View Full Version : Now the increase...PLEASE ADD YES NETWORK & B MANIA TV...
rolou21
01-09-03, 05:38 PM
Charlie you got your $2 raise across the board...now there is no excuse to add the yes network and b mania tv.
In fact those who seriously want Yes please state you results from this thread.....
Or does Charlie want to lose subscribers to *D.
2 seasons without Yes is not good!
YES would make sense given Nets are doing extremely well. I cant say about B Mania, its not a mainstream channel and isnt backed by a big provider that demands it carried.
NewsCorp (Fox), NBC, and Disney usually tie their channels into retransmission.
Ronmort
01-09-03, 06:54 PM
I am hoping for YES also. I have a gut feeling it will be on this year. This and Extra Innings in the future will make Dish the perfect service for me. Right now I would settle for YES.
If Dish does not get the Yes Network soon; then I'm going to DTV.
AT100
HBO works
jeffwtux
01-09-03, 09:41 PM
I think it's quite pathetic that DirecTV can afford all of these stations(YES, NESN, OLN, Bloomberg....) for $31.99 and Dish can't even get YES or NESN for $33.99. I'm a retailier, and I think that AT100 is a total rippoff compared to DirecTV. People why are you waiting around with Dish for any certain package that DirecTV has??? Dish just gave you the added incentive to switch. Are you listening Charlie??? You just gave any customer, who MIGHT have waited around for you to get the programming that DirecTV already has, the incentive to switch to DirecTV.
TNGTony
01-10-03, 12:05 AM
Look at the company making money.
Now look at the company losing money.
There is your answer. :)
See ya
Tony
Scott Greczkowski
01-10-03, 01:14 AM
Adding YES network is $2 a month per subscriber charge that Dish must pay YES in order to broadcast it. It's just not worth it.
jeffwtux
01-10-03, 01:19 AM
Then how is DirecTV affording it at $31.99 with more channels. I gave Dish a lot of slack before and defended them against most critics, but not now. If the want to be more money than Direc(AT100 vs. TC), then they better have more channels not less. TC has way more channels and is now $2 less(I'm sure you knew that Scott, but added it anyway).
Oh yeah, congrats on your baby boy.
Scott Greczkowski
01-10-03, 01:23 AM
Again read Tony's post.
One DBS company is making money, another one is not. (The one that is making money does not have YES or the NFL package) :)
jeffwtux
01-10-03, 01:32 AM
Well, then one company will be gaining customers and the other will be losing them(The one that will be gaining is the one I'm not a retailer of, and the one that is losing them is the one I am a retailer of, but I won't mention names either) :)
jeffwtux
01-10-03, 01:37 AM
BTW: I didn't criticize Chuck for "knowing when to say when" :) on the Sunday Ticket auction. It wouldn't have been worth it to anybody at E* to have paid what DirecTV paid to keep it exclusive. Not that you said I did.
Ronmort
01-10-03, 04:09 AM
Originally posted by TNGTony
Look at the company making money.
Now look at the company losing money.
There is your answer. :)
See ya
Tony
So follow this logic even further: DTV is losing money because they have YES? And the one making money is the service raising its rates. Give me a break!
What the hell is Dish waiting for. Add Yes already... DAM!
I would think that most big Yankee baseball fans on E* have already switched to D*. I guess some people were probably in contract and couldn't, but still I have to imagine YES isn't a big priority for E*. If it wasn't for my free 501, I would have switched last season. I don't have much hope for this season.
Originally posted by fresco
If Dish does not get the Yes Network soon; then I'm going to DTV.
AT100
HBO works
I just visited Circuit City last night to plan on my conversion.
I am so unhappy about this as I love Dish, but I CAN'T go another season without the Yankees and Nets.
It's extremely unfortunate.
Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski
Again read Tony's post.
One DBS company is making money, another one is not. (The one that is making money does not have YES or the NFL package) :)
Scott, CONGRATS!!!!!
Originally posted by TNGTony
Look at the company making money.
Now look at the company losing money.
There is your answer. :)
See ya
Tony
Realistically, if you switch to D* for YES, you run a very low risk of losing service. Someone is going to pick up 10 million satellite subs and there will be significant liability/uproar if they don't honor their contracts to provide particular channels (YES included).
What is the real chance that D* will go belly-up with no warning and no suitors? Not much from my vantage point.
The issue of profitability is somewhat moot here.
P.S. I am a Dish fan, but moreso a Yankee fan, so I say this all with a great deal of reluctance and disappointment.
Actually I'd wait.
