Quick question about burning DVD's from an HR20 receiver

[kevwheez]

Hey all, this is my first post, so Hello!

I have a quick question that I hope is easy to get a yes or no answer to.

I currently have 2 HR20 HD DVR receivers from DirecTV. They have both started acting up (not able to receive various HD channels like HBOHD, ESPNHD, etc.) Although I still do get SOME HD channels, not all come in. I called Customer service and after switching cables and resetting, it was determined that it was a tuner malfunction in both boxes, and they are going to send out new ones to my home, and I am to return the ones I have now.

The main problem with that, and hence my question, is this: I have a LOT of unwatched stuff on both of the boxes. I want to know if it is possible to purchase a DVD recorder (the model I have seen that seems like a good buy is the Toshiba DR410) and to record the movies/shows I currently have on my HR20's to a DVD for viewing later?

I have done some research and it seems like it may work, though only if I do it through Component connections, yes? Or will HDMI work? Any worries that the movies were recorded off of HBO, Starz, etc.

I guess I could live with losing HD quality, and 5.1 sound and all that as long as I don't lose the 40-50 movies I have stored and hope to watch at some point.

I'd love a quick response as to whether this is indeed possible, and I certainly apologize if this is an oft asked question answered amy times before!

Cheers,
Kev

[jodyguercio]

Hey all, this is my first post, so Hello!

I have a quick question that I hope is easy to get a yes or no answer to.

I currently have 2 HR20 HD DVR receivers from DirecTV. They have both started acting up (not able to receive various HD channels like HBOHD, ESPNHD, etc.) Although I still do get SOME HD channels, not all come in. I called Customer service and after switching cables and resetting, it was determined that it was a tuner malfunction in both boxes, and they are going to send out new ones to my home, and I am to return the ones I have now.

The main problem with that, and hence my question, is this: I have a LOT of unwatched stuff on both of the boxes. I want to know if it is possible to purchase a DVD recorder (the model I have seen that seems like a good buy is the Toshiba DR410) and to record the movies/shows I currently have on my HR20's to a DVD for viewing later?

I have done some research and it seems like it may work, though only if I do it through Component connections, yes? Or will HDMI work? Any worries that the movies were recorded off of HBO, Starz, etc.

I guess I could live with losing HD quality, and 5.1 sound and all that as long as I don't lose the 40-50 movies I have stored and hope to watch at some point.

I'd love a quick response as to whether this is indeed possible, and I certainly apologize if this is an oft asked question answered amy times before!

Cheers,
Kev

Is the recorder you mentioned capable of recording in HD? I didnt look it up but the simplest way to record from the HR20 to a recorder is by using the composite hookups.

[kevwheez]

I don't think so - though that is a good point. I will have to take a look and see if there is a reasonably priced unit that CAN indeed record the HD content.

But barring that, am I fairly assured that the content will be able to be burned onto a DVD AT ALL? I mean will the stuff off the preminum stations (which most of it is) be flagged and not viewable, making this whole exercise pointless - or will it be more a case of reduced quality, but still doable.

Thanks!

[jodyguercio]

I don't think so - though that is a good point. I will have to take a look and see if there is a reasonably priced unit that CAN indeed record the HD content.

But barring that, am I fairly assured that the content will be able to be burned onto a DVD AT ALL? I mean will the stuff off the preminum stations (which most of it is) be flagged and not viewable, making this whole exercise pointless - or will it be more a case of reduced quality, but still doable.

Thanks!

Its extremely doable and not pointless at all. The PQ will be downrezzed to 480i but with the recorder that you mentioned being able to upconvert to 1080p your movies should look fine.

[Stuart Sweet]

Yes, you can definitely burn to DVD. There's no benefit to using anything more than an S-Video connection, and there will be no copy protection.

[kevwheez]

Thanks so much for the quick facts, guys!

They have some VERY nicely priced ones on eBay, and I need to return these DVR's back to DirecTV pretty quick - so knowing it can be done helps me out big time!

I was looking at one of the pictures of the unit, and am I correct that I would be utilizing the Inputs of the Recorder to the Output of the DVR - yes?

