The Frustration Thread: Sometimes a Tech just needs to vent.

[Mertzen]

From a bad day to a bad week, sometimes being out there just doesn't work out. A shady customer, a malfunctioning tool or just bad luck somethings just make your blood boil.
Share your frustrations here, But let's keep it in good spirits and with due relevance. :grin:

[Mertzen]

A quick tale.
2 TV HD job, 1 HD DVR, one HD.
Good news, apartment building so no messing around with my ladder. On 3rd floor of 4 floors so not too much wire. One room has existing DBS wire.
But quickly it goes south.
First battery does immediately, second one also flat. GRRR. Do other stuff while charging. Up and down stairs like it's a stairmaster.
Dish up, wire ran.
HD DVR good to go, signal decent, software downloading.
HD seems odd, from the second coax from dish goes in gives fuzzy screen. Getting only 1/2 xponders. Odd.
Change to new wire. GRRR still same issue. Pretty sure at this point there is a power issues in this old building.
Ground dish to cell phone tower I beam. Behold issues disappear on HD. Call and activate.
Then.. WTF issues now on HD DVR. Changing LNBs just swaps problem from room to room.
Customer barely understands. "My TV and computer work so it's not my problem"
GRRRRRR.. Been here for way too long at this point.
Had to call boss will come over tomorrow to test outlets.

Just hope to get paid for this one.

[Mertzen]

Second tale.

3 Set HD; HD DVR, 2 STD.

It's raining out. No problem with that, I don't mind just hate getting my tools wet.
Anyhow, decide on SWM, will make job easier and there is some existing wire that can be used.
Dish up, aligned and wire down.
PI uo, first splitter. Clean up wire from shoddy cable install to please customer.
Run more lines etc,
Customer calls cable co to disconnect TV services. We joke about the insane hold time.
Then she gets to a rep who immediately start lowballing D* with claims of bad signal etc. then offers a deal to customer to stay. Been there for 3 hours at that point.
Customer tells me she is canceling the install. GRRRRR waisted time and NO pay since no activation.
Soaked for nada. UGH.

[pfp]

Second tale.

3 Set HD; HD DVR, 2 STD.

It's raining out. No problem with that, I don't mind just hate getting my tools wet.
Anyhow, decide on SWM, will make job easier and there is some existing wire that can be used.
Dish up, aligned and wire down.
PI uo, first splitter. Clean up wire from shoddy cable install to please customer.
Run more lines etc,
Customer calls cable co to disconnect TV services. We joke about the insane hold time.
Then she gets to a rep who immediately start lowballing D* with claims of bad signal etc. then offers a deal to customer to stay. Been there for 3 hours at that point.
Customer tells me she is canceling the install. GRRRRR waisted time and NO pay since no activation.
Soaked for nada. UGH.

Cancel the install - the install is done! This one would really tick me off if I were you. :mad:

[Mertzen]

Cancel the install - the install is done! This one would really tick me off if I were you. :mad:

I was really ticked off.
She told me the cable co guy [slimebag] told her that D* charges for truck rolls. Me and office told here that she is covered for 1 year and even promised her a second year of free service. Still nada.
To be honest, and I'll probably receive flak for this, but at that point I had already disconnected two of the three cable boxes and left them as such upon leaving.
Guess she can enjoy one of cable co's free tech tolls.:nono2: GRRRRRR

[BattleZone]

Customer calls cable co to disconnect TV services. We joke about the insane hold time.
Then she gets to a rep who immediately start lowballing D* with claims of bad signal etc. then offers a deal to customer to stay. Been there for 3 hours at that point.
Customer tells me she is canceling the install. GRRRRR waisted time and NO pay since no activation.
Soaked for nada. UGH.

I always start my installs with a site survey/interview. The end of that includes a warning to the customer that once I start working, I'm going to activate the receivers and any changes to the plan is going to cost the customer. In your situation, I'd have left and activated those receivers a block away.

[Mertzen]

In your situation, I'd have left and activated those receivers a block away.

Wish I could have done that, but retailers get a 100% back charge if a customer disconnects. And I really don't want to do that to my boss' company.

[joe diamond]

DTV is what it is and has been around long enough for everyone except those who have been living in a cave for the last..........10+ years to know about it.

So it is time for DTV to stop kissing ass to sneak their service into the homes of the few who are undecided. And it is also time cowboy up to a non refundable deposit to schedule an installation. The installer should get paid for even a NLOS. Cancellations should not be the problem of the installation company.

And I wonder where the recent thread about an installer union went? It seemed an apt topic for an installation discussion site.

Joe

[awblackmon]

My rant is this after yesterday. I really enjoy being an installer. I don't think I am the fastest, but I do a good job. I am trying to get faster, but I am finding certain things beyond my control just slow me down. Like yesterday. I go into a room, and it looks like a tornado hit it! I am told that the receiver will go over there, behind the biggest pile of stuff in the room. The customer never cleared out the pile, in front of the wall where I had to to get to drill the hole and install the plate. The spot where the tv goes, oh my, where do I put the receiver? All that stuff on and around the tv. Extra time involved for maid service, about ten minutes, but if I have to clean a couple of piles per day or per house to do my job, I can't get home as fast as I would like at the end of the day.

Please people, clean the room before the poor installer gets there. At least where the service is going to go in. And if it is in your teens room, yeah, just inform him or her if they want tv in the room, they will have to clean it or maybe you just may not have it installed. Nothing like a carrot dangle to get some room cleaning action out of them.

Alan in Boise

[joe diamond]

My rant is this after yesterday. I really enjoy being an installer. I don't think I am the fastest, but I do a good job. I am trying to get faster, but I am finding certain things beyond my control just slow me down. Like yesterday. I go into a room, and it looks like a tornado hit it! I am told that the receiver will go over there, behind the biggest pile of stuff in the room. The customer never cleared out the pile, in front of the wall where I had to to get to drill the hole and install the plate. The spot where the tv goes, oh my, where do I put the receiver? All that stuff on and around the tv. Extra time involved for maid service, about ten minutes, but if I have to clean a couple of piles per day or per house to do my job, I can't get home as fast as I would like at the end of the day.

Please people, clean the room before the poor installer gets there. At least where the service is going to go in. And if it is in your teens room, yeah, just inform him or her if they want tv in the room, they will have to clean it or maybe you just may not have it installed. Nothing like a carrot dangle to get some room cleaning action out of them.

Alan in Boise

I get that all the time...........try asking the customer to make a hole in the pile and work somewhere else. If it looks like a real time killer do not start the installation. Leave and tell them to unblock access to the building.

IF you attempt to move stuff you set yourself up for an accusation that you stole some precious piece of crap. Also, electronic accessories including the TV should work before you start. A disconnected pile of VCRs and stereo speakers is not your job.

Charge extra or run away,

Joe

[ThomasM]

This is a very interesting thread!!

I guess very few people consider the install horror stories which might be the install just before theirs!! (And thus the installer isn't in the best of moods)

Now, here's the kind of install you need:

When I added one of my DVR's it was replacing an existing receiver so it needed a second cable run to the multiswitch. The installer sized me up and after I explained that I installed all of my own DirecTV hardware and didn't really care to change that plan he asked how much coax I thought was needed. (imagine!) He rolled off a bunch of cable and handed me some connectors and said "have at it!". Then he let me poke through his selection of R15's (all were recons) until I found one I liked! I picked one, we hooked it up to the existing cable to be sure it worked and he was off to a long lunch hour.

[roadrunner1782]

Second tale.

3 Set HD; HD DVR, 2 STD.

It's raining out. No problem with that, I don't mind just hate getting my tools wet.
Anyhow, decide on SWM, will make job easier and there is some existing wire that can be used.
Dish up, aligned and wire down.
PI uo, first splitter. Clean up wire from shoddy cable install to please customer.
Run more lines etc,
Customer calls cable co to disconnect TV services. We joke about the insane hold time.
Then she gets to a rep who immediately start lowballing D* with claims of bad signal etc. then offers a deal to customer to stay. Been there for 3 hours at that point.
Customer tells me she is canceling the install. GRRRRR waisted time and NO pay since no activation.
Soaked for nada. UGH.

I would have lost my cool real fast at the house!:mad: Congrats on not blowing a gasket and losing control, especially since no good would have came from it!

[xmguy]

My rant is this after yesterday. I really enjoy being an installer. I don't think I am the fastest, but I do a good job. I am trying to get faster, but I am finding certain things beyond my control just slow me down. Like yesterday. I go into a room, and it looks like a tornado hit it! I am told that the receiver will go over there, behind the biggest pile of stuff in the room. The customer never cleared out the pile, in front of the wall where I had to to get to drill the hole and install the plate. The spot where the tv goes, oh my, where do I put the receiver? All that stuff on and around the tv. Extra time involved for maid service, about ten minutes, but if I have to clean a couple of piles per day or per house to do my job, I can't get home as fast as I would like at the end of the day.

Please people, clean the room before the poor installer gets there. At least where the service is going to go in. And if it is in your teens room, yeah, just inform him or her if they want tv in the room, they will have to clean it or maybe you just may not have it installed. Nothing like a carrot dangle to get some room cleaning action out of them.

Alan in Boise

First I'm not an installer, love to be one maybe someday. But I'll be honest. I'm not a teen, but don't keep the cleanest room. So when I had D* to install my service last yr. I asked the installer If I could run the coax lines and connect the box (R15-100) in my room. I then provided the RID and SERIAL numbers to the installer for activation. Also assisted the installer in running the other coax through my brick outer wall. As well as connecting the other receivers and giving the installer those RIDs and Serials.
I have the utmost respect to all D* installers. Because I know they have to take alot of S*** from customers. I feel for you.

[xmguy]

This is a very interesting thread!!

I guess very few people consider the install horror stories which might be the install just before theirs!! (And thus the installer isn't in the best of moods)

Now, here's the kind of install you need:

When I added one of my DVR's it was replacing an existing receiver so it needed a second cable run to the multiswitch. The installer sized me up and after I explained that I installed all of my own DirecTV hardware and didn't really care to change that plan he asked how much coax I thought was needed. (imagine!) He rolled off a bunch of cable and handed me some connectors and said "have at it!". Then he let me poke through his selection of R15's (all were recons) until I found one I liked! I picked one, we hooked it up to the existing cable to be sure it worked and he was off to a long lunch hour.

Cool. I enjoyed helping the installer who did my D* install. I try to assist in all installer/service people who come to my home. I enjoyed getting my hands dirty drilling the holes with a rotary hammer drill (2 holes for each coax lines from the dish). The darn bit came out about 3 times. I tightened the bit and continued at it.
I'd love to be an installer. But not sure if I could take the added stress that comes with it.

[Mertzen]

y.

Please people, clean the room before the poor installer gets there.

Yeah honestly, got one of these to some extend to day. Mail from 1997 on the dining room table, etc. Just throw something out once in a while.
But all together not too bad of a day for once.:grin:

[rob316]

When I had D installed installer had to run all new cabling because Comcast coax he wanted to use was bad. So he ran the cabling and hooked up the Sat, as he was doing that I removed all my Comcast boxes and placed all the D boxes in their place. I hooked up all the HDMI cabling to the tv. Once he ran the cabling from teh SAT, I assisted him in plugging the coax into all the boxes. Overall a good job by him, and he was pleased that I did not sit on my ass and watch him bust his ass.

[Incompetent]

5am: wake up, clean up, check handheld for any surprises. Nope, just one big install not too far from the house.

6am: Roll into office for weekly meeting. Listen to yammering, watch the same video for the 5 millionth time. Techs get threatened, one gets fired. blah blah blah.

730am: Meeting finally ends. Go into warehouse to get some equipment. Sup waves me over(this cant be good). Some guy in our DMA dropped his route, I get his jobs and get moved to the front of the line in the warehouse. Just 2 installs and 2 Upgrades. 120 mile drive (to the first job)and I notice I am out of my cellphone coverage area. Use payphones and customers phone all day.

730pm: Get home and check work. Wow only three jobs tomorrow.Hmm New sup cant route worth crap. Ill have to drive through 5 diff counties to do 3 jobs. Also got a callback and will need 40' ladder and not sure if that will even work for LOS.


FUN eh?

[netraa]

Here is my vent for today.

Ladies and gentlemen, when YOU go and lease a rcvr from best buy, and decide to try and do a self install and $@^& it all up, DO NOT call directv for a service call for your not working rcvr that you did not follow the instructions on to begin with where it tells you NOT to call until you have it installed proerly.

you took the choice to go around the directv install model and get your own rcvr so you are on your own for the install!!!!!!!!!!!

When you finally decide to punt, call directv for a UPGRADE (yes they are likely going to charge you), otherwise your going to get your service call canceled bu the technician, and told to order an UPGRADE and get to WAIT even longer to get that brick working. WE, the installers, CAN NOT add equipment on a service call. That means wire, switches, or dishes! if it is not on the work order, it doesn't go in.

Also, when you call for the upgrade, give FULL DISCLOSURE to the csr. If you try and hide pieces of your system from them and they don't add the proper switches, dishes, or other parts and build the work order with out those critical parts.... well, see above. If its not on the work order, it doesn't go in.

IF you converted yourself to swim, you HAVE to tell them that, if you have a single lnb dish and went and got a HD rcvr and no slimeline dish, you have to tell them that.

If you figure you can call in on a 'broken rcvr' and the tech will just 'get it done while he is there' your fooling yourselves. (unless you happen to have 2 ben franklins lying around to hand to the installer, then your golden)

[ChrisPC]

I've been my family and friends' "tech guy" for about 15 years now. I've installed TVs, computers, DVD players, game systems, D* systems, etc. I even worked for D* for a while, but didn't want to keep dealing with all the crap. I have many horror stories of my own. Not to mention, this was before hourly pay and GPS systems!

When an installer shows up, I do as much as I can to help. I hook everything up that I can, move TVs, etc. I know what they have to deal with.

[awblackmon]

When I had D installed installer had to run all new cabling because Comcast coax he wanted to use was bad. So he ran the cabling and hooked up the Sat, as he was doing that I removed all my Comcast boxes and placed all the D boxes in their place. I hooked up all the HDMI cabling to the tv. Once he ran the cabling from teh SAT, I assisted him in plugging the coax into all the boxes. Overall a good job by him, and he was pleased that I did not sit on my ass and watch him bust his ass.

I know a lot of techs can get a bit annoyed at customers who want to be helpful. I enjoy the customer who will roll up sleeves and help. I know I ranted about teens and dirty rooms, but teens can also be great assistants. They run cables in crawl spaces. hand you tools and hook up equipment. and such. Adult customers can often recommend ways to get an install done because they know their house much better than you. One customer had pre-solved what could have been at first glance a impossible install for me.

I love it when a customer removes all the old equipment from the cable company or other satellite provider and makes room for my install. I love it when the furniture is moved to make room for me working behind the entertainment system. Everyone benefits.

But, when I get the young customer who lays around on the couch and texts while I am busting my butt doing an install to meet their extra mile requests, I am not feeling warm and fuzzy about being there.

Alan in Boise

[awblackmon]

I get a giggle out of the installs where people are moving and the new house doesn't have any televisions moved in yet. There may be one, and it is usually the big 52 inch Plasma which just cannot be moved from room to room.:lol:

So I went onto craigslist and found a little gem. For twenty bucks I got a 3 inch battery powered LCD tv. I can move it from receiver to receiver and do the install. It takes longer to complete the setups but at least I get the install done.

The upside is the install can be done pretty easy with no stuff to work around, or have to move. I love that part but I make this request. If you a customer are moving, and you want your Directv right away, before the furniture is brought over, please move the tv in right away too.:) Thanks.

Alan in Boise

[KC2LLW]

I've been my family and friends' "tech guy" for about 15 years now. I've installed TVs, computers, DVD players, game systems, D* systems, etc. I even worked for D* for a while, but didn't want to keep dealing with all the crap. I have many horror stories of my own. Not to mention, this was before hourly pay and GPS systems!

When an installer shows up, I do as much as I can to help. I hook everything up that I can, move TVs, etc. I know what they have to deal with.

I recently upgraded to HD last month, My installer came out to find a AU9-SL3 already installed and roughly tuned to 86 signal strength, all cables ran WB68 installed and old SD DVR's removed and ready for the new HR23's all he had to do was hook up the HR23's and activate them. I asked him to check the signal and to fine tune it but when he left it was no better than when he first arrived. I figured I must have saved him 3 hours of time a Slimline dish and a WB68 not to mention about 120' of Dual solid copper RG6. But I am into doing things myself, he did complement me on my install :)

[Mertzen]

I know a lot of techs can get a bit annoyed at customers who want to be helpful.

I know, it's a very thin line between helpful and annoying. Once I had an easy 3 setter. But the customers was on me like a lly. Constantly ' are you sure you want to do this, why are you doing this, etc '
One point I told customer ' here's my drill, go at it' :sure:

[Incompetent]

I know, it's a very thin line between helpful and annoying. Once I had an easy 3 setter. But the customers was on me like a lly. Constantly ' are you sure you want to do this, why are you doing this, etc '
One point I told customer ' here's my drill, go at it' :sure:

Absolutley agree. The annoying ones are the guys who want to follow you into the attic.

Also, the opposite of the lazy slobs are the OCD neat freaks. I figure most people fall somewhere in between. I once had a customer who had different shoes for certain parts of the house. I wasn't really noticing it much until he had to change into his "attic" shoes to show me where the homeruns were.

[Parvopup]

Customers are great - not only a source of income but a source of constant amusement as well.

I have decided that there are three basic types of customers -

1. Disinterested - these are the "ho-hum" folks who could really care less who provides their video service at any given moment in time.

What drives them is price and savings - meaning they jump to whoever is offering a better/cheaper deal that day. Easy to spot - they have the remains of at least two previous sat dishes on their roof as well as a few hundred splitters on their house wiring from the local CATV outfits that they have used in the past.

Most likely to be the customers who have piles of junk right in front of where you need to work.

Say "Whatever" a lot.

Offers you beers.

2. Embarrassed - these are the tofu eaters and global warming advocates who feel compelled to tell you at least once every 5 minutes how "We seldom if ever watch TV and really didn't want TV but our kids bought us a HD Flat Screen for our anniversary and it would be a shame not to use it".

Very concerned about where you place the dish - can't have the neighbors seeing that "THING" now can we?

Did I mention how they really really really don't watch TV?????

Want to know if "they can paint the dish a different color?"

Offers you bottled spring water a lot.

Never tip.

3. Rabid Mad Dogs - these people have NO life.

What they DO have is a nice fat 5 box install....in a four room house!:) Meaning one in the living room for the 60-inch plasma altar, one for each bedroom, one in the kitchen and then "should we put one in the garage or in the bathroom instead?"

Easy to identify - these people have homes where EVERY piece of furniture faces a TV and the kids get the shakes when you tell them that it will be a couple of hours before the TV comes back on!

