yes

[juan ellitinez]

I guess cheapo charlie couldnt put a deal together in time for opening day..:lol: :lol:

[Cyclone]

Thanks for another YES vs Dish Network topic.

hey Scott, can YES get its own forum here?

[tampa8]

I guess Charlie held his ground and is keeping our rates down. Thanks Charlie.

[FTA Michael]

It may be true that Charlie held his ground, and it may be true that Charlie is keeping our rates down, but those two points are not related.

Dish sets prices to maximize profits. Dish negotiates programming rates to retain subscribers while minimizing costs. Charlie's folks probably did projections of how many subscribers Yes would lure/retain vs. how much Yes would cost, and decided it wasn't worth it at the rate Yes wanted to charge Dish.

In short, our rates have more to do with how much we're willing to pay than with how much the programming costs Dish Network.

[tampa8]

Originally posted by carload
It may be true that Charlie held his ground, and it may be true that Charlie is keeping our rates down, but those two points are not related.

Dish sets prices to maximize profits. Dish negotiates programming rates to retain subscribers while minimizing costs. Charlie's folks probably did projections of how many subscribers Yes would lure/retain vs. how much Yes would cost, and decided it wasn't worth it at the rate Yes wanted to charge Dish.

In short, our rates have more to do with how much we're willing to pay than with how much the programming costs Dish Network.

I do not totally disagree.

[Richard King]

Thanks Charlie. Keep up the good work.

[NJ_John]

He raised my bill by $2 and he's not even going to get YES? Is it official? If this is true then I think I had just about enough of cheap charlie. I guess I will cancel my subscription. I think this sucks!

Bye cheap ass network!
Why did I wait so long? I am so stupid.

[Ronmort]

Your extra fees are due to Charlie's debacle of having to pay $600 million to DTV for that failed merger plus all the legal fees, consulting fees, etc. that it cost us as customers. Our anti-sports cheerleaders on these forums don't seem to care much about that fact.

[tampa8]

Originally posted by Ronmort
Your extra fees are due to Charlie's debacle of having to pay $600 million to DTV for that failed merger plus all the legal fees, consulting fees, etc. that it cost us as customers. Our anti-sports cheerleaders on these forums don't seem to care much about that fact.

You guys really give me my laughs for the day. For that I thank-you. Direct TV went up the same amount, $2, Cable goes up way more. Dish and Direct are comparable in prices, with Dish having some better pricing at certain levels/packages, and Direct having some better pricing. I do not think your fact is a fact. There is nothing to substantiate that kind of link. You may think it, but that does not make it so.

[Steve Mehs]

IMO, Charlie did and is continuing to do the right thing by saying no to YES.

[TerryC]

Originally posted by NJ_John

Bye cheap ass network!
Why did I wait so long? I am so stupid.
If leaving leaving a company that is dedicated to keeping your rates down is stupid, then I agree. You are stupid.

If you're leaving because watching the Yankees is important to you, then I would understand.

[jeffwtux]

Originally posted by tampa8


You guys really give me my laughs for the day. For that I thank-you. Direct TV went up the same amount, $2, Cable goes up way more. Dish and Direct are comparable in prices, with Dish having some better pricing at certain levels/packages, and Direct having some better pricing. I do not think your fact is a fact. There is nothing to substantiate that kind of link. You may think it, but that does not make it so.


Please, don't try to spin these lies again. For basic packages without HBO, Cinemax, Dish is a complete rippoff for the average customer compared to Direct(unless you have ClubDish credits). DirecTV didn't raise the rates at all on TC+ with locals which still blows me away. It's the same price at AT100 with locals which has fewer channels than just TC. Charlie now has less for more for the majority of the existing customers.

[jeffwtux]

Originally posted by TerryC

If leaving leaving a company that is dedicated to keeping your rates down is stupid, then I agree. You are stupid.

If you're leaving because watching the Yankees is important to you, then I would understand.


Talk is cheap. If they are SO dedicated to keeping rates down, then why are their basic packages more money than Direct with less channels? TC+ with locals is the same price as AT100 with locals. I'm not going to allow spinning of lies.

[Cheyenne]

I support Echostar on their stance concerning YES.
Most of the subs don't care, even in the NY area, including me.

[jeffwtux]

Most subs care about less cost and more channels in general(TC has more channels than AT100 not including YES). I agree that this passing on the excess cost of sports contracts that foolish networks are paying for to monopolized consumers is big time wrong and needs to be stopped, but if Charlie REALLY wants to make his point he would have AT100 lower than TC and AT150 near the price of TC+ not way more. He talks a good game about making the sports teams networks the bad guys, and I agree, but he contradicts himself when he raises the rates anyways.

