Cropped Networks

[ICBM99]

All right, I've been searching for over an hour, and haven't found the same situation, and I'm sure its something simple but its driving me nuts.

I recently upgraded to HDTV (Samsung HLT 6187s), and a Dish ViP722. I've got the 722 set to 16:9 and 1080i over HDMI, I've got the Sammy set to just scan, of course the HD channels look great, but when we watch the network shows (Midland, TX) I've noticed that the images are cropped.

I'm pretty sure most of the shows I watch are "widescreen" but they show up as 4:3, with the edges cut off. Like on NBC you can only see about 1/4 of the NBC Logo on the left side, then its the pillar boxes, then the edge of the screen. I've gone through most of the settings I can find on both the DVR and the TV, but nothing seems to fix it.

I wonder if it has something to do with the feeds from Midland. I'm too far away to pick them up OTA, so Dish is my only option.

I'm sure I never noticed it on my old tv, because it was a SD set.

If anybody has some suggestions I'd appreciate it.

TIA

[theoak]

If you hit the "*" button on the bottom left of the remote, it will toggle through a variety of view options including normal, stretch, zoom, bars, etc.

It could be that you may have accidentally hit the button.

[ICBM99]

I'll check it out thanks. When I was at home during lunch, when I turned on the TV, Days of Our Lives was on NBC, and the Logo was fully visible (still at 4:3). It makes me wonder even more if it has something to do with the Feeds from the Stations, and that they are cropping widescreen Primetime shows to 4:3

[ICBM99]

Well I tried the * button, and all it did was stretch and zoom the all ready cropped picture. Somethings fishy. I should have some more time tonight, and I'll do some more tests.

[Stewart Vernon]

Some TVs also have their own stretch/zoom settings. Try checking out your TV's remote (and manual if necessary) to see if someone has accidentally set your TV to zoom.

[Taco Lover]

Yup, check your TV settings. On my Sony, I have the TV set as "Full", so whatever the receiver sends to the TV will fill the screen appropriately.

[icmoney]

Hello ICBM99 another West Tx viewer here. If you are just receiving the Midland area locals from Sat., then you are getting the local analog transmission that is received by Dish and re-transmitted to you via Sat. These are all 4:3 aspect ratio signals. I have a similar setup as yours. I have a Sammy 42" DLP 720p HDTV. My vip622 is set for 720p output and 16:9 screen size. Screen mode is set to normal(via the "*" button).

My Sammy HDTV PSize is set at 16:9. All the locals received via Sat display on my Sammy with Black bars on the side and the picture in normal 4:3 aspect ratio with all info viewable on screen.

I agree with HDMe, it sounds like your TV picture size is not set up to match your vip722.

Too bad you can't get the locals via antenna, Chan 9(NBC), 7(CBS) and 24(Fox) are broadcasting High Def on their Digital channels.

[ICBM99]

Yeah, I wish I could pick them up, but Alpine is just too far away. Well I don't know that for a fact, but I'm pretty sure :D. Like I said I'm going to try some more tonight. I'm pretty sure I ran through the Sammy's settings, but I'll try again tonight, I think I have the Sammy set to Just Scan, which means (I think) that it displays what ever the signal being sent is.

Good to know I've got a neighbor around here. :)

[Paul Secic]

Some TVs also have their own stretch/zoom settings. Try checking out your TV's remote (and manual if necessary) to see if someone has accidentally set your TV to zoom.

I get those thick bars on the sides on http://www.cbs5.com. It's the station that's doing that, because channels 2,7.9,11 look great. KRON4 who is for sale by Young Broadcasting (thank God) doesn't do HD. STRETCH-O-RAMA!

[icmoney]

Yeah, I wish I could pick them up, but Alpine is just too far away. Well I don't know that for a fact, but I'm pretty sure :D. Like I said I'm going to try some more tonight. I'm pretty sure I ran through the Sammy's settings, but I'll try again tonight, I think I have the Sammy set to Just Scan, which means (I think) that it displays what ever the signal being sent is.

Good to know I've got a neighbor around here. :)

My Sammy does not have the Just Scan option. You might try taking it off Just Scan and set the PSize to a permanent 16:9.

