Upscaling/Upconversion Question

[bcab17]

I just upgraded my av receiver to a Denon 3808, which does video upscaling/upconverting, and I'm wondering how people who have upconverting receivers setup their HR-20/21 as far as resolution is concerned. Do you set the HR-20/21 to "Native" and let the av receiver (and/or the TV) do the upconversion or do you set it to output just 1080i so that the HR-20/21 is upconverting the SD channels?

[mjones73]

I let my HR20-100 do it, cuts down on the delay changing channels. Try the various options and see what looks best for your set up though.

[veryoldschool]

Try native on and original format for your Denon 3808 to do the work.

[gnahc79]

If you have a decent display I would leave all the converting to the display. It's worth seeing if the hr2x or denon does a better job though. You probably already know, whatever you do make sure only one component is doing the conversion.

[bcab17]

If you have a decent display I would leave all the converting to the display. It's worth seeing if the hr2x or denon does a better job though. You probably already know, whatever you do make sure only one component is doing the conversion.

I understand your comment about doing the conversion in only one device. Since my tv converts everything it receives to it's native res of 1080p, if I set the HR21 to 1080i instead of "native", then the HR21 is performing upconversion, and then the tv is deinterlacing the 1080i to 1080p. Is this the kind of scenario (2 devices doing video processing) you are saying I should avoid? If I'm understanding you correctly, then anyone with a fixed-panel 1080p tv should only use the HR21 set to "native".

I'm so new to the whole HD, HDMI, and resolution processing thing that I'm really just trying to get a better understanding of it all.

[veryoldschool]

I understand your comment about doing the conversion in only one device. Since my tv converts everything it receives to it's native res of 1080p, if I set the HR21 to 1080i instead of "native", then the HR21 is performing upconversion, and then the tv is deinterlacing the 1080i to 1080p. Is this the kind of scenario (2 devices doing video processing) you are saying I should avoid? If I'm understanding you correctly, then anyone with a fixed-panel 1080p tv should only use the HR21 set to "native".

I'm so new to the whole HD, HDMI, and resolution processing thing that I'm really just trying to get a better understanding of it all.
What you want to do is have the best scaler do the work.
My TV scaler is better than the one in the DVR [my eyes can tell] so I have the DVR decode the SAT signal to what the provider encoded it [native on], then this gets sent to my TV, where my TV then does what is needed to display it correctly.
This is for my Sony TV.
With my Vizio, there isn't any difference and it is only a 720p display, so I leave native off and limit the DVR to 720p. In this case the DVR is doing all of the work [since it is as good as the TV].
All of these settings come down to personal choices, and the only "right" answer is what you, the viewer, like.

[lparsons21]

I'm with you. My TV's scalar works better than the DVR's, so I have mine set to 'Native'. Yes, it does slow down the channel change, and the screen flickers a bit as it goes about changing, but the picture is just so much better.

[bcab17]

What you want to do is have the best scaler do the work.
My TV scaler is better than the one in the DVR [my eyes can tell] so I have the DVR decode the SAT signal to what the provider encoded it [native on], then this gets sent to my TV, where my TV then does what is needed to display it correctly.
This is for my Sony TV.
With my Vizio, there isn't any difference and it is only a 720p display, so I leave native off and limit the DVR to 720p. In this case the DVR is doing all of the work [since it is as good as the TV].
All of these settings come down to personal choices, and the only "right" answer is what you, the viewer, like.

You mention a Sony TV. It wouldn't be a A3000 would it? That's what I have, and as I add more hdmi components (I just picked up a Denon 3808 receiver) the connection and scaling scenarios keep getting more complicted.

Many reviews I've read say that the Sony A3000 doesn't do a great job upconverting 480i to 1080p, and that while the Denon does a very good job of upconverting 480i to 1080p, it's deinterlacing of 1080i to 1080p is not good at all.