[TerryC]

Originally posted by jeffwtux



Talk is cheap. If they are SO dedicated to keeping rates down, then why are their basic packages more money than Direct with less channels?

Because they are interested in being a financially stable company.

DirecTV is not.

The decision to pass on YES at the rates that YES wants is a means to that end.

[jeffwtux]

Originally posted by TerryC

Because they are interested in being a financially stable company.

DirecTV is not.

The decision to pass on YES at the rates that YES wants is a means to that end.

I'm a customer not a shareholder. Why should an existing customer who hasn't been on a contract for 2 or 3 years care if they stable company or not? Once again, the rate increase has nothing to do with YES, because they don't have YES. DirecTV TC has MORE channels than AT100 without counting YES and it costs the same. TC+ with locals has WAY more channels than AT100 with locals and it costs the same. Ever see the Wall Street Journal commercial, "If you want to know which tire company has the best lawyers, read the WSJ. If you want to know which tire company makes the best tires, read the personal journal. " That holds truey here too.

[jeffwtux]

Basically, stability of a company is more of an investment question than a purchase question. I guarantee you won't get any ROI from dish network as a company no matter how stable.

[dbronstein]

Stability of a company is an issue for customers because if a company does go out of business, you're stuck with some useless equipment. And talking about "investments", paying $500 for a receiver is an investment. But I really don't think either Dish or DirecTV are in any danger of going under any time soon.

Dennis

[TerryC]

Your question was:

If they are SO dedicated to keeping rates down, then why are their basic packages more money than Direct with less channels?

And I answered it.

The rate increase was necessitated by Charlie gambling and losing his bid to buy DirecTV. The six hundred million dollar "fee" for losing that bid has been passed on, in part, to Dish Network subs.

[abc_charlie]

and losing that 600 million is probably the biggest reason why Charlie will not get Yes... Admit it oh cheap one!

You mean to tell me they can't get a similar deal like Cablevision. Something smells fishy!

[tampa8]

Originally posted by jeffwtux



Please, don't try to spin these lies again. For basic packages without HBO, Cinemax, Dish is a complete rippoff for the average customer compared to Direct(unless you have ClubDish credits). DirecTV didn't raise the rates at all on TC+ with locals which still blows me away. It's the same price at AT100 with locals which has fewer channels than just TC. Charlie now has less for more for the majority of the existing customers.

So if I don't agree with you I am telling lies. Because you see no value in the Dish 150 package doesn't make it a lie that I do. That's called a disagreement. We watch the movie channels included often. And I love how you so easily dismiss the package price when you add HBO/Cinamax. That is a great value, period. For those that have little to spend, the 50 package is very affordable. Yes, the Direct TC+ is a very good deal - as I alluded to in my post above- both have their strong points. I also love how you again ignore that Direct did increase prices $2 on other packages. They must be doing their homework well, because they have been adding more subs than Direct.

[TerryC]

abc_charlie, I never thought of that. Sounds like a reasonable theory as to why Charlie isn't agreeing to add YES. He can't afford it. :)

[Cheyenne]

It does not make good business sense adding a channel that
has little to no value on the market at the present rate requested.
I know this contradicts many of your views, but this is of fact.
Perhaps YES could be added IF they come to the table with reasonable offer.

[tampa8]

Apparently, if you want to believe that Dish cannot afford to get YES as some are postulating, Direct is having bad financial problems too. They do not seem to be able to keep ABCFAMILY. What other reason could there be??

[jeffwtux]

dbronstein: That's why I specifically stated "existing customers". Well, I guess at least there won't be any lies about DirecTV having similiar price hikes. I diffused that lie for a while.

[juan ellitinez]

I do believe existing direct tv customers had to agree to a one year contract extension

[jeffwtux]

6YES isn't the issue. Forget about YES. DirecTV TC has more channels than AT100(not including YES) at the same price. TC+ with locals was WAY more channels than AT100 with locals at the same price. NOT INCLUDING YES. How can anybody say that Charlie is actually holding rates down??? I don't want to hear YES mentioned. All you are doing is trying to change the subject. Sure AT150 gives you even more channels than TC+, but it is way more money. Unless, you TRUELY value HBO and Cinemax or have ClubDish certificates DirecTV is the better value as an EXISTING CUSTOMER. I'm not talking about me personally either. I pay like $11/month for AT100 + Starz+ ATL Fox+ Den Fox(Detroit 62 CBS rejects my CBS waiver always) because I have ClubDish credits. Nobody can beat that deal. Maybe ClubDish is the culprit. Maybe I'm the reason Dish Has to raise their rates? I just know it's not YES.

