Shack, Ebay-unless it was previously owned on another acct.).

You can purchased owned receivers from Directv by calling in and asking for the owned price for the receiver for upgrade over the lease upgrade price. Current owned upgrade costs are as follows: SD receiver $149, DVR $349, HD $349, HD-DVR $749 plus shipping and local taxes. Any offers you get from a directv rep for anything less than the owned price will be a leased receiver.

As far as getting receivers from Ebay or from a kind Friend or Neighbor, the only way for those to be activated to your acct. as owned receivers would be if the receiver were owned on the account it was previously on.

When transferring used equipment from one Directv account to another it does require the purchase of a new acess card. An access card is $20 and must be paid for at the time of the order with either a check by phone payment or credit/debit card.

1.The receiver that is wanting to be used must be an owned receiver (leased receivers are non transferable).

2. The account that the receiver was previously on must be in good standing (not on an account in collections or not on an account with a past due balance).

3. The person that wants the receiver added to their account must be the one to call in to place the order and be the account holder or authorized user for the account.

4. The access card would be sent to the service address on the account.

The access card csr that places the order will give additional info about how the card will be shipped and security features of the card. Hopefully that helps anyone that is not sure about adding used equipment to their Directv account. You can always just call Directv and ask for the Access Card department, we will be more than happy to give you the accurate info that you need. You can also get the info from your Directv customer agreement.

[CJTE]

Now I'm wondering if I'll get the new HR21. :-)

Haha, dont you wish!
DTV isnt even shipping out H21's yet (still gotta go buy it at Best Buy), so I dont beleive you'll be able to get an HR21

But heres to hopin :biggrin:

[randyk47]

Jsizzle - Well, that's kind of the official line. I did buy a receiver from an authorized dealer on eBay after March 2006, I didn't pay the D* price, and I registered it with D* as owned. Having said that I probably wouldn't "buy" another one and, in fact, got my soon to be delivered (I hope) HD DVR directly from D*. It will be leased of course. I no longer see any benefit in owning D* equipment. Already have 2-3 old units stuck away in storage that have no resale value, why add more.

CTJE - Actually, I have mixed feeling about the HR20 versus HR21. I kind of like having the OTA option I have now and do use it for weather warnings when the sat goes out and we have bad weather (like tornado warnings) in the area. Funny thing is that they delayed my HD DVR delivery by a week. Their reason was "waiting for new shipment". Of course, that could be a shipment of any HD DVR and not necessarily the new HR21. It'll be what it'll be.

[CJTE]

Jsizzle - Well, that's kind of the official line. I did buy a receiver from an authorized dealer on eBay after March 2006, I didn't pay the D* price, and I registered it with D* as owned. Having said that I probably wouldn't "buy" another one and, in fact, got my soon to be delivered (I hope) HD DVR directly from D*. It will be leased of course. I no longer see any benefit in owning D* equipment. Already have 2-3 old units stuck away in storage that have no resale value, why add more.

Its only really useful for DVRs, that way you arent losing anything you have saved on them, but... if you have an external backup solution then... :hurah:

[techrep]

Since the leasing program started on march 1, 2006 all receivers that you get from an authorized dealer are leased (Best Buy, Circuit City, Wal*Mart, Costco, Local Dealer-Like, Mike's Dish Shack, Ebay-unless it was previously owned on another acct.).

You can purchased owned receivers from Directv by calling in and asking for the owned price for the receiver for upgrade over the lease upgrade price. Current owned upgrade costs are as follows: SD receiver $149, DVR $349, HD $349, HD-DVR $749 plus shipping and local taxes. Any offers you get from a directv rep for anything less than the owned price will be a leased receiver.

As far as getting receivers from Ebay or from a kind Friend or Neighbor, the only way for those to be activated to your acct. as owned receivers would be if the receiver were owned on the account it was previously on.

When transferring used equipment from one Directv account to another it does require the purchase of a new acess card. An access card is $20 and must be paid for at the time of the order with either a check by phone payment or credit/debit card.

1.The receiver that is wanting to be used must be an owned receiver (leased receivers are non transferable).

2. The account that the receiver was previously on must be in good standing (not on an account in collections or not on an account with a past due balance).

3. The person that wants the receiver added to their account must be the one to call in to place the order and be the account holder or authorized user for the account.

4. The access card would be sent to the service address on the account.

The access card csr that places the order will give additional info about how the card will be shipped and security features of the card. Hopefully that helps anyone that is not sure about adding used equipment to their Directv account. You can always just call Directv and ask for the Access Card department, we will be more than happy to give you the accurate info that you need. You can also get the info from your Directv customer agreement.

