The BEST D*TV Retailer?

[cyberized]

I do believe that after 6+ years with Charlie - I am jumping ship to DirecTV, I have been googeling to find ALL the Retailers I can find, and from doing that and reading here; I am down basically to two: EXpert OR Rapid.
Rapid at this time is $10 cheaper and that is enticing - BUT - the reason I post here is to ask those who have dealt with either or both - what were your experiences - good, bad, indifferent?
My main concern is the "Standard Install" which is included in the deal - I don't want some guy trying to tell me that DISH mounted everything all wrong and we must charge you ------- and re-do everything. Should be basically a swap out - NO hassle or extra charges. Wish I knew would be coming out here in my area so I could talk to them ahead of time about this - don't want any rip off hassles - as in the past.

TKS Michael

[spanishannouncetable]

www.valueelectronics.com

Rave reviews of their first-rate customer service are scattered all over the www.tivocommunity.com forums

[SlicerMDM]

I used Expert several weeks ago and while things didn't go as planned, overall I was satisfied.

From what I've learned, "Free Standard Install" totally depends on the installer and generally you don't know much about them until they're at your home.

I switched from E* Dish 500 to D* Triple LNB with 1 Tivo and 1 Std receiver. All wiring inside my home (dual coax from the dish) was already there so I figured this would be a fairly simple install -- just swapping out the dish and he's done. I actually called Expert and tried to verify whether my situation would really be free since it seemed rather simple to me. Of course, they couldn't say for sure but, I did find out that the installer "could" charge for a "pole mount". Standard Installation includes a "house mount", not a pole mount, even though a house mount is obviously much more work. They even verified that if I were to remove the pole from my roof there would definately be no charge for that. But, there may be a charge if I left it the way it was. Dumb.

My install was scheduled for "am" (morning) and the installer called on the install day (mid - late morning) to confirm a "pm" installation. I specifically told him "am" so I could possibly get to work just after lunch and not miss the whole day. Anyway, I resigned to the fact I would just take the whole day off and get this over with. He ended up showing up rather late, just before dark. Even still he managed to get the dish setup and aligned, and he did have to run an extra line from the dish to a splitter on the side of my house (needed 3 lines, instead of the 2 that Dish 500 had).

Other than the am/pm mess up and late arrival, the installer was pretty cool. He mentioned a couple times he normally would charge $50 for a 2-story roof mount but charged nothing because he was late (was that a hint?). He also did a pretty clean job running the extra wire to the box on the side of my house.

I helped him get some of the wire in position, determine signal strength (he didn't have a meter he could just look at from the dish??, strange), held a flashlight for him to see in the dark for a good portion of it, and had already setup all the connections to the boxes inside our house before he arrived.

Overall, it worked out OK for both of us.. I really got a free install and there were issues that would've been a pain for him to do on his own.

What does this mean? Mine turned out OK, your mileage may vary... Good Luck!

BTW, I was a longtime supporter of E* also. Couldn't wait to give them lots of cash for their new services (SuperDish, 921, HD programming, Other DVRs...) I'm REALLY glad I switched. TIVO ROCKS. The std receiver rocks. And it appears lots of good things are coming to D* in 2004. I guess Murdoch will get all my cash and not Charlie.

[tivosmart]

Directv doesn't use it's own installers as opposed to Dish, who has a staff of installers. All DTV installer are local businesses hired by the DTV retailers and DTV itself to do the install.

Installer is a gamble. You could get a good one or a horrible one like I did, and this is the same for any DTV retailer or if you buy directly from DTV itself.

Advice: Look for good retailers that will follow up with the Installers if you have any problem.

I used Expert Satellite, and although my installer was horrible and didn't get the job done, they resolved my issue wonderfully and fast, which is one of the reasons I now recommend them.

I heard horror stories about OrbitSat customer support, but I guess this is prone to interpretation.

At TivoCommunity they praise value electronics, but this is also prone to interpretation since this retailer is a sponsor of that forum, so most of the senior members will of course praise it so the forum and the sponsoring $$ keeps going. And one thing I hate about TivoCommunity is their policy to filter out URLs of some retailers, while they leave the value electronics URLs intact, this is deception to say the least.