[Stuart Sweet]

Correct. S-Video and Stereo Audio out of the DVR to the corresponding inputs on the DVD recorder, then out to the TV.

[veryoldschool]

Yes, you can definitely burn to DVD. There's no benefit to using anything more than an S-Video connection, and there will be no copy protection.
"maybe and maybe not".
Sometime back I wanted to make a DVD off Showtime, so I fed it through composite to my MCE 2005 to have it record and then I'd burn it to DVD. Microsoft wouldn't let me and would display copyright problems.
I was able to use a non Microsoft app, to make a recording.
If you read the labels on the DVR, there are HDCP for digital, and macrovision which does seem to be used on the analog.
"How" a recorder handles this will vary.
Just an FYI, as YMMV

[Stuart Sweet]

VOS is correct that MCE will sometimes find copy protection, but at least in my experience I haven't seen a standalone DVD recorder do this.

[hdtvfan0001]

Correct. S-Video and Stereo Audio out of the DVR to the corresponding inputs on the DVD recorder, then out to the TV.
That's how I've been doing it for some time here....works well, and I've been pleasantly surprised just how good the SD DVD's have looked using HD source content.

[Chip Moody]

I've been running a Tivo S2 to record shows from my H20 off S-Video, then let my TV re-scale the image back to a 16x9 format when I play them back. I won't say that I was "pleasantly surprised" with the quality, but it's certainly "not bad" considering... (And certainly worth the savings of DirecTV's monthly DVR charges and the extra features that come from the Tivo service)

- Chip


That's how I've been doing it for some time here....works well, and I've been pleasantly surprised just how good the SD DVD's have looked using HD source content.

[davring]

Not to deviate from your questions, which have been answered by the experts, my concern is the problem of BOTH HR's having the exact same problem. I would highly suspect something common to both receivers, poor alignment, multi-switch, cables or the LNB. I would hate to see you go through all this trouble only to continue having the same problem after replacing the units.

[kevwheez]

Not to deviate from your questions, which have been answered by the experts, my concern is the problem of BOTH HR's having the exact same problem. I would highly suspect something common to both receivers, poor alignment, multi-switch, cables or the LNB. I would hate to see you go through all this trouble only to continue having the same problem after replacing the units.

A very good point, Davring -

I just don't know what it could be at this point. As recently as 2 weeks ago, I was ble to watch those stations just fine - and to tell you the truth, I remember a night not too long a go that I couldn't watch HBOHD and ESPNHD and then a day or two later, I could - why? I have no idea.

I did look over the input signal strengths on both Sat 1 and 2, and they seemed perfectly fine. I'm perplexed as to why some of the stations (in HD) are absolutely fine, but others can't be received. I don't have a service contract with DirecTV, so if I wanted them to come out and monkey with it, I'd be on the hook for it, so I really don't want to do that.

I am far from an expert in anyof this, but I ran through the logical steps to see if it would be anything else, but can't think of what it might be - any suggestions from anyone else?

ALSO: I have been looking at blank DVD+RW discs that I would be burning the content from these DVRs onto, and I see that pretty much all say the have a 120 minute video limit on them. What does one do when you have a movie that is over 2 hours long - split it between 2 discs? Seems wierd, though I have never done it before so maybe I'm missing something very obvious?

Cheers,
Kevin

[bobnielsen]

My Lite-On DVD recorder has a 4-hour setting which I have used for movies over two hours in length. The quality is somewhat reduced, however. I have also captured some to my Mac (using a Miglia EvolutionTV and EyeTV software). The Miglia has hardware compression and even under the best quality setting I can record about 3 hours of video on a DVD with this method.

[veryoldschool]

Those little "BBCs" hanging off the back "might" be a cause.
When you have "the problem", are you looking at all of the SATs?
Can you check the cables for being "tight"? Almost every time an installer comes out, I will find a cable [or more] that isn't as tight [well snug really] as it should be.

[kevwheez]

Those little "BBCs" hanging off the back "might" be a cause.
When you have "the problem", are you looking at all of the SATs?
Can you check the cables for being "tight"? Almost every time an installer comes out, I will find a cable [or more] that isn't as tight [well snug really] as it should be.

