How do I reuse 2nd DTV cable

[Smitty1960]

I currently have 11 drops with 2 RG6U "outlets" each. They're not all in use, I'm just trying to future-proof my home. I have 2 cables to each of my dual-tuner receivers but want to expand my system to incorporate basic cable (don't ask). So to reuse DTV's 2nd cable at the "outlet" I would require 2(?) SWM8 units? Also, the now single DTV cable is split behind the receiver using a diplexer right?

[jdspencer]

Do you have an OTA antenna that you are diplexing?

How many tuners do you need? Each DVR has 2.

I'd use the extra connection for OTA or the basic cable thus eliminating the need for a diplexer.

[bobnielsen]

You say they are not all in use. If you have 8 or fewer tuners connected you will only need one SWM8 (you could still run the cables to more locations and terminate those which are not in use). The single cable connects to just one of the inputs of the receiver and is split internally.

[Smitty1960]

I think I must be misunderstanding what a diplexer is for. I thought that the now single cable is split again so that two cables are connected to the back of the dual-tuner receiver as it was before. The 2nd cable that originally was going to the same receiver would be used for cable (or possibly an OTA antenna). What I'm trying to do is plan my wiring closet home run's structured wiring to future-proof the home.

[PokerJoker]

What Bob said. A SWM connection does not use any kind of diplexing or splitting at the receiver end. The cable goes directly into the #1 satellite input. The receiver takes care of any required splitting, internally.

How many SWM boxes you need depends on how many DirecTV tuners you need to feed. Note that "tuners" is not the same as "boxes". A DVR counts as TWO tuners. A plain receiver counts as ONE. Each SWM-8 supports a total of EIGHT. (So, as an extreme example, if someday you end up with 11 DVRs, thats 22 tuners and you would need four SWM8's. Or two of the upcoming SWM16s. Or one of the upcoming SWM32s.)

And of course all your receivers need to be SWM-compatible. Not all D* units are. Most recent models qualify.

Once SWM is in, then using the other cables for cable TV is easy, just requiring some combination of amps/splitters to feed all the cables. In both cases (SWM and cable TV) you should terminate all unused outputs with 75 ohm terminator caps.

Hope this helps.

Keith

[jdspencer]

A diplexer is used to combine OTA with a sat signal and then split again at the receiver for use with a TV tuner.

With the SWM you are thinking about, you don't need to split the cable in order to use both tuners on a SWM capable DVR.

What I'd do is home run your current cables (if not already) and install the SWM8 module there.

[David MacLeod]

until whole deca/cat5 issue for mrv solidified I would not diplex anything.

[Smitty1960]

What Bob said. A SWM connection does not use any kind of diplexing or splitting at the receiver end. The cable goes directly into the #1 satellite input. The receiver takes care of any required splitting, internally.

How many SWM boxes you need depends on how many DirecTV tuners you need to feed. Note that "tuners" is not the same as "boxes". A DVR counts as TWO tuners. A plain receiver counts as ONE. Each SWM-8 supports a total of EIGHT. (So, as an extreme example, if someday you end up with 11 DVRs, thats 22 tuners and you would need four SWM8's. Or two of the upcoming SWM16s. Or one of the upcoming SWM32s.)

And of course all your receivers need to be SWM-compatible. Not all D* units are. Most recent models qualify.

Once SWM is in, then using the other cables for cable TV is easy, just requiring some combination of amps/splitters to feed all the cables. In both cases (SWM and cable TV) you should terminate all unused outputs with 75 ohm terminator caps.

Hope this helps.

Keith

Thanks Keith, but I'm still a little confused. If I understand it, each SWM8 will service 8 TUNERS, so if I have a single cable coming out of the wall plate, I'll still need TWO cables plugging into the back of the Receiver/DVR because of the TWO TUNERS--so won't I still need to add a splitter/diplexer behind the receiver/DVR? Although I don't envision all 11 drops to be used simultaneously, and it's unlikely that all 11 drops will include a dual-tuner DVR, I expect some combination of lets say 5 drops in use at any one time with as many as 3 of them being dual-tuner DVRs. So correct me if I'm wrong, but 2 SWM8s should suffice for my purposes.

I really like the ability to add an OTA antenna into the system by simply tying into one of the SWM8's input terminals. But I can't envision how I'll tie in the cable signal into the system without using separate set-top boxes (but that's another project). The whole idea is to make my structured cable homerun as flexible as possible and try to reduce the need to run additional cables in the near future. The Cat6 and Cat5e portion is already figured out, I'm just a little sticky on the video signal distribution portion of the project.

[rudeney]

Thanks Keith, but I'm still a little confused. If I understand it, each SWM8 will service 8 TUNERS, so if I have a single cable coming out of the wall plate, I'll still need TWO cables plugging into the back of the Receiver/DVR because of the TWO TUNERS--so won't I still need to add a splitter/diplexer behind the receiver/DVR?