The price increases at Dish, will probably cover YES carriage.
YES will probably be coming soon.
Originally posted by Brett
Actually I'd wait.
The price increases at Dish, will probably cover YES carriage.
YES will probably be coming soon.
Brett,
Just talked with a Customer Service rep last night in the ceo@echostar.com group (EVP Office) and her comment was "we obviously don't want to lose you, but the outlook for us getting the YES Network by the beginning of the season is not good. Don't hold your breath. If you need it, your olny real option is to switch."
It appears they aren't even negotiating together. The price hike most likely will cover the failed merger costs, not YES inclusion.
DarrellP
01-10-03, 10:28 AM
If Dish adds YES, I hope it's A La Carte because I can't get it and I don't want to pay $2/month so you can watch it.
Originally posted by DarrellP
If Dish adds YES, I hope it's A La Carte because I can't get it and I don't want to pay $2/month so you can watch it.
Exactly. You're not the only one. If that increase goes to cover YES, there'd be significant consumer backlash.
Dollars to donuts they won't get YES by the season's start, if at all.
I don't want YES added and would rather see the ESPNs and regional sports channels carved out into a seperate tier, like the superstations.
Originally posted by lee635
I don't want YES added and would rather see the ESPNs and regional sports channels carved out into a seperate tier, like the superstations.
So, the NYers pay for your sports channels and they don't get them?
Doesn't seem so fair.....
toomuchtv
01-10-03, 12:23 PM
For MY money, put ALL the sports channels (ESPN's,Outdoor, OLN & Golf, etc.) into the Sports Pkg. & lower my AT150 accordingly.
DmitriA
01-10-03, 12:33 PM
Originally posted by jeffwtux
Well, then one company will be gaining customers and the other will be losing them
Yeah, DirecTV DSL was also gaining customers in droves because of much better service plans for the same price as other providers. Now you can see where that lead them :(
In case Echostar is reading this (?) ...
Please add Fox Sports West 2 to the multi-sport package - this can be your "bone" to those of us getting hit with the $1 (equates to 20%) increase in this package. Thanks.
Ronmort
01-10-03, 05:07 PM
I hope no one is under the impression that YES was going to charge Dish Network $18 million per month for their channel. I think Charlie exaggerated the cost of YES to justify his refusal to pay for the channel for customers in the YES DMA. Does anyone really believe that Directv is paying YES over $30 million per month to provide YES? I keep reading about this $2 per month cost for every customer, but I don't think so. I think it's more like $2 for every customer in the NY region and something extra to place it on the sports pack or multi-sports package. Get real! God, people are so gullible.
These damn sports chanels are a big reason why subscriptions costs keep going up and up. These services need to be placed in a premuim package and those that want them can pay for them. I'm sick of subsidizing sports channels. In my opinion, thats why ESPN and the like have strict guidelines that providers can't carve these out of the program packages nad offer them al-a-carte, because millions of us wouldn't take them and thus they'd lose millions of dollars in revenue. But somethings gotta give eventually - people can't keep absorbing these astronomical rate increases from the cable and satellite providers.
I am more than happy to pay for it if it is offered. Obviously true if I'm willing to eat the cost and effort of switching to D* for just this channel. What a royal disappointment.
Frustrated_Fred
01-11-03, 04:33 AM
Why doesn't Charlie get rid of FSNY; I mean this is a useless station now... Get rid of FSNY and put the Yes Network in its place... I could only imagine the many customers that Dish is losing to DTV because they don't have the Yes Network...
Why is Charlie doing this to us?... I mean really; he's raising the price and has not added a single good channel to my AT100 lineup... Are you kidding me!!!!!
Also NO one in my area wants those dish certificates... I’m seeing so many DTV dishes in my area its not even funny!... Heck my neighbors have already switched to DTV and there laughing at the fact that I still have Dish Network... How much longer do I Have to Wait Charlie???
Seems to me that Dish Network is only concerned about adding locals and they seem to be focusing more on rural America...Dish Network is not going to survive in the NY,NJ area if they can't accommodate there loyal customers with the channels that they want... At least give us Yes to give us a reason to pay an extra 2 bucks a month.
Ronmort
01-11-03, 11:04 AM
There are Mets games on FSNY, and there are many Mets fans who enjoy those games. Dish could have MSG, FSNY, and YES for the NY area fans. Nothing has to be removed. I also agree with Minnow. Sports channels could be optional for a monthly fee, but the channel owners will not let them offer them in that fashion.
platinum
01-11-03, 11:21 AM
Originally posted by Frustrated_Fred
Why doesn't Charlie get rid of FSNY; I mean this is a useless station now... Get rid of FSNY and put the Yes Network in its place... I could only imagine the many customers that Dish is losing to DTV because they don't have the Yes Network...