VOS - BBCs?? I'm either clueless or haven't had enough coffee today - lol! What are these?

And when I'm looking at the signal strength numbers, they are all fluctuate - some in the 80s some in the 90s occasionally down in the 70/60 range - but all seemingly fine enough that I get SOME HD stations perfectly. There is one always at "0" - but have been told that is normal - correct?

All the cable are tight, as I said, I actually unhooked them, switched them from Sat in 1/2 and retightened - but still got the same problem.

[SDizzle]

The BBCs are plastic boxes, either gray or black in color, they hook to the sat inputs, then your cables screw into them. They must be attached for MPEG4 viewing.....unless you have an swm....

[kevwheez]

The BBCs are plastic boxes, either gray or black in color, they hook to the sat inputs, then your cables screw into them. They must be attached for MPEG4 viewing.....unless you have an swm....

Oh OK - yep I have those back there, one for each Sat line coming in. But I'm wondering somethiing here (and this is info I had not shared yet, so maybe it makes the point moot). When I first would try to view HBOHD say, the screen message would say something like "Unable to recieve signal on Sat 2 - message 771" or near enough to that. Now when I swapped the Sat In cables from on to the other it STILL said "Unable to receive signal from Sat 2. . ." Would this mean that the "BBCs" are fine and that it is the HR20 itself?

[veryoldschool]

VOS - BBCs?? I'm either clueless or haven't had enough coffee today - lol! What are these?

And when I'm looking at the signal strength numbers, they are all fluctuate - some in the 80s some in the 90s occasionally down in the 70/60 range - but all seemingly fine enough that I get SOME HD stations perfectly. There is one always at "0" - but have been told that is normal - correct?

All the cable are tight, as I said, I actually unhooked them, switched them from Sat in 1/2 and retightened - but still got the same problem.
I'm a bit concerned with the 80-90 dropping to 60-70.
While the cables may be tight/snug at the receiver, what about the other end(s)? [and any connection in between]
Can you get to your dish?
If you're careful, you can remove the two screws that connect the LNB [on the end of the arm] and pull it out to check the cable there. This was where I first found my problem. There was one so loose that it was giving problems known as the "even/odd" transponder issue.

[veryoldschool]

Oh OK - yep I have those back there, one for each Sat line coming in. But I'm wondering somethiing here (and this is info I had not shared yet, so maybe it makes the point moot). When I first would try to view HBOHD say, the screen message would say something like "Unable to recieve signal on Sat 2 - message 771" or near enough to that. Now when I swapped the Sat In cables from on to the other it STILL said "Unable to receive signal from Sat 2. . ." Would this mean that the "BBCs" are fine and that it is the HR20 itself?
cables, or BBC sure are starting to sound like your problem.
Swapping cable and/or BBCs and having the 771 error change from Tuner #1 to tuner #2, points to NOT being the receiver.

[kevwheez]

cables, or BBC sure are starting to sound like your problem.
Swapping cable and/or BBCs and having the 771 error change from Tuner #1 to tuner #2, points to NOT being the receiver.

I think you might have misunderstood - It DOESN'T change - no matter which coaxial line was plugged into either Sat In 1 or Sat in 2, the error message STILL said Sat 2 in both cases, does that make sense?

Also, when I get home today, I will definitely go up and look at the dish connections and see if they are good. We have a VERY clear line of sight where it's at so is there ANY reason I shouldn't be getting really high numbers ALL the time?

[veryoldschool]

I think you might have misunderstood - It DOESN'T change - no matter which coaxial line was plugged into either Sat In 1 or Sat in 2, the error message STILL said Sat 2 in both cases, does that make sense?

Also, when I get home today, I will definitely go up and look at the dish connections and see if they are good. We have a VERY clear line of sight where it's at so is there ANY reason I shouldn't be getting really high numbers ALL the time?
OK, with not changing, it starts to eliminate the BBC/cable, but not [yet] the "other end".
With a clear LOS, your numbers "should be" stable and with a well aligned dish, very high [90s & 80s]

[kevwheez]

Hey guys,

My new receivers arrived yesterday, and before installing them, I thought I would try and tweak the dish and/or connections of my current boxes and see what I could find.

