Add SWM8 to current 5lnb setup

[opie168]

I tried to search for this and couldn't get any results, I guess because the search words were too small that I was using.

Anyway I have the current slimline 5lnb dish that got installed about 3mo. ago and am currently using all the lines on the zinwell. I want to add a DVR but would also like to possibly add a SWM8 if you think that is better than doubling up zinwel switches. (this would be adding 1 line if using the zinwell switches since the room already has 1 for the regular box)

Currently all my lines meet outside the home at a specific location so I would have to have the Power Inserter for the SWM8 inside the house in between one of the lines as shown in the First Look by Smiddy thats posted on here I assume.
I saw the review was a little while ago and wanted to know if there were any more improvements or changes ppl have figured out that are better setups that would fit my situation. My other big question is since I have 4 lines coming off the dish and the SWM LNB dish only has 1, how the wiring needs to be done since there is an obvious difference there.
I have my installers phone number and hes a great stand up guy, so if you think they possibly have a SWM dish in Raleigh, NC on their trucks I could give him a call and he'd deff come put it up, I'd just rather not bug him untill I figure out exactly what I want to do. If I go the SWM8 route which might make the wiring easier (if you guys agree with that statement) then I'll be purchasing one off craigslist or ebay since they are so much cheaper there.

thanks in advance.

[Norm]

You may want to check out a SWM LNB. They are fairly cheap on ebay.

[texasbrit]

An SWM LNB will not work if the Zinwell multiswitch is already full, there will be too many tuners, and the SWM LNB is not expandible beyond 8. So there are three options. First, use a Zinwell WB616. Second, use four wide-band splitters, power-passing on both ports, and drive two WB68s in parallel. This is probably the solution the installer would use - don't let him cascade two WB68s (by connecting four outputs from one WB68 to the inputs of another) because this is not recommended by Zinwell and can cause problems. Third, use the four splitters and drive an SWM8 and a WB68 in parallel.
The only one the installer is likely to use is option two - he probably will not have a WB616 or an SWM8, so you will have to buy them yourself..

[Norm]

With the swm you only need one cable per box so you can have up to 8 different units hooked up.

[houskamp]

With the swm you only need one cable per box so you can have up to 8 different units hooked up.
nope.. 8 tuners.. dvr=2 tuners..

[LameLefty]

Hook up an SWM8 module in parallel with your current WB68 multiswitch. That's what I did. :)

(Pardon the mess in my crawlspace)

http://www.angryherb.net/misc/dtvwiring.jpg

This setup gives me two open SWM-compatible tuner slots (for another single-line DVR setup), plus six free HD-compatible ports on the WB68 switch (up to three more dual-line DVR setups), plus one more "legacy" port for an older receiver that can only see the 101/110/119 sats. LOTS of flexibility in this kind of setup. Power Inserter is on the SWM1 line, inside behind my living room TV between the HR21-700 and the SWM8 module (make sure to use power-passing splitters such as the Skywalkers I have).

[rudeney]

Yes, I did exactly this. I have a AT9 5-LNB dish with four feeds into splitters that then connect to the Zinwell WB68 and a SWM8. The SWM8 feeds a 4-way splitter that feeds my four HR20’s. The power inserter is in the living room, inbetween the HR20 there and the splitter, using the single power-passing port on the splitter. The WB68 feeds an H20 (still using the BBC) and an R15. I also have OTA, but it is not diplexed, it runs on separate cable with its own splitter.

http://RUDENEY.COM/SWMINSTALL.JPG

[veryoldschool]

Yes, I did exactly this.
Is your photo upside down, or did you mount everything upside down?

[David MacLeod]

Is your photo upside down, or did you mount everything upside down?

flip your pc vos.... :)

[rudeney]

LOL! No, I mounted it all upside down. It made it easier based on where the lines were running. Originally, there were two WB68's and all this was laying on the "floor" of the attic. When I went to mount it on the wall (this is an attic over an attached garage, hence the flat wall inside), I had issues with cable lengths. After routing everything where I could, it just made the most sense for the SWM8 to be on the bottom and the WB68 on top. It then made it neater to put the inputs of the two facing each other, which mean "upside down". Everything works just fine (all of my TV"s have the correct orientation!)

