View Full Version : HD Bird Brain Pack
Steve Rhodes
12-24-07, 12:46 PM
I understand that after D*'s success in getting people to pony up five bucks a month for 4 channels, they are looking into other à la carte small packages.
In their plans, so I have heard, are a new Audobon HD channel, which features lots of bird watching, and a new Medical HD channel, which lets you get up close and personal with brain surgeries.
Along with 2 other HD channels yet to be named, the package will be called the HD Bird Brain Pack. It will be available for free for the first three months. After that viewers will have to call in or log on to attempt to add this new package for additional $4.98 per month.
Greg Alsobrook
12-24-07, 01:00 PM
you serious clark?
:lol:
davring
12-24-07, 01:02 PM
:lol:
Still whining about this SteveRhodes? :rolleyes:
Did you need another dedicated thread to yourself? Couldn't use one of the existing?
Ok, enjoy your five minutes, you've got the attention grab you were seeking.
litzdog911
12-24-07, 02:31 PM
It's getting old, Steve. We already know how you feel.
jimmyv2000
12-24-07, 02:38 PM
Dim WIT Pack + coming soon.
we can have the fireplace hd channel,the aquarium HD channel and maybe throw in RFD-hd for an extra $3.99/month:D
Just being funny here folks with a great buzz this x-mas eve
happy holidaze:D
Jimmy
Paul Secic
12-24-07, 02:45 PM
I understand that after D*'s success in getting people to pony up five bucks a month for 4 channels, they are looking into other à la carte small packages.
In their plans, so I have heard, are a new Audobon HD channel, which features lots of bird watching, and a new Medical HD channel, which lets you get up close and personal with brain surgeries.
Along with 2 other HD channels yet to be named, the package will be called the HD Bird Brain Pack. It will be available for free for the first three months. After that viewers will have to call in or log on to attempt to add this new package for additional $4.98 per month.
Typical Directv MO. I'll never deal with the surcharge Co.
Ext 721
12-24-07, 03:34 PM
Yes, and then there's a package that consists of the food channel's new grape-based alcoholic beverage channel, animal planet's channel consisting exclusively of purebred canines ready to be mothers, and finally, discovery wings is making a comeback with a channel dedicated exclusively to commercial (COM.) airliners, as opposed to other types of plane.
Guess what that package will be called!
This HDEXTRA pack has caused more bad feedback then anything from Directv that I can remember in a while. So, Directv, get rid of it!!!
Mike D-CO5
12-24-07, 03:57 PM
I wonder how much money it is really costing Directv for these extra hd channels? Would it been easier for DIRECTV to just bite the bullet and put them into the hd pack or under the tech fee for $9.99 and then later next year hike the price to 14.99? It would of still pissed off some for the hd price increase, but it would of been in line with what they said about no price increase for hd when all those hd channels were added for this year.
Earl Bonovich
12-24-07, 04:05 PM
This HDEXTRA pack has caused more bad feedback then anything from Directv that I can remember in a while. So, Directv, get rid of it!!!
Really?
You should go back and read the initial posts when they announced they will drop TiVo?
Or when the R15 was released...
Or when the HR20 was released...
Or when the HR21 was released... without the ATSC
When ever something is changed... there is a lot of feedback.
And the fact that over the last year, blog/forum world has gotten a lot more popular... there is no doubt that "feedback" is louder as people now have an avenue to do so.
HD Extra Pack is not going anywhere... as much as you all might think it will.... it's cost to DirecTV is directly related to the number of subscribers... so the less that subscribe... the less DirecTV has to pay to the content providers.
I meant as to programming, not anything else. And, what makes you so sure they won't change this package? If none of us sign up for it, they just might.
Earl Bonovich
12-24-07, 04:07 PM
I wonder how much money it is really costing Directv for these extra hd channels? Would it been easier for DIRECTV to just bite the bullet and put them into the hd pack or under the tech fee for $9.99 and then later next year hike the price to 14.99? It would of still pissed off some for the hd price increase, but it would of been in line with what they said about no price increase for hd when all those hd channels were added for this year.
But as many times it has been noted...
There is the clamor for more Ala-Carte... this is just one step towards Ala-Carte. Those that want it... can pay for it...
Those that don't... don't..
Either way, those taht want those channels pay $14.95.
Those that don't... don't have to pay the extra $5.
There was no price increase of the new HD channels in October when they were launched... there is no price increase for HD till March 15, 2008 when you will then be charged for the HD Extra Pack.
When the comments were made back in July (I think that is when they were made), how long did you think there would be no price increase....
They didn't say that the price would be $9.99 for the next 3 years...... they didn't put a time frame on how long prices would remain at the price they were.
Earl Bonovich
12-24-07, 04:09 PM
I meant as to programming, not anything else. And, what makes you so sure they won't change this package? If none of us sign up for it, they just might.
I am sure the package will change...
I am sure more channels will be added to it...
And it is possible that contracts will be re-done and some channels might even move out of it.
But all indications...
I personally don't see the package going anywhere, anytime soon.
I know I have signed up for it, as I want MGM and Smithsonian.
My neighboor signed up, because he likes HDMovies and MGM as well.
So that is at least two people, and based on some of the other polls here, there are other that are signing up for it as well.
So "none" isn't going to happen...
And I don't think they are looking for 100% participation either on the package...
As to the programming aspects:
The Choice to Choice Extra caught some discussion like this...
It is not like they are making these changes monthly or anything like that....
So certainly... changing something that has been the "norm" for 4+ years... yep... that is going to get a lot of discussion about it.
And IMHO: This is just the tip of the iceberg...
Wait till next year, when the MPEG-2 HD channels start to shutdown.
This HDEXTRA pack has caused more bad feedback then anything from Directv that I can remember in a while. So, Directv, get rid of it!!!
Nope, hands down it's the USSB/DirecTv merger and the creation of packages to accommodate premium channels (gold silver etc in those days). All of the Encore pack used to come with Total Choice and at that time was placed into the premium tier with Starz (that used to be 5 bucks a month). Now that was some uproar!
Second place=Primestar merger.
This is hardly a blip.
Newshawk
12-24-07, 05:12 PM
I am sure the package will change...
I am sure more channels will be added to it...
And it is possible that contracts will be re-done and some channels might even move out of it.
I'd bet that some of the channels (particularly UHD and MHD) will either morph into another channel that may not fit into the HD Extra pack or be shut down as being duplicates of the "prime" channels.
Dim WIT Pack + coming soon.
we can have the fireplace hd channel,the aquarium HD channel and maybe throw in RFD-hd for an extra $3.99/month:DMaybe they should put the SD upconvert HD channels in their own package.
Earl Bonovich
12-24-07, 05:20 PM
Or maybe we can go the Vonage model.
1 Price... 1 Package.
Everything will be the same for everyone, for the exact same fees.
Sharkie_Fan
12-24-07, 06:07 PM
When the comments were made back in July (I think that is when they were made), how long did you think there would be no price increase....
They didn't say that the price would be $9.99 for the next 3 years...... they didn't put a time frame on how long prices would remain at the price they were.
