ViP622/ViP722 - L6.13 Software Experiences/Bugs Discussion

[Rob Glasser]

L6.13 has started to spool to some ViP622/ViP722 customers. Please use this thread for discussing your experiences and bugs with this release.

Release notes can be found here (http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=137926).

[RasputinAXP]

HOORAY!!!!!

# Fix for the video only taking up 1/8 of the screen in the corner.

[barryaz1]

L6.13 has started to spool to some ViP622/ViP722 customers. Please use this thread for discussing your experiences and bugs with this release.

Release notes can be found here (http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=137926).

So the Release notes say some 1080p fixes. Will Sony TV's now work? :confused:

[Rob Glasser]

So the Release notes say some 1080p fixes. Will Sony TV's now work? :confused:

Sorry, I don't have anymore details. I would just suggest trying and see. If you do test, please post your findings here so others know.

Thank you.

[NetMXer]

Is there any way to force my receiver to download L6.13 or do I just have to wait until E* is ready to send it to me?

[barryaz1]

Sorry, I don't have anymore details. I would just suggest trying and see. If you do test, please post your findings here so others know.

Thank you.
Of course, although I've been pretty late in the update queue

[Rob Glasser]

Is there any way to force my receiver to download L6.13 or do I just have to wait until E* is ready to send it to me?

You have to wait. Echostar targets ranges of receivers, until your receiver is in the ranges they are targeting you will not get it. You can not force it to update to software you are not targeted for.

[phrelin]

Sigh. I have ongoing communications with Dish and San Francisco's ABC station. I just sent the following email to both: Well, here's the update. I can say with great confidence that your update L6.13 did nothing to alter the audio dropout situation. I recorded the 11:00 am local news on KGO 7 ABC. Live there were no problems. But recorded I had audio dropouts.

If you do communicate with KGO engineering, for specificity I can report that some dropout began in the weather portion beginning as the weather guy gave the temperature for Livermore and for a few seconds after that point the number of audio dropouts were enough to make the report worthless were he not standing next to a weather map.

The weird thing is I hooked a boom box up to the RCA audio outs and still get dropouts. But not exactly in the same place though still during the same general time frame on the weather.So L6.13 didn't solve the intermittent audio dropout problem that we're also discussing on the Bay Area Folks: Audio drops on Fox and ABC (http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=133727) thread. I'm still hoping that if they can focus on one data stream coming into their system they might find the problem.

[kucharsk]

Strange that they're rolling out 6.13 in a phased fashion, as the last two releases were blasted out to anyone powering off their receiver.

Currently I've got one 6.12 and one 6.13 722.

[Rob Glasser]

Phased releases are typical. My guess is, this way if a problem is discovered post release they can stop the release until fixes can be made.

The only time, lately, that I've seen a release spool to everyone at once is when it's a special release to fix a widespread issue.

[thefunks67]

HOORAY!!!!!

# Fix for the video only taking up 1/8 of the screen in the corner.

What does this mean?

-Funk

[Rob Glasser]

What does this mean?

-Funk

There was a bug where after going through some menus that have a preview window of the video stream, where the video stays at the size and location of the preview window even after exiting the menu. Basically most of your TV is a black screen with a small video window in the upper right hand corner of your TV.

[RasputinAXP]

There was a bug where after going through some menus that have a preview window of the video stream, where the video stays at the size and location of the preview window even after exiting the menu. Basically most of your TV is a black screen with a small video window in the upper right hand corner of your TV.

Also, if you used TV2 and changed ratios from Zoom to Widescreen, the same thing would happen but in the upper left. Really annoying.

[DAG]

Got this update at around noon today. The mini screen bug seems to be gone!

[audiomaster]

I got a replacement 622 four days ago (old one had no HDMI and off air tuner died. Everything was OK till this AM when, after about an hour of OK operation the box started endlessly rebooting. Power cord reset did not work. I don't know if the box got hit by new software last night or not and I can't check now cause it won't boot!
Anybody else seen this? If not, I guess it's get another box.

[zuffy]

No update yet :( Can't wait to get the mini screen fixed so I can switch back to dual mode.

[phatal]

Just tested viewing 1080p VOD with my Sony KDS-R60XBR2. No dice. Still doesn't work. :confused: So what did they actually fix? Has anyone confirmed they were able to view I Am Legend in 1080p via E* VOD?

I'll have to wait till my other 622 gets the upgrade before I can test my other display.

[phrelin]

Regarding my post above (#8), I sent my original and subsequent emails to Dish Quality and to Tech with a copy to ceo@. I then had interactions with Dish Quality providing technical information, including the one posted above (the others are posted on the Bay Area thread referred to above). This morning I received the standard email from Tech in response to my original email. The Tech form email is what I call the "busy work" email asking for information that they should be able to get off their own systems. Here is my response: Dear tech@echostar.com:

It appears that you do not have my ongoing correspondence with dishquality@echostar with more technical information as part of your file on my original email. So I have included that information below. Here also is the information you requested in your non-case-specific form email.

• Model ID: ViP722 DVR HD
• Software Version: L6.13
• Receiver CA ID: R00XXXXXXXX-XX
• Smart Card CA: S19XXXXXXXX-XX

This is the information associated with our account which is also associated with our phone number XXX-XXX-XXXX.

I am also copying this to dishquality@echostar and ceo@dishnetwork so everyone is on the same page.

It was very disappointing the L6.13 didn't address this problem. Hopefully, L6.14 will be released over the weekend solving this problem as Fox is starting their new season Monday.

Me

[Schizm]

Strange that they're rolling out 6.13 in a phased fashion, as the last two releases were blasted out to anyone powering off their receiver.

Currently I've got one 6.12 and one 6.13 722.

I didn't receive 6.12 until last week. I even ran a few Check Switches and power cycled my 622. I guess my 622 is in the very last phase :(

[phrelin]

Just got this:
Dear Us,

Thank you for your research and prompt response! We realized that our response from yesterday was misleading. We should have clarified that today's partial release of L613 might contain a fix for these audio dropouts. We have since learned that L613 does not address this particular issue and we know that engineering continues to research the matter on a daily basis.

That said, the information you provided today is exactly what we needed and it's on the way to our software teams now. These folks are researching this issue on a daily basis and we are confident that it will be fixed as quickly as possible.

Again, thank you for your patience and the time you have taken so far in helping us figure this out.

