Scott's Thoughts on HDNet, the SuperDish and MORE!

[Scott Greczkowski]

Hello folks, what a week it's been! We thank you for sticking it out with us, all the problems have ultimately been worth it will all kinds of exciting Dish Network News!

I have been hearing all kinds of things from my sources (both official sources at Dish Network and no official sources as well) and most everything is conflicting with what everyone else is saying.

So I will now give you my thoughts on whats going on. (These are just my thoughts and are not those of DBSTalk.COM, SatelltieTalk.COM, Dish Network or Echostar)

I also ask that you not get upset at Dish or any other company for my thoughts on the subject, I am just raising some questions here which need to be answered. Do not consider what I am saying here to be gospel, these again are just my own thoughts.

While I am very excited by the news and this is something I have been waiting a long long time for, I honestly believe Dish Network is putting to many eggs in one basket.

All the things they have announced have depended on them launching the new satellite which will go to 121, I have heard no plans on what happens if 121 blows up in launch or does not function correctly when it reaches orbit.

A few weeks ago Dish announced it would be adding 100 international channels, now yesterday it announces its adding 2 HDNet Channels (HDNet Sports is on hold for now from HDNet) and in their press release they announce that they will have room for 50 HD Channels. And then they announce that they are also adding 42 new local markets.

So let's see if I am reading this correctly 121 will host 100 Internationals, 42 new local markets (with the avg of 6 local channels per market for a total of 252 Channels) plus 50 HD Channels. I would really like to see how they are going to do that, even compressing the channels using a 10 to 1 ratio (just on the Standard Def Channels they would need 39 transponders (and they only have 32) So where are they going to fit the 50 HD Channels?

I have been contacted by a few people last night saying that the HD Channels would be put on 110 which makes more sense to me and would eliminate the need for a "SuperDish" (which I don't like anyways, I don't want to advertise to the world I have a HDTV, a Dish like that has "Come rob me" written all over it.)

And speaking of the SuperDish has anyone noticed that while its supposed to see 3 slots (110, 119, 121) there is only a DISHPRO Twin LNB on it which can look only at two slots? The 121 satellite is a KU/KA Bird and will require a different type of LNB.

Another question comes up, I have been told by a few sources that the SuperDish will not work with the Dish 6000 and that only DishPro receivers will be able to use it. What does this mean for 6000 owners? Will they be able to see the new HD channels if the go to 121? What did we spend all that money on 8PSK adapters if our 6000's will not be able to see the new satellite?

And what about those folks out there who currently point at 61.5 for HD will they need to disconnect their 61.5 feed? And what if those people also have SkyAngel? What kind of switch is going to be needed to see 4 orbital locations? Are the folks with Legacy equipment going to have to upgrade to Dishpro technology and buy adapters so that their old legacy equipment still works?

Now on to the 811, I am told that in the picture where you see the HDTV and Receiver combo package, that the receiver shown IS the 811 (Looks like the 6000 don't it?) I have been told that the 811 is really just a 6000 with more memory (for openTV) a new Dishpro compatible satellite tuner and the UHF remote circuitry is gone. This to me actually makes sense, as the 6000 is a very stable receiver and there is really no need to reinvent the wheel to make the 821.

Again ultimately this all hinges on the 121 satellite successfully launching and working correctly and stay working correctly (there is no backup for 121 is it fails) so I ask again is Dish putting to many eggs in one basket?

Don't get me wrong, I want this to succeed for Dish Network but at the same time I must take the what if approach. These are questions that need answers, if I were an invester I would be concerned. Let's hope on next week's tech chat many of these questions are answered.


Thanks for visiting DBSTalk.COM / SatelliteTalk.COM today, I am Scott Greczkowski.

[JMikeF]

Another question comes up, I have been told by a few sources that the SuperDish will not work with the Dish 6000 and that only DishPro receivers will be able to use it. What does this mean for 6000 owners? Will they be able to see the new HD channels if the go to 121? What did we spend all that money on 8PSK adapters if our 6000's will not be able to see the new satellite?