[jkane]

There have been a couple threads around on this topic. I have done some testing, and I think Dish is doing something to it's feed, or some stations are doing something to tehm selves. The one I tested throughly was History channel. It is overscanning on each edge at least. I am not sure about top and bottom. I went through all the combinations of TV and 6722 size settings, and it still does it. Not all the time either. Just some shows!

I have over that past couple of months noticed some other channels that are over scanned some times. It is not the TV nor the settings on the 722. It's the feed itself, or the 722 has a bug that kicks in only often enough to be frustrating. :(

[patmurphey]

When and SD program is broadcast on an HD channel, it will be 4:3 with black bars. You can use the zoom controls to fill the screen to your taste or just accept it. If you do zoom an HD channel remember to set the zoom control back to normal for HD broadcasts. The zoom settings on a 722 are remembered separately between the SD and HD channels. If you are receiving HD programming correctly on the non network HD channels as you stated in your original post, your settings are correct - do all of your zooming with the 722 controls to keep from mixing things up. Dish is NOT fooling with the aspect of broadcasts - they are passing on to what they receive.

Some of the cable HD (i.e. History and Science) channels are doing some strange things with stretch and zoom - don't let them confuse you.

[ICBM99]

I don't want to zoom at all, I just want to see the whole picture. And as of now the networks I'm refering to are SD.I didn't end up watching much prime time network shows but, I know for sure that it is happening on the NBC channel. I think what I'm going to do is compare Friday Night Lights Online to what was saved on the 722. That way I can tell if something was cropped off, or if some nimrod put the NBC logo in the wrong spot.

So if a TV show is filmed in a widescreen format, what happens when that show is broadcast on SD? Is it squeezed into a 4:3, or is it Cropped? Or does it depend?

I've tried every different combination of zoom and stretch, and aspect ratio that I can find, but nothing seems to work correctly.

I believe "Just Scan" is only an option with HDMI and a 1080 source.

I checked the 722 and it is "normal" operation via the "*" button.

Its not really that big of a deal, but it just bugs me. I guess I can live with it if I have to. I really don't mind black bars, I just want the whole show.

With my current settings, every thing else is fine, HD SD, DVD, etc. Its just when I prime time show that appears to be filmed in Wide screen that I notice the cropping. Heck even sometimes when a commercial comes on it is in widescreen, but I end up with bars all around the picture (sides and top & bottom).

Like I said I'm going to mess around with it a little more, I'll let you know what I find out, or if there are any other suggestions I'll try them out also.

Thanks

[HobbyTalk]

So if a TV show is filmed in a widescreen format, what happens when that show is broadcast on SD?

It depends on what the program broadcaster wants to do with it. They can letterbox it, crop it, Pan/Scan, squeeze it or ??????

[ICBM99]

Ok, if I can get these to link here is a picture of FNL on my computer, and one from Dish. As you can see the Dish feed is definitely cropped. whether it is done at the broadcast station is yet to be seen.

Computer Image: http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/8117/fnlcomputerqa7.jpg

TV Image: http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/4403/fnlsamsuned4.jpg

Sorry for the Flash in the pics, still trying to figure out how to take pics good.

[racton1]

Ok, if I can get these to link here is a picture of FNL on my computer, and one from Dish. As you can see the Dish feed is definitely cropped. whether it is done at the broadcast station is yet to be seen.

Computer Image: http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/8117/fnlcomputerqa7.jpg

TV Image: http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/4403/fnlsamsuned4.jpg

Sorry for the Flash in the pics, still trying to figure out how to take pics good.

Certain shows like Opra are in 4:3 format in HD. I dont understand if it is E, The local affiliate or the national feed.

[patmurphey]

Dish is NOT messing with your signal format! If the broadcaster crops you CANNOT undo it! Dish is sending out what they receive. If you are getting less on your TV than what Dish is sending, it is YOUR settings that are to blame.

[ICBM99]

I've always figured that it was the broadcasters and not Dish, and I can see why they do it (for the majority people that have SD TV sets), but it still aggravates me. Well I'll just have to wait until I can get them in HD, then hopefully things will be right.

Thanks for all your responses.

Till next time.