Install refused - LOS issue

[pgb]

After years of ever increasing costs and inefficiencies with cable, my wife and I decided to take the plunge and go with DirectTV.

Two days ago, this pimply faced kid who looked all of about 20 parked his personal van with no DirectTV logo on it in our driveway. He then asked me to speak to his supervisor on his cell phone to confirm that he was "on site". The kid then climbed onto the roof and about 5 mins later he came back to me and said, "Sorry, your trees are blocking the view of the HD satellite. I can't install it." He then stated that he could install a dish, but I would only get SD. Obviously with an HD TV that's not an option. He then said a supervisor would arrive on site within 72 hours to re-confirm his opinion. And with that he left!

I live in NH and I have some pretty tall trees in my back yard about 100 feet from the house. Its not a real dense forest, but it is woody. I would have thought the kid could have at least ventured into the back yard to see if there were some gaps.

I called the supervisor's office to find out when he was coming, because I wanted to be there, but they couldn't give me a day or a time.

I'm a satellite newbie and I know next to nothing about the technical stuff. But is that it for us? I'm so disappointed. I really was looking forward to a better TV experience.

I noticed in the yellow pages there were a few satellite installation companies in my area. Are these guys better than the crappy sub-contractors DirectTV send out? How does the free install thing work with DirectTV if these guys charge me for their service. Can I then hit DirectTV for my expenses if they can get me hooked up.

Any advice and information is most appreciated. Thanks.

[litzdog911]

An experienced supervisor, or independent satellite installation company might indeed provide better advice.

You can also check the situation yourself. See the link in my signature below to see how you can use the moon's position to perform your own site survey.

[Canis Lupus]

welcome pgb,

First of all if he said he could put an SD dish there, there's no way he could have known whether he could put an HD dish there just from eyeballing it. They're just too similar in their angles to the sky for him to have known that just by looking.

If you can't get a Super to come out so you can be there, you may be wasting your time with a D* contracted installer. I'd give a call to a pro company in your area and ask them for a site survey. From there you can decide whether to go with them, or go back to D* and call BS and make them do it.

Some people have also gotten credits from D* when they've been forced to use someone other than D* contractors, mostly due to incompetence or lack of knowledge.

I'd pay the Pros to find out where you stand first. Good luck.

[SDizzle]

After years of ever increasing costs and inefficiencies with cable, my wife and I decided to take the plunge and go with DirectTV.

Two days ago, this pimply faced kid who looked all of about 20 parked his personal van with no DirectTV logo on it in our driveway. He then asked me to speak to his supervisor on his cell phone to confirm that he was "on site". The kid then climbed onto the roof and about 5 mins later he came back to me and said, "Sorry, your trees are blocking the view of the HD satellite. I can't install it." He then stated that he could install a dish, but I would only get SD. Obviously with an HD TV that's not an option. He then said a supervisor would arrive on site within 72 hours to re-confirm his opinion. And with that he left!

I live in NH and I have some pretty tall trees in my back yard about 100 feet from the house. Its not a real dense forest, but it is woody. I would have thought the kid could have at least ventured into the back yard to see if there were some gaps.

I called the supervisor's office to find out when he was coming, because I wanted to be there, but they couldn't give me a day or a time.

I'm a satellite newbie and I know next to nothing about the technical stuff. But is that it for us? I'm so disappointed. I really was looking forward to a better TV experience.

I noticed in the yellow pages there were a few satellite installation companies in my area. Are these guys better than the crappy sub-contractors DirectTV send out? How does the free install thing work with DirectTV if these guys charge me for their service. Can I then hit DirectTV for my expenses if they can get me hooked up.

Any advice and information is most appreciated. Thanks.

A local installer can also offer a free install and any deals that D* is currently offering. And IMHO, usually actually WANT TO WORK!!

[rotohead]

I had a similar experience with my HR21/Slimline dish upgrade a month ago. I previously had the 3lnb dish shooting through some gaps in tall trees too. I was worried about not getting the two new sats so when the installer arrived he initially stated that my current location would not work (his exact statement to me was, "I've been doing this for a long time and can guarantee this spot won't work".) Later during the install he said he'd been working as a installer for Ironwood (Directv's subcontractor in this area) for four months and was a electrican before that. Anyway, I encouraged him to give my original dish location a try because anywhere else was going to be a real pain...lo and behold...it worked. Until you get a dish up and a signal strength meter hooked up you're just guessing.
Good luck, keep trying, it's worth it.
Chuck

[K4SMX]

At your latitude, there very likely could be an issue with LOS on the 119 satellite, which is fairly low in the sky in NH. The new HD channels on 103(b) are only two degrees from the main 101 SD satellites, however, and somewhat higher in the sky, so if you can get SD, you can get 95% of the HD carried by DirecTV. A local custom installer will be able to install your 5 LNB dish without being able to receive the 119 satellite, if there's really no location on your property that's totally suitable. I understand you will occasionally lose the Guide data while watching the new HD channels, unless you periodically park a tuner on your receiver(s) on one of the 101 SD channels, because the 119 provides the alternate stream for the Guide data.

[pgb]

Wow, what a great site this is! Some great and helpful responses in such a short time. I've taken some of the advice offered in this thread. I have just spoken to a local professional satellite installation company. I spoke to one of the techs and he is coming out tomorrow afternoon for an inspection at no cost.

He seemed like a pretty good guy and he echoed a lot of stuff from what I've read here. He didn't have a lot of respect for the DirectTV contractors. He said the problem stems from the fact that Direct underpays these guys - $30 for a job and $15 for an attendance/refusal. They are promised in "Satellite school" that they can do 5 jobs a day @ $30 a job. They soon find out that one job can take all day. By doing a little math they figure out they can make more money by stating the job cannot be done. He also said that if there is snow on the ground (like now) its too complicated and they can't be bothered digging holes in the ground.

