(771) searching for sat. and conversation with 2 CSR's...HELP!

[VOLBEAT]

O.k. I'll try to keep this short as possible...........came home after doing thanksgiving with relatives, put the tv on, and just started looking through the guide, and for some reason, stopped at BravoHD, and got the "searching for satellite" message. I went down the guide, tried a few other HD channels, can't remember which, and they were on, so went back to BravoHD,and it was on, so I figured it was a freak thing, and went channel 2(HD local) to watch the news. I'm just 2 hours north of San Francisco , for whatever it's worth. Got the 771 message again, and on one other HD local.....4, I think, so I did the standard checking of the b band test channels, signal strengths, etc. Everything looked o.k., then I came here to see if anyone was posting about a similar problem.......and no one was,so I called D. The CSR I got had me remove one of the satellite in connectors, and gently rub the copper wire for about ten seconds, saying it would remove any built up static in the line. I did that, connected it again, and the channels I had called about were on, and so were all my HD locals, so figured we fixed it..........talked a bit about how it may have happened, and how my dish isn't grounded, but it should be, and that I'm still within my 90 day warranty period on the HR21 upgrade, and they could send someone out to ground the dish, but the system was screwed up for appointments, so I could call in the morning and get it scheduled. I said fine. Let me add that I have never had a problem where a CSR has had me disconnect the satellite in line and rub the copper wire, but whatever........the channels were back on....right then anyway. So, after hanging up, I went back to guide to go to watch Leno I think it was, and channel 11 was giving me the 771 message, and upon checking, so was 2 and 4. Started checking all my HD locals for a couple minutes, and it was sporadic........2 was searching, 4 was on, then go to maybe 11, it was working, and go back to 4, and it was giving me 771 message again...........just all over the place, so I called D again, got a different CSR, and went through what had happened, including the conversation with the first CSR. He asked me what kind of multiswitch do I have. I told him just whatever is built into the LNB of the slimline, because I only have an HR21 and an old standard receiver in the bedroom.He said it doesn't matter if you only have one receiver, you still need a wideband multiswitch to ensure that all the HD channels work properly. He said they might work just fine without it, but to ensure it, you need a wideband multiswitch. Again, the system was down for scheduling service calls, so he told me I could call in the morning. I'm not buying his theory, but that's why I came here to ask. It sounds ridiculous to me, but waht do I know. The installer that hooked up my HR21 a few weeks ago said I didn't need a multiswitch. This CSR said they are just starting to discover that systems that don't have a multiswitch are having problems like mine, and that they have known about it since the beginning of october. My HR21 was hooked up at the end of october, so ??????? Let me also add that this is the first time since the upgrade a few weeks ago that this has happened.I'm also using Belden 1694a RG6, and all three runs are just under 50 feet .I'm just confused, and not confident that the second CSR is accurate, but I know someone here will have an idea if this makes sense. Sorry for the long post, and I greatly appreciate any and all feedback! Thanks!

[Zuidemac]

It's probably not be related, but I had a new 5lnb dish and HD DVR installed last Saturday, and had all the channels fine, but the last few days all the HD locals have been giving me 771. Just the HD locals - the SD locals and the new HD channels are fine. I called and went through the sat setup and sat 99 failed - he said that's where the hd locals come from, so I scheduled a tech for tomorrow - I'm guessing it's an alignment issue. This morning, they were on, but the signal strengths off 99 were either 0 or very low.

It's too bad the new dvrs don't have OTA receivers any more.

[texasbrit]

