Retention failure

[mikewolf13]

So I switched from DTV to FIOS in January. When I called to cancel DTV, no attempt was made to stop me from leaving.

I figured this was due to assorted credits I may have received in the past (nothing major), or my several e-mail complaints I had regarding the R15 and being overcharged for the Protection Plan (http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=65119), maybe having 7 months left on my committment, they thought the fee would dissuade me?

Either way, I was fine with it, I wasn't looking for an offer to stay and that call was quick and painless.

However, since then DTV has called me repeatedly with "great offers" to get me back.

I cannot testify to what the offer is, cause I simply say no thank you, and hang up. I am in a 2year committment to FIOS, between the termination fee, and the lostt bundle savings, I doubt DTV could make an offer to me that makes sense.

Now, I probably would not have left, if they had simply credited me the $2/month I felt I was overcharged for the protection plan. And, It certainly would have been easier to make this offer to me during my initial call instead of calling me dozens of times. My wife ignores calls from "unknown caller" as it appears on y caller ID, but I have spoken to them 3 or 4 times.

The next call I may listen to their offer and tie up the reps time for a good 20 minutes asking lots of questions....then say no....

I understand trying to reduce credit hunters who abuse retention, but this is a very poorly executed process.

[tcusta00]

The next call I may listen to their offer and tie up the reps time for a good 20 minutes asking lots of questions....then say no....


That would be a productive use of everyone's time. :rolleyes:

[Stuart Sweet]

Obviously it's a work in progress. There was a time you could say they were too loose in giving credits and trying to retain, and in your case they were too tight. All I can hope is that it will get a little better.

[tcusta00]

Obviously it's a work in progress. There was a time you could say they were too loose in giving credits and trying to retain, and in your case they were too tight. All I can hope is that it will get a little better.

It doesn't sound as if he even asked for the $2/month credits in order to be "retained" - he just cancelled.

No offense to the OP, but maybe DirecTV is starting to only offer retention credits to people who fit their "profitable customer" mold, discussed on prior threads? If this is the case then obviously they need to stop marketing to these folks after they've left, too. :lol:

[braven]

The next call I may listen to their offer and tie up the reps time for a good 20 minutes asking lots of questions....then say no....




Oh boy, that will show 'em. :rolleyes:

[mikewolf13]

It doesn't sound as if he even asked for the $2/month credits in order to be "retained" - he just cancelled.

No offense to the OP, but maybe DirecTV is starting to only offer retention credits to people who fit their "profitable customer" mold, discussed on prior threads? If this is the case then obviously they need to stop marketing to these folks after they've left, too. :lol:

I asked for the $2/month about 8 months ago...was denied..so i cancelled the PP but remained a customer, but at that point I inteneded to leave..the question was when. That came 2 months ago,

I did not say "give me the credit or I'll cancel", I was not yet prepared to leave so I asked, they declined and I made my decision

So, yes they missed their true retention chance 8 months ago and any offer at time of cancellation would likely fallen on deaf ears. But any chance they had was over after I went to the "time and expense" (not to mention my committment) of having FIOS installed.

As far as profitable, 1 premium, NFLST, 4 receivers, DVR fee and protection plan. Certainly not the most profitable, but I believe I was in the 20% that provides 80% of the profit.

Otherwise, repeated attempts to gain back my non-profitable business are really really really dumb.

[tuff bob]

No offense to the OP, but maybe DirecTV is starting to only offer retention credits to people who fit their "profitable customer" mold, discussed on prior threads?

Why are they calling him now that he canceled?

[tcusta00]

Why are they calling him now that he canceled?

You'll have to ask them.

I'm speculating here to try to help the OP figured out why they're still calling him.

I agree, them calling you after not making an effort to retain you is just silly.

[Plusdvrjunkie]

You'll have to ask them.

I'm speculating here to try to help the OP figured out why they're still calling him.

I agree, them calling you after not making an effort to retain you is just silly.

Call Directv and ask to be removed from their Promotion call list. If you want them to quit calling.