[dbronstein]

Originally posted by jeffwtux
dbronstein: That's why I specifically stated "existing customers". Well, I guess at least there won't be any lies about DirecTV having similiar price hikes. I diffused that lie for a while.

And "existing customers" are the ones paying $500 for 721s or considering paying even more for 921s when they are released and buying other receivers and switches and so on. I was a customer for over 2 years when I bought my 721. If you don't think your satellite company is stable, you're probably not going to spend money on equipment you think could be useless in 6 months.

Dennis

[jeffwtux]

Now as for the $600 million. Didn't they also get compensated somewhere very close to $600 million from another investor who was in on this deal? I know that was in a not as talked about Reuters story. Plus, they aren't going to pass on the costs of the $600 million to the customers. They just wrote it off on their quarterly statement and the shareholders ate it. However, even with that, DISH is in far better financial shape than Direct and has been the better investment no doubt. THIS ISN'T A STOCKPICKING BOARD!!! People constantly get mixed up about these 2 perspectives these days.

[BobMurdoch]

OR. He is just pricing things to actually make, <gasp> a profit. The long term viability of E* is better than D* which just made ANOTHER blunder by overpaying for the NFL again. They can either continue to lose money or they can try to become a company that is viable in the long term. Rest assured that once Rupert takes over, prices will rise to make sure that he makes a "fair and reasonable" profit in his opinion.

[FTA Michael]

Why doesn't Dish pay for Yes? Let's look at the counter-argument: why should Dish pay for Yes? That is, what would Dish gain?

By now, anyone desperate for their Yankees has already defected to D* or cable last year. Most folks signing up with DBS/cable to see more Yankees games did it last year. For how many Dish subscribers would Yes mean the difference between staying and going?

I guarantee that the E* folks have some estimates in print (internally) with the numbers of how many subscribers Yes would bring them and how much it would cost. And according to their numbers, it isn't worth the price Yes wants.

It's no fun if you're a Yankee fan in Connecticut with a bundle invested in Dish equipment, but that's the way it is. If I were there, I'd have switched to D* weeks ago.

And a reminder, Dish's prices have next to nothing to do with its merger settlement or the cost of HBO or the rise in Denver water rates. It has everything to do with maximizing profits, based on how much subscribers are willing to pay.

[abc_charlie]

I'm willing to pay 2 extra bucks for YES. I'm already paying 2 extra bucks for nothing.

[abc_charlie]

3 days away before the beginning of the Yankee season. Still no word on whether YES will be on Dish Network.

It looks like I will have to go back to cablevision.....DAM!

[DChristmann]

Can somebody please tell me why I should give a flying flip about whether or not DISH has YES?

It's not that I'm not a sports fan. I am a sports fan. A BIG sports fan. But I don't live anywhere near New York, and even I got it in the Multi-Sport Package, all the Nets and Yankees game (which I really don't care about) are gonna be blacked out. So that pretty much leaves Mike and the Mad Dog and Manchester United.

Oooooooooooooooooooooooh. Now that's a channel I gotta have. :rolleyes:

Yeah, pardon me if I'm not too bummed about not putting money in King George's pockets for stuff I don't care about or can't see.

You provincial New Yorkers need to take it to www.tristatedishownersbitchandmoanaboutyes.com and stop pretending that the rest of the country gives a rip.

[motjes2]

Satellite TV provider EchoStar is asking Mayor Bloomberg to intervene in its dispute with the YES Network.

Here is the entire article:

ECHOSTAR ASKS MAYOR TO MEDIATE YES FIGHT (http://www.nypost.com/business/72005.htm)

[tampa8]

Originally posted by motjes2


Here is the entire article:

ECHOSTAR ASKS MAYOR TO MEDIATE YES FIGHT (http://www.nypost.com/business/72005.htm)

I'm not sure I like government getting involved even informally. That said, Echostar puts the pressure more on Yes than on itself by saying it only wants what a competitor got. When these channels want a price out of the realm of other like channels, A La Carte is probably the way to go.

[DCSholtis]

Well guess what guys the Cablevision deal fell thru.....No Yankee baseball on TV unless you have D* in NYC

[juan ellitinez]

Wellll maybey Charlie knew more about the yes deal than we did...

