Does a "free" move start a new service agreement?

[EricJRW]

I'm moving, and will most likely keep DTV, even though FIOS is in the ground at the new address.

The reason I feel compelled to stay with DTV is that I still have 7 months left on my commitment, and to terminate means a $150 charge. What's odd is that I thought I did nothing to start a new commitment, as when DTV dangled a new receiver in front of me, I really was under the impression it was with no strings attached. I had asked this question repeatedly.

I asked the same question about the "free" move... I was explicitly told it does not alter my contract date, but in a conversation with Verizon today (going FIOS for Internet), they seemed to think otherwise, and urged me to check.

Anyway, I'm curious if anyone knows...

Also, is there a way to document this "no change in date" statement made by the CSR (other than getting a name)?

Thanks,

Eric

[loudo]

I'm moving, and will most likely keep DTV, even though FIOS is in the ground at the new address.

The reason I feel compelled to stay with DTV is that I still have 7 months left on my commitment, and to terminate means a $150 charge. What's odd is that I thought I did nothing to start a new commitment, as when DTV dangled a new receiver in front of me, I really was under the impression it was with no strings attached. I had asked this question repeatedly.

I asked the same question about the "free" move... I was explicitly told it does not alter my contract date, but in a conversation with Verizon today (going FIOS for Internet), they seemed to think otherwise, and urged me to check.

Anyway, I'm curious if anyone knows...

Also, is there a way to document this "no change in date" statement made by the CSR (other than getting a name)?

Thanks,

Eric
When ever you add a new piece of equipment, it starts the commitment clock again. Also the Move will do it. I had DirecTV put a dish in my summer home, so I would just have to move my receivers back and forth. It started my commitment clock again.

[hasan]

I would expect any subsidized purchase from D* to start a new commitment.

I would not trust anything a CSR said about what does or doesn't restart the clock. Too many reports of false/incorrect information provided by CSRs litter these forums.

[The Merg]

Any time you add an additional receiver or upgrade a receiver, it will create a commitment extension. Replacing a defective receiver does not create a commitment extension.

As for Mover's Connection, in the past using it did require a new commitment extension. That changed recently though and the commitment requirement was removed.

- Merg

[JLucPicard]

EricJRW,

I would log into your DirecTV account, use the "Contact Us" link and ask this question via e-mail. That should at least give you a written communication from them with the answer.

I caveat that by stating that when I've contacted them this way, a larger-than-I-would-like percentage of their first responses seem like "canned" responses and don't always even address the question I asked. I then respond and state again what I am trying to find out from them. Just a heads up in case response #1 doesn't answer your question.

[EricJRW]

EricJRW,

I would log into your DirecTV account, use the "Contact Us" link and ask this question via e-mail. That should at least give you a written communication from them with the answer.

I caveat that by stating that when I've contacted them this way, a larger-than-I-would-like percentage of their first responses seem like "canned" responses and don't always even address the question I asked. I then respond and state again what I am trying to find out from them. Just a heads up in case response #1 doesn't answer your question.

Great idea, I'll give it a try...

Thanks for the other responses too.

Eric

PS. Is a agreement extension 12 or 24 months?

I'm thinking this recennt extension was from when they swapped out a defective box, which per above, should not have happened

If it's two years, it makes sense, but that seems a long time. I was told I'm under contract until July, which is 24 months from when I "upgraded" to the HR21, which I was told was to replace my Samsung so I could get more HD (and have a bigger bill), but I was told it did not change my agreement, but it seems it did. The HR21 was was replaced, but that was in May of this year, so seems to confirm no exension for swap-out.

Thanks

[BattleZone]

Your commitment was correctly reset to 24 months when you upgraded from the Samsung receiver (which wasn't an HD-DVR) to an HD-DVR.

If you had a failed receiver, or an obsoleted receiver, and got it replaced with a receiver from the same class, meaning SD replaced with SD, DVR replaced with DVR, HD replaced with HD, or HD-DVR replaced with HD-DVR, then there wouldn't have been an extension, but clearly you upgraded, and all upgrades with leased receivers come with a commitment to offset the steep discount vs. an owned receiver.

[quizzer]

Any time you add an additional receiver or upgrade a receiver, it will create a commitment extension. Replacing a defective receiver does not create a commitment extension.