O.k. I'll try to keep this short as possible...........came home after doing thanksgiving with relatives, put the tv on, and just started looking through the guide, and for some reason, stopped at BravoHD, and got the "searching for satellite" message. I went down the guide, tried a few other HD channels, can't remember which, and they were on, so went back to BravoHD,and it was on, so I figured it was a freak thing, and went channel 2(HD local) to watch the news. I'm just 2 hours north of San Francisco , for whatever it's worth. Got the 771 message again, and on one other HD local.....4, I think, so I did the standard checking of the b band test channels, signal strengths, etc. Everything looked o.k., then I came here to see if anyone was posting about a similar problem.......and no one was,so I called D. The CSR I got had me remove one of the satellite in connectors, and gently rub the copper wire for about ten seconds, saying it would remove any built up static in the line. I did that, connected it again, and the channels I had called about were on, and so were all my HD locals, so figured we fixed it..........talked a bit about how it may have happened, and how my dish isn't grounded, but it should be, and that I'm still within my 90 day warranty period on the HR21 upgrade, and they could send someone out to ground the dish, but the system was screwed up for appointments, so I could call in the morning and get it scheduled. I said fine. Let me add that I have never had a problem where a CSR has had me disconnect the satellite in line and rub the copper wire, but whatever........the channels were back on....right then anyway. So, after hanging up, I went back to guide to go to watch Leno I think it was, and channel 11 was giving me the 771 message, and upon checking, so was 2 and 4. Started checking all my HD locals for a couple minutes, and it was sporadic........2 was searching, 4 was on, then go to maybe 11, it was working, and go back to 4, and it was giving me 771 message again...........just all over the place, so I called D again, got a different CSR, and went through what had happened, including the conversation with the first CSR. He asked me what kind of multiswitch do I have. I told him just whatever is built into the LNB of the slimline, because I only have an HR21 and an old standard receiver in the bedroom.He said it doesn't matter if you only have one receiver, you still need a wideband multiswitch to ensure that all the HD channels work properly. He said they might work just fine without it, but to ensure it, you need a wideband multiswitch. Again, the system was down for scheduling service calls, so he told me I could call in the morning. I'm not buying his theory, but that's why I came here to ask. It sounds ridiculous to me, but waht do I know. The installer that hooked up my HR21 a few weeks ago said I didn't need a multiswitch. This CSR said they are just starting to discover that systems that don't have a multiswitch are having problems like mine, and that they have known about it since the beginning of october. My HR21 was hooked up at the end of october, so ??????? Let me also add that this is the first time since the upgrade a few weeks ago that this has happened.I'm also using Belden 1694a RG6, and all three runs are just under 50 feet .I'm just confused, and not confident that the second CSR is accurate, but I know someone here will have an idea if this makes sense. Sorry for the long post, and I greatly appreciate any and all feedback! Thanks!
You are correct, you don't need a multiswitch. but you should post back with a list of your signal strengths on all transponders on the 103(a) and 103(b) satellites. ist both tuners if they are different.

[veryoldschool]

You do know what bull sounds like when you hear it.
With three cables, the switch in the dish is all you need.

"Started checking all my HD locals for a couple minutes, and it was sporadic........2 was searching, 4 was on, then go to maybe 11, it was working, and go back to 4, and it was giving me 771 message again...........just all over the place,"

This points to one tune [cable] as being the problem.
Here is how the HR21 is working:
One tuner tuned to channel 2 [771 error].
your change to channel 4 used to other tuner [working]
I think you left out a channel change here [one gave you 771] then channel 11 [worked] and you changed back to channel 4 [771 error].
With no recordings, the tuners swap with each channel change.
Next time you "see this":
Your 771 errors should be on every other channel change. Go to a channel that works, and pull a SAT feed. If you lose the signal, then "that" is your good tuner/cable, and the other tuner cable is what is giving you the problems.
I needed to tighten all of my connectors after my installation. I had one location that was giving 771 errors. It turned out to be loose cables at the dish. One was "looser" than the others. While I was there I inspected the connectors and found they all hadn't been installer properly too. [How can someone screw up compression connectors? By not pressing them on far enough.]
Well if you want to play with it a bit before the tech comes out, you can swap the cables ans see if the 771 searching for signal on tuner #1 or 2, changes tuner number. If the cable is the problem it will change tuners when you swap cables. If a tuner is the problem, then it will always be tuner #x, regardless of which cable is connected to SAT 1 or 2.
Also if you are using your local HD to test this, you can remove the BBCs to see if one of them is the cause.

[VOLBEAT]

You do know what bull sounds like when you hear it.
With three cables, the switch in the dish is all you need.

