One Dish for Local Channels and More

[BigKB1]

Correct me if I am wrong, but with DishNetwork you need one dish for local channels and one dish for non-local channels . . . .

Does anyone know if there is a plan to combine this into one dish?
In particularly for HD . . . . .

If this has already been discuss, can you direct me in the right direction.

Thanks.

[Mark Holtz]

Depends on the local. Some local areas have additional local stations on side satellites, while one or two locals areas are severed exclusively on the side satellites.

There is the so-called superdish which will receive the signal from 110, 119, and either 121 or 105. (Right now, there are problems with reception of 105). The side satellites of 148 and 61.5 are simply too far from the main satellite positions that a second dish is needed.

I'm going to move this over to the Dish forum.

[Slordak]

If you want detailed information on whether you personally would need a second dish to receive all of your locals, you can either look it up on Dish Network's web site, or you can provide your city/zipcode to us and we can look.

Today, you need a single Dish 500 pointed at 110/119 to get all of the basic programming and the HD Package. Depending on your exact locale, this may also provide you with your locals (although they will not be in high definition). It also depends on what additional programming, if any, you are interested in receiving. The standard 110/119 configuration does not include international channels, some locals, or CBS-HD.

[BigKB1]

If you want detailed information on whether you personally would need a second dish to receive all of your locals, you can either look it up on Dish Network's web site, or you can provide your city/zipcode to us and we can look.

Today, you need a single Dish 500 pointed at 110/119 to get all of the basic programming and the HD Package. Depending on your exact locale, this may also provide you with your locals (although they will not be in high definition). It also depends on what additional programming, if any, you are interested in receiving. The standard 110/119 configuration does not include international channels, some locals, or CBS-HD.

I looked on the Dish Network web site. I was unsure where exactly to look.
Still looking . . . In the meantime, city Burlington - NJ / zip 08016

Also, what would I need to get CBS - HD?

[TNGTony]

EDIT....Wrong burlington! OOPS

You need a second dish pointed to 61.5º for a few of the locals, but not all.

According to the Dish Network web site:

Station Local Channel Number Dish Channel Number
PHILADELPHIA ABC-WPVI (LOCALS) 6 8150
PHILADELPHIA CBS-KYW (LOCALS) 3 8151
PHILADELPHIA FOX-WTXF (LOCALS) 29 8153
PHILADELPHIA NBC-WCAU (LOCALS) 10 8152
PHILADELPHIA PBS-WHYY (LOCALS) 12 8156
PHILADELPHIA UPN-WPSG (LOCALS) 57 8155
PHILADELPHIA WB-WPHL (LOCALS) 17 8154

These are all available with a Dish 500. (Single now standard 20" dish)

The ones below require a second dish which would be provided free of charge for parts and labor.

PHILADELPHIA IND-WGTW (GENL ENTERTAINMENT/LOCALS)* 48 8166
PHILADELPHIA IND-WFMZ (RELIGIOUS/LOCALS)* 69 8164
PHILADELPHIA PBS-WYBE (LOCALS)* 35 8162
PHILADELPHIA TMNDO-WWSI (SPANISH/LOCALS)* 62 8159
PHILADELPHIA UNVSN-WUVP (SPANISH/LOCALS)* 65 8158

See ya
Tony

[boba]

DISH will probably never offer your local channels HDTV feeds because of the bandwidth required. If you want your local HDTV broadcasts you will have to get them with an OTA antenna.

[Un-lucky]

According to the Dish Web Site, all the locals are available with just the standard Dish 500. (20" dual slot dish). This dish comes standard with all new receivers.

The stations in Burlington on Dish include the following

Station Local Channel Number Dish Channel Number
BURLINGTON ABC-WVNY (LOCALS) 22 8935
BURLINGTON CBS-WCAX (LOCALS) 3 8936
BURLINGTON FOX-WFFF (LOCALS) 44 8938
BURLINGTON NBC-WPTZ (LOCALS) 5 8937
BURLINGTON PBS-WCFE (LOCALS) 57 8942
BURLINGTON PBS-WETK (LOCALS) 33 8941

I also have them listed as such on the EKB's Dish Channel Chart. Though for some reason I forgot to update the "locals" page at ekb.dbstalk.com/19 and still have a listing from when one of the PBS stations were on 61.5 and required a second dish. I will update that later tonight.

See ya
Tony dude thats burlington new york..that guys looking for burlington NEW JERSEY!!! which i believe is in the nyc dma..if not then its phiilly

[TNGTony]

Oops! edited the post. Thanks.

See ya
Tony

[BigKB1]

Looking at your chart I think that I my locals are Philadelphia based,

Therefore:

WPVI - TV 6 (ABC)
KTW-TV 3 (CBS)
WCAU-TV 10 (NBC)
WTFX-TV 29 (FOX)
WPHL - TV 17 (WB)
WPSG-TV 57 (UPN)
WHYY-TV 12 (PBS)

Again, looking at the chart, these appear to be 110 so I can get my locals on
Satellitte Dish 500 (20"), right?

Also, what HD channels will I get with the Dish500?
I think (looking at the chart):
Discovery DSCHD
HDNET
HD NET Movies
ESPN HD
HBO HDTV
SHOWTIME HDTV
HD EVents
HD-Pay-Per-View

Will I need another satellit dish for CBS HD?

[TNGTony]

As of right now, yes. You will.

