Official Dish DVR-510 Information from Dish Network

[Scott Greczkowski]

The following was sent to retailers this morning.

All "inside" dealer information has been removed.

DishDVR 510: This exciting new receiver will be available starting the week of August 18th. The DishDVR 510 has
all the great features of the DishPVR 508 and more, it has a 120 GB hard disk drive and provides up to 100 hours of recording capacity. You’ll notice we are calling the 510 a “D” VR instead of “P” VR, as we are adopting the industry term of “Digital Video Recorder” to capitalize on consumer awareness of the category. Standalone Unit MSRP of $299. Full System with Dish MSRP is $349.

DVR Fees: We are also instituting a monthly charge for DVR functionality. Monthly charges allow for a lower cost of entry for customers as well as providing an incentive for customers to subscribe to a higher level of programming. We will begin charging for DVR functionality with the release of the DishDVR 510. (Please note the monthly fees are per DVR receiver.) Any new or existing DishPVR 501/508 or DishPVR 721 receiver will be grandfathered in - no DVR fee will be charged.

Keep in mind, some customers first received DVR under the Digital Dynamite promotion and are already paying a monthly DVR box fee. This process was implemented before there was an “upgrade” fee for the use of DVR receivers. These customers will continue to pay their DVR box fee as they always have. Additionally, the DISHPlayer fee will remain unchanged.

Here is a breakdown of the DVR fee as it relates to the programming packages:
o America’s Everything Pak = $0 (No charge)
o America’s Top 150/ DISH Latino Max = $4.98 per month
o America’s Top 100/ DISH Latino Dos = $4.98 per month
o America’s Top 50/ America’s Top 50 Plus/DISH Latino = $9.99 per month
o Programming not included in an America’s Top package or DISH Latino package is subject to the $9.99 per month DVR fee.

[angiodan]

Scott, as much as I'm angered about any fee at all, the "PER DVR" is the one that gets me the most. Even D* doesn't charge per unit.

Also not including AT150 as "no fee" is ridiculous. AT150 has always been considered one of the top packages. So, if you have multiple DVR's, do you suck it up and get the AEP, even though you don't want it? I'm sure this is what Dish is thinking most will do.

I'd love to get through on Chat this month! I guarantee you they won't take one question about it at all, let alone even mention it.

[Bob Haller]

Charlie should sell out. He obviously has lost his business sense.

Besiddes the only difference between the 508 and 510 is the larger hard drive made necessary by drive manufacturers moving to larger drives. Smaller ones will cost more.

This saves E money whoile gouging the sub....

[N2Tronix]

Anyone have their "grandfathered" distant networks taken away? Wonder how long before this grandfather dies? This is crap and Dish should be ashamed.

[Jacob S]

Lawsuits would hit Charlie so hard it would make his head spin if he started charging those who were grandfathered for the 501, 508, 721. We were grandfathered before he even said we were because he gave the promise before and when the receivers were purchased.

Notice the price of the 510 did NOT drop in price, the 522 will be higher in price, probably $399 or $499. Charlie will say that you will save enough on the second outlet fee to make up for the DVR fee on the 522 unless he decides to charge a second outlet fee on the 522 as well and gouge consumers again.

[Scott Greczkowski]

Yes $299 is WAY TOO HIGH if they are subsidizing the costs and users are paying a monthly fee to use the unit.

It should be $99 or less for the 510.

[greylar]

Well that settles it. I was saving for the 921 but guess i will have to jump to HD Tivo. There is no way I'm going to pay: $1000 for the receiver AND $10 / month for something that is clearly inferior..

I have been a supporter of Dish for their cheaper low end packages, better super station lineup, more networks (yea i'm one of those lucky ones that can get all of the networks), and no fee PVR.

But, not having name based recording now combined with the monthly fee, is too much

G

[JBKing]

'Grandfathered' as in the lifetime DishPlayer PTV (or is that PVR, ...maybe DVR?) that was only good for 3 years?


Something that isn't clear to me.... If I have a 508, it is 'grandfathered' in. What if I now buy an additional receiver, a 510? Am I still grandfathered, or will there be a fee for the 510? I bet I know the answer, but I believe it has been stated both ways, yes there will be a monthly charge for the 501 only, and no there won't be a monthly charge at all.

