SWM Problem with H21-100

[oldengineer]

I converted my Zinwell 6X8 to a Zinwell SWM-8 last Friday. I thought the installation was perfect. I checked my 2 HR21 boxes and had 85-100 on all active transponders on 99, 101, and 103 on both tuners. Watching and recording over the weekend was routine, no problems.

I also have an H21 box on a set which I don't use too often. This morning I decided to do a satellite check on it and I've got a problem. All 3 satellites show readings of either 85-100 or 0 and the problem is not consistent. Looking at 99C for example I see 2 to 7 zeroes and they move around. I also see 771 errors come and go on various channels, verifying the varying signal strengths.

I just spent an hour with a "technician" at D* and they had me
1. Put a BNC on - ooops, don't do that
2. Reconfigure the dish as a 5LNB - no, that won't pull guide data from 119.
3. Check all cable connections -
4. OK you need a service call and its $49.95 even though you have the PP.

I finally said thanks and hung up.

I switched splitter connections with a good box and the problem stayed with the H21.

I then switched boxes between 2 sets and the problem still stays with the H21. SWM is great there.

This box worked OK coming off of the 6X8, so there is either an incompatibility issue with SWM or the box has gone south. The box shows SWM in the Satellite setup menu. The S/W version is 0x434e installed on 10-8-09.

Before I get back to D* and demand a replacement box I want to check with people who really know about these things and see if there is a problem with H21-100 boxes and SWM.

Thanks in advance for the good answers I know I will see.

[veryoldschool]

"Just a thought" [if you haven't tried].
Move the H21 to where one of your "working" receivers are, to retest.
I'm not sure if you've eliminated "the cable" yet.

[oldengineer]

"Just a thought" [if you haven't tried].
Move the H21 to where one of your "working" receivers are, to retest.
I'm not sure if you've eliminated "the cable" yet.

Yes I did that. I swapped the H21-100 box with the HR21-200 box and reconnected both in their new locations. I swapped boxes only; power cords, all cabling, HDMI cables, ethernet hookups, etc remained in place. The HR21-200 worked perfectly in the H21 location and the H21 exhibited the same bad behavior in the HR21-200 location. I think its definitely either a SWM problem or a box gone bad. I could probably switch back to the 6X8 and see how the H21 behaves. I saw a few other threads where folks with H21 boxes had to reset frequently, etc. so it may be a SWM issue.

Maybe I'll try the 6X8 test.

[Beerstalker]

Hook the 6x8 back up and see if you get it working. If it works try updating the firmware.

1. Restart your receiver. Using the remote control, select
Menu -> Parental, Fav's & Setting -> System Setup > Reset -> Restart Receiver ({DASH} to confirm)

2. When the reset process starts, the blue LEDs on the front of the receiver will turn off

3. Once the LEDs on the front of the receiver come back on OR the first blue screen is displayed, whichever occurs first, enter this special code from your remote control: 0 2 4 6 8.

4. After a few more seconds, you should see a screen indicating that the 10-20 minute download cycle has started.

Once the new firmware is installed try hooking it back up to the SWM setup and see if it works then.

[BattleZone]

4. OK you need a service call and its $49.95 even though you have the PP.


This is BS, and the person you were talking to was an idiot. A service call is a good idea, and will be covered by the Protection Plan, so no additional charge to you.

[oldengineer]

This is BS, and the person you were talking to was an idiot. A service call is a good idea, and will be covered by the Protection Plan, so no additional charge to you.

I just posted this on a thread in the General Discussion group

Funny, I just spent the majority of the day on the phone with D* about whether the PP would cover service calls for self-installed SWMs. I installed a Zinwell SWM-8 last Friday and now my H21-100 box has severe fluctuations in satellite strength across all transponders on 99/101/103. The strength randomly goes from 85-100 to 0. I put one of my HR21s in the bad location using the bad location's cable and wiring and it works fine. No brainer, bad H21 box, right?