As for Mover's Connection, in the past using it did require a new commitment extension. That changed recently though and the commitment requirement was removed.

- Merg

I agree.

[wildbill129]

I did the move last December, no contract extension. It's only when you add equipment with your move that it triggers a contract extension...

[EricJRW]

I did the move last December, no contract extension. It's only when you add equipment with your move that it triggers a contract extension...

This is correct, I now have an e-mail from DTV saying so...

Also, and this is the best part, they reviewed my account and noted that my "free" HD upgrade last July should not have put me under a new contract, and I was told that will be corrected too.

Thank you so much for suggesting I e-mail DTV.

PS. BattleZone, actually my Samsung was HD, just not MPEG-4. But yeah, it wasn't a DVR, but the CSR really was quite clear that my agreement did not change... I really thought I worked a good deal. And I really must say I'm very happy that DTV did what was right. But now that I'm not under contract, it make it more difficult since I'm moving to a FIOS neighborhood.

[The Merg]

This is correct, I have now have an e-mail from DTV saying so...

Also, and this is the best part, they reviewed my account and noted that my "free" HD upgrade last July should not have put me under a new contract, and I was told that will be corrected too.

Thank you so much for suggesting I e-mail DTV.

PS. BattleZone, actually my Samsung was HD, just not MPEG-4.

Since that was a forced update by DirecTV to allow you to get MPEG-4 channels, that is why you should not have gotten a commitment extension for that "upgrade".

And if the Samsung was owned and not a lease, your new HR21 should also be marked as owned. You can verify that with the Access Card Team at DirecTV.

- Merg

[loudo]

I wish that DirecTV would post your commitment time left on the web site in your account, like they used to. I guess they want to keep it a secret, you have to call to find out. I got a commitment added to mine when I added a dish to our summer home (2 years ago), but by the above posts looks they don't add it any more.

[BattleZone]

PS. BattleZone, actually my Samsung was HD, just not MPEG-4. But yeah, it wasn't a DVR, but the CSR really was quite clear that my agreement did not change... I really thought I worked a good deal. And I really must say I'm very happy that DTV did what was right. But now that I'm not under contract, it make it more difficult since I'm moving to a FIOS neighborhood.

I realize you had an MPEG2 HD Samsung receiver. DirecTV would have replaced that for free, and for no commitment, with an H2x-series MPEG4 HD receiver. But you chose to upgrade to an HD-DVR, which is a higher class of receiver and thus turns your free swapout into an *upgrade*, and upgrades come with commitments.

If you've gotten DirecTV to waive that, great, but understand that that's not the way the system is supposed to work.

[The Merg]

I realize you had an MPEG2 HD Samsung receiver. DirecTV would have replaced that for free, and for no commitment, with an H2x-series MPEG4 HD receiver. But you chose to upgrade to an HD-DVR, which is a higher class of receiver and thus turns your free swapout into an *upgrade*, and upgrades come with commitments.

If you've gotten DirecTV to waive that, great, but understand that that's not the way the system is supposed to work.

Weren't some of the HR10-250's manufactured by Samsung?

- Merg

[EricJRW]

I realize you had an MPEG2 HD Samsung receiver. DirecTV would have replaced that for free, and for no commitment, with an H2x-series MPEG4 HD receiver. But you chose to upgrade to an HD-DVR, which is a higher class of receiver and thus turns your free swapout into an *upgrade*, and upgrades come with commitments.

If you've gotten DirecTV to waive that, great, but understand that that's not the way the system is supposed to work.

Ah, I understand now...

Well, per the e-mail it should have been waived... But wasn't.

If I can get that reversed I can save some money by bundling with FIOS, maybe... I need to add up all their no-so-up-front fees (I think an HD-DVR adds $15 or $16 a month to their "low" fees). Since I already have my DVR "paid for", I might actually be ahead by staying with DTV.

What kills me is the only way to get decent speed Internet is with Verizon, but then bundling is supposed to make the deal better...

Back to the spread-sheet I guess.

Thanks again for all the help.

And yeah, it would be nice if contract date was clearly visible, but I can see how they don't want us thinking about that.

[videojanitor]

Replacing a defective receiver does not create a commitment extension.

