New Install Problem

[enigma96]

First off I'll state that I already have Directv coming out tomorrow to fix the problem I'm having, but I'd like to know really what's going on. About a week ago I had the Slimline dish put in and a HR-22 so I could get HD channels. The install went fine. The one thing was the installer said that his dispatch didn't let him know about me needing a new switch that comes with the slimeline. I originally had 2 tivo's dual tuners with 2 lines coming into each of them. Plus 2 standard receivers with 1 line each, for a total of 6 lines coming into my house. He said the standard slimeline switch that they use on a normal install would not work, but my existing switch would which is fine. He set it up and left. Then about 5 days later I bought another HR-22 to install in our other room with another HDTV. I took out the old directv tivo dual tuner, and put in the new HR-22. I selected Slimeline-5 just like the other room and other HR-22 was setup. Now I get nothing but "Searching for Sat error 771". I have tried to change the sat setup, with different settings, but nothing works. Just get the 771 error. What would cause this? My other receivers seem ok, but their are a few channels now that even the other HR-22 gets the 771 error. Could the switch be the problem, or maybe not enough power? Like I said Directv is coming tomorrow but I was just curious...Thanks and sorry for the long post...

[litzdog911]

You have the wrong multiswitch. You need the Zinwell WB68 multiswitch. Hopefully the installer with one with him. Swapping the multiswitch should solve the problem.

Also, be sure to connect the B-Band Converter (BBC) modules to your HR22 if you haven't already. And have the installer check the signal readings on the 99 and 103º while you're there to see them. They should be up in the high 80-90s with a properly aligned dish.

[Incompetent]

Customers should really purchase their EQ through DTV and have the tech come out to install it, no matter if its just a simple swap or not. If you can get the EQ cheaper through a retailer then just explain this to DTV and ask for a credit.

Some tech just ate a service within 7 days, most likely through no fault of his own.

Maybe the tech was some newb that didnt know what was going on, but maybe he was there for like 6-9 months (senior tech in HSP system). Either way you have no idea of the a$$ chewing he is gonna get even though its is not your fault. Its a great catch 22 between tech and customer, where both wants to be happy and the powers that be screw each of them in between.

Also Litz his HD would not be working on the original upgrade if he didnt already have a 6x8 M/S. Perhaps its a 2 dish issue or some other thing? not enough details atm.

"Then about 5 days later I bought another HR-22" this is my reasoning for questioning the original switch problem. If he had HD to begin with then he would have had the 771s the first go around.

[enigma96]

Thanks for the reply. I had a feeling it had something to do with the switch. I'm going to call them and make sure them bring the switch your talking about. Thanks man....

[enigma96]

I only have 1 dish installed the slimline-5

[samrs]

I'd bet a few forum bucks the tech put up the new dish, used the existing lines to the existing switch to leave your SD equipment working, then ran two new lines to the HD DVR. If true the tech that comes out today wont be happy, unless it's an easy fix and he gets paid for the service call plus the charge back for the shoddy upgrade.

[enigma96]

Actually I know for a fact he didn't change any lines. All the lines up their are from the original tivo's and standard units, what would lines have to do with it though? I thought all cable was the same, RG6 RG9 etc...

[litzdog911]

samrs means that the tech *might* have run two lines to the HDDVR directly from the dish and used the two other dish connections to feed your current (old) multiswitch. Hopefully that's not the case.

If all four cables from the dish are connected to the old multiswitch's SAT INPUTs, then the tech simply needs to swap the old multiswitch with a new Zinwell WB68 and you'll be good to go.

But be sure to have him check your signal readings on 99 and 103º while you're there in case your dish alignment needs any tweaking. You want to see readings on most transponders up in the 80-90s.

[enigma96]

"the tech *might* have run two lines to the HDDVR directly from the dish and used the two other dish connections to feed your current (old) multiswitch"

You know what, that sounds exactly what he said he was going to do. If I remember correctly, I think that's what he did. He is supposed to be here between 12 pm and 3 pm. I called directv last night to make sure they put in the notes of the work order, "New switch might be needed". I better not get a tech that says "Oh I don't have that switch with me" if he does I'll be pissed. But I think he did do what you said, it sounds vaguely familiar.

[enigma96]

Figures the guy is late. Every time I my an appointment in the afternoon, they either come like 1-2 hours late or they call and say they can't make it today and they'll have to come first thing in the morning next day, everytime without fail :-( if I make an afternoon appointment. That's why I told the CS agent please make it in the morning, but they didn't have anything...

[enigma96]

Ha, the tech is here now. First thing he said when he went on the roof was, Man whoever installed your SlimeLine dish didn't do it right and you have the wrong switch. Nice. He asked me if I had the guys name, I told him I don't remember. I do know that the other guy came in what looked like his own personal car, where the guy who is here now is in an official Directv Van. He said I need a new switch and new cables. He said the guy was trying to run 2 lines into the HR22 without going to the switch. And that he did a half ass job...figures my luck, this new guy seems to know his business alot more than the other guy so I'm happy their..

[BattleZone]

Sounds like you'll be getting taken good care of.