This all appears to be accurate.

This is the only way (at this time) I know of to own a HR20 for less than 749.00. You can buy an upgraded HR20 from WeaKnees for 599.00 and have it activated on your account as owned. You do have to explain to the CSR that it is a modified HR20 and that the warranty is from Weaknees and not D* as the basis for being owned.

WeaKnees.com is the only authorized DirecTV reseller

http://www.weaknees.com/directv-hd-dvr/hr20-700-500-details.php

[CJTE]

How does D* know wether its a leased or owned receiver?

What stops me from going to BB, buying the receiver (at cost of lease fee), then calling in and trying to register it as owned, versus buying one online, or through D* at owned price, and the exact same thing...

[jsizzle]

How does D* know wether its a leased or owned receiver?

What stops me from going to BB, buying the receiver (at cost of lease fee), then calling in and trying to register it as owned, versus buying one online, or through D* at owned price, and the exact same thing...

Because if you order the receiver from Directv there is a record made of what type of receiver and how much you paid, installation info etc.. As noted in my previous post anything less than the owned price and the receiver will be a lease. Also if we show no order was placed through a Directv csr the receiver will be leased, unless we can confirm the receiver was a used receiver from another acct. and it was previously owned.

[techrep]

How does D* know wether its a leased or owned receiver?

What stops me from going to BB, buying the receiver (at cost of lease fee), then calling in and trying to register it as owned, versus buying one online, or through D* at owned price, and the exact same thing...

D* counts every HR20 as leased unless you buy it from them (749.00) or you can prove otherwise.

[randyk47]

I think they can tell by the seller. To register my H20 with D* as a bought unit I had to have the dealer's D* account number. You give tell them you "bought" it at BB and they automatically know it's leased because that's the only way BB offers D* equipment nowadays. You tell them you got it someplace else and you don't have the D* dealer's account number and I'll bet you're toast convincing them it's purchased and not leased. I'll bet they've even gotten "smart" on new H20's. It really wasn't difficult to register mine as bought 9+ months ago but, in retrospect, not sure it means anything. It certainly doesn't save me any money on the monthly unit charge.

[JLucPicard]

... but, in retrospect, not sure it means anything. It certainly doesn't save me any money on the monthly unit charge.
And if you have a problem with it, it's on your dime unless you have the Protection Plan as the receiver wouldn't be covered for problems as it is under the lease.

[VOLBEAT]

I'd be interested to know how you could buy and own an HR20 for less? And if you can, why don't you go that route?

You can get them for less than $299 all day long.....brand new in a sealed box. My pont was, I'm not paying D $299 to "lease" one. If I pay $299, it will be mine, and not a lease. The CSR told me If I got my own, I could activate it, and it's mine. If it comes down to it, I will buy one. My wife and I agree.......I'm not giving them $200-$300 that I will never see again, so they can let me use a box they ultimately own.

[Pink Fairy]

Good luck then.

[CJTE]

Because if you order the receiver from Directv there is a record made of what type of receiver and how much you paid, installation info etc.. As noted in my previous post anything less than the owned price and the receiver will be a lease. Also if we show no order was placed through a Directv csr the receiver will be leased, unless we can confirm the receiver was a used receiver from another acct. and it was previously owned.

And how would you "confirm" it.
If I purchase a receiver to be owned you bet your ass im gonna be making sure I have whatever it takes to confirm it is OWNED!

[ThomasM]

Not always. If the box was never plugged into a phone line it could not report to DTV what was ordered as far as PPV.

It does not matter if a purchased box has unpaid PPV.

Access cards are NOT transferable, and the unpaid PPV info is stored on the access card. When you call DirecTV to activate a receiver, they send you a new access card associated with your account. When this new card is plugged into the receiver, all of the "old" user's info is erased.

[ThomasM]

No offense, but why would anyone buy an R15 off ebay when they are free with the DVR4U2 code, and just $99 otherwise? I got three free ones last year.

To get out of the 2 year commitment. Duhh! :D

[Tom B]

Since the leasing program started on march 1, 2006 all receivers that you get from an authorized dealer are leased (Best Buy, Circuit City, Wal*Mart, Costco, Local Dealer-Like, Mike's Dish Shack, Ebay-unless it was previously owned on another acct.).