I'm sure there will be a charge for the 510.

The worst part of this is the per unit fee.

[spanishannouncetable]

Charlie is apparently comparing his DVR lineup to cable companies' offerings rather than the DirecTiVo.

The SciAtlanta 8000 DVRs Time Warner rents go for $8.95 extra per box in most places. In this light, what he's doing make sense as even the 501/508 software is reported to be much better than the SciAtlanta POS.

However, even the worst cable company doesn't make existing customers BUY their equipment, then turn around and charge them to use software developed by the company that sold them the hardware in the first place, AND then charge a seperate monthly fee FOR EACH BOX the software is on :nono2:

Customers would be much less upset if E* went the Directv route (low-cost subsidized hardware + monthly fee covering DVR service on the account) or the cable route (all rented hardware w/a monthly fee on each box). The current triple-dipping approach is just flat-out greedy IMHO.

[Chris Freeland]

Yes $299 is WAY TOO HIGH if they are subsidizing the costs and users are paying a monthly fee to use the unit.

It should be $99 or less for the 510.

Yes, I agree, see my post in another thread on 4 ways to fix the E* DVR fee plan.

[Jacob S]

I want to know how Dish can expect to get so so much more, multiple amounts more, out of their product and still charge a fee. That alone in itself is CRAZY NUTS!!! Then add to the fact that their receivers and software is unreliable at times? On top of that a charge per receiver? What the heck? So now you have to pay $4.99 for the additional outlet PLUS $4.99-$9.99 for the DVR fee? What the heck? $10-$15 per additional DVR is not going to get business Charlie. Come on now, think think think.

I am glad that most people I talk to do not know what PVR/PTV/DVR is or do not have much interest in it or my business would be hurting a heck of a lot worse than it is right now. I have only sold two Dishplayers when they first came out and for good reason too. I already lose enough business due to CSR's and their slander and lies and misinterpretation even talking the customers in shutting off their systems early and being mean and disrespectful.

[nuts4scuba]

Charlie is apparently comparing his DVR lineup to cable companies' offerings rather than the DirecTiVo.

The SciAtlanta 8000 DVRs Time Warner rents go for $8.95 extra per box in most places. In this light, what he's doing make sense as even the 501/508 software is reported to be much better than the SciAtlanta POS.

However, even the worst cable company doesn't make existing customers BUY their equipment, then turn around and charge them to use software developed by the company that sold them the hardware in the first place, AND then charge a seperate monthly fee FOR EACH BOX the software is on :nono2: This triple-dipping approach is just flat-out greedy IMHO.


He maybe comparing to cable companies, but you don't have to shell out $299.00 for the box with cable. You can pay the $8.95 for almost 3 years before you get to the $299 you have to pay for the receiver.

Compare E*'s Top 50 to D*'s Total Choice with a DVR/PVR you would pay 34.98 for Top 50 and 37.98 for Total Choice. You get music channels and better programming with Total Choice. It won't take a math whiz to fiqure out which is better.

[gcutler]

'Grandfathered' as in the lifetime DishPlayer PTV (or is that PVR, ...maybe DVR?) that was only good for 3 years?

Charlie is using the "Accounting" term for lifetime, where you depreciate a PC or something over 3 or 5 years and then it holds no value after that.

And I remember someone talking about a 4 year old reciever not being able to handle new enhancement, charlie insisted that the sub has gotten their value out of the reciever.

Does charlie think that there are no PCs or Cars or Stereos out that are older then 3-5 years. Now if he was dealing with the older subs who were more bleeding edge, then a hardware upgrade every 3 years was not out of the question. But his new average sub will probably want their recievers to last 10 years. At some point his new average sub and Charlie will have a major disagreement on value recieved over x many years...

[Mark Holtz]

When I get home this afternoon, I will be switching from CC to statement billing.

[Jacob S]

I thought I saw some information on the internet a while back about Rainbow's receivers in which one would allow PVR functionality and another had HD PVR functionality. It also said you could lease their receivers. Reminds me of Primestar all over again in which many liked because of the lease program they had and the service that came with it.

[RAD]

When I get home this afternoon, I will be switching from CC to statement billing.

