Some Locals info from Retailer Chat - Jan 13/04 [Archive]

Darkman

01-15-04, 12:37 AM

Traverse City - Cadillac, Mi - available to Subs - Jan 22/04 - $4.99/m missing CBS for now (at 61.5)
Grand Junction, Co - available to Subs - Jan 22/04 - $4.99/m missing ABC for now (at 148)
Johnstown-Altoona, Pa - available to Subs - Jan 29/04 - $5.99/m all majors available (at Dish 500)

With those above - will be 104 local markets..

Meanwhile.. Dish will continue to move forward with locals..

Planned Additional January/February Launches (Subject to change cuz of retrans. etc) :

Columbia-Jefferson City, Mo
Davenport,IA - Rock Island-Moline, IL
Duluth, MN - Superior, WI
Ft.Wayne, IN
Green Bay-Appleton, WI
Harlingen-Weslaco-Brownsville-McAllen, TX
Juneau, AK
Lincoln & Hastings-Kearney, NE
South Bend-Elkhart, IN
Tri Sities, TN/VA

Next Retailer (Scheduled) Chat - Feb. 10, 2004 .. But Charlie said they will more likely change the date and make it sooner...

Darkman

01-16-04, 08:07 AM

JohnH

01-16-04, 08:18 AM

Darkman

01-16-04, 08:28 AM

I think they mentioned on Retailer Chat Duluth to be at Dish 500 ...
hmm - i possibly interpreted it to be then on the same spot beam with Minniapolis lets say.. no? (nuff room there?)

TonyM

01-16-04, 09:01 AM

I think they mentioned on Retailer Chat Duluth to be at Dish 500 ...
hmm - i possibly interpreted it to be then on the same spot beam with Minniapolis lets say.. no? (nuff room there?)

Darkman
There are 9 Mpls stations on Spotbeam 8 right now (the 4 major, 2 PBS, WB, UPN, IND) and from reading on these sites, the absolute max they can put on a TP is 12. Duluth has 5 stations (the big 4 + PBS) so they would have to split them onto 2 TP.

The other thing to remeber is...does the spotbeam go all the way to the Canadian border (Int'l Falls is right on the border and in the Duluth DMA)?

I have a feeling Duluth will be on 61.5 (right after I took down my 61.5 dish to put up a 30" for FTA :lol: )

JohnH

01-16-04, 09:47 AM

Duluth might go on DISH 500. Perhaps someone up that way can check Spotbeam signal levels on Tps 2 and 8 from 110. TonyM? :)

There is room for 2 on 2 and 3 on 8. :)

forklifter

01-16-04, 09:51 AM

Any idea where the lincoln kearney stations will be at or when

Darkman

01-16-04, 09:51 AM

all i know they said - Duluth - Dish 500...
When they referred to those others at the wings - they clearly said - at 61.5 or at 148 ;)

Of course they are in charge and can change their minds at any time though :D
(Subject to change)))))

Darkman

01-16-04, 09:53 AM

Forklifter - read the first post: "Planned Additional January/February Launches" :D

Patience my friends, patience.. it's all good.. it's comin' ;)

TonyM

01-16-04, 10:08 AM

Duluth might go on DISH 500. Perhaps someone up that way can check Spotbeam signal levels on Tps 2 and 8 from 110. TonyM? :)

There is room for 2 on 2 and 3 on 8. :)

JohnH
Where I am located (Aitkin, MN) I can get 125 on TP8 and around 115 on TP2 (using my 301)..the 5000 gets 101 and 96. Aitkin is at 46.47N 93.645 W, Duluth is 46.77N 92.12W. The town straight south from Duluth and in the Mpls DMA is Sturgeon Lake, which is about 45 miles from Duluth. So its anybody's guess.

I will be in Duluth this weekend, and will swing by my buddy's house and see what I get on those 2 TP's and let ya know!