What does this all mean? Well, if I set the HR-21 to "native" (as you do) I would want to try to figure out a way to get the Denon to upconvert the SD (480i) channels, and pass-thru the HD channels (720p, 1080i) so the Sony does the conversion to 1080p. How will I accomplish this? I have no idea.:confused:

[veryoldschool]

You mention a Sony TV. It wouldn't be a A3000 would it? That's what I have, and as I add more hdmi components (I just picked up a Denon 3808 receiver) the connection and scaling scenarios keep getting more complicted.

Many reviews I've read say that the Sony A3000 doesn't do a great job upconverting 480i to 1080p, and that while the Denon does a very good job of upconverting 480i to 1080p, it's deinterlacing of 1080i to 1080p is not good at all.

What does this all mean? Well, if I set the HR-21 to "native" (as you do) I would want to try to figure out a way to get the Denon to upconvert the SD (480i) channels, and pass-thru the HD channels (720p, 1080i) so the Sony does the conversion to 1080p. How will I accomplish this? I have no idea.:confused:
I have a Bravia XBR2 with the "pro" scaler.
I don't have a Denon to know the setup there but: Native on, and either "as broadcast" or "original format" [label changed with a software release] will have the HR21 do "nothing" but send out the programing as it is sent to DirecTV. Now going into your Denon setup is where you want to have it output 1080i [for everything] and then your Sony will do what it needs to display it.

[bcab17]

I have a Bravia XBR2 with the "pro" scaler.
I don't have a Denon to know the setup there but: Native on, and either "as broadcast" or "original format" [label changed with a software release] will have the HR21 do "nothing" but send out the programing as it is sent to DirecTV. Now going into your Denon setup is where you want to have it output 1080i [for everything] and then your Sony will do what it needs to display it.

That sounds like a plan. The only problem is that if I set the Denon to upconvert to 1080i, then both the Denon AND the Sony will be doing video processing. If I set the Denon to upconvert to 1080p, then only the Denon is doing the processing (in this case, the upconverted SD channels may very well look better, but the deinterlaced HD channels may look worse). I guess I'll have to see which looks better.

[veryoldschool]

I guess I'll have to see which looks better.
Well, that is what it always comes down to. :D

[bcab17]

Just one other thought. Since the Denon receiver does a great job upscaling everything but 1080i, one possibility would be to set the HR-21 to output everything but 1080i? What would the HR-21 do to 1080i HD channels in this scenario? Would they be down-converted to 720p or all the way down to 480i?

I guess my last question would be is down-converting 1080i to any other resolution (especially when it's going to end up being displayed on a 1080p tv) just a dumb thing to do?

[josetann]

Just one other thought. Since the Denon receiver does a great job upscaling everything but 1080i, one possibility would be to set the HR-21 to output everything but 1080i? What would the HR-21 do to 1080i HD channels in this scenario? Would they be down-converted to 720p or all the way down to 480i?

I guess my last question would be is down-converting 1080i to any other resolution (especially when it's going to end up being displayed on a 1080p tv) just a dumb thing to do?

To answer your first question, if you have everything but 1080i selected, and tune to a channel in 1080i, it will down-convert it to 720p.

I'd just try the different settings and see which works best for you. Yes there's a difference converting 720p to 1080i (the resolution is higher yes, but it's interlaced instead of progressive) and vice versa. You may not notice a big difference, if not then who cares? Right now I have my receiver set to always output at 1080i because I hate the time it takes for everything to resync (takes 5-10 seconds for my setup), even though I have a dedicated scaler. I'm considering switching back to native but deselecting 480i and 480p, I figure that'd take care of most of the resyncs and still output native for most of the HD stuff.

[gnahc79]

I'm considering switching back to native but deselecting 480i and 480p, I figure that'd take care of most of the resyncs and still output native for most of the HD stuff.

That's an interesting idea....*runs off to try it out* :)

[Richierich]

I'm considering switching back to native but deselecting 480i and 480p, I figure that'd take care of most of the resyncs and still output native for most of the HD stuff.

That is what I am doing. I let the HR21 upconvert the 480I & 480P material & then let the 720P & 1080I pass thru as broadcast and then they get converted to 1080P by the Samsung LCD. At least that is the way I think it works.