In another great thread here, I noticed a person that posted their signal strength numbers and you guys were able to tell him some good info. I've written mine down and wondered if anyone might have some suggestions for me!

Do these reading mean I should try and have the Dish adjusted before swapping out the boxes? Or would these indicate a faulty receiver even more.

Satellite transponders (32 total at 101º - tuner 1)

1-8 79 79 80 92 76 92 79 92
9-16 77 81 80 98 77 95 77 95
17-24 75 69 79 97 79 95 83 94
25-32 80 96 82 0 83 95 81 95

Satellite transponders (32 total at 101º - tuner 2)

1-8 79 77 81 92 77 91 79 92
9-16 78 80 79 98 76 95 76 95
17-24 75 69 79 96 77 91 82 94
25-32 79 96 80 0 83 95 80 95


Satellite transponders (3 total at 110º - tuner 1)

1-8 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA 58
9-16 NA 60 NA 63 NA NA NA NA
17-24 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA
25-32 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA

Satellite transponders (3 total at 110º - tuner 2)

1-8 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA 59
9-16 NA 60 NA 62 NA NA NA NA
17-24 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA
25-32 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA


Satellite transponders (11 total at 119º - tuner 1)

1-8 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA
9-16 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA
17-24 NA NA NA NA NA 83 0 78
25-32 76 72 77 80 76 81 65 83

Satellite transponders (11 total at 119º - tuner 2)

1-8 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA
9-16 NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA
17-24 NA NA NA NA NA 82 0 79
25-32 77 71 79 80 78 81 68 83


Satellite transponders (14 total at 99º(c) - tuner 1)
[New national HD channels]
1-8 0 15 0 16 0 18 0 20
9-16 0 20 0 19 0 22 NA NA

Satellite transponders (14 total at 99º(c) - tuner 2)
[New national HD channels]
1-8 0 12 0 13 0 17 0 16
9-16 0 17 0 17 0 17 NA NA


Satellite transponders (14 total at 103º(c) - tuner 1)
[Most national HD channels]
1-8 0 13 11 14 0 12 0 14
9-16 10 14 0 14 15 NA NA

Satellite transponders (14 total at 103º(c) - tuner 2)
[Most national HD channels]
1-8 11 14 13 17 14 16 16 20
9-16 16 19 15 20 15 19 NA NA

There were also some numbers for Satellites 99º(s) and 103º(s), but it didn't seem from the other thread that those were all that important.

Let me know if you have any input - and thanks again!

PLEASE NOTE! It IS kinda rainy out today, so these numbers maaay be suffering alittle from the weather,but it's not like a crazy storm outside - I;m in MI and it's just a summer drizzle.

Cheers,
Kevin

[carl6]

Your satellite readings are low. 101, 110 and 119 are marginal. 99 and 103 are totally unacceptable. Dish alignment is clearly indicated.

Carl

[kevwheez]

Your satellite readings are low. 101, 110 and 119 are marginal. 99 and 103 are totally unacceptable. Dish alignment is clearly indicated.

Carl

Thanks for the quick response, Carl! One question.

I've never tried it, but is a dish alignment something I myself should attempt, or is it much better left to the DirecTV guy?

ALSO - One more question - It looks like they shipped me HR21 - 700C-R; any advantage to having those as opposed to my HR20's?

Cheers,
Kevin

[kevwheez]

I have been trying to record the content from the above mentioned DVRs but with only limited success so far. I played about 10 minutes of a movie to test it out, stopped it and tried to play it back from the DVD disc in my newly purchased DVD recorder and I am having this problem:

I can hear the audio just fine, but NO video? I tried it using both the regular yellow RCA plug connection as well as an S-video cable. All I did was run a left/right (red/white) audio cable from the output of the DVR to the input of the recorder as well as the same for the video mentioned previously. Started the recording and played the movie - am I missing something here? Why would the audio work, but not the picture

Any suggestions?