Most likely to want to "get involved" in the install but usually just end up ordering pizza and beer which they chow down in front of you while you crawl their attic.

Most likely to tip!

[TigersFanJJ]

For twenty bucks I got a 3 inch battery powered LCD tv. I can move it from receiver to receiver and do the install. It takes longer to complete the setups but at least I get the install done.

The upside is the install can be done pretty easy with no stuff to work around, or have to move.

The downside is that you are opening yourself up to a chargeback when the customer tries and fails to connect their tv properly. Even by leaving your number and explaining how important it is to call you, some will call Directv first and cause you to lose money.

Also, by leaving your number, you open yourself up to the customers that call you up three years after their install and expect you to drop what you are doing to come fix a problem they are having for free. They are the ones that get downright rude and start cursing at you when you tell them that a charge will be involved.

[DaaQ]

5am: wake up, clean up, check handheld for any surprises. Nope, just one big install not too far from the house.

6am: Roll into office for weekly meeting. Listen to yammering, watch the same video for the 5 millionth time. Techs get threatened, one gets fired. blah blah blah.

730am: Meeting finally ends. Go into warehouse to get some equipment. Sup waves me over(this cant be good). Some guy in our DMA dropped his route, I get his jobs and get moved to the front of the line in the warehouse. Just 2 installs and 2 Upgrades. 120 mile drive (to the first job)and I notice I am out of my cellphone coverage area. Use payphones and customers phone all day.

730pm: Get home and check work. Wow only three jobs tomorrow.Hmm New sup cant route worth crap. Ill have to drive through 5 diff counties to do 3 jobs. Also got a callback and will need 40' ladder and not sure if that will even work for LOS.


FUN eh?

I wish I only had to drive 120 miles. Here is what my day was like today.

2am: woke up for no reason at all, went and had a smoke and decided to check the handheld. Wow what a screwin they gave me. 5 jobs, I know where they are and have been to 2 of the four towns. GPS first job and see that I need to leave home by 6am to make it onsite before 8:30 am. Go back reset the alarm and go back to sleep.

6:15am- Wake up and am late already. Take quick shower, run coffee and get on the road by 6:40 am.

8:15am- Make detour to warehouse to get onsite and start gettin paid, grab a dvr, back on the road 8:35ish.

9:15 Get to 1st service call, cust shows me whats wrong. I ask where multiswitch is, up to the attic we go, "where is the black power pack?" Back downstairs we go, hear it buzzing, unplug, replug, go grab replacement 4x8 intall it, wife says "ask him about the second wire" so he does, can you put a second wire over on this wall so when we move the tv it will work. I look behind existing area and see one line coming through floor other out the wall plate. Remember the switch in the attic?? I tell him let me finish up and we'll talk about it. So I go outside smoke again and clean up my stuff. Decide I am not going to do this "favor" or "upgrade" remember the switch in the attic? So I go tell him the deal, that it IS an upgrade, which it really is to any of you that may be thinking its not. Relocates are upgrades and cost money, not covered by the PP. I tell him this, which is the truth, and if he is a handy person I'll tell him how I would do it if I were him, and I'll give him 30 ft or so of cable to do it himself. He agrees, no tip, nice big house by the way. So back on the road.

To shorten the rest of this up I'll just tell ya the times.
6:40 leave home
8:15 start gettin paid
4 jobs later
5:49 stop gettin paid
Back on the road by 6pm got to stop for gas.
Lost an hour at the store (inc looking for it)
9:45 arrive home with BK for my son and I.

My gps said my truck was moving for 6:52 hr/mins and went 332 miles round trip from/to home. Gave yas my start and stop time (actual) I'v filled the tank 5 out of 6 days this week. We're on 6 days, off tomorrow. So keep this thread going Mertzen I get some good ones where I am at, will report back later.

[kucharsk]

Absolutley agree. The annoying ones are the guys who want to follow you into the attic.

Since you as the installer know nothing about the house or its layout when you get there, doesn't it make sense for the homeowner to follow you into the attic to point things out or answer questions as to where the coax should be run?

It's not like most installers are going to be fishing wires, so don't you need to be present to tell them where the cables should come out or the best way to get them to the basement or crawl space?

Frankly, I didn't think installers would even be willing to crawl through the attic to route cable.

[Mertzen]

My gps said my truck was moving for 6:52 hr/mins and went 332 miles round trip from/to home.

Dang, I should stop complaining when my job is 20 miles away. Then again I sometimes only average 10mph in NYC traffic and pay my own gas.

Still out there the drives must get boring.


Just had some decent jobs, one 'plug and play' from previous tenets dish and lines. And to other SD 2 setters without too much effort.

[BattleZone]

Just went to one yesterday.

"There's going to be a dish? How am I supposed to know that DirecTV is satellite?"

"They didn't tell me that I might be charged extra!" (pole mount and 120' of trenching)

"There's no cable in any rooms. So I'm going to have to have a cable? I won't see anything, will I?"

They're out there.

[pressureman0]

:DJust went to one yesterday.

"There's going to be a dish? How am I supposed to know that DirecTV is satellite?"

"They didn't tell me that I might be charged extra!" (pole mount and 120' of trenching)

"There's no cable in any rooms. So I'm going to have to have a cable? I won't see anything, will I?"

They're out there.

:hurah:
120 = $120 PLUS A POLE OR A NO LOS AND SOUND LIKE A EXTRA LABOR AT 45 PER HOUR :nono2: YOUR MUST BE A ROOKIE I ONLY HOPE THEY NEED A WALL FISH:D

[Mertzen]

"There's going to be a dish? How am I supposed to know that DirecTV is satellite?"



:lol::lol::lol: Yup, get those more then once.

Reminds me off a install 1TV for a orthodox jewish customer.
Talking to two ladies, the fear of god in them that someone would see the dish.
I offered to get on the roof with the dish so they could check.
I got "But someone over there [ pointing several blocks away] could see it"
I gave them our card and got out of there.

[DaaQ]

Since you as the installer know nothing about the house or its layout when you get there, doesn't it make sense for the homeowner to follow you into the attic to point things out or answer questions as to where the coax should be run?


Well, unless you have the installer that has absolutely no clue as to whats going on, Most installers should have an idea about home construction.

An attic is an attic, unless you have it full of storage stuff, there is not much you could tell me that would make it any different that other attics, it has joists and trusses spaced out at even intervals, it is full of blown insulation, it is hot, most are dark, and most attics, it does not matter where the cable is run, unless there is room to stand up and walk around, then the installer would know that the cable should be tacked up or routed around the space that is usable for storage.

[kucharsk]

Fair enough; I'd love to be able to trust the installer enough to tell them to go do their thing.

[Parvopup]

Road time - yeah - gotta just love it when you are away from home for 12 hours a day...and 7 of them were spent driving.

My shop doesn't do email - so even with a handheld we are still expected to drive in for a paper copy. So I spend every morning driving 45 minutes to the shop, spend twenty minutes in line while the supervisor sorts through the stack or tries to find the stapler, then 45 minutes back to the town I just left only to drive another 60 minutes past there to my first job...only to have Mister Joe Customer go "they said you would be here at 800am"!

Sure thing Bud - but since the shop won't open before 7am and I haven't figured out that time travel thing just yet and the speed limit is 65 - well guess what - it's 10 o'clock so bite me.

Usually, I end up logging 200-250 miles a day for 3 to 4 jobs - really love it when half are 20 buck upgrades. Nothing quite like figuring that once you factor in the drive - you make about 8 bucks an hour.

[joe diamond]

Road time - yeah - gotta just love it when you are away from home for 12 hours a day...and 7 of them were spent driving.

My shop doesn't do email - so even with a handheld we are still expected to drive in for a paper copy. So I spend every morning driving 45 minutes to the shop, spend twenty minutes in line while the supervisor sorts through the stack or tries to find the stapler, then 45 minutes back to the town I just left only to drive another 60 minutes past there to my first job...only to have Mister Joe Customer go "they said you would be here at 800am"!

Sure thing Bud - but since the shop won't open before 7am and I haven't figured out that time travel thing just yet and the speed limit is 65 - well guess what - it's 10 o'clock so bite me.

Usually, I end up logging 200-250 miles a day for 3 to 4 jobs - really love it when half are 20 buck upgrades. Nothing quite like figuring that once you factor in the drive - you make about 8 bucks an hour.

I just love the CSR routers. "They said..." And when they ask for an ESTIMATED Time of Arrival they want to argue about your estimate.

For years I had no trouble making my own appointments and keeping them.

There may not have ever been a good old days with this work but for sure we are now into the stupid current days.

Joe

[avmaster]

Had a customer throw a fit after the fact I opened up their attic scuttle to look around and there was a huge pile of insulation literally ontop of the scuttle cover. I cleaned up as best I could(not exactly like we carry vaccums and dry cleaning gear with us lol). Also he drywalled a splitter into his wall so I had to run another line to get signal(customer doesn't understand why you cant put satellite through a cable splitter lol) Customer is fine after I left his 5 hour job, and happy. Next day I am getting bitched at because his wife threw a fit over the insulation when she got home, as if I can somehow magically see inside the attic before I go into it. Thats a huge pet peeve of mine, as if there is some way we can just crawl around in a 140 degree attic and there is not going to be any dirt or insulation on us when we get out. Some people are just dumb.

Job after that one, biggest ghetto house possible. Literally 20 people standing around smoking, drinking, kids running around everywhere, every wire on the house is a bird swing. Could have been a 1 hr job but turned into 3 just because I had to navigate through their jungle of hell.

[avmaster]

Road time - yeah - gotta just love it when you are away from home for 12 hours a day...and 7 of them were spent driving.

My shop doesn't do email - so even with a handheld we are still expected to drive in for a paper copy. So I spend every morning driving 45 minutes to the shop, spend twenty minutes in line while the supervisor sorts through the stack or tries to find the stapler, then 45 minutes back to the town I just left only to drive another 60 minutes past there to my first job...only to have Mister Joe Customer go "they said you would be here at 800am"!

Sure thing Bud - but since the shop won't open before 7am and I haven't figured out that time travel thing just yet and the speed limit is 65 - well guess what - it's 10 o'clock so bite me.

Usually, I end up logging 200-250 miles a day for 3 to 4 jobs - really love it when half are 20 buck upgrades. Nothing quite like figuring that once you factor in the drive - you make about 8 bucks an hour.


Ya stupid shops/supervisions do not make your jobs easy. Then customers bitching at you as if you are supposed to be there at 8am when its an 8-12 really gets old. I worked for a shop like that, it was always something, they were slow routing, or out of equipment, or just dumb in general. You would be lucky to make your first appt before ten even when it was 5 miles away. I said 'see ya' to those idiots. Now I store my own equipment at home and my routes are done at 8:30 the night before. Gotta love that!!

[avmaster]

Just went to one yesterday.

"There's going to be a dish? How am I supposed to know that DirecTV is satellite?"

"They didn't tell me that I might be charged extra!" (pole mount and 120' of trenching)

"There's no cable in any rooms. So I'm going to have to have a cable? I won't see anything, will I?"

They're out there.

Yup, you gotta pay extra, doesn't matter how mad the customer gets, or if they jump up and down and scream about it. They want something 10x more than a standard install, they pay up or no go. You could't go to get an oil change on your car and expect to get the brakes done for free did ya? Same logic applies to us, theres gotta be guidelines or customers will have you doing some completely rediculous stuff.

[kucharsk]

Just to defend the customers a bit, I've been on the receivng end of estimates of 8 AM - 12 Noon where an installer showed up at 2:00 PM, and worse yet, once when a repair guy was supposed to arrive between 10 AM and 2 PM and showed up at 8 AM (!).

Though I think a lot of arrival issues could be easily solved if installers just called customers to let them know if they were delayed and/or when they're on their way.

Most people don't care if you're late, they just want to know what's going on…

[xmguy]

I wish I only had to drive 120 miles. Here is what my day was like today.

2am: woke up for no reason at all, went and had a smoke and decided to check the handheld. Wow what a screwin they gave me. 5 jobs, I know where they are and have been to 2 of the four towns. GPS first job and see that I need to leave home by 6am to make it onsite before 8:30 am. Go back reset the alarm and go back to sleep.

6:15am- Wake up and am late already. Take quick shower, run coffee and get on the road by 6:40 am.

8:15am- Make detour to warehouse to get onsite and start gettin paid, grab a dvr, back on the road 8:35ish.

9:15 Get to 1st service call, cust shows me whats wrong. I ask where multiswitch is, up to the attic we go, "where is the black power pack?" Back downstairs we go, hear it buzzing, unplug, replug, go grab replacement 4x8 intall it, wife says "ask him about the second wire" so he does, can you put a second wire over on this wall so when we move the tv it will work. I look behind existing area and see one line coming through floor other out the wall plate. Remember the switch in the attic?? I tell him let me finish up and we'll talk about it. So I go outside smoke again and clean up my stuff. Decide I am not going to do this "favor" or "upgrade" remember the switch in the attic? So I go tell him the deal, that it IS an upgrade, which it really is to any of you that may be thinking its not. Relocates are upgrades and cost money, not covered by the PP. I tell him this, which is the truth, and if he is a handy person I'll tell him how I would do it if I were him, and I'll give him 30 ft or so of cable to do it himself. He agrees, no tip, nice big house by the way. So back on the road.

To shorten the rest of this up I'll just tell ya the times.
6:40 leave home
8:15 start gettin paid
4 jobs later
5:49 stop gettin paid
Back on the road by 6pm got to stop for gas.
Lost an hour at the store (inc looking for it)
9:45 arrive home with BK for my son and I.

My gps said my truck was moving for 6:52 hr/mins and went 332 miles round trip from/to home. Gave yas my start and stop time (actual) I'v filled the tank 5 out of 6 days this week. We're on 6 days, off tomorrow. So keep this thread going Mertzen I get some good ones where I am at, will report back later.

I'll be honest. I never knew you were supposed to tip an installer?! I just try to help any way possible. I've never had a problem getting my hands dirty.

[Mertzen]

I'll be honest. I never knew you were supposed to tip an installer?

I think the mantra of "above and beyond" applies here.
I get plenty of big tips on jobs where I barely do anything special, but peanuts from people who chase me all the time, set demands for every aspect of the job and feel like they 'own' you for the duration when we're 'onsite'.:nono2:

[xmguy]

I think the mantra of "above and beyond" applies here.
I get plenty of big tips on jobs where I barely do anything special, but peanuts from people who chase me all the time, set demands for every aspect of the job and feel like they 'own' you for the duration when we're 'onsite'.:nono2:

I'll add, I never ask an installer to do more than what is on the order sheet. But I like to help if the installer wants. Not to sound rude. But the Tip thing was something I never knew was expected of me. I guess from now I will. Let me ask, If I have D* do any more upgrades/installs. Should I offer to help? The first install, I offered the guy was more than willing. Like I said in an above post. I ran coax, installed boxes, drilled holes in brick for the dish lines. What would you advise to an consumer from an installer?

[Mertzen]

I'll add, I never ask an installer to do more than what is on the order sheet. But I like to help if the installer wants. Not to sound rude. But the Tip thing was something I never knew was expected of me. I guess from now I will.

A tip should never be 'expected' and sometimes I even refuse one.

Really, if you tip me with your laundromat coins then you need the cash more then I do.

But when you complain to me that two techs before me didn't want to do the job the way you wanted them to and I spend 4+ hours on a 2 TV then throw me a bone, especially when you're obviously loaded.

[xmguy]

A tip should never be 'expected' and sometimes I even refuse one.

Really, if you tip me with your laundromat coins then you need the cash more then I do.

But when you complain to me that two techs before me didn't want to do the job the way you wanted them to and I spend 4+ hours on a 2 TV then throw me a bone, especially when you're obviously loaded.

see above post for more info. I'm NOT loaded. I know you're also speaking in a general since. I never complain about a tech's work.
Unless the OBVIOUSALLY do a crappy job. Which most do an excellent job. D* install was the best. I even told a supervisor that came to my home to check the work. I praised the installer.

[RobertE]

Just to defend the customers a bit, I've been on the receivng end of estimates of 8 AM - 12 Noon where an installer showed up at 2:00 PM, and worse yet, once when a repair guy was supposed to arrive between 10 AM and 2 PM and showed up at 8 AM (!).

Though I think a lot of arrival issues could be easily solved if installers just called customers to let them know if they were delayed and/or when they're on their way.

Most people don't care if you're late, they just want to know what's going on…

Thats all fine and dandy if:

You provide a VALID and WORKING phone number and, here's the biggie, pick up the fraking phone when I'm calling you.

I can't count the number of times I've tried calling only to get no answer. I get there, beat the crap out of the door because the fracking doorbell is broke, finally someone opens the door.

Them: "You were supposed to call first"
Me: "I tried, no one picked up"
Them: "What number did you call?"
Me: "xxx-xxx-xxxx"
Them: "No one called that number"
Me: Shows them the call log from cell phone.
Them: "Oh, I didn't recongize the number, so I didn't pick up"
Me: Resists urge to do great bodily harm to customer.

No kidding you didn't recongize the number, I've never talked to you before fool. :rolleyes:

[xmguy]

Thats all fine and dandy if:

You provide a VALID and WORKING phone number and, here's the biggie, pick up the fraking phone when I'm calling you.

I can't count the number of times I've tried calling only to get no answer. I get there, beat the crap out of the door because the fracking doorbell is broke, finally someone opens the door.

Them: "You were supposed to call first"
Me: "I tried, no one picked up"
Them: "What number did you call?"
Me: "xxx-xxx-xxxx"
Them: "No one called that number"
Me: Shows them the call log from cell phone.
Them: "Oh, I didn't recongize the number, so I didn't pick up"
Me: Resists urge to do great bodily harm to customer.

No kidding you didn't recongize the number, I've never talked to you before fool. :rolleyes:

My lord! If I'm waiting for an installer or just a tech or what ever to come to my home. I ask them to call first as I have dogs I have to put up and confine before hand. I ALWAYS answer unknown/unrecognized calls during this time. I can't see who wouldn't!!!?? If you are expecting someone you've never met WHY would you ignore a call from them! I could see how that would piss anyone off.

[ThomasM]

3. Rabid Mad Dogs - these people have NO life.

What they DO have is a nice fat 5 box install....in a four room house!:) Meaning one in the living room for the 60-inch plasma altar, one for each bedroom, one in the kitchen and then "should we put one in the garage or in the bathroom instead?"

Easy to identify - these people have homes where EVERY piece of furniture faces a TV and the kids get the shakes when you tell them that it will be a couple of hours before the TV comes back on!



Watch it! You're describing most of the mods on this messaging system! :D:D:D

[Tech_1438]

I'll add, I never ask an installer to do more than what is on the order sheet. But I like to help if the installer wants. Not to sound rude. But the Tip thing was something I never knew was expected of me. I guess from now I will. Let me ask, If I have D* do any more upgrades/installs. Should I offer to help? The first install, I offered the guy was more than willing. Like I said in an above post. I ran coax, installed boxes, drilled holes in brick for the dish lines. What would you advise to an consumer from an installer?