Personally, I don't have a BIG problem with the HD extra pack. I'd be much more upset if I DIDN't want those channels and was still being charged the extra $5 because they raised the HD access fee for EVERYONE.
To me, though, if they make the announcement that there will be no increases, I'd like to see that hold true for a year. As it is, the declaration that there would be no increases seems like a disingenuous statement put out there simply to appease the masses. And, to further appease, they offer 3 months free.
I understand it's their right to raise prices whenever they see fit, and as you pointed out, it's not as if they're making these changes monthly. And I did pay the $5 a month because I want those channels...
However, "there will be no price increases" is alot different than "there will be no price increases until you've had 3 months to sample our channels, then we'll adjust our packages and you'll have to pay more to keep all the HD you've been enjoying". The latter statement is a little deceptive, given that this change certainly didn't happen overnight - they didn't wake up and decide to create the HD extra pack.. it's something they've been working on, and probably knew it would happen before the first new HD channel was ever turned on. So, from that standpoint, I understand the uproar over the increase.
spartanstew
12-24-07, 06:32 PM
To me, though, if they make the announcement that there will be no increases, I'd like to see that hold true for a year.
They never made that announcement. Why are people hung up on that?
They mentioned to their shareholders 7 or 8 months ago that they weren't planning a price increase.
They didn't put ads in USAToday stating "no increases". They didn't promise you squat. At the time, they didn't have any plans for an increase. Their plan changed.
What did you want them to say?
bobnielsen
12-24-07, 06:34 PM
Or maybe we can go the Vonage model.
1 Price... 1 Package.
Everything will be the same for everyone, for the exact same fees.
Actually Vonage has two packages, unlimited for $24.99, 500 minutes for $14.99.
armophob
12-24-07, 08:52 PM
I just wish they would balance it with discount options also as I mentioned in the numerous other threads. Allow me to opt out of other genres at a discount to make up for the increases on upcoming package ala carte groupings.
Mike D-CO5
12-24-07, 10:44 PM
Personally, I don't have a BIG problem with the HD extra pack. I'd be much more upset if I DIDN't want those channels and was still being charged the extra $5 because they raised the HD access fee for EVERYONE.
To me, though, if they make the announcement that there will be no increases, I'd like to see that hold true for a year. As it is, the declaration that there would be no increases seems like a disingenuous statement put out there simply to appease the masses. And, to further appease, they offer 3 months free.
I understand it's their right to raise prices whenever they see fit, and as you pointed out, it's not as if they're making these changes monthly. And I did pay the $5 a month because I want those channels...
However, "there will be no price increases" is alot different than "there will be no price increases until you've had 3 months to sample our channels, then we'll adjust our packages and you'll have to pay more to keep all the HD you've been enjoying". The latter statement is a little deceptive, given that this change certainly didn't happen overnight - they didn't wake up and decide to create the HD extra pack.. it's something they've been working on, and probably knew it would happen before the first new HD channel was ever turned on. So, from that standpoint, I understand the uproar over the increase.
I think I understand now why there is so much bitching now about this hd extra pack. I understood your explanation of why everyone is so pissed off about it better than anyone else's. I see your point.
Like I said in my post, I think it would of probably been better for the hd channels to stay all together for this year at least and then when the yearly price increases came, they could of jacked the price of the tech fee to $14.99 and all hd channels would of stayed the same. I don't think people would of minded the change as much if it came all at once . Two changes in pricing or programming within a few months of each other looks bad and as you pointed out pisses people off.
But I will offer something to ya'll that might make you think better of the whole deal. You know how you get the hd channels in each programming pack that you sub to with the tech fee? What would of happened if DIRECTV had lumped all those X-tra hd channels into the Premier pack and if you wanted them you had to sub to that pack to receive them? And of course if you subbed to the PRemier Pack you would also gain the dvr fee too. Wouldn't you of thought better of paying /or not paying as the case maybe, $4.99 more to sub /or not sub to those xtra hd channels , than paying about $40.00 more for those same Xtra hd channels found only in the Premier pack? Ala carte for these X-tra hd channels would make perfect sense then , don't you think?
Davenlr
12-25-07, 12:27 AM
Only thing bugging me I'd they make me pay $52 a month for crap SD channels I never watch. I wish they had a HD Only pack with no SD channels at all, but including all the HD channels available... Then give me a $9.95 credit for NOT getting the SD channels. $52 for SD or $52 for HD, and an extra $15 if you want both.
Right now the people who have only SD are subsidizing those of us with HD not the other way around. If they charged the 10% of us who have HD what it costs them to carry it the price would not be $52 but many times that.
warriorking
12-25-07, 11:27 AM
HD Extra Pack is not going anywhere... as much as you all might think it will.... it's cost to DirecTV is directly related to the number of subscribers... so the less that subscribe... the less DirecTV has to pay to the
cEarl - Gotta Love Karma
Chicago's Bid for the 2016 Olympics
All comments are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of DBSTalk.com, or Direcontent providers.
Never say Never!!!! If a very large number of subscribers opt out as well as cut back some of their current packages due to the perceived money grab, D' will probably rethink its decision....never underestimate the power of the consumer...
We will see what happens come April....
I think I understand now why there is so much bitching now about this hd extra pack. I understood your explanation of why everyone is so pissed off about it better than anyone else's. I see your point.
....But I will offer something to ya'll that might make you think better of the whole deal. You know how you get the hd channels in each programming pack that you sub to with the tech fee? What would of happened if DIRECTV had lumped all those X-tra hd channels into the Premier pack and if you wanted them you had to sub to that pack to receive them? And of course if you subbed to the PRemier Pack you would also gain the dvr fee too. Wouldn't you of thought better of paying /or not paying as the case maybe, $4.99 more to sub /or not sub to those xtra hd channels , than paying about $40.00 more for those same Xtra hd channels found only in the Premier pack? Ala carte for these X-tra hd channels would make perfect sense then , don't you think?
I agree... and that's what made the Premier Pack obsolete today in terms of the way they marketed it to everyone. They need to simplify the packages; having various tiers that lead up to the Premier level is the way to go without making DirecTV look like they are milking fees out like Comcast/Dish or other providers....they know the bottom line numbers of what makes money and what it costs to provide the underlying programming. They should figure how to roll it out without alienating a lot of people.
I understand that after D*'s success in getting people to pony up five bucks a month for 4 channels, they are looking into other à la carte small packages.
In their plans, so I have heard, are a new Audobon HD channel, which features lots of bird watching, and a new Medical HD channel, which lets you get up close and personal with brain surgeries.
Along with 2 other HD channels yet to be named, the package will be called the HD Bird Brain Pack. It will be available for free for the first three months. After that viewers will have to call in or log on to attempt to add this new package for additional $4.98 per month.
Gee, its April Fools Day. A Medical Network HD channel would be cool, though. It could be like the old show "The Operation" 24/7.
Steve Mehs
12-25-07, 01:22 PM
As a non D* subscriber I am absolutely perplexed at this. The additional content is either worth it to you so or not, so either pay or don’t. With cable we have an HD Tier for $4.95 which includes HD Net, HD Net Movies and Universal HD. All of the other HD channels, and it looks like all future HD channels will be included with a base subscription to digital cable at no additional charge all you need is an HD set top terminal, which costs the same as an SD terminal.
