Direct TV...local channels w/ bars?

[Cade]

I just got set up with Direct TV last night and as the installer was showing me how everything worked I found that most of my locals have gray bars on the top and bottom of the screen. When I asked about it he tried to switch to a wider screen format* and that looked horrible. He finally said that there wasn't much that could be done except to upgrade to a HD DVR.

I purposefully went without the HD DVR/service since I do not have any HD TV's. This is very frustrating because I convinced my wife that this (direct tv) would be better than the cable we had. Of course, she's pissed, and now I feel like I've been taken.

Any suggestions or remedies?

Thanks in advance.

ETA* Please don't hijack and tell me how much better Dish is... it will do little to help me out.

[Mertzen]

It's something directv can do little about since it the broadcaster who letterbox / crop and all that other stuff.
Even with the HD DVRs they can still be there when the HD stations don't send out HD.

[BattleScott]

The DirecTV boxes don't have any setting that would treat local stations any differently than the national channels. If the picture is the way you want it to be on the national channels, the problem is in the signal that your locals are providing to DirecTV. Have the locals in your area shut down analog transmissions? That would explain the letter boxing of the image.

[HRJustin]

Ive had the same problem since we had the new SD DVR installed the R22. Our local channels are switching to a new satellite so they installed new equipment for free. The locals are now broadcast in MPEG 4 so we needed new compatible receivers. The normal non-dvr HD receivers in the other rooms have options to either change the color of the gray bars to either dark gray or black. there is also options to change screen format between crop, letterbox, and stretch.

Im hoping that Directv will at least send an update to change the color to black. The installer said when he installed the new DVR that alot of people are complaining about them bars. They dont really bother me since the channels are in HD. I think they come in way clearer even though this DVR has the ability to output in HD locked out.

I know of three of these R22 SD DVRs and they all have this problem your not alone!!! LOL. There isnt anything you can do about them right now. Maybe enough people will complain and Directv will release an update to change them. As far as I know the only reciever that has this problem is the standard DVR model R22. All of the other HD recievers have options you can change for the format.

[texasbrit]

Ive had the same problem since we had the new SD DVR installed the R22. Our local channels are switching to a new satellite so thats why we had to have new boxes installed in order to still receive them. The normal HD receivers in the other rooms have options to either change the color of the gray bars to either dark gray or black. there is also options to change screen format between crop, letterbox, and stretch.

Im hoping that Directv will at least send an update to change the color to black. The installer said when he installed the new DVR that alot of people are complaining about them bars. They dont really bother me since the channels are in HD. I think they come way clearer even though this DVR has the ability to output in HD locked out.

I know of three of these R22 SD DVRs and they all have this problem your not alone!!! LOL. There isnt anything you can do about them right now. Maybe enough people will complain and Directv will release an update to change them. As far as I know the only reciever that has this problem is the standard DVR model R22. All of the other HD recievers have options you can change for the format.

This situation only exists with the R22 and only in those areas that have moved the SD locals away from the 72.5 satellite. In those areas, instead of having two separate signals one for HD and one for SD, DirecTV is only delivering the HD signal over the satellite.
What happens is that the R22 is receiving the HD locals and then downconverting them to SD. Since they are in HD, the format is 16:9, so the R22 has to add top and bottom bars to make the picture 4:3 which is the standard SD format. None of the DirecTV SD receivers have the ability to stretch, zoom etc so you will have to use these features on your TV (if your TV has them).
It is interesting that we see these complaints about the way the R22 delivers the signals. At the other end of the spectrum, now that many local channels have gone to digital and are delivering HD, DirecTV is creating the SD feed in areas getting SD locals from 101/119 by centercutting the 16:9 picture to give 4:3 fullscreen (this has apparently been requested by the networks). We are seeing many complaints about this, from people who WANT the letterboxed format like that being delivered by the R22 (that you don't like!).

[Phroz]

I think the biggest issue is that the bars are... gray.

If we aren't going to get an option to change them, at least make it black by default like everything else out there.

[HRJustin]

I have only had Directv since january of 08 when they installed a slimline dish, 3 d11 recievers and an r15. I got the email around january of 09 saying I had to have all my equipment replaced with new MPEG 4 compatible equipment. wouldnt it make sense to assume they are eliminating SD recievers or at least moving to more twards MPEG 4 only?

the HD h21-200 receivers that are in the other rooms have the options of changing that gray bars color and screen format from crop, letterbox, stretch(i use crop on my 14inch tv in my bedroom). These options are in the HDTV tab and then under the Video tab of the setup menu. Theres no reason why Directv couldnt allow these options on the R22 and still block resolutions above 480i/p.

all that directv has to do is allow the ability to change the bars color and/or be able to change the screen formats from crop, letterbox, stretch.

it has nothing to do with what TV you have.
it has nothing to do with what is being broadcast from directv.