Kind regards,

EchoStar Technologies LLC
Quality Assurance Department
dishquality@echostar.com

[Larry Kenney]

Just tested viewing 1080p VOD with my Sony KDS-R60XBR2. No dice. Still doesn't work. :confused: So what did they actually fix? Has anyone confirmed they were able to view I Am Legend in 1080p via E* VOD?


I have the new L6.13 software and 1080p will still not work on my Sony XBR4 LCD. 1080i is the best it shows in the HDMI test.

Larry
SF

[Redlinetire]

Just got this:

I'm not clear as to why you expected the audio issues to be addressed in this release?

The Release Notes mention nothing about it.... :confused:

[Rob Glasser]

... Has anyone confirmed they were able to view I Am Legend in 1080p via E* VOD?


I have watched it on my Pioneer Kuro Plasma, with 1080p support.

[phrelin]

I'm not clear as to why you expected the audio issues to be addressed in this release?

The Release Notes mention nothing about it.... :confused:It wasn't because of the release notes. Here's part of what I was sent from Dish Quality: We are aware of these audio issues and our engineering folks are actively working on them. In fact, the software team plans to partially release software version L613 pretty soon, perhaps this week or next week. We will test our department's receiver(s) once they're hit with new software. Would you mind helping us test the software by answering these questions - as observed by you - both before and after your receivers are upgraded? So dumbly, I thought something related was going to happen as a result of L6.13.:(

[kucharsk]

They're definitely phasing 6.13; I got the last two updates in the same night on both my boxes, but 48 hours later one of my 722s is still at 6.12.

[tnsprin]

They're definitely phasing 6.13; I got the last two updates in the same night on both my boxes, but 48 hours later one of my 722s is still at 6.12.

722's have usually been in the first phase of the roll outs. But 622's have been multi phase for all the recent versions. Most 622 users never saw L6.10 or L6.11.

[BobaBird]

The only 622 users who saw L610 were those who also had a 722 ;) as that was the only receiver to get it per RandallA's software uplinks tracking. There was no L611, at least not in public release, for either model.

[olguy]

I have the new L6.13 software and 1080p will still not work on my Sony XBR4 LCD. 1080i is the best it shows in the HDMI test.

Larry
SF
I had IAL on screen at 1080p on my Toshiba and ran the HDMI test out of curiosity. Same result. It did not show 1080p. I guess the only way to know is to run the test for showing IAL.

[EXTACAMO]

Have had my leased 622 for over 2yrs. now. Its worked almost flawlessly. Been using the component connections since the box was installed. Now with the introduction of TURBO HD I decided to finally make the switch to HDMI. After noting I had L6.13 I purchased the necessary cables from MonoPrice. Plugged in everything and NOTHING! My TV keep telling me to check the cable as it could see nothing connected to HDMI. I tried the usual fixes Feeding the TV directly, pulling the plug etc. nothing worked. I just figured the box had a bad HDMI port from day one and it took me 2yrs. to find out. I called E* and was pleasantly surprised. I got a csr on this side of the pond named Lisa. After going through some preliminary troubleshooting over the phone she determined that yes the HDMI port was bad and promptly arranged to ship me a new 622. So, I should have my new 622 in 5 to 10 days and hopefully this one will be as reliable as my last one. :)

[ImBack234]

Does anyone know if 6.13 can now play DishONLINE on TV2?

[kucharsk]

Still no L6.13 on one of my 722s.

However, I found my first bug:

If you leave the receiver on past its normal reboot time (when it presents the "shut off and download?" screen), with L6.13 the receiver will now shut itself "off" (reverting to the "You have been Turbocharged" screensaver and no audio) but the lights on the front panel will remain on - so the receiver looks on but in reality it's "off."

When you press the power button, the receiver comes back "on" but of course since the front panel LEDs were already on, they don't change state. After that, the LEDs work normally with the receiver power status as expected.

This is quite annoying, as I leave my 722 on past the normal "reboot" time on weekends as I've got Sirius audio going, and this weekend is the first time this ever happened.

How do we report bugs, just call DISH or is there a more formal route?

[AVJohnnie]

I use the TV1 S-Video outputs on both of my 622s to record to DVD recorders. I noticed that immediately after getting L6.13 on the newer (rev E) of my two 622s, it lost the TV1 S-Video color signal output, yet it still manages to output a b&w signal on the S-Video connection. I tried the TV1 composite video output and it seems to be outputting an out-of-range signal -- at least nothing I’ve tried will sync up on it. Fortunately the TV2 composite output still seems to function okay so I'm now using that instead.

All this prompted me to check my older (rev D) 622 and fortunately it’s still okay on all of its outputs, except for its HDMI port which has never functioned.

Since I’ve seen no other postings reporting a similar issue I’m assuming that it’s a hardware failure of some sort, and just a freak coincidence that it accompanied the L6.13 arrival.

[tnsprin]

I had IAL on screen at 1080p on my Toshiba and ran the HDMI test out of curiosity. Same result. It did not show 1080p. I guess the only way to know is to run the test for showing IAL.

I don't believe the HDMI test on the diagnosis screen will show if your Dish receiver recognizes your TV as supporting 1080P24. I believe it only runs the necessary tests if you tell it you are purchasing a 1080P Movie. So far my Sony 55A3000 fails that check. It is hooked to one of my 622's that is at L6.12.

[kstuart]

I use the TV1 S-Video outputs on both of my 622s to record to DVD recorders. I noticed that immediately after getting L6.13 on the newer (rev E) of my two 622s, it lost the TV1 S-Video color signal output, yet it still manages to output a b&w signal on the S-Video connection.

Over 15-20 years, that has happened to me about 50-100 times and it is always the S-Video plug coming very slightly loose from the jack (of course, it could be either end of the S-Video cable).

Worst Plug Ever.

PS I have lots of black-and-white S-VHS recordings of color programs due to this...

[DJ Lon]

However, I found my first bug:

If you leave the receiver on past its normal reboot time (when it presents the "shut off and download?" screen), with L6.13 the receiver will now shut itself "off" (reverting to the "You have been Turbocharged" screensaver and no audio) but the lights on the front panel will remain on - so the receiver looks on but in reality it's "off."

When you press the power button, the receiver comes back "on" but of course since the front panel LEDs were already on, they don't change state. After that, the LEDs work normally with the receiver power status as expected.

I can confirm this but I still have L6.12 software. Last night I fell asleep watching TV and the exact same thing happened to me as well.