You should never feel obligated to tip a technician. A technician who expects a tip is most likely not deserving of one.

I appreciate any help a customer is willing to give, after all it is your home.

[xmguy]

You should never feel obligated to tip a technician. A technician who expects a tip is most likely not deserving of one.

I appreciate any help a customer is willing to give, after all it is your home.

How about helping with installs, etc

[netraa]

I love it when a customer thinks that since they are capable of unscrewing the coax fitting from the back of the rcvr, that they are qualified to move said rcvr.

For example, at least today's dude had the stones to fess up to what he did.

Dude's wife wanted to flip the living room around. Dude unplugged everything from the entertainment center, moved everything to the other side, plugged the rcvr into the coax outlet on that wall, and didn't know what to do with the little black box with the white and red ports on it. So.. when the system didn't start up, and the wife started screaming from the rest of the house that everything was down he vaguely remembered that the black box was plugged into the rcvr. Since he didn't know what 'power to swm' meant, nor what an IRD was... he looked on the back of the rcvr, saw 'swm 1' on the input and hooked it right on up. When that didn't work, he decided it might work if he tried it on the other rcvrs at the house. Then he even tried it on the old line that was never Directv, but was near where the cable people put the amp to run his modem...

total damage.....


2 HR20-700.
2 R22
3 D12
4 splitters
1 Power inserter
1 Cable modem
1 cable amp
1 REALLY pissed off wife when I carried her DVR's and all her shows out the door.


For sure one of the HDDVR's was shot, the swm input on the back was smoked... and all the rest of the rcvrs were twitchy so... he got a full replace job since i didn't want to risk a charge back on a rcvr that died 10 mins after i left the house.

[David MacLeod]

never had a st installer here, but have had other techs out for stuff. can't afford to tip but I get dirty helping them and give coffee/food/drink without any reservations.

[Rakul]

Yeah I haven't tipped yet, but I am the above and beyond kind of guy and normally I help the guy by pulling out furniture, unpacking and hooking up the box to the TV and so on. Last guy that came here for a two room upgrade just had to push the coax through the hole. He was out of here in 15 minutes or so.

[joe diamond]

I love it when a customer thinks that since they are capable of unscrewing the coax fitting from the back of the rcvr, that they are qualified to move said rcvr.

For example, at least today's dude had the stones to fess up to what he did.

Dude's wife wanted to flip the living room around. Dude unplugged everything from the entertainment center, moved everything to the other side, plugged the rcvr into the coax outlet on that wall, and didn't know what to do with the little black box with the white and red ports on it. So.. when the system didn't start up, and the wife started screaming from the rest of the house that everything was down he vaguely remembered that the black box was plugged into the rcvr. Since he didn't know what 'power to swm' meant, nor what an IRD was... he looked on the back of the rcvr, saw 'swm 1' on the input and hooked it right on up. When that didn't work, he decided it might work if he tried it on the other rcvrs at the house. Then he even tried it on the old line that was never Directv, but was near where the cable people put the amp to run his modem...

total damage.....


2 HR20-700.
2 R22
3 D12
4 splitters
1 Power inserter
1 Cable modem
1 cable amp
1 REALLY pissed off wife when I carried her DVR's and all her shows out the door.


For sure one of the HDDVR's was shot, the swm input on the back was smoked... and all the rest of the rcvrs were twitchy so... he got a full replace job since i didn't want to risk a charge back on a rcvr that died 10 mins after i left the house.

OVER FIXED!

So you still don't know what went wrong? But you based your actions upon the expectation of charge backs for taking other actions? Replace everything?

How much would you charge to fix it?

Any questions?

Joe

[avmaster]

Just to defend the customers a bit, I've been on the receivng end of estimates of 8 AM - 12 Noon where an installer showed up at 2:00 PM, and worse yet, once when a repair guy was supposed to arrive between 10 AM and 2 PM and showed up at 8 AM (!).

Though I think a lot of arrival issues could be easily solved if installers just called customers to let them know if they were delayed and/or when they're on their way.

Most people don't care if you're late, they just want to know what's going on…

Usually try to do that, but sometime the day is nothing but pressure from the word go to work quickly, so phone calls come.

[kucharsk]

Thats all fine and dandy if:

You provide a VALID and WORKING phone number and, here's the biggie, pick up the fraking phone when I'm calling you.


But if you reach an answering machine, do you bother to leave a message?

That's my pet peeve.

All I need is a message stating "This is Robert, your DirecTV installer. I'm on my way and I hope to be there by 9:30. See you soon."

Just because you're supposed to call doesn't mean I'm not in the bathroom, brushing my teeth, in the shower, getting the mail out of the mailbox, or in fact don't answer calls that come up "Unknown Caller" or "Private" on my Caller ID boxes.

I'll never get why so many people (not specifically you, as I don't know) feel they can't leave a message.

Usually try to do that, but sometime the day is nothing but pressure from the word go to work quickly, so phone calls come.

Your customers more often than not understand that and quite often have similar jobs themselves, yet another reason why a 90 second phone call to let them know that it looks like you'll be there at 3:00 rather than 1:00 is important.

Don't you get just as frustrated when an appliance breaks and all the repair shop can tell you is "sometime between 10 and 3?"

[RobertE]

But if you reach an answering machine, do you bother to leave a message?

That's my pet peeve.

All I need is a message stating "This is Robert, your DirecTV installer. I'm on my way and I hope to be there by 9:30. See you soon."

Just because you're supposed to call doesn't mean I'm not in the bathroom, brushing my teeth, in the shower, getting the mail out of the mailbox, or in fact don't answer calls that come up "Unknown Caller" or "Private" on my Caller ID boxes.

I'll never get why so many people (not specifically you, as I don't know) feel they can't leave a message.



Your customers more often than not understand that and quite often have similar jobs themselves, yet another reason why a 90 second phone call to let them know that it looks like you'll be there at 3:00 rather than 1:00 is important.

Don't you get just as frustrated when an appliance breaks and all the repair shop can tell you is "sometime between 10 and 3?"

Nope, I don't leave a message. Not anymore. When I did, I would often see the customers machine blinking with X number of messages on it. It turned out to be a waste of MY time and MY cell minutes.

[David MacLeod]

Nope, I don't leave a message. Not anymore. When I did, I would often see the customers machine blinking with X number of messages on it. It turned out to be a waste of MY time and MY cell minutes.
what many don't realize is a lot of this phone stuff is not paid for by anyone except the installer.

[joe diamond]

what many don't realize is a lot of this phone stuff is not paid for by anyone except the installer.

One of the last conversations I had with an HSP manager revolved around a charge back for No Call No Show. I had called (and actually spoke to) a customer. He was one of eight AM jobs. I had received the whole pile at 11:ooAM. Since I told him it would be late in the day before I got to his work but did not state a specific time they felt ok with hitting my check.

There are reasons why people will not do thi work.

Joe

[JB292]

I install in an area where us techs usually help each other out on exceptionally hard installs, usually commercial. Anyway, today's my off day, and I just got a call from my friend co worker who has a 10 box commercial job in a "gentlemen's club".

Damn my luck, he said it will probably take him well into the night to finish....:grin:

[ThomasM]

For sure one of the HDDVR's was shot, the swm input on the back was smoked... and all the rest of the rcvrs were twitchy so... he got a full replace job since i didn't want to risk a charge back on a rcvr that died 10 mins after i left the house.

WOW!!!

I've always been curious what DirecTV does if a customer causes damage to the equipment by not knowing what they are doing. What do they do/charge?? :confused:

[Mertzen]

WOW!!!

I've always been curious what DirecTV does if a customer causes damage to the equipment by not knowing what they are doing. What do they do/charge?? :confused:

A lot of it goes unnoticed. I have replaced many a soda soaked IRDs. Just replace and drop the old one at the warehouse. A lot of them went into the dumpster soon thereafter.

[RobertE]

WOW!!!

I've always been curious what DirecTV does if a customer causes damage to the equipment by not knowing what they are doing. What do they do/charge?? :confused:

The tech has the "option" of fixing/replacing the customer damaged items one time as a courtesy or report the problem as customer caused. If the later, then the customer would get billed for the repairs.

Now, how often does the later happen? Just about as often as I win the lotto. ;)

[Mertzen]

I remember at one point when I was repeatedly dealing with a blind customer they gave me a form to make the customer pay for the repeat service calls as 'customer caused' since the person would stray into the 500/600 channels to which he didn't subscribe and hence would lose all audio.
So there are procedure for the HSP to recover customer cause cost.

But it barely gets enforced.

[kucharsk]

Nope, I don't leave a message. Not anymore. When I did, I would often see the customers machine blinking with X number of messages on it. It turned out to be a waste of MY time and MY cell minutes.

Really? You've got a plan that charges for minutes?

Seriously though, it's basic customer service and I'm surprised anyone's against it.

[kucharsk]

I remember at one point when I was repeatedly dealing with a blind customer they gave me a form to make the customer pay for the repeat service calls as 'customer caused' since the person would stray into the 500/600 channels to which he didn't subscribe and hence would lose all audio.


Wow, is there a way to lock out the unsubscribed channels?

If so, I could see the customer suing under the ADA…

[netraa]

OVER FIXED!

So you still don't know what went wrong? But you based your actions upon the expectation of charge backs for taking other actions? Replace everything?

How much would you charge to fix it?

Any questions?

Joe

I know exactly what went wrong. The dude moved the SWM power inserter from the location that it was wired into, to another location and didn't move the hot leg on the splitter.

Then the guy forced 21V INTO the sat in port on ALL of his rcvrs.

After i restored the system the remaining rcrvs were jacked up the tuners were bouncing up and down, dropping odds one second, evens the next, all of them the next, and nothing the second after that. tuner 1 and tuner 2 were reporting different readings at the same time on a swm system....

I replaced ALL rcvrs, closed it customer caused, and called it into the call center to let them decide what they wanted to do with *D. He basically murdered his own system.

[awblackmon]

Yeah I haven't tipped yet, but I am the above and beyond kind of guy and normally I help the guy by pulling out furniture, unpacking and hooking up the box to the TV and so on. Last guy that came here for a two room upgrade just had to push the coax through the hole. He was out of here in 15 minutes or so.

I will take a furniture moving customer any day. I would also love to have a customer who would take receiver out of box and hook it up to tv over any tipping! I would even love it if you just took the plastic bands off the cords, upwrap the remote, and put in the batteries if you are comfortable and can do any of these things. I am amazed at the amount of time it takes to do all this. Also I would love having the old satellite stuff from the old satellite or cable company removed by customer so I can make room for the new one. I know not everyone is comfortable in doing this, but if you are, bless you when you do. It means more to me than any tip. You gave me the gift of time. Alan

[bird dog]

i love 20 minutes of phone calls with dispatch trying to find a place in the boondocks, driving to where it should be, then being out of cell range, driving back to where it works then finding out the customer called in looking for an eta and providing directions 6 miles up a different dirt road.

in all fairness, it has gotten much better with google maps app on our hand helds, but sometimes mapquest will have other streets google doesnt. note to self... need a mapquest app too.

[Telcoguru]

Calling in advance doesn't always work either. I had a customer with an 8am-5pm appt. I call him at 1:15pm and tell him I will be there later in the day so if he needs to go out I have his cell phone so he can leave the house and I will call him when I am on my way. Meanwhile it is pouring rain out and I get a call from dispatch that he called in to ask where I am when he already has my cell phone number. I call him back to tell him I'll be there around 6pm and he tells me that he already canceled service because he has previous unresolved issues. Crazy people all of the time.

[RobertE]

Really? You've got a plan that charges for minutes?

Seriously though, it's basic customer service and I'm surprised anyone's against it.

Yes, I've got a plan with low minutes, 750 if you want to pry that much. Anyway, those are my minutes. Before doing this, I only had a pay as you go plan. I'm not the type that wants or needs to be connected to everyone every single second of the day. It's funny to see people here piss and moan about paying for custom work a service call or even upgrading to HD, when they pay $100 or more each month for a fraking phone. Crazy. They company does not pay a dime towards my cell use. If they paid my cell bill or turned on the voice part of the handheld, then sure, no problem calling. I'm not going to burn any more of my limited money for the beneft of the company. They make millions a year, I don't.

[Mertzen]

I would also love to have a customer who would take receiver out of box and hook it up to tv over any tipping! I would even love it if you just took the plastic bands off the cords, upwrap the remote, and put in the batteries if you are comfortable and can do any of these things. I am amazed at the amount of time it takes to do all this. Also I would love having the old satellite stuff from the old satellite or cable company removed by customer so I can make room for the new one.

God no, it really irks me; mainly because [ all have happened ]:
- Remote already dragged all over the house and into everything by the little one.
- Batteries will be in the wrong way.
- Cables not color matches
- Access card in the wrong way or still in the IRD box which is in the trash already.

And I prefer if they leave old equipment there. The cableco's boxes here use the same power cord and I just reuse it, saves me from digging through 4 power strips and dust bunnies the size of basket balls.

I never bring in the IRDs till the last moment.

IT does take a long time to set up a bunch of IRDs, especially HD DVRs, but I rather do it all once the right way then to fix it all.

[David MacLeod]

They make millions a year, I don't.

you big liar-head.. I know you and Trump are drinking buddies :) :)

[joe diamond]

God no, it really irks me; mainly because [ all have happened ]:
- Remote already dragged all over the house and into everything by the little one.
- Batteries will be in the wrong way.
- Cables not color matches
- Access card in the wrong way or still in the IRD box which is in the trash already.

And I prefer if they leave old equipment there. The cableco's boxes here use the same power cord and I just reuse it, saves me from digging through 4 power strips and dust bunnies the size of basket balls.

I never bring in the IRDs till the last moment.

IT does take a long time to set up a bunch of IRDs, especially HD DVRs, but I rather do it all once the right way then to fix it all.

Good Plan,

Most of the time it doesn't make a difference but when they try to work a fast one nobody has your back.

Favs = "No, these are all the boxes they (fulfillment co.) sent." Translation is...my junkie son probably sold the box with the dish in it.
" I didn't see any remote, you must have lost it." Translation is...go get another one out of your truck because I want two.
"There was no access card in the box." Translation is...I tried hooking this thing up and couldn't figure it out." ACs were in the trash pile on the porch.
Most of my experiences with DTV customers were like meeting new friends. I felt honored to be invited into their homes and took care to leave the place as I found it with DTV service up & running.
But you do remember the crazies.

Joe

[kucharsk]

I thought installers normally brought the receivers with them, or is that just for upgrade installs (like install a new HD dish and replace the SD receivers with HD ones?)

[joe diamond]

I know exactly what went wrong. The dude moved the SWM power inserter from the location that it was wired into, to another location and didn't move the hot leg on the splitter.

Then the guy forced 21V INTO the sat in port on ALL of his rcvrs.

After i restored the system the remaining rcrvs were jacked up the tuners were bouncing up and down, dropping odds one second, evens the next, all of them the next, and nothing the second after that. tuner 1 and tuner 2 were reporting different readings at the same time on a swm system....

I replaced ALL rcvrs, closed it customer caused, and called it into the call center to let them decide what they wanted to do with *D. He basically murdered his own system.

Ah!

We are almost to the point where this stuff should end up in a sealed drop box (again). Watch for the customer to deny touching anything.

Good one!

Joe

[hobie346]

The last two times I called re: my "dead" H23-600 box and asked to have it replaced (PP) via a dropped FEDEX shipment they stated that they would have to have a tech stop by and see if it was truly dead.

The second time the techs showed up they decided that my black dual shield RG6 cabling wasn't up to D*'s standard and replaced everything with white quad shield. They showed up at 6PM and left at 10PM. All that just to replace a box. :grin:

[joe diamond]

The last two times I called re: my "dead" H23-600 box and asked to have it replaced (PP) via a dropped FEDEX shipment they stated that they would have to have a tech stop by and see if it was truly dead.

The second time the techs showed up they decided that my black dual shield RG6 cabling wasn't up to D*'s standard and replaced everything with white quad shield. They showed up at 6PM and left at 10PM. All that just to replace a box. :grin:

Beginners or being paid by the hour!

Joe

[hobie346]

Beginners or being paid by the hour!

Joe


These two knew what they where doing - getting paid by the hour IMO. :grin:

But one them had to go into the crawl space from the front of the house for one box all to way to back exit point and a grounding block; a good 100' run as the routing isn't a straight line and that crawl space is a hell hole to crawl around in. I've been down there on several occasions and it's a b**** to move around in there so I think he earned it.

The other got off easy as all he did was string cables from the roof mounted switch to grounding blocks and then the external cables to the two other boxes.

[DaaQ]

I want to respond to the quote of "no tip" that I had made. I in no way ever expect a tip, and did not mean to imply so, but was ranting about this particular job.

It was requested on a pp service call, this was one of those where the wife says, ask him about this wall, "oh by the ways" things, that I run a second line for the dvr to a different location in the living room "so it will work when she moves the room around"
Now this is after the system is fixed and all is working the way it should be.

For those of you that don't know, this is not any part of a service call at all, this is upgrade work, this is IRD relocation. The charge for a service call full price is different than charge for a relocate upgrade, cheaper even. They probably already knew this hence the last minute request.
I may have even did it time or circumstances permitting. In this case neither did.
I went out of the way to be helpful, explained that this request was not part of a service call it would be an upgrade. I looked at what would need to be done and explained it to him. I checked the one outlet that was at the location that they were requesting the 2nd line run to for signal and it was hooked up to the 4x8 that was in the attic with all 8 ports already full. This particular wall was an interior wall FYI. So that means either a wall fish for 2nd line or a drop down into the crawlspace out the exterior and into the attic. He inquired about the DIY route and I expressed my opinion. What I would do if it was me.

Mind you that the service call was complete already, I also had 2 more am jobs, with alot of drivetime in an unfamiliar area.

So, to make this long story shorter, dude got 50ish foot of coax plus connectors and told how to do it for free. If you were to goto the store or anywhere and get 50 ft of quality RG6 cable, how much would you pay??
Hence the inclusion of no tip in my rant. Which is what this thread is a rant thread correct?

[DaaQ]

Here is a rant from yesterday. Nothing I like more first thing in the morning is to have to relocate a pole mount because somebody thought it was a good idea to put a pole under a tree.
Here is the kicker, it was installed originally in the last week of April!! There were already leaves in at that time in this area.

[avmaster]

ya you gotta love the customers that want you to do something extra or change something when you are already done. An hour ago would have been a good time to ask!! Not when im done and ready to leave haha.

[Mertzen]

ya you gotta love the customers that want you to do something extra or change something when you are already done. An hour ago would have been a good time to ask!! Not when im done and ready to leave haha.