[David MacLeod]

LOL! No, I mounted it all upside down. It made it easier based on where the lines were running. Originally, there were two WB68's and all this was laying on the "floor" of the attic. When I went to mount it on the wall (this is an attic over an attached garage, hence the flat wall inside), I had issues with cable lengths. After routing everything where I could, it just made the most sense for the SWM8 to be on the bottom and the WB68 on top. It then made it neater to put the inputs of the two facing each other, which mean "upside down". Everything works just fine (all of my TV"s have the correct orientation!)

where's the grounds ??? lol

[rudeney]

where's the grounds ??? lol

Actually, my dish isn't even grounded. I've been meaning to get around to doing that. I really have no excuses. My grounding post is actually right under the dish. I just need to get the wire and run it.

[opie168]

Thanks for all the responses.

So if I get just the SWM8 switch then will I not need to have that power inverter that I've seen in the reviews? Thats my big hicup in wiring the thing as my wires all meet outside and split comming into the home so there is no where to get power to the inverter via elec. outlet if its located outside where the current switch is.

[veryoldschool]

Thanks for all the responses.

So if I get just the SWM8 switch then will I not need to have that power inverter that I've seen in the reviews? Thats my big hicup in wiring the thing as my wires all meet outside and split comming into the home so there is no where to get power to the inverter via elec. outlet if its located outside where the current switch is.
While the SWM can be outside, the power inserter MUST be inside. [normally it's behind a receiver, so cable --> PI -->receiver SAT input]

[rudeney]

VOS is correct. The PI is definitely not rated for outdoor use, but it can be placed anywhere on the cable between a receiver and the SWM. The only thing is that whenever there is a splitter between the PI and the SWM, it needs to be a power-passing type. Typically, a power-passing high-bandwidth splitter will have only one port that does that. The port is usually indicated by a line on the label.

For example, if you used a splitter like this:

http://www.electronicsoutfitter.com/images/items/872/17872-201-234.jpg

You’d want to make sure that the power inserter is connected to the cable tied to the port on the far left marked as “power pass”. It does not matter where (well, between 15 and 150 feet) along the cable you “insert” the power inserter. It can be located right next to the receiver at the end of that cable or anywhere between it and the SWM or splitter(s).

[opie168]

so it does not matter which line has the power inserter hooked onto it? as in it does not matter which port on the SWM8 its in line with? Also just to double check, you still have to split the line comming out of the SWM8 to go and feed a DVR or do you only need the 1 line now?

[robq391]

opie168,

I recently added a swm8 to my exisiting setup. My original setup had a wb68 w/ all 8 ports used. I replaced a h21 w/ a hr22. This left me needing 1 more port. My other problem was the room where the new hr22 was going only had 1 run of coax. Like yours, all of my coax meets in a network box on the rear of my house. This box also houses my wb68.

To solve my problem, I purchased a swm8. I cascaded the swm8 off 4 ports of the wb68. I decided to set it up this way due to somewhat limited space in the box. It was cramped before w/ the wb68, 2 diplexers, an ota splitter, 2 bbcs & the multiple short coax jumpers needed to put it all together.

The box now contains a wb68 & a swm8 & 4 12" coac jumpers. The wb68 is running 3 d11 receivers & 4 lines going to swm8. The swm8 runs a hr20 & a hr22(w/ am21) off the 2 swm ports & a r15 off 2 of the legacy ports. The swm pi is located on the line just prior to the hr20 inside the house.

The swm pi is an approximate distance of 75' from the swm8. Both multi switches are 150' from the dish. I have no amplifiers in this setup. I used qs rg6 throughtout. I have no problems & all signals are 90-100. I have room for 6 more tuners(4 on swm8 + 1 legacy & 1 on wb68) before I need to change.