I must be cursed, because every time I deal with DirecTV, my experience is always the exact opposite of what people say should happen. I called yesterday to replace a dead, leased SD receiver, and not only did they extend my commitment by 12 months, but they tried to charge me $50 for it, plus $20 more for shipping. I eventually whittled the total down to $31, but the commitment remains. Not that I care ... I don't plan on leaving ... but it is amazing.

[The Merg]

I must be cursed, because every time I deal with DirecTV, my experience is always the exact opposite of what people say should happen. I called yesterday to replace a dead, leased SD receiver, and not only did they extend my commitment by 12 months, but they tried to charge me $50 for it, plus $20 more for shipping. I eventually whittled the total down to $31, but the commitment remains. Not that I care ... I don't plan on leaving ... but it is amazing.

Get that corrected. The only thing you should pay for a defective replacement is shipping. Make sure when you call to activate the receiver you get that fixed. You should explicitly explain to them that you are not adding an additional receiver or upgrading; you are having a defective receiver replaced. Plus, make sure you get the commitment issue corrected as well.

From the DirecTV webpage:

Why lease the DIRECTV equipment?

As the technology in our receivers becomes more advanced, leasing allows us to continue to provide the latest equipment to you — at minimal cost. Leasing also permits affordable upgrades and free replacement receivers.


- Merg

[joshjr]

I work with a guy who just used the movers program within the last month and he recieved a new 2 year commitment.

[videojanitor]

Get that corrected. The only thing you should pay for a defective replacement is shipping. Make sure when you call to activate the receiver you get that fixed.

Thanks. I do plan to bring up the topic again when I call to activate. I received an email confirmation from them with the subject line:

Your New Receiver Upgrade Order Confirmation

Ummmm, I didn't upgrade anything. I guess the CSR entered the information incorrectly, but she knew I was talking about a direct replacement for a dead receiver, so there was definitely no confusion about that. As I said, this is the kind of thing that always happens to ME.

[itguy05]

If I can get that reversed I can save some money by bundling with FIOS, maybe... I need to add up all their no-so-up-front fees (I think an HD-DVR adds $15 or $16 a month to their "low" fees). Since I already have my DVR "paid for", I might actually be ahead by staying with DTV.

What kills me is the only way to get decent speed Internet is with Verizon, but then bundling is supposed to make the deal better...

Back to the spread-sheet I guess.

I'm in the process of trying out Fios (They come on Thursday) and it's about $5-10 cheaper than DirecTV.

Here's what I have with DirecTV:
Choice $55.99
HD $10.00
DVR $6.00
1x HD-DVR, 1x SD-DVR - $5.00
Sales Tax $4.26
Total: $81.99

What I have with FIOS internet (15/5): $54.99

Total: $136.98

What I'm getting with FIOS
HD Extreme
2x HD-DVR
1x DCT-700 SD box (basic box, $3.99/mo)
25/15 Internet
$130.96

And then there's that $150 carrot that they are dangling. There's also a promo for the Home Media DVR free for 3 months (after that you can remove that and not be bound to it in a contract).

As well as a 2 year guarantee on the price. So it's definitely cheaper.

Should be an interesting ride.

[hilmar2k]

Since that was a forced update by DirecTV to allow you to get MPEG-4 channels, that is why you should not have gotten a commitment extension for that "upgrade".

And if the Samsung was owned and not a lease, your new HR21 should also be marked as owned. You can verify that with the Access Card Team at DirecTV.

- Merg

I recently had my dish replaced (because D* mistakenly thought it was defective), and the tech installed a SWiM system, making my old Tivo SD DVR useless. I called DIRECTV to get it swapped out with an R16. CSR said I would be extended. By your logic, I should not have had to.

So should I have been extended or not?

[EricJRW]

Since that was a forced update by DirecTV to allow you to get MPEG-4 channels, that is why you should not have gotten a commitment extension for that "upgrade".

And if the Samsung was owned and not a lease, your new HR21 should also be marked as owned. You can verify that with the Access Card Team at DirecTV.

- Merg

Just realized I did own my Samsung, but when DTV upgraded me, the best deal I got was to "pay for shipping" ($20). I never assumed I owned the HR, but maybe I do (but the original has been swapped out).