If you want the extra channels with D* subscribe to the HD Extra package, if you don’t well then don’t subscribe. It’s not a very hard concept. Nowadays I very rarely defend either satellite provider, but I see nothing wrong with what D* is doing and if they were my service provider I’d subscribe to the HD Extra package.
Sharkie_Fan
12-25-07, 03:04 PM
They never made that announcement. Why are people hung up on that?
They mentioned to their shareholders 7 or 8 months ago that they weren't planning a price increase.
They didn't put ads in USAToday stating "no increases". They didn't promise you squat. At the time, they didn't have any plans for an increase. Their plan changed.
What did you want them to say?
An "announcement" to the shareholders is as good as an ad in the USA today, IMHO.
And second, there's no way they didn't know they were going to increase the prices, in my opinion.
I paid the 5$ as I think the channels offered have value. However, my compaint is this: Chase Carey said, in no uncertain terms, in the Q2 conference call that "We will not have a programming cost increase related to HD". That was August 9th. Less than 3 months later comes the creation of the HD Extra Pack.
I just don't believe that they didn't have this move planned when those statements were made - hence, the feeling that this was some sort of "bait and switch".
Perhaps it's semantics, but if Carey had said "we don't foresee" or "we are not planning on" any price increases, I think the sentiment would be different, because then your argument that "plans change" explains everything away. As it is, he said plainly that there WOULD NOT be an increase, and then there was.
That, I believe, is the heart of the problem. Not the change in pricing itself. I expect prices to change... that's the nature of the beast, costs to DirecTV go up, and in turn, prices to us go up. I understand that.
But I don't think it's unreasonable to expect that if the CEO of DirecTV says "there will be no price increase" that we should see that play out - at least for some decent period of time. Not forever, certainly, but 6 months, yes. A year, to me, would be a fair amount of time. But the announcement that there would be no price increase didn't even last a month after the September 26th launch of HD channels. That is my ONLY complaint about the price increase.
Certainly, this model is better than charging everyone $14.99 for "HD Access" regardless of whether or not you want the extra channels. For those who don't see the value of the extra channels, they have the option to not pay the $5.00. I'm all for that pricing model. And for more "a la carte" options.... I just don't appreciate the manner in which the change was handled.
redchicken
12-25-07, 03:30 PM
Really?
You should go back and read the initial posts when they announced they will drop TiVo?
Or when the R15 was released...
Or when the HR20 was released...
Or when the HR21 was released... without the ATSC
When ever something is changed... there is a lot of feedback.
And the fact that over the last year, blog/forum world has gotten a lot more popular... there is no doubt that "feedback" is louder as people now have an avenue to do so.
HD Extra Pack is not going anywhere... as much as you all might think it will.... it's cost to DirecTV is directly related to the number of subscribers... so the less that subscribe... the less DirecTV has to pay to the content providers.
Earl is there any thing that Direct could do that you won't rally up the support? I mean is there any price you are not willing to pay? Or will you just tolerate any change no matter how onerous and any price increase and say thank you sir may I have another?
An "announcement" to the shareholders is as good as an ad in the USA today, IMHO.
And second, there's no way they didn't know they were going to increase the prices, in my opinion.
I paid the 5$ as I think the channels offered have value. However, my compaint is this: Chase Carey said, in no uncertain terms, in the Q2 conference call that "We will not have a programming cost increase related to HD". That was August 9th. Less than 3 months later comes the creation of the HD Extra Pack.
I just don't believe that they didn't have this move planned when those statements were made - hence, the feeling that this was some sort of "bait and switch".
Perhaps it's semantics, but if Carey had said "we don't foresee" or "we are not planning on" any price increases, I think the sentiment would be different, because then your argument that "plans change" explains everything away. As it is, he said plainly that there WOULD NOT be an increase, and then there was.
That, I believe, is the heart of the problem. Not the change in pricing itself. I expect prices to change... that's the nature of the beast, costs to DirecTV go up, and in turn, prices to us go up. I understand that.
But I don't think it's unreasonable to expect that if the CEO of DirecTV says "there will be no price increase" that we should see that play out - at least for some decent period of time. Not forever, certainly, but 6 months, yes. A year, to me, would be a fair amount of time. But the announcement that there would be no price increase didn't even last a month after the September 26th launch of HD channels. That is my ONLY complaint about the price increase.
Certainly, this model is better than charging everyone $14.99 for "HD Access" regardless of whether or not you want the extra channels. For those who don't see the value of the extra channels, they have the option to not pay the $5.00. I'm all for that pricing model. And for more "a la carte" options.... I just don't appreciate the manner in which the change was handled.
I think you have the quote wrong which changes your entire POV. My understanding (I don't have the transcript in front of me) is that he said we are not planning a price increase related..."
Correct me with a link if I'm wrong.
leww37334
12-25-07, 03:44 PM
Earl is there any thing that Direct could do that you won't rally up the support? I mean is there any price you are not willing to pay? Or will you just tolerate any change no matter how onerous and any price increase and say thank you sir may I have another?
Two posts, hmmm seems like someone was afraid to use their real userid.
No one at Directv has held a gun to my head, they gave me the choice by shuffling some channels that not everyone wants into an ala a carte package and not adding any costs for 80+ new channels. I think it was a good move, rather than just adding a straight $4.99 to everyone's bill. Folks, there is a price to pay somewhere for all the new HD channels, and I am happy with the approach that provides a choice.
Sharkie_Fan
12-25-07, 03:56 PM
I think you have the quote wrong which changes your entire POV. My understanding (I don't have the transcript in front of me) is that he said we are not planning a price increase related..."
Correct me with a link if I'm wrong.
http://www.seekingalpha.com/article/44085-directv-group-q2-2007-earnings-call-transcript
"In terms of HD rollout, it will not have an impact. We are looking to get the HD channels as part of what we would expect as part of a relationship on the standard def channels, so we do not -- we will not have a programming cost increase related to HD."
Notice, he began to say "we do not", as if he was going to say 'we do not anticipate a programming cost increase related to HD'.
However, he stopped, and continued on with the quote you see. "we will NOT have a programmin cost increase related to HD."
As a non D* subscriber I am absolutely perplexed at this. The additional content is either worth it to you so or not, so either pay or don’t.
Don't worry, I am a DirecTV subscriber and I'm equally perplexed. What service in a modern economy doesn't increase in price over time? My barber doesn't do anything extra in my haircut these days, but his fee goes up as time goes by.
DirecTV added, what? 50 HD channels in the last few months? And people get mad because they have to pay $5 more for a couple of channels? Some people here claiming that DirecTV lied to them are behaving as if their significant other just cheated on them. Or that DirecTV claimed up and down that there were WMD when there weren't any.
If you're that mad about it move to Utopia, then give me the address once you get there so I can relocate too. From what I understand everything is perfect there.
http://www.seekingalpha.com/article/44085-directv-group-q2-2007-earnings-call-transcript
"In terms of HD rollout, it will not have an impact. We are looking to get the HD channels as part of what we would expect as part of a relationship on the standard def channels, so we do not -- we will not have a programming cost increase related to HD."
