Dish 6000 OTA

[JStanton]

I have a Dish 6000 that I recently got the OTA module for. I have Channel Master 4221 that I put up yesterday, mounted above (close to, but not blocked by) my dishes, pointing maybe not exactly, but pretty close to my local towers (+/- 10 deg). I'm ~10 miles northeast from the tower.

I'm getting zero signal strength on all of the digital stations. The analog UHF stations (broadcasting from the same tower) come in reasonably well (a little ghosting). I figured I'd get some digital signal, and then be able to tweak the antenna position. Is this not how it works?

I also realize that I have no idea how to read a topographical map (any of them that I can find online, anyway). Is there a website that will just show you the topo contour lines and not all the streets?

I also have a RS Bowtie that I tried using inside. It too shows zero signal strength. The only piece of hardware that I used between the two tests (besides the 6000 itself) is the 300-75 ohm converter that came with the CM4221.

Any ideas, tricks, tips, etc?

Thanks,
Jim

[Mark Lamutt]

Where are you located? Are your OTA stations broadcasting at full power? I'm assuimg that your OTA stations are broadcasting a digital signal.

Is there a large hill or a mountain between your location and the tower that you know of?

If your stations are broadcasting at low power, +/-10 degrees in your antenna orientation will make a huge difference. If they are broadcasting at full power, 10 degrees should make hardly any difference at all.

Did you try to scan DTV channels with your 6000 in the setup menu, or try to enter the channels manually? If you tried one, but not the other, try that.

How long is the cable run from your antenna to the 6000? Are you using at the very least RG6 cable with good connectors on the ends?

BTW, Welcome to DBSTalk Jim! :hi:

[JStanton]

I'm in Somerville, MA, about 10 miles outside of Boston.

I have the big 3 networks all broadcasting at full power and Fox at somewhat less. I'm think I'm in somewhat of a valley, but would like to check with the topo maps to be sure.

I tried both scanning and entering manually. Its a 40 foot RG-6 (admittedly the cheap RG-6 from Home Depot) run with only the grounding block in it. I'll try reterminating the ends tonight.

Thanks,
Jim

[Chris Blount]

Here is a site that might help you:

http://www.antennaweb.org/aw/address.asp

You type in your address and it will give you all the information about your local digital stations. Be sure to click on the "MAP" link to give you a visual representation of which way your antenna should be pointing.

Also you might want to consider that some digital stations do not broadcast during the day so be sure to do your testing in the evening during prime time hours.

[boba]

Try www.100000watts.com for a site TV listing referral is in the upper right of there site. WGBH Digital is CH19, WCVB is CH20, WBZ is CH30, WFXT is CH31, WSBK is CH39 & WHDH is CH42. 100,000 watts will tell you where the station is located not where their broadcast tower is located but you could call the broadcast engineer to find out where they actually broadcast from and that should help you refine the direction to point the small end of your antenna towards.

[dmodemd]

IMPORTANT:

I have discovered that, at least for me, if you had about -3.5db of attenuation before coming into the receiver, it significantly improves the signal. I also had trouble with direct connect of the antenna to the Dish 6000.

You can get the attenuation a couple ways:
1. Use a splitter labelled -3.5db on the output. You will only go in the IN and go OUT from one OUT port.
2. Get a fixed -6db attenuator from Radio Shack (6db is ok)
3. Get a variable attenuator - has a dial on it. That way you can play around with it but I have found 3.5db to be optimal.

P.S. Normally you attenuate if your signal is TOO STRONG but I am way out and signals are weak. So yes, I AMP it and then attenuate it back down - dont ask why - it just works!

Lee

[Mike123abc]

It probably works because you are reducing the strength of the multipath signals in addition to the main signal. Probably suffering from multipath and weaken it enough to hide it.

[Mark Lamutt]

I had to add a 3rd split to my antenna line coming into my house this past weekend to add a 3rd HD receiver to my setup (a 2nd hipix card). Splitting the signal the 1st time (-3.5db) didn't affect my signal strength at all - every channel was exactly the same as with no splitter installed. Probably due to the multipathing that Mike is suggesting. But, adding the second splitter (so 2 of the lines are now at -7.0db) hurt me on the lowest power station I receive - was getting a signal strength of around 70, now it's at 55. Still enough for a good strong signal lock, but I doubt I'd be able to receive that channel if I was down -10.5db. So, your mileage may vary with the antenuator.

[DVDDAD]

I know it may be a lot of work to relocate your mast, but if you're in a valley, you may need to do so. I resisted doing so for over a year to get an additional station (WNHT ABC-DT in New Haven, CT). I even purchased a single channel antenna to get it in, but still couldn't lock onto their signal. Then I finally decided to try re-locating the mast, adding a tri-pod and moving it to the peak of my house. I gained about 10' and sure enough, I locked onto the signal w/o a hitch. If you are in a valley, it may help to raise your antenna. Good luck; I hope this helps.

[brentp]

JStanton - Definitely go to antennaweb.org. The towers for Boston are not located in Boston, they are located out in Needham, which is likely more west than you think. It will also make you further away than you might think you are. If you know the Long/Lat where you are, the towers are at;

42 18 37N 71 14 14W

There is a website (I can't remember where it is) that will tell you how far away you are as the crow flies based on 2 Long/Lat readings, if that is important to you.

More importantly, at the site above, you should be able to get a magnetic compass reading on where you should point your antenna. At least with that magnetic heading, you can figure out if you have any buildings or anything else in your line of sight.

As an FYI, most of the Boston DT stations transmit all day long at full power. You should be able to get WGBH-DT PBS (both SD and an HD version), WCVB-DT ABC, WBZ-DT CBS, WSBK-DT UPN, WHDH-DT NBC, WFXT-DT Fox, WLVI-DT WB, and maybe WUTF-DT Uni. And, there are more on the way. Fortunately, Boston has an excellent DT OTA broadcast portfolio.

I too live in New England, . . . I am 35 miles away and get all of the above stations very well with an attic install.

Hope this helps, Good Luck

[sampatterson]

antennaweb.org is a good place to start but you have to take your own geographical location into consideration. I had to get a bigger antenna then it suggested because we live in a valley (hole!) in the suburbs of Atlanta (around 30 miles from the transmitters). Because of this there is no line of sight, but I still receive all the stations with the big antenna. Amplification hurt my signal (increased the errors and multipath).

[JStanton]

I had gone to both antennaweb.org and 100000watts.com before I purchased the antenna. The towers are actually southwest from me. (All stations +/- 3 deg from 243 deg).

I tried reterminating the ends of the cable, as well as a new 75-300 ohm converter to no avail. Looking at the topograhic maps, it looks like I'm 20' below a hill that's 1/2 mile away.

My next step is going to be getting a professional installer to put it up on a mast. I don't want to play around with a "lightning rod" bolted to my house. Hope I can get him out before the superbowl!

Thanks all for the help!

- Jim

[jerryez]

I still think that you have a connection problem. You should get some signal strength from at least one of the stations. if you are only ten miles from the towers. Buy a one piece cable and hook it up directly from the Dish 6000(be sure you hook to the ant in) to the antenna just out thru a window. Be sure the couplings are installed properly( preferably factory installed). Then do a digital scan.

[Mark Lamutt]

Or, another idea - take your UHF remote stub antenna and screw it onto the antenna input on the 8VSB and then do a digital scan. Even the little stub antenna should pick up something from the area you're in I would think.