[AVJohnnie]

Over 15-20 years, that has happened to me about 50-100 times and it is always the S-Video plug coming very slightly loose from the jack (of course, it could be either end of the S-Video cable).

Worst Plug Ever.

PS I have lots of black-and-white S-VHS recordings of color programs due to this...

Thanks for the response and it could well be – But it's not the S-Video cable since it still works fine with other equipment and other cables I've tried yield the same b&w results. So if that's the problem then it would have to be the TV1 S-Video connector on the 622 suddenly going bad. But then to also lose that 622's TV1 Composite output at the same time -- well, that's just a bit too coincidental in my book...

[kstuart]

Thanks for the response and it could well be – But it's not the S-Video cable since it still works fine with other equipment and other cables I've tried yield the same b&w results. So if that's the problem then it would have to be the TV1 S-Video connector on the 622 suddenly going bad. But then to also lose that 622's TV1 Composite output at the same time -- well, that's just a bit too coincidental in my book...

Just in case you have not tried it, I'll mention that it is helpful to do a "power cord pull" after a software update, i.e. when not recording anything, pull the AC power cord plug of the 622 out for 20-30 seconds and plug it back in.

I once had timer probelms after an update that no one else was reporting, and a power cord plug fixed it.

[AVJohnnie]

Just in case you have not tried it, I'll mention that it is helpful to do a "power cord pull" after a software update, i.e. when not recording anything, pull the AC power cord plug of the 622 out for 20-30 seconds and plug it back in.

I once had timer probelms after an update that no one else was reporting, and a power cord plug fixed it.

Thanks for the suggestion, but that's always the first thing I try. Guess I'll just not worry about it for now. If the TV2 Composite output also fails I'll be giving them a call and asking for a replacement.

[Mr5150]

Just got my 722 Fri 8-29, and got several 1/8 screen issues. Thought I was going crazy. Is the best way to insure download of 613 to leave receiver in standby mode? Is this a similar mode to off mode of my old 921 in off mode? Thanks, Larry

[Ron Barry]

Yes Larry... StandBy is basically Off mode for a DVR since DVRs really are never off unless you actually unplug them.

[digital223]

I have 613 for a few days. I have noticed extremely loud audio on some commercials, and when switching to some channels I have to increase the program volume.
I was wondering is anyone else experiencing this ?

[zuffy]

Still on version 6.12. Normally how many phases does it take Dish to complete the rollout?

[teddy]

I have discovered quite by accident that I can now get the 1080P VOD if I use component video. It does not work with HDMI. Apparently the problem is with our old friend, HDMI handshake issues.

I have:
VIP 622
firmware 6.12
Pioneer elite Kuro.

I'd be interested if it works for others.

:hurah:

P.S. Sorry for double posting.

[ImBack234]

Does anyone know if 6.13 can now play DishONLINE on TV2?
No it can not. Thanks dish.

[SE_Sooner]

My 622 downloaded 6.13 last night and all OTA signals are gone. I tried soft reset first, then hard reset, still no signal on any channel even one that comes in at 100 percent. Made sure tuner was still set to off air, it was. In the add local channel screen the signal is zero on all channels. If I delete them out, it won't add them back because there is no signal strength. Anyone else have this problem? Any suggestions/solutions.

Definition of Broke -- Worked last night doesn't work today!

[tnsprin]

My 622 downloaded 6.13 last night and all OTA signals are gone. I tried soft reset first, then hard reset, still no signal on any channel even one that comes in at 100 percent. Made sure tuner was still set to off air, it was. In the add local channel screen the signal is zero on all channels. If I delete them out, it won't add them back because there is no signal strength. Anyone else have this problem? Any suggestions/solutions.

Definition of Broke -- Worked last night doesn't work today!

I lost first one then all my OTA channels on one of mine. However they did come back after a hard reset.

[lwien]

Update:

Update on Sony A3000 not being able to pass compatibility tests with Dish 1080p content:

Thought that maybe software update L613 would fix the issue.

It didn't.

[space86]

My 722 and my 622 got 6.13 today.

[Captain_Sternn]

Both my 622 and 722 received 6.13 today.

I have a question about the 1080p VOD: Are all the HD VOD in 1080p or is there something that identifies it being in hd or 1080p??? Are 10,000 BC and The Bucket List offered in HD both in 1080p as well?

[fredp]

Both my 622 and 722 received 6.13 today.

I have a question about the 1080p VOD: Are all the HD VOD in 1080p or is there something that identifies it being in hd or 1080p??? Are 10,000 BC and The Bucket List offered in HD both in 1080p as well?
It will state 1080P in the title of the movie. There will also be a HD to the left of the title. The other offerings on 501(for me 16 of them) are just SD.

[Leprechuan]

I woke up to find I have L6.13.
I see no changes.

[teacher1066]

I have 613 for a few days. I have noticed extremely loud audio on some commercials, and when switching to some channels I have to increase the program volume.
I was wondering is anyone else experiencing this ?

My unit does exactly the same thing. It can be extremely jarring. I've taken to recording almost everything--including the news--and skipping the commercials on playback.
I am sorry if this is "off topic" but when I got a replacement 722 one of the software features I liked the most--placing multiple episodes of a single shoe in a folder--no longer works. Anyone else experience this? I wrote to Dish about it but their answer was so convoluted that itt made little sense to me.

[Mr5150]

I have discovered quite by accident that I can now get the 1080P VOD if I use component video. It does not work with HDMI. Apparently the problem is with our old friend, HDMI handshake issues.

I have:
VIP 622
firmware 6.12
Pioneer elite Kuro.

I'd be interested if it works for others.

:hurah:

P.S. Sorry for double posting.

Mine only works on my HDMI 722 not my component 722

[Rduce]

Still no L6.13 on one of my 722s.

However, I found my first bug:

If you leave the receiver on past its normal reboot time (when it presents the "shut off and download?" screen), with L6.13 the receiver will now shut itself "off" (reverting to the "You have been Turbocharged" screensaver and no audio) but the lights on the front panel will remain on - so the receiver looks on but in reality it's "off."

When you press the power button, the receiver comes back "on" but of course since the front panel LEDs were already on, they don't change state. After that, the LEDs work normally with the receiver power status as expected.

This is quite annoying, as I leave my 722 on past the normal "reboot" time on weekends as I've got Sirius audio going, and this weekend is the first time this ever happened.

How do we report bugs, just call DISH or is there a more formal route?