Hope this helps.



*Hello & how ya doin' VOS???

[rudeney]

so it does not matter which line has the power inserter hooked onto it? as in it does not matter which port on the SWM8 its in line with? Also just to double check, you still have to split the line comming out of the SWM8 to go and feed a DVR or do you only need the 1 line now?

The Power Inserter has to be connected “somewhere” along the cable that is fed from the SWM-1 port. It will not work connected to the SWM-2 port. For SWM-compatible DVR’s (HR2x, R22, or R16), they only require one cable to Tuner 1 as they have internal splitters for the SWM signal. Of course DVR’s count as two tuners, and a SWM8 can still handle only 8 tuners total. For example, I have four HR20’s connected to my SWM8 so it is full.

[br408408]

As for connecting your power inserter, open the link http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=129302, click on the .pdf and look at Figure 10 on page 3. Your splitter would go where all your home runs end up. The rome run that is connected to the RED power passing output on the splitter would have the power inserter connected inline just before the RG6 is connected to the receiver. Figure 10 is for the Swmline LNB of course, in your case the input to your splitter would be the SWM 1 output on your SWM-8

[opie168]

Just so I'm getting this right, If I run the four lines from teh sat. directly into the SWM8 to begin with. Can I take a 1-4 spliter off the FTM1 port on the SWM8 and run my lines off that to my 2 HR21 recievers (1 line to each reciever) and then the other 2 lines running to a regular HD box and then the last to a regular SD box?

Or, if I had these recievers: 2 HR21's, 1 SD box, 1 R15 SD DVR.
Can I take a 1-4 spliter off the FTM1 port on the SWM8 and run my lines off that to my 2 HR21 recievers (1 line to each reciever) and then the other 2 lines running to a regular SD box and then the last to the R15 DVR box with it bieng split into 2 lines in front of the R15 since its not SWM compatable(correct me if im wrong though)?



Or do I need to use the other FTM2 port on the SWM8 or the legacy ports?

This is all done with making sure the power inserter is on FTM1 connected to the power passing port on the spliter too.

thanks again for all the help so far.
Btw I currently have 1 HR21, 1 SD rec., 1 HD rec, and 1 R15 SD DVR. My plan is to replace either the R15 or the HD rec with an HD DVR soon. I am leaning on replacing the HD rec with the HD DVR which will req. the extra port/line comming into my house since the WB68 is currently full.

[LameLefty]

Check out the pics posted above again.

The R15 has to be connected to two of the legacy ports if you're not gonna hook things up in parallel. It cannot be on one of the SWM legs.

You can hook everything off SWM1 using a 4-way splitter or (as I have done), use both SWM ports, so long as the PI is running off of SWM1.

[opie168]

when I was talking about the setups in my post I was looking at it as in the SWM8 would be the only switch and I would NOT use the WB68 for the time being.

If doing it like that still have to use the legacy ports for the R15? I assume it does not matter where the regular SD box is connected since you didn't mention that above right??

[rudeney]

You can only use SWM-compatible receivers (H2x, HR2x, R22, R16 and D12) on the SWM outputs. Other receivers must use the legacy ports. No matter how many times you split the SWM, it can only handle 8 tuners. Even though you only connect one line to a SWM-compatible DVR, it counts as two tuners (unless you are willing to disable one in the IRD's setup menu). As for SWM port 1 vs SWM port 2, using either or both does not change the number or type of tuners that can be connected. The only difference is that the PI must be used only on SWM port 1; it won't work on SWM port 2. If you do feed everything from SWM-1, then make sure SWM-2 is terminated. Oh, and the legacy ports do not count toward the SWM tuner's maximum, so a SWM8 can actually handle 11 tuners - 8 on the SWM ports and 3 on the legacy ports.

[rudeney]

when I was talking about the setups in my post I was looking at it as in the SWM8 would be the only switch and I would NOT use the WB68 for the time being.