I did that last week when this garbage floated to the top of the heap.

[DarrellP]

I cut off my CC last night as well. Getting ready to bail the E* ship.

[HTguy]

Yes $299 is WAY TOO HIGH if they are subsidizing the costs and users are paying a monthly fee to use the unit.

It should be $99 or less for the 510.Jim said that there will be changes in the PVR UPG Promo starting in Sept. If you think about where all this is going you can anticipate a DVR 510 UPG Promo for existing customers for nothing or next to nothing with a new 12mo committment & CCAP considering the fees.
I was saving for the 921 but guess i will have to jump to HD Tivo. There is no way I'm going to pay: $1000 for the receiver AND $10 / month for something that is clearly inferior.. Who told you you would have to pay $1000 and $10mo for the 921, greylar?If they rename the PVR921 to DVR921 (probable) and charge monthly fees (again, probable) they will lower the up-front cost. And if you want a PVR/DVR 921 will you stay or downgrade to T50?

BTW, I'm a little curious how you know it's "clearly inferior" since it's never been tested and there's no readily available HD DVR to which it could be compared.

[Peluso]

The Dish marketing department looks at things very differently than we do. They are focusing on new customers. If new customers look around and see that to buy a Tivo it costs them $10.00 a month for service, and that Dish is $5.00 for service when they order the package they want, the customer will perceive this as a good deal.

Also, someone who has never had a Tivo will be quite happy with the Dish DVR/PVR. I was absolutely euphoric with my Dish player, especially when you consider I was coming from a VCR.

To those of use who are existing customers, know the difference between Tivo features and Dish features, or who know the service used to be free are biased. We know we are now simply paying more for something than we used to. We still get to make the same choice as any other customer, we can weigh the options and decide for ourselves if it's worth the money for the service.

Ultimately I believe that the 921 will be out a considerable amount of time before the DirecTivo HD. This being the case I can't get mad at what they are asking. I can only decide if this service is worth what they are asking. For me, It is. For others, it apparently not.

[RAD]

Who told you you would have to pay $1000 and $10mo for the 921, greylar?If they rename the PVR921 to DVR921 (probable) and charge monthly fees (again, probable) they will lower the up-front cost. And if you want a PVR/DVR 921 will you stay or downgrade to T50?.

I don't see why Dish would change the $999 price of the 921 in addition to the $4.95 fee. Remember, us HD adopters have spend a bunch of money on things already, what's another $4.95 (using the same logic that Dish said on the Tech Chat why we'd have to pay for the SuperDish upgrade).

[Jacob S]

DirecTv only charges $4.99 for their PTV service and if they would give existing subs an offer on the 510 then they probably would not allow those that got a deal on the 501 or 508 to get that deal and they would get stuck into having to pay the fee when they want to upgrade.

The 921 WILL have these DVR charges according to what was written to Scott in an email.

[Lee L]

I don't see why Dish would change the $999 price of the 921 in addition to the $4.95 fee. Remember, us HD adopters have spend a bunch of money on things already, what's another $4.95 (using the same logic that Dish said on the Tech Chat why we'd have to pay for the SuperDish upgrade).

I agree, unless Charlie woke up one night after a dream of world domination through PVR fees, they had to have been considering this edven if it was not set in stone at the time of the last tech chat when they announced that the 921 will be $999.00.

Or maybe E* is run on a whim, it sure seems like they are rudderless with no real long term plan lately.

[DarrellP]

I dropped to the AT50 in anticipation of the HD Package coming out. Right now I pay $41/month with AT50/Locals/extra receiver and warranty. Add $10-$20 for the HD Package, another $5 for an extra receiver AND THE GOD DAMNED $9.95 DVR FEE and I am now paying as much as the AE package. This totally stinks, no matter how much money I am paying these B*A*T*S*T*U*R*D's on a monthly basis, they will still charge me $9.95 because I don't have the AE package.

Dish, up yours!