My 322 always did that so when I saw that my 722 did it I didn't think anything of it, so that's a bug??

[Captain_Sternn]

It will state 1080P in the title of the movie. There will also be a HD to the left of the title. The other offerings on 501(for me 16 of them) are just SD.

Hee hee, I now only have one listed right now, it's the Bucket List. It says HD in the channel list however says nothing about 1080p. I don't have any SD listings for VOD on 501 for my 722. Wonder why my 622 lists 6 or so SD VOD's while the 722 lists only 1 HD VOD.... hmmmm <scratches head>

[tymekeeper]

My 622 downloaded 6.13 last night and all OTA signals are gone. I tried soft reset first, then hard reset, still no signal on any channel even one that comes in at 100 percent. Made sure tuner was still set to off air, it was. In the add local channel screen the signal is zero on all channels. If I delete them out, it won't add them back because there is no signal strength. Anyone else have this problem? Any suggestions/solutions.

Definition of Broke -- Worked last night doesn't work today!

I've had this happen and I think what i did was go to a non local channel, ie espn and then go back and select a local and it worked. If it happens a gain i'll try to note more on what i did. thought it was just a local thing.

[SE_Sooner]

Thanks TymeKeeper. My problem now is that I deleted all the locals out and can't add them back in because the the signal strength is zero, nada. CSR made an engineering report and said to call back in 3 to 5 days to see if they had a solution. So I'm in a holding pattern.

I'll post the solution if ever I get one.

[daleles]

Is there any way to force my receiver to download L6.13 or do I just have to wait until E* is ready to send it to me?

Apparently, this is supposed to work:

-Push the MENU button on the remote control
-Choose SYSTEM SETUP option from the MAIN MENU
-Next select the INSTALLATION option from the SYSTEM SETUP menu
-Now choose POINT DISH from the INSTALLATION menu
-Make sure that the signal bar is green and indicates "Locked"
-Use the remote control to power the receiver off, and then wait about 15 minutes for the download.

This supposedly will force download the current software version.

daleles

[yovinman]

My 622 received 6.13 and it listed "10,000 BC" as 1080p (on channel 501). I chose to rent it to go through the test. I have a Westinghouse LVM-42W2 LCD monitor that supports 1080p. Well, the test said my display was not compatible with the resolution. Funny, since my Sony PS3 has no problems playing Blu-Ray discs in 1080p on this display. Not sure what the issue is, but I suspect it may have something to do with the 24fps thing or perhaps it is an HDMI handshake issue.

[Redwingsfan]

I got 6.13 yesterday and the only thing it's done is screw up the aspect ratio.
I have a 622.

[lujan]

My 622 received 6.13 and it listed "10,000 BC" as 1080p (on channel 501). I chose to rent it to go through the test. I have a Westinghouse LVM-42W2 LCD monitor that supports 1080p. Well, the test said my display was not compatible with the resolution. Funny, since my Sony PS3 has no problems playing Blu-Ray discs in 1080p on this display. Not sure what the issue is, but I suspect it may have something to do with the 24fps thing or perhaps it is an HDMI handshake issue.

I got the same thing. You need to answer "Yes" pretty fast after the test is done or it will keep bringing up this message.

[bloom]

I had a weird problem right after getting 6.13. When I would turn on the TV, I could not get a picture, simply a blank screen saying DVI in. To restore the picture, I had to unplug the DVI cable from the 722, and replug it in.

If I turned off the TV, and turned it back on, the problem reappeared - blank screen, no signal input.

I did a soft reboot, and the problem has not returned. I do not know if 6.13 has caused some new "HDMI handshake" issues, or if this is symptomatic of a hardware problem.

[GiBi]

My 622 received 6.13 and it listed "10,000 BC" as 1080p (on channel 501). I chose to rent it to go through the test. I have a Westinghouse LVM-42W2 LCD monitor that supports 1080p. Well, the test said my display was not compatible with the resolution. Funny, since my Sony PS3 has no problems playing Blu-Ray discs in 1080p on this display. Not sure what the issue is, but I suspect it may have something to do with the 24fps thing or perhaps it is an HDMI handshake issue.

Hi yovinman,

Your Westinghouse supports 1080p (1080/60p) but not 1080/24p which is what the receiver is testing for. Still, Dish knows there are compatability issues with other sets (more specifically Sony) that support 1080/24p.

[lwien]

Still, Dish knows there are compatability issues with other sets (more specifically Sony) that support 1080/24p.

They do???? I've reported this to Dish over 5 times, and EVERY time I call, they say that I am the first to have ever reported this, and that I needed to call Sony because there is something wrong with my TV even though my Sony accepts a 1080p/24 signal from my Blu-Ray.

Sony A3000.

[ChuckA]

Doesn't that hint to you they tell everyone this is the first they have heard of it even though it's not?

[lujan]

Doesn't that hint to you they tell everyone this is the first they have heard of it even though it's not?

Some of these techs can get downright obnoxious. I was talking to a tech yesterday that said she was a third level tech (I thought they only had two levels). She kept insisting that I had to change the TV resolution from my TV to get 1080p. I told her over and over again that the TV is just a dumb monitor and the resolution is received from the source (622, Blu-ray player, etc.). I don't think I ever got her to understand and she's third level support.

[yovinman]

Hi yovinman,

Your Westinghouse supports 1080p (1080/60p) but not 1080/24p which is what the receiver is testing for. Still, Dish knows there are compatability issues with other sets (more specifically Sony) that support 1080/24p.

So am I SOL? Why is Dish forcing 24 fps support? How many folks own 1080p sets that don't handle native 24fps? I bought this monitor 2 years ago and I'm already a victim of being an early adopter?

I'm also somewhat confused by all this since I thought that at 1080/60p the display has the circuitry to detect and handle film pulldown. What am I missing? Does Dish expect you to be on the bleeding edge to watch 1080p?

If anyone can explain this without me having to have an Electrical Engineering degree to understand it would be most appreciated.:confused:

[tymekeeper]

I had a weird problem right after getting 6.13. When I would turn on the TV, I could not get a picture, simply a blank screen saying DVI in. To restore the picture, I had to unplug the DVI cable from the 722, and replug it in.

If I turned off the TV, and turned it back on, the problem reappeared - blank screen, no signal input.

I did a soft reboot, and the problem has not returned. I do not know if 6.13 has caused some new "HDMI handshake" issues, or if this is symptomatic of a hardware problem.

This is from the owners manual on my Toshiba.