[jeffwtux]

At some point, the Yankees(and Nets) must be hurting from this.... right? I mean the #1 reason by far that they've been able to have the largest payroll and make the most money has been from their local TV deal, well they can't be making the most from their local TV deal right now.

[cnsf]

Originally posted by DCSholtis
Well guess what guys the Cablevision deal fell thru.....No Yankee baseball on TV unless you have D* in NYC

Where did you see this???? Link???

[cnsf]

Found it....

http://breakingnews.nypost.com/dynamic/stories/B/BBA_CABLEVISION_YES?SITE=NYNYP&SECTION=SPORTS

Amazing......

[tampa8]

Originally posted by jeffwtux
At some point, the Yankees(and Nets) must be hurting from this.... right? I mean the #1 reason by far that they've been able to have the largest payroll and make the most money has been from their local TV deal, well they can't be making the most from their local TV deal right now.

Very good point. If, and I only say if Cablevision and Dish stick to their positions what does YES (Yankees, Nets) do? Is YES stuck with what they are asking for because this is truly their cost with little profit, or are they just playing their cards? Do they think enough people would switch to DIRECT for YES? (I don't pretend to know if enough would switch or not but I suspect not.)

[Bill D]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by DChristmann
[B]Can somebody please tell me why I should give a flying flip about whether or not DISH has YES?

It's not that I'm not a sports fan. I am a sports fan. A BIG sports fan. But I don't live anywhere near New York, and even I got it in the Multi-Sport Package, all the Nets and Yankees game (which I really don't care about) are gonna be blacked out. So that pretty much leaves Mike and the Mad Dog and Manchester United.

QUOTE]

You shouldn't care, but those of us that live in the Ny area and would like to watch any of the sports teams in the area deserve to see the RSN's that carry them. Just like you would expect Dish or any operator to carry any locals in your area they should also carry any RSN's. YES has two and soon 3 of the sports teams in the area. Meanwhile MSG and FSNY are owned by the same company just water done each of their own programming to keep the networks alive. I understand that people outside of the NY area don't want a raise in rates if they carry YES, I agree raise the rates in the NY area only if at all.. And those of you who hate sports and don't want to pay the increase I'm sure there is some channel thats been added over the years that you love and others hate. Ideally YES should have been a premium service on all cable and satellite operators. But the cable operators I think made deals to quickly, if they all would have stuck together YES would have had to change it's asking price.

[John T]

I got a kick from listening to WFAN this afternoon where they chatted with Dolan, Hindry and the mediator. It seems everyone is on the same page except for ONE prominent YES board member (or investor) who insists on changing the March 12th agreement. It might be George, it might not be.

I think it does vindicate Cablevision somewhat and sheds some light on what DishNetwork is dealing with. What a roller-coaster.

Ironic that WFAN ran some 'WIZ going out of business' commercials (during the program) for this weekend. Scratches head, wonders if some 50% off HDTV's are available. They made it sound that way. (edit: Cablevision owns the WIZ)

DChristmann, its OK to not care bout' NY sports but we're all fish in the same bowl. Does Clemmens (a Texan) winning his 300th mean anything to fellow Texans? Flip side of that, I'm sure lots of northeast people will suddenly be following the Dallas Cowboys for obvious reasons.

[DCSholtis]

John T you should have seen Mike and the MadDog on YES...was even funnier when they realized YES cut the feed during the Dolan interview....Priceless

[dbronstein]

Originally posted by Bill D
You shouldn't care, but those of us that live in the Ny area and would like to watch any of the sports teams in the area deserve to see the RSN's that carry them. Just like you would expect Dish or any operator to carry any locals in your area they should also carry any RSN's.

So Dish and Cablevision and everyone else should be required to carry YES at a loss? That's just plain ridiculous.

I don't understand why you guys keep insisting on making this all Charlie's fault. From the reports I have read, he has made several reasonable offers and YES has refused them because they want to dictate what package it's in and what Dish charges for it.

Charlie realizes that if he accepts their terms, he'll piss off more people by making them pay for YES when they don't want it than he'll satisfy who do want it.

Dennis

[Bill D]

I agree it does seem like YES is really the problem in all of this, but my feelings are all of Dish's competition has the channel except cablevision. Regardless of whether it was a good business deal for them or not they carry YES. which to me makes Dish look bad and most likely will make me jump to Directv and have to sell my 721 which I really don't want to do..