+1. can you relocate the DVR to the bedroom.
"Sir I just spent two hours running a double wire to the living room, and your wife told me to put it here, go ask her"

[TigersFanJJ]

For those of you that don't know, this is not any part of a service call at all, this is upgrade work, this is IRD relocation. The charge for a service call full price is different than charge for a relocate upgrade, cheaper even.

It's not part of an upgrade either. A relocate would only cover removing the old location's cables from the full 4x8 and connecting the cables to the new location. Then connecting the receiver to the new cables and tv. An additional outlet with no receiver is 100% custom work.

[avmaster]

+1. can you relocate the DVR to the bedroom.
"Sir I just spent two hours running a double wire to the living room, and your wife told me to put it here, go ask her"


Lucky im a Dish installer now and not DTV:) No double lines for me

[Brannayen]

Here's one of my biggest pet peeves...happedened today, even.

Scenario: customer scheduled between 4-8, I call at 3 p.m., en rout early (stressing the early part), and here's the phone call....

"Hi, this is **** with DirecTV. I have you scheduled for a service call today....

"well, come on..I been waiting on ya!"

If it's not even in the window yet, and I'm early, don't tell me that "you're waiting on me".

[kucharsk]

If it's not even in the window yet, and I'm early, don't tell me that "you're waiting on me".

Just to be fair, many people do have to take a full day off of work to wait for the installer no matter what time the window is…

[hobie346]

Just to be fair, many people do have to take a full day off of work to wait for the installer no matter what time the window is…

Amen to that.

[joe diamond]

Just to be fair, many people do have to take a full day off of work to wait for the installer no matter what time the window is…
+1

Of all the crap HSPs and fulfillment companies dish out in the name of QC and contract specs..........the No Call, No Show is the one item I agree with in principle.

I still remember the ONE day when all the morning appointments came out of the fax machine at 11AM........one hour drive away from the first AM. So you spend an hour contacting EIGHT AM customers to say you will be late.

But I digress.........someone has to take a day off and the installer can't do all jobs on weekends. The installation stops being FREE if you loose a day of work to get it. If you loose the day AND nobody shows or calls....that sucks.

Joe

[Incompetent]

/rant on

110 degree heat index today

/rant off

[TigersFanJJ]

/rant on

110 degree heat index today

/rant off

Tell me about it. It was 90 degrees here at 3 A.M. and I was having to walk around on the top of two barges that had asphalt loaded in them (asphalt is heated to around 300 degrees to keep it liquid). I couldn't get away from there fast enough.

[netraa]

Here is one for you.

Just because your little weener dog or worse, your big 85 pound lab is your baby, and you are not bothered by them sniffing you, jumping on you, barking at you and getting under your feet does NOT mean that I have to put up with it.

Our steel toe boots are not the most nimble of shoes and are real good at squishing tails and feet. And when I do step on your dog, don't even think about getting on my case about it.

I get enough bumps, scrapes, bruises, and cuts in this job, i do not need your dog jumping up on my arms and legs with his claws to finish off the wound list.

Installing this stuff is not a 1 trip in and your done type of job and it makes it just that much harder when i have to worry about letting your dog out by mistake when i make a run to the truck for something.

and for petes sake..... don't sit on your couch and just yell at your dogs. get off your lazy duff and put them up.

[joe diamond]

Here is one for you.

Just because your little weener dog or worse, your big 85 pound lab is your baby, and you are not bothered by them sniffing you, jumping on you, barking at you and getting under your feet does NOT mean that I have to put up with it.

Our steel toe boots are not the most nimble of shoes and are real good at squishing tails and feet. And when I do step on your dog, don't even think about getting on my case about it.

I get enough bumps, scrapes, bruises, and cuts in this job, i do not need your dog jumping up on my arms and legs with his claws to finish off the wound list.

Installing this stuff is not a 1 trip in and your done type of job and it makes it just that much harder when i have to worry about letting your dog out by mistake when i make a run to the truck for something.

and for petes sake..... don't sit on your couch and just yell at your dogs. get off your lazy duff and put them up.

Ah yes,

Find a dog turd in the lawn and you are guilty if some migrates to the house.

And I know of one installer who is no longer in the business. The customer did a good job of controlling the varmint during the installation. As he was leaving the three year old opened the door to say good by. The dog ripped the tech's arm to the point where his hand needed surgery to get the fingers to work a little. Independent contractor....no workers comp. His hospitalization insurance wouldn't pay...He ended up starting to sue the (not rich) homeowner.

Don't know how it ended.

Joe

[Parvopup]

Does It Say "Best Buy" on my truck?

That sums up my 4 box install this past weekend. Now - to be fair, my client was not a Native English speaker and my command of his native tongue is mostly nil - but still.

Roll to this unit - no habla on both our parts - look around for the closest kid who speaks English and offer them a buck to translate. I give him my introduction and a brief review of the work order as my translator passes this on. My customer starts going on and on about "televisio" while my translator nods in rapt attention.

She turns to speak and with deadpan seriousness says "He wants to know what kind of televisions you have on your truck - he needs three for the bedrooms but wants a big flat screen one for the living room."

"Que WTF?" - I do know some Spanish.

My client obvious picks up on my response because he starts talking in earnest with our translator who then tells me that he "was told by the people he called at D* that he could get 4 televisios and Optimo Mas for just 19 dollars a month".

Apparently, this deal was too good to pass up - since he had neither a TV nor programming - to get 4 TV's for less than a 12 pack was a muy bueno deal!

I spent the next 20 minutes explaining in painful detail how we do not provide the televisios - just the botas that make the televisios work and that many good deals could be had at Walmart or Best Buy. He eventually seemed to get it and let me install the four boxes into four empty rooms.

All seemed well when I left.

Today - I get a SIN7 - seems his wife came home later and wants to know where are the four TVs I was suppossed to bring?

I guess I failed on "Customer Ed"!

[roadrunner1782]

Here's one of my biggest pet peeves...happedened today, even.

Scenario: customer scheduled between 4-8, I call at 3 p.m., en rout early (stressing the early part), and here's the phone call....

"Hi, this is **** with DirecTV. I have you scheduled for a service call today....

"well, come on..I been waiting on ya!"

If it's not even in the window yet, and I'm early, don't tell me that "you're waiting on me".

You saying this reminded me of a commercial I saw years ago. I don't really remember what the commercial was about, just that a cable guy got a mans roof to do some sort of work (why a cable guy would go on a roof is beyond me) and the customer took his ladder after he was on the roof and said something like "yeah I'll bring it back between 12 and 5":lol: That made me wonder if anyone here has had that happen to them either as a joke (not really a joke if you fell after they put it back) or a customer was just pissed and decided to be mean.

[joe diamond]

Does It Say "Best Buy" on my truck?

That sums up my 4 box install this past weekend. Now - to be fair, my client was not a Native English speaker and my command of his native tongue is mostly nil - but still.

Roll to this unit - no habla on both our parts - look around for the closest kid who speaks English and offer them a buck to translate. I give him my introduction and a brief review of the work order as my translator passes this on. My customer starts going on and on about "televisio" while my translator nods in rapt attention.

She turns to speak and with deadpan seriousness says "He wants to know what kind of televisions you have on your truck - he needs three for the bedrooms but wants a big flat screen one for the living room."

"Que WTF?" - I do know some Spanish.

My client obvious picks up on my response because he starts talking in earnest with our translator who then tells me that he "was told by the people he called at D* that he could get 4 televisios and Optimo Mas for just 19 dollars a month".

Apparently, this deal was too good to pass up - since he had neither a TV nor programming - to get 4 TV's for less than a 12 pack was a muy bueno deal!

I spent the next 20 minutes explaining in painful detail how we do not provide the televisios - just the botas that make the televisios work and that many good deals could be had at Walmart or Best Buy. He eventually seemed to get it and let me install the four boxes into four empty rooms.

All seemed well when I left.

Today - I get a SIN7 - seems his wife came home later and wants to know where are the four TVs I was suppossed to bring?

I guess I failed on "Customer Ed"!

It would be interesting to hear if this one results in a back charge.

I have had a few like that....not the TV part but the exact identity of the customer and the service address......."..no, just because your sister spoke to DTV in English does not mean we (I) will install your DTV unless your sister, who lives in another state shows up, NOW!"

DTV does help with this with Espaniol CSRs.

Joe

[Brannayen]

Just to be fair, many people do have to take a full day off of work to wait for the installer no matter what time the window is…

I fully understand that some customers wait a full day for me to arrive. I'm just saying, if I'm not scheduled till after 4 p.m., understand that there's a good chance that I won't be there till after 4. You don't need to sit around your house starting at 8 a.m. If I'm going to be early, and you're not home, I come back at 4. But don't give me "I've been waiting all day for you...where are you?". If it's after 6 p.m. or so, that's different...just not at 3 p.m.

[hobie346]

I fully understand that some customers wait a full day for me to arrive. I'm just saying, if I'm not scheduled till after 4 p.m., understand that there's a good chance that I won't be there till after 4. You don't need to sit around your house starting at 8 a.m. If I'm going to be early, and you're not home, I come back at 4. But don't give me "I've been waiting all day for you...where are you?". If it's after 6 p.m. or so, that's different...just not at 3 p.m.

And what would you expect a customer to do when the service was scheduled for between 8AM and noon only to have the tech show up after 6PM with no calls to the customer to inform him that the tech is going to be a little late.

I really hate the system that D* has gone to when they insist that they send a tech to replace a faulty receiver even after you've explained to the CSR that you saw smoke coming out of your receiver and the earliest that they can have someone there is in two weeks.

What it really comes down to is a bad three way relationship that has many bumps in the read.

[avmaster]

Here is one for you.

Just because your little weener dog or worse, your big 85 pound lab is your baby, and you are not bothered by them sniffing you, jumping on you, barking at you and getting under your feet does NOT mean that I have to put up with it.

Our steel toe boots are not the most nimble of shoes and are real good at squishing tails and feet. And when I do step on your dog, don't even think about getting on my case about it.

I get enough bumps, scrapes, bruises, and cuts in this job, i do not need your dog jumping up on my arms and legs with his claws to finish off the wound list.

Installing this stuff is not a 1 trip in and your done type of job and it makes it just that much harder when i have to worry about letting your dog out by mistake when i make a run to the truck for something.

and for petes sake..... don't sit on your couch and just yell at your dogs. get off your lazy duff and put them up.


If peoples pets are bothering me, they either put them away or I stop working, PERIOD. I for one DO NOT put up with peoples crap like that.

Case in point, lady had her two dogs outside, she says they are freindly and not to wory about them. I got down off my ladder and the one tried to bite my ankle. The stupid idiot wouldn't tend to the dog so I walked away.

I really don't care if a customer jumps up and down screams and does backflips, your F'in tv is NOT more important than my personal safety.




Another thing, people do this all the time, and it probably urks me more than anything, is they have their 18yr old kid there at the house, and of course the place hardly even has a path to walk through, back yard trashed, kid doesn't know much about whats going on, parent at work. Don't bitch beause you wanted your dvr in a different room than your kid told me to. 2 days later you hear about the customer bitching about the way the place was setup. I gave a lady a piece of my mind about that once, she was screaming at me because I had to run a second line into a room because she was running cable internet into that room. I told her if she didn't like it she should have been there and ACTUALLLY cleared a path for me to work in.

[avmaster]

And what would you expect a customer to do when the service was scheduled for between 8AM and noon only to have the tech show up after 6PM with no calls to the customer to inform him that the tech is going to be a little late.

I really hate the system that D* has gone to when they insist that they send a tech to replace a faulty receiver even after you've explained to the CSR that you saw smoke coming out of your receiver and the earliest that they can have someone there is in two weeks.

What it really comes down to is a bad three way relationship that has many bumps in the read.

Yup, bad thing is, DTV has such a high turnover rate for their techs, they get frustrated quickly and at a certain point stop caring about making calls.

I know a lot of GOOD guys that after a while were so pissed off and frustrated with the way business was done, they just stopped caring. I for one walked away from being a DTV tech for this very reason. I was getting so angry it was being reflected in my work.

Somewhere along the line, a lot of the HSP's forgot that they may need to actually treat an employee right and keep them happy. They figure techs are a dime a dozen.

[Parvopup]

Installers are a dime a dozen - yep - that's the pep talk we get everyday from our Ops Manager.

I just love it when we watch the Video of the Month with Mr. Happy telling us that we are the "face of D*" and it's up to us to present a positive attitude to our customers.

Only to be followed by a 30 minute profanity filled diatribe by our local management on how many ways we stink for not hooking up phone lines in a cellular only household and how we can be replaced in a second and we should feel lucky we even have a job and oh, by the way - have a nice day and remember to smile for your customer.

Not a day goes by that we are not threatened with being fired because of some bigwig in Field Ops having his shorts in a wad over some trivial issue.

Not a month goes by without the same bigwigs whining about the "turnover" rate of field techs.

Guess no one has figured that 1 + 1 = 2.

The only saving grace for our shop is that we are located so far away from our jobs that we have a least an hour's drive to get over being feeling pissed and demeaned. Kindof.

[roadrunner1782]

Installers are a dime a dozen - yep - that's the pep talk we get everyday from our Ops Manager.

I just love it when we watch the Video of the Month with Mr. Happy telling us that we are the "face of D*" and it's up to us to present a positive attitude to our customers.

Only to be followed by a 30 minute profanity filled diatribe by our local management on how many ways we stink for not hooking up phone lines in a cellular only household and how we can be replaced in a second and we should feel lucky we even have a job and oh, by the way - have a nice day and remember to smile for your customer.

Not a day goes by that we are not threatened with being fired because of some bigwig in Field Ops having his shorts in a wad over some trivial issue.

Not a month goes by without the same bigwigs whining about the "turnover" rate of field techs.

Guess no one has figured that 1 + 1 = 2.

The only saving grace for our shop is that we are located so far away from our jobs that we have a least an hour's drive to get over being feeling pissed and demeaned. Kindof.

It amazes me a job would treat employees like that. I know I could and would not put up with that type of verbal abuse! I wouldn't only lose my job but my freedom as well!

[Mertzen]

Installers are a dime a dozen - yep - that's the pep talk we get everyday from our Ops Manager.

Only to be followed by a 30 minute profanity filled diatrib......

Not a day goes by that we are not threatened with being fired because of some bigwig in Field Ops having his shorts in a wad over some trivial issue.


I started reading your post and thought hey this must be our HSP here, then to realize you're in CA.
Isn't is sad that the exact same situation goes down at every single HSP.

I shouldn't complain though, looks like I'm going back to being HSP sub.:grin:

[Mertzen]

It amazes me a job would treat employees like that. I know I could and would not put up with that type of verbal abuse! I wouldn't only lose my job but my freedom as well!

It's odd; I didn't mind being called a 'POS' by or VO of Ops. I did get offended when he called me incompetent. This while other tech sups put 4by4s on SatC, bummed out of work, got subs to do their jobs, make bogus QC's etc.

[Incompetent]

ah yes HSP middle management, the true gems of the entire operation.

No matter where you are its all pretty much the same. I guess they get an email or something? ;)

Seriously i have done my own ODU Evals, took the pics filled out the paperwork and everything. My latest sup was actually a good guy and worked for his techs. His routing was a little shaky but he worked hard for his guys. Of course, he was just demoted so the plant managers best friend could get the job.

When they attempt to make the field techs hourly later this year, I know for a fact I will be going back to subbing.

[RobertE]

ah yes HSP middle management, the true gems of the entire operation.

No matter where you are its all pretty much the same. I guess they get an email or something? ;)



Well, when all the middle mgt drones share a single brain cell (I think it's a time share at that), then...:lol:

[RobertE]

I would like to get an AT&T workorder that is correct for once. Is that two much to ask for?

It's not like I'm asking for peace in the middle east, or for North and South Korea to kiss and make up, or even to be paid and treated fairly. :rolleyes:

[inkahauts]

I would like to get an AT&T workorder that is correct for once. Is that two much to ask for?

It's not like I'm asking for peace in the middle east, or for North and South Korea to kiss and make up, or even to be paid and treated fairly. :rolleyes:

Actually, those other things might be easier ya know.. :D

[TigersFanJJ]

I would like to get an AT&T workorder that is correct for once. Is that two much to ask for?

Yet another reason why I'm glad I moved on to something else. :nono2:

[avmaster]

Installers are a dime a dozen - yep - that's the pep talk we get everyday from our Ops Manager.

I just love it when we watch the Video of the Month with Mr. Happy telling us that we are the "face of D*" and it's up to us to present a positive attitude to our customers.

Only to be followed by a 30 minute profanity filled diatribe by our local management on how many ways we stink for not hooking up phone lines in a cellular only household and how we can be replaced in a second and we should feel lucky we even have a job and oh, by the way - have a nice day and remember to smile for your customer.

Not a day goes by that we are not threatened with being fired because of some bigwig in Field Ops having his shorts in a wad over some trivial issue.

Not a month goes by without the same bigwigs whining about the "turnover" rate of field techs.

Guess no one has figured that 1 + 1 = 2.

The only saving grace for our shop is that we are located so far away from our jobs that we have a least an hour's drive to get over being feeling pissed and demeaned. Kindof.

HAHA, lol. Notice how those videos never include the rats nest of wiring from the previous 10 techs who have been there, the screaming kids running everywhere and the indecisive dude who cant make up his mind where he wants his dvr put and the piles of junk you are expected to dig through in order to find the wall plate in that room . If every house was a clean, easy, home run to every room, easy place to mount the dish then i think everyone would be mr. HAPPY.

Must be the DTV way to 'threaten' everyone into submission. Guess they forgot that we live in a free country and are able to work elsewhere hahaha. Joke is on them, I know for a fact that the sub I used to work for is just a bunch of newbs now. ALLL of the good guys quit, or got fired over something trivial. Then they sit there scratching thier heads wondering why they have so many service calls and sin7's. The guy that run the shop, I wouldn't trust him to put air in a tire let alone do ANYTHING technical.

There was a time when it wasn't like that of course, when you actually owned up to your own work and if you screwed sometihing up you FIXED it, instead of it being an excuse to find something that didn't even matter to use as leverage to pay you less. Bottom line, 99% of the B.S. that they blow up everyones asses, its a thinly veiled attempt to increase their bottom line, PERIOD.

I would suggest that literally every SINGLE tech out there that works as a sub or inhouse UNIONIZE. everyone needs to get in on it, not just a few people. it WILL make a difference.

Or go work as a sub for dish, in my experience they are actually NOT stupid, and do care about their employees.

[joe diamond]

HAHA, lol. Notice how those videos never include the rats nest of wiring from the previous 10 techs who have been there, the screaming kids running everywhere and the indecisive dude who cant make up his mind where he wants his dvr put and the piles of junk you are expected to dig through in order to find the wall plate in that room . If every house was a clean, easy, home run to every room, easy place to mount the dish then i think everyone would be mr. HAPPY.