Anyway this guy seemed pretty positive. I will keep you posted as to what transpires tomorrow.

Thanks so much for all that have responded.

[SDizzle]

Wow, what a great site this is! Some great and helpful responses in such a short time. I've taken some of the advice offered in this thread. I have just spoken to a local professional satellite installation company. I spoke to one of the techs and he is coming out tomorrow afternoon for an inspection at no cost.

He seemed like a pretty good guy and he echoed a lot of stuff from what I've read here. He didn't have a lot of respect for the DirectTV contractors. He said the problem stems from the fact that Direct underpays these guys - $30 for a job and $15 for an attendance/refusal. They are promised in "Satellite school" that they can do 5 jobs a day @ $30 a job. They soon find out that one job can take all day. By doing a little math they figure out they can make more money by stating the job cannot be done. He also said that if there is snow on the ground (like now) its too complicated and they can't be bothered digging holes in the ground.

Anyway this guy seemed pretty positive. I will keep you posted as to what transpires tomorrow.

Thanks so much for all that have responded.

Good Luck!! Like I said earlier, the local guys actually want to work! All these install leads are not just dropped in their laps like the contracted guys.:nono2:

[TigersFanJJ]

Wow, what a great site this is! Some great and helpful responses in such a short time. I've taken some of the advice offered in this thread. I have just spoken to a local professional satellite installation company. I spoke to one of the techs and he is coming out tomorrow afternoon for an inspection at no cost.

He seemed like a pretty good guy and he echoed a lot of stuff from what I've read here. He didn't have a lot of respect for the DirectTV contractors. He said the problem stems from the fact that Direct underpays these guys - $30 for a job and $15 for an attendance/refusal. They are promised in "Satellite school" that they can do 5 jobs a day @ $30 a job. They soon find out that one job can take all day. By doing a little math they figure out they can make more money by stating the job cannot be done. He also said that if there is snow on the ground (like now) its too complicated and they can't be bothered digging holes in the ground.

Anyway this guy seemed pretty positive. I will keep you posted as to what transpires tomorrow.

Thanks so much for all that have responded.

He may be a good guy and hopefully he can get you up and going, but don't pay any attention the contractor pay rates that he gave you. Some contractors get paid more than others and, unless it is an HSP hourly employee, I haven't ever heard of a contractor getting paid unless they complete the job. Not saying it doesn't happen somewhere, just not around here. Around here, the contractor will get charged back if they NLOS a job that can be done.

[TigersFanJJ]

A local installer can also offer a free install and any deals that D* is currently offering. And IMHO, usually actually WANT TO WORK!!

They can offer it for free, but don't always. :D

If I got paid for both the sale and the full install price, I'd probably bad mouth all hsp employees, also. That's a nice chunk of change.

[SDizzle]

They can offer it for free, but don't always. :D

If I got paid for both the sale and the full install price, I'd probably bad mouth all hsp employees, also. That's a nice chunk of change.

:lol: :lol: :lol: Don't say that after I was just sticking up for the local guys that are not as lazy as D* "authorized" installers :lol: :lol: :lol:

[K4SMX]

......Anyway this guy seemed pretty positive. I will keep you posted as to what transpires tomorrow.

Thanks so much for all that have responded.
Good luck with the trees. There's always chain saws, copper nails, ethylene glycol...just kidding about the last two. :)

And again, welcome to DBSTalk.com!

[joe diamond]

A little known cure for trees is to "prune" them with a shotgun. Tune the dish as best you can........look out from behind the dish along the az (direction) and el
(angle up between the top of he dish and the LNB.) Blast suspected limbs....check the meter again.

Don't do this in cities. 12 ga BB is my fav unless you can get buckshot.

Joe

[K4SMX]

Joe, I blew a little coffee on my keyboard. Thanks for the first laugh of the day! I'll retire the pole saw and start packin' the 10 gauge. It should only take one blast, so the people in the neighborhood will never know where it came from.....

[litzdog911]

A little known cure for trees is to "prune" them with a shotgun. Tune the dish as best you can........look out from behind the dish along the az (direction) and el
(angle up between the top of he dish and the LNB.) Blast suspected limbs....check the meter again.

Don't do this in cities. 12 ga BB is my fav unless you can get buckshot.

Joe

Yeah, you might want to warn the neighbors first! :lol:

[slimline]

After years of ever increasing costs and inefficiencies with cable, my wife and I decided to take the plunge and go with DirectTV.

Two days ago, this pimply faced kid who looked all of about 20 parked his personal van with no DirectTV logo on it in our driveway. He then asked me to speak to his supervisor on his cell phone to confirm that he was "on site". The kid then climbed onto the roof and about 5 mins later he came back to me and said, "Sorry, your trees are blocking the view of the HD satellite. I can't install it." He then stated that he could install a dish, but I would only get SD. Obviously with an HD TV that's not an option. He then said a supervisor would arrive on site within 72 hours to re-confirm his opinion. And with that he left!

I live in NH and I have some pretty tall trees in my back yard about 100 feet from the house. Its not a real dense forest, but it is woody. I would have thought the kid could have at least ventured into the back yard to see if there were some gaps.

I called the supervisor's office to find out when he was coming, because I wanted to be there, but they couldn't give me a day or a time.

I'm a satellite newbie and I know next to nothing about the technical stuff. But is that it for us? I'm so disappointed. I really was looking forward to a better TV experience.

I noticed in the yellow pages there were a few satellite installation companies in my area. Are these guys better than the crappy sub-contractors DirectTV send out? How does the free install thing work with DirectTV if these guys charge me for their service. Can I then hit DirectTV for my expenses if they can get me hooked up.