"Started checking all my HD locals for a couple minutes, and it was sporadic........2 was searching, 4 was on, then go to maybe 11, it was working, and go back to 4, and it was giving me 771 message again...........just all over the place,"

This points to one tune [cable] as being the problem.
Here is how the HR21 is working:
One tuner tuned to channel 2 [771 error].
your change to channel 4 used to other tuner [working]
I think you left out a channel change here [one gave you 771] then channel 11 [worked] and you changed back to channel 4 [771 error].
With no recordings, the tuners swap with each channel change.
Next time you "see this":
Your 771 errors should be on every other channel change. Go to a channel that works, and pull a SAT feed. If you lose the signal, then "that" is your good tuner/cable, and the other tuner cable is what is giving you the problems.
I needed to tighten all of my connectors after my installation. I had one location that was giving 771 errors. It turned out to be loose cables at the dish. One was "looser" than the others. While I was there I inspected the connectors and found they all hadn't been installer properly too. [How can someone screw up compression connectors? By not pressing them on far enough.]
Well if you want to play with it a bit before the tech comes out, you can swap the cables ans see if the 771 searching for signal on tuner #1 or 2, changes tuner number. If the cable is the problem it will change tuners when you swap cables. If a tuner is the problem, then it will always be tuner #x, regardless of which cable is connected to SAT 1 or 2.
Also if you are using your local HD to test this, you can remove the BBCs to see if one of them is the cause.

Well, hopefully it's related.........turned the tv on this morning and only channel 2 was out, and all the other locals were fine. Checked my signal strengths on both tuners again, and all seemed fine. Went back and was having almost identical problems as last night and heavy pixelating on every local, and was about to try what you said with swapping cables and whatnot, and a message came on a light gray screen that says no need to call us, we are aware that this tv station is temporarily unavailable and will have it back as soon as possible. Have that on every local hd station right now, so maybe that was the problem all along. When the stations come back, I'll continue to monitor it.

[veryoldschool]

Well, hopefully it's related.........turned the tv on this morning and only channel 2 was out, and all the other locals were fine. Checked my signal strengths on both tuners again, and all seemed fine. Went back and was having almost identical problems as last night and heavy pixelating on every local, and was about to try what you said with swapping cables and whatnot, and a message came on a light gray screen that says no need to call us, we are aware that this tv station is temporarily unavailable and will have it back as soon as possible. Have that on every local hd station right now, so maybe that was the problem all along. When the stations come back, I'll continue to monitor it.
That sounds like a problem at your local DirecTV uplink office.
The tuner swapping works the same way for the national channels, so if you can go stepping through them fine, it's not your tuners or cables.

[VOLBEAT]

That sounds like a problem at your local DirecTV uplink office.
The tuner swapping works the same way for the national channels, so if you can go stepping through them fine, it's not your tuners or cables.

Well, all the locals are back on now, so I'll go through and check out a bunch of channels. If I get the 771 message again, I'll do the tuner swapping. That multiswitch thing the CSR wa talking about last night just seemed pretty ridiculous to me, especially when the first CSR 15 minutes before didn't mention a thing about a multswitch.

[VOLBEAT]

Here's my 103 numbers, just for the heck of it......

103(a)

1-8 0 99 0 98 0 100 na na
9-16 na na na na na na 100 0
17-24 95 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
25-32 all na

103(b)

1-8 92 95 94 90 90 94 90 91
9-16 90 95 93 94 94 95 na na
17-24 95 na na na na 96 na na
25-32 all na


Identical on both tuners......at least at that moment.

[veryoldschool]

Here's my 103 numbers, just for the heck of it......

103(a)

1-8 0 99 0 98 0 100 na na
9-16 na na na na na na 100 0
17-24 95 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
25-32 all na

103(b)

1-8 92 95 94 90 90 94 90 91
9-16 90 95 93 94 94 95 na na
17-24 95 na na na na 96 na na
25-32 all na

Identical on both tuners......at least at that moment.
Those look good/great. :)

[VOLBEAT]

That what I was thinking also.........all locals still on, so time will tell if was a D problem all along. If it comes up again, I will do the cable swapping. No harm in leaving one cable disconnected to give it time to show/not show a problem (since it is sporadic to a degree), if I'm not planning on recording something I'm not watching, correct?

[baritony]

Ok. I and my dad are having the same problem. Ive been rebooting to 'fix' the problem but now I realize I was fixing anything


I went to his place to troubleshoot his system.

He just had a hr21-700 installed Tuesday and the same sort of thing is happening as Norcal.

The installer for my dads( i was there and this guy was VERY good, MI-Microtech out of Novi) and everything was done well.

The installer even put lok-tite on the connectors, I tell ya this guy was very good!

I thought about finding out if it was just one feed. I did the record one channel and isolated it to one cable coming in. I tried swapping the bbc and it still was the one cable feed. So it was only failing on one tuner.

I had found that the OTA feed was 'mixed' with a proper combiner and then separated back out right before the hr21.
[side note...The hr21 does not have an OTA input so the OTA feed was run directly into the display.]