[Chris Freeland]

Remember this $299 charge for the 510 is full-retail and the announced $999 price for the coming 921 is full-retail. If you are a new sub the 510 is Free with a two-year commitment and 508 will still be available to current subs at the special $199 and sometimes $149 price without DVR fee's until the end of Augest, I suspect starting September 1 when the 508 deal for current subs ends, their will be a highly discounted deal for current subs to upgrade to the 510 with a reduced price with DVR fee for a one or two year commitment with cc-auto pay, the same I suspect will apply for the 921 too. If E* does this then the big mistake will still be the per-unit charge rather then per-account, I just hope E* recognizes this BIG blunder and rectifies this soon. Then if E* will just improve their DVR software, only time will tell ;) .

[Jacob S]

Thats why I say that they are going to get some people to pay one way or another. What will be said "If you can afford the HD Television you can afford the 921. If you can afford the 921 you can afford the SuperDish. If you can afford the SuperDish you can afford the DVR Fee......." When will it end? One can only afford so much and thats it.

[tampa8]

There is no question, it is the structuring of the fees, not the fee itself. I think it would be acceptable to charge a fee to Top 50 and Top 100 subscribers. But you cannot charge the fee for each DVR. I can think of several exceptions that can be made to get what they want in the end.

1. Top 150 plus any other programming/AEP no charge

2. Top 50 with two or more movie packages and HD programming - no charge (meant for those with a 921)

3. No charge on the 921 with Top 100, and two other progamming choices, one of which is the HD package.

These are just examples, but you get the point. I purposely have it skewed towards no fees if you purchase a 921 @ the $999 price.

[DarrellP]

I refuse to increase my programming with the exception of the HD Package. I don't care if they give away the 921 for $500 I will not get suckered into paying $10/month forever, it is ridiculous.

Does anyone really believe Dish will sell the 921 for anything less than $999? Look how long it took them to loosen up on the 501 after it's release.

It's easy for you guys with bottomless wallets to pay for the AE pack and then sit back and say "What's the BFD? I'm not getting charged" Well, I don't want any more programming than what I have except for the HD Package. The 921 is meant for HD, why should I have to buy every damn channel they offer just to watch 4 or 5 channels? It sucks.

[Chris Freeland]

I refuse to increase my programming with the exception of the HD Package. I don't care if they give away the 921 for $500 I will not get suckered into paying $10/month forever, it is ridiculous.

Does anyone really believe Dish will sell the 921 for anything less than $999? Look how long it took them to loosen up on the 501 after it's release.

It's easy for you guys with bottomless wallets to pay for the AE pack and then sit back and say "What's the BFD? I'm not getting charged" Well, I don't want any more programming than what I have except for the HD Package. The 921 is meant for HD, why should I have to buy every damn channel they offer just to watch 4 or 5 channels? It sucks.

As I said in an earlier post, I believe that $999 for the 921 will be the suggested retail price, however I believe their will be special promotions for both new subs and for upgrades for current subs at a reduced price with a 1 or 2 year contract. Remember when the SuperDish and the ATHD package do finally come out, E* will want to get as many ATHD subs as possible, what better way to do this but to offer a Special to commit you for a year or two and make you think you are getting a bargain because you payed several hundred dollars less then the suggested retail price of $999?

[Soycrema]

Charlie, Dishnetwork, if you're monitoring this threat I'mm telling you right now: CHARGE FOR DVR, PVR......whatever and YOU WILL LOOSE ME AS A CUSTOMER!!!!!!!!!! THIS IS JUST RIDICULOUS!!!! I HAD PLANS TO BUY THE 921 BUT TO HELL WITH THAT, LOOKS LIKE DIRECT TV IS COMING MY WAY!! :mad:

[boba]

I switched to Directv Sunday, my $149 PVR508 arrived today(UPS delivered it to the wrong address). I activated it, dropped my other 4 receivers downgraded to AT-50 only. I am keeping at least 1 receiver active I've got 12 Club Dish certificates coming in monthly so it is the only way I can collect my credits. It's the only way I can figure to get even with Charlie, keep using up the credits instead of giving them to him by cancelling outright.

[Jacob S]

See, Dish is screwing up on other people as well delivering to wrong addresses. Even if you call in and tell them over and over they still get it wrong.

Dish is trying to get more money out of you one way or another, they want you there by air or by sea, by car or by plane, they want you at a certain pricepoint and determined on throwing so many things at you until you get there. If everyone was a higher priority customer then who would get priority then? Those that used to pay $50 or $60 per month customer would be not be considered a higher priority anymore of any greater importance.