Notice, he began to say "we do not", as if he was going to say 'we do not anticipate a programming cost increase related to HD'.
However, he stopped, and continued on with the quote you see. "we will NOT have a programmin cost increase related to HD."
Thanks for the link, but I think you're confusing cost with price here. He said that in response to what their programming costs would be, not what their programming prices would be. It was in response to this:
"Thanks. Good afternoon. So my first question is Chase, as you roll out HD more broadly in the second half, should we expect an acceleration in your programming cost growth as that happens?
The second question I guess is for Mike; I believe your ’07 CapEx guidance is $2 billion. I think you are running about 15% higher than that on an annualized basis through the first half. Could you just update us on what you think that -- if that’s still an okay number for the year?
And then at DIRECTV Latin America, there seems to have been a little bit of a spike in CapEx in the quarter. Was it just a one-time thing or if you could just give us some clarity there. Thanks"
Cost increases and price increase don't always go together in a linear way.
Thanks for the link, I'll read the entire call after the holidays, but I do think you're misinterpreting the part you're quoting.
An "announcement" to the shareholders is as good as an ad in the USA today, IMHO. Unfortunately you forgot one major aspect of shareholder statements and meetings. This quote is from the same transcript posted earlier, with the bold emphasis added by me for the most significant parts:
In a moment, I’ll hand the call over to Chase and Mike for some introductory remarks but first I am obligated to read to you the following: on this call, we make statements that may include forward-looking statements within the meaning of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. These forward-looking statements involve known and unknown risks, uncertainties and other factors that could cause actual results to be materially different from those expressed or implied by the relevant forward-looking statements.
Factors that could cause actual results to differ materially are described in each of the DIRECTV Group’s and DIRECTV U.S.’ annual reports on Form 10-K, quarterly reports on Form 10-Q and our other filings with the SEC, which are available at www.sec.gov.
Additionally, in accordance with the SEC’s Regulation G that requires companies reporting non-GAAP financial measures to reconcile these measures to the most directly comparable GAAP measure, we provide schedules for the non-GAAP measures. These reconciliation schedules are attached to our earnings release and are posted on our website at directv.com.
With that, I am pleased to introduce Chase.
Clearly, comments from shareholder meetings are subject to change and can not be taken as promises or commitments.
Steve Rhodes
12-25-07, 08:07 PM
Don't worry, I am a DirecTV subscriber and I'm equally perplexed. What service in a modern economy doesn't increase in price over time? My barber doesn't do anything extra in my haircut these days, but his fee goes up as time goes by.
DirecTV added, what? 50 HD channels in the last few months? And people get mad because they have to pay $5 more for a couple of channels? Some people here claiming that DirecTV lied to them are behaving as if their significant other just cheated on them. Or that DirecTV claimed up and down that there were WMD when there weren't any.
If you're that mad about it move to Utopia, then give me the address once you get there so I can relocate too. From what I understand everything is perfect there.
1. What if your barber kept his price at $10 for almost all of your hair, but charged you an extra $5 for cutting just 4 strands of your hair on the top your head? Maybe you'd pay. Maybe you would not. But you probably would not think he was a very smart businessman. (Or maybe you'd think he was brilliant if most of customers paid the extra $5 anyway.)
2. And what if you'd already agreed to pay him whatever he asked to cut all of your hair from now on, but one day he made you go to a website, which frequently didn't work right or at all for some customers, in order to agree to pay him $5 more to cut all of your hair. Now you'd really think he was nuts.
1. What if your barber kept his price at $10 for almost all of your hair, but charged you an extra $5 for cutting just 4 strands of your hair on the top your head? Maybe you'd pay. Maybe you would not. But you probably would not think he was a very smart businessman. (Or maybe you'd think he was brilliant if most of customers paid the extra $5 anyway.)
2. And what if you'd already agreed to pay him whatever he asked to cut all of your hair from now on, but one day he made you go to a website, which frequently didn't work right or at all for some customers, in order to agree to pay him $5 more to cut all of your hair. Now you'd really think he was nuts.
I've read lots of analogies but none work that well. Sorry to say, I don't think this one does either.
Providing television content is far more complicated that sitting in a chair while a guy cuts your hair. Billions of dollars of equipment, contractual negotiations with networks, legal affairs, then dealing with people that have a hard time accepting the way the business works.
1. What if your barber kept his price at $10 for almost all of your hair, but charged you an extra $5 for cutting just 4 strands of your hair on the top your head? Maybe you'd pay. Maybe you would not. But you probably would not think he was a very smart businessman. (Or maybe you'd think he was brilliant if most of customers paid the extra $5 anyway.)
2. And what if you'd already agreed to pay him whatever he asked to cut all of your hair from now on, but one day he made you go to a website, which frequently didn't work right or at all for some customers, in order to agree to pay him $5 more to cut all of your hair. Now you'd really think he was nuts.
What if your barber went to an ala-carte system, where he charged you for each hair individually? I expect you'd end up with a pretty darned expensive haircut:)
Carl
Steve Rhodes
12-25-07, 09:16 PM
I've read lots of analogies but none work that well. Sorry to say, I don't think this one does either.
Providing television content is far more complicated that sitting in a chair while a guy cuts your hair. Billions of dollars of equipment, contractual negotiations with networks, legal affairs, then dealing with people that have a hard time accepting the way the business works.
The way business used to work at D* was that they offered a package (Premier) that had everything in it -- yes I know there were special cases not in it -- which customers could purchase and never have to call D* ever again. Sure, they raised the price several times. Great. No problem. Now it is no longer offered.
It was simple for customers and good for D* since they could always raise rates.
In a stupid business decision D* abandoned their Premier customers and decided to ask them to start going through the hassle of calling in or logining to ATTEMPT to add service and pay more without screwing up their service and their accounts. Grrr.
1. What if your barber kept his price at $10 for almost all of your hair, but charged you an extra $5 for cutting just 4 strands of your hair on the top your head? Maybe you'd pay. Maybe you would not. But you probably would not think he was a very smart businessman. (Or maybe you'd think he was brilliant if most of customers paid the extra $5 anyway.)
2. And what if you'd already agreed to pay him whatever he asked to cut all of your hair from now on, but one day he made you go to a website, which frequently didn't work right or at all for some customers, in order to agree to pay him $5 more to cut all of your hair. Now you'd really think he was nuts.
LOL. That makes absolutely no sense. What you're saying is more equivalent to DirecTV letting you watch 50 minutes of an HD broadcast and then charging you more for the last 10 minutes.
And I wouldn't agree to pay him whatever he asked to cut all of my hair from now on. That would be kinda stupid.
Are you just mad because you like being mad?
I've read lots of analogies but none work that well. Sorry to say, I don't think this one does either.
Providing television content is far more complicated that sitting in a chair while a guy cuts your hair. Billions of dollars of equipment, contractual negotiations with networks, legal affairs, then dealing with people that have a hard time accepting the way the business works.
I agree it's a pretty simple analogy. I'm just pointing out that all services go up in price over time, from the simple to the complex. It's kinda silly to think one can keep paying the same price for the same thing forever.