"To ensure that the HDMI or DVI device is reset properly it is recomended that you follow these procedures"

1. When turning on your electronic components, turn on the TV first and then the HDMI or DVI device.

2.When turning off you electronic components, turn of the HDMI or DVI device first and then the TV.

My prior toshiba HD had the same warning but I never particularly followed it and did not have any problem but maybe doing it just once will reset everything.

[tnsprin]

So am I SOL? Why is Dish forcing 24 fps support? How many folks own 1080p sets that don't handle native 24fps? I bought this monitor 2 years ago and I'm already a victim of being an early adopter?

I'm also somewhat confused by all this since I thought that at 1080/60p the display has the circuitry to detect and handle film pulldown. What am I missing? Does Dish expect you to be on the bleeding edge to watch 1080p?

If anyone can explain this without me having to have an Electrical Engineering degree to understand it would be most appreciated.:confused:

If your TV does not recognized as supporting 1080P24, the Dish receiver offers you the picture as 1080I60. If your TV does a good pulldown, then there is almost no difference in viewing a movie in 1080P24 vs 1080I60.

[lwien]

If your TV does not recognized as supporting 1080P24, the Dish receiver offers you the picture as 1080I60. If your TV does a good pulldown, then there is almost no difference in viewing a movie in 1080P24 vs 1080I60.

If "almost" was good enough, I sure as hell wouldn't be on this forum.

[yovinman]

If your TV does not recognized as supporting 1080P24, the Dish receiver offers you the picture as 1080I60. If your TV does a good pulldown, then there is almost no difference in viewing a movie in 1080P24 vs 1080I60.

So if I understand you correctly, I guess the question would be why wouldn't Dish offer 1080p/60 if the display doesn't support 1080p/24? This way they would have much wider compatibility (and less calls to Support) and their Marketing department still can say they are offering "1080p VOD"? Appartently, this is the way the Sony PS3 is doing it and it seems to work for them.

Sigh. As usual, this is why buying Hi-Def is a losing battle. Incremental "improvements" that makes your investment become less compatible in a fairly short period of time. That's not to say I haven't gotten real viewing enjoyment from the display, but I really don't want to upgrade such a large item (size and price) on a 2-3 year cycle.

[EXTACAMO]

Well just received my replacement 622 because of a dead HDMI port. I installed it and activatated without issue. The HDMI port is working perfectly. It has L6.13 but can not see the 1080p channel 501. What gives? Is there anything currently on 501 for purchase?

[otnipj3s]

This is from the owners manual on my Toshiba.

"To ensure that the HDMI or DVI device is reset properly it is recomended that you follow these procedures"

1. When turning on your electronic components, turn on the TV first and then the HDMI or DVI device.

2.When turning off you electronic components, turn of the HDMI or DVI device first and then the TV.

My prior toshiba HD had the same warning but I never particularly followed it and did not have any problem but maybe doing it just once will reset everything.

Does the electronic component( VIP 722) ever really shut off? The TV shows the turbocharged screensaver when the unit is " turned off " and tv is on. Just a question.

[lwien]

Is there anything currently on 501 for purchase?

Quite a bit actually.

[digital223]

My unit does exactly the same thing. It can be extremely jarring. I've taken to recording almost everything--including the news--and skipping the commercials on playback.

teacher,

i have a vip722 also.
just curious, what make and size is your tv ?
i am experiencing this audio glitch on a vizio 42"xvt, which i just purchased prior to receiving the 613 software.
now i am wondering that it might be the new tv ?
if you have the same tv it would be a good indication the tv is the problem.

[fredp]

Does the electronic component( VIP 722) ever really shut off? The TV shows the turbocharged screensaver when the unit is " turned off " and tv is on. Just a question.
Unless you unplug your 722, then no your unit isn't really off. How else can you get updates etc..

[EXTACAMO]

Okay, my 622 is finally showing channel 501 in the EPG. The only movie it shows is Semi-Pro right through 9/15. It just says VOD but doesn't say anything about 1080p. :confused:

[AVJohnnie]

Okay, my 622 is finally showing channel 501 in the EPG. The only movie it shows is Semi-Pro right through 9/15. It just says VOD but doesn't say anything about 1080p. :confused:

In an earlier post you said that you recently received your replacement 622 which I take to mean that you haven’t had it hooked up for very long? All VOD content is slowly trickled down to a reserved area on your DVR’s internal HD and will not show up in the VOD menu / Guide displays until it has been fully downloaded to your DVR.

Most VOD (so far) is SD and because SD content is smaller there's not as much to trickle down so it shows up sooner in your receiver's VOD listings. HD content (especially full length features) are huge by comparison and take quite a while to download and show up.

Give it a while and you will begin seeing more and more VOD offerings on your 622.

[EXTACAMO]

In an earlier post you said that you recently received your replacement 622 which I take to mean that you haven’t had it hooked up for very long? All VOD content is slowly trickled down to a reserved area on your DVR’s internal HD and will not show up in the VOD menu / Guide displays until it has been fully downloaded to your DVR.

Most VOD (so far) is SD and because SD content is smaller there's not as much to trickle down so it shows up sooner in your receiver's VOD listings. HD content (especially full length features) are huge by comparison and take quite a while to download and show up.

Give it a while and you will begin seeing more and more VOD offerings on your 622.

Thanks for the time and explanation. :)

[Captain_Sternn]

Okay, my 622 is finally showing channel 501 in the EPG. The only movie it shows is Semi-Pro right through 9/15. It just says VOD but doesn't say anything about 1080p. :confused:

Well finally someone else has confirmed they haven't been getting any listings for 501 either! Thanks! I have an HD listing but it says nothing about 1080p while others state it says 1080p in the title!

[AVJohnnie]

Thanks for the time and explanation. :)

I should add that additional VOD content can be delivered from Dish to your DVR via broadband – That is of course, if you hook up your receiver’s Ethernet port to a broadband internet connection – And if you happen to have a relatively decent BB data rate from your ISP (say 3mbps/down or better) the content arrives much, much quicker than via the SAT trickle down method.

You can check out Dish Online at http://www.dishonline.com for more info on those services.

[EXTACAMO]

Well finally someone else has confirmed they haven't been getting any listings for 501 either! Thanks! I have an HD listing but it says nothing about 1080p while others state it says 1080p in the title!

See post #78 by AVjonnie.

