DirecTV HD Audio?

[BuffaloDenny]

I've been pondering potentially updrading my AV receiver to one of those 7.1 units that decodes all these new HD audio codecs. I know I can take advantage of the newer audio formats with my BluRay and HD DVD players. The question is, will DirecTV ever provide any programs in audio formats other than DD 5.1?

If not, I'm not sure it's worth it (to me) to upgrade from a perfectly fine receiver, given that probably 90% of my viewing time goes to DirecTV and their DD 5.1 audio. Now, on the other hand, if they were to ever make HD audio available.....

[jodyguercio]

If you can afford it and want new gear to play with go for it....Ive found that it never hurts to future proof something. But to answer your question I havent seen or heard if Directv will offer the newer audio formats

[Stuart Sweet]

Never say never, but as the broadcast spec is, I believe, up to 5.1, I can't imagine DIRECTV surpassing that. Still, 7.1 receivers are not usually much more expensive, so "it couldn't hurt"

[gazzie4]

I ran into that dilemna myself, but broke down and got myself a pioneer elite 7.1 receiver. Let me tell you, even on the 5.1 stuff it is awesome. It takes the 5.1 to 7.1 through audio processing and it sounds great.

[dtrell]

they can already broadcast the current 7.1 format for dolby digital, as it uses a 5.1 format and just matrixes the back channel into the two surround back channels. your receiver can then matrix decode the back channel out. although, this is really 6.1, it still uses both back speakers for a fake 7.1...(also called dolby digital EX)

[spartanstew]

I've been pondering potentially updrading my AV receiver to one of those 7.1 units that decodes all these new HD audio codecs.

Well, that might be 2 different things. Receivers have been around for 4 or 5 years that have ProLogic IIx, which can matrix almost any signal into 7.1. Sounds fantastic.

So, are you just interested in 7.1 or are you interested in a receiver that can decode the newest formats (True HD, DTS-HD HR, DTS-HD MA)?

I know I can take advantage of the newer audio formats with my BluRay and HD DVD players.

That's not necessarily true. They've yet to make a BluRay player that can decode all of the new formats. Only 3 currently exist ( Panny BD30, Pio 95HD and Sammy 1400 ) that can even stream the new formats (with the right receiver). BD Players that can decode them all won't be coming out until later this year.

If you do get a BD player that can decode the formats, you don't need a receiver that can do it. So, if you plan on getting one of the new BD players you might might not even need a new receiver (depending on the receiver you currently have). Additionally, if you have the Sammy 1400, the only format it can't decode is DTS-HD MA, so if you're OK living without that, you might not need a new receiver either.

The question is, will DirecTV ever provide any programs in audio formats other than DD 5.1?


I doubt it. At least not for a long time.

[jodyguercio]

^ Trust him he knows what he's talking about. Look at his HT setup and just shake your head and go yes please I'll have another.

[BuffaloDenny]

Well, that might be 2 different things. Receivers have been around for 4 or 5 years that have ProLogic IIx, which can matrix almost any signal into 7.1. Sounds fantastic.

So, are you just interested in 7.1 or are you interested in a receiver that can decode the newest formats (True HD, DTS-HD HR, DTS-HD MA)?



I was looking for the latter. I probably won't even add 2 more satellite speakers (at least not right away). I thought that if I get one of these receivers, then as long as it's on the disc (HD DVD or Blu) then the receiver would be able to decode? Is that part at least true? I figured DirecTv wouldn't be making these newer formats available, but just wanted to make sure. It still might be worth it from what little I've read so far.

[coacho]

I have a 7.1 Pioneer but only used 5 speakers until recently. On my unit, I had to add an amplifier and 2 more speakers to get 7.1. I set the Pioneer to auto and it now indiciates when I get Stereo, 5.1 and when I get 7.1.

I am not sure I really understand the different HD sounds nor am I exactly sure what 7.1 I am getting, but I get 7.1 on many shows even from D* (at least the receiver says it is 7.1). I also notice I get 7.1 from my blu-ray player. I do notice quite a difference in the sound which was surprising to me!