[Terry K]

Your commitment was correctly reset to 24 months when you upgraded from the Samsung receiver (which wasn't an HD-DVR) to an HD-DVR.

If you had a failed receiver, or an obsoleted receiver, and got it replaced with a receiver from the same class, meaning SD replaced with SD, DVR replaced with DVR, HD replaced with HD, or HD-DVR replaced with HD-DVR, then there wouldn't have been an extension, but clearly you upgraded, and all upgrades with leased receivers come with a commitment to offset the steep discount vs. an owned receiver.

There is one other exception to this. If you're in a MPEG4 only for locals market (Like Springfield, MO), you're going to fall under obsoleted box as well.

[joshjr]

I'm in the process of trying out Fios (They come on Thursday) and it's about $5-10 cheaper than DirecTV.

What I have with FIOS internet (15/5): $54.99

Total: $136.98

What I'm getting with FIOS
HD Extreme
2x HD-DVR
1x DCT-700 SD box (basic box, $3.99/mo)
25/15 Internet
$130.96

And then there's that $150 carrot that they are dangling. There's also a promo for the Home Media DVR free for 3 months (after that you can remove that and not be bound to it in a contract).

As well as a 2 year guarantee on the price. So it's definitely cheaper.

Should be an interesting ride.
Didnt I read someone on here recently that said the Fios DVR's have alot less storage space? Were you just gonna get an external or deal with a shortage of space in a HD world?

[EricJRW]

Hmm... I never thought to ask that question... But after some serious number crunching, and the fact it's plus $16/month to have a Motorola HD DVR instead of my HR, well for now it seems to make more sense to stay with DTV for TV and FIOS for Internet and phone.

Moving is so much fun!

[itguy05]

Didnt I read someone on here recently that said the Fios DVR's have alot less storage space? Were you just gonna get an external or deal with a shortage of space in a HD world?

Yes, they do have less recording space. For us it should not be a problem as our HR is not an archival place for TV. It pretty much records, we watch and then delete. If it's 50-60% full at one given time, that's a lot and rare. So for us it shouldn't be an issue.

And they have a higher capacity (or external drive enabled) DVR coming sometime in December or Q1 '10 that I can upgrade to without extending my commitment.

Should be a better deal all around. I'm not loyal to any provider - I want the best deal.

[The Merg]

I recently had my dish replaced (because D* mistakenly thought it was defective), and the tech installed a SWiM system, making my old Tivo SD DVR useless. I called DIRECTV to get it swapped out with an R16. CSR said I would be extended. By your logic, I should not have had to.

So should I have been extended or not?

Did they install a SWM-LNB dish or a SWM8? If the latter, you could still use your Tivo using the legacy ports on the SWM8. If they installed the SWM-LNB and you currently had the Tivo active on your account, they should replace that receiver for you at no cost and with no commitment extension (as they are forcing you to switch receivers). At a minimum, you might need to pay for shipping for the new receiver.

Just realized I did own my Samsung, but when DTV upgraded me, the best deal I got was to "pay for shipping" ($20). I never assumed I owned the HR, but maybe I do (but the original has been swapped out).

Paying for shipping is normal for a replacement receiver, especially if you don't have the Protection Plan. Contact the Access Card Team and they can tell you if your receiver is owned vs. leased.

- Merg

[EricJRW]

Paying for shipping is normal for a replacement receiver, especially if you don't have the Protection Plan. Contact the Access Card Team and they can tell you if your receiver is owned vs. leased.

- Merg
Thanks Merg.

I will definately (now) look into this.

[videojanitor]

Get that corrected. The only thing you should pay for a defective replacement is shipping. Make sure when you call to activate the receiver you get that fixed. You should explicitly explain to them that you are not adding an additional receiver or upgrading; you are having a defective receiver replaced. Plus, make sure you get the commitment issue corrected as well.

Well, the replacement receiver arrived today and I called to activate it. At the same time, I tried to get these issues corrected, but ran into the same problem -- the CSR insisted that without the Protection Plan, I have to pay for the receiver, and extend the commitment. I called back later and talked to two other people and got the same story. At that point, I gave up, as it's more trouble than it's worth.