[enigma96]

This guy seems pretty cool. He's replacing the switch and the cabling and he's also going to replace my old D10 standard receivers in the other 2 rooms with the D12 :-) I offered the guy some food and drink as well :-)

[enigma96]

Well after 4 hours, the installer got half my channels to work :-( He was here about 3 hours and it was too dark to work much more. But he figured out that 1 of mine lines is bad, something about not being grounded. He told me to call Directv and setup a reinstall of all my lines. I guess I had be using the exsisting lines left over from DishNetwork when I had them about 6 years ago.

[samrs]

I have a flashlight and spare batteries. Unless you told him to leave he should have finished. If he left any of his company phone numbers call them, speak to a supervisor. Otherwise, call DirecTv open another service call. It will for sure be a Sin7 and might get kicked up to the crisis management team. Some poor fella with a camera will show up to hopefully resolve your issues.

[enigma96]

I have a reinstall setup for monday between 8-12 pm. It seems its only one line that is bad. I'm wondering if I could just replace the line myself. I mean all you have to do is unplug it from the switch and run a new line right? He said something about the line their now is not grounded. Where can I buy grounded RG6 cable from, radio shack?

EDIT: Forget it, I want Directv to do it, and to do it right. I want all my lines changed and straighten out. I think they did a very messy job and like I said the cables are left over from Dishnetwork.

[enigma96]

Here are some pictures

http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/5814/dscn1870uh5.th.jpg (http://img294.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn1870uh5.jpg)

http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/2261/dscn1871bc0.th.jpg (http://img24.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn1871bc0.jpg)

I think that white cable is the bad one in question. But I still want all those lines replaced threw my house and tidy up. Oh and one another thing, the lines going into the bedroom go in under the house and come up from the floor, will they do that still when they replace the lines? And should I ask for a SWM install?

[litzdog911]

What a horrible installation job. Pictures are worth a thousand words.

[randyk47]

I was going to pass on commenting but the devil is making me do this.....that's pretty much a mess and that's the kindest words I can muster up right now.

[roadrunner1782]

Wow that is sad after two installers coming out there it looks that bad!!!

[enigma96]

Yeah I'm going to rip the installer a new one tomorrow. I also want to make sure he uses Quad Shielded HDTV ready RG6 cable. Isn't that what their supposed to use??

[enigma96]

I just saw some Quad Shielded HDTV RG6 ready cable at walmart 50ft for $20. I wonder if I should buy all the cables myself and then have them install it? Or do they already have that type of cable with them when they come out tomorrow?

[randyk47]

Not sure quad is the norm or specified. I'd be more into like starting from scratch and rewiring the whole mess with new cable, grounding blocks, etc. I'd also be thinking about cleaning up the interior with a box.

[enigma96]

When the installer comes tomorrow, can't I tell him, or suggest to him about using quad RG6 and also the tidy up and clean up my wiring mess that they made?

[BattleZone]

No, Quad Shield is NOT the spec.

DirecTV requires RG6 solid-copper core dual-shield with 60% or greater braid coverage. Most installers use Perfect 10 cable which has the DirecTV logo printed right on it. The installer will not have quad shield, nor will DirecTV pay for quad shield. It isn't needed.

I don't see a ground source nearby, but there should be a quad ground block in the system anyway (I'd put it up under the eaves). The lines going into the house should have feed-through bushings, sealed with silicone, not just holes left in the wall.

I'm not sure what that guy could have done in 3 hours, but obviously some part of the job was difficult, which is why the original tech used the work-around. My problem with DirecTV was that I was always the 3rd tech, who had to fix all this mess (i.e., full reinstall) for service call pay, while the original techs, who didn't do the job right, got paid more.

Anyway, good luck.

[enigma96]

Ha that's funny that you say that, because the guy who was here yesterday, said I need a full reinstall and that he doesn't get paided enough to do that :-) Is their a big diffence in quality version quad and double shielding cables?

[carl6]

Ha that's funny that you say that, because the guy who was here yesterday, said I need a full reinstall and that he doesn't get paided enough to do that :-) Is their a big diffence in quality version quad and double shielding cables?

Quad shield coax only makes a difference if you are in a strong rf interference envirnment, like very close to a tv transmitter tower. With an analog signal, signal can get into the coax and interfere with the signal on the coax and cause symptoms such as ghosting. With a digital signal, even if a little signal leaks in, it won't cause a noticeable effect.

As IIP noted, quad shield is not the spec and is not needed in most installations. Proper connectors, proper grounding, all matter a whole lot more. Going and buying some cheap quad shield locally and running it yourself would probably result in a lower quality installation than an installer doing the job properly with regular shield.

[enigma96]

I've made a list of all the stuff I want the guy to do tomorrow to make me happy. Pretty much everything you guys have told me here about what a proper install should entail. So we'll see if he listens :-)

[satguy22]

For 30.00 nd they want him to use 25 dollars worth of wire?

[BattleZone]

For 30.00 nd they want him to use 25 dollars worth of wire?

Now you understand why I won't work for DirecTV anymore. Paying for the priviledge of doing someone's install is a common occurance. There are "preferred" contractors (read: those paying kick-backs to the HSP) and those who aren't. The preferred contractors get all the install work, do a half-ass job, and get paid full rate. Then the other contractors get to come after them and re-do all the work for service call pay. Somehow, the preferred contractors escape chargebacks.

