Did Dish break my Tivo connection intentionally?

[jballard]

I have a ViP 211 and an external Tivo Series 2. This setup has worked great for years. Until a week ago. Dish decided that my 211 receiver should automatically go into stand-by mode every morning and I should not be allowed to over-ride it. This is part of checking for updates. Following the check for updates my receiver will automatically go into stand-by mode and require me to press the "Select" button on my remote.

This breaks the automatic recording function of my Tivo. The Tivo now will only record the stand-by screen until I manually press the Select button.

Does Dish do any testing? Isn't the leading brand of external recorder Tivo?

I have called Dish tech support 4 times about this and so far no help.

[SaltiDawg]

...
I have called Dish tech support 4 times about this and so far no help.
Set a daily timer to tune to, not record, any channel. Set it to fire after your morning update. (4:00 AM?)

[dennispap]

Set a daily timer to tune to, not record, any channel. Set it to fire after your morning update. (4:00 AM?)

What the above poster said will work.

[jballard]

That is exactly what one of the Dish Tech support people suggested. So I did. This does not seem to work reliably. My update is scheduled to occur at 5:30am so I set a timer for 6:00am to Autotune to CNN channel 200. I did this three days ago. It worked the first day but not the last two. I set this up as a Daily timer. The past two days the receiver is in Standby mode. The timer is still programmed into the receiver.

If the timer is not a persistant timer then what good is it?

We used to have the option to update when we wanted to. Now, we are forced to upgrade daily! Why couldn't they put the receiver back into the mode it was in when they checked for the update istead of forcing the receiver into standby mode following the upgrade check.

[Stewart Vernon]

I'm not sure why this only became a problem recently, because this is the way it has worked for as long as I can remember.

The receiver always does a nightly update (unless you are there to cancel it) in order to refresh EPG data as well as check for possible firmware updates.

What I always recommend, though, is to put at least 1 hour difference between your update time and the auto-tune timer. Sometimes the update takes longer than others (particularly if there is a firmware update) and other times it doesn't happen exactly on schedule.

I recommend setting, for example, update time for 5am and auto-tune for 6am and see if that makes a difference.

[jballard]

The reason that it only recently became a problem is that until last week you could select to not allow updates without permission. Since I do not use the guide in the Dish receiver, I use the TIVO guide, I had disabled nightly updates.

Last week they decided to make nightly updates not optional. There is no longer a way to opt out. Why they make the receiver go into stand-by mode instead of remaining in its original mode I do not understand. You are still allowed to disable inactivity timeout standby mode but not update standby mode. They have effectively disabled external recorders.

Their solution is to switch to their DVR, but their DVR is brain dead compared to TIVO.

[bigshew]

Could a remote that had its own timers be used to wake up your receiver?

[jballard]

A remote with a timer would probably work. I guess I could enlarge the select button on my dish remote and train my dog to step on it every morning when he eats. But why should either of these solutions be necessary?

Dish broke it they should fix it! I am working on trying to get TIVO to come up with a fix but I blame the problem on the arrogance of Dish Network. I have been a Dish customer for over 10 years. I have four receivers and subscribe to everything Dish offers. America's Everything, Superstations, Locals, HD, etc and I am thinking about switching because Dish does not care about my business anymore.

They broke my satellite receiver and when I point this out they admit it but refuse to do anything about it. The only way this could happen is that they do not test a configuration which includes a TIVO recorder connected to their receiver. That is arrogance! TIVO is the leading manufacturer of DVRs because they add functionality above what is built into the Dish unit and if Dish doesn't test this configuration then they are doing a disservice to their customers.

At they very least they should work with TIVO or notify them of a change which affects their mutual customers before they make the change.

[DNSFSS]

A remote with a timer would probably work. I guess I could enlarge the select button on my dish remote and train my dog to step on it every morning when he eats. But why should either of these solutions be necessary?

Dish broke it they should fix it! I am working on trying to get TIVO to come up with a fix but I blame the problem on the arrogance of Dish Network. I have been a Dish customer for over 10 years. I have four receivers and subscribe to everything Dish offers. America's Everything, Superstations, Locals, HD, etc and I am thinking about switching because Dish does not care about my business anymore.

They broke my satellite receiver and when I point this out they admit it but refuse to do anything about it. The only way this could happen is that they do not test a configuration which includes a TIVO recorder connected to their receiver. That is arrogance! TIVO is the leading manufacturer of DVRs because they add functionality above what is built into the Dish unit and if Dish doesn't test this configuration then they are doing a disservice to their customers.

At they very least they should work with TIVO or notify them of a change which affects their mutual customers before they make the change.

I'm sure that E* did this to protect their equipment (potential damage from tuners being on 24/7) and it's not intentional that it happens to now be incompatible with your blessed Tivo. I'd also bet that E* has put together a full investigation into this matter and will be working night and day to correct this problem so that it'll work with your Tivo (which E* has been in quite a lawsuit with for a while so I doubt there is much working together there):lol:

PS. They didn't "break" your receiver, it still works just fine! Maybe it's the Tivo that's broken. Why can't Tivo make a box that will tell the satellite receiver to turn on? Why won't Ford make parts that work on a Chevy? Or Citroen and Bentley?:lol:

[P Smith]

"I'm sure that E* did this to protect their equipment (potential damage from tuners being on 24/7) " - you probably is not aware,

but practically all components exclude some audio chips working 24/7 include those sat tuners !