[tnsprin]

So if I understand you correctly, I guess the question would be why wouldn't Dish offer 1080p/60 if the display doesn't support 1080p/24? This way they would have much wider compatibility (and less calls to Support) and their Marketing department still can say they are offering "1080p VOD"? Appartently, this is the way the Sony PS3 is doing it and it seems to work for them.

Sigh. As usual, this is why buying Hi-Def is a losing battle. Incremental "improvements" that makes your investment become less compatible in a fairly short period of time. That's not to say I haven't gotten real viewing enjoyment from the display, but I really don't want to upgrade such a large item (size and price) on a 2-3 year cycle.

I don't belive the chip set used supports 1080P60, it requires a much higher bit rate. 1080I60 will look the same as 1080P60 if your Set does a "good" job of handling the pulldown. Remember the source is film (24 frames), so the additional are just duplicates.

[tnsprin]

If "almost" was good enough, I sure as hell wouldn't be on this forum.

I was tempted to leave out the almost. On many new 1080P24 sets there is no difference in picture quality if it is presented as 1080I60, 1080P60 or 1080P24. Essentially the set deintlerlaces (pulldown) and presents the material as 1080P24. Many 1080P sets that cannot present 1080P24 simply present the 24 frames as some variation such as duplicating 3 frames than 2 frames.

[lwien]

I was tempted to leave out the almost. On many new 1080P24 sets there is no difference in picture quality if it is presented as 1080I60, 1080P60 or 1080P24. Essentially the set deintlerlaces (pulldown) and presents the material as 1080P24. Many 1080P sets that cannot present 1080P24 simply present the 24 frames as some variation such as duplicating 3 frames than 2 frames.

If you left out "almost", than you would mean "all", and saying that there is NO difference between 1080i and 1080p?

And here all this time, I thought it was a matter of how large the screen is relative to how close your viewing distance is regarding that issue.

[Captain_Sternn]

In an earlier post you said that you recently received your replacement 622 which I take to mean that you haven’t had it hooked up for very long? All VOD content is slowly trickled down to a reserved area on your DVR’s internal HD and will not show up in the VOD menu / Guide displays until it has been fully downloaded to your DVR.

Most VOD (so far) is SD and because SD content is smaller there's not as much to trickle down so it shows up sooner in your receiver's VOD listings. HD content (especially full length features) are huge by comparison and take quite a while to download and show up.

Give it a while and you will begin seeing more and more VOD offerings on your 622.

However, in my case, I had all the VOD content on the 722 when it just disappeared on me. I was left with only 3 HD VOD offerings, none of which gave any indication they would be in 1080p. I had no SD VOD on 501 either. My 622 had 7 or so SD VOD movies but none in HD... I am now down to only one HD VOD on 501 for my 722, there are no more options. The receiver has been 'calling home' regularly so there isn't any sort of communication error on that level.

Dish has been of no help, each tech says something completely contrary to what the last one said and the supervisor I spoke with had no clue VOD was offered on channel 501 to start with so she wasn't much help. They elevated the ticket to some higher tech level (apparently the programmers who wrote the software) to see why my 'unheard of before issue' was happening. That was about 10 days ago. I have heard nothing since.

[RasputinAXP]

Just got it the other day. I'm happy, mainly because it definitely fixed the squished-screen problem in Dual Mode.

[tnsprin]

If you left out "almost", than you would mean "all", and saying that there is NO difference between 1080i and 1080p?

And here all this time, I thought it was a matter of how large the screen is relative to how close your viewing distance is regarding that issue.

On a 1080P screen with proper deintelacing (pulldown) their should be NO difference for a 24 fps (e.g. film). That's because all the info necessary to reconstruct a 1080P24 picture is in the 1080I60 signal. The only diffence (the almost) is whether it can fully show a frame it in some equal number of scans. e.g some tvs might show each frame 4 times (ie 96 frames a second), and others 3 frames then 2 frames (60 frames a second).

[electrafied]

I am now having trouble with the PIP feature. With the last update it was the audio and now seems the PIP isn't adjust the picture size correctly and freezes up after awhile. Forcing a reset seems to fix it temporarily but i hope a patch is sent out soon.

[BonefishPaul]

Ever since my 622 received the update to 6.13, I am experiencing several "Lost Signal" errors. It mainly happens when I change channels and has become quite frustrating! Has anyone else had this problem? I am ready to call tech support, but I'm afraid they'll say this is the first time they have ever heard of this problem.

[Scott Spillers]

With 6.13, it seems that some of the problems that we had seen previously with trick-play features have returned. Specifically, after using pause and skip forward and back, the receiver will sometimes jump to a point far from where you are currently viewing. Some of the spots it jumps to seem to be spots where the program may have been paused previously, but I am not sure that this is always the case. Is anyone else seeing this with 6.13?

[Tulsa1]

With 6.13, it seems that some of the problems that we had seen previously with trick-play features have returned. Specifically, after using pause and skip forward and back, the receiver will sometimes jump to a point far from where you are currently viewing. Some of the spots it jumps to seem to be spots where the program may have been paused previously, but I am not sure that this is always the case. Is anyone else seeing this with 6.13?

Unfortunately I am seeing the same on SD recordings:nono2:

[DJ Lon]

With 6.13, it seems that some of the problems that we had seen previously with trick-play features have returned. Specifically, after using pause and skip forward and back, the receiver will sometimes jump to a point far from where you are currently viewing. Some of the spots it jumps to seem to be spots where the program may have been paused previously, but I am not sure that this is always the case. Is anyone else seeing this with 6.13?

Yes, especially with Live TV and Local DVR content.

[dbconsultant]

Yes, we're seeing it on football games where we use it the most. Really frustrating. You'd think, since it keeps breaking, that it would be one of the first things they would test for bugs before releasing the software.

[space86]

Do you think we might get 6.14 software next week?

[ImBack234]

Do you think we might get 6.14 software next week?
OOgod. LOL
Let all the new headaches begin.:eek2:

[kucharsk]

With 6.13, it seems that some of the problems that we had seen previously with trick-play features have returned. Specifically, after using pause and skip forward and back, the receiver will sometimes jump to a point far from where you are currently viewing. Some of the spots it jumps to seem to be spots where the program may have been paused previously, but I am not sure that this is always the case. Is anyone else seeing this with 6.13?

Big time.

I never figured out the exact sequence, but pausing and skipping slightly in my DVRed copy of Mad Men this week would send the DVR back several minutes.

Something really got messed up with this in L6.13.