[cnsf]

I agree it appears YES is the bad guy here, but Bill D does make a good point that in the end, it doesn't really matter. Dish will end up looking like the holdout.

[raj2001]

Originally posted by DCSholtis
Well guess what guys the Cablevision deal fell thru.....No Yankee baseball on TV unless you have D* in NYC

YES is on Time Warner cable. Most of NYC is served by Time Warner. Cablevision just serves parts of The Bronx, Brooklyn and Long Island, as well as parts of New Jersey.

[DCSholtis]

Point well taken Raj...I messed up on that one...

[tampa8]

Originally posted by raj2001


YES is on Time Warner cable. Most of NYC is served by Time Warner. Cablevision just serves parts of The Bronx, Brooklyn and Long Island, as well as parts of New Jersey.

And from what I can tell all of Southwestern Connecticut, where the largest population of CT is. I don't think you can minimize the impact of Cablevision not carrying it. When you say "just serves parts of ..." that is quite a large population.

If Dish is viewed as the bad guy, then by who? The subs in Kansas? Florida? No, just SOME of those subs that are in the YES viewing area. I just don't see how Dish loses on this one IF it means the difference of keeping the current prices or raising prices for everyone. I will say, if Dish is given the chance to carry it as a separate choice with no subscription guarantee, they should offer it even if the price seems high to them. In that case let the consumer decide. But doesn't it make sense that is not the case? There has to be a subscription guarantee or YES will not let them offer it as a separate channel, or something along those lines. Perhaps Charlie had an agreement and they backed out as they did with cablevision.

[Greg Bimson]

I don't understand why you guys keep insisting on making this all Charlie's fault. From the reports I have read, he has made several reasonable offers and YES has refused them because they want to dictate what package it's in and what Dish charges for it.And how would this be any different than other programmers?

[pez2002]

does anyone think Comcast will buy Yes & rename it Comcast Sportsnet New York ????



Directv Is Better then dish you got a problem with that





dbstalk.com the Place for everything DBS



Go ahead scott sue me :lol: :lol:

[Scott Greczkowski]

Originally posted by pez2002
Directv Is Better then dish you got a problem with that


In this case DirecTV is better the Dish if your a Yankee fan, I am not so I could care less about the Yankees on Dish. :)

And no, I am not going to sue you for telling the truth about DBSTalk. :) (Believe it or not DBSTalks first name was Everything DBS) :D

[pez2002]

Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski


In this case DirecTV is better the Dish if your a Yankee fan, I am not so I could care less about the Yankees on Dish. :)

And no, I am not going to sue you for telling the truth about DBSTalk. :) (Believe it or not DBSTalks first name was Everything DBS) :D




Oh i see your a mets Fan Right :hi:

[Scott Greczkowski]

Hell no. Red Sox Fan (ducking) :lol:

[DCSholtis]

Naw Scott is really a closet Indians Fan...Tell the truth here, Scott...:lol:

[dbronstein]

Originally posted by Bill D
I agree it does seem like YES is really the problem in all of this, but my feelings are all of Dish's competition has the channel except cablevision. Regardless of whether it was a good business deal for them or not they carry YES. which to me makes Dish look bad and most likely will make me jump to Directv and have to sell my 721 which I really don't want to do..

"all of Dish's competition" is DirecTV, Cablevision, and Time Warner. It's not like there are 10 carriers and only Dish and Cablevision don't have it, there are only two that actually have it, according to what has been posted here.

Dish doesn't really care if they look bad, they just care about the bottom line. And I'm sure they figure that the number of subs they will lose from not carrying Yes doesn't hurt the bottom line as much as accepting Yes' terms would.

Dennis

[dbronstein]

Originally posted by Greg Bimson
And how would this be any different than other programmers?

Dish doesn't just accept the terms that any other network tries to force on them, so why should they do it for Yes?

[motjes2]

I usually listen to Mike and the Mad Dog on WFAN but did not on Friday. I listened to Jim Dolan, Yes, and the Mediator interview with Mike and Mad Dog on real audio on www.wfan.com.

I am a Yankee fan but it is clear that YES is the one that does not care about the Fan and it's looking at making more than just a profit! I do not think any Yankee fan should put pressure on E* or Cablevision on this matter. The pressure should be on YES. They are the one holding out on us, the fans.

I wouldn't like anybody other Yankee fans to pay for the Channel and I now agree with Cablevision and E* for making it this way. YES wants to take advantage of the situation (being the Yankees). I rather watch the Mets than the Yankees at this point. The Yankees (the whole franchise) are making it very difficult for me.