The only problem is they have the settings blocked on the R22 for some dumb reason. Directv could still block the HD resolutions on the R22 and allow the other options.

[HRJustin]

I think the biggest issue is that the bars are... gray.

If we aren't going to get an option to change them, at least make it black by default like everything else out there.

exactly why gray!!! at the very least change it to black....... I dont have HD access and I can still use this option on the H21-200 boxes in the bedrooms.

[harsh]

exactly why gray!!! at the very least change it to black.......Almost certainly because the CRT/early plasma group of subscribers would scream bloody murder about their screens getting burned in.

No good deed goes unpunished.

[HoTat2]

Someone refresh my memory here;

But even with the R22's “HD software enabled cousins,” (for want of a better term) the HR2Xs, wouldn't any allowed format changes in screen resolution and/or aspect ratio be limited to the component and HDMI outputs only and not the S-video and composite outs?

You'll have to pardon me for forgetting, but I haven't used the S-video/composite outs on any of my HR's in a long time. :)

[Prince Oz]

I just got set up with Direct TV last night and as the installer was showing me how everything worked I found that most of my locals have gray bars on the top and bottom of the screen. When I asked about it he tried to switch to a wider screen format* and that looked horrible. He finally said that there wasn't much that could be done except to upgrade to a HD DVR.

I purposefully went without the HD DVR/service since I do not have any HD TV's. This is very frustrating because I convinced my wife that this (direct tv) would be better than the cable we had. Of course, she's pissed, and now I feel like I've been taken.

Any suggestions or remedies?

Thanks in advance.

ETA* Please don't hijack and tell me how much better Dish is... it will do little to help me out.

:welcome_s
Have you thought about possibly upgrading to an HD System? (TV & Receiver) I know not everyone can do it, but if you can afford D*, you should be able to get an HD TV.:icon_lol:

[JLucPicard]

Someone refresh my memory here;

But even with the R22's “HD software enabled cousins,” (for want of a better term) the HR2Xs, wouldn't any allowed format changes in screen resolution and/or aspect ratio be limited to the component and HDMI outputs only and not the S-video and composite outs?

You'll have to pardon me for forgetting, but I haven't used the S-video/composite outs on any of my HR's in a long time. :)
I use component with my R22, and the menu options that exist in the HR2x series that allow you to choose the formats (pillars, crop, gray, black, etc.) are not enable on the R22 unit. So even using component outputs, I can't, for instance, change the background color from gray to black or any of that stuff.

[HoTat2]

I use component with my R22, and the menu options that exist in the HR2x series that allow you to choose the formats (pillars, crop, gray, black, etc.) are not enable on the R22 unit. So even using component outputs, I can't, for instance, change the background color from gray to black or any of that stuff.

Thanks;

However if what texasbrit described earlier is correct for what DirecTV is doing these days where the R22 is locked on a letter-box output whenever down-rezzing a received 16:9 HD signal. Then doesn’t this mean that the picture from an R22 will drop to a window-boxed (or postage stamp) image on a 4:3 TV whenever the station is broadcasting un-converted 4:3 material on their HD channel? Or even worse a window-boxed picture with double width size pillar-bars on a 16:9 TV set?

[bobnielsen]

Someone refresh my memory here;

But even with the R22's “HD software enabled cousins,” (for want of a better term) the HR2Xs, wouldn't any allowed format changes in screen resolution and/or aspect ratio be limited to the component and HDMI outputs only and not the S-video and composite outs?

You'll have to pardon me for forgetting, but I haven't used the S-video/composite outs on any of my HR's in a long time. :)

The resolution on composite and S-video is fixed at 480i, but the aspect ratio and format can be switched on the HR2x DVRs (I use my HR21 with an older analog TV). It shouldn't be too hard for Directv to add this capability to the R22 and hopefully it is being worked on.

[HoTat2]

The resolution on composite and S-video is fixed at 480i, but the aspect ratio and format can be switched on the HR2x DVRs (I use my HR21 with an older analog TV). It shouldn't be too hard for Directv to add this capability to the R22 and hopefully it is being worked on.