[mikewolf13]

Call Directv and ask to be removed from their Promotion call list. If you want them to quit calling.

I understand that. I am not going to call and sit on hold to tell them not to call me, It's not being called that I really mind, otherwise I would tell the rep to remove me form the list when they call.

I don't care that they didn't make me an offer to stay.

My issue is with the process:

They made no attempt when I am on the phone cancelling and then wait until I have another provider and THEN say come back

Then when I say NO, cal then next day and say Come back again???

In most cased once you say no to a solicitaion they stop calling.. at least with regards to that offer.

[SDizzle]

This isn't far off from what a couple of my friends experienced from E*, I convinced them to go to D* after they both repeatedly experienced bad customer service from E*. They let E* know they were unhappy, and E* did nothing. So after they had D* installed and called to cancel, then E* wanted to "Deal"..... But, at least they weren't called after the fact, but E* did still let them go, basically. when you go through the trouble to get another service installed, you've already left.

[msmith]

I dropped cable at the time that I got FIOS for Internet access (I already had DirecTV for TV).

Now about 5-6 months later I'm getting calls on my Caller ID from Cablevision. They haven't called when I'm home yet, so I don't know what they're calling about.

[Shades228]

You have to stop thinking individually and start thinking at a corporate broad range level.

When you call in to cancel people will look over your account and make a determination based on what they see. This determination is subjective to the person you talk to. It sounds like based on your account the person you talked with determined that you were not entitled to any more credits. It doesn't matter how great of a customer you are there comes a point with all accounts that money will not be offered.

After you cancel the companies marketing machine now takes over. The deal you are given will be structured around what they know will still bring a profit to the company. This particular offer will have commitments associated with it. Companies don't look at the accounts on an individual basis to do everything they can to get people back. Companies just send you an offer they know is competitive so that if you have a problem or are not enjoying the reason you canceled a compelling reason to come back.

[Tom White]

That would be a productive use of everyone's time. :rolleyes:

You mean just like D's repeated calls to him?

Pot meet Kettle, Kettle meet Pot.

[JDubbs413]

If I were DirecTV, I'd be happy to get rid of all the needy customers we had anyway. They make plenty of money.

[Ken S]

Hey, over two million people are going to voluntarily cancel DirecTV this year. That's about 5,500/day. Rather than waste the time fixing issues they'll just sign up new customers and lock them in for two years. The supply of new customers is endless...isn't it?

[Shades228]

Hey, over two million people are going to voluntarily cancel DirecTV this year. That's about 5,500/day. Rather than waste the time fixing issues they'll just sign up new customers and lock them in for two years. The supply of new customers is endless...isn't it?


Your numbers are skewed by your cynicism. DTV has 16.8 mil with a churn of 1.2% annual. While cust leaving for other companies and promotions is the largest portion of that there are other reasons that go into that number. Cust death, 2 people with DTV get married and combine accounts, selling a second home, involuntary disconects, and moving into a non LOS area are still in there.


Retention has turned into a beast that is bad for consumers as well as the companies. There is a place for a retention department in every business. There will be the bottom 2% of people who are truly having real problems that are not being corrected in the maner they shoudl be. That said consumers keep demanding more and companies in the last 5 years have been giving in. This thread could continue forever with oppinions on what is right because it's oppinion based.

New customer offers and retention credit/discounts are really just a bandaid for companies to cover up what problems they really have. If neither of these existed then companies would be forced to focus on what's truly important and that would be quality of services and customer service. As it is consumers are happy with being bought to stay with a company over a bad experience or companies are happy provide discounts to people who complain at the neglect of customers who just pay their bills and enjoy what they pay for.

[Ed Campbell]

4Q 2007, DirecTV was adding over 9000 per day.

[diggerg56]

4Q 2007, DirecTV was adding over 9000 per day.


I heard a radio ad today that put it in different terms. They were pitching that every eight seconds someone subscribes to Directv. Interesting approach I guess.

[tcusta00]

You mean just like D's repeated calls to him?