Must be the DTV way to 'threaten' everyone into submission. Guess they forgot that we live in a free country and are able to work elsewhere hahaha. Joke is on them, I know for a fact that the sub I used to work for is just a bunch of newbs now. ALLL of the good guys quit, or got fired over something trivial. Then they sit there scratching thier heads wondering why they have so many service calls and sin7's. The guy that run the shop, I wouldn't trust him to put air in a tire let alone do ANYTHING technical.

There was a time when it wasn't like that of course, when you actually owned up to your own work and if you screwed sometihing up you FIXED it, instead of it being an excuse to find something that didn't even matter to use as leverage to pay you less. Bottom line, 99% of the B.S. that they blow up everyones asses, its a thinly veiled attempt to increase their bottom line, PERIOD.

I would suggest that literally every SINGLE tech out there that works as a sub or inhouse UNIONIZE. everyone needs to get in on it, not just a few people. it WILL make a difference.

Or go work as a sub for dish, in my experience they are actually NOT stupid, and do care about their employees.

+1

And I thought it was just me!

If you want to go somewhere you can get on your horse and go. If you decide not to feed the horse but beat him more the horse will either run away or die. You will need another horse.

If you feed the horse and tell him where you are going he will take you there without commands after a few trips.

Joe

[avmaster]

Ya, the local management cracks me up around here. I often wonder what sort of job they would have if they were not making everyones lives miserable. Flipping burgers maybe? Basically some dumbass that figured out how to point a dish, kissed enough ass to get to where he is, and now thinks hes something, preaches satellite like its rocket science, and will fire you for not putting a weatherboot on a fitting thats no where near anywhere that is going to be exposed to water. But then I come at him with some REAL technical questions, i get the deer in headlights look. Yup, thats what I thought LOL. Common sense seemed to fall off the wagon at some point.

Like I said, Im glad im not dealing with it any more.

[awblackmon]

I was laid off from a company last October that had a very interesting philosophy on how to treat an employee. Each department would treat the next or previous department as a customer. Customer satisfaction ruled. If there was a problem, it had to get corrected. It was a clean room fab job and this model worked very well.

Now, like you say, the gritching about what gets done, and not done, hooked up or not hooked up, how, and why we get back charged for situations really out of our control, is a work model that is so alien to me, I wonder how we are getting our jobs done? We sit on the phone longer than is needful because some system somewhere is not working right to activate, or we are installing a system for a customer that is not up to date on payments. Wow, it just causes me to stare in wonderment how and why things are being done the way they are?

So, if we were treated like a Directv customer, I think they could become one of the top customer satisfaction companies in the world both within and outside the company. Mr. Happy Face would make me proud, not giggle.:lol: Alan

[TBoneit]

Just to be fair, many people do have to take a full day off of work to wait for the installer no matter what time the window is…

Why I will not take an afternoon appointment.

Snipped

I really hate the system that D* has gone to when they insist that they send a tech to replace a faulty receiver even after you've explained to the CSR that you saw smoke coming out of your receiver and the earliest that they can have someone there is in two weeks.
QUOTE]

MY reply to them would be come take this piece of Doo Doo now and don't even think about early termination when you fail to provide the contracted service. In fact I just told Chase to close their credit card when they refused what I asked them for.

[QUOTE=avmaster;2141270]Snipped
Somewhere along the line, a lot of the HSP's forgot that they may need to actually treat an employee right and keep them happy. They figure techs are a dime a dozen.

Sarcasm mode on: You mean you don't just unplug the old and plug in the cheapo replacement tech? Sarcasm off
Honestly all employers need to understand that they need to treat employees better. Especially when that is the employee interfacing with the customer.

Snipped
When they attempt to make the field techs hourly later this year, I know for a fact I will be going back to subbing.

Piecework benefits the competent worker. Hourly benefits the incompetent or lazy worker.

OTOH Hourly could be better for the customer

I worked for someone that liked to yell and denigrate his workers. Worked until I could get out of there as fast as I could that is.

I had a customer like that, threw his weight around and browbeat everybody. I talked to my boss, we refunded his money and told him never come back again. AFAIK he's worn out his welcome at all the repair stores around here. It was always a hour+ just for him to drop off his computer for repair and say the .... isn't working. 50 minutes of that was wasted by him beating around the bush telling stories about everything but what needed doing.

You're lucky at least your customers don't ignore the we'll call you when it is done. Some of them call 3 - 4 time a day. Then they wonder why it takes so long to get done. Huh? Each time they call you move there repair back to the bottom of the heap.
Cheers

[MrShowtime]

Things have gone to hell in our office. They are rolling on all of our service calls and making sure they are 100% up to code and the quality of installs I'm seeing is atrocious. If they aren't they are sending us back. Half of the jobs I roll up on aren't even remotely close to code, no drip loops, not ground, wires not neat. I was fixing jobs the best I can before but to make the entire install that was done half assed 6 mo - 1 yr ago pretty is ridiculous. This is an example of the stuff I'm running across pretty much on a daily basis:

Before
http://i44.tinypic.com/nyb6sz.jpg

After
http://i43.tinypic.com/ort3qh.jpg

[joe diamond]

Things have gone to hell in our office. They are rolling on all of our service calls and making sure they are 100% up to code and the quality of installs I'm seeing is atrocious. If they aren't they are sending us back. Half of the jobs I roll up on aren't even remotely close to code, no drip loops, not ground, wires not neat. I was fixing jobs the best I can before but to make the entire install that was done half assed 6 mo - 1 yr ago pretty is ridiculous. This is an example of the stuff I'm running across pretty much on a daily basis:

Before
http://i44.tinypic.com/nyb6sz.jpg

After
http://i43.tinypic.com/ort3qh.jpg

Showtime,

You are being screwed!
There are ob out there that are messy........as in your first picture. And your cleanup is neat and workmanlike. But...did the system work better after your quick ties and clips?

My last interaction with DirectSatUSA was an introduction to a subcontractor who was a crook and who I cannot find to collect a court judgment.
They called for months after I stopped taking work from them to ask for ETAs on jobs I had never seen or planned to install.
They were no help finding their trusted subcontractor.
They did double book jobs to make sure somebody arrived.

Pretty work.....except that a professional would rerun the white cable so all lines were black and looked the same down in the crawl. Did they pay you to neaten up that work?

Oh yeah!.....What code? I see a ground messenger in the first pic...where is it now?

Joe

[MrShowtime]

Showtime,

You are being screwed!
There are ob out there that are messy........as in your first picture. And your cleanup is neat and workmanlike. But...did the system work better after your quick ties and clips?

My last interaction with DirectSatUSA was an introduction to a subcontractor who was a crook and who I cannot find to collect a court judgment.
They called for months after I stopped taking work from them to ask for ETAs on jobs I had never seen or planned to install.
They were no help finding their trusted subcontractor.
They did double book jobs to make sure somebody arrived.

Pretty work.....except that a professional would rerun the white cable so all lines were black and looked the same down in the crawl. Did they pay you to neaten up that work?

Oh yeah!.....What code? I see a ground messenger in the first pic...where is it now?

Joe

Wow thats crazy. And the system worked better after i took out the corroded loose fittings and replaced the 3x4 but of course making it pretty does nothing for the functionality. Its actually in a maintenance shed attached to a townhouse. And I just got paid the standard service call rate. I mean it didnt take that much time to do, but when you have 5-7 service calls most days, and half of them require this stupid stuff, the frustration adds up pretty fast. I'm considering requesting going back to installs, but in my area, 75-80% our standard completion rate (mine is like 83% but I know how to get creative), and I get 96-97% of service calls done and I like knowing that barring some catastrophe I'm definitely making a certain amount each week.

And its ground on the other side of the wall, to the electric meter, that was one thing the first guy did right :lol:

[avmaster]

heres my vent for tonight.

For the retailer I work for some of the salesmen are idiots.

They book a 8-8:30 appointment 50 miles away. Crossing the absolute busiest part of the largest physical city in the united states. What kind of time frame is this? and the notes say 'customer is serious about 8-8:30. Dumbass!! im leaving at 7:30. if I get there in time, I do, if I get stuck in traffic, i will get there when i do.

Then in the notes it says 'program customers pro-logic remote to reciever'. Ok, if its a remote with an LCD screen that takes 30 min to program or needs to be hooked to a computer, im charging for it.

[awblackmon]

heres my vent for tonight.

For the retailer I work for some of the salesmen are idiots.

They book a 8-8:30 appointment 50 miles away. Crossing the absolute busiest part of the largest physical city in the united states. What kind of time frame is this? and the notes say 'customer is serious about 8-8:30. Dumbass!! im leaving at 7:30. if I get there in time, I do, if I get stuck in traffic, i will get there when i do.

Then in the notes it says 'program customers pro-logic remote to reciever'. Ok, if its a remote with an LCD screen that takes 30 min to program or needs to be hooked to a computer, im charging for it.

Jeez, I hate that. Hook up, program, whatever, while you are doing the install. Call the Best Buy or stereo shop guy you got the stuff from to do this for you. I have other customers to get to. No wonder I am late, with these silly requests and get complaints about being late for other appointments. I want to focus on you, but there are limits. Yet my shop says I should do this. WHY? Usually the requests of programming, fixing, hooking up, are from people who originally had the son in law set it up, and now he isn't around, so will I be so kind? I opt that you somehow get the son in law to come back around and do this, or his clone, or whoever will fill that role. I don't want to sound mean, but I am being paid by the job, not by the hour, and hooking up and programming stuff, isn't paying me anything, and my wife really does want me home earlier tonight than when I have been getting home for the last week. Alan

[woodybeetle]

Good lord you guys seem to get kicked in the b**** doing the residential installs. I switched to commercial and MDU installs 5 years ago and never looked back. Its nice to go to a customers condo, use the key code to get in, set up 6 boxes, activate them and be out in an hour with a helper, just in time for the other 5 installs that day. No dish, no managers loosing their minds, oh yeah, a quad "tuner" not receiver pays 130 with 15 for each additional, not bad for all SWM installs. The bad part is the fact that if the building goes down due to a storm, I get 100+ customers calling my phone. Yes I give them my number, and respond to them at 930 at night. When you take your skill set and change the environment, your life gets easier. We never have to dig through customers piles of crap to find an outlet. We never get a no customer home, and we charge for additional items ie harmony remote programs, stereo hookup, plasma unbox. I recommend to any installer in this career path, get your level 4 training, then get your DSS3 training and make yourself much more valuable to the industry. Then find someone that will pay you what you think you are worth.

[woodybeetle]

Here is one for you.

Just because your little weener dog or worse, your big 85 pound lab is your baby, and you are not bothered by them sniffing you, jumping on you, barking at you and getting under your feet does NOT mean that I have to put up with it.

Our steel toe boots are not the most nimble of shoes and are real good at squishing tails and feet. And when I do step on your dog, don't even think about getting on my case about it.

I get enough bumps, scrapes, bruises, and cuts in this job, i do not need your dog jumping up on my arms and legs with his claws to finish off the wound list.

Installing this stuff is not a 1 trip in and your done type of job and it makes it just that much harder when i have to worry about letting your dog out by mistake when i make a run to the truck for something.

and for petes sake..... don't sit on your couch and just yell at your dogs. get off your lazy duff and put them up.

Hand them this little tidbit, it will make them put up their dogs in a heartbeat.
It is against OSHA guidelines to have a canine in an active work area. You are a worker, thus this is now an active work area, if they insist on keeping the animal in the work area, then the OSHA rep will insist that they pay the 12,500 fine for the violation, Or they can avoid the fine by stopping work and leaving the jobsite vacant until the issue can be resolved in a court of law.

They usually look at you with a deer in the headlights look as they put the dog in the bathroom.

And yes, I have been bitten, and did promptly assault that animal, and then had its owner arrested and sued the pants off of him. Charges of willful endangerment go a long way.

[avmaster]

Heres an example of the type of situation that just pisses me off to no end, just happened to me today.


Easy 2 room install, do a (verbal)site survey, explain where a good place to mount the dish is, whatever. I mount the dish, nothing out of the ordinary, asphault shingle roof, right above the d'mark. Customer (woman) is standing right there when I tell her where Im goign to put it. She says 'ya that should be fine'

2 hours later, husband gets home, pitches a bitch because he doesn't like where the dish is mounted. And then says there is already the same dish mounted on the back side of the house. Well, this was not visible to me, and NO one mentioned it before i started the install. So i guess I am supposed be psychic and have x-ray vision? bottom line is, I have to go move or remove my dish now because the customers dumb ass wife was too dumb to know what was going on with the install. Not to mention that, he blatantly lies to my company, he said his wife told me to put it in the back yard. People just don't use common sense, we cant read minds!! I swear, some days, I am so sick of this kind of stuff that I just want to walk away from it and never look back. Problem is, this kind of thing is SOOO common, it literally happens all the time to lots of techs.

We don't use site survey forms, but from now on im using my own, at least there is some hard evidence when a customer lies.

[bnglbill]

2 hours later, husband gets home, pitches a bitch because he doesn't like where the dish is mounted. And then says there is already the same dish mounted on the back side of the house. Well, this was not visible to me

Obviously, verbal site surveys don't work, it seems to me that a visual site survey should have been done.:nono2:

[avmaster]

Lol, dont shake your head at me man, it was visual, did you not read my post and just skim through it? Did I mention that the customer was standing outside by the dmark before I started the install and i physically SHOWED her where the dish was going to go? This dish that was already 'supposedly' there was no where to be seen, so it had to be deep on a patio roof on the back side of the house. Seriously how dumb does someone have to be to not know there is already a dish on the house and not tell me about it.

What I mean is a site survey on paper vs. just going over the install visually and verbally. A signed off piece of paper before the install is what I am going to start using before I start any work. That way they can't lie and go back on themselves, and if their significant other is not educated on what they wan't, thats between them and they have to pay a trip charge for me t come back out there and not waste my time and gas.

[Mertzen]

Obviously, verbal site surveys don't work, it seems to me that a visual site survey should have been done.:nono2:

Even then, had it this week, showed customer where dish would go. Still changed their minds. IDiots.

[satguy22]

WOW What a week! Now we have to pay direct tv,25 to 30% of all are custom work. Are we working for the mob?

[Mertzen]

WOW What a week! Now we have to pay direct tv,25 to 30% of all are custom work. Are we working for the mob?

Obviously you are joking :eek2:

[bonscott87]

You guys would have loved my install/upgrade. I've always done my own installs dating back to 1996 when I first got DirecTV. When I got the HR20 in Sept 2006 it came with the free 5 LNB upgrade. I really didn't want the installer to touch my stuff and hoped he would just do the dish.

So when he showed up I told him I just wanted him to swap the dish and I would take care of the inside replacing the switch and put in the HR20. I could tell he wasn't so sure. So I showed him my stuff.
Dish on a pole next to the driveway, not on the roof. He was pleased.
Told him I had 4 cables buried in PVC then drilled into the house.
Took him in and showed him the cable runs to my "connection closet" where everything in the house comes to the central location.
He said no problem and gave me the HR20 and the WB68 and he went out to do the dish.
I had the install all done inside pretty quickly and helped him peak the dish.
I needed 4 short cables and 2 10 footers and he said no problem, I did half his job for him anyway. So we sat in his van while he made up some cables.
His supervisor showed up before we were done looking for a switch for another installer.
He showed the super all my cable runs and stuff and they asked if I wanted to come work for them. LOL.
Anyway, activated the HR20, all was good. Signals were a bit low but I told him I'd take care of it later as the Red Wings were on tonight. Gave him a tip to get some beer and sent him on his way.

The problem with the signals was due to the new dish being 2" and the pole being the smaller. He really didn't want to install on that pole but I convinced him to rig it so I got lucky there. I ordered up a pole adapter and it was perfect after that.

Anyway, he spent a total of maybe an hour and a half and most of that was just the dish and making me some cables.

[Milkman]

In most cases I really feel bad for the installers here...

A lot of the problems that you guys experience is because people don't think/realize that you don't work for D*, and they think you get paid to do what they need/want (I made this mistake in the past too - a LONG time ago). As I have stated before, I blame D*, since they don't properly level set with the customer, and due to that, you guys end up getting screwed sometimes.

As someone who has also done in-home type service before, I empathize with the stories that you guys have shared. There is only one installer issue that I disagree with, but don't want to post it here, since this is a venting thread after all... :)

[Canis Lupus]

Well I just finished reading a lot of posts in this thread.

To all you installers: Thanks for putting up with so much crap. You get it from both ends and still find a way to make it work.

That's why like many others here I've always prepared my home for a tech's arrival (put up dog, clean up dog poop, clean and prepare locations, provide any extra tools/equipment needed, etc.) and always offer to help.

Although I've done most of the work myself (installed new dish, SWMLine, PI, ethernet etc.), on those occasions when an installer has shown up, I've always been friendly and gotten them on there way as fast as possible.

[amorse2183]

I am not an installer, but I do have a passion for my computers and home theater gear. I may have a little knowledge when it comes to satellite installation, but I am also smart enough to know a little knowledge can be a dangerous thing sometimes, so I gladly leave all that work to the techs. I treated the techs with the respect with which I would want to be treated, and stayed out of the way while they did their job. I really do feel for you in the situations described in this thread. but, to again defend the customer here, all that is your job. I realize that the work is not easy, and it will take time. the only problem i have with installers is the actual time they say they will be there. when they are not there, be it because of a lengthy install or travel distance from other places on their route that day, there are absolutely no repercussions. i waited home all day, and you just say sorry and that is the end of it. do you know what happens to people in other jobs when they don't have things done on time? or don't show up at work on time? they get fired. i agree with you on every point made about the actual physical installation of the dish and wires and equipment, as well as the customer providing a clean and safe work environment to you. i just can't wrap my mind around the fact that install techs can pretty much come and go as they please, at any time they please, and can get out of any problems by merely stating their last job took time. that really is just very very unfair to the customer. i mean no disrespect. good adn honest techs are hard to find, and necessary for us all to avoid the horrible abomination of basic cable. but if people are upset that you were hours late, i honestly don't think it's right for you to complain about something that is totally under your control.

[Milkman]

i honestly don't think it's right for you to complain about something that is totally under your control.

I think your very last line that you posted (quoted above), is the exact problem with your post.

What makes you believe that the technician's schedule is totally under their control?

[Mertzen]

i just can't wrap my mind around the fact that install techs can pretty much come and go as they please, at any time they please, and can get out of any problems by merely stating their last job took time.

What about on time guarantee back charge, on site back charge, ...
Trust me it aint that easy for a HSP tech be it in house or sub.

With the current system most of the routing is done by a computer. Ir has certain time slots for every type of job. 45 mins for a service call, 60 for upgrade, etc. Now all of those frames are from the point that the install is done up to spec. Now for service calls and upgrades you come across countless jobs where the previous guy winged it and bam you're out of your timeframe.
When computers take over, everybody looses.