And now, DirecTV is buying out HSPs and LOWERING tech pay. So, yeah, if you wonder why you don't get a quality installer, that's why.

[avmaster]

In this case, I woud have had your job turned into a former install. Your tech would be MUCH happier.

IF you have not moved within the last 6 months, and don't plan on moving in 6 months, all you have to do when you call direct tv is say you had some roof work done or something to the effect that the whole job needs to be re-done, and a tech told you that you needed a former install, they will set it up with no question and no charge to you.

The tech that cleans up the job will get paid the full install price, not $20 or $30. It pisses me off when I do a simple upgrade for someone and I am expected to clean up the whole job, in that case I would be basically working for free. This is one way around it.

[enigma96]

So the tech came out (I was not their my father was) I left a list of stuff I'd like done. Well he did none of it. Left the wires hanging the holes everything. All he did was adjust the satellite. He didn't run any new wires nothing. He checked a few channels and then left. Screw them, I'll do it myself. That's 3 tech's that did nothing really. And the funny thing was each one blamed the other one. I'll tidy up the wires myself this weekend. Or is their a independent installer that could do a professional job on installing this stuff? Any recommendations....

Thanks

[joe diamond]

Now you understand why I won't work for DirecTV anymore. Paying for the priviledge of doing someone's install is a common occurance. There are "preferred" contractors (read: those paying kick-backs to the HSP) and those who aren't. The preferred contractors get all the install work, do a half-ass job, and get paid full rate. Then the other contractors get to come after them and re-do all the work for service call pay. Somehow, the preferred contractors escape chargebacks.

And now, DirecTV is buying out HSPs and LOWERING tech pay. So, yeah, if you wonder why you don't get a quality installer, that's why.

Wait a minute,

I was assured by a MASTEC manager that, even though the service call I was on did require a redo, if I was to just take this one for the team this time the next one would be good for me. The customer's alarm system wouldn't work. The original tech ran the cables through the windows and the windows wouldn't close. Silly cable guy!

Are you saying that tomorrow may never come and the one hand that washes the other won't work even though I did take the bad with the good?

It has been several years. But I am sure he will make it right somehow.
They did pay me, sort of, for the a/o & new box.

Joe

[joe diamond]

So the tech came out (I was not their my father was) I left a list of stuff I'd like done. Well he did none of it. Left the wires hanging the holes everything. All he did was adjust the satellite. He didn't run any new wires nothing. He checked a few channels and then left. Screw them, I'll do it myself. That's 3 tech's that did nothing really. And the funny thing was each one blamed the other one. I'll tidy up the wires myself this weekend. Or is their a independent installer that could do a professional job on installing this stuff? Any recommendations....

Thanks

The plan is to work through the DTV Home Service Provider system or do something else. Call a Home Theatrer Company or get an alarm system installer. And, surprise, surprise there are many many former DTV installers around.

Even though your job looks like crap there is not much in the FREE basic installation list about neat. Work that is done in the dark or in rain or snow tends to be that way. I wouldn't leave a job looking like that but then the HSP deal is not in my future either.

FIOS is coming

Joe

[avmaster]

So the tech came out (I was not their my father was) I left a list of stuff I'd like done. Well he did none of it. Left the wires hanging the holes everything. All he did was adjust the satellite. He didn't run any new wires nothing. He checked a few channels and then left. Screw them, I'll do it myself. That's 3 tech's that did nothing really. And the funny thing was each one blamed the other one. I'll tidy up the wires myself this weekend. Or is their a independent installer that could do a professional job on installing this stuff? Any recommendations....

Thanks

That sucks, then he didn't do the job he was paid to do in that case, I would bitch. Even being a tech that hates being bitched at, you can turn it into an escalation at this point. A good HSP will pay a tech properly if its a bigtime cleanup job.

[enigma96]

Well the problem is back again. Half my channels on one of my HR-22's are not working. Mainly all the ESPN channels. I'm sure its bad lines related but for whatever reason the tech refuse to change them. I called Directv on thursday. They said that my case has now gone to a case manager since thei'r been 3 techs out to fix the problem and not one of them did, correctly anyway. And all 3 techs all blamed each other on who's fault it was. I was told that tomorrow their will be a tech and a supervising tech with him, and that if that have to do a full reinstall they will. I really hope they do something this time rather than say, "Oh its the other techs's fault". I would really like my lines changed. I also mention a SWM and the manager I spoke too said we'll see. I've got my fingers crossed that they actually do something this time....

[Telcoguru]

What a crappy job. You need 4 RG6 lines from the dish to a grounding block then you need 4 RG6 lines from the grounding block to a Zinwell WB68 Multiswitch. Then depending on your receivers that are installed you need RG6 lines from the multiswitch to your receivers. DVRs will get 2 lines the other receivers will get 1. I used RG6 tri-shielded cable. I ran my own lines to the back of my house because I ran them inside my house and snaked the walls. The installer was very happy. He just had to do the outside work and hook up my receivers.