Pot meet Kettle, Kettle meet Pot.

I fail to see how your point refutes my comment that this is a productive use of everyone's time. Obviously something is broken at DirecTV - it's a giant company with an apparent prospect management deficiency.

[Ken S]

1.2% annual churn? Umm...you need to read a little more. Any of their financial statements for the past five years or so should do. Their monthly total churn number is about 1.5% of which about 1% is voluntary. That's about a 12% annual voluntary churn rate. 12% of 16.8 million = 2,016,000. Certainly there are deaths and marriages (no doubt DirecTV is for lovers). The involuntary disconnects don't count in the voluntary number...but that should be obvious...no?

I'm not being cynical...it's reality and it has been the DirecTV strategy for many, many years.


Your numbers are skewed by your cynicism. DTV has 16.8 mil with a churn of 1.2% annual. While cust leaving for other companies and promotions is the largest portion of that there are other reasons that go into that number. Cust death, 2 people with DTV get married and combine accounts, selling a second home, involuntary disconects, and moving into a non LOS area are still in there.


Retention has turned into a beast that is bad for consumers as well as the companies. There is a place for a retention department in every business. There will be the bottom 2% of people who are truly having real problems that are not being corrected in the maner they shoudl be. That said consumers keep demanding more and companies in the last 5 years have been giving in. This thread could continue forever with oppinions on what is right because it's oppinion based.

New customer offers and retention credit/discounts are really just a bandaid for companies to cover up what problems they really have. If neither of these existed then companies would be forced to focus on what's truly important and that would be quality of services and customer service. As it is consumers are happy with being bought to stay with a company over a bad experience or companies are happy provide discounts to people who complain at the neglect of customers who just pay their bills and enjoy what they pay for.

[ThomasM]

So I switched from DTV to FIOS in January. When I called to cancel DTV, no attempt was made to stop me from leaving.

However, since then DTV has called me repeatedly with "great offers" to get me back.



It appears that both DirecTV and DISH network have figured out that subscribers wanting "freebies" and "deals" call in and threaten to cancel. So they no longer knuckle under to these folks and just let them cancel. BUT if the customer really does cancel the barrage of "please come back" calls starts. I've seen other posts on this from former DISH customers who switched to DirecTV because they were irked with DISH. But, of course, by the time DISH woke up and started the offer calls, the customer was already into a 2 year commitment with DirecTV.

The moral of this story:

If you are irked with DirecTV or DISH network, CANCEL. But DON'T sign up with another service (and get a commitment) for at least two weeks. (Suffer along with over-the-air TV or watch DVD's) :D

And stay by the phone....

[ThomasM]

Hey, over two million people are going to voluntarily cancel DirecTV this year. That's about 5,500/day. Rather than waste the time fixing issues they'll just sign up new customers and lock them in for two years. The supply of new customers is endless...isn't it?

Sprint-Nextel believed that. Their stock is now at $5.75 (it was over $20). The CEO got tossed out and they lost millions and millions of customers (which were cheerfully picked up by A T & T and Verizon). I know. I used to work for Nextel before being forced into early retirement. Now I just laugh at their way of doing business.

Hopefully, DirecTV isn't so dumb. ;)

[rudeney]

D* is doing things like many contract-based companies. They rate customers by ARPU: average revenue per user. Like a credit score, if you have a high ARPU rating, then you are more likely to get a better deal whereas a lower ARPU rating will get you nothing. If you have been given any credits, regardless of the reason, you will have lower ARPU rating. If you have received any sort of incentive, such as a free H20 or discounted HR2x, then you will also have a lower ARPU. If you “want a deal” from D*, you need to not be under contract and not have had any credits in the last 12 months. Then they will do what they can to keep you. Otherwise, you’re just another insignificant drain on their profits.

[ironwood]

So I switched from DTV to FIOS in January. When I called to cancel DTV, no attempt was made to stop me from leaving.

However, since then DTV has called me repeatedly with "great offers" to get me back.

