Pictures of Iraqis giving thumbs up to troops not a good thing

[TNGTony]

On Fox news they keep showing a picture of a man giving the "thumbs up" to an allied soldier. The comentary was saying that this was a good thing that the people were welcoming the troops. Well...in this particular instance it was definitely not.

In that region of the world, the thumbs up sign is similar to the U.S.'s single finger salute. The bird of contempt.

Thought you may want to know.

See ya
Tony

[Jack White]

Originally posted by TNGTony
On Fox news they keep showing a picture of a man giving the "thumbs up" to an allied soldier. The comentary was saying that this was a good thing that the people were welcoming the troops. Well...in this particular instance it was definitely not.

In that region of the world, the thumbs up sign is similar to the U.S.'s single finger salute. The bird of contempt.

Thought you may want to know.

See ya
Tony

LOL, but you wouldn't expect the Fox Neocon Propoganda Channel to tell you that:lol:

[TNGTony]

I just have a feeling that the folks in the Fox News room this afternoon have NO CLUE as to this particular cultural difference.

I've e-mailed Fox News weekend nearly the same text as the post above, and since I haven't seen the picture pop up. Not saying there is any corrolation between the two events...:)

See ya
Tony

[Richard King]

I had heard the same thing somewhere else about a week ago. Now, here's the dilemma... Was the source that I heard it from (and your source) accurate? The way things are these days, this info could have been released from some "neolib" media outlet to place a different meaning on the message than is meant by the deliverer of the message. Then again, if someone gave the middle finger salute here, with a great big smile attached, and the salute were returned also with a great big smile, I would think that one or the other of the involved parties would be very confused.

[RandyAB]

For some reason though I really believe that thumbs up that the person is giving to the soldier that he really does mean it in a positive way.

[sampatterson]

Some believe that this has actually changed meaning to have a good meaning instead of a bad meaning as it used to in the Middle East.

http://slate.msn.com/id/2080812/

[TNGTony]

The first place I heard it was from my Iranian house mate in High School. He and a several other Iranians went to school with me. This was in 1976. Since then I have read this in several travel books (when you travel you have to be careful not to inadvertantly insult your hosts). And when I was in Istanbul, Turkey 5 years ago, I was told by a Turk that it is considered an insult. In Kusadasi, Turkey I also saw another passanger of the ship give a thumbs up answering a yes/no question from a local. It took 3 people to convince the local that it was NOT meant as an insult. Lots of apologies from those involved.

There are lots of little things like this all over the world. In Greece you never want to jokingly tell some one to go on by holding both hands over your head and making a "get away" gesture. This is symbolically throwing sh*t on the recepient. :)

As to this particular person in the picture shown on Fox (not the one in the article above, there were two Iraqi men walking accross a road. Neither looked very happy. The man closest to the photographer had his hand in front and just above belt line in a clenched thumbs up. He was looking at the soldier facing away from the camera keeping a close eye on the men with a weapon pointed slightly downward. The man doing the thumbs up had a look of disgust. Of yourse I have no idea what was going though his mind, but it did not look like an approval.

See ya
Tony

[Bogy]

After reading the Slate article, my guess would be that the thumbs up probably has been having both meanings, depending on the circumstances, including who is giving it.

[Cheyenne]

In the "slate" articule, I would have to lean towards insulting gesture. That guy doesn't look happy to see anyone and the other seems to be indicating support for some picture of another guy ???

[gcutler]

That is why good translators need to know all the local "issues and sayings so "the feel" of the statements and hand jestures are understood.

I think when we were meeting with the Russians during WWII on how to deal with hitler, one of the US mediators said "Well there is more than one way to skin a cat", the russians were perplexed as why we wanted to skin a cat and what it had to do with dealing with hitler. :p

[John Corn]

There has been so much wrong reporting, like the surrender of the 51st division or the rising in Basra. I am not sure if its simple blundering or deliberate distortion, as at MACV in Vietnam that was always ridiculously optimistic.

[DDRio]

Tony,

You should change the channel and watch either MSNBC or CNN. I'm pretty happy with the coverage of MSNBC. The info is accurate and there's no editorializing of the news and no biases.

[Nick]

I've always heard that in the middle-east, the 'OK'
sign - circled forefinger and thumb - had
a negative sexual connotation.

I wonder if turning and dropping one's BDUs would be considered 'OK' in any culture.?.

[gcutler]

Depends on if they draw a happy face on ones buttocks, then it is ok.

[Nick]

I say tell our guys to give them all the middle-finger salute and let them figure it out.

Not our problem.

[Halfsek]

Although according to the Washington Post

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A36124-2003Apr5.html

Many Iraqis at a key crossroads in this southern city greet Marines with a thumbs-up - meaning thanks for coming - followed by an outstretched hand begging for food or water.