811 and HDTV output (does the receiver keep the native format)

[walendvay]

Does anyone know if the 811 will keep the native format of the picture? For example, when I turn to Discovery, will the output be 1080i and when I turn to ESPN, will the output be 720p and when I turn to CNN, will the output be 480p?

I hate having to go into the setup menu on the 6000 to change from 1080i and 720p

The Sony SAT-HD200 allows you to view the incoming signal in the native format and it also allows you to convert any/all signals to 480p/720p/1080i.

Also, does the 811 change the size of the menus when you change from 1080i to 720p? I notice that my 6000 does this and it is annoying.

[rcbridge]

Does your display take the 720p, if not it will be up-converted, regardless of what the box does your display will limit your options.

[HTguy]

You set the receiver to output the native resolution of your display. One time. That's it.

From then on it scales the video to match your display as needed.

For example, if you have a 1080i CRT device when you are on ABC or ESPN it converts the 720p signal to 1080i.

If you have a DLP, LCD or Plasma display it converts the 1080i (everything except ABC & ESPN) signals to 720p.

The 480i & 480p signals are also upscaled to the output you set it for to match your display.

[walendvay]

that's lame. I wish they could have their high end HDTV receiver operate like their competition.

My receiver has the ability to view 720p, 1080i, and 480p in their native format.

However, the two posts before me, do you honestly know the specs of the 811 or are you speculating?

[rcbridge]

Remember the receiver is not the problem if your display will not handle the 720p you can use any receiver made and you will have the same effect!!

[walendvay]

who said there was a problem? I am asking a simple question and you are debating my receiver.

for your reading pleasure, go look at the specs for a Toshiba 51H83. Also, look at the specs for the Sony SAT-HD200 and you will see what I am talking about.

sheesh. ask a question and get a technical debate about a different subject.

[dmodemd]

Yeah, this is a good question and clearly noone knows the answer since they haven't actually USED an 811. Someone from Dish would have to answer or we wait.

[klang]

From the Toshiba website:
'CrystalScan HDSC™ upconverts all video signals (including 480i/p) to 1080i HD. This results in a significant
reduction in jagged-line artifacts which produces a smoother, more natural image. Selectable 540p, for users who
want to display a progressive scan image from a progressive scan source, is available via the on-screen menu'.

It doesn't appear the set will display a 720p signal without converting to 1080i. So why is it so important for the sat receiver to pass through 720p?

[rcbridge]

One last attempt to answer your original question, I believe you are asking if it will automatically detect and select the proper output 720p,1080i or 480p/i, looking at the data sheets it doesn't specify that, so we don't know the answer to that one. Most receivers will probably not do that because it doesn't know what your display is. I also looked up your Toshiba television and it will not pass the 720p, 1080i 0r 480p/i only.
it will up-convert to 1080i.

[John Kotches]

I am going off of recollection here, but I believe that Echostar reps at CEDIA indicated that it would not output "Native Res", but rather either 720p or 1080i for HD.

I could be incorrect, as that was some time ago.

Regards,

[greylar]

Does anyone know if the 811 will keep the native format of the picture? For example, when I turn to Discovery, will the output be 1080i and when I turn to ESPN, will the output be 720p and when I turn to CNN, will the output be 480p?



I guess my question is how would that work? Would you have to change inputs on the TV every time you changed channels? And what happens if my tv (like most) supports only 1080 or 720. Would that mean I just couldn't get that channel? That would sure be a pain in the butt.

G

[rcbridge]

greylar

To answer your question you would not need to change inputs for different channels, if the signal is 1080i or 720p (ESPN,ABC), when your television is in the HD mode via component inputs it will automatically up-convert all signals to 1080i.
If you are watching a dvd using a progressive scan player it will accept and pass the 480p.

[HTguy]

It just isn't all that complicated.

You should know the native resolution of your display. You set the 811 to put out that format. That's all there is to it.

Evidently the Toshiba downconverts 1080i to 540p (I don't know the model personally) but the E* STBs are designed to output either 1080i or 720p.

I'm very familiar with the SONY SAT-HD models, too. Again, the idea is to set it up for the display. Why would you want the STB to scale the video and then have your display rescale it again?????

Just set the box to match your display, not the program.

[John Kotches]

HTGuy,

The one flaw with your approach is if the scaling engine in 811 (used when displaying 720p on 1080i displays or 1080i on 720p displays, and all 480i/p content) is worse than the display device this wouldn't be the optimum solution.

Since most material isn't going to be native to the display, this is a serious concern for those trying to eke out the best performance they can get.

Regards,

[HTguy]

Yes, I know that scaling devices vary in quality from display to display and device to device.

For example, the DRC upscaler in the Sony set I use is superior to the digital line doublers ("deinterlacers") in most "progressive output" DVD players. So I let the Sony upconvert the DVD I currently have connected to it. But I'm about to put in a Denon DVD-2900 which has a superior upconverter so I will set it to the "progessive" mode and connect it to the Y Pr Pb component video inputs that the 6000 goes into (switched by the pre-pro).

But I certainly can not tell any difference between 720p content coming out of my 6000 as 1080i into my 1080i display or switching the 6000 to output 720p & letting the Sony do the conversion.

Neither can I or my friend, who has a Sony SAT-HD200 connected to a 720p DLP display, discern any difference on his system.

YMMV, and if you think you can, go ahead & switch the video output every time you change channels from one version to the other.

I think that 99% of HD viewers are not going to bother & will not be dis-satisfied in the least.

But if you have a really high-end display and system you ought to consider the Farouja "Native-Rate" devices which are customized to the users particular device and take care of rescaling every source in the best possible manner. They run around $5K.

[John Kotches]

HTGUy,

I'll be using an alternative to the Faroudja's once they hit the market.

Regards,