I understand trying to reduce credit hunters who abuse retention, but this is a very poorly executed process.

Now how do you know its Directv calling you and not some retailers? There are thousands of companies and individuals trying to sell Directv. If they find out you are potential customer they gonna call you all the time.

Its also possible Directv is calling you. Just in case you switched to another provider and you dont like them. In this case you are a perfect returning customer.

[mikewolf13]

It appears that both DirecTV and DISH network have figured out that subscribers wanting "freebies" and "deals" call in and threaten to cancel. So they no longer knuckle under to these folks and just let them cancel. BUT if the customer really does cancel the barrage of "please come back" calls starts. I've seen other posts on this from former DISH customers who switched to DirecTV because they were irked with DISH. But, of course, by the time DISH woke up and started the offer calls, the customer was already into a 2 year commitment with DirecTV.

The moral of this story:

If you are irked with DirecTV or DISH network, CANCEL. But DON'T sign up with another service (and get a commitment) for at least two weeks. (Suffer along with over-the-air TV or watch DVD's) :D

And stay by the phone....

That's absurd..I cancelled becaue i had already signed up..infact I waited until FIOS was installed before I cancelled,

I was asked why I was leaving . I Said bendled FIOS package...there was no threat, I simply said I wanted to cancel...I didn't say "unless you can make it worth my while" or anything to that effect.

But this is when any offer should have been made. To continue repeatedly after the fact is silly.

There is a reason you can't cancel online or throught the VRU (automated system), it's so they can talk to you...yet no attempt to save me (which was fine). They should allow non-desirables to cancel in the VRU...no retention cost and lower wait times for those they WANT to save. No doubt lower wait times improve chances for the save.

IF they don't want to save me, that's fine. I have NO issue with that. IT's the repeated calling afterward that I object to ( more from a business view thatn a personal one). Especially after I have actually answered and spoken to three reps and said no each time.

Apparently they don't want to take a hit in their goals by saying I refused the offer and mark down that I haven't spoken to, so I get called again.....gotta love call centers! (worked in them for 8 years)

[mikewolf13]

Now how do you know its Directv calling you and not some retailers? There are thousands of companies and individuals trying to sell Directv. If they find out you are potential customer they gonna call you all the time.

Its also possible Directv is calling you. Just in case you switched to another provider and you dont like them. In this case you are a perfect returning customer.


THe person on the phone says "I am 'Bill' form DirectV with a fantastic offer to get you back"

Also I am on the Do not call list....so DTV can call me as part of our "existing business relationship" which includes these retention attempts But should end after I say "NO".

But 3rd part retailer offering new service cannot

[jpl]

I'm sort of in the same boat. I don't get calls from DirecTV, but I've gotten a bunch of mailers from them, and I just started getting e-mails, asking me to come back. I can understand why DirecTV, or any company, gets a little shy about giving stuff to every customer who calls and threatens to quit. Unfortunately there are way too many people who do that just to get a better deal with their existing service. In other words, there are way too many people who bluff.

I think that's what they saw with my case as well - they thought I was bluffing. I wasn't. I had just got an HDTV and wanted an HD DVR. I wanted to see if there was some arrangement that DirecTV could accomodate - I wasn't even looking for a discount - I just was hoping that they would have been willing to break up the cost into three payments, put onto my bill. They wouldn't accomodate me at all (after a couple phone calls, and a couple of e-mails - including an e-mail I got from them saying that they wanted to work with me).

So, like Mike, I signed up for FiOS. That day I suspended my DirecTV account. When asked 'why' (they ask that, so they can add information about it to your account) I was totally honest. I told them that I had just gotten a different service installed and was checking them out.

All of a sudden DirecTV was anxious to play 'lets make a deal'. Twenty four hours later I got a call from their escalation department, wanting to work with me. They made an offer and I said 'no thanks...' They thought I was trying to negotiate at that point. I wasn't. I gave them a chance to negotiate. They came back with a counter offer. I said 'look that's very generous of you, but I'm not interested in taking it at this point. I got fios hooked up and I want to try it out.' I bet if I had pushed, I would have gotten an amazing deal. But I don't play it like that - this wasn't some move on my part. I'm a very honest broker in these types of deals.