Why is Charlie doing this to us?... I mean really; he's raising the price and has not added a single good channel to my AT100 lineup... Are you kidding me!!!!!
Also NO one in my area wants those dish certificates... I’m seeing so many DTV dishes in my area its not even funny!... Heck my neighbors have already switched to DTV and there laughing at the fact that I still have Dish Network... How much longer do I Have to Wait Charlie???
Seems to me that Dish Network is only concerned about adding locals and they seem to be focusing more on rural America...Dish Network is not going to survive in the NY,NJ area if they can't accommodate there loyal customers with the channels that they want... At least give us Yes to give us a reason to pay an extra 2 bucks a month.
FSNY also carries Islander games, so go get yourself a D* system you'll be happy you did. :D
YES can only get the $2 per month from subscribers if carried, within the New York-New Jersey sports market.
I believe this includes New York DMA, Wilkes-Barre Scranton DMA, most of New York State(except maybe Buffalo??), Hartford-New Haven DMA, and Mercer County, NJ (1 county in Philly DMA).
I read somewhere MSG used to charge less in areas outside the NYC DMA but still in the NY sports market, but I think YES charges the same to all providers.
This does not include Springfield, MA DMA (only 25 miles from Hartford), South Jersey(Burlington Camden Gloucester Atlantic Cumberland Cape May Salem Co.), or the Philly DMA part of Lehigh Valley (even though in Lehigh Valley WPIX WWOR WNBC WNYW are carried on cable, and NYC AM FM get ratings there). There are some Yankees fans in Lehigh Valley but they do not get the sports casts since WPIX doesnt carry Yankees anymore.
I do know the cable systems in the Allentown and even Southern NJ area get requests for YES Network, but its not YES territory. Comcast though had to add YES in Trenton, and its Northern-Central NJ systems.
In theory, Comcast would rather Trenton not get the NY RSNs because then it increases the likelihood people in Trenton will became fans of NY sports teams, over their owned Sixers and Flyers. But Comcast doesnt have much say. Since they agreed to carry YES, they have to carry it on all their systems in the New York-New Jersey sports market. They cant carry it on some lineups, and not others. YES would accept a deal like that.
YES wouldnt accept a deal like that.
Charlie_the_cheapskate
01-11-03, 09:24 PM
I can see why cablevision doesn't want Yes (competition from Nets and Yankees)... Cablevision owns msg and they do not want to risk losing some of there viewers to The Yes Network...
But for the life of Me I can not see the reason why Dish Network can't get the Yes Network.... Is Dish Network that cheap that they would rather put the money in there pocket and not add this much needed station in the NY,NJ area... I Just don't get it!
You mean to tell me that the cable companies and DTV are losing money because they have Yes... I see Dish Network as the big loser in this one..
from: future DTV subscriber
platinum
01-11-03, 09:29 PM
Originally posted by Charlie_the_cheapskate
I can see why cablevision doesn't want Yes (competition from Nets and Yankees)... Cablevision owns msg and they do not want to risk losing some of there viewers to The Yes Network...
But for the life of Me I can not see the reason why Dish Network can't get the Yes Network.... Is Dish Network that cheap that they would rather put the money in there pocket and not add this much needed station in the NY,NJ area... I Just don't get it!
You mean to tell me that the cable companies and DTV are losing money because they have Yes... I see Dish Network as the big loser in this one..
from: future DTV subscriber
Get D* you wont be sorry
Brett, join the fun and register. Not being a Guest may add some credibility here.
I am also a Yankee fan, but my understanding is that YES requires that Dish pay based on their entire subscriber base, not just those who can "get" the channel.
It's almost impossible to know what the real requirements are on both sides. The fact is, I still can't get the Yanks and the people "in the know" at Echostar appear to have no hope whatsoever they will be getting YES.
I don't see any other viable/secure option for getting the network before the season than moving to D*.
Sorry, Charlie.
Steve Mehs
01-12-03, 09:33 AM
Please add Fox Sports West 2 to the multi-sport package - this can be your "bone" to those of us getting hit with the $1 (equates to 20%) increase in this package.
Actually the 'bone' is NBA TV and the possible retention of NESN. The contract between E* and FSNW2 is only for carriage in it's home area, that's why it's not in the sports pak and why it's on a west coast spot beam.
