Problem with transponders 1-8 on 2nd Tuner only

[Colonel Badger]

Had an engineer upgrade us to HD this weekend. He got everything up pretty quickly and checked alignment and signal strength on all satellites/tuners which initially passed with flying colors. (5 lnb slim line dish, R20-100)

He then disappeared in to my basement I suspect to hook up the Zinwell splitter (I suspect the initial test was done inline without my upstairs R15 hooked up as well). When he came back up he did a second test and everything passed on tuner 1. On tuner 2 however transponders 1-8 had 0's and 45-50's readings I *THINK* on satellite 103(s) (although my memory may be wrong on that).

He tried numerous things

1. Replaced the BBC's
2. Replaced the receiver
3. Replaced the splitter downstairs
4. checked the LNB's
5. swapped the two feeds to the receiver so that the feed going to tuner 1 went to tuner 2 and vice versa. *It didn't follow the cable, tuner 2 gave the same results*

Nothing helped. He also removed the BBC from the 2nd tuner input and lo and behold the numbers went up to 90's - 100's. But obviously we need the BBC.

In the end he called a colleague who told him some of the channels that are on that transponder and satellite, we tried viewing and recording those channels ( to exercise the 2 tuners) and everything worked.

In the end the installer (who seemed very knowledgeable and thorough) was baffled and believed that perhaps the signal strength test on the receiver was returning false results.

So in the end he left with everything apparently working, I haven't had any issues so far watched or recording anything. But the fact that something failed in testing is bugging me.

What are peoples thoughts?

Mark.

[bobnielsen]

Without the BBC, you will not be able to receive any channels on 103(c). It shouldn't affect any others. Perhaps it was a bad BBC and should be replaced.

[Colonel Badger]

Without the BBC, you will not be able to receive any channels on 103(c). It shouldn't affect any others. Perhaps it was a bad BBC and should be replaced.

He replaced the BBC and it made no difference. Also, if it was a bad BBC the problem would follow to tuner 1 when it was swapped from tuner 2. It didn't.

Anybody know what channels I could double check to make sure everything is fine?

[texasbrit]

He replaced the BBC and it made no difference. Also, if it was a bad BBC the problem would follow to tuner 1 when it was swapped from tuner 2. It didn't.

Anybody know what channels I could double check to make sure everything is fine?


Go back and check the 103(c) signals on both tuners. They should be in the 80s/90s across the board.
103(s) carries spotbeams and so many of the signals will be low or zero, but they should be approximately the same on both tuners.

[Hansen]

Very odd issue. The thing you're going to want to check is whether Tuner 2 can lock in on a channel that is broadcast via one of those transponders. You have to remember that when switching channels, the receiver flip flops between the two tuners if both are available (i.e not recording at that time). So, tuner 1 is on channel 8, then you hit channel 11 and it will use tuner 2 to go to channel 11, then you hit channel 200 and it will use tuner 1 to go to 200. So, to lock Tuner 2 on a channel on that sat, you need to find out what channels are broadcast to you via that satellite (you said 103(s), which suggest a spot beam sat and means local HD channels and you need to see if that sat is used to send you the locals - if not, no worries; if so, then keep going) and transponders. Once you know the channels, tune to one fo the channels and hit record. It will lock one of the tuners on that channel, then while recording on that turner, type in another channel also on that satellite and see what happens, i.e. searching for signal.

[convem24]

Possibly you might have a bad run, but I am with Bob on this. The BBC is the likely culprit. The BBCs are free and can be ordered at www.directv.com/bbc. Good luck!

[Colonel Badger]

Very odd issue. The thing you're going to want to check is whether Tuner 2 can lock in on a channel that is broadcast via one of those transponders. You have to remember that when switching channels, the receiver flip flops between the two tuners if both are available (i.e not recording at that time). So, tuner 1 is on channel 8, then you hit channel 11 and it will use tuner 2 to go to channel 11, then you hit channel 200 and it will use tuner 1 to go to 200. So, to lock Tuner 2 on a channel on that sat, you need to find out what channels are broadcast to you via that satellite (you said 103(s), which suggest a spot beam sat and means local HD channels and you need to see if that sat is used to send you the locals - if not, no worries; if so, then keep going) and transponders. Once you know the channels, tune to one fo the channels and hit record. It will lock one of the tuners on that channel, then while recording on that turner, type in another channel also on that satellite and see what happens, i.e. searching for signal.