It is not a big loss anyomore if I E* or Cablevision do not carry them. I want to see YES on E* but ONLY IF THEY DO THE RIGHT THING.

[DCSholtis]

YES offers a new deal to Cablevision....

http://www.yesnetwork.com/news/index.cfm?section=main&cont_id=44652&table_name=ap_cont_text&table_cd=a&right_include=/customtags/dsp_local_news_module.cfm

[juan ellitinez]

Does anybody know what the old deal was?

[Greg Bimson]

I don't understand why you guys keep insisting on making this all Charlie's fault. From the reports I have read, he has made several reasonable offers and YES has refused them because they want to dictate what package it's in and what Dish charges for it.

And how would this be any different than other programmers?Dish doesn't just accept the terms that any other network tries to force on them, so why should they do it for Yes?Are you kidding me? Disney dictates that ESPN is in the lowest available package, and the price. Take a look at every single programming issue that Dish Network has had. Don't tell me Dish Network got to pick where the channels go. Take a good look at National Geographic Channel, to understand what I mean.

Why do you think otherwise?

Come on. This latest offer from YES to Cablevision is that YES is placed in the "basic tier", and costs $2.12 per subscriber, just like Comcast and Time Warner agreed.

Charlie will not get YES unless he agrees to those terms. Because they aren't so different terms than anyone else has.

[dbronstein]

Originally posted by Greg Bimson
Charlie will not get YES unless he agrees to those terms. Because they aren't so different terms than anyone else has.

And to use an old, tired line from our parents - if Comcast and Time Warner and Direc all jumped off a bridge should Dish do it as well? Just because other carriers caved to Yes doesn't mean Dish should.

If Charlie thought he would make money or at least break even with the terms Yes is proposing, he would've signed a long time ago. But he knows he'll lose money on it.

I don't live in the NY area and I'm not a Yankee fan so I really don't give a rats ass about it. But I find it hilarious to hear people crying "it's no fair - I can't watch the Yankees because dish isn't willing to lose money."

Dennis

[Guest]

Your right on dbronstein.

Why should E (and eventually the customers) have to be the one to have to take the financial hit?
YES refusing to open their books to binding arbitration is just covering up how much of a killing they will be making at 2.12/subscriber. Sure there are cost related to production but nothing near 2.12/subscriber. And YES is not exactly breaking the bank on additional programing with the college basketball and Oregon football replays.

[DCSholtis]

No but they are breaking the bank on NJ Nets and in a year or so the NJ Devils programming

[Greg Bimson]

If Charlie thought he would make money or at least break even with the terms Yes is proposing, he would've signed a long time ago. But he knows he'll lose money on it.Not that he'll lose money. That he'd have to pay for a third New York City area RSN. Which will cost money.

I'm not terribly disagreeing. What I am saying is that with many more of the baseball/hockey/basketball teams looking to create their own RSN's, you will see this problem with more RSN's being created.

Dish Network has put their foot down. And, as we have now seen, with YES putting the kibosh on their recent agreement w/ Cablevision, many of the smaller teams will have to rethink their ability to create a new outlet.

My only question now is when does Dish Network feel that they'd be better off without ESPN? I am waiting for one of these carriers to make a stand against Disney. And I think the only one that has any modicum of support would be Dish Network.

[Rusty]

Many of you must be personal acquaintances of Mr. Ergen since you always refer to him as "Charlie". If this is the case, why don't you simply ask him for the information that you seek. I'm sure your' pal will be happy to tell you why he isn't carrying YES.

[juan ellitinez]

How come Direct tv can carry 4 rsn's for theNew York market(foxny,msg,empire,yes) and still charge less for their 100 channel package?(less than at 100)

[dbronstein]

Originally posted by Greg Bimson
I'm not terribly disagreeing. What I am saying is that with many more of the baseball/hockey/basketball teams looking to create their own RSN's, you will see this problem with more RSN's being created.

Dish Network has put their foot down. And, as we have now seen, with YES putting the kibosh on their recent agreement w/ Cablevision, many of the smaller teams will have to rethink their ability to create a new outlet.

I think the teams will find out pretty quickly that the market isn't going to support a separate RSN for each team. NY/NJ is in a unique position because it has 9 pro teams in the 4 major sports, so they could have 2 or 3 RSNs with 2 or 3 teams on each, which gives them a bit more clout. But as we're seeing, even the Yankees are having problems getting their network carried. So you know it's a tough sell.


