View Full Version : Installer trying to tell buddy hr-21 is old and HR-20 is new
CrazyJerry
03-01-08, 11:12 AM
I have a buddy getting an install today. The installer is telling him that the HR-20-100 is the newest thing out right now. As well as telling him that the HR-21-700 you can only get refurbished unit.
I need proof that the HR-21 is the newer model so he can show the installer and his supervisor. They are taking him round and round.
This info would be greatly appreciated ASAP please. Thanks in advance!
CJ
If your buddy needs to record over the air channels, the HR20-100 is BETTER than the HR21! Because the HR20 has OTA, HR21 does NOT!. HR21 is the new cut-down model that prevents reception of local channels off the air.
CrazyJerry
03-01-08, 11:31 AM
If your buddy needs to record over the air channels, the HR20-100 is BETTER than the HR21! Because the HR20 has OTA, HR21 does NOT!. HR21 is the new cut-down model that prevents reception of local channels off the air.
Doesn't need OTA recording we get all locals in HD here.
The main thing is, what can I send to these guys to show them the HR-21 is newer. Feels like they just want to get rid of the HR-20 when he was told by D* that he was getting an HR-21-700
Stunod7
03-01-08, 11:31 AM
Okay... The installer's supervisor is telling me the HR21's are being found to be faulty and they are having a lot of recalls on them.
OTA doesn't really bother me much as I'm in a market where I get all my Locals HD and I'm in an area where I can receive HD, although it might be nice to record HD off locals to bypass compression...
I thought the 21 was the way to go, but everything the installer is telling me is that the 20 is what I should have. Any... I guess, suggestions? Which way to go? Tell the installer to take a leap?
I suspect your friend or the installer heard/said the wrong thing. The HR21-100 is
the newest receiver.
Stunod7
03-01-08, 11:39 AM
Hi, I'm the friend.
The installer has heard of it, after first claiming it was an older discontinued/refub, but they are claiming there are recalls on them and they don't even know how to get HR-21 because of that.
I have latest and greatest problems... I almost replaced my macbook when the new ones came out and it is only 4 months old, at most... But I guess since the specs of the 20 and the 21 are negligible and the installer has no idea when they'll be able to get 21's, and I don't want to wait another 2-3 weeks to actually get my install done, I'll probably just stick with the 20.
Not too many people can tell the difference between OTA mpeg 2 vs. LIL mpeg 4. All boxes are getting more and more software updates so both should be ok. If they are new then I would go for the hr20 just because it does have OTA and therefore more options available to record. Some OTA digital stations are not on D* lil yet and will look better than the standard def signal D* provides. Just make sure it is a new box whatever it is. Sometimes it is really hard to tell if it is new because the installers could be issued the same box( not brown or white) whether it is new or refurbished. When D* sends you a refurb directly from there warehouse it most likely would be in a brown or white box.
waynebtx
03-01-08, 11:47 AM
I have a buddy getting an install today. The installer is telling him that the HR-20-100 is the newest thing out right now. As well as telling him that the HR-21-700 you can only get refurbished unit.
I need proof that the HR-21 is the newer model so he can show the installer and his supervisor. They are taking him round and round.
This info would be greatly appreciated ASAP please. Thanks in advance!
CJ
Show him this http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=121332
Stunod7
03-01-08, 11:55 AM
It looks pretty new. What do you think?
h t t p://picasaweb.google.com/stunod7/DirecTVEquipment
Can't post urls until I've made 5 posts... Almost there...
litzdog911
03-01-08, 12:39 PM
I doesn't really matter which is "newer". Bot the HR20 and HR21 series HD DVRs are functionally equivalent, except that the HR21 removed the internal OTA tuners. HR20-100's are still being manufactured, as are HR21's from several manufacturers.
i don't think that he meant newer, but new as opossed to refurb ( at least that is what I meant in my earlier post)
it looks like d* is sending recv in different boxes now. Got a hr20-100 a few months ago and it was in the colored box. the sticker on the box that says the model number usually has an R in the model number if it is refurbished. can anyone confirm the brown boxes now on brand new recvrs. n e way looks like you got it, as long as it works you'll surely be happy, and you don't have to wait any longer to get one. hope you enjoy!! i like the blue circle of lights better on the 20-100 vs the 20-700
One thing to check for sure with the HR20-100: Make sure to drill down down into the Setup menu under Satellite and Antenna, select View Satellite Strength. Arrow over to the 103(c) satellite (or(b), depending on software) and confirm that your signals are mostly all in the 90's, i.e., good dish alignment. This is the satellite which carries all the national HD channels. Then arrow over to the 110 satellite. Check the signal strengths on the satellite 110 transponders (8,10, & 12). Then arrow down and over from tuner 1 to tuner 2 and confirm you have substantially the same signal strengths on tuner 2. If the tuner 2 signals are down in the 40's and 50's, while the tuner 1 signals are in the 90's, you're going to have to reject that receiver. This is a known issue which effects some of these receivers.
As a side note, you may have to wait a few minutes for the automatic download of the latest software, if you don't have a 103(c) choice in your View Signal Strength menu. Your installer should also know how to force that download.
RobertE
03-01-08, 06:16 PM
it looks like d* is sending recv in different boxes now. Got a hr20-100 a few months ago and it was in the colored box. the sticker on the box that says the model number usually has an R in the model number if it is refurbished. can anyone confirm the brown boxes now on brand new recvrs. n e way looks like you got it, as long as it works you'll surely be happy, and you don't have to wait any longer to get one. hope you enjoy!! i like the blue circle of lights better on the 20-100 vs the 20-700
Basicly it boils down like this:
All white boxes - 99.9999% chance of a refurb.
