MDU Prewire

[stewp97]

I am in the process of building several 8 and 12 plexes. I want to verify how to prewire the units for use with a single dish. I have been given four different phone numbers and just keep getting shuffled around at DirecTv. At this point I plan on having my low voltage contractor pulling all the coax to a common home run closet for the entire building and six coaxes (for redundancy) to the dish location. I have built many homes and duplexes but this is the first MDU I have built with plans for satellite TV.

I also need to know how much room to allow for their equipment. Is all their equipment wall mountable? I am assuming all they will need to do is stack mutiswitches?

Any information or good phone numbers would be greatly appreciated. I will be starting the prewire in a couple of weeks.

I realize this is not the correct place to ask this next question but maybe someone will have an answer. Because I am the developer/contractor and not the owner of the buildings (they will be resold when complete), do I need to do anything different for Dish Network? Obviously I will try to push for the owners to go with DirecTV but I do not have final say in the matter.

Thanks,

peter

[carl6]

There is a "today" answer and there is a "tomorrow" answer. The tomorrow answer involves the use of new technology known as Single Wire Multiswitch (SWM), which will reduce the number of coax you will ultimately need.

The today answer is to run enough coax to allow two RG6 at each possible TV location. The easiest might be to put a distribution point inside each unit and wire each unit back to it's own central point, then run FOUR coax from each unit's central point back to your building common point. That's for DirecTV. If an occupant might want cable internet in addition to DirecTV, you will need a separate coax for that. If you also want to provide access to an OTA antenna, you will need a separate coax for that.

With four coax to each unit, you could then put a multiswitch in each unit and feed as many locations as there is wire. But you need the four coax to make that happen.

The tomorrow answer would probably allow you to use a single coax for DirecTV, plus one for cable internet and one for OTA as applicable.

There are several people who read this forum who do MDU work. Perhaps you can communicate directly with one of them for more or better ideas.

Carl

[RobertE]

For the most part, I agree with what carl said with a few minor differences.

I'd run 10 lines from your dish location to the master closet. 4 for a KA/KU dish, 1 for an international dish. The other 5 for just a backup set. Figuratively speaking, coax is cheap. Or run big enough conduit that new lines can easily be pulled. Probably another for OTA. If you really wanted to go nuts, pull a full set for the best that Dish has as well.

From the master closet, I'd do 6 or 7 to the units closets. 4 for KA/KU, 1 international, 1 OTA, 1 spare. Again coax is cheap, big conduit is even better.

With those amount of lines, a 6x8, 6x16 or a SWM could be put in each units closet to feed whatever is needed from there. Life would be very easy at that point. Plug & play.

From each units closet, 2 at a minimum to each TV location, 4 preferable. 2 Sat, 1 OTA, 1 cable.

Phone lines at Cat5/5e/6 everywhere to the units closet would be a good idea as well.

The only expericnce I've had with Dish is takeing them down. :grin: But, I can't see where having 2 to 4 cables to each location would be a bad thing.

More lines the better. :)

[stewp97]

Thank you very much for your help. All of the homes I usually build I do I run at least 2 coaxs and two cat5e's to most TV locations. The cat5e's are terminated for voice and data at the jack and in the closet one cat5e is laid down on a punchdown block for voice and the other cat5e is terminated with RJ-45 ends for data. I plan on doing the same in these apartments.

At the location of these apartments cable is not available. I highly doubt that OTA is available either (small remote mountain town). I had not thought about running the extra line for the international dish. I like the idea of running the ten lines. Same thing for the master closet to the units.

What equipment will be required in the master closet? Will the installers need access to this closet every time a tenant request a change? I would like to be able to lock this room off if possible.

Thanks again for your help!

peter

[RobertE]

Thank you very much for your help. All of the homes I usually build I do I run at least 2 coaxs and two cat5e's to most TV locations. The cat5e's are terminated for voice and data at the jack and in the closet one cat5e is laid down on a punchdown block for voice and the other cat5e is terminated with RJ-45 ends for data. I plan on doing the same in these apartments.

At the location of these apartments cable is not available. I highly doubt that OTA is available either (small remote mountain town). I had not thought about running the extra line for the international dish. I like the idea of running the ten lines. Same thing for the master closet to the units.

What equipment will be required in the master closet? Will the installers need access to this closet every time a tenant request a change? I would like to be able to lock this room off if possible.

Thanks again for your help!

peter


Myself I'd run all the lines from the dish to a power locker such as this:
http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=HRPID1422

or a WB616
http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=WB616

Either would lock and power the dish. A downside is, I'm not sure what would need to be done to power the international dish with just the Sonora.

From there I'd take the outputs of the Sonora or five of then from the WB616 and feed them into these (or similar) splitters:

http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=SP8HFA

Then you could lock up the master closet.

Going this route though would then require a WB68 or another WB616 in each unit. The lines in the master and unit would have to be labled (13v, 18v, 13v22k, 18v22k, intl) and connected accordingly.

Other route would be to not have any multswitches in the units, but all in the master closet.

Hope this helps. That's about as far as my knowledge on big setups goes.

You could also try and find someone at Directv that can give you more information on SMAT (System Master ATenna). Might be the MDU group, but not sure.

[RobertE]

A couple of other bits. If you/the owners want to get some extra insurance against rain/snow fade using two of the AK/HI dishes could be used.

See here:
http://www.thesatelliteshop.net/dire...aii-p-148.html

&

http://www.thesatelliteshop.net/dire...aii-p-147.html

For the other coax, while it may not currently be needed for OTA, who knows what the future brings. It could also be used for CCTV/security cameras, who knows.

[carl6]

What equipment will be required in the master closet? Will the installers need access to this closet every time a tenant request a change? I would like to be able to lock this room off if possible.

Thanks again for your help!

peter

What you need in the master closet depends on how you want to approach the overall system.

If you were to put multiple WB616's in your central closet, and feed each unit with four coax off the WB616, then an installer would not normally require access to the central closet. They could cross-connect one to four lines directly to receivers, or put a WB68 in the unit closet if there is need for more than four connections. Make sure you leave adequate instructions/documentation so they know what they have available.

As to the international dish. that complicates the issue, and would almost certainly require the installer to access your central closet to access it. You can't cascade flex port dishes through two multiswitches. If you input the international dish into your WB616's, then the international dish would be available on each of the four lines going to the individual units, but you could not put a WB68 in the unit and still have access to the international dish. If you expect high demand for the international dish (unlikely), then you might want to run five coax from the central closet to each unit, so it can be mixed with a WB68 in each unit.

Carl

[stewp97]

Thanks again for the replies. I am learning quite a bit in a hurry! I have never given much thought about satellite distribution in apartments. Most of the MDU installs I see around here are just a dish planted on each unit and the wires hacked into the building. Not very attractive on any building, whether brand new or not!

Another dumb question. Does DirecTV generally supply and install the dish and multiswiches both in the central closet and the units or will I be responsible for that? I'm not trying to be cheap, I'm just curious and would like to be ready when the time comes for occupancy!

peter