If doing it like that still have to use the legacy ports for the R15? I assume it does not matter where the regular SD box is connected since you didn't mention that above right??

The R15 is not SWM-compatible so it must use the legacy ports. If you want both tuners active on it, you will need to run two cables from two of the legacy ports, just like you would have to do if it was connected to a WB68 or other non-SWM switch. What model is the SD receiver? If it's not a D12, then it will also have to be fed from a legacy port.

[David MacLeod]

when I was talking about the setups in my post I was looking at it as in the SWM8 would be the only switch and I would NOT use the WB68 for the time being.

If doing it like that still have to use the legacy ports for the R15? I assume it does not matter where the regular SD box is connected since you didn't mention that above right??

if you have receivers that don't accept swm parallel use of wb68 may be best bet. 1 dvr and 1 rec max out legacy ports.

[opie168]

thanks for the response's Rudeney really cleared it up there for me with his last post.

thanks again, now i just gotta get a deal on the hddvr somehow so i can add another to my account. hehe

[rudeney]

Glad I could help! My understanding is that you should be able to get $100 off a new receiver every 6 months. YMMV!

[claycruncher]

opie168,

I recently added a swm8 to my exisiting setup. My original setup had a wb68 w/ all 8 ports used. I replaced a h21 w/ a hr22. This left me needing 1 more port. My other problem was the room where the new hr22 was going only had 1 run of coax. Like yours, all of my coax meets in a network box on the rear of my house. This box also houses my wb68.

To solve my problem, I purchased a swm8. I cascaded the swm8 off 4 ports of the wb68. I decided to set it up this way due to somewhat limited space in the box. It was cramped before w/ the wb68, 2 diplexers, an ota splitter, 2 bbcs & the multiple short coax jumpers needed to put it all together.

The box now contains a wb68 & a swm8 & 4 12" coac jumpers. The wb68 is running 3 d11 receivers & 4 lines going to swm8. The swm8 runs a hr20 & a hr22(w/ am21) off the 2 swm ports & a r15 off 2 of the legacy ports. The swm pi is located on the line just prior to the hr20 inside the house.

The swm pi is an approximate distance of 75' from the swm8. Both multi switches are 150' from the dish. I have no amplifiers in this setup. I used qs rg6 throughtout. I have no problems & all signals are 90-100. I have room for 3 more tuners(2 on swm8 & 1 on wb68) before I need to change.

Hope this helps.



*Hello & how ya doin' VOS???

I am currently running 2 cascading zinwell wb616 multiswitches. From your description I could cascade the swm8 from the second zinwell to provide me 8 swm lines to connect another 8 hd or sd dvrs. Do I have this correct?

[veryoldschool]

I am currently running 2 cascading zinwell wb616 multiswitches. From your description I could cascade the swm8 from the second zinwell to provide me 8 swm lines to connect another 8 hd or sd dvrs. Do I have this correct?
So you have: WB616 ->WB616 and you want to add ->SWM8
Why not add the SWM8 off the first WB616?
(#1) WB616-->(#2) WB616
(#1) WB616 --> SWM8

[claycruncher]

So you have: WB616 ->WB616 and you want to add ->SWM8
Why not add the SWM8 off the first WB616?
(#1) WB616-->(#2) WB616
(#1) WB616 --> SWM8

I could do that as well. What I was trying to confirm is that I could cascade a SWM8 off of either of the WB616's. This SWM is totally new to me so I am just learning and trying to figure out what will be the easiest configuration for me to set up. Currently I have one room with an HR22 and a Tivo DVR (don't know the model number off hand) but have maxed out the 4 coax that feeds that room. I want to run an OTA cable to an am21 to get local HD to the HR22. If I can run the HR22 with one line instead of two, it will free up one of my lines to deliver the OTA signal to the am21.