[curt8403]

I have been trying to record the content from the above mentioned DVRs but with only limited success so far. I played about 10 minutes of a movie to test it out, stopped it and tried to play it back from the DVD disc in my newly purchased DVD recorder and I am having this problem:

I can hear the audio just fine, but NO video? I tried it using both the regular yellow RCA plug connection as well as an S-video cable. All I did was run a left/right (red/white) audio cable from the output of the DVR to the input of the recorder as well as the same for the video mentioned previously. Started the recording and played the movie - am I missing something here? Why would the audio work, but not the picture

Any suggestions?

I think the program may be copy protected, and the recorder knows it (By the type of signal) and so is not working

[kevwheez]

weird though - as it was stated earlier in this thread, I didn't think I'd have that big a problem trying to record anything. Especially using such crude connections (compared to component or HDMI)

So if most of the stuff is off of HBO, Starz, etc. should I be expecting them all to be blacked out? I though I might see some type of image or text on screen saying it was protected - not just blackness.

[curt8403]

weird though - as it was stated earlier in this thread, I didn't think I'd have that big a problem trying to record anything. Especially using such crude connections (compared to component or HDMI)

So if most of the stuff is off of HBO, Starz, etc. should I be expecting them all to be blacked out? I though I might see some type of image or text on screen saying it was protected - not just blackness.
if it was recorded in HD, you are probably looking at something called HDCP High Definition Copy Protection. It could affect even the downresed outputs...

[rudeney]

Before blaming “copy protection”, I’d verify the signal. First, connect some other composite (i.e. yellow RCA) or S-video output to the DVD-R’s inputs to make sure they work. Don’t use a VCR with a commercial video – use a camcorder with your own video or maybe a video game system like an old Nintendo.

Note that some DVD-R’s have menu settings to select which set of inputs you use. Mine has options for “front” or “back”. Some have to be set for composite or S-video, but some will “auto sense” the correct input. Don’t connect both S-Video and composite video at the same time as this might confuse it if it has auto-sense. If this all fails, then you have a setting or other problems with the DVR-R.

If the video signal from another source works, then verify that the HR20’s composite and S-video outputs work. Even though you likely have an HDTV connected, I’ll bet it still has analog inputs, so use it to test the HR20’s outputs. If that fails, then it’s the analog outputs on the HR20. There have been a few reports of them failing, but it is rare.

If all that works, yet you still get black from the HR20, then maybe it is some sort of copy protection. I’d be surprised, though, because I’ve copied many things from my HR20’s to my DVD-R and the ATI analog capture card on my PC with no problems.

[curt8403]

Before blaming “copy protection”, I’d verify the signal. First, connect some other composite (i.e. yellow RCA) or S-video output to the DVD-R’s inputs to make sure they work. Don’t use a VCR with a commercial video – use a camcorder with your own video or maybe a video game system like an old Nintendo.

Note that some DVD-R’s have menu settings to select which set of inputs you use. Mine has options for “front” or “back”. Some have to be set for composite or S-video, but some will “auto sense” the correct input. Don’t connect both S-Video and composite video at the same time as this might confuse it if it has auto-sense. If this all fails, then you have a setting or other problems with the DVR-R.

If the video signal from another source works, then verify that the HR20’s composite and S-video outputs work. Even though you likely have an HDTV connected, I’ll bet it still has analog inputs, so use it to test the HR20’s outputs. If that fails, then it’s the analog outputs on the HR20. There have been a few reports of them failing, but it is rare.

If all that works, yet you still get black from the HR20, then maybe it is some sort of copy protection. I’d be surprised, though, because I’ve copied many things from my HR20’s to my DVD-R and the ATI analog capture card on my PC with no problems.

good point. check different cables and different sources

[gfrang]

About copy protection if you haven't bought your recorder check cc's website and read customer reviews to see which models have it and which don't. I have a older sony that recorded everything so far, but newer models are more copy protected.Some brands are less protected than others. I get very good recordings if i keep recording times at two hours or less. I recorded The Right Stuff it is a three hour movie and had a lot of compression artifacts, wish i bought some double layer discs.

[rudeney]

good point. check different cables and different sources

Dang! Good catch, Curt - I didn' even think to suggest different cables!