[Bob Haller]

sent this to sky this morning. I hope others will do something similiar. A bit of media attention may get them to come to their senses.

Send your mail to!!! editor@skyreport.com.



You have a lot of avid readers out here. Perhaps theres a story for you here.

Dish is going to charge for new DVRs. a monthly fee per receiver.

This is fine for new subs who essentially get their box for free. But by doing this long term existing subs get screwed. We will be forced to pay full retail PLUS the fee Plus in all honesty dishes PVRs arent as stable as Directs, lack features like name based recordings, and have ongoing problems with software upgrades causing glitches.

Honestly they release half designed buggy software and have ther subscribers beta test the units.

The 721 their top of the line box was promised to provide internet access which was never made available. This box is now out of production and people are disappointed.

Perhaps you could look into this. Please see these discussions as to why were upset. Apparently this is falling on deaf ears at diish. They think everything is OK.

DBSTalk.COM / SatelliteTalk.COM - Official Dish DVR-510 Information from Dish DBSTalk.COM / SatelliteTalk.COM - DVR 510 announced and monthly fee3! DBSForums Discussion Forums: DISH Network announces DVR fees

Thanks much for your time Bob Haller

__________________

[Inaba]

Well, I do think these fees are ridiculous. One of the primary reasons I went with Dish instead of DTV was because of the no-PVR fee.

While I understand I will be grandfathered in with my 721, when it comes time to upgrade, I may return to cable, as my bill will be about the same. Right now, with the Top 50, my bill is about $30/mo w/ my extra receiver (which I will probably cancle next year, so my price will drop to $25/mo) -- that's what I'm willing to pay. If I'm totally forced by the market to pay more, such as with cable, or DTV - I will go with cable.

Currently, the lack of features and bugginess of the software on the 721 are acceptable (in a damned if you do, damned if you don't sort of way) because of the low cost of my subscription. If the sub price raises to that of DTV or Cable, there's no point in putting up with crappy software... might as well roll with the big boys and pony up the big $$ for stable/feature rich equipment if you're going to have to pay anyway.

I'm all for supporting the underdog and tolerating less than perfect equipment/service... but when the underdog starts thinking they are a big dog (and charging accordingly) and they don't offer what the big dogs do... the underdog can piss up a lamp post.

[A former 921 customer]

I WAS waiting for the 921. Now dish has made my discission easier. I will be switching to direct tv as soon as my contract is up ( i bought a 508, 6 mo ago with a contract).. I've been a dish network customer since 1996!!! Yes, I as one of the people that bought in early. So ends my 7yrs.. I talked so many friends and people into getting dish, no more.. Recently my parents where on cable and thinking of getting a TIVO, but I talked them into a 508 cause the 508 doesn't involve any monthly fees. I know the 508 will continue not to have a fee in the near future, but come on, its just a matter of time. Nothing is sacred with Dish..

One peeved customer, soon to be former..

[Chris Freeland]

I WAS waiting for the 921. Now dish has made my discission easier. I will be switching to direct tv as soon as my contract is up ( i bought a 508, 6 mo ago with a contract).. I've been a dish network customer since 1996!!! Yes, I as one of the people that bought in early. So ends my 7yrs.. I talked so many friends and people into getting dish, no more.. Recently my parents where on cable and thinking of getting a TIVO, but I talked them into a 508 cause the 508 doesn't involve any monthly fees. I know the 508 will continue not to have a fee in the near future, but come on, its just a matter of time. Nothing is sacred with Dish..

One peeved customer, soon to be former..

So, switch when and if ( which I doubt it will ever happen)
E* starts charging the DVR fee on the 508, if you switch to the D*DVRw/TIVO you will pay this fee, sure you will get a few more features and posibly more stable software, but you will be paying a DVR FEE, while if you stay with your 508 it will continue to be FREE for the foreseeable future. People here are way over reacting to something that will not effect most of us directly and has already ben pointed out many times by me and some others here, but many do not seam to be comprehending, this deal means new subs will get their DVR510 hardware for FREE and their will be a highly discounted new deal for us current subs to upgrade come September, but I guess it is easier for some here to be close minded and stomp around mad over this then to relax and see how things shake out over the next month or two. :shrug:

[Mark Holtz]

Except that I will have a two-tuner DVR for the price that Dish charges for a single-tuner DVR.