No, all SWM-capable DVR"s have internal splitters, so only one coax feed is needed from the SWM to the "Tuner 1" input on the DVR.

Although I don't envision all 11 drops to be used simultaneously, and it's unlikely that all 11 drops will include a dual-tuner DVR, I expect some combination of lets say 5 drops in use at any one time with as many as 3 of them being dual-tuner DVRs. So correct me if I'm wrong, but 2 SWM8s should suffice for my purposes.

How many total tuners do you have? remember that DVR's count as two. As long as your total number of tuners does not exceed 8, then you can use one SWM module.

I really like the ability to add an OTA antenna into the system by simply tying into one of the SWM8's input terminals. But I can't envision how I'll tie in the cable signal into the system without using separate set-top boxes (but that's another project). The whole idea is to make my structured cable homerun as flexible as possible and try to reduce the need to run additional cables in the near future. The Cat6 and Cat5e portion is already figured out, I'm just a little sticky on the video signal distribution portion of the project.

If you aren't concerned about using DECA or any other future enhancements that might need the bandwidth, you could diplex OTA onto the SWM circuit. I would definitely not diplex CATV onto the SWM as it can carry frequency ranges that might interfere (i.e. Internet, VOIP, etc.)

[PokerJoker]

Thanks Keith, but I'm still a little confused. If I understand it, each SWM8 will service 8 TUNERS, so if I have a single cable coming out of the wall plate, I'll still need TWO cables plugging into the back of the Receiver/DVR because of the TWO TUNERS--so won't I still need to add a splitter/diplexer behind the receiver/DVR? Although I don't envision all 11 drops to be used simultaneously, and it's unlikely that all 11 drops will include a dual-tuner DVR, I expect some combination of lets say 5 drops in use at any one time with as many as 3 of them being dual-tuner DVRs. So correct me if I'm wrong, but 2 SWM8s should suffice for my purposes.

I really like the ability to add an OTA antenna into the system by simply tying into one of the SWM8's input terminals. But I can't envision how I'll tie in the cable signal into the system without using separate set-top boxes (but that's another project). The whole idea is to make my structured cable homerun as flexible as possible and try to reduce the need to run additional cables in the near future. The Cat6 and Cat5e portion is already figured out, I'm just a little sticky on the video signal distribution portion of the project.

What Rudeney said is correct. The HR2x DVRs only need ONE cable connected, to feed BOTH tuners, when using SWM. NO splitters or other hardware needed. The cable literally goes directly from the wall plate/drop to the #1 satellite input on the box.

It almost sounds like you intend to move receivers around the house from time to time? An issue with multiple SWM-8 setups is that any one SWM-8 can only feed eight tuners at a time. If you have two (or more) SWM-8s, yes, you can feed 16 (or more) tuners, but the actual physical connections and receiver deployment have to be arranged such that no more than 8 tuners are ever fed from any individual SWM-8. So if you, for example, wire the house drops so that, lets say, 6 of them were connected (via a standard SWM splitter) to one SWM-8, that would work fine until the moment you attach more than eight tuners' worth of receivers to any combination of those 6 drops. (No physical damage will occur if you violate this, you will just start to see 771 errors.) Remember that DVRs count as two tuners.

Another way of saying this is that you can't combine multiple SWM-8 outputs into one big happy multi-drop network, as you would with OTA or cable TV. You have to "partition" or "segment" the house drops so that some of them are only fed by one SWM, and some are only fed by the other SWM. Then you have to make sure that no more than 8 tuners are connected on either portion at any one time.

Naturally this is TONS easier to arrange if your drop cables are all individually home-run to a central location. I hope that is the case with you.

Finally, while it is possible to diplex OTA signals (from an antenna) onto the SWM cabling, and there is even an input for that purpose on each SWM-8, doing so is not supported by DirecTV, might not work all that well, and will interfere with DirecTV's new DECA coax-based networking system, should you ever want to use it. You definitely don't want to diplex Cable TV signals onto the SWM cabling, since some cable channels would probably be lost, and interference with the SWM signal could occur.

I hope this clears things up for you.

Keith

[Smitty1960]

Thanks everybody, that clears up things a bit. I DO intend to build in flexibility to the system and everything does combine at a single location using a star topography. This is partly why I moved my entire setup from the garage (at one end of the house) to the utility area behind the kitchen (more centrally located).

Is there a way to attach a powerpoint diagram to this forum? I'd love to upload it when I get the plans finalize, so you folks can give it the once over and help me double check for mistakes?

[rudeney]

You can attach a PowerPoint, but that would require people to have PP or at least the free viewer installed to look at it. Instead, you might consider attaching it as a PDF or even a JPEG image.