[spartanstew]

I was looking for the latter. I probably won't even add 2 more satellite speakers (at least not right away). I thought that if I get one of these receivers, then as long as it's on the disc (HD DVD or Blu) then the receiver would be able to decode? Is that part at least true? I figured DirecTv wouldn't be making these newer formats available, but just wanted to make sure. It still might be worth it from what little I've read so far.


It's partially true. In order for you to receive it, it has to meet these criteria:

1. It's on the disc
2. Your DVD player or receiver can decode it.
3. If your receiver is doing the decoding, the DVD player has to at least allow for pass through of the audio.


So, you could have a disc with one of the new audio formats (DTA-HD MA, for example) and a receiver that can decode it (Onkyo 805, for example), but if your DVD player doesn't pass through/stream that Audio (Samsung 1200, for example), then you won't have it.


Complicated, eh?


Lets try from a different angle. What Blu Ray player do you have? What receiver do you currently have? If you were to buy a new receiver, what would your budget be?

[dtrell]

I have a 7.1 Pioneer but only used 5 speakers until recently. On my unit, I had to add an amplifier and 2 more speakers to get 7.1. I set the Pioneer to auto and it now indiciates when I get Stereo, 5.1 and when I get 7.1.

I am not sure I really understand the different HD sounds nor am I exactly sure what 7.1 I am getting, but I get 7.1 on many shows even from D* (at least the receiver says it is 7.1). I also notice I get 7.1 from my blu-ray player. I do notice quite a difference in the sound which was surprising to me!

again as i posted above, DTV can currently send Dolby Digital EX, which is 7.1 (really 6.1) because the back channels are matrixed into the side surround channels, so the stream resembles a DD 5.1 stream but there is a flag in the data stream that tells your receiver when the back channel is present, and obviously your pioneer receiver can pick that up and automatically switch to 7.1. I just watched the DVD of War (with Jason Statham...lousy movie...) but anyway, it had the back channel flag. I would imagine that if HBO were to show this movie, that it would also be in the Dolby Digital stream.

[BuffaloDenny]

It's partially true. In order for you to receive it, it has to meet these criteria:

1. It's on the disc
2. Your DVD player or receiver can decode it.
3. If your receiver is doing the decoding, the DVD player has to at least allow for pass through of the audio.


So, you could have a disc with one of the new audio formats (DTA-HD MA, for example) and a receiver that can decode it (Onkyo 805, for example), but if your DVD player doesn't pass through/stream that Audio (Samsung 1200, for example), then you won't have it.


Complicated, eh?


Lets try from a different angle. What Blu Ray player do you have? What receiver do you currently have? If you were to buy a new receiver, what would your budget be?

I followed what you were saying (I think):) I have the PS3 and the gen1 HD DVD player, with an old Onkyo that only does DD5.1 and DTS. All works well. I was initially thinking budget wise of the Onkyo 705, but with these tax rebates I wanna do my part and put it right back into the economy:lol: Therefore, I may be willing to splurge on a really nice receiver that does all these HD audio codecs, and has say 3 HDMI inputs. I haven't done the research yet, but was thinking along the lines of Denon or Pioneer in the $1,500 range. Will either or both of my DVD players pass through the audio? Seems I would have the first 2 points covered. I am not willing at this point to swap out both AV receiver AND DVD players.

[flipptyfloppity]

It's partially true. In order for you to receive it, it has to meet these criteria:

1. It's on the disc
2. Your DVD player or receiver can decode it.
3. If your receiver is doing the decoding, the DVD player has to at least allow for pass through of the audio.


You missed one. The cable system connecting the disc player to the amp must also support it. In that case of ANY 7.1 format (DTS-ES and DD-EX are only 6.1) that means you need to be using HDMI for the audio.

I don't think D* will use these new formats since they all send a a lot more data. In extreme cases, on a BluRay movie, there can be as much AUDIO data alone as a DVD movie has. Bandwidth costs money, and D* isn't going to waste it on 7.1.