[Chris Freeland]

Except that I will have a two-tuner DVR for the price that Dish charges for a single-tuner DVR.

Can a new sub get a D*DVR for FREE? I don't think so. We do not yet know what deals may be available for the 522, which will not only have 2-tuners but will also have 2-outputs too, so one can have two tv's accessing this DVR, accessing it's hard-drive and tuners independently without a 2nd receiver mirror fee, does D* have any DVR's in the pipeline that can do this? Not that I know of. All I am saying is that their is no need for all of us getting all upset when we do not yet know all of the facts yet.

[SParker]

I am going to wait to see if this fee comes to fruition. If it does i am sure Direct will have some killer offers for Dish Network customers.

[Jacob S]

The 522 may be the solution to the extra charges in that the $4.99 you would save on the additional outlet fee would make up for the DVR fee and then not having to buy two DVR's would ultimately make it cheaper than purchasing two of them seperately plus having a larger hard drive, a UHF remote that turns 200 feet away, and especially if they get the Linux software onto that receiver that they have on the 721, it may not be so bad on that receiver after all. As long as they do not charge that much extra for this receiver than the 510 it may be the way to go. If it would cost $399 then that would be an average of about $200 per tuner vs. having to pay $300 for each receiver like you have to pay now.

[508 junkie]

With the intro of the 510 how long are 508's going to be around and are they still 299.00. Dont want cc auto pay or a 12 month comitt so i never took up the 149.00 deal.

[Jacob S]

Not all customers have to take the cc auto pay 12 month commitment for the 501/508 deal. Some can even get two of these with no cc auto pay or commitment. I wonder what Dish will do if you do not activate the two 508's when you got the no commitment or no cc auto pay deal but choose to sell them instead?

[508 junkie]

Not all customers have to take the cc auto pay 12 month commitment for the 501/508 deal. Some can even get two of these with no cc auto pay or commitment. I wonder what Dish will do if you do not activate the two 508's when you got the no commitment or no cc auto pay deal but choose to sell them instead?

This is very interesting. How can I take advantage? Every time I call dish net they say I have to auto pay or do the 12 month commitment. Aren’t the two hand in hand?

[508 junkie]

Dish depot has the 508 at 279.00 + s&h In light of the fees for the 510 that seems like too much. Funny when I bought my 508 299.00 seemed like a bargain at the time. now I am ready to expand and i feel like I am in a corner.

[Jacob S]

It will seem like more of a bargain now that they are going to charge DVR fees on the new receivers and have the hardware at the same cost. The savings will really add up when you get multiple DVR's since Dish has decided to charge per DVR receiver. This is why I think people will get almost as much if not more out of the used 501, 508, 721 and even more out of the new ones. Being used should not be too much of a factor since you can get the $1.99 warranty per month. Its a wonder they dont try to charge you that per receiver as well like they are trying to do with the DVR fees. Better not give them any ideas though.

[34gfgh]

So when is this puppy being released? Looking at the thread, I'm gessing Aug 2002?

[Jacob S]

2002? Dont you mean 2003?

[SParker]

Bob H,

Any response from Sky?

[jeffwtux]

So, switch when and if ( which I doubt it will ever happen)
E* starts charging the DVR fee on the 508, if you switch to the D*DVRw/TIVO you will pay this fee, sure you will get a few more features and posibly more stable software, but you will be paying a DVR FEE, while if you stay with your 508 it will continue to be FREE for the foreseeable future. People here are way over reacting to something that will not effect most of us directly and has already ben pointed out many times by me and some others here, but many do not seam to be comprehending, this deal means new subs will get their DVR510 hardware for FREE and their will be a highly discounted new deal for us current subs to upgrade come September, but I guess it is easier for some here to be close minded and stomp around mad over this then to relax and see how things shake out over the next month or two. :shrug:


Hmm, I agree with most of what you are saying with the exception of one group of complaints: the people who have the 6000 and have been waiting to upgrade directly to the 921. These people have a lot to be pissed off about. First they were told that the only extra equipment they needed to get to receive all of the HD programming was the 8PSK. Then they were told they were going to to have to buy the SuperDish, now they are told that after they fork over the $999 fo the 921 and the $149 or whatever for the SuperDish that they will be slapped with the $4.99 monthly fees unless the subscribe to AEP in addition to ATHD after they have already been paying $8/month for DiscHD. These people were told that the $999 price would have no monthly fees. They have been lied to 2 times now and have deserve to be mad as hell.