If YES is offered I hope it's a la carte also, or it won't make anything go up. I hate baseball with a passion, and even if offered, even though I'm in Yankee territory, I most likely won't get it anyhow, as I never got MSG from Dish.
BTW- I believe Brett is already registered :)
Originally posted by Steve Mehs
Actually the 'bone' is NBA TV and the possible retention of NESN. The contract between E* and FSNW2 is only for carriage in it's home area, that's why it's not in the sports pak and why it's on a west coast spot beam.That's a pretty gnarly looking bone they're throwing us then - NBA TV without the games included (unless they plan to change this after the free preview ends). If I want to see NBA scores, I tune to ESPN2.
As for FSW2, they can always update he contract. :) I'm concerned that as new channels are added (YES someday?) or contracts are renewed (NESN) more channels could be deleted from the Multi-sport package until it is pretty much worthless. The goal should be to have every RSN included in the package.
So, what is the overall impression here? Am I wasting my money converting to D*? Does everyone expect YES to be carried by April 2003?
All indications I've seen so far are that we should not expect YES and that E* is not in any negotiations at all with them.
i.e. if they're not talking, they won't come to an agreement.....
Steve Mehs
01-13-03, 05:58 PM
NBA TV without the games included (unless they plan to change this after the free preview ends). If I want to see NBA scores, I tune to ESPN2.
NBA games should be shown. I went into the EPG and next week, after the NBA LP preview is over, non LP subs still can get the games on NBA TV.
Frustrated_Fred
01-13-03, 08:55 PM
cnsf
Have you switched to DTV yet? Anyway I doubt cheap Charlie will ever get the Yes Network... Seems to me that Dish Network will not be the Choice for the NY, NJ sports fan... Those of you that want Yes Network must be Heard...
Is Dish Network just too cheap to get the channels we want or is DTV just the bigger better deal? Does Charlie personally do the negotiations with the networks for a contract? You mean to tell me Charlie does not have the ability to come to some sort of agreement with the Yes Network?... DTV did!!!
The customer service people have no clue about what is going on between Dish and Yes... who In the Dish organization can i contact to get some answers to my Yes questions ?..Charlie?..whats his email address?
Check here:
http://servicedesk.dbstalk.com/EmailContacts.htm
Originally posted by Frustrated_Fred
cnsf
Have you switched to DTV yet? Anyway I doubt cheap Charlie will ever get the Yes Network... Seems to me that Dish Network will not be the Choice for the NY, NJ sports fan... Those of you that want Yes Network must be Heard...
Is Dish Network just too cheap to get the channels we want or is DTV just the bigger better deal? Does Charlie personally do the negotiations with the networks for a contract? You mean to tell me Charlie does not have the ability to come to some sort of agreement with the Yes Network?... DTV did!!!
The customer service people have no clue about what is going on between Dish and Yes... who In the Dish organization can i contact to get some answers to my Yes questions ?..Charlie?..whats his email address?
Not yet, still trying to find the best price/installer.
I contacted someone in the EVP's office via ceo@echostar.com (Suzy - she's excellent, helpful, polite, etc.). That's the way to get the best answers possible.
Originally posted by Steve Mehs
NBA games should be shown. I went into the EPG and next week, after the NBA LP preview is over, non LP subs still can get the games on NBA TV. OK, I modify my statement above, that is a fairly tasty bone after all. :) I'm personally not a big NBA fan (prefer college hoops), but I like the option of having at least one NBA game to check out every night ...
NY/NJ_Area
01-16-03, 05:29 AM
I wonder if anyone at dish Network actually comes to this site and read the forums? If they do then I’m pretty sure they can see how many of there customers are getting pissed off at them... But maybe Dish Network doesn't care about what the customers want or think...
Anyway I don't think Yes Network will ever be on Dish Network... NY, NJ sports fans and I mean Yankee, Nets and soon Devil fans will have to switch to DTV.. I know I am! Wow! I have to commend DTV for doing an excellent job of getting the channels that people want to see.... Congratulations DTV for being the best!
Also NBA TV; is this channel only acquired by getting NBA League Pass? Or will NBA TV be part of AT 100 or AT150?
Steve Mehs
01-16-03, 05:52 AM
I wonder if anyone at dish Network actually comes to this site and read the forums?
Yes people from both E* and D* visit the forums quite often :)
Mike123abc
01-16-03, 10:23 AM
Dish has probably figured out that not carrying Yes will not hurt them. Yes there will be some outraged fans that will change over to DirecTV, but they will be few. Dish probably saves enough not carrying those nets to pay for all the subscribers that might leave.