PeaceOfMind
12-26-07, 02:37 AM
HD Extra Pack is not going anywhere... as much as you all might think it will.... it's cost to DirecTV is directly related to the number of subscribers... so the less that subscribe... the less DirecTV has to pay to the content providers.
Hmmmm, I think I understand you Earl...the less that subscribe to the HD Extra Pack, the less Directv has to pay to the content provider....math.....soooooo, the smaller amount of people that subscribe to the HD Extra Pack, the less Directv will have to pay to the content provider....All the time, I thought it was a fishing trip to see how many would pay the extra $5 a month for the 4-5 extra HD channels. In life, I have l have learned that, if a chess player comes to the board with billions and billions of dollars, to play a consumer with hundreds of dollars....the billionaire will end up making more money and the consumer, with hundreds of dollars, will pay what they need to pay, to pay for the package that includes the channels that they really want to watch. Package, being the key word...what, as the consumer, are you willing to pay? That is the story of life...to test the market, I would raise the price of something that I knew people really wanted....let's say GAS for $3 or $4, a gallon....if people buy it at this price, why should I lower the price? If people buy the $5 a month, for the 4-5 HD channels, why would a billionaire change any package? It is a win win situation for the billionaire, for, after all, the billionaire is only testing the market and only the poorer side of the consumer will actually feel the increase. That's economics, ie, I have something that you want and how much are you willing to pay for it. Bottom line, let Directv run their test...if you vote "YES", pay the extra $5, a month.....if you vote "NO", don't purchase the Extra package....for, after all, it's what we have been taking in the school class rooms all our lives, "It's Just A Test".....If they can make a profit, it will stay.....if they lose money, it will go away or change.....this is about the dollar bill. 2 + 2 still equals 4.
Learn to Love to play games, over a dollar, then, the HD package will make more sense.....soooo, let the well off and the not so well off....Vote...and let the purchasing power of the consumer, decide the outcome....the billionaire will still win. It is all legal, it is called "business".
The way business used to work at D* was that they offered a package (Premier) that had everything in it -- yes I know there were special cases not in it -- which customers could purchase and never have to call D* ever again. Sure, they raised the price several times. Great. No problem. Now it is no longer offered.
It was simple for customers and good for D* since they could always raise rates.
In a stupid business decision D* abandoned their Premier customers and decided to ask them to start going through the hassle of calling in or logining to ATTEMPT to add service and pay more without screwing up their service and their accounts. Grrr.
Ah there you are buddy. You finally came back to your thread with what your gripe is all along. You believed Premier was something it was not ever promised to be and you're still all upset because it isn't that which it never was.
Get over the Premier thing. If you want everything get on the waiting list for Titanium. If you don't want everything, quit complaining about your misinterpretation of what Premier was intended to be. :rolleyes:
Sirshagg
12-26-07, 06:20 AM
I understand that after D*'s success in getting people to pony up five bucks a month for 4 channels, they are looking into other à la carte small packages.
In their plans, so I have heard, are a new Audobon HD channel, which features lots of bird watching, and a new Medical HD channel, which lets you get up close and personal with brain surgeries.
Along with 2 other HD channels yet to be named, the package will be called the HD Bird Brain Pack. It will be available for free for the first three months. After that viewers will have to call in or log on to attempt to add this new package for additional $4.98 per month.
This is great news! Seeing as how I don't want these channels I'm happy that I'm not forced to pay for them.
Ed Campbell
12-26-07, 06:40 AM
I know a reminder isn't necessary - but, this is officially National Whiners Day.
NYSmoker
12-26-07, 07:22 AM
I know a reminder isn't necessary - but, this is officially National Whiners Day.
So being upset that the CEO of a major corporation lied is now considered whining?
paulman182
12-26-07, 07:41 AM
So being upset that the CEO of a major corporation lied is now considered whining?
Yes.
Earl Bonovich
12-26-07, 08:32 AM
Earl is there any thing that Direct could do that you won't rally up the support? I mean is there any price you are not willing to pay? Or will you just tolerate any change no matter how onerous and any price increase and say thank you sir may I have another?
I am sure there are plenty of things that they could do....
But as of right now... there really hasn't been anything they have done, that I don't have a big issue with.
I understand why the $4.99 price is there.
I understand why we will probably see a price increase in March.
I understand how the HD Access works.
So just because I have an undestanding of the why's and how's... maybe I look at it less emotionally and knee jerk style as others.
Sharkie_Fan
12-26-07, 09:11 AM
Unfortunately you forgot one major aspect of shareholder statements and meetings. This quote is from the same transcript posted earlier, with the bold emphasis added by me for the most significant parts:
Clearly, comments from shareholder meetings are subject to change and can not be taken as promises or commitments.
Promises, no. Commitments, yes.
They're laying out their business plan, as they see it, at that moment. I understand things change, prices go up, etc. That's not my complaint, at all.
My complaint is that I believe - and this is my opinion, I don't have any facts to back it up - that at the point the comments were made, they knew that there was going to be an HD extra pack.
It is my opinion that a change in the programming structure would take more than 30 days to be concieved AND enacted. If that's the case, they would have known at this point that the change was coming, and yet all the information at that point (including what CSRs were instructed to tell customers) was that no price change was coming.
That is my one and only complaint, and to me, it's minor. IF my thinking is true, it's disappointing that they would tell us one thing knowing it wasn't true, but on the other hand, I've been around long enough to know that large corporations rarely tip their hands publicly until they're ready to act....
And as I've said before, I think the $5 is worth it, but I also appreciate the fact that should I decide at some point in time I DON'T want the extra channels I can cancel them and save the money.
I just keep seeing so many posts which are basically saying "Get over it, what's the big deal", and I was attempting to explain what the deal is (not big, in my opinion, but there's some reason to be mildly irritated, I think).
So being upset that the CEO of a major corporation lied is now considered whining?
I'm not remotely close to being a D* mouthpiece. but, you really need to look at the "forward looking statements" piece of the disclaimer attached to the conference calls. These are commonplace for these types of communications, and for good reason.
If you're going to be mad at the Extra Pack nonsense, be mad that some of the channels are still sub-par picture quality. Be mad if you're a frequent viewer of said channels. However, don't consider this being "lied" to. It's nonsense.
Maybe they should put the SD upconvert HD channels in their own package.
There wouldn't be a whole lot left :D
NYSmoker
12-26-07, 09:44 AM
I'm not remotely close to being a D* mouthpiece. but, you really need to look at the "forward looking statements" piece of the disclaimer attached to the conference calls. These are commonplace for these types of communications, and for good reason.
If you're going to be mad at the Extra Pack nonsense, be mad that some of the channels are still sub-par picture quality. Be mad if you're a frequent viewer of said channels. However, don't consider this being "lied" to. It's nonsense.
For good reason is right, most corporations nowadays consider that a license to lie, decieve, cheat and steal just to make a buck and then fall back on the, "well we had a disclaimer."
Just because it may be legal doesn't make it right. Goodwill towards your customers still can go a long way.
So being upset that the CEO of a major corporation lied is now considered whining?