I am at the cust house when promised and we even use that as a selling point, but we're a dealer so we have that flexibility.

[amorse2183]

I think your very last line that you posted (quoted above), is the exact problem with your post.

What makes you believe that the technician's schedule is totally under their control?

the tech has the ability to call and let me know that he will be late. that is what i meant. if the tech could call and tell me that, then i don't mind the wait. but how could the tech taking 30 seconds to make a call be under the control of anyone else but them?

[Mertzen]

the tech has the ability to call and let me know that he will be late. that is what i meant. if the tech could call and tell me that, then i don't mind the wait. but how could the tech taking 30 seconds to make a call be under the control of anyone else but them?


not this discussion again:nono2:
The times i chirped the office to call customer with ETA were countless, but many many times I asked the cust ' did the office call' just go get a blank stare back.

[amorse2183]

not this discussion again:nono2:
The times i chirped the office to call customer with ETA were countless, but many many times I asked the cust ' did the office call' just go get a blank stare back.

are you honestly telling me that you can't call yourself, perhaps when you are getting something off your truck? while you are waiting for the software to download?

[RobertE]

the tech has the ability to call and let me know that he will be late. that is what i meant. if the tech could call and tell me that, then i don't mind the wait. but how could the tech taking 30 seconds to make a call be under the control of anyone else but them?

In a perfect world, tech A calls the office letting them know that he is screwed on his current job and stands a snowballs chance of making it to you today, let alone on time. The office staff, having access to where all the other techs are and how they are progressing in their jobs have several options. 1) Move the job from tech A to tech B who can get to you in your timeframe, 2) If no other tech is available then options should be presented to the customer A) wait for a tech to showup sometime today or B) reschedule.

Tech A has no ability to reschedule you if needed, nor does he have the ability to call the other hundred or so guys out of his warehouse to see if someonce can pick up the job.

[Mertzen]

are you honestly telling me that you can't call yourself, perhaps when you are getting something off your truck? while you are waiting for the software to download?
Again we've gone over this before but.

Why would I use my personal phone with my minutes?
How many WO's have incorrect numbers on them.
How many people have unknown number block.
How many #s on older accounts have long been disconnected
How many people don't pick up the phone.
Not to mention how many people have called me months after an install to tell them their new LCD doesn't work.
Etc
Etc
Etc

I'm a tech, not a secretary. If I need to call in ETAs I would, the admins are there for that.

[Canis Lupus]

Plus it's important to remember techs get paid by the job in many cases - not by the hour.

So it flies in the face of common sense that a tech who's running behind the clock is benefiting in any way, shape or form.

[amorse2183]

Again we've gone over this before but.

Why would I use my personal phone with my minutes?
How many WO's have incorrect numbers on them.
How many people have unknown number block.
How many #s on older accounts have long been disconnected
How many people don't pick up the phone.
Not to mention how many people have called me months after an install to tell them their new LCD doesn't work.
Etc
Etc
Etc

I'm a tech, not a secretary. If I need to call in ETAs I would, the admins are there for that.

I've had directv since 1998. my phone number hasn't changed since 1987. if i were waiting at home for the tech and an unknown number came up around that time, i would probably think it was the tech and answer anyway. as for your cell phone and your minutes, i do understand your point, but as a customer waiting for an installer who is 4 hours late it is really difficult to accept that as a valid reason not to get in contact.

[BattleZone]

I've had directv since 1998. my phone number hasn't changed since 1987. if i were waiting at home for the tech and an unknown number came up around that time, i would probably think it was the tech and answer anyway. as for your cell phone and your minutes, i do understand your point, but as a customer waiting for an installer who is 4 hours late it is really difficult to accept that as a valid reason not to get in contact.

In my 6+ years of experience working for DirecTV and Dish, we can only reach the customer about 50% of the time at the phone numbers provided, and that number is considerably lower for Mover's, which probably have a disconnected number at least half the time, and the other half of the time will be the phone number at the old house, where the customer isn't going to be on their install date.

Also, what typically happens is that the tech ends up playing phone tag with the customer, and you can ALWAYS be assured that his phone is going to ring at the worst possible time.

50' into the crawlspace, on your belly, scraped up, with your phone back at the entrance? At the top of a 40' ladder? Craning back to get your heavy dish on an undereave mount? Hands filthy from trenching/mixing concrete/pulling old nasty cable off the house/silicone/etc.? That's when your phone will ring.

So, either you answer it (often risking injury/death), or you let it go and try to call back when you can. Then the customer won't be home, OR if they are home, will want to have a 45-minute conversation with you, including asking a ton of questions that you can't answer until you've seen their house. Meanwhile, the customer you're at is late picking up her kids or whatever, and is upset that you're "rude and wasting time" talking on the phone when you should be working on HER house.

No, there are GOOD reasons why most offices have, to a large extent, moved the job of contacting the customer off of the tech and onto their office staff.

[Tallgntlmn]

Not really a tech vent, more of a consumer vent. Might not even be a legit vent.

I caught a tech yesterday. I asked him if he could peak my dish when he was done with his install. He was like "sure, just catch me in an hour." Three hours later, he was done. He got in the truck and left while I was on my way to catch him. Not his fault, he was probably upset he'd be in 5:00 Atlanta traffic. Probably more my fault for not telling him I'd give him $20 just to peak the dish at the LNB.

Hopefully when the people two doors down get their dish installed, I'll be able to catch that guy. I'll let him know upfront I'll give him cash if I can catch him. If I can't catch him, I'll probably end up having to get the protection plan which I don't really want, just to get this thing looked at.

I have way lower signals on tuner 2 vs tuner 1 and get rain fade with a sprinkle on tuner 2. It takes much heavier rain to get tuner 1 to go down. HR22-100 BTW.

Speaking of phone numbers... When I had my upgrade done, I told D* to use my cell, not the one on my account. What did they do? Put the other number on the work order. Luckily I had the phone forwarded to my cell.

[amorse2183]

In my 6+ years of experience working for DirecTV and Dish, we can only reach the customer about 50% of the time at the phone numbers provided, and that number is considerably lower for Mover's, which probably have a disconnected number at least half the time, and the other half of the time will be the phone number at the old house, where the customer isn't going to be on their install date.

Also, what typically happens is that the tech ends up playing phone tag with the customer, and you can ALWAYS be assured that his phone is going to ring at the worst possible time.

50' into the crawlspace, on your belly, scraped up, with your phone back at the entrance? At the top of a 40' ladder? Craning back to get your heavy dish on an undereave mount? Hands filthy from trenching/mixing concrete/pulling old nasty cable off the house/silicone/etc.? That's when your phone will ring.

So, either you answer it (often risking injury/death), or you let it go and try to call back when you can. Then the customer won't be home, OR if they are home, will want to have a 45-minute conversation with you, including asking a ton of questions that you can't answer until you've seen their house. Meanwhile, the customer you're at is late picking up her kids or whatever, and is upset that you're "rude and wasting time" talking on the phone when you should be working on HER house.

No, there are GOOD reasons why most offices have, to a large extent, moved the job of contacting the customer off of the tech and onto their office staff.


if that is the case, then the office staff must really be incompetent because they can't even make a phone call to another customer. now there may be customers who will lie to you and say nobody called. my guess in that case would be somebody trying to get something (programming/equipment upgrade, etc.) for nothing. I am not one of those people. in fact, I've always been very happy with my installers and the work they do. i have no reason to get something for nothing, nor would i attempt to do so. but in the end it all comes down to the fact that whatever it is that the tech is doing at another location that causes him to be late to my location is NOT my problem. they were supposed to be there, and they were not. that is all there is to it. if the office or the tech or anyone could have the simple courtesy to even attempt to call and say that a previous install was taking longer and he would try his best to be there today, i would be more than satisfied with that answer and gladly wait or reschedule (time permitting). but the fact is that doesn't always happen. now if somebody upgraded something and changed phone numbers from the time they originally ordered service, i can understand the tech's frustration about not getting in touch with them. but just because some people may have changed their phone numbers that is an excuse to not call anyone at all? that is my only problem with the entire satellite tv installation.

[awblackmon]

WOW What a week! Now we have to pay direct tv,25 to 30% of all are custom work. Are we working for the mob?

Uh, I wouldn't want to pay them a dime, considering the ease with which they do charge backs, and now this. Our shop though, does not allow us to charge any custom work. We have to just get the job done, whatever it takes. I don't mind that, but charging a percentage of what work you do, is over the top I think. Alan

[wallfishman]

Uh, I wouldn't want to pay them a dime, considering the ease with which they do charge backs, and now this. Our shop though, does not allow us to charge any custom work. We have to just get the job done, whatever it takes. I don't mind that, but charging a percentage of what work you do, is over the top I think. Alan so your shop makes you do custom work for free ?

[wallfishman]

WOW What a week! Now we have to pay direct tv,25 to 30% of all are custom work. Are we working for the mob?

are you kidding me ?? you make GOOD MONEY working for the mob !!!! we work for the guy that works for the guy that the mob already took half from.

[satguy22]

We were told that this new system is nation wide. Gave us a price to charge and a price we will recieve back after a week or two. None of you subs get this letter? A wall fish is 49. and we must have check made out to Direct TV and get 42. back in two to four weeks if lucky. Not kidding!

[Mertzen]

That is a load of crap. I wonder if they can do this legally. Someone should be talking to a lawyer about this. I doubt they can pull that for subs.

[RobertE]

That is a load of crap. I wonder if they can do this legally. Someone should be talking to a lawyer about this. I doubt they can pull that for subs.

I've been wondering the same thing.

If the custom work is just pure labor, say wallfishing or trenching the cable, how or why should the HSP or DirecTv be entitled to any of that? Thats my labor. The cable would still have to get from the dish to the house, or from the groundblock/switch to the tv without being trenched or fished. So that rules out "materials".

Now to a slightly lessor degree I can see if additional items where consumed, like the pole in a pole mount, etc. as that actually costs someone else money.

They can't say it's for taxes, as I get taxed on my cut anyway.

And yet, people wonder why techs ask for cash or check made out to them. :confused:

[netraa]

I've been wondering the same thing.

If the custom work is just pure labor, say wallfishing or trenching the cable, how or why should the HSP or DirecTv be entitled to any of that? Thats my labor. The cable would still have to get from the dish to the house, or from the groundblock/switch to the tv without being trenched or fished. So that rules out "materials".

Now to a slightly lessor degree I can see if additional items where consumed, like the pole in a pole mount, etc. as that actually costs someone else money.

They can't say it's for taxes, as I get taxed on my cut anyway.

And yet, people wonder why techs ask for cash or check made out to them. :confused:


NOT to defend the HSP's or anything here, but if you wrench your back while digging that trench, or drive a nail through your skull in the attic doing that wall fish, it's their workers comp insurance that's going to put you back together again.

[satguy22]

We pay our own insurance. We are subs. Our own supplies. our own cell phone, truck, ect.

[awblackmon]

This afternoon we had an interesting discussion in our shop. I comes out from the owner that Directv is HIS customer, he is customer to us Techs. I had to wrap my head around that, and he explained how it works. He went to directv wanting to become a sub shop or he is wanting them to do business with him. Then we go to him wanting to become installers for him. I think it falls apart there for me because what am I to the house we are installing and what are they to me. If I follow the above thought process, I am the customer to the house I am installing. It just doesn't work for me to think of it that way.

So if all that is true, when does a customer come in and want 20 percent of our labor we are performing on their behalf. I know it could be discussed to no ends, but I think that the idea of demanding a percentage of our labor is wrong. That being said, we can do no custom work in our market. We have to do what it takes to get the job in. So guys here say they would be pleased to give part of the custom pay up if they could charge it to begin with.

[amorse2183]

This afternoon we had an interesting discussion in our shop. I comes out from the owner that Directv is HIS customer, he is customer to us Techs. I had to wrap my head around that, and he explained how it works. He went to directv wanting to become a sub shop or he is wanting them to do business with him. Then we go to him wanting to become installers for him. I think it falls apart there for me because what am I to the house we are installing and what are they to me. If I follow the above thought process, I am the customer to the house I am installing. It just doesn't work for me to think of it that way.

So if all that is true, when does a customer come in and want 20 percent of our labor we are performing on their behalf. I know it could be discussed to no ends, but I think that the idea of demanding a percentage of our labor is wrong. That being said, we can do no custom work in our market. We have to do what it takes to get the job in. So guys here say they would be pleased to give part of the custom pay up if they could charge it to begin with.

Rockefeller did the same thing with Standard Oil and forced "rebates" when dealing with the railroads in the 19th century. Eventually, his companies grew into a monopoly. They were the only game in town when it came to oil. It's a shame if directv wants a cut of your labor. you shouldn't have to do that. but, there is no monopoly here, because in theory you can still work for comcast or dish network or whatever. it still sucks for you, but sadly there isn't much you can do.

[TigersFanJJ]

NOT to defend the HSP's or anything here, but if you wrench your back while digging that trench, or drive a nail through your skull in the attic doing that wall fish, it's their workers comp insurance that's going to put you back together again.

I understand what you are saying. However, the examples you provided are are every day duties that happen on the standard (non-custom) install. Also, many techs are required to carry their own workers comp and liability insurance. So that shouldn't be justification for an HSP to take a cut from you for work that they aren't paying you to do in the first place (n/a for hourly employees, of course).

[awblackmon]

I would say that at least 80 percent of my recent installs, both new and former installations are for people that are moving. So if you are moving here is what I am finding. IF you have a tv in each room you are getting service, AND before any boxes or furniture is brought in, the install goes very fast. IF you bring boxes in and leave them in rooms the install goes slower. IF you bring furniture in, like a bed and don't set it up, things go slower. Or if you get all moved in, set up beds and other furniture and clear out the boxes, things speed up again for the install. Also PLEASE bring all the television sets over before I get there whatever part of the move in I am installing. Thanks so much for listening.

[avmaster]

I've been wondering the same thing.

If the custom work is just pure labor, say wallfishing or trenching the cable, how or why should the HSP or DirecTv be entitled to any of that? Thats my labor. The cable would still have to get from the dish to the house, or from the groundblock/switch to the tv without being trenched or fished. So that rules out "materials".

Now to a slightly lessor degree I can see if additional items where consumed, like the pole in a pole mount, etc. as that actually costs someone else money.

They can't say it's for taxes, as I get taxed on my cut anyway.

And yet, people wonder why techs ask for cash or check made out to them. :confused:

AEROSAT were complete a-holes about this kind of stuff. The checks had to be made out to them, and they took $20 for a $60 wall fish. You take cash on a job and they find out, they fire.

Their claim was that you get paid even if the check bounces etc. In 3 years I have had 2 checks bounce from a customer. They can't justify taking 30% or more from that, they are profiting from it.


Basically a thinly veiled attempt to deepen their pockets even more.

Make no mistake about HSP's. They are 90% crooks, they are in the business of making money, bottom line, and they sure are not afraid to dig in the techs pocket to get it.

The last sub i worked for from what I have heard is now 100% worse than they were. They cut pay, bouncing checks to employees, lying about chargebacks, etc.

They are about to get sued out of business, im suprized that it hasn't happened already.

But the whole time, the HSP just looks the other way, and lets them continue to do business this way, because they are putting money in their pockets. No business ethics whatsoever.

What They really need to do is cut out all of the bull****, drop all the chargebacks, etc, and state what they REALLY want to pay techs. That way a tech can make a truely informed descision on whether they want to work for the company or not. Obviously, they want to pay out less. Instead of it being a 'suprize sorry you got screwed'.

I asked some middle management people about chargebacks, and they flat out told me its just to gain more money for the company, bottom line. They don't like the cost of service calls etc. Well, service calls cost them $20 - $25 ea. if they chargeback a tech for one, its $43-$50. So obviously they profit there too.

Basically, in a nutshell, the whole system is corrupt from the bottom all the way to the top.

All I gotta say is Karmas a bitch!!


You could not pay me enough to work as a D* tech again. 3 years was enough for me. I work for dish and deal with 1/100th of the drama that I did for that whiney other company.

[RobertE]

Jobs are now comming through for new customers with the 2009 NFLST promo, that are not activation approved. :(

So what does this mean?

The $1600 handheld computer is useless to activate.
Must call in to activate, at which time the IVR will take one of the receivers, if your lucky, before bouncing you to a CSR.

So, more time wasted. :mad::mad::mad:

[joe diamond]

Jobs are now comming through for new customers with the 2009 NFLST promo, that are not activation approved. :(

So what does this mean?

The $1600 handheld computer is useless to activate.
Must call in to activate, at which time the IVR will take one of the receivers, if your lucky, before bouncing you to a CSR.

So, more time wasted. :mad::mad::mad:

I read where tech were being charged to use those handheld gadgets. So you still sit on hold? That would ice the cake............complete an installation.....sit on hold and the CSR moves you to accounting because the customer cannot be activated until a past balance from another life is cleared.

Joe

[RobertE]

I read where tech were being charged to use those handheld gadgets. So you still sit on hold? That would ice the cake............complete an installation.....sit on hold and the CSR moves you to accounting because the customer cannot be activated until a past balance from another life is cleared.

Joe

I'm not getting charged (have a contract :) )

I think someone messed up in the backend systems for new account creation with the new promo. At least I hope there's nothing nefarious going on. :eek2:

[avmaster]

I read where tech were being charged to use those handheld gadgets. So you still sit on hold? That would ice the cake............complete an installation.....sit on hold and the CSR moves you to accounting because the customer cannot be activated until a past balance from another life is cleared.

Joe


LOL, that would suck. Yet another reason im glad im a Dish tech now. As crooked and shady as direct tv on the installation side has been these days, i hope they go under or literally get sued so bad that they actually pay for thier pitiful actions.

My roomate is having to go so far as to put liens on customers houses that he worked on and was never paid to get someone to step up and do something about the $1500+ he is owed.

[Shades228]

We pay our own insurance. We are subs. Our own supplies. our own cell phone, truck, ect.


Is this true still for the O&O?

[joe diamond]

Is this true still for the O&O?

NO,

That new company was bought by DTV and will have employees doing the work. Unless otherwise arranged, employees arrive and the employer provides insurance, tools and work standards. Employees are usually paid wages per hour. The hourly rate will be what you accept or reject. You can be fired for screw ups but not back charged, for example.

Should be different.

Joe

[carl6]

the employer provides insurance, tools and work standards.

Typically tools are not provided - in most industries, in most cases.

[joe diamond]

Typically tools are not provided - in most industries, in most cases.

Picks and shovels yes, back hoe & dump truck yes, tool belt and crimpers...probably not. Some companies insist on a specific tool...telcos for example...and provide it. The best answer to this I ever hear of was issuing and having the employee sign for all hand tools. There was an annual bonus paid after tool inventory around the time of the Christmas party. Part of the bonus was a $200.00 tool allowance...missing stuff came out of that. Folks who lost more than $200.00 per year were usually not around for another party.