Thanks, i'm going to double check the satellite signal tests and confirm which satellite it was and then run the test you suggested above.

Mark.

[K4SMX]

Since you have an HR20-100, you need to carefully check the three tp's (8, 10, & 12) on the 110 satellite, tuner 2 versus tuner 1. This is a known issue, and may be what he was seeing.

If you have low signals on tuner 2 on the 110 satellite, you will have problems with all of the channels in the 70's except 72 and 79, which are on the 119 satellite. Because of the way the tuners alternate, every time you try to tune one of these channels, you have a 50% chance of getting either no picture or bad pixellation, depending on whether you're above or below a signal strength of about 50 on the 110 tp which carries that channel.

[Colonel Badger]

Since you have an HR20-100, you need to carefully check the three tp's (8, 10, & 12) on the 110 satellite, tuner 2 versus tuner 1. This is a known issue, and may be what he was seeing.

If you have low signals on tuner 2 on the 110 satellite, you will have problems with all of the channels in the 70's except 72 and 79, which are on the 119 satellite. Because of the way the tuners alternate, every time you try to tune one of these channels, you have a 50% chance of getting either no picture or bad pixellation, depending on whether you're above or below a signal strength of about 50 on the 110 tp which carries that channel.


Interesting. Now that you say it, it could well have been the 110 satellite. I did a quick search of this problem in the forums and from what was described it does sound very similar to what I was seeing yesterday. I will check tonight.

If it turns out to be this, should I simply call DirecTv and ask for an engineer to return? How do I spin it without DirecTv simply sending me a replacement box in the mail?

[K4SMX]

If you do in fact have this problem, I'd first attempt to contact your installer directly, since he appeared pretty conscientious. He may have some different receivers available, and you would like to avoid him receiving any possible chargeback.

[Colonel Badger]

If you do in fact have this problem, I'd first attempt to contact your installer directly, since he appeared pretty conscientious. He may have some different receivers available, and you would like to avoid him receiving any possible chargeback.

Ok, well last night I checked 110 transponders 8, 10 and 12 and they're fine on both tuners (90+ strength). I then checked other satellites and noticed that satellite 101 on tuner 2 has zero's on the first line of transponders (didn't let it get past the first line), but tuner 1 was fine with 90+ strength for satellite 101. I then went around the other satellites testing and all other satellites and all were fine on tuner 2!

Here's the bizarre thing. After testing all other satellites I came back to satelite 101 on tuner 2 and guess what, I was then getting 90+ strengths on tuner 2 as well!!! I then tried my hardest to get the tuner 2 satellite 101 strengths
to go to zero and failed !!

So it seems that on the first attempt to test tuner 2 on 101 failed, but all later tests past !! weird!!

Just out of curiosity what channels are on transponders 1-8 on satellite 101?

[K4SMX]

Ok, well last night I checked 110 transponders 8, 10 and 12 and they're fine on both tuners (90+ strength). I then checked other satellites and noticed that satellite 101 on tuner 2 has zero's on the first line of transponders (didn't let it get past the first line), but tuner 1 was fine with 90+ strength for satellite 101. I then went around the other satellites testing and all other satellites and all were fine on tuner 2!

Here's the bizarre thing. After testing all other satellites I came back to satelite 101 on tuner 2 and guess what, I was then getting 90+ strengths on tuner 2 as well!!! I then tried my hardest to get the tuner 2 satellite 101 strengths
to go to zero and failed !!

So it seems that on the first attempt to test tuner 2 on 101 failed, but all later tests past !! weird!!

Just out of curiosity what channels are on transponders 1-8 on satellite 101?
Sounds like everything is working OK, then. :) Don't be concerned about some zero's popping up sometimes when you first do a signal strength grid. The software sometimes skips a tp or two. Their actual signal strength on both tuners can be simultaneously confirmed using the Signal Meters selection in the View Satellite Signals menu page.