What are you talking about? No one lied. As posted earlier:
An "announcement" to the shareholders is as good as an ad in the USA today, IMHO. Unfortunately you forgot one major aspect of shareholder statements and meetings. This quote is from the same transcript posted earlier, with the bold emphasis added by me for the most significant parts:
In a moment, I’ll hand the call over to Chase and Mike for some introductory remarks but first I am obligated to read to you the following: on this call, we make statements that may include forward-looking statements within the meaning of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. These forward-looking statements involve known and unknown risks, uncertainties and other factors that could cause actual results to be materially different from those expressed or implied by the relevant forward-looking statements.
Factors that could cause actual results to differ materially are described in each of the DIRECTV Group’s and DIRECTV U.S.’ annual reports on Form 10-K, quarterly reports on Form 10-Q and our other filings with the SEC, which are available at www.sec.gov (http://www.sec.gov/).
Additionally, in accordance with the SEC’s Regulation G that requires companies reporting non-GAAP financial measures to reconcile these measures to the most directly comparable GAAP measure, we provide schedules for the non-GAAP measures. These reconciliation schedules are attached to our earnings release and are posted on our website at directv.com.
With that, I am pleased to introduce Chase.
Clearly, comments from shareholder meetings are subject to change and can not be taken as promises or commitments.
NYSmoker
12-26-07, 10:23 AM
What are you talking about? No one lied. As posted earlier:
Well I guess we disagree on what is a lie.
I feel deceived and that will be one factor in choosing my television provider come June 2008 when my commitment to D* is over.
You can feel free to take what D* gives you and like it. I won't.
Steve Rhodes
12-26-07, 10:23 AM
This is great news! Seeing as how I don't want these channels I'm happy that I'm not forced to pay for them.
But you would never have been forced to pay more. D* had a set of tiers of packages. The top tier had everything. If you didn't want everything, you could pick a lower tier and pay less.
mikewolf13
12-26-07, 10:28 AM
I agree... and that's what made the Premier Pack obsolete today in terms of the way they marketed it to everyone. They need to simplify the packages; having various tiers that lead up to the Premier level is the way to go without making DirecTV look like they are milking fees out like Comcast/Dish or other providers....they know the bottom line numbers of what makes money and what it costs to provide the underlying programming. They should figure how to roll it out without alienating a lot of people.
yep...just raise the price for EVERYONE 5 bucks but include the price...voila 100% enrollment....I ams usre they have lots of data on their churn after periodic price increases...so just wait..the package will go away..but everyone will pay for it...
Well I guess we disagree on what is a lie.
I feel deceived and that will be one factor in choosing my television provider come June 2008 when my commitment to D* is over.
You can feel free to take what D* gives you and like it. I won't.There's quite a difference from being lied to and feeling deceived.
Let's say it's 4 PM and I invite you to a family dinner today at my folk's house and tell you my mother said dinner was for 6 PM. When you show up at 6 PM, you find that dinner is over. Turns out my mother put dinner on at 5, not 6, because she found out half of the guests had tickets to the local production of Nutcracker and had to leave early.
Were you lied to? No. You were given the best information available at the time.
Do you feel deceived? Probably.
Do you decide never to eat at my folk's house again? Your call. But you'll miss some good eats. ;)
But you would never have been forced to pay more. D* had a set of tiers of packages. The top tier had everything. If you didn't want everything, you could pick a lower tier and pay less.
Blah blah, get over your Premier rant Steve. Premier never had everything and you were never promised it would. No matter how many times you say it or how strongly you wish it were, it just wasn't what you think.
Nice and analogical, thanks for that Drew2k!
NYSmoker
12-26-07, 10:56 AM
There's quite a difference from being lied to and feeling deceived.
Let's say it's 4 PM and I invite you to a family dinner today at my folk's house and tell you my mother said dinner was for 6 PM. When you show up at 6 PM, you find that dinner is over. Turns out my mother put dinner on at 5, not 6, because she found out half of the guests had tickets to the local production of Nutcracker and had to leave early.
Were you lied to? No. You were given the best information available at the time.
Do you feel deceived? Probably.
Do you decide never to eat at my folk's house again? Your call. But you'll miss some good eats. ;)
Well it's like I said we disagree on what is a lie.
We might also disagree on what is is.
Sharkie_Fan
12-26-07, 11:06 AM
There's quite a difference from being lied to and feeling deceived.
Let's say it's 4 PM and I invite you to a family dinner today at my folk's house and tell you my mother said dinner was for 6 PM. When you show up at 6 PM, you find that dinner is over. Turns out my mother put dinner on at 5, not 6, because she found out half of the guests had tickets to the local production of Nutcracker and had to leave early.
Were you lied to? No. You were given the best information available at the time.
Do you feel deceived? Probably.
Do you decide never to eat at my folk's house again? Your call. But you'll miss some good eats. ;)
IF one assumes that there either (a) wasn't a price increased planned or (b) Chase Carey didn't know about one if it was planned, then your scenario would apply, and would be a pretty good analysis of the situation.
IF, on the other hand, you KNEW your mom was putting dinner on at 5 and failed to tell me, then, I think you lied to me.
If your mom knew dinner would be at 5, but you didn't know when you invited me, then it's another gray area - probably not a lie, but definately a breakdown in communication which is going to leave me pretty ticked off.
paulman182
12-26-07, 11:33 AM
Thanks for the link, but I think you're confusing cost with price here. He said that in response to what their programming costs would be, not what their programming prices would be. It was in response to this:
"Thanks. Good afternoon. So my first question is Chase, as you roll out HD more broadly in the second half, should we expect an acceleration in your programming cost growth as that happens?
The second question I guess is for Mike; I believe your ’07 CapEx guidance is $2 billion. I think you are running about 15% higher than that on an annualized basis through the first half. Could you just update us on what you think that -- if that’s still an okay number for the year?
And then at DIRECTV Latin America, there seems to have been a little bit of a spike in CapEx in the quarter. Was it just a one-time thing or if you could just give us some clarity there. Thanks"
Cost increases and price increase don't always go together in a linear way.
Thanks for the link, I'll read the entire call after the holidays, but I do think you're misinterpreting the part you're quoting.
Xaa, thanks for pointing this out. Carey was saying there would not be an increased cost to DirecTV for the new HD channels. He said nothing about any possible increase in fees from subscribers.
All these months and AFAIK, no one has correctly interpreted this statement until now. Amazing. Carey was simply telling the shareholders that the new channels will not cost the company more money.
So no matter what issues we have with the fee, this quote is totally immaterial.
Ya know Paulman, the one from which I was addressing was from August 07 and that was clearly speaking about DirecTv's cost to provied. The one where I *believe* he said something along the lines of "We don't plan...." was from this spring IIRC.
Steve Rhodes
12-26-07, 12:28 PM
Blah blah, get over your Premier rant Steve. Premier never had everything and you were never promised it would. No matter how many times you say it or how strongly you wish it were, it just wasn't what you think.
Yes it did and yes I was.
Ext 721
12-26-07, 01:03 PM
bah. want an analogy? Restaurant you've been going to forever has a dinner meal combo: burger, beans, and fries...$10.
They change the combo to be burger, beans, fries, a drink, dessert and a side salad $10.