That's where I think these companies need to do a better job - they need to better figure out who the honest brokers are, and who the folks just trying to get free stuff are. I think there are ways to figure that out. Will it be perfect? No, but it has to be better than the system of dial-a-csr that gets played today. Some 6 weeks later when I finally called to cancel DirecTV the CSR just said 'I suppose there's nothing I can offer at this point to convince you to stay?' I said 'no... there isn't' At least they were very curteous about the whole thing. A co-worker went from Comcast to FiOS, and when she called to cancel Comcast the CSR gave her a lecture that 'you should have called us first.' Yeah that kind of attitude would make me change my mind... Then again, Comcast is losing so many customers (their numbers are only offset by the fact that they just bought out a couple other cable systems) that I've heard of some incredible deals just for hinting that you were looking elsewhere (another co-worker was a fios customer for all of 3 hours - he called to get fios, and immediately called to cancel Comcast - before he actually got fios installed - Comcast came back with a deal so incredible he couldn't pass it up.)

[mikewolf13]

I'm sort of in the same boat. I don't get calls from DirecTV, but I've gotten a bunch of mailers from them, and I just started getting e-mails, asking me to come back. I can understand why DirecTV, or any company, gets a little shy about giving stuff to every customer who calls and threatens to quit. Unfortunately there are way too many people who do that just to get a better deal with their existing service. In other words, there are way too many people who bluff.



Although it's not what I did, i have no problem with people "bluffing".

DTV (or any provider) can raise rates and if you don't like it you leave...that's their "bluff" to you.

I have no issue with calling them and saying I may leave unless you give me a reason to stay..and I have no issue with that provider saying "get lost".

If it makes bus. sense for them to offer something fine..If not Fine...that's america free market negotiations.....:smaileinh

A few years ago, i was moving and was off contract, I called DTV and said simply, I am moving and like DTV, but may explore other options. If you can offer me something, I'll skip that process and just schedule my mover's connection. I got 6 months showtime. To me that was a valid negotiation. I didn't say I would cancel, i said I would look at the possibility and wanted to give them an opportunity to pre-emptively secure my business.

[jpl]

Although it's not what I did, i have no problem with people "bluffing".

DTV (or any provider) can raise rates and if you don't like it you leave...that's their "bluff" to you.

I have no issue with calling them and saying I may leave unless you give me a reason to stay..and I have no issue with that provider saying "get lost".

If it makes bus. sense for them to offer something fine..If not Fine...that's america free market negotiations.....:smaileinh

A few years ago, i was moving and was off contract, I called DTV and said simply, I am moving and like DTV, but may explore other options. If you can offer me something, I'll skip that process and just schedule my mover's connection. I got 6 months showtime. To me that was a valid negotiation. I didn't say I would cancel, i said I would look at the possibility and wanted to give them an opportunity to pre-emptively secure my business.

Just realized that what I wrote wasn't what I intended. This sounds contradictory, but as a rule I don't have an issue with people bluffing either. I'm very much a free-market person, and both parties have the right to try to better the terms of their contracts. My point was that this is an issue for companies. Companies like DirecTV clearly want to be able to separate the wheat from the chaff - they want to be able to make offers to folks who are legitimately thinking of leaving, because it makes more sense from a business perspective.

They can't afford to cut deals with everyone who calls threatening to quit, but if they had a better way of determining who was serious (who had a serious issue) and who was bluffing, it would help to lower the cost of their doing business. Their retention rates would go up as a result. I was really talking about this from the perspective of the business involved - that it would help the company if they could make that determination.

[DouglasPHill]

I guess my ARPU number must be very low. I called to cancel, they made a small offer to keep me. They have never called me since. I don't feel too bad. No matter what their offer, I would not sign a two year, one way, no way out contract. But on the other hand I would be willing to buy my own equipment.