Brown "natural" box - 95% chance of new unit, just a non-retail box for installer use.
Pretty box with pictures- 99.9999% chance of new, retail box & pacakaging.
Stunod7
03-01-08, 07:32 PM
... Then arrow over to the 110 satellite. Check the signal strengths on the satellite 110 transponders (8,10, & 12). Then arrow down and over from tuner 1 to tuner 2 and confirm you have substantially the same signal strengths on tuner 2. If the tuner 2 signals are down in the 40's and 50's, while the tuner 1 signals are in the 90's, you're going to have to reject that receiver. This is a known issue which effects some of these receivers....
My tuner 2 on the 110 is in the dumper. 0, 59, 54. I didn't see him do the test on this unit. What can I expect with the 110 satellite having such awful numbers? I already know I have to call and complain that the installer didn't hook the OTA up (are they supposed to? I would assume they do since it has an OTA tuner.) I'll bring this up to them as well. The installer seemed a little green when it came to the actual setup of the device itself. Also... Could this be just a poor job at aligning or is this going to be a genuine issue with the hardware?
If your 110 tuner 1 numbers are normal (85-100), you're going to need to swap out that receiver. Before doing that though, since you obviously want OTA and need an HR20, I'd try as many different BBC's on the tuner 2 input as there are on the truck in an effort to find one that'll give you at least in the 70's so you can perhaps keep the receiver you've got. I'm not optimistic, however.
BTW, check that zero on tuner 2 tp 8 with the Signal Meters in the menu. I doubt if it's really zero. The software might have missed tp 8 on it's go around. But it might be zero...
You're going to need to do the OTA yourself, unless you've already got an antenna and coax in place he can easily just hook up. Or you can pay him a little extra.
Stunod7
03-01-08, 11:50 PM
Okay, when I go into the signal meters, here is what I come back with:
S110 Transponder 08 Audio Feedback: Tuner 1 - 95% Tuner 2 - Not Acquired
S110 Transponder 10 Audio Feedback: Tuner 1 - 94% Tuner 2 - 55%
S110 Transponder 12 Audio Feedback: Tuner 1 - 95% Tuner 2 - 71%
I let it sit for a few minutes. Tuner 1 bounces up and down maybe... 1-2 percent on all 3 transponders, however, tuner 2 on 110 transponder 8 just doesn't show up. It did jump to 8% for a few seconds, but that's about it. It just sits there. Mocking me. Not acquiring.
If you could answer this for me, I'd really appreciate it. What can I expect to be my problems with the poor link on the 2nd tuner (or what do I tell D* is wrong with my setup) and should I call D* directly or just deal with the installer?
I've had a pretty rough time with the installer out here, so much that D* has already given me a $150 credit, and I want to make sure that I'm able to go back at the installer and/or D* with guns a blazin' tomorrow.
Also, I really, really, really appreciate your help :D
The effect of this problem is that every time you try to change to a channel in the 70's, except 72 and 79, which are on the 119 satellite, you will get a "Searching for Satellite Signal on Sat In 2 (Error Message 771)" if you were just previously on tuner 1. The tuners alternate back and forth, unless you've got one of them tied up recording something. You can work around this by forcing the receiver to land on tuner 1 for the channel you can't receive on tuner 2 by sequentially changing channels as follows, where you start out on tuner 2 with no reception, but want to end on tuner 1, same channel: CH A > CH B > CH C > CH A. This is obviously a major PIA.
Also, if you set up a recording on a 110 channel and go to bed, you won't know for sure whether it will record or not unless you take great care to make sure that channel is already on tuner 1, or will be forced to use tuner 1 because you are simultaneously already recording some other channel on another satellite on tuner 2. Grrrrrr.
I'd call the installer and tell him he needs to bring you another HR20. You can easily prove to him yours is not functional. I'm beginning to get the impression that the HR20-700's (different manufacturer) either don't have this problem, or if they do, it's not as widespread. This issue hasn't been around that long. It is probably correctable through updated software, but I'm not sure when that will be. Obviously. not all -100's have this problem either. So keep trying all receivers he has even if they're all -100's, assuming he has more.
You do not have to activate the receiver with DirecTV to determine if it has the problem. You do need to access the 103(c) s.s. page prior to checking for the problem, which may require the software download first. For whatever reason, it only shows up after you have once used the tuners to access the 103 satellite, either by tuning to a 103 channel (after activation) or using the tuner to tune the 103 signal strength page. That is to say a reboot will temporarily fix it until the first use of 103. Not handy.
If the installer has no more HR20's, you'll have to call DirecTV and get past the first level CSR's to the Tech Support people, many of whom have got to be aware of this issue by now.
TigersFanJJ
03-02-08, 10:36 AM
It doesn't really matter which one is the newer model. A specific model is not guaranteed, only a specific type (standard, dvr,hd, hddvr). You can request a certain model, however, you will get what the hsp has in stock. Any csr that tells you different is misinformed.
The OTA should be connected by the installer if it has its own dedicated cable running to the area that the receiver is located. Unless it's a line item on the workorder, the installer won't install the OTA or run any cable to make your OTA work.
Stunod7
03-02-08, 01:56 PM
K4SMX: I did a quick test, recorded 1 channel off the 110 and swapped to a different channel and it was pure garbage. I have the installer coming back out, next Saturday, with new boxes to test with. I guess I better not get attached to anything I've already recorded, or get some external storage ASAP.
Re: the "external storage" - you are limited primarily to SD DVD recordings at this time. External drives get married to the current receiver. If you get a new receiver, there's no trial separation, no "double-dipping" - it's flat-out, immediate divorce and re-marriage to the new receiver. :)
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