Dish HD Upgrade

[hsweiss]

New subscriber - first post....

I'm in the mid-atlantic area (between Baltimore and Annapolis MD). I've been a Dish subscriber for about the last 3 years (SD) and now have "moved on up" to a 46" Samsung HD TV. I've called Dish and they are upgrading me this Fri to HD.

My current setup is a SuperDish antenna with a 322 receiver. The receiver was set up to see orbital locations at 105, 110, and 119 degrees. However, there is nothing on 105 and all of my programming is coming from 110 and 119 (I'm getting the Baltimore DMA locals).

When I talked to Dish tech support about what they are going to do for my upgrade (antenna wise) I heard that they were going to swap out my Superdish for a 1000.4. But they are also talking about eastern arc. And they also mentioned a possible need for a 2nd (wing) dish (something popped up in their database about this but they can't confirm it).

It turns out that I'm probably not a good candidate for eastern arc - lots of mature trees to the east unless the higher elevation of the eastern arc spacecraft (up around 44 degrees I think) will give me enough clearance over the trees. I'm assuming that if the installation tech can go eastern arc, all I will need is a 1000.4 to see the 3 eastern orbital positions? But what if they have to stay with the western sats? Do I then need to see 110, 119, and 129 and can they do this with a single antenna? I really don't want anymore downleads or more hardware on my roof. Also, can I get HD locals if I stay with the western arc?

Is there an advantage to going with eastern vs. western arc? I know its MP4 on the east but does that xlate into better picture/sound or just better bandwidth utilization for Dish?

Thanks in advance.

[coldsteel]

First of all, :welcome_s

As to the dishes, the HD locals for Baltimore are on the 61.5 orbital, so you may only need a wing for 61.5, but if the system's putting you to Eastern Arc (61.5, 72, 77), you won't need 2 dishes. However, with the LOS issue you mentioned, let the tech see and decide then; it's easy to mod the order after a look-see by the tech.

[4HiMarks]

Howdy Neighbor, and welcome to DBSTalk.

I'm in Laurel, but I get Washington DMA channels, so your situation might be different. DC locals are on 61.5, which is where the wing dish requirement probably comes from. AFAIK, Balt. needed the Superdish because those locals were on another sat (105?). I will leave the answers to the rest of your questions to those more knowledgable than I (of which you will find a lot on this forum).

[coldsteel]

Baltimore SD locals moved to 110 when the Superdishes were discontinued.

[hsweiss]

Question is, if LOS to 61.5 is blocked because of trees (I'm pretty sure it is), can I get HD locals or am I SOL wrt Dish?

I guess I wouldn't be all that upset if I had to hang out an antenna since I've been absolutely amazed at OTA HD broadcasts (particularly the 1080i that Maryland Public Television is pumping out) - and I save $5/month to boot!

I read someplace that everything is duplicated on the eastern and western arcs but this hold true for local HD?

[tkrandall]

HD core programming is also on 61.5

[hsweiss]

But HD core is also on Western arc (110 and 129) according to various channel guides (including the one linked from DBSTALK) and the Dish Eastern Arc Installation doc I found while trolling the web.

From that document (dated Aug 21 2008): "Eastern Arc and Western Arc will simulcast parallel programming from different orbital locations (with the exception of DishLATINO programming which is currently only available at the 110 degree orbital location), so Eastern Arc and Western Arc customers will have access to virtually all of the same programming options."

[scooper]

Eastern Arc would be 61.5, 72, and 77.
Western Arc is /will be 110,119, and 129

Your big question is can you get Baltimore locals (HD) on 129 or not.

If Baltimore (HD) is only on 61.5 (and it maybe), then you would need that wing at least. You can most programming (HD) on 61.5 , and having 110/119 you should get most of what you want.

But let the installer check it out - if you can get 61.5, odds are that the other 2 eastern arc are even higher in the sky.

[catnapped]

Baltimore (HD) locals are only on 61.5

[hsweiss]

Eastern Arc would be 61.5, 72, and 77.
Western Arc is /will be 110,119, and 129

Your big question is can you get Baltimore locals (HD) on 129 or not.

If Baltimore (HD) is only on 61.5 (and it maybe), then you would need that wing at least. You can most programming (HD) on 61.5 , and having 110/119 you should get most of what you want.

But let the installer check it out - if you can get 61.5, odds are that the other 2 eastern arc are even higher in the sky.

Well, I'll find out tomorrow.

My problem with "let the installer check it out" is that I have little or no faith in the crop of Dish installers I've encountered thus far in my area. The guy who did my original installation failed to show up on our first appt.