Any advice and information is most appreciated. Thanks.

THIS IS A FUNNY POST I JUST LEFT A CUSTOMERS HOUSE SET UP HIS HD DISH
HE WAS TURNED DOWN TWICE FOR L.O.S

THEY TOLD HIM IT WAS NOT POSSIBLE I ALSO DO HSP WORK FOR DTV AND
IF HE WAS MY CUSTOMER HE WOULD HAVE BEEN (LIVE ) 3 WEEKS AGO
I DO CUSTOM INSTALLS ALSO SO ONE CALL MADE AN APOINMENT FOR 8AM THIS MORNING DONE LESS THEN 3 HRS. IT WAS NOT FREE BUT I TS DONE

I THINK I COULD MAKE A LIVING JUST INSTALLING LOS INSTALLS.....

[sandman9r]

I'm having similar problems with these sub-contractors. When DirecTV was installed for me in 2003, it was done by a low-budget, father and son team. They simply installed a dish outside my window.

When I upgraded to HD and required a 3 LNB dish, I called an expert. This real tech moved the dish to my roof where the signal was coming in at 100%. He also did this awesome job where he drilled down the dish on top of some cinder blocks because my roof cannot be drilled into.

Then, earlier this year, I had my service upgraded to the 5 LNB dish by a subcontractor. Unfortunately, after some strong winds, my dish was knocked off alignment. I don't think he used the cinder blocks as the independent tech had.

Here's the real nightmare: I still don't have service because these subcontractors obviously don't communicate with each other. Every time I call DirecTV to reschedule, the fact that I need a 40 foot ladder is not getting relayed. My old expert installer is no longer in business and doing a yellow pages search online only brings up more subcontractors. Calling the phone numbers given transfers you to DirecTV's main customer line.

Luckily, I have cable as well.

[bjunks]

I am amazed to find so many people have similar experiences with D* installers. I had a tech come out today and tell me that even though my 3lnb (standard def) dish would receive a signal (in the 90s by the way) through the top of a distant pine tree, a 5lnb dish would not. not even worth the hassle of setting it up. i concluded with a friend of mine that the installers must not have any interest in the company. i know that if i had company stock, etc. I'd be trying anything the customer would allow to get the online and paying for the hd, dvr the whole nine yards. This apparently isn't the case. D* said they would forward my email to their tech and he'll handle it from there. Question for you guys: is there a reputable national or region installation company that you can recommend? I'm in Asheville, NC. I cannot imagine some one can just look at the distant treetops and a decipher whether to additional signals with get through. I am mainly interested in the Center ICE HD, does anyone know which sat I need a signal from to get this content? PLS keep us posted on the outcome of your LOS issue. Sorry for the length...ARRGGHH!

[slimline]

I'm having similar problems with these sub-contractors. When DirecTV was installed for me in 2003, it was done by a low-budget, father and son team. They simply installed a dish outside my window.

When I upgraded to HD and required a 3 LNB dish, I called an expert. This real tech moved the dish to my roof where the signal was coming in at 100%. He also did this awesome job where he drilled down the dish on top of some cinder blocks because my roof cannot be drilled into.

Then, earlier this year, I had my service upgraded to the 5 LNB dish by a subcontractor. Unfortunately, after some strong winds, my dish was knocked off alignment. I don't think he used the cinder blocks as the independent tech had.

Here's the real nightmare: I still don't have service because these subcontractors obviously don't communicate with each other. Every time I call DirecTV to reschedule, the fact that I need a 40 foot ladder is not getting relayed. My old expert installer is no longer in business and doing a yellow pages search online only brings up more subcontractors. Calling the phone numbers given transfers you to DirecTV's main customer line.

Luckily, I have cable as well.

40 feet you are gonna need a yellow page contractor.

28 feet max for most techs its in the d tv service manual.

[joe diamond]

I am amazed to find so many people have similar experiences with D* installers. I had a tech come out today and tell me that even though my 3lnb (standard def) dish would receive a signal (in the 90s by the way) through the top of a distant pine tree, a 5lnb dish would not. not even worth the hassle of setting it up. i concluded with a friend of mine that the installers must not have any interest in the company. i know that if i had company stock, etc. I'd be trying anything the customer would allow to get the online and paying for the hd, dvr the whole nine yards. This apparently isn't the case. D* said they would forward my email to their tech and he'll handle it from there. Question for you guys: is there a reputable national or region installation company that you can recommend? I'm in Asheville, NC. I cannot imagine some one can just look at the distant treetops and a decipher whether to additional signals with get through. I am mainly interested in the Center ICE HD, does anyone know which sat I need a signal from to get this content? PLS keep us posted on the outcome of your LOS issue. Sorry for the length...ARRGGHH!

bjunks,

My first couple hundred installations were a bit daunting for but it gets easier. The LOS (Line of Sight) is just plain old plane geometry. Most of the installers on this site can see where the dish has to go from a map before getting out of the truck. A clinometer can be made with a protractor and you are in business. ..............you did hit the problem....a reputable national company is hard to find.

By the time the money DTV pays for an installation is sliced up by all the subcontractor arrangements there is nothing left for the guys with the tools and they leave. Everyone has a first day on the job and your are meeting them over and over.