As an early adopter who has shelled out major coin to support Dish's HD intiative, I demand that they replace without cost any equipment needed to continue to receive HD. PERIOD.

[Randy_B]

Agree. Aside from the new HD initiatives, E* NEEDS to concentrate harder on making what they have better. Bug free PVRs, enhanced features on the E* PVRs, Interactive features, home media server (feed many TVs from one box, not just 2), MORE Channels (hint -- PBSKids!).

[patmac01234]

HAS ANYONE seen a photograph of the SuperDish ?

[Lee L]

Let's hope they do have some better answers than , "hey, some new stuff is coming RSN, it will be real k3wl, we promise." I am a little PO'ed that they are now giving the 8PSK mod for free with DHD year sub as I just bought the darn thing for $50 anticipating ESPN coming. Also, if they are doing the yearly deal for DHD it sure seems like they are not going to be offering it as some kind of package any time soon either. Plus, it sure will suck to have my 6000 made obsolete to see HDTV with this new system if that is how this goes. Maybe Dish has been taking lessons from Mitsubishi on how to piss off loyal customers. ;)

[motjes2]

Scott,

these are all excellent concerns. I hope we can get answer to all of these soon. I am sure that dish will figure out a way to do it. I have spent about $1,200 in two 6000 receivers in the past 12 months. Dish should be able to replace them for free or small fee if they are not going to work with this superdish.

[sampatterson]

Other issue:

The 121 bird doesn't use circular polarity also, so definately the new triple LNB will have to have 2 LNBs with Circular (for 119 & 110), and one with Hor/Ver for 121.

121s Ku output power is significantly less than the DBS birds. With a 66 cm "super" dish, rain fade will be more of an issue on channels coming from the 121 satellite.

There was no mention of how many new shopping channels had to be added to pay for some of the extra channels they are adding ;)

If they move all locals from 110 & 119 to 121, this would be the best for HDTV. But it would mean replacing everyone's dish for free to the new super dish (can't see them doing that). I can only guess that they will put all the HD channels on 121, and any new locals added to there also.

I guess we now know why the 921 is being delayed. Probably to coincide with 121 going live (probably in September if the July launch goes as planned). It will then ship with a new super dish with the correct lnbs, and software to support 3 sats.

Just guesses / comments, I have absolutely no inside info.

[Frapp]

Dish is making some very "Speculative" announcements in an attempt to slow down all the positive public relations news DirecTV has enjoyed lately.

If they do indeed put the HD at the 121. slot instead of 110., they can put a fork in my Dish account ( and probably many others )because it will be "DONE". I am already fighting to keep my 119. signal because of huge tree growth issues and the wife and I keep saying: Why don't we just go back to cable ( with a high speed modem no less ) :shrug:

[Richard King]

Rampant speculation is great fun, but:
I have heard no plans on what happens if 121 blows up in launch I am sure that any contracts that they have to provide the many services from this location are contingent on getting the satellite into it's proper place in the sky and once there having it work correctly. They can't simply wait to announce anything until the bird is in place. What they have done is provide "forward looking statements".

And speaking of the SuperDish has anyone noticed that while its supposed to see 3 slots (110, 119, 121) there is only a DISHPRO Twin LNB on it which can look only at two slots?IT'S A MOCK UP OF THE REAL DISH. I am sure that the LNB will do what it needs to do for the required function. They show mock ups of many products at these shows every year. The 721 was shown as a mock up. The 921, same story. They showed a combo Dish receiver/DVD player one year as a mock up that never made it to market. The LNB housing for three slots will probably be a fraction of an inch wider than what they showed, but will be very similar since the two birds are so close.
Another question comes up, I have been told by a few sources that the SuperDish will not work with the Dish 6000 and that only DishPro receivers will be able to use it.I am sure it will work just fine with legacy adapters. Stirring people up with this kind of speculation at this stage is totally irresponsible.
if I were an invester I would be concerned.Well, considering that Dish broke out to a new 52 week high today, I don't think the market agrees. The market (and myself as an investor in Dish) took this as good news.