[jballard]

I'm sure that E* did this to protect their equipment (potential damage from tuners being on 24/7) and it's not intentional that it happens to now be incompatible with your blessed Tivo. I'd also bet that E* has put together a full investigation into this matter and will be working night and day to correct this problem so that it'll work with your Tivo (which E* has been in quite a lawsuit with for a while so I doubt there is much working together there):lol:

PS. They didn't "break" your receiver, it still works just fine! Maybe it's the Tivo that's broken. Why can't Tivo make a box that will tell the satellite receiver to turn on? Why won't Ford make parts that work on a Chevy? Or Citroen and Bentley?:lol:

This particular receiver has been powered on and working with this TIVO for the past two years. Your argument makes no sense. The compatibility between the receiver was broken by a firmware change to the receiver made unilaterally by dish last week. Dish admits that they made the change. I am sure TIVO can make the change to suddenly require that the select button must be pressed before selecting channels. It will take time to implement. In the meantime dish has screwed its customers.

If dish network cared about it's customers they would not unilaterally make changes to break compatibility with other equipment. I am not saying that it is illegal for them to make the changes, I am saying that it shows that they do not care about their customers. As I said earlier I have been a dish customer for over 10 years and this is the second time something like this has happened. After enough outcry from their outraged customers, dish finally fixed the problem last time. My configuration was broken for 6 weeks last time.

[deaincaelo]

I can see why your frustrated. On the whole though, it's better overall that they did this.

If you had your receiver for 10 years with auto updates turned off, you know it needs to be turned off to get updates or it stops working. When people do this and call dish, it's natural to expect dish to disable the user from breaking the equipment. Stupid users will always outnumber the adept.

Auto tune timers work to fix the tivo issue. You probably need to set a manual timer. More importantly, if your tivo can change channels then it ought to be able to send out the discrete power on signal.

It's not reasonable to expect Dish to support a third party piece of equipment at the expense of the majority of their customers. Especially when they have plenty of work arounds. Beyond the fact that tivo should have this built in, timers work fine and the ehd service is plug and play.

[jballard]

Dish could have satisfied all of your requirements as well as not broken compatibility with external recorders by simply putting the receiver back into its previous state once the update was complete. If the receiver was in standby prior to the update then put it into standby after the update, otherwise leave the receiver active after the update. Simple. Or they could simply allow us to configure what state the receiver should be left in following an update. After all they allow us to turn off the inactivity standby timeout. It is the same issue, I do not want the receiver to go into standby mode ever! They can still do their forced update but put the receiver back into the mode that I have chosen.

I am sure that TIVO will come out with a fix but in the meantime dish has screwed its customers unnecessarily. I think the problem is that Dish does not view their receiver as a component of a larger system. They feel free to change compatibility issues with out worrying how it will affect their customers.

[jclewter79]

You can still change the update time right?


Just move the update time. Simple.

[SaltiDawg]

...
If the timer is not a persistant timer then what good is it?
...
Doh. Indeed! What good is the receiver itself if the timers are not "persistent." lol

What did the receiver indicate was the cause of the timer not firing? After all, that is the answer to your concern. Is ther not a better time to schedule your daily update? How about the default 3:00AM? If that time works, set the Tune Only timer for a couple of hours later... 5:30AM???

It almost seems you want this to fail. :rolleyes: Many do it with total success and certainly timers with no conflict (nor update in progress) fire without problem in most of our experiences.

EDIT: Now that I've read the rest of your posts, I am positive that you are planning on failure. Trolling?

"Dish broke it they should fix it! "

As numerous replies have suggested, they didn't break anything. Many of us have been receiving 3:00AM updates for years without missing a timer. Your aside "digs" at Dish versus Tivo miss the point that many oeople here are just totally satisfied with their VIP receiver - I wouldn't have a Tivo if it were given to me if I had to lose the flexibility of my VIP receivers.

If you want to solve your problem, try listening to the helpful replies others have posted. Maybe instead of sarcastically suggesting that you might need to train your dog to push one button on the remote control, you should consider letting him operate the entire remote.:rolleyes:

[jballard]

You last two miss the point entirely. What difference does it make what time the update occurs? Why am I suddenly forced to set a bogus timer to wake up my receiver because Dish decided to change my receiver from Active to Standby without my permission?

TROLLING???

I would be willing to bet that those commenting do not have a TIVO and therefore have no horse in the race! I am also posting on other forums, specifically TIVO forums since the customers affected are customers who have TIVO recorders and get their programming from Dish.

[Kent Taylor]

OK, you've expressed your displeasure with Dish. We get it. You have been offered several solutions to your issue but you don't seem to want any help. Maybe you can get satisfaction from the other forums where you've posted.
I think this thread has run it's course.

[DNSFSS]

<Nevermind>

[jballard]

What solutions have I been offered that work? Switch to a Dish DVR? I have tried the bogus timer option and it only works sometimes, so what working option have I been offered?

But I will move on. It is obvious that only people who drink the Dish Coolaid are allowed here.

[SaltiDawg]

... I have tried the bogus timer option and it only works sometime, ...
Last post from me. You have been previously asked what the receiver indicates was the reason for your "bogus timer" not firing? Canceled by user? Conflict with a timer of higher priority?

On second thought, someone else may be able to help you after you reply - or not. I'll not see your reply. :rolleyes:

Bye

[jballard]

Simple question. Why is a bogus timer necessary? Why didn't dish simply put my receiver back into the same state it was in prior to the update?

[Kent Taylor]

I don't see anything new happening here except rehashing the same old complaints. I hope you find an adequate solution to your problem but apparently none of the suggestions offered here will satisfy you. Good luck.