On my system, I have an hr20-100 AND a Hr 20-700 and the failure is only one one unit. I have yet to investigate it and I will right after this but I now know the reboot was only faking a fix. So thank you guys! This has helped me in my troubleshoot.


So anyway, I at my dads I called D and they said they would send out a tech tomorrow ( I was surprised on how quick) and that there would be no charge since it was a new install recently BUT that normally it would be $70 for a service call. YIKES.
She then tried to sell me a maintenance plan but I passed for the time being. I just wanted to pass along the cost info.

Anyway, my dad is suppose to have a tech out btw noon & 4pm tomorrow. We will see if he has any failures by then and will report back here.

I will investigate my system and report back as well.

I know my writing and story if all over the place but hey, I am a scrambled dude!

[DtvSlave]

Here's my 103 numbers, just for the heck of it......

103(a)

1-8 0 99 0 98 0 100 na na
9-16 na na na na na na 100 0
17-24 95 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
25-32 all na

103(b)

1-8 92 95 94 90 90 94 90 91
9-16 90 95 93 94 94 95 na na
17-24 95 na na na na 96 na na
25-32 all na


Identical on both tuners......at least at that moment.


We don't use the 103a around here but i do know that when i setup a receiver in a customers house and one of the sats show 0's on every other transponder, that normally indicated a problem that needs fixed.

sometimes it's a splitter in the line or a multiswitch problem. (which u don't have one)

other times it could be a bad lnb, bad barrel in the line with the wrong insert not rated for high def.

A couple of times it had even been that when i pulled the connector loose somewhere in the line that either (A.) the plastic coating was still on part of the copper conductor. (B.) a small piece of the ground braid was touching the copper conductor. or (C.) when you look into the end of the cable the dielectric was not smooth, rather had a small divot missing from where the installer just jammed the connector on and messed up the end, which messes with the rotation of the signal as it enters or leaves the cable.

I'm not sure if any of this will help but if I had tried everything else this is a few places i would look.

[VOLBEAT]

We don't use the 103a around here but i do know that when i setup a receiver in a customers house and one of the sats show 0's on every other transponder, that normally indicated a problem that needs fixed.



I did have that problem a while back with my 103b......every other one was 0, and I wasn't getting the newly launched HD channels. That led to a service call, which resulted in swapping out my sidecar dish for the slimline, and problem solved. It's my understanding that those 0 readings on my 103a are irrelavant, in my case. I do appreciate pointing that out as a possible problem though!

[veryoldschool]

It's my understanding that those 0 readings on my 103a are irrelavant, in my case. I do appreciate pointing that out as a possible problem though!
Until DirecTV finds another DMA in our area, the "zeros" are just because "there is nothing there".

[VOLBEAT]

Until DirecTV finds another DMA in our area, the "zeros" are just because "there us nothing there".

Thanks! Was pretty sure I was right, just don't know the 'technical' reason:)

Edit: VOS.......do you think this problem I've been having could be related to the cable not being grounded, because the first CSR mentioned that last night? I told him not one installer has ever even mentioned grounding it, and I have heard different theories on how important it is and isn't, so I haven't worried about it. He also said the grouinding block has to be within 12 feet of a grounding rod or my copper plumbing. Neither is that close with the present dish location, but that will change sooner or later, as I am getting a new roof on my house in the spring and will have to relocate the dish at least during the work period, but have decided on a great new location that will only require the monopoles to attach to the roof in the eave area, and will put my dish with 12 feet of a grounding rod that I pounded into the ground 10 years ago for my first sony dish. The CSR said they would send someone out to ground it as part on an incomplete install, but if that 12 foot rule is accurate, then it's waste of time, so I might as well wait until I move the dish. Just curious, while I'm thinking of it. Thanks.

[texasbrit]

Thanks! Was pretty sure I was right, just don't know the 'technical' reason:)
Yes, it can be very confusing. On a set of transponders like 103(a), that are all spotbeams, seeing only evens or only odds can just be a matter of where you are located and not necessarily be a sign of a problem like it would be on the other satellites.

[VOLBEAT]

Yes, it can be very confusing. On a set of transponders like 103(a), that are all spotbeams, seeing only evens or only odds can just be a matter of where you are located and not necessarily be a sign of a problem like it would be on the other satellites.
Yeah, had me worried(and on the phone to D) the first time I saw that.