[Scott Greczkowski]

Here is a picture of the SuperDish from our friends at SkyRetailer.COM

http://www.skyretailer.com/teamsummit1.shtm

[Scott Greczkowski]

Rking, while you may look at things one way I see things another and my concerns are valid.

All's I see currently is "Smoke and Mirrors"

Let's hope these questions get answered and soon. :)

[Richard King]

my concerns are validWe don't know this, yet. I doubt very much that they are.

[JMikeF]

Hey Scott,
Doesn't Dish provide free Dish 500 upgrades when folks want to upgrade their subscriptions? Hope they follow suit with HD....

Rking: seems to me that Scott is far more connected than you are. What information do you have that allows you to blow off Scott's concerns?

[Rick_EE]

Scott's concern about advertising that he has HD interests me. I live in a relatively low-crime area. I am curious, do large TV's get stolen a lot in other areas? It seems to be a difficult task. Or are you worried that the tuners, etc would get ripped?

[Scott Greczkowski]

My house is an electronics haven, with lots of pcs, laptops, tv's etc.

We have an alarm system but many times my wife forgets to turn it on. :(

Just don't like to advertise that I have a HDTV to all who drive by that all.

[tampa8]

I have to say I am blown away at those being so pessimistic. One day all I see posted is how dish has promised to be leader in HD and so far nothing, then they announce plans to not only provide new HD progamming, but that they are preparing to carry many such channels. Now posts are dissing that!. People are complaining they want their locals. Dish announces they are adding some 42 markets and now there are posts that call it all "smoke and mirrors." Then the complaints about having to have two dishes turns into complaints there will be one dish that will beg people to "rob" them. And within a day of what should be some good news for the DBS community and Dish in particular, I see people demanding things already without knowing the facts. What has this forum turned into? Some problems with some receivers aside, all I see is constant leadership from Dish and Charlie. They are financially responsible yet seem to be forging ahead with new and better receivers and programming. Am I out of line to suggest it seems nothing will make some of you happy? It is important to talk about what needs to change and Dish certainly can improve in some areas, but it just seems to be all negative recently.
All of that said, I want to be clear I really like this forum, it is informative and we get to say what is on our mind.

[sampatterson]

If someone can steal (or even carry) my upstairs direct view 36" HDTV (470+ pounds), they deserve to have it! ;)

[sampatterson]

I am not pessimistic, just being realistic to keep my hope from getting dashed by their announcements. (still waiting for the 921...) ;)

[Rayser]

My house was broken into a couple of months ago. They did not touch any of the HDTV or DBS stuff. Both DVD players and a game system were taken.


How many DBS satellites have blown up on launch? Has any DBS company ever announced what their plans would be if it happened?

E* has a lot of assets in the sky. I don believe that everything annouced will end up at 121.

[Richard King]

Originally posted by tampa8
I have to say I am blown away at those being so pessimistic. and a bunch of other good stuff.

I am begining to think that many of the posts posted by some people here are simply done in the desire to create more hits and more posts. Most of what was posted, in my opinion, is totally irresponsible.

[Scott Greczkowski]

Take it for what you will but to me they are VERY valid concerns.

And if I remember correctly didn't Dish loose a satellite at launch once before?

edit by Scott - Yeah I know I screwed up they did not have a launch failure they had a problem with a satellite after it was launched (Echostar 4) - sorry

[motjes2]

Guys,

I think we all very excited about the news of this superdish (with all the HD space available). At the same time, it is all good to brainstorm and discuss this. Yet, we need to give E* a lot of credit for coming out in the public and making such revelation and yet cautiously wait to see how the heck they are going to do this. We'll have to wait and see how all of this is going to fit together. First, let's wait until July to see if the satellite lunches because everything depends on this... We can talk all we want but no lunch no HD space,nothing.

[Mike123abc]

Well my thoughts on the issues Scott brings up:

1. 42 local markets. Many will probably still go on E7/E8. For example there is an unused spot that already points to AK. There is still capacity on E8/E7 in some areas on spots for expansion. Dish originally planned on about 80 markets on E7/E8.