You can purchased owned receivers from Directv by calling in and asking for the owned price for the receiver for upgrade over the lease upgrade price. Current owned upgrade costs are as follows: SD receiver $149, DVR $349, HD $349, HD-DVR $749 plus shipping and local taxes. Any offers you get from a directv rep for anything less than the owned price will be a leased receiver.

As far as getting receivers from Ebay or from a kind Friend or Neighbor, the only way for those to be activated to your acct. as owned receivers would be if the receiver were owned on the account it was previously on.

When transferring used equipment from one Directv account to another it does require the purchase of a new acess card. An access card is $20 and must be paid for at the time of the order with either a check by phone payment or credit/debit card.

1.The receiver that is wanting to be used must be an owned receiver (leased receivers are non transferable).

2. The account that the receiver was previously on must be in good standing (not on an account in collections or not on an account with a past due balance).

3. The person that wants the receiver added to their account must be the one to call in to place the order and be the account holder or authorized user for the account.

4. The access card would be sent to the service address on the account.

The access card csr that places the order will give additional info about how the card will be shipped and security features of the card. Hopefully that helps anyone that is not sure about adding used equipment to their Directv account. You can always just call Directv and ask for the Access Card department, we will be more than happy to give you the accurate info that you need. You can also get the info from your Directv customer agreement.

I know that is what you believe. However, I also know what I have seen from personal experience. I have TWICE purchased used HR20s on ebay. On the first one they told me it was an owned unit because the previous customer had been charged a non-return fee. (Therefore D* no longer owned it!) On the second one, the csr couldn't activate it the first time I tried because the non-return fee had not been posted to the previous customer's account. I had to wait about a week, then I was able to activate that one as owned. (The big plus to this is there is no 2 year commitment!)

When I activated the second HR20, I had called to request an access card. The csr said she could possibly save me the cost by transferring the card. I was quite surprised. But, she said that sometimes it works and other times it doesn't. So, the card was successfully transferred to my account.

So, believe what you want...and, realize you may get a different story from different csrs. However, I KNOW from personal experience that these things are possible.

[shocky]

Use paypal and/or a credit card as your payment option. If the unit doesn't pan our file a paypal claim for significantly not as advertised. If you paid with a credit card then you are protected by your CC provider. Call them up and tell them you were scammed and they will initiate a chargeback to the merchant. But whatever you do, don't pay with check/money order.

[VOLBEAT]

I know that is what you believe. However, I also know what I have seen from personal experience. I have TWICE purchased used HR20s on ebay. On the first one they told me it was an owned unit because the previous customer had been charged a non-return fee. (Therefore D* no longer owned it!) On the second one, the csr couldn't activate it the first time I tried because the non-return fee had not been posted to the previous customer's account. I had to wait about a week, then I was able to activate that one as owned. (The big plus to this is there is no 2 year commitment!)

When I activated the second HR20, I had called to request an access card. The csr said she could possibly save me the cost by transferring the card. I was quite surprised. But, she said that sometimes it works and other times it doesn't. So, the card was successfully transferred to my account.

So, believe what you want...and, realize you may get a different story from different csrs. However, I KNOW from personal experience that these things are possible.

Thank you! That is the point I have been trying to make. Some people say no matter where you buy it from, it is still leased. I asked D last night that very question......" If I bought new HR20 off Ebay that has a new access card still sealed in it's plastic, could I simply call and activate it, and it is mine. They said yes, no problem. If I buy an HR20 from Ebay, I own it, I don't have to make a 2 year commitment, and I don't have to give it back If I cancel service.....end of story.

[CJTE]

Thank you! That is the point I have been trying to make. Some people say no matter where you buy it from, it is still leased. I asked D last night that very question......" If I bought new HR20 off Ebay that has a new access card still sealed in it's plastic, could I simply call and activate it, and it is mine. They said yes, no problem. If I buy an HR20 from Ebay, I own it, I don't have to make a 2 year commitment, and I don't have to give it back If I cancel service.....end of story.

Yea, but call again and try to get CSR 2 and 3 to say that.

sorry pal

[VOLBEAT]

Yea, but call again and try to get CSR 2 and 3 to say that.

sorry pal

The previous poster said he has activated 2 HR20s he has bought.But you will still argue the point, and say sorry pal? I don't get it. Just curious, not being a jerk.

[CJTE]

The previous poster said he has activated 2 HR20s he has bought.But you will still argue the point, and say sorry pal? I don't get it. Just curious, not being a jerk.

CSR Roulette.
I call it luck of the draw.