My only question now is when does Dish Network feel that they'd be better off without ESPN? I am waiting for one of these carriers to make a stand against Disney. And I think the only one that has any modicum of support would be Dish Network.

There's no comparison between Yes and ESPN. ESPN is a national network that has the NFL. THere's no way Dish could take the hit from all the subs they'd lose.

Dennis

[Brett]

NY/NJ is in a unique position because it has 9 pro teams in the 4 major sports, so they could have 2 or 3 RSNs with 2 or 3 teams on each, which gives them a bit more clout.

There are also multiple cable providers in NY market (Time Warner and Cablevision). So YES can have carriage on Time Warner, RCN, and Comcast, not be on Cablevision, but still be operational and making money.

In Philadelphia market, Comcast owns and operates basically the entire market percentagewise. Except Allentown and a small part of Philly that gets TW, or RCN. In many of the other markets, there is clustering. FCC doesnt care about this - if one cable system controls the local market. Atleast here there are some benefits. Comcast has upgraded the market (and offers digital cable and high speed internet). The synergies of owning the local systems and operating the fiber ring does bring benefits, but Comcast also controls which channels are added to each lineup.

[Ronmort]

Actually this would be a great time for Dish to add YES. It would give Dish an opportunity to tap into the second wave of Cablevision defectors. I'm sure there are others who will now seek another outlet to get the Yankees. Furthermore, it would be a moral victory for YES to get on the Dish line-up in order to isolate Cablevision as the only hold out.

[John T]

The recent negotiations were forced by the NYC Mayor. Now that George has played games with them, the mayor should play games right back. Pull the lease on the stadium, offer it to NJ.

When you're deal with billionares, you gotta get tough.

Do the same with Cablevision. Pull the lease on MSG, radio city etc.

[BobMurdoch]

Originally posted by dbronstein


Dish doesn't just accept the terms that any other network tries to force on them, so why should they do it for Yes?

I agree with this. I'm a Mets fan so maybe I'm a little jaded, but why is E* REQUIRED to pay whatever price George wishes?

The whole controversy goes away if George agrees to let it on via a la carte pricing. The $4.95 sports pak seemed like a good compromise that Cablevision and Bloomberg negotiated. I guess it was too good a deal. Maybe now the spotlight will shift to George for scotching the deal. Up until he has been able to paint Cablevision as the bad guy. Don't wait for Bloomberg to attack George (he might threaten to move to Jersey again), but Cablevision and the media should start turning on George for his heavy handed tactics.

[jeffwtux]

Greg Brimson: I totally agree. The new NBA contract is an outrage, and should've attracted majore anti-trust attention. If suscribers could've chosen to take all ESPN EXCEPT the NBA, which probably has 1/3 the cost right now, I'm sure they would. NBC LOST MONEY on their last NBA contract, that's why they ditched it. Now ESPN/Disney offers even more money?!?!? Instead of paying for it with a fair and capitalistic advertising plan, like NBC, they will pay for it by charging captive cable/DBS subscribers, who must take the NBA if they want the people want the NFL, NHL, MLB, College BB, and College Fcheaper programming ESPN offers like NHL, coollege hoops, college FB... which makes it nearly impossible to ditch. I definitely agree though. Somebody must stand up to this or salaries will never be held in check. Cable/DBS subscriber revenue is pretty much a bottomless source of revenue for ESPN. However, I just want to make sure that EVERBODY HAS the SAME ROTTEN DEAL. WideOpenWest and other lucky cable companies better not be getting any breaks. Perhaps they could all appeal to the courts and collude the same way ESPN has done with their monopoly in sports.

[rolou21]

**UPDATE**
Cablevision reaches carriage agreement for 1 year with binding arbitration set for April 2004. Agreement comes 2 hours before game time. NYC subscribers can watch Yes on channel 89.....

[DCSholtis]

Its Funny ....I guess the State Attorney General gets credit for brokering that deal from reading some stories on it...

[abc_charlie]

I hope the Attorney General Eliot Spitzer can help dish network get a deal with YES!

http://www.nyyfans.com/article/7790/

[DChristmann]

Originally posted by John T
DChristmann, its OK to not care bout' NY sports but we're all fish in the same bowl.
It's not that I don't care about NY sports, it's that I wouldn't be able to see anything worth watching even if DISH did carry it. Yankees? Blacked out. Nets? Blacked out.

Like I said, I'd get to see Mike and the Mad Dog and Manchester United, even if I did get it. Sorry if that's not enough to make me take up arms against DISH.