2. E8 at 110 still has a significant amount of unused national capacity. With a bit of squeezing (still not as much as E7 at 119) I can see them coming up with about 7 national transponsers. This could carry 21 HDTV channels.

3. Explosion/out of control/or other disaster with 121 would be a big problem... I wonder what backup plans could be available. Perhaps another Ku-FSS satellite could be moved to 121 in case of emergency. IF 121 meets disaster it would be as bad as if E7 or E8 blew up.

What I hope dish does and could be done since they are fairly vague in the press release:

A. Move all LIL off the wings to 121, and put all the new markets on either the 119/110 spots or 121.

B. Put all the international on the wings, with LIL off and HDTV off the wings this could be done.

C. Put all HDTV on 110 until it fills up. Since they could put about 21 HDTV channels on 110, it will last them a long time. Right now we know of about 10 channels: HBO, SHO, MAX, HDNet1, HDNet2, ESPN, DHDT, Demo, CBSE, CBSW. That could leave them 11 more channels of expansion before they have to put them on 121.


-----
Now for the issue of 121 and the 6000. It is hard to say without official word if it will work. The 6000 CAN work with four satellites as demonstrated by the Philly market and people that get both E/W CBS. The issue could be the Philly market demanding the ability to point to 5 satellites. The Philly market could be the only place that the 6000 will not work. So, they could move the Philly market to 121 from 129.

[Scott Greczkowski]

Excatly my point motjes. No satellite no nothing, no new 100 international channel, no new 42 markets, no room for 50 new HD channels, NOTHING.

[Richard King]

And if I remember correctly didn't Dish loose a satellite at launch once before?No

[mattmcg]

No offense all but I'm excited to see that my HD viewing will not require a second dish installation! I've been putting off installation of the 2nd at 61.5 (?) as this just seemed too ludicrous. Thank god I waited. The triple LNB elliptical dish will be a much nicer addition to my existing installation.

I'm also pleased Dish is moving ahead with HD more aggressively than the others. HD is not a trivial technology and they seem to be leading the charge in making technology and programming available (well, almost here......921).

To me, these announcements just solidify my satisfaction with Dish. I was excited to hear about, then install a dual LNB with a 721 and am even more excited about the 921 and the elliptical dish!

[dbronstein]

The info I read about the Superdish in the Rocky Mountain News today said it's not just for HD, it will also allow people to get all their locals off one dish instead of needing two. So I don't think you need to worry about it being an advertsiement that you have an HDTV.

Dennis

[Nick]

"And if I remember correctly didn't Dish loose a satellite at launch once before?"

<groan>

Richard, would you do the honors, or shall I?

[Scott Greczkowski]

Yeah I know I am wrong, for some reason in my big head I remembered Echostar 4 now that I think about it it had a solar panel problem and was not lost.

Ok I am allowed one mistake a year right? :D

[cjvergara]

I love the idea of having 1 dish to get all my hd and standard programming.&nbsp; And I'm jumping about the idea of getting HDNet finally!&nbsp;

But I also think they should leave out the "HDTV" part of the logo on the superdish... It does tell everyone that you've got some pricey equipement inside.&nbsp;&nbsp; If I get one, I may just end up painting over it.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; And while it may be hard to lug out a 470lb bigscreen... its not such a problem to walk out&nbsp;with a 60 lb. plasma worth over 10k, or a 20lb projector worth over 10k.... I'm sure there are some people out there with those types of equipement and very hush hush about it of course.

[Curtis0620]

Originally posted by Nick
"And if I remember correctly didn't Dish loose a satellite at launch once before?"

<groan>

Richard, would you do the honors, or shall I?

But, SeaLaunch did.

[tampa8]

Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski
Yeah I know I am wrong, for some reason in my big head I remembered Echostar 4 now that I think about it it had a solar panel problem and was not lost.