I plan to get a 7.1 receiver and HDMI connection to my PS3 soon, but I'll still only have 5.1 speakers hooked up.

[BuffaloDenny]

I plan to get a 7.1 receiver and HDMI connection to my PS3 soon, but I'll still only have 5.1 speakers hooked up.

That's what I was thinking - just waiting for confirmation on that last dependency - whether or not the PS3 will allow the HD audio to pass through to the receiver.

Also, I currently use a HDMI switcher to connect my 3 HDMI components to my one HDMI input on my TV for video. I use optical cable for my audio to the receiver. I am looking for a receiver with 3 HDMI inputs so I can run one HDMI cable from said components to the receiver, then one HDMI from AV receiver to the TV to get both audio and video over HDMI. I have heard some of the Onkyo's are having some issues doing this.

[MONSTERMAN]

I've been pondering potentially updrading my AV receiver to one of those 7.1 units that decodes all these new HD audio codecs. I know I can take advantage of the newer audio formats with my BluRay and HD DVD players. The question is, will DirecTV ever provide any programs in audio formats other than DD 5.1?

If not, I'm not sure it's worth it (to me) to upgrade from a perfectly fine receiver, given that probably 90% of my viewing time goes to DirecTV and their DD 5.1 audio. Now, on the other hand, if they were to ever make HD audio available.....

Not worth it. Don't try to play catchup with electronics every year. The 7.1 surround audio format is just another selling gimmick. My flagship SONY has 5.1 surround with a PHANTOM rear center speaker (6.1) which works better than any 7.1 audio format. I do wish they would add 5.1 DTS though, favorite format.

Most DVD's don't even support 7.1 audio format, yet let alone Blu-ray and HD-DVD You'd be paying more not just for the receiver but for 2 more speakers you'd have to find room for on the sides of your room. Even now at CES they are showing 8.1 audio formats. There will be no limit to these audio formats in the years to come (in-floor and in-ceiling) and how many speakers you'll have to add.

:nono:

[spartanstew]

I followed what you were saying (I think):) I have the PS3 and the gen1 HD DVD player, with an old Onkyo that only does DD5.1 and DTS. All works well. I was initially thinking budget wise of the Onkyo 705, but with these tax rebates I wanna do my part and put it right back into the economy:lol: Therefore, I may be willing to splurge on a really nice receiver that does all these HD audio codecs, and has say 3 HDMI inputs. I haven't done the research yet, but was thinking along the lines of Denon or Pioneer in the $1,500 range. Will either or both of my DVD players pass through the audio? Seems I would have the first 2 points covered. I am not willing at this point to swap out both AV receiver AND DVD players.

How many inputs does the 705 have? I'm shooting for the 805 myself.

I don't think the PS3 can pass-through all of the BD codecs, but rumor is that there might be a firmware update for it.
As for the HD player, it depends upon which one you have (and I'm not that familiar with them). Let me know your player and I'll see what I can find out for ya.

[Slardybardfast]

Folks, :mad:
I have just begun to use the PPV option for my HR20-700. I use the online PPV ordering service. In the last month, I have downloaded 2 HD PPV movies ( Oceans 13 and The Bourne Ultimatum) and they were in Dolby Digital 2.0. This is despite the opening banners from Directv saying that the movie was in SS.

Anyone else notice this?:mad:

I called both times, got a refund (as I did not choose to watch these action movies in 2.0). During this same period I recorded Rescue Dawn, Harry Potter, Die Hard Uncut, Rat...... All had 5.1 audio. I also have recorded numerous HD programs in 5.1. I have never had a problem with HBO, for example.

Slardy

[dtrell]

DD 2.0 can still be surround sound. its just DD Prologic II surround instead of discrete 5.1 ACS DD. It may be two channels, but it can still be encoded with DD Prologic surround.

[Papa J]

How many inputs does the 705 have? I'm shooting for the 805 myself.

I don't think the PS3 can pass-through all of the BD codecs, but rumor is that there might be a firmware update for it.
As for the HD player, it depends upon which one you have (and I'm not that familiar with them). Let me know your player and I'll see what I can find out for ya.