Granted, my perspective is a bit different than it would be for people in the Tri-State area. But let's have a little perspective here. If you're in the Tri-State area and you've got DISH, then yeah, I can imagine that DISH's not carrying YES is a major source of annoyance to you. But for DISH's subscribers in the rest of the country, does it merit all the melodramatic language that's been used? Not in the least.
Does Clemmens (a Texan) winning his 300th mean anything to fellow Texans?
No. In fact, he and I are fellow UT alums, and it still doesn't mean anything to me. The fact of the matter is that he's spent the last 20 years in Boston, Toronto, and New York. The only time his origins ever come up is when he's trying to yank the Rangers' or Astros' chains to drive up his price.

But even if I were interested, I wouldn't be able to see Roger Clemens in action. I'd be blacked out.

[Mad_YES]

So is Dish Network still telling yankee and net fans to switch to DTV like they did last year? Are they ever going to get this channel?

I think sports fans might be the majority of the people that get satellite TV. Why is Dish Network taking so long to get this done?

Since it seems that there company doesn't give a dam about sport fans, why even keep msg and fsny? Get rid of them and lower our dish bills! We NY sports fans lost Yankee and Nets from the Dish Network system; shouldn’t we get a $2 reduction on our bill? There is no YES on the system so I can’t see why I am paying $2 extra dollars for.

[FTA Michael]

Originally posted by Mad_YES
I think sports fans might be the majority of the people that get satellite TV.Wow, you sure wouldn't know it by some of the posts I see here! If I had a dollar for every "wish I didn't have to pay for all these crummy sports" posts I see, it would pay for my Sports package.:D

[John T]

Anyone catch the MSG 3rd period + OT between the Isles & Rangers last night?

Great stuff.

[Guest]

OK I think it’s a bad thing that YES is not on Dish Network. Who is to blame for this happening Dish Network or YES? I hear things like cheap Charlie. Is he really that cheap?

Also why does DTV have it and not Dish Network? Is Dish network having financial problems that they can't afford Yes? Aren't Dish and DTV competitors? Don’t you guys think that it would be in the best interest of Dish Network to get this station for the NY/NJ area (one of the biggest markets in the US)?

Did many people in the NY/NJ area dump Dish for DTV just because DTV has the YES Network? Is there a site that has information on the number of people in the Ny/NJ area that has DTV compared to Dish Network?

[TNGTony]

Vivendi paid Dish back $420 to $460 million dollars for their part of having to back out of the deal. Also there were several other companies that paid Dish cash back for the same reason. Don't muddle their arguments with facts. :)

See ya
Tony

[crkeehn]

Do I think it's in the best interest of Dish to get this channel for the NY/NJ area.

No, not if I have to pay either directly or indirectly.

If there is no additional charge added to NY/NJ subscribers then the cost is being spread over the entire customer base. I have no interest in paying for YES.

[juan ellitinez]

Since Mr Ergin cant cut a deal to carry the yankee's,devils and nets..the only FAIR thing to do is to discontinue all New York sports programming and cut everyone's rates by 2 dollars..

[waydwolf]

Originally posted by tampa8


And from what I can tell all of Southwestern Connecticut, where the largest population of CT is.

Darien, Easton, Greenwich, New Canaan, Norwalk, Redding, Stamford, Weston, Westport, Wilton, Cornwall, Goshen, Litchfield, Morris, Thomaston, Torrington, Warren, Watertown, Bridgeport, Fairfield, Milford, Orange, Stratford, and Woodbridge are the towns in CT served by Cablevision.

Just in case anyone wondered.

[RichW]

I used to be an avid sports fan. One of the reasons I bought a DBS system was for sports. But since the baseball strike a few years ago, combined with the horrendous behavior of a lot of NBA players and some NFL players, I found that I quickly became disinterested in watching pro sports. Now I very rarely watch a sporting event. I didn't even tune into the Super Bowl this year.

And you know what? I found I had tremendously more time for other activities. I lost about 25 poounds because I no longer have an excuse to just sit around and snack while watching a game. I am out in the garden or hiking in the woods instead.
I am not anti-sports, but the draw of pro sports has gone from my life.

While the YES controversy doesn't effect me directly, Paul Allen has been tryign to force his network onto carriers in my area with the same type of PR - that the carriers are "deprivng the sports fan". Yet these channels are unwilling to go ala carte, because the reality is that few people really care enough about sports channels to pay a large premium for them.