OK;

Thanks for the reminder Bob;

I used to have an HR21 here hooked-up to a 4:3 analog set myself, but I always used the component outputs at 480i. The only time I would switch to the S-video/composite outputs was during a SW update since the component (and HDMI I assume as well) outputs would always default to 480p for some reason making the picture un-viewable on a 4:3 analog set.

Therefore I had to switch to the S-video/composite outs to view the progress of any updates.

[texasbrit]

Thanks;

However if what texasbrit described earlier is correct for what DirecTV is doing these days where the R22 is locked on a letter-box output whenever down-rezzing a received 16:9 HD signal. Then doesn’t this mean that the picture from an R22 will drop to a window-boxed (or postage stamp) image on a 4:3 TV whenever the station is broadcasting un-converted 4:3 material on their HD channel? Or even worse a window-boxed picture with double width size pillar-bars on a 16:9 TV set?

Yes, if the HD station is broadcasting a 4:3 picture inside a 16:9 frame then an R22 receiving one of these locals will have a picture that is both pillar-boxed (in order to fill out the 4:3 to 16:9) and then letterboxed (to fill out the 16:9 frame to 4:3). Remember the R22 has no way of knowing that the 16:9 frame includes a 4:3 picture. And also remember this ONLY happens in those areas which used to have SD locals on 72.5

Just about all 16:9 TVs have the ability to stretch/zoom/crop the picture so can overcome this. If the R22 capabilities for these adjustments were enabled, then things would be improved for those people with 4:3 TVs, because they could create their own center-cut. But I still think it's ironic that the posters are wanting to create a centercut, whereas many people who get a centercut on their regular SD receivers(from the SD locals now being fed from the digital signals) want to go to letterbox.

[HRJustin]

when watching local channels from the R22 there is always the gray bars on the top and bottom. I have noticed some commercials and our local news have black bars on the left and right. I think this is what texasbrit is talking about some commercials and local broadcasts are only 4:3 instead of 16:9 widescreen.

I dont necessarily want to get rid of the letterbox format just change the GRAY bars to BLACK. I dont really care if I cant change the options I just want directv to make the default color BLACK. I dont mind letterbox on the bigger 27inch TV thats on the R22 because you can see alot more on both sides on shows that are in 16:9.

the HD receivers that replaced our SD receivers have all the options for this. I can either leave the format on letterbox and have the bars on top gray, dark gray, or black OR i can just change it to crop and eliminate the bars completely. Eliminating them completely give the biggest picture on a small 14inch 4:3 TV.

[Cade]

After speaking with three different people at DTV, I learned from the last one that the satellite signals were being sent in HD. The locals on my three HD receivers did not have the bars and my SD DVR did. I politely told him that I was disappointed that I was now stuck with the bars and an equally unhappy (with me) wife.

He put me on hold for three minutes and came back and OFFERED TO SEND ME A FREE HD DVR!!!

He said that a charge for $199.00 and a credit for $199.00 will show up on my bill. He said to call back when it comes in and someone will lead me through the hook-up to save on a service call. He requested that I send back the SD SVR in a prepaid postage box that DTV will send to me.

I couldn't believe it. I read on alot of different forums (auto, firearms, archery) and often sit in envy when someone else gets great service from a big company that could have easily told them to pound sand.

+55 Trillion for DirecTV!

[BlueEos]

I think the color gray may be caused by the TV rather than DTV or the stations broadcast. When HD first came out I bought a 36" RCA HD that was in the 4x3 format. If I chose an HD channel, I got a 16x9 output with the top and bottom of the screen in gray. If I remember correctly, there was an option to change the color to black.

[HRJustin]

I paid $99 for an HD DVR when i had the appointment set to have the new equipment installed but the installer brought out the R22 instead. I got the money credited back. Ive tried to get an HD DVR but I have to pay the $199. The gray bars dont really bother me enough that I would cancel service with them.

you can still see everything just fine I dont see why you and your wife are that unhappy with them. Hopefully it all works out for you and you get the HD DVR free. I have read on other threads that with the HD DVR you have to pay for the HD access no matter what.

[HRJustin]

I think the color gray may be caused by the TV rather than DTV or the stations broadcast. When HD first came out I bought a 36" RCA HD that was in the 4x3 format. If I chose an HD channel, I got a 16x9 output with the top and bottom of the screen in gray. If I remember correctly, there was an option to change the color to black.

No!... its not the TVs because I know of three R22 DVR receivers that do this. the other normal NON-DVR HD receivers have options on the receiver themselves to change. these options are blocked out of the R22 for some reason....

