frustrating signal problems

[j_clay]

I have directv and my main receiver is in my bedroom (good receiver). it has dvr and works perfectly. my problem is that our other receiver is in our living room (bad receiver) and not all the channels come in. now when i unplug the good receiver the bad reciever works perfect. its tricky though because even with the good receiver unplugged and the bad receiver working if i turn on my overhead light i lose some channels. directv has been out to my house and replaced the receiver and still the same problem, they blame it on my houses wiring. anyway i enjoy directv but if i cant get it to work properly on both tvs then ill have to switch, any advice or tips on how to adress the problem will be greatly appreciated.

[say-what]

If the overhead light causes you to lose channels, it's the wiring. You're going to need to make sure the wire doesn't have any splitters and that it is routed away from the wiring for the lights - also, it's probably cheap cable, so you're going to want to make sure you get RG6 cables.

[j_clay]

ok bear with me please im not the most tech savvy. when i go in my attic and i find my directv cable what will i be looking for. thx again.
do i just run new cable and keep it away from the electrical wiring

[Davenlr]

You didnt mention if you had a HD dish or a standard dish. When you say you lose some channels, are they satellite channels or local antenna channels?

Also, find the 4 wires coming off the dish. They should run into a ground block, which should have a ground wire running to your power breaker box, or the point where your power enters your house. Make sure you have one. If you do not, either hire someone to install one, or if you have the service plan, get Directv to come install one. If the wording on your cable says RG-59, you need to have the cables replaced.

What you describe is a ground loop. You .might. be able to fix it by powering the "bad" receiver from a UPS, but in any event, switching services will only move the problem to a different provider. Until you find the power/cable problem, you will be unhappy.

If the channels you lose are antenna received locals, then its going to be a totally different solution, let us know.

[j_clay]

standard dish still because we dont want to pay extra for the hd if it doesnt work. as for the channels that dont come in they are espn, history channel and such all the local fox, cbs, and abc channels come in


i just look inside the box that the wires from the dish run into, those wires run into a 3x4 multi switch. the only thing i can see on the wire is rg 6 75
but that was only one wire

also there is a ground wire inside that same box that the dish cables run into

also if you can tell me where to get a ups that will work for my problem

[Davenlr]

Is there a ground wire attached to the ground terminal on the multiswitch? Try this... take a 7/16 wrench. turn each connector on the multiswitch 1/4 turn counter-clockwise, the back clockwise until snug (but not overly tight). See if that corrects your problem. If not, and the dish is safely accessable, do the same for the connectors on the lnb on the dish, taking care not to move the dish. If any connectors show any sign or rust or moisture, replace it with a compression F connector.

If the multiswitch is powered (plugged into a A/c outlet, try installing a surge protector on that outlet. Most cheap surge protects use two capacitors to ground, which might help.

Your cable is RG6 75 ohms, and unless its physically damaged, should be adequate.

Just a note...if you upgrade to HD they will replace the entire dish and all the cables, multiswitch, and ground the system correctly, and ensure it works correctly (you might have to monitor them to make sure they dont cut any corners like no ground, or reusing current cables).

[j_clay]

ok there is a ground wire that comes out of my house and connects to some kind of nut connecting it to another wire which connects to the side of the 3x4 switch

i took some photos if that helps

[Davenlr]

Sounds like its grounded ok. If you attached the pictures, I didnt see them, but might have my browser configured wrong. Did loosening and retightening the cables help?

Im guessing you are just using the 101 sat, since 110 is HD. Im not going to worry with 119, since you said the locals were coming in ok. Can you post the signal levels on your 101 sat. You should have a few 0's and a couple other low numbers on the spot transponders, but Ill compare the nationals with my signal here, and see if we can detect a problem.

[j_clay]

i tightened the bolts on 3x4 but its been raining and i dont want to get on the roof right now. also i live in phoenix.

[Davenlr]

Also, it you have a DVR (two cables to the bedroom right?) and another receiver in the Living Room (is it a one cable or DVR?), thats a max of 4 cables. Why are you using a multiswitch I am wondering? Do you have a rooftop antenna, with a splitter looking device attached behind the receiver(s)?

[j_clay]

http://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&ik=01aab9973c&view=att&th=11e71c8882dba277&attid=0.1&disp=inline&realattid=f_fp6epzmf0&zw
heres a photo of the connection i'll get the signals up in a minute

[Davenlr]

I dont have a Gmail account. You can email me the pic if you like to davenlr@yahoo.com.