I made 4 calls about it today. I DO have the Protection Plan
1. Tech L. had me go thru the litany of resets and configurations and in the end told me that the problem required a service call with a $49 charge because I did the SWM install myself.
2. Tech B. went thru a few checks and wanted to schedule a service call for $49 but told me that she could get me a $50 credit to pay for it. I was mysteriously disconnected while waiting for B. to verify my credit.
3. Tech S. went thru a few checks and told me that the PP would cover the service call even though I did the install. I asked her to verify this and she put me on with Supervisor C. C quickly overruled S. and said I would have to pay since I did the install myself.

So 4 CSRs and 3 different answers.

I wish D* would get off the stick and say something definitive about this.

[Kansas Zephyr]

3. Tech S. went thru a few checks and told me that the PP would cover the service call even though I did the install. I asked her to verify this and she put me on with Supervisor C. C quickly overruled S. and said I would have to pay since I did the install myself.
If self installs are not covered...then demand a refund of all PP fees paid to date, and cancel the PP service.

It would be nice to get a definitive answer.

[west99999]

this is not BS the OP caused the problem by screwing with something he has no idea about so yeah he should pay

[RobertE]

If self installs are not covered...then demand a refund of all PP fees paid to date, and cancel the PP service.

It would be nice to get a definitive answer.

Read the terms and conditions of the plan. Not that hard. A refund is not warrented.

[oldengineer]

this is not BS the OP caused the problem by screwing with something he has no idea about so yeah he should pay

As the OP I take exception to your post. I have an MSEE and was a Missile Technician on 2 submarines so I do have some experience with electronics. I did a proper installation of DirecTv approved equipment following instructions and tips obtained from this group.

I don't like to get involved in pissing contests with idiots but i"ll make an exception in your case.

[Alebob911]

Try forcing a software update on it while connected to your SWM. I had to do this with the one H21-100 that I have and it worked. YMMV. Good Luck.

[oldengineer]

Try forcing a software update on it while connected to your SWM. I had to do this with the one H21-100 that I have and it worked. YMMV. Good Luck.

Just tried it. It downloaded the same version and it didn't help. I think the box may have gone bad. I resurrected the 6X8 and connected the H21 and it behaved the same way. I've got another H21 coming via UPS. The PP will at least handle that and the shipping.

[Kansas Zephyr]

Read the terms and conditions of the plan. Not that hard. A refund is not warrented.
I read further up the thread and see where the OP had a working system, until he/she worked on it.

So, my bad, you're right.

I wonder if you have a working self-install, then later have a failure, will PP cover it? If not, they shouldn't offer it to self-installs.

[RobertE]

I read further up the thread and see where the OP had a working system, until he/she worked on it.

So, my bad, you're right.

I wonder if you have a working self-install, then later have a failure, will PP cover it? If not, they shouldn't offer it to self-installs.

While I don't condone trying to defraud anyone, sometimes people with the best of intentions volunteer too much information. ;)

[oldengineer]

I read further up the thread and see where the OP had a working system, until he/she worked on it.

So, my bad, you're right.

I wonder if you have a working self-install, then later have a failure, will PP cover it? If not, they shouldn't offer it to self-installs.

I think D* has to take a more intelligent approach when dealing with self installs, especially with SWM which is a potential revenue gainer for them. I did my own install and 3 out of 4 receivers and all 4 receiver locations worked fine after the install. Its obvious to me and any other rational person that my problem is with a receiver which failed or was not functional in the SWM environment. I agree that D* is under no obligation to cover user inflicted damage.

[imaki]

For what it is worth I went through the same scenario, although with a HR20-700 being the bad egg. My other units, a H20-100 and HR20-100 both worked without a problem. I went to best buy and picked up a HR22-100 to replace the HR20-700 and it works without an issue. I wonder if some of these older boxes don't work quite so well with SWM.