Ok I am allowed one mistake a year right? :D

You are allowed one mistake, You do a great job of keeping us informed. But if this one does blow up I'm blaming you! :wave:

[Jacob S]

OK, here are my thoughts...

Yes, Dish did lose a satellite before. Perhaps they are not using the space that they currently have on 110/119 so that they have backup in case something fails, or to add some of the 40+ markets they plan to add by year's end. How come did I not hear about all of this negativity about losing a satellite before and such concern? It is a possibility though and maybe they do in fact have backup plans for this. If it does fail then who knows how long it would take to get another one up there and it would ruin the HD plans, but Dish could get 61.5 Cablevision Rainbow in which they could do the same there, although that would leave some out for the west coast, but at least get some additional locals up.

I seriously doubt they will make the 6000's useless for this new satellite seeing that they just had done something similar with the 5000. They promoted the new hardware for the 6000 way too much lately to do such thing and it would kill their HD marketed customers in which they would need to sell the 121 HD channels and dish to.

Since the dbs channels on 121 will be at lower power I assume it will use the same lnbf that one would find on a Primestar or similar dish that uses lnbf's for vertical/horizontal polarity and that there may be some polarity adjustment that need be done. This would have to be added to the signal strength screen along with the 121 location dish setting numbers. Now we will see dish 300, dish 500, 129 dish, and super dish w/lnbf polarity number making it a total of 4 dishes on the signal strength screen.

The rain fade would be less rather than greater because it is using a bigger dish to bring in the signal. The lower powered satellites have a lower rain fade issue with them, and more likely to get a signal where there are some leaves or trees.

I doubt they will move locals from 110 to 121 because this would just cost them more money unless they have some good reason for this to save them space or something.

Also with the dish mover's program, would the customer be put up this new dish if he had a previous Dish500 or would the customer have to have this SuperDish to get that with a dish mover promotion or would the customer still not get that dish?

Someone on here had mentioned that DirecTv provides the Para-Todos dish to those that need the dish to get the locals in their markets, would Dish do the same? Would we get this dish free if we order the locals?

One could take the HD logo off of the dish or cover it up, but those that know what they are looking for would know what type of dish has what type of equipment inside the home. Its doubtful that one would be able to flee with an HDTV very easily unless you have a flat screen plasma in which would be wanted even more and much more expensive.

I wonder if they will move the HD channels from 61.5 to 121 and if they do so then would they provide those customers with a free dish for 121?

[DarrellP]

Remember, this is a mockup dish for promo purposes, maybe Dish will remove the HDTV logo when the actual product ships.

[Lee L]

Originally posted by motjes2
Guys,

I think we all very excited about the news of this superdish (with all the HD space available). At the same time, it is all good to brainstorm and discuss this. Yet, we need to give E* a lot of credit for coming out in the public and making such revelation and yet cautiously wait to see how the heck they are going to do this. We'll have to wait and see how all of this is going to fit together. First, let's wait until July to see if the satellite lunches because everything depends on this... We can talk all we want but no lunch no HD space,nothing.


I too am excited about more HD, the problem is we keep giving Dish credit for coming out in public and announcing stuff but that is all they have done so far, announce new stuff. The are lacking in the bringing to market all this new stuff they keep announcing. Hey, everything might turn out to be A-OK but all they have done in the past couple of years is add D-HD, requiring a new add on to the receiver that they sold us to receive their HD programming, all the while saying we'll put up all the HD we can get, we are the HD leader.

[Pocatello]

This is great news.

This does not provide a reason for pessimism.

Look on the bright (HD) side!

[Richard King]

Yes, Dish did lose a satellite before.NO!! They did NOT lose (not loose) a satellite, ever. The most major problem they ever had with a satellite was Echostar IV with some solar array problems. THEY HAVE NEVER LOST A SATELLITE. Jesh.

[Jacob S]

I thought they did lose one before, my bad.

[Kagato]

Who cares if it says HD. That's why you have insurence. People who steal take easy, non traceable things. DVD players, VCRs, Stereo, Playstation. Small things like DVDs and CDs that can be traded in for cash. Big items are too heavy. Just about any house has it. The thief is looking for signs that you're an easy target. No security, open windows in the summer, long vacations.