Joe

[slimline]

I had a similar experience with my HR21/Slimline dish upgrade a month ago. I previously had the 3lnb dish shooting through some gaps in tall trees too. I was worried about not getting the two new sats so when the installer arrived he initially stated that my current location would not work (his exact statement to me was, "I've been doing this for a long time and can guarantee this spot won't work".) Later during the install he said he'd been working as a installer for Ironwood (Directv's subcontractor in this area) for four months and was a electrican before that. Anyway, I encouraged him to give my original dish location a try because anywhere else was going to be a real pain...lo and behold...it worked. Until you get a dish up and a signal strength meter hooked up you're just guessing.
Good luck, keep trying, it's worth it.
Chuck


i see what you are saying however i can tell you in a matter of seconds if a location will work or not its called an inclinometer. it only takes seconds to check a locatio. the tech should have one of these and let you see for yourself
why the site wont work..................... and in most cases the tech dont get paid to try it . if it dont work he has to take it all down and make 0 money.

[joe diamond]

Yeah, you might want to warn the neighbors first! :lol:

litzdog,

I can't decide about the warning. It is easier to apologize than to ask permission. The few times....the cx & not I .....resorted to artillery we were out in the boonies. You can spot he folks that have a gun around and when you suggest they may want to shoot off a few limbs it just makes their day.

I don't even mention the idea in suburbia.

Picture this: Eight or ten NASCAR types being told the Primestar dish would not work at their hunting cabin.......they dug in almost a hundred feet of dual cable with screw drivers. They all got their guns and opened up a 40 x 40 hole...running back to my meter for the vertical and horizontal numbers before shooting some more.

When the picture popped on it was a beautiful thing...they used up the rest of the ammo in celebration.

Joe

[K4SMX]

......When the picture popped on it was a beautiful thing...they used up the rest of the ammo in celebration.

Joe
Screwdrivers? Joe, more stories please!

[K4SMX]

...... Every time I call DirecTV to reschedule, the fact that I need a 40 foot ladder is not getting relayed. My old expert installer is no longer in business.......
See if you can get a loaner on the ladder from that guy, if you can still find him. Maybe you can even talk him into a one time job. Otherwise, since your roof requires a 40' ladder, you probably just need to buy your own ladder, because you won't find too many installers with them, or for that matter, too many who even want to put them up and down, let alone climb them. :)

Welcome to DBSTalk.com!

[pgb]

*** Update ***

And its great news! Here's what happened.....

At 3:15pm this afternoon a DirectTV van pulled up at the front of my house and the guy started walking around along the front of my property. I went outside and asked if he was the supervisor. He stated he was. He walked to the edge of my property and took some measurements. He then told me that I had 1 tree in my back yard that was blocking my LOS. He said that if we chopped the tree down, I was all set and he could install a dish on a post in my front yard at the edge of the property. He was here about 5 minutes in total. (My wife was not real happy about the dish on the post in the front yard due to ugliness, but was prepared to live with it if that was our only option.)

About 3 minutes later after the supervisor left, my neighbors (both husband and wife) knocked on my door. They wanted to know what the DTV guy was doing near their property line. (Our property lines are kind of weird here in this neighborhood and run at angles.) They informed me that they would have a problem if they installed a dish on my property near their property line because from the street it looks as though its in front of their house. (In actual fact - from the street it would appear as though it was in between the two houses.) I wished them a Merry Christmas and they were on their way.

Then about an hour later my guy from New England Antenna Service arrived (as scheduled). I told him that he had just missed the DTV supervisor. He asked me what his results were. When I told him, he asked me if the supervisor climbed onto the roof. He was surprised when I said he didn't. Anyway the professional guy climbed onto the roof and then came down after about 10 minutes. He told me that there were two trees blocking LOS, but that they weren't a big problem. He told me that they were blocking the 119. He said that if he installed DTV without knocking down the trees I would probably only lose 4 HD channels. When he told me what they were - trust me it wasn't a problem. And he's going to install it on the roof - so no fights with the neighbors! He also said that later, if we wished he could come out to indicate to the tree lopping company which branches need to come down if the loss of the 4 channels was annoying us.

He then said the install would probably take about 4 to 5 hours, to do it properly and he would only charge me $86 for the whole thing. (The first 2 hours are free). He's coming on Tuesday.

What a great service! I wish I had called these guys first!

It just seems to me that DTV aren't making the money they could be. Even the supervisor was clueless.

My wife and I are so happy right now. I will keep you updated after the installation.

[cweave02]

A little known cure for trees is to "prune" them with a shotgun. Tune the dish as best you can........look out from behind the dish along the az (direction) and el
(angle up between the top of he dish and the LNB.) Blast suspected limbs....check the meter again.

Don't do this in cities. 12 ga BB is my fav unless you can get buckshot.

Joe

Just make sure your city / town does not have an ordinance prohibiting discharging a firearm inside the town / city limits. You may want to call the cops and tell them that you are 'eradicating vermin' on your property, in case they get any calls from "concerned" neighbors.

[K4SMX]

pgb: Just as we suspected. $86 is a bargain for a roof job, and if he does a good job with the wiring and alignment (~90+ on all 103(b)'s), you should give him a nice tip. Merry Christmas!

[pgb]

K4SMX: That's good to know. I suspected it was a good price, but wasn't 100% sure. He seemed like a real genuine guy, so I will definitely give him a nice tip with a good job.

[RD in Fla]

Really a good price considering the time of year and you live in New Hampshire!! Good luck :)

[joe diamond]

Screwdrivers? Joe, more stories please!

Stew,
We were in a dense woods. Think ax work before shovels. These guys were all mechanics. The pole site was about a hundred feet from the building. Some of it we dug but instead of cutting dense roots THEY got screw drivers that could twist a Sherman tank.

Another part of this story. They all worked together and evenings and weekends used this place to hang out. The owner arranged for a double-wide trailer to be built off the side of the house for the "hunting cabin" (read employee bar).

They are still there in Greensboro, MD. I left my van there once for service and the owner tossed me the keys to a boat '70 Chevy to get home.......my son wanted to sleep out in it because it was bigger than his room in the back seat.