Then one day you see that the fries and beans will be $5 extra, but the burger, drink,dessert and side salad are still $10.
Yes it did and yes I was.
Never had any adult channels in it, never included HD. What color is the sky in your world? I get that you liked what it was and what you believed it to be. You were and are simply wrong that it ever included everything or that that was it's spirit and even if you weren't wrong, your incessant crying about it is pretty lame at this point.
Steve Rhodes
12-26-07, 01:22 PM
Never had any adult channels in it, never included HD. What color is the sky in your world? I get that you liked what it was and what you believed it to be. You were and are simply wrong that it ever included everything or that that was it's spirit and even if you weren't wrong, your incessant crying about it is pretty lame at this point.
It included everything except locals, adult, sports and other special cases as I have said several times. It was marketed, correctly, as the package for people who wanted everything without ever having to call again. Why is this such a hard concept for some people to understand?
STEVED21
12-26-07, 01:36 PM
It included everything except locals, adult, sports and other special cases as I have said several times. It was marketed, correctly, as the package for people who wanted everything without ever having to call again. Why is this such a hard concept for some people to understand?
Once you say except, it doesn't include everything.
I've been with DirecTV since 1998 and I never saw it marketed as "the package for people who wanted everything without ever having to call again"
If you never wanted to call again, how did you get the new HD receiver? Did it mystically show up already programmed to go?
get over it. Things change. Accept it or don't. Just stop ranting.
It included everything except locals, adult, sports and other special cases as I have said several times. It was marketed, correctly, as the package for people who wanted everything without ever having to call again. Why is this such a hard concept for some people to understand?
The concept isn't hard too understand, but it's just not reality. It was marketed as their highest level package, not the package for people that wanted everything without ever having to call again.
I agreed with you last week that the package of everything so I don't have to call again is not a bad idea. It just never existed and Premier was not it.
It also did not include HD.
Can't you just accept that what you had was coincidental with what you wanted and believed Premier to be when it in fact was not? Even if you can't, creating multiple threads to continue to belabor the idea accomplishes nothing. I believe we all understand the package you wish you had.
ddrumman2004
12-26-07, 03:01 PM
It's a no-brainer for me on this. Before DirecTV pulled those 5 channels from the HD lineup, there were still times that there was nothing on television to watch. Even with all that was available.
So I will save that 4.99 and buy an extra gallon or so of gasoline so I can ride my motorcycle.
msmith198025
12-26-07, 03:18 PM
1. What if your barber kept his price at $10 for almost all of your hair, but charged you an extra $5 for cutting just 4 strands of your hair on the top your head? Maybe you'd pay. Maybe you would not. But you probably would not think he was a very smart businessman. (Or maybe you'd think he was brilliant if most of customers paid the extra $5 anyway.)
2. And what if you'd already agreed to pay him whatever he asked to cut all of your hair from now on, but one day he made you go to a website, which frequently didn't work right or at all for some customers, in order to agree to pay him $5 more to cut all of your hair. Now you'd really think he was nuts.
Why do people keep using analogies to try to make apoint on this? This isnt a barber shop, or an auto dealership, or a fast food place people, It is not the same thing!
redchicken
12-28-07, 05:07 PM
I am sure there are plenty of things that they could do....
But as of right now... there really hasn't been anything they have done, that I don't have a big issue with.
I understand why the $4.99 price is there.
I understand why we will probably see a price increase in March.
I understand how the HD Access works.
So just because I have an undestanding of the why's and how's... maybe I look at it less emotionally and knee jerk style as others.
Being ominpotent is great I am sure but that must mean that you think when we all paid 9.99 for virtually nothing we had a fair price. I on the other hand
think that 9.99 for what we now receive in addition to what we pay is a fair price. The additional 60 bucks a year and what it portends is not. These guys simply need to understand it is programming at the best price not at ANY price Earl. This is billed as a forum perhaps its really a fan club or should I say a shill for Direct
Carl Spock
12-28-07, 05:15 PM
Pretty interesting first three posts, redchicken. Why do I think I might know you by another name?
In the long run guys, I think: is $15.00 a fair price for the new (up-converted or HD) channels ? I have to say yes, and the way it was done is a done deal. t will make me a little more wary of changes in future, but it's wrong to minimize the value of the new horizon. :)
For "fair" read "good value"
In the long run guys, I think: is $15.00 a fair price for the new (up-converted or HD) channels ? I have to say yes, and the way it was done is a done deal. t will make me a little more wary of changes in future, but it's wrong to minimize the value of the new horizon. :)
I think in the long run charging extra for HD simulcasts of programming we're already paying for with our base package is wrong. It won't be long before the HD Access Fee is going to be as ridiculous as the "touch tone" service fee that the phone companies charged for years and years after the only place you were getting a true dial phone was eBay or a garage sale.
That also means that charging extra for "new" channels would make sense.
It'll shake out a bit in the coming years...as long as the market stays competitive.
Carl Spock
12-28-07, 07:03 PM
I have another question.
I wonder how many of the folks who are upset over the new package are also Premiere subscribers?
With Premiere, I get dozens of channels that I'll never watch - all the channels between 400 & 500, the kids channels, the shopping channels, the religious channels and many SD movie channels. If I was to count them, I probably watch only a quarter of the channels I get as a Premiere subscriber. Damn it, I want my Premiere package to cost me $25! That is what would be fair.
On the other hand, DirecTV will charge me $4.99 for five HD channels, four of them I do watch. Now that doesn't seem like a bad deal to me.
What it gets down to is how much is the total bill I get from DirecTV and is it worth it? If it is, then I don't care if they charge me $98 for flashing blue lights and $2 for programming. I feel like I'm getting a good value.
All of this just goes to point out the argument of equity is a fallacious one. DirecTV's packages have never been fair. They are always loaded with channels I could care less about. On those terms alone, for me the new HD package is very equitable. But that's not the way DirecTV works. With their programming, you take the good with the bad.
Plus my fair is certainly someone else's unfair. What's the fairness in that?
My current bill is around $128. If I think that is a good value, I will keep all of my channels and hardware. If I don't feel it is a good value, I will make cuts. Fairness has nothing to do with it.
Value should be what we are talking about here, not fairness and to whether the new package is right. If you are getting a good value from DirecTV, you'll be happy with your programming choices. If not, you should be making a change.
Being ominpotent is great I am sure but that must mean that you think when we all paid 9.99 for virtually nothing we had a fair price. I on the other hand
think that 9.99 for what we now receive in addition to what we pay is a fair price. The additional 60 bucks a year and what it portends is not. These guys simply need to understand it is programming at the best price not at ANY price Earl. This is billed as a forum perhaps its really a fan club or should I say a shill for Direct
Nobody forced you to subscribe and pay the 10 bucks previously if it wasn't what you wanted. You chose it and now you're blaming the seller?
shenefie
12-28-07, 09:01 PM
the only real gripe i have with this new package is why isnt it included with premier? that has been marketed for a long time as 'every channel' or something to that effect for a long time, and now they just take those channels away? dont worry, in my opnion, the channels they took away i didnt watch that much anyway. and the smithsonian channel is like groundhog day with all the repeats! same with 76 discovery hd theater. but hey, let the markets shake themselves out....
the only real gripe i have with this new package is why isnt it included with premier? that has been marketed for a long time as 'every channel' or something to that effect for a long time, and now they just take those channels away? dont worry, in my opnion, the channels they took away i didnt watch that much anyway. and the smithsonian channel is like groundhog day with all the repeats! same with 76 discovery hd theater. but hey, let the markets shake themselves out....