James Long

01-16-04, 11:23 AM

Davenport,IA - Rock Island-Moline, IL
Duluth, MN - Superior, WI
Harlingen-Weslaco-Brownsville-McAllen, TX
Juneau, AK
Lincoln & Hastings-Kearney, NE
South Bend-Elkhart, IN

Any guesses John, which one of those ...maybe will go there to 148 (7550-7557)?

Do not think it's Juneau or Duluth anyhow..
Juneau, AK will be 500 on the AK spotbeam
South Bend, IN has channels assigned ... and no ABC so 7550 is out.

* Lincoln, NE
(68502 - Dish500 @ 39 - 61.5º @ 31 - 148º @ 20)
* Duluth, MN
(55701 - Dish500 @ 31 - 61.5º @ 28 - 148º @ 14)
* Harlingen, TX
(78550 - Dish500 @ 54 - 61.5º @ 39 - 148º @ 28)

JL

Chris Blount

01-17-04, 07:25 AM

Thanks for the info Darkman.

rocatman

01-17-04, 08:41 AM

Why were Traverse City and Grand Junction, CO locals put on the wings instead of SuperDish? All recent new locals, at least their major network channels have either gone to Superdish or to a spotbeam. Perhaps they are scheduled for spotbeams on the new 110 satellite (2005) launch and Dish doesn't want to waste Superdishes there but maybe there has been another change in plans for HD. Charlie Ergen implied back in November that some future HD would end up on the wings but maybe the new plan is to have all HD on 110. I know there is no compelling HD channels out there, I have read that in too many posts. Would Dish ever consider moving the non-distant net locals that are not on spotbeams off 110 to either Superdish or the wings? I don't mean to piss off the folks in Lexington Ky, Jackson MS, Roanoke VA, Knoxsville TN, Little Rock AR, or Springfield MO that get there locals off of CONUS TPs on 110 but I have to believe Dish has considered this. Certainly this would cost Dish in terms of replacement/added dishes/switches and installations and probably loss of some subs but certainly a percentage of the subs getting their locals in these areas also have second dishes for the wings. If all of these locals were moved, this would free up three TPs, enough for six more HD channels. Thoughts?

Mike123abc

01-17-04, 10:17 AM

The wings are being used right now because superdish has serious supply problems. They cannot add more markets that need superdish without making the supply problem even worse. Most are not really ready to wait 60-90 days for an install. A wing satellite takes a small dish that has an oversupply problem if anything.

Plus they have tons of space on 148. They have some space on 61.5 with the removal of HDTV. On 148 they can probably put 30 markets.

They have Echostar X being built for 110, probably will move a lot off of the wings to 110 when it goes up next year. But, for now they have to get every market they can in the air and online before D-7s goes up and DIRECTV starts adding markets again.

With existing capacity Dish could easily get the top 175+ markets online if they could solve the SuperDish problem.

TonyM

01-18-04, 01:02 PM

Duluth might go on DISH 500. Perhaps someone up that way can check Spotbeam signal levels on Tps 2 and 8 from 110. TonyM? :)

There is room for 2 on 2 and 3 on 8. :)

JohnH
I was in Duluth this weekend and it was quite an adventure trying to see if Duluth would work with the Spotbeam 8 & 2.
Went to my buddy's house...he dropped Dish for, get this, CABLE!!
Went to the Rat Shack in Superior...they had it there, but not hooked up!
Went to the Rat Shack in Duluth..they had it hooked up and running, but all we could get was 119! Ran a switch test there, and all they have is a Dish300 on the roof! (actually, its their old DirectTv dish)
Went to the other Rat Shack in Duluth and they let me play with it. Got 104 on TP8 and 90 on TP2.

So I think it will work there.
Of course, I came home and remembered the obvious...The Mpls DMA is so damn huge, it covers cities almost 200 miles north of Minneapolis.
Duluth is at 46.77 N latitude
Bemidji (which is in the Mpls DMA) is at 47.48N

So if they do put Duluth on 110, they will have room and it should work.