[Jacob S]

This is why I recommend to my customers that do not want to spend a lot of money to wait and not spend too much just yet because of all the changes being made and for the price to drop as well as waiting for the standards to become more common.

[Mark Holtz]

It has been decided.

Unless something changes in the next 24 hours, I'm ordering from OrbitSat a DirecTivo, two Phillips receivers, and a Triple LNB dish. Cost: Aproximately $250, of which my mom will pay half. (I pulled the guilt trip saying that I had been paying for her two additional receivers).

I will miss the supers a little, but only because of Angel.

[tm22721]

DishDepot will have a lot of cancelled 921 pre-orders if there really is a PVR fee. After all, the unit will cost $900-1000, and the PVR fee adds an additonal $1200 at current interest rates. And they've already broken the promised June then August delivery date.

And we will need a Superdish to get all of the HD programming.

How many 921 suckers are still out there ?

[Chris Freeland]

Hmm, I agree with most of what you are saying with the exception of one group of complaints: the people who have the 6000 and have been waiting to upgrade directly to the 921. These people have a lot to be pissed off about. First they were told that the only extra equipment they needed to get to receive all of the HD programming was the 8PSK. Then they were told they were going to to have to buy the SuperDish, now they are told that after they fork over the $999 fo the 921 and the $149 or whatever for the SuperDish that they will be slapped with the $4.99 monthly fees unless the subscribe to AEP in addition to ATHD after they have already been paying $8/month for DiscHD. These people were told that the $999 price would have no monthly fees. They have been lied to 2 times now and have deserve to be mad as hell.

I agree with you that the HD people have some leginament complaints and concerns, however I suspect their will be some good deals for those folks too, but who knows? I suspect many, and yes I know not all of the HD subs have the AEP package and will not pay a DVR fee, perhaps E* will see fit to waive the PVR fee for those who get both AT150 and ATHD, or offer some sort of Lifetime PVR subscription offer, but who knows? As usual the first ones to purchase the 921 may be the only ones that pay the full $999 retail price, but once again who knows?

[Deuce]

Actually the people who don't want to get the 921 can just get the 811 budled with the superdish and the new Echostar HD monitor for under $1500. Just in case you don't know, the 811 is an open tv version of 6000 with 8VSB and 8PSK already installed, with two RCA inputs, not only that but all outputs are live at the same time, with a very nice and nifty 8.0 UHF Pro remote....

[Bob Haller]

Hi Def and NO PVR? Sure that will be real popular NOT!

[Jacob S]

Is the UHF 8.0 the remote control that the 322 and 522 is going to have in which will turn 200 feet?

Can a computer be used with the same software and hardware to record HD off of a satellite receiver as is used for the non HD content? If so one could buy a computer with that ability or laptop for that price I would think if they shopped around or have one built for them like that.

[HTguy]

It has been decided.

Unless something changes in the next 24 hours, I'm ordering from OrbitSat a DirecTivo, two Phillips receivers, and a Triple LNB dish. Cost: Aproximately $250, of which my mom will pay half. (I pulled the guilt trip saying that I had been paying for her two additional receivers).

I will miss the supers a little, but only because of Angel.You ought to at least wait for the chat on 8/11. You're over-reacting to partial info that wasn't meant for you. Why don't you at least hear the deal from C & J before you get your titties in the wringer?

When you find out their actual plans for the upcoming DVRs you'll probably realize there was nothing to get in an uproar about.

:icon_dumm

[Jacob S]

I think most hear are waiting to see what kind of ''special deals'' they are coming out with before switching over to another service or going with an alternative.

[IndyMichael]

My one year commitment to Dish ends in December, as will my business with them, if they implement a DVR monthly fee.