That all being said, I'm jazzed about Super Dish. My concern isn't about the bird, it's about who pays for the new dish, and what kind of adapters I'll need.

[Jacob S]

Another thing is that just because it says HD dont mean you will have an HD tv, some will need it just for their locals. Probably more likely to have the dish stolen than anything.

[AJ2086]

Originally posted by DarrellP
Remember, this is a mockup dish for promo purposes, maybe Dish will remove the HDTV logo when the actual product ships.

So it doesnt come in queer ugly colors?

[Mike D-CO5]

Like I said before competition is a great thing. You can already see that Charlie is trying to do a pre emptive strike on the new Directv and Rupert. He has been planning "plan B" for a while ,at least since Dec. 2002, and here it is.
So everyone chill a bit. All this speculation is good for conversation, but lets leave the pessimistic comments out. It looks like to me that No One likes change , good or bad. At least when we are talking about Dish. When ever Directv and Rupert are mentioned and the future of that company everyone can't say enough positive things.
Lets give Charlie the benefit of the doubt and take a wait and see attitude. I am POSITIVE that this will be a good thing for Hdtv and satellite industry in general.

So lets all take a deep breath and relax, the future looks bright to me.

[Cyclone]

I'm still surprised that they wait for E* IX and why not jus stick HDNet on the Wings (61.5/148) today?

[DarrellP]

Talk about change, I would love nothing better than to have the Superdish and get rid of that big, ugly 24" dish I have pointing toward 61.5.

[Darkman]

hehe - big ugly - 24...

People are getting spoiled - to call 24" a BUD :)

[normang]

Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski
My house is an electronics haven, with lots of pcs, laptops, tv's etc.
We have an alarm system but many times my wife forgets to turn it on. :(
Just don't like to advertise that I have a HDTV to all who drive by that all.

How tough would it be to touch up the dish without affecting its properties to remove the HDTV logo? Since this is an early mockup, its hard to say whether that will remain on the Dish when it actually goes into a box.

[Lee L]

However tough you think it will be to buy a can of grea paint and paint the whole dish. ;) ;) Really, there is nothing stopping you from painting the dish you have now, it won;t hurt anything.

[LarryH]

I like the proposed SuperDish solution as long as the 121 slot is reserved for the "not-so-popular" channels. I too am concerned about rain fade on 121 and don't want my primary channels on that bird. I prefer the single Dish solution and don't really care that it has the "HDTV" logo plastered on it (I actually like it). HDTV equipment prices really came down this year, so it's not the exclusive club that it used to be. By next year, HDTV equipment will be so affordable that people will no longer think of it as "high end". SuperDish sounds nice (and I will buy it when it comes out), but my primary interest is more HDTV content. All Dish has to do to keep me as a customer is offer more HDTV channels than the competition (and release the 921!!!)

[dlsnyder]

So what will happen with the capacity on the wing slots? If they move HD programming and locals to 110 or 121 respectively will the wing slots be used exclusively for internationals?

[lee635]

Well, let's just take this for what it is, early speculation. In the event of failure, a contingency might be to lease ku transponders off another satellite. Heaven knows there's plenty of ku up there already. Or just scale back plans to maximize the available resources.

Thanks Scott for the early info. And the concerns and coments from everyone are valuable. However, what we have is early information that will get flushed out further in the near future.

The press release is barely dry. ;)

[kstevens]

Originally posted by Scott Greczkowski
Take it for what you will but to me they are VERY valid concerns.

And if I remember correctly didn't Dish loose a satellite at launch once before?

edit by Scott - Yeah I know I screwed up they did not have a launch failure they had a problem with a satellite after it was launched (Echostar 4) - sorry

Sorry, I don't see many of your concerns to be valid. If E* says they have the band space to do what they said, then I would be willing to bet they do. It would be incredibly bad pr if in september they have to retract there statements. Want to see a mass defection to the competition?


ken

[kstevens]

Originally posted by Lee L
However tough you think it will be to buy a can of grea paint and paint the whole dish. ;) ;) Really, there is nothing stopping you from painting the dish you have now, it won;t hurt anything.