[jm9]

I had D* installed yesterday, 1 tivo, 2 basic and a phase III dish. The installer removed my DIsh 500 and mounted the Phase III on the same mast, ran one more wire into junction area.

I bought my system from Expert, They used Installs Inc in my area. This is a national install company that does work with Circuit City and Best Buy to name a few. google install inc and you sohuld find them.

My install was schedule from 8-12 in the morning, he showed up at 2:45. He did call me at 10:00 saying he would be late and would be at my house from 1:00 - 2:00. He was a nice guy, did not do anything extra. I think you get what you pay for, free means you don't get very much. My dish installers were better, they were also a local company.

I would bet that the same installer will get offered the job don't matter who you buy your equipment from. My guy said he wished all installs were as easy as mine. So swapping dishes and running run extra line thru my garage attic was better than starting from scratch.

[cyberized]

That's all they have to do for me - is remove my DISH 500 from it's roof bracket thing - put in the 3 LNB Dish - and run an extra line into my house - disconnect my DVR508 and connect up one DTIVO unit - and I guess they then call D*TV to get you up and running - right?
Hope I have GOOD luck like you when I do it.

TKS Michael

[Robert Zohn]

Look for SBCA Certified satellite technicians to ensure the highest quality installation available. Large Nationwide contractors give the jobs to other sub-contractors that may not be Certified technicians.

SBCA Certificated satellite technicians have gone to the industries special school for technical training and have passed a rigorous test. The schooling sets quality and technical standard which is essential for professional, reliable installations.

[jm9]

PM or email tivosmart and see what he can offer with expert.

Do you have two wires running to the 508 now? I ran two wires to four locations in my house before I finished my basement. You will want both tuners active.

I don't think you will have any problems with the install, It would be more expensive for the installer to put the dish in a new location and run 4 wires into the house, not to mention the time savings.

I do think installers get the brunt of the problems, they are the only person you see, they did not sell you the equipment or schedule your install. If they are late, like mine was, it probably was not their fault. Treat them with respect and you will get better results. I preped all my tv's, attic and distribution center before he showed up.

[spanishannouncetable]

...At TivoCommunity they praise value electronics, but this is also prone to interpretation since this retailer is a sponsor of that forum, so most of the senior members will of course praise it so the forum and the sponsoring $$ keeps going. And one thing I hate about TivoCommunity is their policy to filter out URLs of some retailers, while they leave the value electronics URLs intact, this is deception to say the least.

TiVocommunity members were singing Value Electronics praises for a while before they ever started sponsoring/advertising on the forums. Now, since they are an official sponsor, calling the toll-free number when placing an order and mentioning you're a tivocommunity member will you get an additional discount not mentioned on Value Electronics main page. Now THAT's a good business practice :up:

There is nothing deceptive about the url-blocking policy. Retailers who (deservedly) get their urls blocked are the sort retailers who give internet dealers a bad rep. The infamously rude Karl comes to mind :nono:

[Mark Lamutt]

At TivoCommunity they praise value electronics, but this is also prone to interpretation since this retailer is a sponsor of that forum, so most of the senior members will of course praise it so the forum and the sponsoring $$ keeps going. And one thing I hate about TivoCommunity is their policy to filter out URLs of some retailers, while they leave the value electronics URLs intact, this is deception to say the least.

This wouldn't be because other retailers build their customer base with referral links while Value Electronics doesn't?

[tivosmart]

This wouldn't be because other retailers build their customer base with referral links while Value Electronics doesn't?
I agree with both points, BUT:

1) There are easy ways to know what URLs contain referrals and those who don't, at TivoCommunity they filter out the retailer NAME, instead of the referral keywords

2) There are several VERY REPUTABLE retailers that have referral programs and this doesn't make them less deserving to be recommended than Value Electronics. Sometimes folks that don't have squat to do with referrals want to recommend one of these retailer because they had a good experience and, surprise surprise, they see their URLs filtered out after they post...

3) Every time someone calls Value Electronics and says they came from TivoCommunity I'm sure the forum gets a kick back. I even believe the discount is possible because the forum shares it's referral money with the members when they are buying, so this is exactly the same, just a referral, in this case a more selective referral program, but it also involves money exactly the same as in the other programs.