[jenniferny]

I got a replacement 622 four days ago (old one had no HDMI and off air tuner died. Everything was OK till this AM when, after about an hour of OK operation the box started endlessly rebooting. Power cord reset did not work. I don't know if the box got hit by new software last night or not and I can't check now cause it won't boot!
Anybody else seen this? If not, I guess it's get another box.

I lost my HDMI port the day after I got the new software update. Is there any way to regain the use of my HDMI port without replacing the receiver?

[audiomaster]

I lost my HDMI port the day after I got the new software update. Is there any way to regain the use of my HDMI port without replacing the receiver?
Try a power cord pull and reboot. And be sure the TV is powered up before the receiver so it can find it. Be sure the HDMI connector is all the way in. Try wiggling it up and down. It seems the cooling is not adequate on the 622 and the connector can unsolder itself from the board if there is a lot of cable weight on it. They used to tell us that it was a known problem and just to use the component out. But now with 1080P only on HDMI, I think they are going to have to start replacing boxes.

[Kent Taylor]

Lots of reboots when attempting to set up/edit timers. Super slow if/when it does work.

[jenniferny]

Try a power cord pull and reboot. And be sure the TV is powered up before the receiver so it can find it. Be sure the HDMI connector is all the way in. Try wiggling it up and down. It seems the cooling is not adequate on the 622 and the connector can unsolder itself from the board if there is a lot of cable weight on it. They used to tell us that it was a known problem and just to use the component out. But now with 1080P only on HDMI, I think they are going to have to start replacing boxes.


I'm sorry, I should have stated what I had already done. I've done the power cord reboot at least 6 times, I've also wiggled the cable and also removed and reinserted it numerous times. The left side of the 622 is very warm, and I have plenty of clearance around it for heat disipation. Is there a way to check for fan operation other than removing the cover and turning it on? I use a Monster Cable M-1000 HDMI Cable, which is very stiff.

Thanks for the help.
Any other recommendations?

[Sunnyatthebeach]

... Is there a way to check for fan operation other than removing the cover and turning it on? ...

On the 722, air enters on the right side of the unit and is expelled on the left. To check fan operation, you can dangle a Kleenex tissue next to the vent holes on the right side and watch the tissue get sucked in. On my unit, the fan seems to turn on only when the unit gets warm from recording/playback.

[wangel]

I'm sorry, I should have stated what I had already done. I've done the power cord reboot at least 6 times, I've also wiggled the cable and also removed and reinserted it numerous times. The left side of the 622 is very warm, and I have plenty of clearance around it for heat disipation. Is there a way to check for fan operation other than removing the cover and turning it on? I use a Monster Cable M-1000 HDMI Cable, which is very stiff.

Thanks for the help.
Any other recommendations?

I'd like to report that my 622 is also doing this. The TV that my 622 is hooked too, only does 720p, but ever since the software update, it has stopped working.

I have not tried to hook it up w/ component cables yet.

What happens, even after a power cord pull / reset is that sometimes it may work. If it starts to work, it will work anywhere from a few minutes to an hour maybe, and then blank screen. No sound or anything.

The box still works, I can go and watch tv just fine on TV2 etc. It just dies on TV1.

When I get back home today I'll try to hook it up via component cables and report back.

Thanks!
~wangel

ps: Should I call and report this to Dish, or do they know about it ?

[ImBack234]

If you want a cheap and quick way to drop your temp, try a 5 inch desktop fan from lowes. I bought this O2 Cool fan (item # 146166) that's battery or ac powered. Just $7 and it must have lowered my temp 20*.
A cheap little fan can save some big headaches.

[AVJohnnie]

Since receiving L6.13 I’ve been seeing momentary blank (all black) screens on delayed or recorded HD SAT sources – audio seems unaffected when these occur. I don’t believe it to be a signal issue as there are no artifacts or macro blocking evident, just several consecutive fully black video frames. There seems to be no particular pattern on occurrences, nor on a specific channel source other than it happening on HD SAT channels because that’s all I watch. So far I’ve not noticed it on “live” feeds, just delayed playbacks. Not the end of the world, but still annoying none the less. :rolleyes:

[vampirefish]

I am STILL experiencing the KOMO-HD audio dropout. Especially noticable during Jeopardy (wierd, I know). It's sooo irritating because my family really likes to watch this show together. Any news on this or anyone else still dealing with this (for the latest version)?

[Presence]

A problem I have is if I am watching an HD show, and the screen is all dark for a bit then suddenly lights up with a scene change or something, the audio will dropout for a second. Like if I am watching a concert and the arena is dark, and suddenly all the stage lights come on, the audio will cut.

[Rob Glasser]

I am STILL experiencing the KOMO-HD audio dropout. Especially noticable during Jeopardy (wierd, I know). It's sooo irritating because my family really likes to watch this show together. Any news on this or anyone else still dealing with this (for the latest version)?

I am still seeing this too. I find it's on just about all the Seattle HD channels from Dish but not OTA. I see it the most during commercials during primetime and the local news on KOMO like others have reported.

[mulder5000]

I am STILL experiencing the KOMO-HD audio dropout. Especially noticable during Jeopardy (wierd, I know). It's sooo irritating because my family really likes to watch this show together. Any news on this or anyone else still dealing with this (for the latest version)?

This sounds a lot like the issue we've been discussing in the thread ViP622/ViP722 - L5.12/L6.10/L6.12 Audio Related Issues Discussions (http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=134343).

Unfortunately, there is no fix yet.

[casolorz]

I dont know if this has been reported yet or if its related to 6.13 but its certainly the first time I've seen it.
Today I had House and Fringe set to record on my DVR using the OTA. House ended 3 minutes earlier than my timer was set for, I am guessing because of Fringe even though Fringe has less priority but thats all ok. What is not OK is that Fringe shows as recorded on the Daily Schedule, while the show was going on the guide showed like if it was recording however the show is nowhere to be found on the list.
I've had a lot of shows cut off at the end lately, now I am wondering how many shows are missing from the list. Has anyone else had this problem?

[DJ Lon]

I dont know if this has been reported yet or if its related to 6.13 but its certainly the first time I've seen it.
Today I had House and Fringe set to record on my DVR using the OTA. House ended 3 minutes earlier than my timer was set for, I am guessing because of Fringe even though Fringe has less priority but thats all ok. What is not OK is that Fringe shows as recorded on the Daily Schedule, while the show was going on the guide showed like if it was recording however the show is nowhere to be found on the list.
I've had a lot of shows cut off at the end lately, now I am wondering how many shows are missing from the list. Has anyone else had this problem?