Skilled workers are expected to arrive with their personal tools and are (should be) paid for their skills and their tool use.

That brother Shades had to ask about this makes the point about how clear the line between contractors and employees should be. If you are a contractor you should know it.

Joe

[JB292]

Spent two hours on the phone with Direct today, trying to get the correct locals. Movers connection, from another state. It was escalated. Never did get it working. Told customer to call Direct back tomorrow. Grrrrr.

[joe diamond]

Spent two hours on the phone with Direct today, trying to get the correct locals. Movers connection, from another state. It was escalated. Never did get it working. Told customer to call Direct back tomorrow. Grrrrr.
The official HSP response..that DTV has not repudiated is:

Tough ****! You have had a cx call DTV within 90 days so that will cost you $100.00.

Joe

the word after tough is not the word I selected.

[satguy22]

DTV is so stupid. They are changing the solfware on the reciever that makes your job take longer. Blaming it on bad installers! Hey How about firing this guys. O no they are making money on these guys. Installer does bad install gets paid 75. and DTV takes 50. away.

[amorse2183]

to the techs here-
how is it decided who gets what job for installation? people call directv to order new service/upgrade, etc. i would guess that directv sends the lists of all the people to the installers or contractors or whatever and then each business gives each job to one of their techs? I'm sure that directv gives you techs too many installs per day, and with the nfl season starting again i wouldn't bet that the business will drop anytime soon. again, i wait here all day for a tech to come and put another hd-dvr. now its 8 hours past their time window. now i still have no contact or information from anyone at all. it still boggles the mind why a tech can't call me. to be honest i do feel for you if you have unrealistic expectations placed on your time be directv, and other customers like myself. but at the same time, this is your job. get there on time and get it done. if you cant, call me and schedule later. i feel for you, but in the end the only thing i care about is that my dvr isn't here yet and installed. if you cant handle the work, quit. that's the way of the world. if i have 6 appointments or clients a day (which is quite often) i go. i do my job on time. they pay me for this. we all leave. if i am late or cant go, i call. pick up the freaking phone. why cant techs do this? this is so frustrating. if comcast didn't suck so much here i would go back to it. I've had problems with cable modems and called them at 3 in the morning and still been able to get a tech to come to the house that morning before noon. i just wish their tv was better. ugh. frustrating.

[joe diamond]

to the techs here-
how is it decided who gets what job for installation? people call directv to order new service/upgrade, etc. i would guess that directv sends the lists of all the people to the installers or contractors or whatever and then each business gives each job to one of their techs? I'm sure that directv gives you techs too many installs per day, and with the nfl season starting again i wouldn't bet that the business will drop anytime soon. again, i wait here all day for a tech to come and put another hd-dvr. now its 8 hours past their time window. now i still have no contact or information from anyone at all. it still boggles the mind why a tech can't call me. to be honest i do feel for you if you have unrealistic expectations placed on your time be directv, and other customers like myself. but at the same time, this is your job. get there on time and get it done. if you cant, call me and schedule later. i feel for you, but in the end the only thing i care about is that my dvr isn't here yet and installed. if you cant handle the work, quit. that's the way of the world. if i have 6 appointments or clients a day (which is quite often) i go. i do my job on time. they pay me for this. we all leave. if i am late or cant go, i call. pick up the freaking phone. why cant techs do this? this is so frustrating. if comcast didn't suck so much here i would go back to it. I've had problems with cable modems and called them at 3 in the morning and still been able to get a tech to come to the house that morning before noon. i just wish their tv was better. ugh. frustrating.

Amorse,

How about five tech waiting by a fax machine until 11:00AM for AM work that should have been distributed the night before. The HSP picked over the jobs and then sent what was left out to subs the next day. This office was over an hour drive fromthe closest customer. That one took me over an hour after 11:00 AM to reach all seven of the AM customers.

I quit when I got back charged for not calling or arriving within the scheduled time period. MASTEC is still a DTV Home Service Provider but I am not an installer for them (ever).

I could continue.
But just call back...you could have an excellent experience the next time...or not. They don't know.

Joe

Afterthought: For years fulfillment contractors sent me batches of jobs with the proviso that I schedule them and get them done before more work would be sent. I never missed an appointment, the work was nearby and if there was a problem I could be there the same day (rare). Those companies are no longer associated with DirecTV.......Inhouse is better.

Joe again

[BattleZone]

if you cant handle the work, quit. that's the way of the world.

The problem is that if the people who couldn't "handle the work" quit, there would be no one to put in any DirecTV systems...

[amorse2183]

The problem is that if the people who couldn't "handle the work" quit, there would be no one to put in any DirecTV systems...

and by that rationale its ok for the techs to do substandard work or not show up at all?

[joe diamond]

The problem is that if the people who couldn't "handle the work" quit, there would be no one to put in any DirecTV systems...

Actually,

The people who can handle the work are quitting.

"Yes sir, I understand you have been on hold for a long time but our rule is that you can only close two jobs...then you must call back and wait on hold like everybody else. And I must tell you that since you said you did not replace the multiswitch on the work order we cannot close that job until we produce another work order and that will be in the next business day, your time.

" This call center is now closed! Do not leave job information on any recorder lines you may discover."

" I can't control the reason for charge backs...we pay you when we get paid."

"I don't care if you do have a court judgment against that guy. He is a subcontractor and I don't have time to answer your questions (click).

Almost forgot my personal favs..........you have to take the good with the bad..........I am not going to lie to you ...........one hand washes the other, work with me on this one.

I could go on.

Joe

[amorse2183]

Actually,

The people who can handle the work are quitting.

"Yes sir, I understand you have been on hold for a long time but our rule is that you can only close two jobs...then you must call back and wait on hold like everybody else. And I must tell you that since you said you did not replace the multiswitch on the work order we cannot close that job until we produce another work order and that will be in the next business day, your time.

" This call center is now closed! Do not leave job information on any recorder lines you may discover."

" I can't control the reason for charge backs...we pay you when we get paid."

"I don't care if you do have a court judgment against that guy. He is a subcontractor and I don't have time to answer your questions (click).

Almost forgot my personal favs..........you have to take the good with the bad..........I am not going to lie to you ...........one hand washes the other, work with me on this one.

I could go on.

Joe

but again, i ask, how is any of that my problem as the customer?

[joe diamond]

and by that rationale its ok for the techs to do substandard work or not show up at all?

You are missing it.

If you do not know what good work looks like you can't even know what substandard is. If you can't read a map....or if you are never sent a work order...it is hard to show up on time.

"Not home; looks like they moved, house is empty."
"Oh yeah.......they sent you to the old address..those people moved."

"I am at the address on the work order and nobody by that name lives here."
"The customer is on the other line. He is at a pay phone two blocks away at a market...do you know where that is? He wants to take you to his sister's home. He does not speak English but his sister does."

Keep going, you are getting a feel for this stuff.

Joe

[joe diamond]

but again, i ask, how is any of that my problem as the customer?

My impression, as an installer is.........take it or leave it. "We can replace you tomorrow." And they did.

Now as a customer.......any business with that attitude will be history. DTV got into what it is now doing by beating the pants of cable companies who would not or could not maintain their systems. DTV bought Primestar.....cut back the customer service...made more money.

Knowing the details is not the same as knowing the answer.
Beats me!

Joe

[amorse2183]

You are missing it.

If you do not know what good work looks like you can't even know what substandard is. If you can't read a map....or if you are never sent a work order...it is hard to show up on time.

"Not home; looks like they moved, house is empty."
"Oh yeah.......they sent you to the old address..those people moved."

"I am at the address on the work order and nobody by that name lives here."
"The customer is on the other line. He is at a pay phone two blocks away at a market...do you know where that is? He wants to take you to his sister's home. He does not speak English but his sister does."

Keep going, you are getting a feel for this stuff.

Joe

but again what does any of that have to do with me? i've been here all day. working phone number. hasn't changed since i moved here in 1987. we still have the original directv receiver in the front room since 1998. i want the common courtesy of being told they wont be here on time or at all. in fact i deserve nothing less. techs run into nightmare customers all the time but that doesnt give you an excuse to be rude, not show, not call, or do anything at all. none of it happens because of me. if they can't do your jobs then again, i suggest you find other employment. i'm flabbergasted. if i showed up late in court and told my client or the judge another case was taking a long time and so i didn't contact them do you know what would happen? i would get laughed out of the room and probably fired by my clients. there is absolutely no excuse for being late. none. anything that happened before doesn't have anything to do with me so i think its up to the techs to own up to the responsibility of their jobs, and make a freaking phone call.

[JB292]

There is no excuse for you not being contacted. But it may, or may not be, the installer's fault. Just because you have a particular day scheduled, does not necessarily mean it was routed to an installer.

The private HSP's are slowly being taken over by DirecTV, and in those areas, service IS improving.

In my area, DirecTV has employees doing installs. We have dispatch people, whose primary job is to track and route installers, and relay potential delays to customers.

[joe diamond]

but again what does any of that have to do with me? i've been here all day. working phone number. hasn't changed since i moved here in 1987. we still have the original directv receiver in the front room since 1998. i want the common courtesy of being told they wont be here on time or at all. in fact i deserve nothing less. techs run into nightmare customers all the time but that doesnt give you an excuse to be rude, not show, not call, or do anything at all. none of it happens because of me. if they can't do your jobs then again, i suggest you find other employment. i'm flabbergasted. if i showed up late in court and told my client or the judge another case was taking a long time and so i didn't contact them do you know what would happen? i would get laughed out of the room and probably fired by my clients. there is absolutely no excuse for being late. none. anything that happened before doesn't have anything to do with me so i think its up to the techs to own up to the responsibility of their jobs, and make a freaking phone call.

Nothing you said is wrong!

Especially the part about making the freaking phone call.

And myself and many others do have other lines of employment. I fix installations. People call me. I arrive within a few minutes of when I said I would be there or I am on the phone as soon as I discover I could be late.

I charge $60.00 an hour and cover three counties. I don't advertise because customers who liked what I did refer me to their friends.

DTV installations are, as you are discovering, another world. Techs get a pile of work orders every day and no help sorting them. There are cool ads showing DTV techs carrying customers into their new houses with receivers on a silver platters. That should count for something

Joe

[joe diamond]

There is no excuse for you not being contacted. But it may, or may not be, the installer's fault. Just because you have a particular day scheduled, does not necessarily mean it was routed to an installer.

The private HSP's are slowly being taken over by DirecTV, and in those areas, service IS improving.

In my area, DirecTV has employees doing installs. We have dispatch people, whose primary job is to track and route installers, and relay potential delays to customers.

JB

That is what the HSPs were doing............Hsps are being replaced by HSPs with less experience.

Keep in touch and report how it works. I am watching the changing of the guard here in MD. The term same whore with different lipstick comes to mind.

There is room for improvement...I like your shirt!

Joe

[BattleZone]

and by that rationale its ok for the techs to do substandard work or not show up at all?

Okay for the customer? Of course not. Okay for the tech? Absolutely.

A good tech can realistically handle no more than 3 "average" installs per day, yet during a busy day may get routed 6 or more. He will not only have to put in as many of those jobs as he can, but he will be *constantly* interrupted by his dispatcher asking for ETAs to all his other jobs. It's awfully hard to work at the top of a ladder with one hand on a dish and the other with a tool and still field phone calls. It's also very dangerous. Luckily, most installers have no health insurance...

What's supposed to be happening is that the dispatchers, who are safely in an office, in front of a computer and a phone, are supposed to be calling customers with ETAs. But often they don't, because usually there are too few of them for the volume of jobs and techs they have to manage. Blame, as it always does, falls on the tech.

Further, a minimum of 1/3 of all customers list a phone number that is either out of service or is a home phone that no one answers anymore. It's hard to call customers with ETAs when their numbers don't work. On Mover's Connections, the percentage of bad numbers is more like 60%.

Anyway, your argument is really with DirecTV and the HSP program. HSPs don't pay enough (over the last 6 years, pay has been lowered several times*, while the expenses demanded by the job have risen significantly), which means that the better installers find better work and leave. HSPs are always short-staffed, and on average, their installers have less than 6 months experience because of high turn-over.

Better pay would allow DirecTV to attract more qualified installers and keep the installers they do get for a longer period of time. That would allow them to be fully staffed, which would mean that techs could get realistic routes, and thus probably get to customers within the scheduled window. But it would also mean that an HSP owner would have to go without another summer home, or would have to fly commercial, and we can't have that.

DirecTV has been buying out their HSPs, but even though they are removing the middle man, who takes considerably more than half of the install pay, there have been no pay raises for installers, so very little has changed.





* In 2003, the average HSP tech was making $90/30. That means $90 to install the dish and first receiver, and $30 for each additional receiver. At that time, virtually all customers got the 18" single-LNB dish, which was tiny and could be mounted practically anywhere, and only needed 2 coax lines to feed any multiswitch. Few people had DVRs, so rarely were 2nd lines necessary, and even if they were, 2nd lines were paid for.

Today, the average HSP contractor makes $60/15 (or up to $70/20 in expensive markets), and has much more complicated systems to deal with. DVRs are on almost every account, and relatively few accounts are approved for SWMs, so installers constantly have to run 2nd lines, or whole new runs with dual cable. They must install the larger, heavier, much more complicated Slimline dish and run 4 lines to a multiswitch, and expensive solid copper cable is now required. As a result, the average supplies expense per account has quadrupled or more. Plus, chargebacks are far more common today (and there's a lot more to mess up), and techs get charged back for failing to hook up phone lines, meaning they often must install new phone outlets for free (phone companies who do the same thing charge $135 and up) to prevent chargebacks.

It's really a wonder that any systems get installed at all...

[joe diamond]

Okay for the customer? Of course not. Okay for the tech? Absolutely.

A good tech can realistically handle no more than 3 "average" installs per day, yet during a busy day may get routed 6 or more. He will not only have to put in as many of those jobs as he can, but he will be *constantly* interrupted by his dispatcher asking for ETAs to all his other jobs. It's awfully hard to work at the top of a ladder with one hand on a dish and the other with a tool and still field phone calls. It's also very dangerous. Luckily, most installers have no health insurance...

What's supposed to be happening is that the dispatchers, who are safely in an office, in front of a computer and a phone, are supposed to be calling customers with ETAs. But often they don't, because usually there are too few of them for the volume of jobs and techs they have to manage. Blame, as it always does, falls on the tech.

Further, a minimum of 1/3 of all customers list a phone number that is either out of service or is a home phone that no one answers anymore. It's hard to call customers with ETAs when their numbers don't work. On Mover's Connections, the percentage of bad numbers is more like 60%.

Anyway, your argument is really with DirecTV and the HSP program. HSPs don't pay enough (over the last 6 years, pay has been lowered several times*, while the expenses demanded by the job have risen significantly), which means that the better installers find better work and leave. HSPs are always short-staffed, and on average, their installers have less than 6 months experience because of high turn-over.

Better pay would allow DirecTV to attract more qualified installers and keep the installers they do get for a longer period of time. That would allow them to be fully staffed, which would mean that techs could get realistic routes, and thus probably get to customers within the scheduled window. But it would also mean that an HSP owner would have to go without another summer home, or would have to fly commercial, and we can't have that.

DirecTV has been buying out their HSPs, but even though they are removing the middle man, who takes considerably more than half of the install pay, there have been no pay raises for installers, so very little has changed.





* In 2003, the average HSP tech was making $90/30. That means $90 to install the dish and first receiver, and $30 for each additional receiver. At that time, virtually all customers got the 18" single-LNB dish, which was tiny and could be mounted practically anywhere, and only needed 2 coax lines to feed any multiswitch. Few people had DVRs, so rarely were 2nd lines necessary, and even if they were, 2nd lines were paid for.

Today, the average HSP contractor makes $60/15 (or up to $70/20 in expensive markets), and has much more complicated systems to deal with. DVRs are on almost every account, and relatively few accounts are approved for SWMs, so installers constantly have to run 2nd lines, or whole new runs with dual cable. They must install the larger, heavier, much more complicated Slimline dish and run 4 lines to a multiswitch, and expensive solid copper cable is now required. As a result, the average supplies expense per account has quadrupled or more. Plus, chargebacks are far more common today (and there's a lot more to mess up), and techs get charged back for failing to hook up phone lines, meaning they often must install new phone outlets for free (phone companies who do the same thing charge $135 and up) to prevent chargebacks.

It's really a wonder that any systems get installed at all...

Battlezone,

Wish I had said all that.
The only thing I could add would be that the long distance providers are onto the phone crap. I do repairs for a couple of them and they are looking at service calls where DTV equipment has caused a telco out of service.

For fun I asked a new local HSP where their bank was and how long they had been in business. Who was their resident agent? Could I speak to any installer in the office?...........(Click)

Watching those folks.

Joe

[amorse2183]

Okay for the customer? Of course not. Okay for the tech? Absolutely.

A good tech can realistically handle no more than 3 "average" installs per day, yet during a busy day may get routed 6 or more. He will not only have to put in as many of those jobs as he can, but he will be *constantly* interrupted by his dispatcher asking for ETAs to all his other jobs. It's awfully hard to work at the top of a ladder with one hand on a dish and the other with a tool and still field phone calls. It's also very dangerous. Luckily, most installers have no health insurance...

What's supposed to be happening is that the dispatchers, who are safely in an office, in front of a computer and a phone, are supposed to be calling customers with ETAs. But often they don't, because usually there are too few of them for the volume of jobs and techs they have to manage. Blame, as it always does, falls on the tech.

Further, a minimum of 1/3 of all customers list a phone number that is either out of service or is a home phone that no one answers anymore. It's hard to call customers with ETAs when their numbers don't work. On Mover's Connections, the percentage of bad numbers is more like 60%.

Anyway, your argument is really with DirecTV and the HSP program. HSPs don't pay enough (over the last 6 years, pay has been lowered several times*, while the expenses demanded by the job have risen significantly), which means that the better installers find better work and leave. HSPs are always short-staffed, and on average, their installers have less than 6 months experience because of high turn-over.

Better pay would allow DirecTV to attract more qualified installers and keep the installers they do get for a longer period of time. That would allow them to be fully staffed, which would mean that techs could get realistic routes, and thus probably get to customers within the scheduled window. But it would also mean that an HSP owner would have to go without another summer home, or would have to fly commercial, and we can't have that.

DirecTV has been buying out their HSPs, but even though they are removing the middle man, who takes considerably more than half of the install pay, there have been no pay raises for installers, so very little has changed.





* In 2003, the average HSP tech was making $90/30. That means $90 to install the dish and first receiver, and $30 for each additional receiver. At that time, virtually all customers got the 18" single-LNB dish, which was tiny and could be mounted practically anywhere, and only needed 2 coax lines to feed any multiswitch. Few people had DVRs, so rarely were 2nd lines necessary, and even if they were, 2nd lines were paid for.