These guys needed their race pictures and probably wet themselves with what is available now....I'm gonna drop in and describe what a projection TV can do in HD with a few butt shakers.

Joe

[joe diamond]

Just make sure your city / town does not have an ordinance prohibiting discharging a firearm inside the town / city limits. You may want to call the cops and tell them that you are 'eradicating vermin' on your property, in case they get any calls from "concerned" neighbors.

cweave,

You get one free shot. After that folks look around. Biggest thing here is hunting (shooting) on Sunday. And in the towns it is just not safe.

We had friends visit here and their kids couldn't sleep because it was too quiet but my friend put 1/4 steel plate against the front interior walls of his house in Baltimore because the varmits shoot back.

Joe

[miksmi21]

*** Update ***

And its great news! Here's what happened.....

At 3:15pm this afternoon a DirectTV van pulled up at the front of my house and the guy started walking around along the front of my property. I went outside and asked if he was the supervisor. He stated he was. He walked to the edge of my property and took some measurements. He then told me that I had 1 tree in my back yard that was blocking my LOS. He said that if we chopped the tree down, I was all set and he could install a dish on a post in my front yard at the edge of the property. He was here about 5 minutes in total. (My wife was not real happy about the dish on the post in the front yard due to ugliness, but was prepared to live with it if that was our only option.)

About 3 minutes later after the supervisor left, my neighbors (both husband and wife) knocked on my door. They wanted to know what the DTV guy was doing near their property line. (Our property lines are kind of weird here in this neighborhood and run at angles.) They informed me that they would have a problem if they installed a dish on my property near their property line because from the street it looks as though its in front of their house. (In actual fact - from the street it would appear as though it was in between the two houses.) I wished them a Merry Christmas and they were on their way.

Then about an hour later my guy from New England Antenna Service arrived (as scheduled). I told him that he had just missed the DTV supervisor. He asked me what his results were. When I told him, he asked me if the supervisor climbed onto the roof. He was surprised when I said he didn't. Anyway the professional guy climbed onto the roof and then came down after about 10 minutes. He told me that there were two trees blocking LOS, but that they weren't a big problem. He told me that they were blocking the 119. He said that if he installed DTV without knocking down the trees I would probably only lose 4 HD channels. When he told me what they were - trust me it wasn't a problem. And he's going to install it on the roof - so no fights with the neighbors! He also said that later, if we wished he could come out to indicate to the tree lopping company which branches need to come down if the loss of the 4 channels was annoying us.

He then said the install would probably take about 4 to 5 hours, to do it properly and he would only charge me $86 for the whole thing. (The first 2 hours are free). He's coming on Tuesday.

What a great service! I wish I had called these guys first!

It just seems to me that DTV aren't making the money they could be. Even the supervisor was clueless.

My wife and I are so happy right now. I will keep you updated after the installation.

Good to hear you'll be joining the ranks. I too had a similar experience with the contracted guys. They put the thing on some crappy pole that fell down after the first big wind/rain storm. I called DTV to get them to come out and fix it...cuz I don't know what i'm doing. That's when I was introduced to a pro company that was the last call to DTV I needed to make ever. Anytime I get into issues, I call these guys rather than DTV directly. I've never had issues since, and they are stellar with their knowledge and competency...unlike the random guy who put in my original deal back when I lived in my condo.

[miksmi21]

Really a good price considering the time of year and you live in New Hampshire!! Good luck :)

In parts of NH, $86 is more like the normal nations $150. :D

[pgb]

Well my install went in yesterday, without a hitch!

My installer arrived at around 9:50am and departed around 5pm. He charged me as quoted $86 in addition to the $299 for the HR-21 unit and the $99 SD DVR that I get the rebate on. He did a great job too. He installed the dish on the roof in freezing temperatures, and did a nice neat job with all the wiring. He also set up my sound system with the receiver. He explained both systems with all features to myself and my wife. The pictures look great - far superior to the cable pictures I had. At the end of the day when I paid him, I tried to tip him, but he told me a tip wasn't neccessary.

I can't rate this company highly enough. If anyone in the New England area is looking for an installation, upgrade etc, and you want a professional job with a friendly tech for a great price - this is the company you need to call. Its family owned (2 brothers) and they have been in business for about 30 years.

BTW - I do have one technical question. I can record all my available channels including premium channels on my HD DVR, however, my SD DVR will not allow us to record the premium channels - HBO etc. We can watch the programs, but cannot record on them. I also noticed that they appear gray on the guide, whereas the other channels are blue on the guide. Does anyone know what I need to do to enable recording of these channels on the SD DVR?

Thanks in advance.

[Canis Lupus]

That's awesome news. Glad to hear you found a solution. :) Enjoy the HD!

[Canis Lupus]

You might try calling D* and have them resend your subscription data down to that box. Have your Receiver ID numbers available for all your boxes when you call, and confirm with them which Receiver will get the data push. Be very careful with this, as sometimes it can be akin to the surgeon operating on the right knee when it should be the left ;).
Then keep them on the phone until the data is received and you can test it.


BTW - I do have one technical question. I can record all my available channels including premium channels on my HD DVR, however, my SD DVR will not allow us to record the premium channels - HBO etc. We can watch the programs, but cannot record on them. I also noticed that they appear gray on the guide, whereas the other channels are blue on the guide. Does anyone know what I need to do to enable recording of these channels on the SD DVR?

[RobertE]

You might try calling D* and have them resend your subscription data down to that box. Have your Receiver ID numbers available for all your boxes when you call, and confirm with them which Receiver will get the data push. Be very careful with this, as sometimes it can be akin to the surgeon operating on the right knee when it should be the left ;).
Then keep them on the phone until the data is received and you can test it.