I would imagine that most subdivisions are like mine, while they allow dishes on the house, they must be invisible from the street. If they can see your dish then they have probably already broken in.


Ken

[Mike123abc]

Echostar 3 and 4 failed after reaching orbit. E3 has a heat problem that prevents it from operating at double power so it had to be moved to a wing and operate at low power.

E4 had its solar arrays go bad. Last I heard it could power like 3-6 of its 32 transponders. So, it is in orbit being little more than a useless rock.

[normang]

Originally posted by Mike123abc
Echostar 3 and 4 failed after reaching orbit. E3 has a heat problem that prevents it from operating at double power so it had to be moved to a wing and operate at low power.

E4 had its solar arrays go bad. Last I heard it could power like 3-6 of its 32 transponders. So, it is in orbit being little more than a useless rock.

Where can one find any proof that you are remotely accurate on any of these statements about the condition of E3 & E4? online??

[Mike123abc]

Originally posted by normang


Where can one find any proof that you are remotely accurate on any of these statements about the condition of E3 & E4? online??

Check out http://sat-nd.com/failures/index.html?http://sat-nd.com/failures/timeline.html

You can see all sorts of satellite failures.

You can also look in echostar's 2002 annual report there is a section on sat failures: http://64.58.76.136/search/cache?p=echostar+iv+solar+array&ei=UTF-8&url=InKsvqqsudwC:62.23.130.156/swim/files/us/US2787621091_01_Echostar_Communications_Annual_Rep ort_2002_0.47_Mo.pdf

[Richard King]

Where can one find any proof that you are remotely accurate on any of these statements about the condition of E3 & E4? online??He is correct.

[jegrant]

I agree that I'd prefer the new larger dish to just say "SUPER DiSH" or something similar. I don't have an HDTV, yet, if I understand correctly, there might be new services at 121 in SD. And, even if I did get an HDTV, and even though my dishes are in the back of my house, when viewed from the street, I see no reason for the dish itself to proclaim HDTV. How about offering a decal or something for those who really want that on there?

BTW, am I correct in thinking that they *would NOT* be required to have any public interest channels at 121, since it's technically not a DBS slot? And would they want to move many services that are now on DBS slots to 121, so that they could reduce the total number of public interest channels carried? Dish, from what I can tell, doesn't seem to like the idea of carrying public interest channels much to begin with. I'd guess there are a few they would keep, but probably also a few they might drop if they had the option.

[normang]

Interesting to say the least. At least too, Dish is sending up new birds in obvious prep for the inevitable need to replace aging sats..

[Jeff43]

Don't forget the good things E*IV has been able to do. E*IV was the&nbsp;first satellite&nbsp;to beam from the 110 satellite position giving Dish Network four working satellite slots. Because of E*IV and the 110 slot the "Dish 500" was born and alot of SW64 have been sold.&nbsp;I remember day one when E*IV was turned on at the 110 slot. I had a extra dish pointed at the 110 position before E*IV landed at the 110 position. When Dish Network turned on E*IV, &nbsp;I adjusted my 110 dish and my signal bar on my Dish 5000 read "Locked Echostar 4 110". What a good day that was&nbsp;for Dish Network.

[Mike Russell]

I think E* did lose there first satelite they launched. I think it was launched from China. They launched the next one about 2 months later which became E*I. I might be wrong.

[Ken_F]

Mike Russel,

That's not correct. E* bet the company on the China launch--which went successfully. Everyone criticized the decision to launch from China at the time (which was obviously much less expensive), but it worked out.

[Jacob S]

Someone got on here and told me that none had ever failed after I had said that there was a failure before.

[P Smith]

Just technical observation of the "super-dish" mock from Team Summit:
- pure mock ! - if you will trace a line of horizontal axis from LNBF you will reach upper edge of a reflector; for normal setup the line should touch a center. So a distance from LNBF and a position on an arm too far for WORKING draft.