[The Merg]

Well, the replacement receiver arrived today and I called to activate it. At the same time, I tried to get these issues corrected, but ran into the same problem -- the CSR insisted that without the Protection Plan, I have to pay for the receiver, and extend the commitment. I called back later and talked to two other people and got the same story. At that point, I gave up, as it's more trouble than it's worth.

You mentioned that you are replacing a dead SD-DVR. Is your replacement an HD-DVR by any chance? If so, then it is considered to be an upgrade. The replacement has to be the exact same model level (SD to SD, SD-DVR to SD-DVR, HD to HD, HD-DVR to HD-DVR).

If you can't get it resolved with a CSR, send an e-mail to Ellen Filipiak ellen.filipiak@directv.com. She is the VP of Customer Service. Her office should be able to help you out. Just verify the spelling of her name. I always seem to mess it up.

- Merg

[videojanitor]

You mentioned that you are replacing a dead SD-DVR. Is your replacement an HD-DVR by any chance? If so, then it is considered to be an upgrade.

Merg,

The replacement was the same as the one that died (well, close enough -- the dead one is a D11, and the replacement is a D12), so no upgrade there. Thanks for the email address -- I may or may not pursue it since I don't want to spend much more time on it. Mostly I find it kind of amazing that something that should be "known" by them, isn't. Not sure how that happens.

[BattleZone]

Well, the replacement receiver arrived today and I called to activate it. At the same time, I tried to get these issues corrected, but ran into the same problem -- the CSR insisted that without the Protection Plan, I have to pay for the receiver, and extend the commitment. I called back later and talked to two other people and got the same story. At that point, I gave up, as it's more trouble than it's worth.

If your D11 was leased, then the CSRs you spoke to are giving you the wrong answer. If your D11 was owned, then they are exactly right. So, the question is: what is the status if your D11? You'll need to contact the Access Card department to find out.

[videojanitor]

If your D11 was leased, then the CSRs you spoke to are giving you the wrong answer. If your D11 was owned, then they are exactly right. So, the question is: what is the status if your D11? You'll need to contact the Access Card department to find out.

It was definitely leased -- I got it in the fall of 2006. They said they are sending me a recovery kit to return it, though as of yet nothing has been received, and it doesn't show under "pending orders" on my account.

[loudo]

It was definitely leased -- I got it in the fall of 2006. They said they are sending me a recovery kit to return it, though as of yet nothing has been received, and it doesn't show under "pending orders" on my account.
One day the mistake will be realized and they will come looking for their receiver. I had the same thing when I upgraded my H20 to an HR20. 3 months later they mailed me the recovery kit.

[The Merg]

If your D11 was leased, then the CSRs you spoke to are giving you the wrong answer. If your D11 was owned, then they are exactly right. So, the question is: what is the status if your D11? You'll need to contact the Access Card department to find out.

Actually, there's been talk recently that DirecTV has changed that policy so that any defective replacement does not create a commitment. While replacing an owned receiver without the Protection Plan will mean you get a leased receiver, there would be no new commitment.

- Merg

[videojanitor]

One day the mistake will be realized and they will come looking for their receiver. I had the same thing when I upgraded my H20 to an HR20. 3 months later they mailed me the recovery kit.

I have certainly had my share of experiences with this. About six months ago, I decommissioned a leased HR10-250, and and they said would send a recovery kit for it. After a few weeks, nothing had shown up, so I called back to inquire. This CSR said "What? We don't want those things back ... we have no use for them." Then she proceeded to change it from a "leased" unit to "owned." It must have worked, as I never got the kit, and was never charged anything. However, it is still in my closet, just in case they change their story ...

[videojanitor]

I wish I didn't open this can of worms, but after pressing DirecTV on why I was charged for a replacement receiver and had my commitment extended, I was told that it's because I ordered an "upgrade" and not a "replacement." Huh? I didn't ask for an upgrade -- I just asked for a replacement for a broken standard receiver, and that's what I received. I guess the original CSR incorrectly noted this as an "upgrade," and now I am walking up a steep hill trying to convince them it's their error and not mine.

Their word against mine at this point, though one would think if they looked at the transaction, replacing one standard receiver with another would not be an upgrade. Supposedly now a "specialist" is going to contact me ... I knew I should have left this alone ... more trouble than it's worth!

Merg ... I will use the email address you posted if this doesn't get cleared up soon.