P.S. VOS: Did you work for for D* before? You are quite knowledgeable and I enjoy your post on the various forums. Thanks for all the advice.:D

[veryoldschool]

I could do that as well. What I was trying to confirm is that I could cascade a SWM8 off of either of the WB616's. This SWM is totally new to me so I am just learning and trying to figure out what will be the easiest configuration for me to set up. Currently I have one room with an HR22 and a Tivo DVR (don't know the model number off hand) but have maxed out the 4 coax that feeds that room. I want to run an OTA cable to an am21 to get local HD to the HR22. If I can run the HR22 with one line instead of two, it will free up one of my lines to deliver the OTA signal to the am21.

P.S. VOS: Did you work for for D* before? You are quite knowledgeable and I enjoy your post on the various forums. Thanks for all the advice.:D
[P.S.] No I haven't, but "your tax dollars" kept me quite busy [and if I told you what I did, you know I'd have to... :lol: ].

So why do you have two WB616? How many receivers do you have? Even with these cascaded, you have 28 outputs?
A SWM will free up a cable for your AM21.
Instead of cascading multiswitches, they work better if run in parallel. About $10 worth of splitters would feed two multi-switches this way and is the preferred method.

[claycruncher]

[P.S.] No I haven't, but "your tax dollars" kept me quite busy [and if I told you what I did, you know I'd have to... :lol: ].

So why do you have two WB616? How many receivers do you have? Even with these cascaded, you have 28 outputs?
A SWM will free up a cable for your AM21.
Instead of cascading multiswitches, they work better if run in parallel. About $10 worth of splitters would feed two multi-switches this way and is the preferred method.

I run 11 receivers of which 4 are dvrs. As I transition to HD in my household I will be replacing some of the receivers with dvrs. I could have gotten by with one WB616, but would not have had any room for growth.

I cascaded the 2 WB616 because that was what the tech guy at Zinwell told me to do. Maybe you could explain why it is better to run them in parallel than to cascade them. I've seen a number of post with different guy's installation and splitting the satellite feeds seem to be preferred but I'd like to understand the technical reasons this is a better installation method. Thanks for the info!

[David MacLeod]

for 1 thing you lose 4 ports off your total available. $10 in splitters to go parallel fixes this. with that much investment in switches why limit them.
VOS or someone more knowledgeable than I can speak of the switching/signal specifics.

[claycruncher]

for 1 thing you lose 4 ports off your total available. $10 in splitters to go parallel fixes this. with that much investment in switches why limit them.
VOS or someone more knowledgeable than I can speak of the switching/signal specifics.

Had I been reading this forum before I bought the 2 WB616s, I would have gone another route. But at this point I've already spent the money on the 2 WB 616s. My problem now is I have a room where one wire technology will allow me to bring OTA to an AM21. It looks like I'll have to bite the bullet and buy a SWM any way.

Since I have to buy the SWM I'm trying to understand if it's worth it to rewire using the splitters on the satellite feeds or just cascade the SWM off the WB616 since I have adequate ports between the 2 WB616s. The cascading of the 2 WB616s seems to be working fine. Thanks for the help.

[veryoldschool]

Maybe you could explain why it is better to run them in parallel than to cascade them. I've seen a number of post with different guy's installation and splitting the satellite feeds seem to be preferred but I'd like to understand the technical reasons this is a better installation method. Thanks for the info!
Since your switches are powered, you don't have the DC problems to power the dish that you would with the WB68s, which Zinwell doesn't recommend to be cascaded.
Splitting the RF to each switch means they receive the same RF level, where cascading would have the second switch at "some level" less than the first [this "could be" only 10% of the first]. add this same loss to the outputs of the second switch, and your receivers would be running at significantly different levels off of the second. In fair weather, you won't notice this as there is a lot of "head room". As the signal drops [rainfade] some receivers could start having 771 errors while others don't.
As you feed many receivers, you want to balancing the RF levels. In a simple system this isn't an issue [hard], but the more complex it comes, the more important it is, so all receivers are running at the highest level they can.
Think of it as a pyramid with the dish at the top and the same number of legs [loss] going to each receiver.