[JLucPicard]

You can get them for less than $299 all day long.....brand new in a sealed box. My pont was, I'm not paying D $299 to "lease" one. If I pay $299, it will be mine, and not a lease. The CSR told me If I got my own, I could activate it, and it's mine. If it comes down to it, I will buy one. My wife and I agree.......I'm not giving them $200-$300 that I will never see again, so they can let me use a box they ultimately own.
Thank you! That is the point I have been trying to make. Some people say no matter where you buy it from, it is still leased. I asked D last night that very question......" If I bought new HR20 off Ebay that has a new access card still sealed in it's plastic, could I simply call and activate it, and it is mine. They said yes, no problem. If I buy an HR20 from Ebay, I own it, I don't have to make a 2 year commitment, and I don't have to give it back If I cancel service.....end of story.
I'll certainly concede that it's possible to "buy" an HR20 off of eBay and it can be owned. But you cannot just "buy" ANY HR20 off of eBay and D* will consider it owned. The vast majority of D* receivers made available on eBay - ESPECIALLY ANY 'PURCHASED' BRAND NEW IN A SEALED BOX - are just as much leased units as those sold at Best Buy, Circuit City or most on-line retailers.

This wasn't such common knowledge when the lease program started up, but it appears from the way things have transpired that short of paying the $749 "owned" price through D*, most of the owned HR20s out there are either (a) acquired as replacements under the PP for an owned HR10-250 (I actually own such an HR20 that was an owned HR10-250 replacement) or (b) previous leases that someone does not return and therefore gets charged the non-return fee.

As for any Brand-New-Sealed-in-a-Box owned HR20s, those could be HR20s that someone paid the full purchase price for and never even opened/activated it or a Protection Plan replacement for an owned HR10-250 or an owned HR20 that someone likewise has never opened/activated. Any acquired as a result of the previous possessor not returning it and being charged the non-return fee would overwhelmingly be used (unless they leased it, never opened/activated it, and never returned it - not a likely scenario).

So yes, there could be "owned" units available on eBay, but it is still buyer beware - if your intent is to acquire one on eBay that will be OWNED, you have to really do your homework first. I would certainly not go in with the expectation that any HR20 you could win the bidding on is going to be owned just because you didn't "buy" it from a retailer or from D*.

[VOLBEAT]

CSR Roulette.
I call it luck of the draw.

I'd have to agree with you on that one. It is amazinghow different the answers and offers can be form one to the next. I actually get very tired of it. I just played the "retention" game tonight, and am getting an HR20 installed for $19.95, and t CSRs assured me it would be brand new, but someone in that thread said the first 2 rules of thumb are don't believe the CSR. I made it very clear that I will send the tech away if it refurbished. The one lady went as fasr as to sat that if he pulls out a refurbished one to get him on the phone to D right away. I'll call a few more times and see if I keep getting the same answer.

[CJTE]

I'd have to agree with you on that one. It is amazinghow different the answers and offers can be form one to the next. I actually get very tired of it. I just played the "retention" game tonight, and am getting an HR20 installed for $19.95, and t CSRs assured me it would be brand new, but someone in that thread said the first 2 rules of thumb are don't believe the CSR. I made it very clear that I will send the tech away if it refurbished. The one lady went as fasr as to sat that if he pulls out a refurbished one to get him on the phone to D right away. I'll call a few more times and see if I keep getting the same answer.

The installers usually carry new equipment on the truck.
if they have any. Kindly ask the guy if he doesnt mind giving you a new box, if you get a refurb.

[VOLBEAT]

I'll certainly concede that it's possible to "buy" an HR20 off of eBay and it can be owned. But you cannot just "buy" ANY HR20 off of eBay and D* will consider it owned. The vast majority of D* receivers made available on eBay - ESPECIALLY ANY 'PURCHASED' BRAND NEW IN A SEALED BOX - are just as much leased units as those sold at Best Buy, Circuit City or most on-line retailers.


Yes, earlier tonight I saw some on Ebay with that very description, and they are authorized Directv dealers for $259 shipped, I think it was, but like you're saying, that is most likely a lease, yes? The person clearly states in the ad that you have to contact D to see how it will be put on your account.

[VOLBEAT]

The installers usually carry new equipment on the truck.
if they have any. Kindly ask the guy if he doesnt mind giving you a new box, if you get a refurb.
Oh for sure........I told D I won't accept a refurb, and I won't. They promised me it would be brand new, so I will use that angle if the guy whips out a refurb.....but I'll be cool with him, and just tell him what D said, and that he can call if he wants. I'm going to call Ironwood also, and ask them and tell them what D said.