Even easier, using the 800-531-5000 when you get the voice system just say. 711, 722 or 726. Any of those will resend the authorizations to all the boxes. No need to involve a CSR.

[Canis Lupus]

I had no idea. Nice tip!!!

Even easier, using the 800-531-5000 when you get the voice system just say. 711, 722 or 726. Any of those will resend the authorizations to all the boxes. No need to involve a CSR.

[carl6]

You can also resend authorization to an individual box, or to all units on your account, on-line at Directv.com

Carl

[slimline]

Well my install went in yesterday, without a hitch!

My installer arrived at around 9:50am and departed around 5pm. He charged me as quoted $86 in addition to the $299 for the HR-21 unit and the $99 SD DVR that I get the rebate on. He did a great job too. He installed the dish on the roof in freezing temperatures, and did a nice neat job with all the wiring. He also set up my sound system with the receiver. He explained both systems with all features to myself and my wife. The pictures look great - far superior to the cable pictures I had. At the end of the day when I paid him, I tried to tip him, but he told me a tip wasn't neccessary.

I can't rate this company highly enough. If anyone in the New England area is looking for an installation, upgrade etc, and you want a professional job with a friendly tech for a great price - this is the company you need to call. Its family owned (2 brothers) and they have been in business for about 30 years.
BTW - I do have one technical question. I can record all my available channels including premium channels on my HD DVR, however, my SD DVR will not allow us to record the premium channels - HBO etc. We can watch the programs, but cannot record on them. I also noticed that they appear gray on the guide, whereas the other channels are blue on the guide. Does anyone know what I need to do to enable recording of these channels on the SD DVR?

Thanks in advance.

can you please plug the install company...............

[janezy]

This is bizarre. I just had an install refusal as well, in Minneapolis. The tech was shipped in from Houston and was none to happy about the fact that D* has been jerking them around and is not allowing him home in time for his son's first Christmas even though they previously said they would.

Anyway, he said I had LOS issues and, additionally, said the new dish was 60 lbs (is that right?) and had concerns about my roof. He said he would pole mount, but not in Minnesota in the winter. I have had an Oval 3LNB up for over 4 years with no major issues. I just wanted to upgrade to HD service.

So, is that new 5LNB dish really 60 lbs? Anyone know of a reputable install company in the Twin Cities area?

I must say that I'm a little ticked off, myself. I had to take a day off of work to get the run around. Why can't D* put some basic questions up on their website to avoid the hassle of some of the most basic reasons for install refusals? Cable is looking better all the time, but around here that means Comcast and I've never been very impressed.

[dshu82]

Slimline is only about 30 lbs. Try some specialty home theater installers in the Yellow Pages.

[randyk47]

The shipping weight at several sites is 25 pounds to 30 pounds so I'd say the installer is either not very bright or had a case of the jaws about being so far from home.

[K4SMX]

can you please plug the install company...............
He's in NH, and earlier in the thread he said it was New England Antenna Service.

[K4SMX]

This is bizarre. I just had an install refusal as well.....Anyway, he said I had LOS issues and, additionally, said the new dish was 60 lbs (is that right?) and had concerns about my roof. He said he would pole mount, but not in Minnesota in the winter. I have had an Oval 3LNB up for over 4 years with no major issues. I just wanted to upgrade to HD service.
If you have a fully-functioning 3 LNB dish installation, you do NOT have a 5 LNB LOS issue. PM "Mike500" and get him to give you the latest eBay offering from his buddy who makes a 2" mast adapter for the smaller 3 LNB mounting pole. With that and a set of monopoles from the installer, there should be no trouble completing the install. I'd watch how he secures the monopoles, though. Making additional holes in your roof can cause problems if not done correctly. Mike can advise you about that as well, so that when the installer comes back, you'll be able to make sure you and he are in agreement as to how he's going to secure the monopoles to your roof. :)

[azarby]

Yeah, you might want to warn the neighbors first! :lol:

Especially those that may have BB shot raining down on the kids playing in the back yard.

Bob

[1948GG]

Well my install went in yesterday, without a hitch!

How many of these types of threads have we all read here? Not to good, especially for DirecTV Stock holders, that's for sure, as each one of these that doesn't end good is upwards (or over!) $1000/yr loss for DirecTV.

EVERY one of these 'refusals' should be fully investigated by actual DirecTV employees, and the contract install companies fined BIG TIME for each and every one that is bogus. That's the only way to 'keep them honest'.

The independent guys (of which I do occasional engineering work for), get a 'piece of the action' in turning up each install; apparently, with the large contract companies, that incentive is missing! They've tried to reduce the installation to a 'commodity', and therefore the workers don't give a darn.

Sad Sad Sad

[K4SMX]

Think about the thousands we never hear about. This has got to costing DirecTV a lot of money.

[pgb]

How many of these types of threads have we all read here? Not to good, especially for DirecTV Stock holders, that's for sure, as each one of these that doesn't end good is upwards (or over!) $1000/yr loss for DirecTV.

EVERY one of these 'refusals' should be fully investigated by actual DirecTV employees, and the contract install companies fined BIG TIME for each and every one that is bogus. That's the only way to 'keep them honest'.

The independent guys (of which I do occasional engineering work for), get a 'piece of the action' in turning up each install; apparently, with the large contract companies, that incentive is missing! They've tried to reduce the installation to a 'commodity', and therefore the workers don't give a darn.

Sad Sad Sad


Its funny you should mention the stock holders. I subscribe to a stock newsletter and in January 07, they recommended buying DirectTV stock due to the launch of the new satellites in 07 and the improved HD lineup which would blow away the competition. As a result, I have had DirectTV on my stock watch list for 12 months. The stock should have risen this year because of the potential increase in profits - but it hasn't. All year its hovered around the low $20's. It hasn't lost any ground, but it's basically at the same price as when it was recommended.