They paint a Starchoice dish and attach just regular Twin LNBF to regular arm ( any engineer will cut the arm at least for real looking mock, huh ).

[Richard King]

I think E* did lose there first satelite they launched. I think it was launched from China. They launched the next one about 2 months later which became E*I. I might be wrong.No, they have never lost a satellite at launch. As mentioned above, Echostar I launched from China and this was the FIRST successful commercial launch from China. This launch was also the first one after another launch crashed into a village and killed many people. Needless to say, the investment community at the time was very nervous about this launch. This was also one of the launches that created a lot of controversy because Loral (one of Clinton's biggest supporters and donors) assisted China in solving the problems that caused the crash of the earlier satellite. All Echostar launches after this have also been successful.

[Cyclone]

I think that Dish already has a satellite in space at 105 and that they aren't putting all of their eggs in one 121 basket.

[Scott Greczkowski]

No Dish does not have a satellite in space at 105.

They are instead renting space at 105.

[Jacob S]

Where are they going to add the rest of the locals at by the end of the year? 105 or 121? I thought they were being added to 121.

[Chris Freeland]

Originally posted by Jacob S
Where are they going to add the rest of the locals at by the end of the year? 105 or 121? I thought they were being added to 121.

Both, I suspect the some of the new locals already announced will be added this year will go to a 110 spotbeam where theirs space, the rest will likely go to 105, I suspect the new markets added next year will be split between 105 and 121.

[Jacob S]

They are going to fit all those 42 markets on 110? I didnt think they had enough room for Charleston/Huntington locals on the spot beam along with some of the locals in VA. I did hear that there was lots of room on 110 from someone else on here.

So I take it that 105 will be for HD and locals while 121 will be for inernationals and locals. Those that currently have internationals on the wing slots would still have that dish up plus this big one and a problem with switches. Not a good situation for them unless they substitute 105 for the wing slot if internationals dont go there.

Where is the broadband going?

[Chris Freeland]

Originally posted by Jacob S
They are going to fit all those 42 markets on 110? I didnt think they had enough room for Charleston/Huntington locals on the spot beam along with some of the locals in VA. I did hear that there was lots of room on 110 from someone else on here.

So I take it that 105 will be for HD and locals while 121 will be for inernationals and locals. Those that currently have internationals on the wing slots would still have that dish up plus this big one and a problem with switches. Not a good situation for them unless they substitute 105 for the wing slot if internationals dont go there.

Where is the broadband going?

Read closer, I said that only part of the 42 new local markets would go to 110 and part of them would go to 105, but I am just speculating.

The vast majority of E* subs will not need anything more then a standard Dish500 to receive SDTV core and locals. It will only be us in the smaller markets and probably Baltimore that will need to upgrade to a SuperDish to receive are locals and core programing. Even less will need a 2nd dish in addition to the SuperDish or a 4-LNB SuperDish and a very small number of subs will ever need a 4-LNB SuperDish plus 2nd dish.

[Jacob S]

The only way that a part of those 42 cities would go somewhere else is if they would go to 110 or 105 by the end of the year because they said those locals would be added by then.

It is a possibility. When they came out with that list I assumed they were all going to 121 that you had to have the SuperDish to get those, but I had thought I read a while back that they were putting the broadband service to 121.

I wonder how the public is going to react to having to have such a large dish. These would not be able to be put on a mast or at least the ones we use for the 18 and 20 inch dishes we have now would they?

[Ken_F]

Jacob,

Broadband service, if it is offered, will use the Ka spot beams on the AMC-15 satellite being launched to 105. The two Ka spots at 121 are intended for testing, and more importantly, to meet the FCC's deadline to retain the Ka licenses at that slot.

[Jacob S]

I figure if they put broadband at 105 as well as HD then the internationals would go to 121 as well as a lot of the locals that they are going to add by the end of the year, whatever they cant get on 110. How much free capacity is at 110?