Now, I'm not condemning TC because they are making sponsoring and referral money, I just think that to deserve the label "forum" they should change their filtering policies a bit. They can still filter out referrals and have their rules without penalizing good retailers.

Just my 2 cents...

[Robert Zohn]

I agree with both points, BUT:

1) There are easy ways to know what URLs contain referrals and those who don't, at TivoCommunity they filter out the retailer NAME, instead of the referral keywords

2) There are several VERY REPUTABLE retailers that have referral programs and this doesn't make them less deserving to be recommended than Value Electronics. Sometimes folks that don't have squat to do with referrals want to recommend one of these retailer because they had a good experience and, surprise surprise, they see their URLs filtered out after they post...

3) Every time someone calls Value Electronics and says they came from TivoCommunity I'm sure the forum gets a kick back. I even believe the discount is possible because the forum shares it's referral money with the members when they are buying, so this is exactly the same, just a referral, in this case a more selective referral program, but it also involves money exactly the same as in the other programs.

Now, I'm not condemning TC because they are making sponsoring and referral money, I just think that to deserve the label "forum" they should change their filtering policies a bit. They can still filter out referrals and have their rules without penalizing good retailers.

At TivoCommunity they praise value electronics, but this is also prone to interpretation since this retailer is a sponsor of that forum, so most of the senior members will of course praise it so the forum and the sponsoring $$ keeps going. And one thing I hate about TivoCommunity is their policy to filter out URLs of some retailers, while they leave the value electronics URLs intact, this is deception to say the least.

Just my 2 cents...

I represent ValueElectronics.com and would like to comment on your post. Here's my response to your itemized list:

1. TC filters out only one retailer's URL and that is only because many members were posting the URL with referral codes embedded in them and they had no other way to stop the many referral commission links. You can type in the retailers name and TC displays it completely.

2. Same answer as # 1.

3. I have never paid a referral fee to any individual or any company. People refer other customers to us without any monetary gain because they had an exceptional experience with our company. TC does not get any referral fees of any sort. We pay a flat rate monthly for our banner and that's it. You use the term retailers, however, only one retailers' URL is blocked and not the company or its name, just it's URL. TC members are free to praise ANY company they want.

You have also stated on this thread that senior members are the ones praising my company, although I do agree that many senior members have posted favorable remarks, the overwhelming amount of the posts about the experience my customers have had come from the new members.

Your statement accusing deception is totally inaccurate. In fact, the only deception comes from members who post favorable remarks to get financial rewards. Member paid referrals is exactly what TC and this forum do not permit.

[Punkitup]

Robert,

I don’t begrudge you the opportunity to set the record straight if you were getting a bad rap. But you could have done so without turning the last two paragraphs into an advertisement.

This thread has reminded me why I like a user supported message board.

Peace
James-K1JMD

[Robert Zohn]

Robert,

I don’t begrudge you the opportunity to set the record straight if you were getting a bad rap. But you could have done so without turning the last two paragraphs into an advertisement.

This thread has reminded me why I like a user supported message board.

Peace
James-K1JMD

Thanks James. I agree with your comment and have removed my last 2 sentences. I got carried away with my emotions and wanted to express what makes us different than other dealers.

[Punkitup]

Thanks James. I agree with your comment and have removed my last 2 sentences. I got carried away with my emotions and wanted to express what makes us different than other dealers.

No worries Robert, this shows thoughtful integrity on your part.
Best of luck in all your endeavors.

Peace
James – K1JMD

[tivosmart]

You can type in the retailers name and TC displays it completely.
No, you are wrong there. The retailer's name is expertsatellite.com as they are an Internet retailer they have .com added to their name. Anytime you type expertsatellite.com anywere in TC it gives you this:

********************

The above is cut-and-past from TC. It should read the following:

expertsatellite.com
So, as you can see they are filtering out the string "expertsatellite.com".

I just said before it would be VERY easy to not do that to the poor retailer, they can filter referral strings instead very easy without passing judgement to one or the other retailer. This way the strings above that could very well be posted from a non referrer member, be seen by everybody.