I was considering buying this stock, but after my experience, and with all the other horror install stories I've been reading here, I wouldn't touch this stock because of all the lost revenue that's going down the drain. If I hadn't found this forum, I would have been one of the many lost customers.

[pgb]

He's in NH, and earlier in the thread he said it was New England Antenna Service.

Yes Stew is correct. The company is New England Antenna Service. I forgot to reiterate that and only realised after I had submitted.

[pgb]

As an appendix to this install story - everything is going great, except for one problem, on the non-HD DVR receiver, we cannot record one show and watch another at the same time. However, we can do that no problem on the HR-21.

I called New England Antenna Service and my installer told me I need a multi-switch for that task. Why can I record on one channel and watch another on the HR-21 and not on the other DVR? I'm not very savvy when it comes to this techno stuff.

Anyway, the tech is on his way and will be here in half an hour. He said he will not charge me for the call, but has to charge me for the multi-switch which is about $99. He also said that a multi-switch is not included in a standard install. This doesn't make any sense to me. Isn't the whole point of a DVR to be able to record one show and watch another at the same time (in addition to the other obvious functions of it) ?

[Bill Broderick]

If the only receivers that you have are the two DVR's then you DO NOT need a multi-switch. You can have 4 lines coming off of the Slimline dish (2 for each DVR). If you have any additional receivers, a multi-switch is necessary.

[Rakim]

As an appendix to this install story - everything is going great, except for one problem, on the non-HD DVR receiver, we cannot record one show and watch another at the same time. However, we can do that no problem on the HR-21.

You could just have a bad tuner on the non-HD receiver. I have that on one of mine, and even though there are two cables to it, you can only record or watch one show at a time.

As someone just mentioned, you shouldn't need a multiswitch if you only have 4 lines from the dish into your house.

[makoti]

Hello to all -

New here, and I have this very problem. I got the bad news today that a tree in the common area behind my house blocks the LOS for what was to be a DTV HD upgrade for my new TV. I presently have DTV &, except for storms, never had a problem. The trees behind me are tall, though.
The installer (a guy and his dad, it looked like) said that the LOS needed went "10 feet" into the trees. I set up a "second opinion" call, but that won't be for about 2 weeks.
I guess my questions are does the sencond guy often find something the first misses? Would a private installer be able to do something more? I live in the center unit home in a row of townhouses, and where it can go is pretty limited to the roof.
Or should I expect that his verdict is correct & consider how to return the TV? I mainly got it for the Sunday Ticket, and if I can't do DTV I may take it back.:(
Thanks for the feedback.

[jaybe]

This is bizarre. I just had an install refusal as well, in Minneapolis. The tech was shipped in from Houston and was none to happy about the fact that D* has been jerking them around and is not allowing him home in time for his son's first Christmas even though they previously said they would.

Anyway, he said I had LOS issues and, additionally, said the new dish was 60 lbs (is that right?) and had concerns about my roof. He said he would pole mount, but not in Minnesota in the winter. I have had an Oval 3LNB up for over 4 years with no major issues. I just wanted to upgrade to HD service.

So, is that new 5LNB dish really 60 lbs? Anyone know of a reputable install company in the Twin Cities area?

I must say that I'm a little ticked off, myself. I had to take a day off of work to get the run around. Why can't D* put some basic questions up on their website to avoid the hassle of some of the most basic reasons for install refusals? Cable is looking better all the time, but around here that means Comcast and I've never been very impressed.

I had the SAME guys today in Minneapolis! I'm trying to upgrade my dish to the HD dish. These guys were shipped in from TX - didn't go on my roof, but just KNEW that I had a LOS issue with some of the branches on a tree. I asked how far the tree should be cleared back to get a LOS..... I would go on the roof, sit at the current dish location with a compass, and get a tree trimmer to remove the branches to the required compass reading.

The problem is..... he couldn't tell me what the compass reading should be to trim the trees to! What the heck?!?! How can you tell me that it WON'T work, when you can't tell me what angle WILL work? I seriously think that my current LOS will work with HD - so I'm going to try to find a local pro to do it.

My guess is that he didn't want to get up on a 2 story home. On top of that, he told me to call his company to get a second opinion. I did, their earliest date is at the end of January! And by the way - I ordered the HD upgrade in November. The D* local contractors SUCK!

[Shield]

I had the SAME guys today in Minneapolis! I'm trying to upgrade my dish to the HD dish. These guys were shipped in from TX - didn't go on my roof, but just KNEW that I had a LOS issue with some of the branches on a tree. I asked how far the tree should be cleared back to get a LOS..... I would go on the roof, sit at the current dish location with a compass, and get a tree trimmer to remove the branches to the required compass reading.

The problem is..... he couldn't tell me what the compass reading should be to trim the trees to! What the heck?!?! How can you tell me that it WON'T work, when you can't tell me what angle WILL work? I seriously think that my current LOS will work with HD - so I'm going to try to find a local pro to do it.

My guess is that he didn't want to get up on a 2 story home. On top of that, he told me to call his company to get a second opinion. I did, their earliest date is at the end of January! And by the way - I ordered the HD upgrade in November. The D* local contractors SUCK!

Same thing happened to be almost - the 1st guy wanted to mount the dish in concrete right in my front yard. I paid an independent company $69 to do a site survey and the result = now I'm watching HD directv.

