DishPVR 721 PIP functionality

[TooMuchInfo]

Hi All,

I just got a 721 as a xmas gift. going through all the features I can not understand the PIP

Based on my experience with PIP, I thought I would be able to change the channel in the PIP window. This is not the case. Is this right.

The way it works is I have to use the primary screen for surfing and watch a no-sound PIP window for constant viewing.

I must be doing something wrong. Is there a way to change the channel in the PIP window?

Great site, tons of information

thanks
Rich

[rjenkins]

You'll have to press 'swap' to swap to the PIP picture, change the channel, then swap back. Only way that I know of.

[TooMuchInfo]

I was afraid of that.

So even though the 721 has 2 tuners, you still have to bring it to the primary to change the channel and then swap it back.

Is a software limitation? maybe something that Dish might be able to change with an download upgrade.


My wife gets annoyed by having me flip her show back and forth as I am trying to zone in on a program...

So the dish logo button and the red button do nothing.

I was hoping they would swap tuner control to one window or the other.

thanks
Rich

[sampatterson]

Would be nice if Dish added discrete channel IR changing codes for each tuner, and the current code would affect whichever was being used as the primary.

[zimm0who0net]

It almost certainly could be changed through a software update. The problem is that there's not a good choice for buttons on the remote control to control this. It's unfortunate that when Dish was re-designing their remote for PIP they didn't learn from nearly every PIP enabled TV out there which almost universally have 5-6 buttons to control the PIP functionality.

[raj2001]

Originally posted by zimm0who0net
It's unfortunate that when Dish was re-designing their remote for PIP they didn't learn from nearly every PIP enabled TV out there which almost universally have 5-6 buttons to control the PIP functionality.

They could easily define one button to be a "ch control" button a la UltimateTV. On the UTV to change channels you press PiP then ch control and then you can change channels as you please.

[treiher]

I agree! Most T.V.'s which have PIP built into them, have separate channel up and channel down buttons so you can change the PIP channel without swapping to it. Nothing fancy, just a simple change channel. Since the new Platinum Plus remote doesn't have that, they could use the page-up and page-down buttons to this. Only in PIP mode when the guide or other menu options are not pulled up. I don't believe those buttons do anything in that situation. It's similar to what they did with slow mo and frame advance. Use existing buttons, but when the program is paused, they function differently. They could do this, and it would be a nice improvement. Maybe we should add that to the 721 wish list?

[larrydj]

Or have the left/right cursor determine whether the main picture or PIP is enabled for channel control. Then it would be easy to do either.

I also think that SWAP should switch tuners, even if the PIP isn't on. That'd be sweet.

[Jacob S]

I will add it to my wish list website.

[DmitriA]

I don't think that merely switching the channel up and down is all that useful by itself. If you are going to do it, you should make it so you can actually specify a channel number for the PIP tuner

[Jacob S]

Another good idea, thanks. How about being able to do the pvr functions in the PIP screen while remaining on the main screen without having to swap.

[DmitriA]

Well, all of these things - being able to switch channels (up/down or by number), recall previous channel, pvr functions, etc are best done via a stateful system where by pressing some particular button you tell the system that the next command that is to come in the next few seconds is directed to the PIP tuner and not the main one. Then you can support ALL the functions of the main window in the PIP one

[zimm0who0net]

I think Dmitri's suggestion is probably the best, but I just don't see a suitable candidate for the "context switch" button on the remote. You could stick it behind the page up or page down buttons, but that's pretty confusing. How many tech support calls will it generate when someone accidentally presses the page up button and is now stuck in the state where all their actions control the PIP window? There's not any writing next to the page down button that implies that it can get you out of this state.
This should have been thought of while they were designing the remote. They could have easily put a nice "switch context" button (or something written a little less geeky) right down with the other 3 PIP buttons. Unfortunately they spent their time/effort/money on creating a "Dish" button that glows when you push it, but otherwise does absolutely nothing...

[treiher]

Ahhha! Yes, the fancy button that glows but does nothing! Actually on the 501/508 it does. It takes you to Dish Home. Those features will be available on the 721 with the dreaded "eventually" time frame. Regarding PIP control, how about this . . . whenever you adjust channel up or down (whichever buttons that is assigned to, I still think Page-up and Page-down are good candidates since they do nothing when the PIP window is up), it brings up the banner with a "PIP" heading in there somewhere. Then you can adjust the PIP channel just like the browse feature, allowing you to scan through the channels quickly without waiting for the PIP window to lock in (you know, that 5 sec. delay thing). Just an idea.

[DmitriA]

Originally posted by zimm0who0net
How many tech support calls will it generate when someone accidentally presses the page up button and is now stuck in the state where all their actions control the PIP window?

You can be taken out of the PIP-action mode automatically if you do not perform another legal action (like a channel change) in the next few seconds. Just an idea...

But yeah, I agree - the remote is very badly design. They haven't though through how to do any of the potential 'future' options that they were clearly at least thinking about supporting at the design time (like slow motion and frame advance)

[Jacob S]

There are ways, how about implementing the * and # and Dish and i buttons for different things?

[krlauver]

The number symbol button starts a search. One thing that is neat is that when you press the number symbol it automatically fills in the field with the current show in case you want to search for future events.

But I guess your suggestion was to allow it to do other things, right?

[DmitriA]

The use of # for search is an excellent example of the bad design of the remote - that feature has been there from the very beginning and they clearly new about it before shipping the product, yet they have failed to create a designated button for the search function :rant:

[Jacob S]

Have that one button do several things, like pressing the star/pound button then a number to do a function. It would be a shortcut, or could serve as doing anything such as accessing different features, menu's, functions, etc.

[larrydj]

Either the Page Up/Down or the Cursor Left/Right could be the control that designates whether Main Window or PIP is the actively controlled tuner. I would suggest changing the border color and perhaps thickness around the PIP to indicate that it is active. If users get confused, they could always opt out of PIP for a few seconds, which would change tuner control to the visible tuner.

[Mark]

Who writes the software for the 721?
Can you email or make suggestion online for the next upgrade.

[Jacob S]

I think the page up/down (channel up/down for vcr) button would be great for doing this.

[treiher]

larrydj, you've got it! That's perfect. That is exactly what they should do. Scott, are you watching this thread? Anyway we can make this idea more visible to Dish?

[DmitriA]

I would actually prefer the left/right button. I find them easier to reach and press than the page/down ones

[Jacob S]

How about both?

[zimm0who0net]

Wait, the left/right buttons already do stuff. Right brings up the quick pop-over guide. Left brings up the filter window. Furthermore, the buttons are already labeled as such...

[tm22721]

I architect and write GUI code for a living.

The worst thing you can do to a user is create 'modes' where the user must remember which mode he is in. Even putting reminders on the screen is not good enough for novices since they could accidentally get into a mode and not know it. very bad for tech support call volume and customer relations.

Most GUI architects have learned the hard way that it is better to leave some features out of a GUI, than to add modes.

[DmitriA]

I know, but do you have a better idea? The options are very limited at this point.. Personally, I'd rather have a feature with modes that than nothing

[Jacob S]

same here, would rather have some type of extra functionality, you cant just stop just bc the extra buttons are not there. you can only have so many buttons on a remote. the more buttons the more complex for some. those that do not want to use the features dont have to use them and those extra features can be there for those that want to use them by pressing extra buttons.