I rescheduled for another day between 8-12 and he showed up around 3pm. He did his thing, got it working, and left after it was dark outside. I later found that nothing was grounded. I made calls to Dish tech support and they supported my claim that the dish is supposed to be grounded. Installers came back out twice and claimed everything was fine - no ground needed. I finally had to get a supervisor out who said, oops and they finally installed a ground block. All the other guys were too lazy to install the ground even though Dish's installation guides specifically require grounding.

I then had problems twice with the same F connector. The installer decided to save himself work by reusing a Comcast run through my basement. He cut the Comcast connector and installed his own (with no drip loop) and the connector failed in a year (what a surprise). Dish tried to charge me for the house call and they reversed that when I threatened to drop service.

And almost a year later to the day we got "switch failure" error messages on the TV. Of course the switch is up on the roof so we needed another house call. They didn't come out for 3 days (no show on the 1st appt) and then was it the switch - nope, the same connector again. And once again they were going to charge me for the house call. I was with the person to drop service since the tech support supervisor would not reverse the charge. She appeased me with more monthly discounts. She also sent out their top level installer tech to check my installation. He told me point blank that my install sucked and that whoever did it should be fired. He offered to reinstall everything but since he showed up at 7pm I really didn't want people up on my roof after dark and drilling more holes in my roof. One thing he mentioned was that he would *never* install the switch on the roof because its not reachable by the homeowner. He would have installed the switch on the side of the house.

I'm very happy with the service but I don't trust the installers one bit. We'll see if they really show up on time tomorrow and what they decide to do.

[4HiMarks]

I guess I wouldn't be all that upset if I had to hang out an antenna since I've been absolutely amazed at OTA HD broadcasts (particularly the 1080i that Maryland Public Television is pumping out) - and I save $5/month to boot!

You should get an antenna anyway. That's probably the only way you're going to be able to get BOTH Baltimore and DC channels. When a show gets pre-empted (or a game is blacked out) on one, it is frequently available on the other.

[hsweiss]

Well, the day of upgrading finally arrived. Dish installers were supposed to come between 8-12 but when I originally was installed 3 years ago, they didn't show the 1st time and then not 'till 3pm on the revised appt. But this time, I got a call at about 10:30a telling me that the guys were finishing up another job and would be there just about noon but maybe a few min late! Wow - I guess they finally understand customer service?

The techs showed up before noon but were a substitute crew. They picked up the work order because the original guys turned out to be delayed. They thought they were only swapping out my SD 322 rcvr for the HD VIP 222k rcvr. I told 'em that wouldn't work since Baltimore HD locals weren't on the Western arc which my Superdish was pointed towards. Uh oh - they knew they were going to be here awhile.

Turns out my LOS was ok to eastern arc because of the higher elevation that allowed me to make it over my tall oaks. So they installed a 1000.4 and pulled down my old Superdish. I originally had 2 downleads from a DP34 switch but the 1000.4 has a built-in switch and could operate without the 2nd downlead. The 1000.4 is nice - much smaller and less obtrusive than the SuperDish which was a monster

HD on TV 1 is working, but we never tested TV #2 and it doesn't work. I think I know what's going on. I had a single lead for Sat 1 and a diplexed lead for Sat 2 with the diplexed output to the coax going down to the basement TV #2. They never changed that out since the Sat 1 connection worked fine on my HD TV. I think that the diplexer needs to come out and a separator needs to be used on the downlead for the Sat 1 and Sat 2 split. Also it appears that the UHF is not working as well as it did with my old 322 rcvr. I can't turn on/off TV #2 from the basement as it used to work with the 322 (even have the old 322 remote and it doesn't do it either). The UHF remotes only work up close in the same room as the HD receiver. So something is up with that. Might it be the UHF freq?

Again, to customer service's credit, the tech now leaves his name and his supervisor's phone number and the tech claims he will call every day for 7 days to make sure that we're still working ok. I called the supervisor earlier and left voice mail - so far no call back but its Fri night and I really don't expect to hear from him that quickly.

All in all, I pleased with Dish's installer and the picture quality is great. I also learned that being a sat installer is not a job I'd ever want. It was up around 90 today (before the massive t-storm blew through) and the heat up on the black roof must have been intense!

[hsweiss]

Update - I can't believe it but a Dish tech stopped by this morning to "check to make sure everything is working properly." Nice of him to stop by but apparently they didn't close the loop with the call I made to the tech supervisor on Fri that I was having problems with TV #2. But this guy shook it out and agrees with me that I need to have the diplexor pulled out and a separator installed. Unfortunately, he didn't have a separator on his truck (come on guys - aren't separators, splitters, and diplexors a dime a dozen and shouldn't they be on the truck like cable and F fittings?). They'll be back out tomorrow again.....