[K4SMX]

Advice to all who are declined for "free" 5 LNB HD installs because of alleged LOS issues:

If you currently have 3 LNB DirecTV HD service, you do not have a LOS issue for 5 LNB HD service. If you currently have DirecTV SD service, the install may be validly declined if there is an actual issue with LOS for the 110/119 satellites. Usually, it's the 119 satellite which may be a problem. If so, you can still use the 5 LNB dish and get 99% of the HD channels,, however, you will require the services of your own installer, since the "free" installs require LOS to the 119 satellite. (The 119 carries HDNet and ESPN2HD, as well as most of the NY/LA national network feeds.)

Go to dishpointer.com (http://www.dishpointer.com). Enter your exact street address, scroll down the dish list to select the DirecTV 5 LNB dish, and zoom in on the hybrid view and examine your location yourself for LOS issues. You can also go back and enter a 119 satellite to study that specific LOS issue. Note that you can drag the dish position around on your location.

After surveying your location yourself, you may decide to hire your own installer. High-end, custom TV/audio shops are a good source of local installers, if you can't find one in the telephone directory. Usually, DirecTV will reimburse you through monthly credits for some or all of the installation cost of a local installer, if the "free" install was declined for LOS reasons. You'll find that most local installers can provide both the dish and the receivers you need. DirecTV should also honor any specific pricing you were given on receivers which vary from the local installer's prices through monthly credits, but get this issue resolved prior to moving forward, once the local installer has confirmed he can successfully install the dish.

[randyk47]

Might add that if you're denied install because of a difficult location then K4SMX's third point is valid in that situation. My personal experience this summer was not a LOS problem but too high, too steep of a roof for the DirecTV installer. Called a local home theater install company and they had a private installer. He came out equipped to climb Mt Everest and installed my Slimline. (This guy makes most of his living doing TV and radio tower maintenance so high places don't bother him.) I was able to "trade off" some of the expense with DirecTV by getting an HR20 for shipping and handling.

[RobertE]

Advice to all who are declined for "free" 5 LNB HD installs because of alleged LOS issues:

If you currently have 3 LNB DirecTV HD service, you do not have a LOS issue for 5 LNB HD service. If you currently have DirecTV SD service, the install may be validly declined if there is an actual issue with LOS for the 110/119 satellites. Usually, it's the 119 satellite which may be a problem. If so, you can still use the 5 LNB dish and get 99% of the HD channels,, however, you will require the services of your own installer, since the "free" installs require LOS to the 119 satellite. (The 119 carries HDNet and ESPN2HD, as well as most of the NY/LA national network feeds.)

Go to dishpointer.com (http://www.dishpointer.com). Enter your exact street address, scroll down the dish list to select the DirecTV 5 LNB dish, and zoom in on the hybrid view and examine your location yourself for LOS issues. You can also go back and enter a 119 satellite to study that specific LOS issue. Note that you can drag the dish position around on your location.

After surveying your location yourself, you may decide to hire your own installer. High-end, custom TV/audio shops are a good source of local installers, if you can't find one in the telephone directory. Usually, DirecTV will reimburse you through monthly credits for some or all of the installation cost of a local installer, if the "free" install was declined for LOS reasons. You'll find that most local installers can provide both the dish and the receivers you need. DirecTV should also honor any specific pricing you were given on receivers which vary from the local installer's prices through monthly credits, but get this issue resolved prior to moving forward, once the local installer has confirmed he can successfully install the dish.


Very well put!

I would add that there is a *small* possibility of LOS issues with 99 and/or 103.

[Bill Broderick]

Advice to all who are declined for "free" 5 LNB HD installs because of alleged LOS issues:
...


Also, it should be added to the good points that Stew made, that, if you are currently using multiple dishes to support a 3 LNB install, there are some multiple dish solutions possible for the 5 LNB install (despite what you will be told by DirecTV and nearly every DirecTV installer. The solutions can be found in this thread (http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=62223) and will likely require that you purchase your own dish(s) and hire your own installer (unless you want to do this yourself).

[slimline]

Very well put!

I would add that there is a *small* possibility of LOS issues with 99 and/or 103.

I HAVE INSTALLED AS OF TODAY 255 SLIMLINE DISHES, IF THE 3 PHASE DISH

IS INSTALLED AND YOU ARE TRYING TO INSTALL A SLIMLINE 99.9% OF THE TIME

IT WILL WORK..............UNDERPAID INSTALLERS DONT WANT TO CAHANCE IT.

I AM SO CLOSE TO RUNNING AN ADD IN THE NEWS PAPER AND ONLINE FOR

$65 SITE SURVEY"S OR I COULD DO ONE BETTER SELL THEM A SLIMLINE

MOUNT IT WARE IT NEEDS TO GO TUNE IT AND WHEN THE "FREE" INSTALLER

GETS THERE ALL HE HAS TO DO IS RUN WIRES......................

[condensr]

I was given the same run-around by the first Ironwood installer that came out to my location. I was running a pole-mounted 18inch round, and he said I couldn't get 119.. that 'maybe if it was 4 feet higher.'

I called his BS and custom made and installed a 10 foot high pole, and re-scheduled the install. They sent the same guy (despite my requesting someone else), and guess what? Worked fine. It would have worked on the shorter pole too, but I thought I was rather at their mercy if I wanted my equipment as Directv no longer ships equipment for self-installs, and I didn't want to pay full price on an HR20 + Slimline (got it for 19.95 when I first ordered it.)

He did a crappy job, re-using existing rg-59 cable with crappy twist on connectors, didn't zip tie the cable to the pole, and didn't connect the ground cable of the RG-6 to the dish/pole. Maybe that's not needed as the pole is 4 feet in the ground surrounded by concrete, not sure on that. He also didn't have a dish pointer, and requested I call out signal numbers to him through the back door.

It also took 2 visits for my first 18 inch install due to supposed LOS issues on the first visit. Not a good experience.

To the OP, glad you got your dish installed anyway!