[CJTE]

OK, in regards to prices, you're going to be looking towards these (http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=1234617&postcount=59)...

Anything less than $100 short of that would be someone throwing money away...

[JLucPicard]

Yes, earlier tonight I saw some on Ebay with that very description, and they are authorized Directv dealers for $259 shipped, I think it was, but like you're saying, that is most likely a lease, yes? The person clearly states in the ad that you have to contact D to see how it will be put on your account.
I would definitely figure those to be considered leased units - especially if it references "authorized DirecTV dealers".

[paulman182]

To get out of the 2 year commitment. Duhh! :D

Duhh! That won't get you out of anything. The comittment starts any time a receiver is activated, owned or leased. At least, that's what the agreement says.:)

[randyk47]

From personal experience if you do get a unit, any unit, from an authorized dealer on the Internet, be it eBay or whatever, and you tell D* you paid less than D*'s full retail price it's going to be considered leased. Now we can debate about what business is it of D*'s how much you paid and I can't say I'd disagree but that's one of the hurdles you will or might have to get over with the CSR. Like many other CSR contacts your personal experience may differ, I know that the one I dealt with asked and made it clear they'd not move forward with the registration of the unit without the information.

[mikeny]

Duhh! That won't get you out of anything. The comittment starts any time a receiver is activated, owned or leased. At least, that's what the agreement says.:)But if you get a replacement unit under the "Protection Plan" and activate it, my understanding was that you don't start a new contract. Correct?

[CJTE]

Oh for sure........I told D I won't accept a refurb, and I won't. They promised me it would be brand new, so I will use that angle if the guy whips out a refurb.....but I'll be cool with him, and just tell him what D said, and that he can call if he wants. I'm going to call Ironwood also, and ask them and tell them what D said.

Just out of curiosity, did you ask the CSR to specifically write on the W.O. to bring a NEW box?
Usually they carry a couple in the truck for the next job, but chya never know.

I had to get a NEW box replaced within 1 week of having it, and I got a refurb.
Alot of people told me be thankful that I had one that a tech (mfr) had taken a 2ce over on

[VOLBEAT]

Just out of curiosity, did you ask the CSR to specifically write on the W.O. to bring a NEW box?



I asked him to make sure it was brand new, and he said he just places the orders and has no way of knowing. I called back 3 different times after that, and all 3 times the CSR assured me that whenever it a new install, they always bring a new one. That may not alwyas be the case, but that is waht I was told. The one lady told me if the guy pulls out a refurb, to have him call D and they will straighten him out. That too could have been BS, but I will hold D to that. I told them I won't accept a refurb, and would send they guy away. I will remind them a few more times of that before Nov. 3 trust me. Probably give a friendly call to Ironwood also, and make sure they are clear on that:D

[bret4]

I've had so many problems with HR20's I wouldn't want to own one. I'd want to be able to return it if it breaks down for a new one with no problems. Maybe that's not an issue. Never owned one and tried to get a replacement. Maybe if you had the service plan it would be ok.

[jimb726]

I asked him to make sure it was brand new, and he said he just places the orders and has no way of knowing. I called back 3 different times after that, and all 3 times the CSR assured me that whenever it a new install, they always bring a new one. That may not alwyas be the case, but that is waht I was told. The one lady told me if the guy pulls out a refurb, to have him call D and they will straighten him out. That too could have been BS, but I will hold D to that. I told them I won't accept a refurb, and would send they guy away. I will remind them a few more times of that before Nov. 3 trust me. Probably give a friendly call to Ironwood also, and make sure they are clear on that:D

Just wondering why the refurb thing bothers you so much? As long as the item works what difference does it make? IIRC all new installs are new units but any replacements are done with refurbs. Even if you get a new box, the possibility exists that there could be an issue (I had to go through 4 boxes before I got a working one) and the replacement even under the warranty period will be a refurbished one.

[VOLBEAT]

Just wondering why the refurb thing bothers you so much? As long as the item works what difference does it make?

Well. last(and only) time I got a refurbished box from D, it was in a box about twice it's size, with absolutely no styrofoam or bubble wrap of any kind around it.......just flopping around loose in a box. Went to plug it in, and the power cord was cut, all the way through the insulation, ready to break. So, if that's how they take care of a refurb, no thanks. I'd just rather start out new.

[Draconis]

I have never had that problem when I got an ERP. If something like that did happen, I highly doubt that DIRECTV would allow it to continue. There would be way too much customer backlash if that happened to every refurbished replacement they sent.