[claycruncher]

Thanks VOS. That makes alot of sense. I will be changing my configuration to run the switches in parallel.

[claycruncher]

VOS, one more question. Can you split each of the 4 satellite feeds more than twice so you could feed 3 or 4 switches? What would be the maximum you would want to split the satellite feed? To be clear what is the maximum number of multiswitches (WB68, wb616 or SWM8) you would want to run in parallel?

[veryoldschool]

VOS, one more question. Can you split each of the 4 satellite feeds more than twice so you could feed 3 or 4 switches? What would be the maximum you would want to split the satellite feed? To be clear what is the maximum number of multiswitches (WB68, wb616 or SWM8) you would want to run in parallel?
Skywalker makes nice 4-way splitters. Once you understand how the RF levels "breakdown", you can split them over and over. As the loss increases, you add amps to compensate. Large apartment complexes need to do this.

[claycruncher]

Thaks again. Can you recommend some reading so I can better "understand how the RF levels "breakdown", so I can know when to add amp? As you are aware the WB616 comes with an amp and the SWM8 has a power inserter so is this adequate amplification for each multi switch if I run these 3 in parallel?

[veryoldschool]

Thaks again. Can you recommend some reading so I can better "understand how the RF levels "breakdown", so I can know when to add amp? As you are aware the WB616 comes with an amp and the SWM8 has a power inserter so is this adequate amplification for each multi switch if I run these 3 in parallel?
I didn't [don't] know the WB616 does have an amp. Do you have any links?
I know the Spaun switches do, but they're $600, and are "slope compensated" as the loss through a cable isn't equal for all frequencies.
"Better understand RF"? :lol: [sorry but for many it's "magic"]
The field of RF is so complex, I don't know of a good book to recommend.
Most of what I read is out of print by now [see my user name ;)].
Unless you have some very long cable runs [greater than 150'] amps shouldn't be needed.

[claycruncher]

I purchased the WB616s from Solid Signal. This is from the information page:

"The WB616 is active, powered only by an external AC/DC power module. There is no off-the-shelf equivalent multi-switch. The FlexPorts require selection codes unique to DIRECTV; other ports can be accessed with either tone/voltages or selection codes."

Here's a link to the product page at SS:

http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?prod=WB616

Thanks again VOS for being so much help.
Regards, Jim

[LameLefty]

"Better understand RF"? :lol: [sorry but for many it's "magic"]
The field of RF is so complex, I don't know of a good book to recommend.


My two required EE classes as an engineering undergrad, plus a couple of the "non-dumbed-down Physics for Engineers" type classes taught me just enough to know there's too much for me to learn. A good friend of mine said that our EE classes should have been titled "Sparks & Magic" :)

[veryoldschool]

I purchased the WB616s from Solid Signal. This is from the information page:

"The WB616 is active, powered only by an external AC/DC power module. There is no off-the-shelf equivalent multi-switch. The FlexPorts require selection codes unique to DIRECTV; other ports can be accessed with either tone/voltages or selection codes."

Here's a link to the product page at SS:

http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?prod=WB616

Thanks again VOS for being so much help.
Regards, Jim
A quick check of the link has nothing about an amp. The "power" is DC for the dish LNBs.
I see nothing about RF amplification, as with the Zinwell site also.

[claycruncher]

A quick check of the link has nothing about an amp. The "power" is DC for the dish LNBs.
I see nothing about RF amplification, as with the Zinwell site also.

I thought the power units were to provide amplification. That goes to show you how much I know! Does the power inserter for the swm8 perform the same function; that is provide power for the LNBs and is not an amplifier?

[David MacLeod]

VOS, do the sonara (sp?) lockers provide RF amplification?
you explained some of this to me before but I don't remember this part.
I think the answer is no, they just lock.