I haven't had the above specific problem but since getting L613 set timers have mysteriously begun to disappear (no pattern) so I've had to return to checking them every morning before I go to work to make sure they're still there.

[ImBack234]

I dont know if this has been reported yet or if its related to 6.13 but its certainly the first time I've seen it.
Today I had House and Fringe set to record on my DVR using the OTA. House ended 3 minutes earlier than my timer was set for, I am guessing because of Fringe even though Fringe has less priority but thats all ok. What is not OK is that Fringe shows as recorded on the Daily Schedule, while the show was going on the guide showed like if it was recording however the show is nowhere to be found on the list.
I've had a lot of shows cut off at the end lately, now I am wondering how many shows are missing from the list. Has anyone else had this problem?
I had the same problem with House but I was recording Fringe so it didn't matter.
I've had no shows missing but I've had shows cut off.
The other night I found both tuners recording the same show from the same channel. But the guide and info only showed it recording on TV 2.
Save to say L6.13 sucks.

[phrelin]

The first problem is that House ran about 2 minutes long. Fringe, of course, had those nifty limited commercial breaks, which means they could sell more on House. None of the schedules showed this, not even the local station's schedule.

[casolorz]

The first problem is that House ran about 2 minutes long. Fringe, of course, had those nifty limited commercial breaks, which means they could sell more on House. None of the schedules showed this, not even the local station's schedule.

But my problem is that Fringe was set to record, the guide showed it as recording, the schedule shows it as recorded, but the show is nowhere to be found on the list of shows I can watch. It vanished!

[ericsdad]

I've noticed in the last couple of days that when I try to use the skip back feature on some of my recordings and live paused shows that it will actually skip forward instead. If I push back 4 or 5 times fast it might go back a couple times and forward a couple times. The only way I can find what I wanted to see is to hit rewind.

[phrelin]

It's a bit depressing here on this thread. I feel like I'm reading about a new release of Windows Vista. I've had problems with the skip back, though I didn't think it skipped forward. But sometimes I attribute things to human error, mine, when the problem is in the complexity of the system.

[casolorz]

I've noticed a skipping problem when doing the five sec rewind but I am not certain of what it did. Seemed like doing a lot of rewinds made it do a really big one.

[phrelin]

I've noticed a skipping problem when doing the five sec rewind but I am not certain of what it did. Seemed like doing a lot of rewinds made it do a really big one.I have experienced that one.

[jenniferny]

I'd like to report that my 622 is also doing this. The TV that my 622 is hooked too, only does 720p, but ever since the software update, it has stopped working.

I have not tried to hook it up w/ component cables yet.

What happens, even after a power cord pull / reset is that sometimes it may work. If it starts to work, it will work anywhere from a few minutes to an hour maybe, and then blank screen. No sound or anything.

The box still works, I can go and watch tv just fine on TV2 etc. It just dies on TV1.

When I get back home today I'll try to hook it up via component cables and report back.

Thanks!
~wangel

ps: Should I call and report this to Dish, or do they know about it ?

Mine works fine with the Component Video connection, just not with the HDMI connection. Is there any chance that the next software update will fix this?

[jenniferny]

If you want a cheap and quick way to drop your temp, try a 5 inch desktop fan from lowes. I bought this O2 Cool fan (item # 146166) that's battery or ac powered. Just $7 and it must have lowered my temp 20*.
A cheap little fan can save some big headaches.

Where do you place the fan to get the best cooling?

[jenniferny]

Since the 613 update everything else seems fine except I lost my HDMI port and also when I try to access my external hard drive, if I try to MANAGE DEVICE about 50% of the time the receiver freezes and does an automatic reboot about one minute later, also if I do not wait at least a minute after the screen with the recordings comes up it will freeze the receiver every time and the receiver will reboot itself about a minute later. Is anyone else experiencing this? When I choose SEND TO DEVICE I get immediate access and it works fine every time and once I do get acess I can watch any recording without issue so I do not think it is a Hard Drive issue. The Hard Drive is a Seagate 750 GB 7200.10 SATA II unit that is about three or four months old. I have only noticed it since the software update.

[ImBack234]

Where do you place the fan to get the best cooling?Looking at the back of the receiver to the back rightside. You will see the air vents.
Also I would say your very stiff M-1000 HDMI Cable broke you HDMI port. Next time get a cheap one but just as good one from monoprice.com.

[Scott Spillers]

I am STILL experiencing the KOMO-HD audio dropout. Especially noticable during Jeopardy (wierd, I know). It's sooo irritating because my family really likes to watch this show together. Any news on this or anyone else still dealing with this (for the latest version)?

I also hear lots of dropouts on recorded or delayed programs on KOMO-HD. I don't hear it a lot during the prime-time shows, but the 11:00pm news (which I record and watch later) has dropouts every night. If anything, it seems to have gotten worse with 6.13.

[eddieras]

i'm having trouble watching a delayed show - it keeps jumping forward to live tv... is this part of the software glitch - i have a 722 with L614

[cspinelive]

I dont know if this has been reported yet or if its related to 6.13 but its certainly the first time I've seen it.
Today I had House and Fringe set to record on my DVR using the OTA. House ended 3 minutes earlier than my timer was set for, I am guessing because of Fringe even though Fringe has less priority but thats all ok. What is not OK is that Fringe shows as recorded on the Daily Schedule, while the show was going on the guide showed like if it was recording however the show is nowhere to be found on the list.
I've had a lot of shows cut off at the end lately, now I am wondering how many shows are missing from the list. Has anyone else had this problem?

I've got a 622. I get HD locals via OTA. I get SD locals via DISH. I set up several dishpasses to record all new showings of my favorite primetime shows with a preference for HD. I do this so that if three shows are all showing in the same time slot, they will all be recorded with the highest priority one being recorded in HD via OTA and the other two being recorded in SD on TV1 and TV2. My problem is that the schedule routinely shows two OTA shows on different channels are scheduled to be recording at the same time on OTA. When it comes time for them to be recorded, one will be recorded and the other will show lots of signal loss errors in the schedule history. I also got 30 1 minute recordings of the failed show in my DVR library. Anyone else seeing anything like this? If there's no solution for this I guess I'll have to ditch dishpass and set up two timers for each show. One in HD and one in SD with all the HD timers having a higher priority than the SD timers.