+1
the only real gripe i have with this new package is why isnt it included with premier?Because Premier does not include HD channels.
Tom Robertson
12-29-07, 04:37 PM
Premier never included the international channels, btw. Nor does it include the babyfirst channel, a $5/month separate for a single channel. :)
There was a limited package that did include "all" the channels, Titanium. But it still didn't include channels that were not allowed in your locale by law. And sold out very quickly after being offered. oh, and only cost $7,500/year. :D
Happy Holidays!
Tom
msmith198025
12-29-07, 04:38 PM
Because Premier does not include HD channels.
Nor has it really been marketed to include EVERY channel. It is simply the top programming package(besides Titanium, which no one can get)
redchicken
12-29-07, 04:40 PM
Nobody forced you to subscribe and pay the 10 bucks previously if it wasn't what you wanted. You chose it and now you're blaming the seller?
I am actually done with this but you completely misunderstood what I wrote. I said the 9,99 was a fair price for what we have now. I invested with Direct so to
speak based on their promises of what th HD package would be. I was also told on numerous occasions that the 4.99 would not apply to exisiting HD customers with the premier package. So for those of you who like to pay and pay and pay enjoy because you will.
Re-reading maybe I did misunderstand what you were saying. Thanks for the clarification. That one's on me.
I'm not paying it, I don't give a crap about the channels. Those that pay, it's up to them. I only choose what's right for me.
turbo_oasis
12-29-07, 07:07 PM
It is really lame to have to pay extra for the networks, and I have not decided to keep them. Why even offer the package I have (Premier, HD Access, DVR, etc.) and the hit everyone with a lame extra 5 dollar charge. Are hey going to add more networks to that HD Xtra pack? But this is kinda like what United Airlines did when USAirways/America West brought all of the America West FlightFund members (that was me) into the Star Alliance. United took away the free upgrades to Economy Plus for all of us Star Alliance elite members and reserved the free upgrades to the UA Premiers.
esteeze
01-01-08, 09:56 PM
As a non D* subscriber I am absolutely perplexed at this. The additional content is either worth it to you so or not, so either pay or don’t. With cable we have an HD Tier for $4.95 which includes HD Net, HD Net Movies and Universal HD. All of the other HD channels, and it looks like all future HD channels will be included with a base subscription to digital cable at no additional charge all you need is an HD set top terminal, which costs the same as an SD terminal.
If you want the extra channels with D* subscribe to the HD Extra package, if you don’t well then don’t subscribe. It’s not a very hard concept. Nowadays I very rarely defend either satellite provider, but I see nothing wrong with what D* is doing and if they were my service provider I’d subscribe to the HD Extra package.
Good point.
What irks me (and many others) is that the channels were included in the "base" HD fee all along, and now they're not. I personally didn't know about the change until I turned on the TV on the morning of 12/23, and the channels were gone. I don't think that I was ever clearly made aware of the change beforehand; it's possible I got a mailer about it and just didn't read it.
After reading up on these forums after the fact, I understand the reasoning for the changes, and they make sense; the whole way it developed has been hard to swallow.
I'm planning to upgrade the HD equipment soon, so maybe I'll channel my frustration about the Extra Pack into getting a better deal on the equipment upgrade or other programming discounts.
Value should be what we are talking about here, not fairness and to whether the new package is right. If you are getting a good value from DirecTV, you'll be happy with your programming choices. If not, you should be making a change.
Bingo. My thoughts exactly.
People may be upset about a couple of channels moving to another tier, but at the end of the day, it comes down to the value. After all the rants, the final issue is not how programming has changed, it's what it IS.
Carl Spock
01-02-08, 11:37 AM
^ Thank you!
I spent a lot of time on that post (http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=1359251#post1359251) and frankly, I thought I nailed the argument. When nobody responded, I went, oh well, it's the Internet. Maybe if I had made a dick joke instead. :rolleyes:
^ Thank you!
I spent a lot of time on that post (http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=1359251#post1359251) and frankly, I thought I nailed the argument. When nobody responded, I went, oh well, it's the Internet. Maybe if I had made a dick joke instead. :rolleyes:
I'm with you completely. People can complain about how things have changed, but at the end of the argument, when you pay that monthly bill, the MAIN thing is who provides the best all-around package of what you want for the lowest price.
I posted something similar in another thread about how people seem to be so upset about paying $5 that they're threatening to pay more every month with another provider for fewer channels just to make a point.
Paul Secic
01-03-08, 11:05 AM
I'm with you completely. People can complain about how things have changed, but at the end of the argument, when you pay that monthly bill, the MAIN thing is who provides the best all-around package of what you want for the lowest price.
I posted something similar in another thread about how people seem to be so upset about paying $5 that they're threatening to pay more every month with another provider for fewer channels just to make a point.
Dish is dropping DishHD price to $10 next month.
Ah....that'll make things interesting. Does the DishHD $10 package include the same number of channels?
Carl Spock
01-03-08, 11:13 AM
Dish is dropping DishHD price to $10 next month.
Which just goes to prove the point. Dish is trying to make themselves a better value in order to keep the customers they have and to attract more.
I'm not naive enough to say that DirecTV is the god of all TV delivery systems. They serve me well for now. They also have for years. If, with new ownership, DirecTV takes steps that no longer make my overall monthly expense for the programming and hardware I receive from them a good value, I will look to switch providers. So far, we're not even close to that point for me. Others would say differently. Fine. Different people are different. Now there's profundity on the Internet! :D
Which just goes to prove the point. Dish is trying to make themselves a better value in order to keep the customers they have and to attract more.
I'm not naive enough to say that DirecTV is the god of all TV delivery systems. They serve me well for now. They also have for years. If, with new ownership, DirecTV takes steps that no longer make my overall monthly expense for the programming and hardware I receive from them a good value, I will look to switch providers. So far, we're not even close to that point for me. Others would say differently. Fine. Different people are different. Now there's profundity on the Internet! :D
+1
Dish is dropping DishHD price to $10 next month.I could swear I saw a recent post somewhere here that DISH was allso creating a new tier and moving programming, resulting in a $30 fee to see all of the HD channels. Does this sound familiar to anyone, or was I imagining it?
EDITED TO ADD: Here's where I found it ... with an update that confuses me but makes me thin that DISH is not actually lowering the price if you want to see all HD ...
Have you checked the thread in the E* forum yet though?!! If you thought the bitching was bad when D* started the Extra Pack, apparently E* is going to have a $10 tier made up of upconverted/simulcast HD Channels and a separate $20 tier made up mostly of VOOM and maybe a few others. Thats $30 for everything in HD.
I don't think that's right...the $20 pack includes all the simulcast HD from the $10 tier plus VOOM plus 5 others (channel details not known yet). For those who want everything, the cost is $20, the same as it is today.
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