[veryoldschool]

I thought the power units were to provide amplification. That goes to show you how much I know! Does the power inserter for the swm8 perform the same function; that is provide power for the LNBs and is not an amplifier?
In the SWM, the DC is like other powered multi-switches and powers the LNBs, but the RF "path" is much different than other multi-switches, since it changes frequencies. There is loss as it does this so it needs to amplify the signal. It hasn't been given how much gain there is, just that there is some.

[veryoldschool]

VOS, do the sonara (sp?) lockers provide RF amplification?
you explained some of this to me before but I don't remember this part.
I think the answer is no, they just lock.
"Right" [they just lock], and Sonora makes amps too.

[claycruncher]

What are the indicators that the signal requires amplification? Pixelation? No signal at all? etc?

[hdtvfan0001]

"Right" [they just lock], and Sonora makes amps too.

Actually I experience about a 2% signal gain with the Sonora unit, but as VOS indicated...anything more required a true amplification device.

[veryoldschool]

What are the indicators that the signal requires amplification? Pixelation? No signal at all? etc?
Yes to both.
"Basically" if you have good levels at the dish and don't by the time they get to the receiver, then there is too much loss in the line. This shouldn't be a problem if the line is less than 150'.

[veryoldschool]

Actually I experience about a 2% signal gain with the Sonora unit, but as VOS indicated...anything more required a true amplification device.
That 2% most likely was from the lack of a voltage drop, since the locker is a volt or two above what the receivers output.

[LameLefty]

I got a couple of points gain across the board on each transponder when I added a SWM, though since I did it in parallel with the existing WB68 I would have expected that to have resulted in some minor decrease from splitting the outputs from the dish. But there you go.

[doctor j]

In the SWM, the DC is like other powered multi-switches and powers the LNBs, but the RF "path" is much different than other multi-switches, since it changes frequencies. There is loss as it does this so it needs to amplify the signal. It hasn't been given how much gain there is, just that there is some.

My instruction in MFH-2 systems last year has me recalling that the SWM-8 has an AGC circuit that may be as much as 30 dB. AGC = automatic gain compensation. ie: the output is a fixed dBm level over a specified input range and that things such as rain fade can be compensated for at a significalnt level (?30dB) then fails rapidly. At nominal input very little amplification is taking place.
I'll see if I can dig up those specs.

Doctor j

[veryoldschool]

My instruction in MFH-2 systems last year has me recalling that the SWM-8 has an AGC circuit that may be as much as 30 dB. AGC = automatic gain compensation. ie: the output is a fixed dBm level over a specified input range and that things such as rain fade can be compensated for at a significalnt level (?30dB) then fails rapidly. At nominal input very little amplification is taking place.
I'll see if I can dig up those specs.

Doctor j
Please see if you can dig that up.
"My Butt" has a problem with this because:
Distance from dish to SWM is/should be 45', so input levels are important.
30 dB of gain is... well a lot. I'd guess 13 dB would be more "like it" and this would be to compensate for the conversion loss [and variations]. The AGC would seem to be on the output and might go to explain the 15' min to the PI and the SWM #2 coming with a termination too.
"My Butt" isn't always right, so my brain is waiting. :lol:

[doctor j]

per MFH-2 Training module:

"Provides up to 30 dB of Auto Gain Control for the satellite signal"

However specs say:
Input window -45~-15 dBmper transponder
Typical output -30 dBm (another place -31dBm)per channel @ SWM port

Thus at least 15 if not 30 dBm AGC amplification by SWM-8

Doctor j

[veryoldschool]

per MFH-2 Training module:

"Provides up to 30 dB of Auto Gain Control for the satellite signal"

However specs say:
Input window -45~-15 dBmper transponder
Typical output -30 dBm (another place -31dBm)per channel @ SWM port

Thus at least 15 if not 30 dBm AGC amplification by SWM-8

Doctor j
My butt just got smarter.
input -15 to -45 dBm
output - 30 dBm
conversions loss ?
"Total gain"= -15 to +15 dB [aka 30 dB AGC range].

[rudeney]

Just more arguments for going SWM.