Today, the average HSP contractor makes $60/15 (or up to $70/20 in expensive markets), and has much more complicated systems to deal with. DVRs are on almost every account, and relatively few accounts are approved for SWMs, so installers constantly have to run 2nd lines, or whole new runs with dual cable. They must install the larger, heavier, much more complicated Slimline dish and run 4 lines to a multiswitch, and expensive solid copper cable is now required. As a result, the average supplies expense per account has quadrupled or more. Plus, chargebacks are far more common today (and there's a lot more to mess up), and techs get charged back for failing to hook up phone lines, meaning they often must install new phone outlets for free (phone companies who do the same thing charge $135 and up) to prevent chargebacks.

It's really a wonder that any systems get installed at all...


you are right. don't get me wrong. I don't think that the tech's job is easy in the least. It is hard work, many of you do take it very seriously and do a great job, and your labor is greatly appreciated by me, so don't get me wrong. my problem is the accountability. directv says you should be able to do 6 installs a day and its your fault if you don't. you say directv is crazy and being unrealistic and you ideally could do 3 a day. but in the end, the only one who gets screwed is the customer, namely me. the total perceived lack of accountability if my problem. nothing more.

[joe diamond]

you are right. don't get me wrong. I don't think that the tech's job is easy in the least. It is hard work, many of you do take it very seriously and do a great job, and your labor is greatly appreciated by me, so don't get me wrong. my problem is the accountability. directv says you should be able to do 6 installs a day and its your fault if you don't. you say directv is crazy and being unrealistic and you ideally could do 3 a day. but in the end, the only one who gets screwed is the customer, namely me. the total perceived lack of accountability if my problem. nothing more.

Amarose,
It is not DirecTv that says 6 installations are possible. It is the HSPs (Home Service Providers). All installations are different.

I always insisted on full pay for job that required taking four receivers out of the boxes and connecting where previous receivers had been........expending 1/2 hour. Because there were always four receiver installation that took all day.

I can always do three installations but the length of the day will fluctuate. I did four one time and asked my son to log our times......seven hours of driving! My rate was two a day. This left time for returning for custom work and....the great crime...hanging out with my son.

HSPs would work their list of contractors seven days and ten hours a day if they could. Effectiveness drops........it gets dark and rains and snows....still someone figures six jobs a day is possible. Then some Quality Control wonk shows up and starts looking at work done in the dark and finding reasons to not pay for any of the work.

My fav customer quote..."I was sober this afternoon. Now I am not. So let us cut some trees down and get the TV working. Do you know how to run a chain saw? Can you find a satellite in the dark??

It is strange out there. You are approaching this with entirely too much logic and common sense. You are beginning to see the problem.

Joe

[Matt9876]

2-3 full DirecTV installs a day is enough for any tech,I feel sorry for the customer involved and tech that are forced to do more.


When a tech is pushed too hard,important things are left undone like the dish bolts don't get fully locked down,drip loops left out,ground blocks don't get properly installed,little or no customer education,etc...


I think it's more important to do the job right the first time instead of getting a angry customer,call back,back charge,etc..

Just my opinion.:)

[JB292]

JB

That is what the HSPs were doing............Hsps are being replaced by HSPs with less experience.

Keep in touch and report how it works. I am watching the changing of the guard here in MD. The term same whore with different lipstick comes to mind.

There is room for improvement...I like your shirt!

Joe

Joe, it's obvious from reading your posts, that you have not had a positive experience with your HSP contacts.

First, a little background from my perspective. Around 2000-2003, I worked as an independent contractor doing installs for a private retailer. Back in the day, we "slammed 'em in", with little, to no regards as to what the "correct" method was. Ground? You don't need no stinking ground, was the prevailing attitude.

After that, I got out of the business, and became an avionics technian, working for a defense contractor, working for the Army.

Thanks, Obama, I lost my job on Jan 21, and had to find work.

I then returned to DirecTV installs, working as an employee for DirecTV Home Services.

I can honestly tell you, that the average technician, has been employed for over 3 years, and is dedicated to doing the job correct. We have QC guys, who come behind us, and everything must pass code.

There are no chargebacks, just failed QC jobs, which we are required to fix.
Many of us are dedicated to "do the job right", the first time.

We don't charge extra for custom installs. Just yesterday, I had a pole mount, which the customer wanted buried about 70 feet, in PVC conduit. He helped, and the job took 7 hours, but I left, knowing he had a quality install, which I knew many of you would have charged him $100's to do.

I don't make a lot of money, yet, as DTV's pay scale requires that you do the time, to get to a decent level. After 2 years, I can make almost $60,000 per year, which in today's economy, isn't too bad.

I'm glad you like my shirt, I can hook you up with one, if you want. :)

[joe diamond]

Joe, it's obvious from reading your posts, that you have not had a positive experience with your HSP contacts.

First, a little background from my perspective. Around 2000-2003, I worked as an independent contractor doing installs for a private retailer. Back in the day, we "slammed 'em in", with little, to no regards as to what the "correct" method was. Ground? You don't need no stinking ground, was the prevailing attitude.

After that, I got out of the business, and became an avionics technian, working for a defense contractor, working for the Army.

Thanks, Obama, I lost my job on Jan 21, and had to find work.

I then returned to DirecTV installs, working as an employee for DirecTV Home Services.

I can honestly tell you, that the average technician, has been employed for over 3 years, and is dedicated to doing the job correct. We have QC guys, who come behind us, and everything must pass code.

There are no chargebacks, just failed QC jobs, which we are required to fix.
Many of us are dedicated to "do the job right", the first time.

We don't charge extra for custom installs. Just yesterday, I had a pole mount, which the customer wanted buried about 70 feet, in PVC conduit. He helped, and the job took 7 hours, but I left, knowing he had a quality install, which I knew many of you would have charged him $100's to do.

I don't make a lot of money, yet, as DTV's pay scale requires that you do the time, to get to a decent level. After 2 years, I can make almost $60,000 per year, which in today's economy, isn't too bad.

I'm glad you like my shirt, I can hook you up with one, if you want. :)

JB,

Glad it is working for you. As with everything in a forum like this you share info from around the system. Here on the eastern shore of MD my experience has been constant crooks. Back in 2001 I was one of the locals who fixed the slam-them-in jobs of "road crews" who hot spotted the EZ jobs and left with most of the money. Service calls were actually rebuilds.

Here the level of tech skill is low. Turn over is high. Anyone with any skill has left the trade. I just ring the bell here to provide a cost to the constant theft done in the name of Directv here.

I am glad things are different .....and better elsewhere.

Joe

[wallfishman]

Joe, it's obvious from reading your posts, that you have not had a positive experience with your HSP contacts.

First, a little background from my perspective. Around 2000-2003, I worked as an independent contractor doing installs for a private retailer. Back in the day, we "slammed 'em in", with little, to no regards as to what the "correct" method was. Ground? You don't need no stinking ground, was the prevailing attitude.

After that, I got out of the business, and became an avionics technian, working for a defense contractor, working for the Army.

Thanks, Obama, I lost my job on Jan 21, and had to find work.

I then returned to DirecTV installs, working as an employee for DirecTV Home Services.

I can honestly tell you, that the average technician, has been employed for over 3 years, and is dedicated to doing the job correct. We have QC guys, who come behind us, and everything must pass code.

There are no chargebacks, just failed QC jobs, which we are required to fix.
Many of us are dedicated to "do the job right", the first time.

We don't charge extra for custom installs. Just yesterday, I had a pole mount, which the customer wanted buried about 70 feet, in PVC conduit. He helped, and the job took 7 hours, but I left, knowing he had a quality install, which I knew many of you would have charged him $100's to do.

I don't make a lot of money, yet, as DTV's pay scale requires that you do the time, to get to a decent level. After 2 years, I can make almost $60,000 per year, which in today's economy, isn't too bad.

I'm glad you like my shirt, I can hook you up with one, if you want. :)

no extra for custom installs ??? ok so some customer wants 6 outlets all wallfished to wallplates fished down walls no wires showing anywhere. all your guys do all those jobs for free? get real you and i both know that aint happening. maybe some lead tech has to go do some job like you just did after the customer has been screwed over 3 times, but all your guys arent just showing up and doing whatever the customer says for free. and around here id say the HSP is 75 % guys under 6 months experience and 25 % over 6 months. I doubt any of them have over a year. not many can live on the money they make.

[JB292]

As an employee, it does happen. There are NO extra charges. We get paid per hour, and are expected to take as long as the job requires to do it right. On jobs that require 6 wallfishes, we call our sup, and get help. On such jobs, we may have 2-3 techs working on it.

The only negative thing I can say, is they use a pay scale that doesn't reward good work. It all depends on how long you've actually been there. A 2 yr employee makes $22 pr hr, with overtime at time and 1/2. We also get free service, (all channels, except PPV) with free OWNED equipment. I currently have 3 R15/s, 1 HR10-250, 1 HR20, 1 HR22, and 1 HR23.

Not the best job in the world, but in my neck of the woods, it beats unemployment.

[joe diamond]

As an employee, it does happen. There are NO extra charges. We get paid per hour, and are expected to take as long as the job requires to do it right. On jobs that require 6 wallfishes, we call our sup, and get help. On such jobs, we may have 2-3 techs working on it.

The only negative thing I can say, is they use a pay scale that doesn't reward good work. It all depends on how long you've actually been there. A 2 yr employee makes $22 pr hr, with overtime at time and 1/2. We also get free service, (all channels, except PPV) with free OWNED equipment. I currently have 3 R15/s, 1 HR10-250, 1 HR20, 1 HR22, and 1 HR23.

Not the best job in the world, but in my neck of the woods, it beats unemployment.

JB,

In my world you would be expected to redo any pay sheet that listed more than 40 hrs. You take six or ten installations out the door and know that there is four hours of driving built into the mess. The upgrade mentioned on the WO is code for rebuild the whole install. You will spend much time on hold attempting to close jobs through a call center in India. Equipment inventory will be wrong and IRDs you know are installed and running will appear as a back charge item on your pay sheet. Should you fail to connect phones to receivers that too will eventually cost you.

Is the name on your paycheck Directv?
We live in different worlds.

Joe

[awblackmon]

Just as satellite delivered tv challenged cable delivered tv, so cell phones are now challenging land line phones. Around my part of the woods, cell phone is the normal. Dial tone is so close to dead you may hear of a funeral soon. It is past time for Directv to see what is happening with phone service and drop the phone line connection requirements. The younger customers don't have dial tone, and less and less older customers have it with each passing month.

[joe diamond]

Just as satellite delivered tv challenged cable delivered tv, so cell phones are now challenging land line phones. Around my part of the woods, cell phone is the normal. Dial tone is so close to dead you may hear of a funeral soon. It is past time for Directv to see what is happening with phone service and drop the phone line connection requirements. The younger customers don't have dial tone, and less and less older customers have it with each passing month.

Yes,
And Directv knows this. But since it is or was possible to connect to a land line the HSPs and their subcontractors use this feature to make a deduction from installer checks for failure to "follow policy" or "complete the job." DTV has or had a capability for detecting phone connections but the systems work without the phone line.

As "triple play" may keep the cable companies in there for awhile, the DSL feature may keep land line phones going for awhile...especially if they go the last mile with fiber optic cable.

The question is how do you continue to work for an entity that will use such an obvious issue to reduce compensation?

Joe

[TigersFanJJ]

There are no chargebacks, just failed QC jobs, which we are required to fix. Many of us are dedicated to "do the job right", the first time.

In-house, hourly DHS employees don't get chargebacks for failed QC jobs. However, subcontractors for DHS get chargebacks regularly for stupid reasons. One example. I did a pole mount once on a home that was on a slab that, for some reason I don't know, extended out about 18 inches from the exterior wall. I buried the cable the 6 feet or so from the dish to the slab, then neatly routed the cable up out of the ground and across this small piece of slab, then up the wall. I was always dedicated to doing it right the first time, but that still didn't keep me from getting backcharged on the job for that 18 or so inches that I couldn't bury inside a concrete slab.

[TigersFanJJ]

Yes,
And Directv knows this. But since it is or was possible to connect to a land line the HSPs and their subcontractors use this feature to make a deduction from installer checks for failure to "follow policy" or "complete the job." DTV has or had a capability for detecting phone connections but the systems work without the phone line.

I used to bring the issue of being backcharged for the customer not having a land line up at meetings and was always told the same thing. "Just run the damn phone lines." I also used to see this same phrase posted here in threads about the phone line issue. I'd always get a blank stare when I asked the question, "Can you give me one good reason why I should spend an extra half an hour to three hours running phone lines when I am still going to be backcharged for the boxes not calling in?"

[JB292]

Yes, my paycheck is from DirecTV, El Segundo.

We get non responder stats, and get bitched at a little. But just about everyone is in the same boat, or the 20% bracket. You can't get responders, when there is no land line available.

Joe, the whole point of my posts, was to let you know that from my view, the landscape is changing. Is that a good, or bad thing? I don't know.

I would gladly work as a contractor, where doing 2-3 jobs would pay $200-$300+, instead of my hourly wage. But around here, that's not possible.

[joe diamond]

Yes, my paycheck is from DirecTV, El Segundo.

We get non responder stats, and get bitched at a little. But just about everyone is in the same boat, or the 20% bracket. You can't get responders, when there is no land line available.

Joe, the whole point of my posts, was to let you know that from my view, the landscape is changing. Is that a good, or bad thing? I don't know.

I would gladly work as a contractor, where doing 2-3 jobs would pay $200-$300+, instead of my hourly wage. But around here, that's not possible.
Around here things are pretty slow,
But doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result is a sign of insanity. The most recent HSP around here is reported to have closed their shop in NC and just left town without paying 30 techs about a month of checks. And the same guy is here in MD as an HSP. This is not different from the last three entities I dealt with. Why work for somebody you are going to have to drag into court to get paid.

Directv knows about this crap or should have. Your situation sounds better than what I see here. I can't help thinking about reformed thieves who steal no more because someone cut off a hand.

Get what you can while it is here. The first time they suggest paying for gas or sharing the pain with the latest cable price increase you will know where it is going.

Thanks for sharing,

Joe

[avmaster]

i feel sorry for anyone still doing direct tv installs, espeically as a subcontractor.

NOT ONE GUY, not a single one that i know that has 3+ years experience still works for them around here.

Basically because their rules and chargbacks and now cut pay has reached a level of rediculousness that no one wants to work for them. the ones that do are newbs and quit after a month or two. i wouldn't be suprized if the HSP here started hiring illegals(which is the direction its going)

Check this out, their latest change. You get paid less on an upgrade, its now $25.

Ontop of that you are expected to bring the ENTIRE job up to code, that means pulling off wall plates, replacing all fittings, barrells etc, even if you are swapping one box and there are 6 other outlets in the house.

So basically, on an upgrade, you are lucky if you break even by the time you figure the cost of materials. most likely you are paying out of pocket to service a direct tv customer. Not a good deal.

I can't even believe the stupid stuff i have been hearing, i think i would rather work for mcdonalds.

Screw em, they suck as a company overall.

[dracozny]

in my market we are employees and unless you are a QC, service call tech or wherhouse staff you are paid commission, since the market is a tad slow right now we are actually downsizing, although they wont officially state it in the office, they are doing a massive QC scale to weed out the worthless. quality over quantity for the most part is key to keeping your job around here. they do keep track of how often you request help to pawn off a job to someone but its not too much of an issue normally.

as far as wrong phone# or wrong address, sometimes you just have to get crafty, were not hourly around here so we try to get things done, stop by the fire dept police dept, post office whatever it takes. do the job right and thats always the clencher, kaku jobs always take me longer, especially when I am practically reinstalling the whole system on an upgrade. I even swapped out an entire system to get a swm3 install done instead of a kaku/3. but thats a matter of calling the sup and he calls the manager, from there i can change the whole system via my handheld. downside I dont get paid to install the replacement recievers I add because its done as a csr swap/replace. at most i might see 8 bucks for em.

lucky for me one of the sups is a cool dude and gives me an hour of OEP(Other Essential Pay) which = aprox $18 per box i swapped on that.

you need a swm on a job add it in on your handheld, and delete the old one, you can add in 6x8s too if you need those instead to square your inventory, make sure you leave all fields blank except for product and tech action which will be no tech action until after the line item is created. then go back into it and change to support hardware. do this on case by case basis, and not just on a whim eventually some exec will say wtf, although latest blastfact indicates we are moving to full swm installs on all HD jobs so it may not be much of an issue soon.

I do have one huge gripe out of all of this and that is as an ironwood tech we got paid a hell of alot more for commercial installs and upgrades. as an employee they have slaughtered the pay rate on this, service calls for non service call techs are $34 across the board, sucks for a POV tech like myself, luckily I am off the service call list now.

as far as the complaints about over routing, for the most part its not too bad unless we get a bunch of techs calling in sick. siebel trying to do the routing sucks balls, i'm sure it works fine for you big city techs but out here in the rural areas it will send you to 3 jobs across the state.

my biggest complaint is lying ass third party salesman as they cost me more money than anything else! directv needs to stop outsourcing the sales dept!!!!!!!!!!!!
I do think things overall have improved, but I know there is much more room for improvement

[dracozny]

i

Check this out, their latest change. You get paid less on an upgrade, its now $25.
.

inhouse POV techs get paid $10.50 on the base work order plus equipment $20 per single line box, or 24.50 for dvrs, swap rate is 8 dollars which negates the previous unless a relocate is added, it is less than ironwood paid me but it averages out in the end for the most part. dishes are another story an odu upgrade line item pays about 29.50 plus multidish pay kaku = 12.50 or triple sat 4.50, international 8.50
if i have to mess with the existing dish on an upgrade i add the odu upgrade and dish if i need to replace the LNB.

[avmaster]

its just a failing system, and anyone who really wants to make decent money can no longer do so when it comes to DTV.

When it comes down to hrs vs income the way its setup now, there are several other opportunities that do not have nearly the stress or headache that doing sat for direct tv does that pays much more.

When we used to make 60/20 and were actually able to realisticly do 5 jobs in a day, it was a decent job, it still had its headaches but we were well compensated. Now the headache to compensation ratio is very unappealing.

Sat installs are easy, but dealing with the company you work for and being the final line between the company and the customer is where the biggest difficulties come in.

Thats the reason they will never see long term guys stick around.

[awblackmon]

Our local HSP has found a way to make a list of who will not be routed in the future should the market slow down. If we have low telephone hook up stats, you will no longer be routed and your tech number turned off. Doesn't matter if every thing else about the job is done well, just hook up the phone lines, or face no job. We are to hook up the lines to connections that have no dial tone so our shop sup can verify we did hook it up when he goes to customers to verify. What a waste of his time! Logic here just does not prevail, and common sense as they say, is dead. As for my job, I am one of the techs that may be no longer routed unless I start hooking up to dead lines in homes that have cell phone service only. I sure wish we had a way to back charge DTV for this wastefulness.