As for the quality of refurbished systems, I had a system exchange from Dell a few years back and they gave me a refurbished system. I escalated to a manager who said that he would look up the history of the unit, then he started laughing. I was quite miffed until he told me the reason he was laughing.

The unit was returned to Dell because the keys on the keyboard were not in alphabetical order. The old 30-day total satisfaction guarantee.

Moral of the story, just because it’s a refurbished unit does not mean that there was something wrong with it.

I also agree with randyk47, I have enough junk in my garage. I do not need a pile of useless DIRECTV receivers if I ever decide to disconnect my account.

[VOLBEAT]

Moral of the story, just because it’s a refurbished unit does not mean that there was something wrong with it.



Oh I agree........probably just have a bad taste in my mouth from that one experience, so just don't want to go there if I don't have to.

[DFDureiko]

I myself am very confused buy this. From what I can see E* DVRS are not available in stores you have to order them from E* they are free and they are understandably leased. Only D* seems to "sell" them in retail stores for 299.00 and of course the non DVR boxs as well. I just noticed this thread. I sold our RV with the understanding that the Motosat and HR10 went with it to the new owner. I tried to get an "upgrade" from D* for a HR20 for free or at a discount last week for the new RV, none, so I bought a new-sealed-in-box HR20-100 for 258.00. Do I own it or lease it? should I have sold the TiVo HR10 with the RV or not.
Understanding E* seems easy, you don't pay anything for it and the installer brings it. With D* you have to actually purchase the item for a considerable sum of money from a retailer. so is it really leasing or buying? it all seems so gray to me. Why did they suddenly call it leasing? to the consumer it sure as hell seem like you buying something.
Dan

[carl6]

I myself am very confused buy this. ... so I bought a new-sealed-in-box HR20-100 for 258.00. Do I own it or lease it?

It is leased. When you disconnect it, or cancel your account, it must be returned.


should I have sold the TiVo HR10 with the RV or not.

The Tivo was owned. But you need to delete it from your account (if you haven't already). You were okay selling it.

With D* you have to actually purchase the item for a considerable sum of money from a retailer. so is it really leasing or buying? it all seems so gray to me. Why did they suddenly call it leasing? to the consumer it sure as hell seem like you buying something.
Dan

It is an up-front lease charge, just like if you lease a car - a good example.

It is not hard to understand. It costs DirecTV better than $400 to have an HR20 manufactured. They are so popular right now, they can't keep them in stock - they are selling (leasing) as fast as they are being produced. As a business, DirecTV decided to recover some of that cost, and the market is allowing them to do that.

If you don't agree with this, then you certainly have the option to use a different service provider.

Carl

[JLucPicard]

I tried to get an "upgrade" from D* for a HR20 for free or at a discount last week for the new RV, none, so I bought a new-sealed-in-box HR20-100 for 258.00. Do I own it or lease it?
If you got a new sealed-in-the-box HR20 for $258, it is definitely leased (to purchased a new HR20 that you then own costs around $750). I know this may be wishful thinking, but you should not have been able to walk out of where ever you got the HR20 without knowing that you were leasing. First, there should be a sticker on the box indicating such, but even moreso than that, the retail outlets should be making it very clear that you are leasing. And I do believe that you should have had to sign a lease agreement that explains it as well. (Not having gotten any except from DirecTV and not know where you did get yours, I can't speak directly to what their particular policies are, but I think from DirecTV's standpoint, these Brick-and-Mortar retailers should be making it clear to the consumer that they are leasing).

And DFDureiko, this is not meant as any kind of slam or attack or anything, but I see that you registered on the site in February 2006 - right at the peak of all the discussion regarding DirecTV going to a leasing model. Were you unaware of how the leasing thing works? I'm just a little surprised if you hadn't read all about that here already.

[d0ug]

I currently have a leased HR20 that i purchased from bestbuy for $299. Is it possible to call into directv and pay the difference between $749 and the $299 i have already paid to "convert" this into an owned reciever?

[CJTE]

I currently have a leased HR20 that i purchased from bestbuy for $299. Is it possible to call into directv and pay the difference between $749 and the $299 i have already paid to "convert" this into an owned reciever?

I dont know if they can do that directly, but you could pay the NRF Fee on it whenever you get it disconnected and that'll convert it to an owned receiver.

[JLucPicard]

d0ug,

I would have to parrot what CJTE said, but I'm curious - why would you want to do that? To what end?

[d0ug]

I have no plans to, it was just something I thought of. May help answer someone elses question in the future.