3. I have never paid a referral fee to any individual or any company. People refer other customers to us without any monetary gain because they had an exceptional experience with our company.
Good for you, althouth I believe you do pay sponsoring money, and this conclusion came from this excerpt of a post I saw at TC:

I have been informed by the moderator that the answer is always our good sponsor "Value Electronics".

A lot of the people that would like to praise expert satellite are also not paid for referrals.

I suggest a little experiment for you so you can validate your theory: stop sponsoring TC (not referral, monthly sponsoring money) and let us know if the number of people that come from there and mention TC when buying from you increases or decreases. And please post your results here.

I know you won't do that, my point is only that some percentage of your business comes from TC because you are a sponsor, and it's probably true that some of the folks there put a good word because of the sponsoring money, that's all, I'm not accusing your company of deception (although I do think TC's policy of filtering out retailer's names borders to that), I know this is a business practice and that it's very common nowadays, please don't be offended by that, and I also don't see a reason to try to justify it as every other business do the exact same thing.

Also sorry if this shocks you, but despite their referrals program, I put them and also rapidsattelite.com above your company based on what I hear from friends and forum posters. Value electronics seems to come next, and then the last place goes to orbitsat.com (I heard several horror stories about them). This is just what I hear, I'm not judging anybody as I didn't have personal experiences with them all.

And just to finalize, a word on one of your other comments. Yes, I believe there are some people that could be deceptive in recommendations to earn money from referrals (as there could be some people that do the same because someone gives their site sponsoring money for that matter), but I'm not in this category. I do have a referral number and I highly recommend Expert Satellite because I BOUGHT FROM THEM AND HAD A WONDERFUL EXPERIENCE WHEN I NEEDED THEM, otherwise I would not refer them.

[durl]

Just a thought, but have you thought about doing the install yourself? When I first got Directv 6-7 years ago, I installed everything myself and it wasn't extremely difficult. It took several hours even though I'm no home improvement expert by any means.

I bought the equipment that I wanted, installed everything, then called Directv and my programming started beaming down within 5 minutes.

[Tomsoundman]

I would like to install myself as DURL mentioned above. Where is the best place to buy D* for that? (Go Reds)

[durl]

I bought my system at Best Buy because they had the Sony receivers which is what I really wanted. Since that was several years ago I can't say that you should buy there as well.

When I upgraded to an HD receiver, I bought the unit online and that was also a good experience.

My suggestion (and others may give better advice) would be to check some online retailers and see who offers the best deals. (all hail Brak)

[Punkitup]

I would like to install myself as DURL mentioned above. Where is the best place to buy D* for that? (Go Reds)
Concerns over the expertise and/or certification of an installer set aside in your case, I would feel free to concentrate on other issues, were I you. One would be bottom-line price, after shipping; I have always thought more highly of on-line retailers who spell it all out for you on the first page and don’t make you go digging or adding things to a cart to find out what the final price will be. What type of shipping is your dough going to buy you, there are outfits (not just DBS) that overcharge for UPS Ground. I wish many of these outfits would take a cue from newegg.com the computer component retailer and their extensive use of FedEx 3 Day Saver, often free. The next thing I would look at is their return policy, and I would find testimonials to the fact that they honor it, what happens if you get a piece of equipment that is DOA and trying to get the retailer to RMA it is like pulling teeth.

Just a couple thoughts.

Peace
James – K1JMD

[djfrankie]

I will be switching to Directv, currently have E*.

My question is, should I order directly from Directv or go through Best Buy, etc.

I have read that a 3rd line needs to be run into the house. I currently have Dish 500, 501 and 301.

When I switch to DTV, I going to get Dtivo and Standard rec.
Do I need the 3rd line run into the house?

Frank

[beejaycee]

I will be switching to Directv, currently have E*.

My question is, should I order directly from Directv or go through Best Buy, etc.

I have read that a 3rd line needs to be run into the house. I currently have Dish 500, 501 and 301.

When I switch to DTV, I going to get Dtivo and Standard rec.
Do I need the 3rd line run into the house?

Frank

Not gonna go near the first question but as for the second, you don't NEED the 3rd line because the DTivo will work with only one line going to it. However, to use both tuners you will need a second line connected. And you're gonna want it eventually so you might as well have the installer do it.