[TBlazer07]

I think D* has to take a more intelligent approach when dealing with self installs, especially with SWM which is a potential revenue gainer for them. I did my own install and 3 out of 4 receivers and all 4 receiver locations worked fine after the install. Its obvious to me and any other rational person that my problem is with a receiver which failed or was not functional in the SWM environment. I agree that D* is under no obligation to cover user inflicted damage. If one simply tells them that their receiver isn't functioning without "I installed a SWM and that's when it stopped and yada yada yada" after they did some basic receiver troubleshooting one would have had the new rx shipped and have avoided all the extra calls and aggravation. When I have had a receiver that I KNOW is bad and I don't want to deal with all the scripted reboots and reformats I just get on the phone and OK them to death for 10 minutes and get a new one shipped. The worst thing anyone can do with DirecTV is try to show them how much you know. :)

[oldengineer]

If one simply tells them that their receiver isn't functioning without "I installed a SWM and that's when it stopped and yada yada yada" after they did some basic receiver troubleshooting one would have had the new rx shipped and have avoided all the extra calls and aggravation. When I have had a receiver that I KNOW is bad and I don't want to deal with all the scripted reboots and reformats I just get on the phone and OK them to death for 10 minutes and get a new one shipped. The worst thing anyone can do with DirecTV is try to show them how much you know. :)

I don't try to show them how much I know. I spent over 2.5 hrs on the phone with 3 different CSRs patiently going thru their scripts. I did relate to them the fact that swapping the locations of a good and the bad box resulted in the good staying good and the bad staying bad was a pretty clear indicator that the box was in fact bad.

I was only able to get the Supervisor to send a replacement receiver by politely but firmly asking to speak to the next higher person in her chain-of-command after she initially said that she would not authorize a replacement or a service call covered by the PP. I wish my "OK them to death" only lasted 10 minutes.:D

[pmayo2002]

You should have told then it will not power up. Then the only thing it could be is the receiver. You already isolated it to the receiver by swapping them around.

Had a similar problem with a stuttering HDD and got tired of the BS the CSR wanted me to go thru.

I too am a know it all Engineer :)

[oldengineer]

You should have told then it will not power up. Then the only thing it could be is the receiver. You already isolated it to the receiver by swapping them around.

Had a similar problem with a stuttering HDD and got tired of the BS the CSR wanted me to go thru.

I too am a know it all Engineer :)

This is great advice. I'll do that next time. I'll also forget to tell them that I did a self install of SWM. I have the PP and if a customer does a good install of DTV approved equipment D* has to come up with a better solution than what they are doing now.

[2dogz]

This is great advice. I'll do that next time. I'll also forget to tell them that I did a self install of SWM.

Forget to tell them that you self installed anything. They won't know. I've been in these call centers. Know that part where everyone you talk to first asks for your home phone number. It brings up your customer account on their computer screen. Profile of you as a paying customer, your equipment, and history of service calls and service orders. Suppose you self installed the SWM, the CSR won't know. Even if he/she were motivated to research your service history, the fact your SWM/dish/receiver install is not in the computer would be chalked up to screwed up computer error or slacker installer. But they won't know you bought and installed it unless you tell them.

Your only objective is to get the CSR to either send you a replacement receiver (best) or schedule a truck roll with a tech having a replacement receiver (better). When the tech gets there you can bond with him showing off your cool custom install and saving him time explaining all the steps you've taken to pinpoint the problem.

Just an addition note: All these folks advising people to keep calling back for different CSRs in order to get freebies and discounts, your exact same customer profile comes up on the CSR's computer and you have a ranking as to what perks they can offer you. If the first CSR make notes on your account stating what was asked for and what was offered, every following CSR can read it. Just so you know the game is rigged.

[oldengineer]

Time to kill this thread.

Bottom line - D* sent a replacement receiver and it works fine.

[808installer]

There is a communication issue between swim's and h21-100, they are supposidly trying to fix the issue but its been months since the problem was discovered. we swap the box out when we come across them thats the only thing to do.