JohnH

01-18-04, 01:17 PM

Thanks for the effort TonyM. I plan to keep checking daily to see what is being put up on all 6 slots that are part of the system. 157 is just out there by itself and below the horizon here. :)

TNGTony

01-18-04, 02:34 PM

Tony,

Keep in mind that the Duluth market goes WAY north and west of Duluth itself. So it could be that International Falls which is also in the DMA may have a problem.

See ya
Tony

TonyM

01-18-04, 04:51 PM

Tony,

Keep in mind that the Duluth market goes WAY north and west of Duluth itself. So it could be that International Falls which is also in the DMA may have a problem.

See ya
Tony
Tony
Oh I know the DMA goes way father North (and West and East for that matter) than Duluth. Heck, it goes to the Canadian border and all the way East into the Up of Michigan! In an earlier post, I questioned that the Spotbeam would work for Duluth. This might be why its taken so long for Duluth to be put up.

I think they mentioned on Retailer Chat Duluth to be at Dish 500 ...
hmm - i possibly interpreted it to be then on the same spot beam with Minniapolis lets say.. no? (nuff room there?)

Darkman
There are 9 Mpls stations on Spotbeam 8 right now (the 4 major, 2 PBS, WB, UPN, IND) and from reading on these sites, the absolute max they can put on a TP is 12. Duluth has 5 stations (the big 4 + PBS) so they would have to split them onto 2 TP.

The other thing to remeber is...does the spotbeam go all the way to the Canadian border (Int'l Falls is right on the border and in the Duluth DMA)?

I have a feeling Duluth will be on 61.5 (right after I took down my 61.5 dish to put up a 30" for FTA )

Inundated

01-18-04, 08:35 PM

Juneau, AK will be 500 on the AK spotbeam
South Bend, IN has channels assigned ... and no ABC so 7550 is out.

FWIW, South Bend, IN does have an ABC affiliate - WBND-LP 57. I don't know if E* is in the habit of adding network affiliates which reside on LPTV stations, tho. D* has a few times, including WBQC-LP 25 Cincinnati (UPN).

James Long

01-18-04, 10:28 PM

FWIW, South Bend, IN does have an ABC affiliate - WBND-LP 57. I don't know if E* is in the habit of adding network affiliates which reside on LPTV stations, tho. D* has a few times, including WBQC-LP 25 Cincinnati (UPN).
E* is in the habit of NOT adding LPs. The SBN locals have been uplinked to 105 since September with no ABC or WB feed. (WMWB 25 is the LP WB affiliate.) OTA UPN in South Bend is a subcarrier on WSBT CBS 22's Digital feed.

The local cable systems all carry ABC57 and WB25, plus "UPN Michiana" - all on analog channels. It will be interesting to see what D* will do with the South Bend market once they get D7S running.

According to the address broker I don't qualify for ABC distants because I live too close to ABC57's tower. Odd that a station that cannot force its way onto DBS can force me not to get ABC. I'd have to move further away to qualify for the distants. I do, oddly enough, qualify for superstations. Which means paying $5.99 MORE just to watch WB/UPN. Not cool.

But I'm rambling again. E* has already assigned numbers for the South Bend market, and they are not the mystery ones quoted above.

JL

Mike Richardson

01-18-04, 10:58 PM

Which means paying $5.99 MORE just to watch WB/UPN. Not cool.

Actually they offer I believe individual superstations for $1.50/ea so you could get one UPN and one WB for $3. And you get interesting out of market news as well, and some syndicated programs.

James Long

01-19-04, 12:05 AM

Actually they offer I believe individual superstations for $1.50/ea so you could get one UPN and one WB for $3. And you get interesting out of market news as well, and some syndicated programs.
The online "add programming" doesn't give that option, but even so to get the networks via E* that I can get OTA I'd have to move and pay $9.50 .

I do hope they put us on 61.5 - I have one of those dishes. :)

JL

Inundated

01-20-04, 02:45 AM

E* is in the habit of NOT adding LPs. The SBN locals have been uplinked to 105 since September with no ABC or WB feed. (WMWB 25 is the LP WB affiliate.) OTA UPN in South Bend is a subcarrier on WSBT CBS 22's Digital feed.