Oh, what the heck, I'll give the first question a shot, too. I bought my system from an online retailer/not DirecTV (I got 2 DTivos and a reg'lar ol' box). The 2-tuner DTivos rock (I am an ex-501 user) but the plain-jane failed. It took me about 2 weeks to get it replaced but that was over the New Year's holiday so that was probably a contributing factor. So, I found that the online retailer was cheapest but more risk-prone, since I could have just brought the box back to the store and had it swapped immediately. How's your risk tolerance? ;)

[djfrankie]

Thanks for the info.

[Strong]

Look for SBCA Certified satellite technicians to ensure the highest quality installation available. Large Nationwide contractors give the jobs to other sub-contractors that may not be Certified technicians.

SBCA Certificated satellite technicians have gone to the industries special school for technical training and have passed a rigorous test. The schooling sets quality and technical standard which is essential for professional, reliable installations.
This was a joke/troll, right??

The SBCA class was nothing more than a scam to get $200 out of installers. The one day class consisted of an instructor going over powerpoint slides while clearly emphasizing the questions that would be asked on the test. The open book test was almost impossible to fail if you were able to stay awake for the entired day. I passed the test with absolutely zero experience installing satellites.

There was no hands on of any kind, although they did have a cool commericial receiver rack for us to ogle.

On a positive note, the lunchtime sandwiches were great and the afternoon cookies were quite tasty.

[SParker]

If I ever switch to D* will they replace this old crap Primestar RG59 that I still use today with my E* stuff?

[MikeHDTulsa]

Hi,

I am a Dish Network customer and have four receivers and when the DirecTivo HD receivers comes out I will be switching to DirectTV and I will have 3 regular DirecTivo's and 1 HD for the living room and I figure why not leave the Dish Network receivers hooked up while they are installing the Direct TV equipment and then later turn off the Dish Network equipment and use the spare RG6 cables for the second tuners on the Tivo's? Now I am just guessing that they would charge extra for the second cable but this way I will be covered.

[tivosmart]

Hi,

I am a Dish Network customer and have four receivers and when the DirecTivo HD receivers comes out I will be switching to DirectTV and I will have 3 regular DirecTivo's and 1 HD for the living room and I figure why not leave the Dish Network receivers hooked up while they are installing the Direct TV equipment and then later turn off the Dish Network equipment and use the spare RG6 cables for the second tuners on the Tivo's? Now I am just guessing that they would charge extra for the second cable but this way I will be covered.
You don't need to leave Dish up if you like. You are the rightful owner of the existing cables you may have in your house. If you tell the installer NOT to use them then they won't (well, they may try to talk you unto it, but they can't obligate you to reuse your existing wires).

Each new installation should include for free 2 runs to each Tivo and 1 run to each non-Tivo receiver, and the maximum lenght varies but should be at least 100 ft for EACH run.

What they CAN do is charge you extra $$$ if the extra runs you're asking them to do require more than the maximum lenght (but in this case you probably need an inline booster too) and if the run requires what they call "wall fishing" (basically pull the cable through the wall to reach an interior wall). What is free is the "wall penetration", but this will work only for TVs located at or near exterior walls, they basically just drill a hole in your wall and pull the cable through it.

A piece of advice: if you do need "wall fishing" consider doing it with somebody else BEFORE the Directv installer come. Just out of curiosity I asked mine how much he would charge for it and he said to me $75 per "wall fishing", I almost had a heart attack when I heard it. If you call folks from a nearby construction site they might do it for you for much less, like $25 or $30. Well, don't forget that in this case you will need to factor in the price of the RG6 cable too (since your Directv installer is the one that brings the cable), but even in this case the final price will be much cheaper, depending of course how much cable you need.

[MikeHDTulsa]

Hi,

Thank you for the info I actually wired my first four receivers myself and Dish Network wired the fifth for free and it was on a inside wall just like the ones I had wired. Now I will have to call Direct TV and see if they are going to charge me for the switch I will need to hook up the four Tivo's to the three LNB dish I will need for HD. Thanks for the help, Mike.