[Cade]

I paid $99 for an HD DVR when i had the appointment set to have the new equipment installed but the installer brought out the R22 instead. I got the money credited back. Ive tried to get an HD DVR but I have to pay the $199. The gray bars dont really bother me enough that I would cancel service with them.

you can still see everything just fine I dont see why you and your wife are that unhappy with them. Hopefully it all works out for you and you get the HD DVR free. I have read on other threads that with the HD DVR you have to pay for the HD access no matter what.

HRJustin- You seem to be taking this personally for some reason? You do realize that I never said that I would cancel service with them don't you. I'm glad that the gray bars don't bother you, but the 2" bars on the top and bottom of my screen are not what my wife and I are use to-diff'rent strokes for diff'rent folks. BTW, the guy said that I would not get charged for HD service since I didn't want it in the first place.

[HRJustin]

sorry I misread your first post but even with the gray bars directv is still way better then cable. I would just like to see an update from directv theres no real reason them bars should be gray. they can be easily changed on the HD recievers with a simple setting.

[joshjr]

Cade, just wanted to let you know I have a HR20-100 and I dont have a HDTV either. I still can notice a difference between SD and HD channels especially on Sunday Ticket. I will be getting a HDTV one of these days.

[Cade]

HRJustin- no prob bro!

joshjr- I hope to get one this summer too.

[dodge boy]

Directv could remedy this by letting you change the "bars" to black, making them less noticible and allowing the "Cropped" "Unaltered" and "Pillar Box" options ont the 480i & p settings. This would allow you to "zoom" the picture as the viewer sees fit, but still leave the R22 an SD receiver. I would prefer this myself, but since I already have and HR22 unit and HD on my account let the R22 on those accounts access to HD... I know less money for D* since I won't have to upgrade 3 DVRS, but more money for the local Best Buy, I'll need 3 more HD TVs.

[HRJustin]

all that would have to be done is unblock the grayed out "video" tab under "HDTV" in the system setup. Just by allowing that one tab it would fix everything while still keeping this DVR Standard Definition. It is just such a silly thing to block. It makes perfect sense to keep the "TV Resolutions" tab grayed out so you cannot change the output resolutions.

[texasbrit]

all that would have to be done is unblock the grayed out "video" tab under "HDTV" in the system setup. Just by allowing that one tab it would fix everything while still keeping this DVR Standard Definition. It is just such a silly thing to block. It makes perfect sense to keep the "TV Resolutions" tab grayed out so you cannot change the output resolutions.
My suspicion is that the code for the video format settings is embedded in a section of the program that handles HDTV, so it was difficult to enable the settings without a rewrite, it isn't just a matter of unblocking a tab. Maybe DirecTV will rewrite the code to give R22 users the ability to change the format.

[bobcamp1]

The bars are supposed to be gray to help prevent burn-in on the TV. My ABC local station uses gray bars during its newscast. Whether that helps or not is a whole other topic....

I have no problem putting in an option to change them to black, and the R22 should be able to zoom/crop/etc. I mean, if the cheaper non-DVR receivers can do it, why can't the R22?

[HoTat2]

Or if not, should DirecTV for whatever reasons deem it impractical to rewrite the R22’s software to include these matte-bar change color and 480p/i format options, then turn on addition Ka band channels of SD MPEG-4 center-cut versions of the locals on spotbeams to the former 72.5 LiL markets.

Personally I’d be mad as heck about this since it is almost as though the mandatory locals move from 72.5 is forcing you to upgrade to HD access with an HR2X receiver in order to get around the locked letter-box/gray matte-bar issue on the software limited R22.

[dishrich]

Or if not, should DirecTV for whatever reasons deem it impractical to rewrite the R22’s software to include these matte-bar change color and 480p/i format options, then turn on addition Ka band channels of SD MPEG-4 center-cut versions of the locals on spotbeams to the former 72.5 LiL markets.

Agree, but not practical, since now D* will be back to, in essence, sending a 2nd copy of most locals up & taking up bandwidth.
Better solution would be to just to us ALL HD DVR boxes, then disable the HD channels - they ALREADY do this for non-DVR receivers, since they now use ONLY HD boxes (Hxx series) in all these markets, & just shut off HD.

[Cade]

and all my channels look like they did before the switch. DTV has displayed some outstanding service so far! I hooked it up and called in and the rep helped me get all the settings "set" in about 30 minutes.:D

[LOCODUDE]

and all my channels look like they did before the switch. DTV has displayed some outstanding service so far! I hooked it up and called in and the rep helped me get all the settings "set" in about 30 minutes.:D

Glad you are once again happy Cade. Happy viewing............:D