The local cable systems all carry ABC57 and WB25, plus "UPN Michiana" - all on analog channels. It will be interesting to see what D* will do with the South Bend market once they get D7S running.

As I mentioned, D* does carry LPTV network affiliates and even cable-only ones.

In addition to the aforementioned WBQC-LP 25/Cincinnati (UPN), D* also carries the WB mostly-cable-only affiliate in my former home market of Roanoke/Lynchburg, VA, "WBVA/WB5". (I say "mostly" because like "UPN Michiana", WBVA/WB5 is a subchannel on one of the Roanoke market's Fox network simulcasters, Fox 21/27. The 5 is its cable position in Roanoke and Salem, and some other areas.)

I'd be shocked if South Bend locals went up on D* without ABC57 and WB25, and would perhaps include the UPN station. They seem to want to put all available local network affiliates, even LPTVers.

I don't know why E* does it differently. Maybe it's a bandwidth issue, maybe they're not as willing to work with the LPTVers on signal issues, etc.

newsub

01-20-04, 04:48 AM

As I mentioned, D* does carry LPTV network affiliates and even cable-only ones.

In addition to the aforementioned WBQC-LP 25/Cincinnati (UPN), D* also carries the WB mostly-cable-only affiliate in my former home market of Roanoke/Lynchburg, VA, "WBVA/WB5". (I say "mostly" because like "UPN Michiana", WBVA/WB5 is a subchannel on one of the Roanoke market's Fox network simulcasters, Fox 21/27. The 5 is its cable position in Roanoke and Salem, and some other areas.)

I'd be shocked if South Bend locals went up on D* without ABC57 and WB25, and would perhaps include the UPN station. They seem to want to put all available local network affiliates, even LPTVers.

I don't know why E* does it differently. Maybe it's a bandwidth issue, maybe they're not as willing to work with the LPTVers on signal issues, etc.

Ok if dish ever adds the local networks for steubenville,oh/wheeling,wv what stations will it add? Will they add the pittsburgh fox,pbs and abc stations since there arent any fox,pbs or abc stations in the wheeling dma or will they add wtov-9 which is nbc and wtrf 7 which is cbs and what about wb18 which is carried on comcast cable, will they add it as well? How do they work in dma's which have some stations and not all?

Darkman

01-21-04, 08:00 PM

James Long

01-21-04, 08:24 PM

They still have two hours ...

JL

Darkman

01-21-04, 08:28 PM

AHAHA - If Eastern time - then 1 and a half :D

JohnH

01-22-04, 01:17 AM

No change in the status of Traverse City. It remains at 121 and not available. 61.5 is extremely packed with Tp 28 not in use. There is barely room for Traverse City if nothing else is planned for there.

It should not be stated that it did not move as promised when it was on Tp 4 at 61.5 and was replaced by channels from Tp 28 there as an apparent emergency arose with Tp 28. No apparent comment on that situation from EchoStar.

Mike Richardson

01-22-04, 02:14 AM

It seems to me that E* would want to carry all major channels (ABC, NBC, CBS, FOX) even if they are LP, because then they can charge $5.99 instead of $4.99.

moedog

01-22-04, 07:06 AM

E* most certainly does carry LP and "cable only" channels when warrented. For example, E* does carry the Roanoke/Lynchburg WB5, just as D* does. In the case of the South Bend ABC, there is an additional issue there, I believe. Isn't the South Bend ABC LPTV, and the cable only WB, owned by Weigel Broadcasting, which also owns WCIU CHicago and the Milwaukee CBS, neither which are carried by E* COme to think of it, why is that the case?

James Long

01-22-04, 06:10 PM

E* most certainly does carry LP and "cable only" channels when warrented. For example, E* does carry the Roanoke/Lynchburg WB5, just as D* does.
You will find that carraige of a LP/CA is an exception, not thr rule.
Or maybe you won't find, but you should! :D

JL