Cheap_Charlie
01-17-03, 03:16 AM
Charlie is a freaking cheapskate! That is why Yes and other new channels are not in the Line Up... Lets Face it DTV is just a better company than Dish! Seems to me that DTV cares more for there customers than Dish! I wonder how long before Dish becomes just another primestar?
Originally posted by Cheap_Charlie
Charlie is a freaking cheapskate! That is why Yes and other new channels are not in the Line Up... Lets Face it DTV is just a better company than Dish! Seems to me that DTV cares more for there customers than Dish! I wonder how long before Dish becomes just another primestar?
Mark Holtz
01-17-03, 09:34 AM
It appears that some of the New York Yankees fans aren't aware of all the fact behind YE$.
Both Dish Network and Cablevision are holdouts on the YES Network. Cablevision owns the MSG network, where the Yankees used to air until George Steinbrenner elected to buy out the contract and start up the YE$ network.
According to published reports, YE$ wants $1.85 per subscriber and be placed in a basic package. This does not even factor in the costs of getting the signal to Dish's uplink facilities. Dish's and Cablevision's counter-offer was to offer the channel a'la carte, but YE$ said no to that offer. In addition, there is a clause that makes the contracts that YE$ provides open to other multi-channel providers, so if YE$ negotiates a better rate for one provider, the other providers have the right to ask for a better rate.
This is not the first situation with a problematic sports network. Comcast Philadelphia has a R$N that carries several sports teams it owns, including the 76ers. Because the distribution is via terrestrial means, it is using a loophole in the law. As a result, while the R$N is carried on neighboring cable systems, it is simply NOT AVAILABLE to either DirecTV or Dish because they are competitors. As a result, DBS has a lower-than-average percentage penetration in that market.
Oh, and you can't do an end-run by subscribing to a Extra Innings package or NBA package. They are designed to protect the home team.
Ronmort
01-17-03, 10:30 AM
And here is another unfortunate aspect to all this. There are those of us who are part of the zones of both the Philadelphia and New York teams. So with Dish, I don't get the Phils, Flyers, Sixers, Yankees, or Nets. Right now, I am getting the Sixers and Nets in the NBA LP. If Dish had the MLB EI, I would buy it even if the Yankees and Phils were blacked out because I would get a lot of other teams which I like better anyway.
Originally posted by jeffwtux
Well, then one company will be gaining customers and the other will be losing them(The one that will be gaining is the one I'm not a retailer of, and the one that is losing them is the one I am a retailer of, but I won't mention names either) :)
Except that Echostar continues to gain market share. We criticize how poorly E* services its consumers but it is the darling of Wall Street compared to DirecTV.
The year-end number are not in yet, but until E* starts LOSING market share, don't expect any radical change of policy. Taken in total, E* appears to have more new customer appeal than does DirecTV... or perhaps its because DirecTV has been hacked more and just can't get legit subs as fast as E*.
Mike123abc
01-17-03, 01:02 PM
The problem that DBS faces is that the easy fruit has been picked. Most people who cannot get good cable are switched now.
Now the deciding choice of DBS vs cable will come down to price. Why would I in TX want to to pay $1.85/month to get YES when I would never watch it? I know people scream that D* has it and E* does not. But, I would point out that E* makes money now because they have kept expenses down. D* has a problem, to make money they will probably have to raise prices above E*, this is something they cannot do without killing themselves. Expect them to match every price increase that E* makes. E* does not care because they can watch D* slowly bleed to death.
D* is a business, even though now they have a large parent corp to keep them afloat, if that changes expect to see major cost savings suddenly appear. YES could be dropped like the hot potato it is.
FTA Michael
01-17-03, 02:03 PM
The cable companies keep generating new "easy fruit." With every outage, every rate increase, every bone-headed CSR call, they drive more customers to look for alternatives. And to stretch the analogy, the easiest fruit is the fruit you've already picked; existing subscribers have a lot of inertia to stay with DBS.
Question: I'm confused about the YES pricing. Texas subscribers can't get YES (ignoring the sports pack for a moment), so YES couldn't charge E* for them, right? We're only talking about YES's sports teams' market area, since YES would be one of those subscribers' RSNs. Am I correct so far?
Next, I wonder how the pricing works for the sports pack. If I get a dozen Fox sports networks, plus MSG, NESN, etc., for $6, then they can't all be charging Dish $1 each for me. So, for example, does that mean that NESN charges Dish two rates: one for in-market and another for mostly-blacked-out out-of-market?
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