[j_clay]

Satellite Transponders (32 total at 101)
1-8: 19 85 20 0 21 96 68 96
9-16: 91 92 95 0 0 98 0 98
17-24: 94 83 95 100 95 99 96 98
25-32: 95 69 96 88 96 99 95 99

[Davenlr]

Transponders 1,3,4,5,7,13,15 are low. Do you have a phase 3 (3 lnb) dish, or one 18" single dish right now?

[j_clay]

i have just one dish

[Davenlr]

That one unused outlet on your multiswitch, make sure that cable thats right below it, isnt touching the multiswitch. Not likely the problem, but could be.

[j_clay]

so if i put electrical tape around the unused outlet will that be good enough cause all those cables are jammed in a box and it would be hard to keep them from touching

[Davenlr]

Id try that first, since for some reason, they have the output cable running a few inches and then its spliced with a barrel connector It looks like, I dont see why they would do that. Yea, try to isolate stuff in there from touching, and see if it changes any of your signal readings on those low transponders. If it does, you fixed it. If not, you might have a bad cable, lnb, or multiswitch. We can determine which it is, when the weather is better and you can check the two coax connections up on the dish. Start there, and work your way down. Im pretty sure its not your receiver though.

[j_clay]

im out of electrical tape so i used duct tape and now over half the signals are at zero. also i notice a random coax cable coming out of wall into that box that isn't connected to anything.

[j_clay]

just tried again and i have 7 zeros

[Davenlr]

Found your problem then, one of those connectors on the multiswitch or splices are bad. If you lost all the even transponders its the one labeled 18V, if you lost the odds, its the one labeled 13V on the top of the multiswitch.

If they are random, its probably one of the splices or the output cables. That extra cable probably goes to an old tv antenna or a fourth cable run, hard to tell.

[j_clay]

just ran another test
1-8 0 95 0 0 0 99 0 99
9-16 9 96 33 0 42 99 36 99
17-24 41 91 48 100 41 99 0 99
25-32 74 73 85 94 0 99 92 100

[Davenlr]

Thats weird as hell. One of those connectors is barely making connection. do you have someone who can watch the signal reading on the receiver on the single transponder screen while you tap on each connector to see which one causes the signal to fail?

[j_clay]

yeah your talking about the view signal strength screen

[Davenlr]

Yeam the one with a single transponder, not the one with all 32. Set it on transponder 1, and try tapping connectors, see if you can find one that causes it to jump up.

[j_clay]

so go to transponder 4 since its been at zero and then go tap all the 18v and 13 v and see which one makes some noise

[Davenlr]

Yep, that should work. Do you have the protection plan?

[j_clay]

i dont know

[Davenlr]

If you did, it would be listed on your bill each month. Just thought if you did have it, you could just have Directv come replace the whole dish and all for free, instead of trying to fix it yourself.

[j_clay]

weve had directv for over a year and they've come out twice to fix it. both times we kept our problem and were charge for service

[Davenlr]

If they charged you, you dont have it. If the problem wasnt fixed, I would personally email them and explain this (or guide them to this thread) and politely request a free service call to find which cable is bad, since its obviously in that area if moving the wires cause transponders to drop out and come back.

If you want to forgo all that, we can find the bad one, but you wont have the compression tool or connector to replace it, and those things cost about $60 for a cheap one.

[j_clay]

i wouldnt mind finding out what is wrong because the guy they send out really doesnt seem like he knows what hes doing, so if its just tapping on the connectors than im game

[Davenlr]

If tapping doesnt show you which one is bad...

This is what *I* would do... if you feel up to it...

Snug up the two top connectors on the multiswitch.

Power off both receivers and unplug them.

Disconnect the three lower connectors from the multiswitch and check them for water inside, rust, etc.

REconnect the two that have the same connector color and power up the single receiver in the living room. If you have no signal on any transponders, thats good. Power up the DVR and see how signals look on both tuners. If both are good, you know its the connector to the "bad" receiver in the living room, or the splice in that line (the one still disconnected. If the receiver in the living room works with that one cable disconnected, power it off and unplug it, replace that cable and remove the next one. and repeat.
until you find the line that gives you zero readings in the living room. Thats likely the bad one. You need to observe how much copper wire pokes out of the connector. If one is short inside the connector, it could be making a very bad contact inside the switch. They should all sick out to at least the edge of the outside of the connector.

[j_clay]

all right thank you. it is raining pretty good right now so i will until tomorrow, but i will post the results. again thanks again for your time hopefully we can fix this and make it worth it.

[Davenlr]

Good deal. Sending an email...

[j_clay]

after i disconnect the three cables does it matter if i plug them back into the same slots or can they go into any of the 4.(rx1, rx2......)

[Davenlr]

doesnt matter, any of the four...unless one port on the switch is bad. All 4 ports have all transponders available on it.