The Onkyo 705 has 3 HDMI inputs. I have one and the Panasonic BD30. I have not had any problems with the system. It sounds great. Since you are knowledgable on audio equipment, I was wondering if there is any quality difference if the fiber optic connection is used. I use the HDMI now for both audio and video but I can select to use the fiber optic for the audio if that would be an improvement. Honestly, I doubt I could hear the difference but wanted to ask. I am assuming the fiber optic could carry the new HD sound formats??????? Thanks in advance for your help.

[spartanstew]

I don't think the PS3 can pass-through all of the BD codecs, but rumor is that there might be a firmware update for it.


Just to update, the PS3 currently will not bitstream (pass-through) DTS-HD HR or DTS-HD MA. The PS3 will handle DD+ and TrueHD, but that's it.

The Onkyo 705 has 3 HDMI inputs. I have one and the Panasonic BD30. I have not had any problems with the system. It sounds great. Since you are knowledgable on audio equipment, I was wondering if there is any quality difference if the fiber optic connection is used. I use the HDMI now for both audio and video but I can select to use the fiber optic for the audio if that would be an improvement. Honestly, I doubt I could hear the difference but wanted to ask. I am assuming the fiber optic could carry the new HD sound formats??????? Thanks in advance for your help.

That's a good combo. The BD30 can stream all the formats right to the 705 which can then decode them.

Optical cannot carry all of the HD sound formats, so you want to leave things as they are with HDMI doing all the work

[Slardybardfast]

DD 2.0 can still be surround sound. its just DD Prologic II surround instead of discrete 5.1 ACS DD. It may be two channels, but it can still be encoded with DD Prologic surround.

All of todays top movies are encoded with DD 5.1 or better (DTS). To deliver any less to the customer is short-changing them.

Slardy

[Papa J]

Just to update, the PS3 currently will not bitstream (pass-through) DTS-HD HR or DTS-HD MA. The PS3 will handle DD+ and TrueHD, but that's it.



That's a good combo. The BD30 can stream all the formats right to the 705 which can then decode them.

Optical cannot carry all of the HD sound formats, so you want to leave things as they are with HDMI doing all the work

Thanks for the info. I will leave it as is. :)

[BuffaloDenny]

Just to update, the PS3 currently will not bitstream (pass-through) DTS-HD HR or DTS-HD MA. The PS3 will handle DD+ and TrueHD, but that's it.



That's a good combo. The BD30 can stream all the formats right to the 705 which can then decode them.

Optical cannot carry all of the HD sound formats, so you want to leave things as they are with HDMI doing all the work

Thanks for the update! I'll have to look into whether a firmware update will allow that (DTS-HD HR & MA) down the road. Maybe I'll just stick with the Onkyo 705, which has 3 HDMI inputs. Not sure if spending twice as much will really buy any more than the 705 based on how I'll be using it.

P.S. Look in my sig for the specific DVD player models. Think the 1st gen Tosh will pass through?

[gully_foyle]

Just to update, the PS3 currently will not bitstream (pass-through) DTS-HD HR or DTS-HD MA. The PS3 will handle DD+ and TrueHD, but that's it.That's kind of funny since DTS-HD MA is more common on blu-ray discs than Dolby TrueHD.

[gully_foyle]

The Onkyo 705 has 3 HDMI inputs. I have one and the Panasonic BD30. I have not had any problems with the system. It sounds great. Since you are knowledgable on audio equipment, I was wondering if there is any quality difference if the fiber optic connection is used. I use the HDMI now for both audio and video but I can select to use the fiber optic for the audio if that would be an improvement. Honestly, I doubt I could hear the difference but wanted to ask. I am assuming the fiber optic could carry the new HD sound formats??????? Thanks in advance for your help.The Onkyos have an annoying issue with the HR20. THere seems to be an audio mute after pause when using Dolby Digital to an Onkyo receiver. See this DBSTalk thread. (http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=110381)