See ya
Tony

[Slordak]

You would need a Dish 300 pointed at 61.5 in addition to the standard Dish 500 for 110/119 in order to receive CBS-HD. You might also need a non-O&O waiver, which can be quite difficult to get (I was denied one here in Chicago because of competing non-O&O partial coverage), so you may find that you are not able to get the channel regardless.

Note that the dishes, switches, installation and wiring are all free if you are a new customer. The "wing" satellite dish won't cost anything extra if you do in fact have minor locals on the wing.

[BigKB1]

Depends on the local. Some local areas have additional local stations on side satellites, while one or two locals areas are severed exclusively on the side satellites.

There is the so-called superdish which will receive the signal from 110, 119, and either 121 or 105. (Right now, there are problems with reception of 105). The side satellites of 148 and 61.5 are simply too far from the main satellite positions that a second dish is needed.

I'm going to move this over to the Dish forum.

I want to have only one dish and I want to have HD signals (with preparation for the future).

Here are my options:
a) get superdish because it has more signals (110, 119, 121, 105) than Dish500 (110,119)
b) get Dish500 and Dish300

I want the best situation where I do not have to change equipment when more stations (HD and non-HD) become available . . .

Questions:
1) Is the superdish a part of the free installation? If not, what is the cost?
2) I'm a newbie - are there any known problems with signal switching?
3) Is signal switching as easy changing the channel on a the TV?

[Slordak]

In answer to your questions:

1) As far as I know, SuperDishes are not part of a standard installation, unless your locals are served on one of the SuperDish slots (105 or 121). In theory, it might also be possible to get a SuperDish if one is ordering more exotic international programming selections during install.

2) Switches can fail, just like anything else, but if properly installed and all connections reasonably sealed, there shouldn't be much issue.

3) Yes.


Please note:

A) Any given SuperDish provides only three orbital slots, either 105/110/119, or 110/119/121. It does not receive four satellites at once.

B) The SuperDish is not presently compatible with a wing satellite on 61.5 or 148, so programming on these two satellites will not be available to you at all. However, in the future, a DP-44 switch (not currently available) will make this possible. In your case of not wanting to install two dishes, this may be a non-issue.

C) The SuperDish is now generally being mounted on poles, rather than on the roof, due to the size and weight of the dish. If this is going to be an issue for you, this is one more reason why it might not be appropriate for you.

[BigKB1]

In answer to your questions:

1) As far as I know, SuperDishes are not part of a standard installation, unless your locals are served on one of the SuperDish slots (105 or 121). In theory, it might also be possible to get a SuperDish if one is ordering more exotic international programming selections during install.

2) Switches can fail, just like anything else, but if properly installed and all connections reasonably sealed, there shouldn't be much issue.

3) Yes.


Please note:

A) Any given SuperDish provides only three orbital slots, either 105/110/119, or 110/119/121. It does not receive four satellites at once.

B) The SuperDish is not presently compatible with a wing satellite on 61.5 or 148, so programming on these two satellites will not be available to you at all. However, in the future, a DP-44 switch (not currently available) will make this possible. In your case of not wanting to install two dishes, this may be a non-issue.

C) The SuperDish is now generally being mounted on poles, rather than on the roof, due to the size and weight of the dish. If this is going to be an issue for you, this is one more reason why it might not be appropriate for you.

Thanks this is very helpfuil.

1) If (and when) they add more HD channels, what slot?
2) Unless I am misisng it, most HD is on 110 and 148. Very few on 61.5?
3) But it appears alot of Sky Angel on 61.5. I think you mentioned that it was going away?
4) How do you get 148?

It is beginning to look like I have two choices. (Not crazy about a Superdish on a pole):
a)Dish500
b)Dish500 and Dish300(biting the bullet about two dishes)

[Slordak]

Next set of answers for you:

1) Three possibilities:
i) 110. As FEC coding is tweaked and/or more locals are moved to spotbeams, more bandwidth becomes available on 110 for HD channels.
ii) 61.5 and 148. These satellites generally mirror each other's programming (since many locations can only get one or the other), so the programming would probably go to both. These satellites had the HD package before it moved to 110, so they should have available capacity.
iii) 105 (SuperDish). Dish's original plan was to put all HD programming on the 105 slot, but apparently some fringe locations in the US (e.g. parts of Minnesota) cannot receive 105 at all, and many existing customers balked at having to purchase a new dish, so this plan appears to be on hold or scrapped.

2) HD programming used to be on 61.5 and 148, before it moved to the core 110 location. What is left on the wing satellites is CBS-HD, and apparently 148 still has a mirror of some of the 110 content.

3) I did not specifically mention Sky Angel (possibly someone else did). If Sky Angel is removed, this would provide more bandwidth on 61.5 for HD content.

4) The 148 satellite is received the same was as 61.5, via a second Dish 300. Generally 148 is for the west coast and 61.5 is for the east coast. At your location, in New Jersey, you would probably only be able to receive 61.5, since 148 might be below the horizon or otherwise not able to be received (although I'm sure someone will come back with the elevation and azimuth and correct me).

[BigKB1]

Next set of answers for you:

1) Three possibilities:
i) 110. As FEC coding is tweaked and/or more locals are moved to spotbeams, more bandwidth becomes available on 110 for HD channels.
ii) 61.5 and 148. These satellites generally mirror each other's programming (since many locations can only get one or the other), so the programming would probably go to both. These satellites had the HD package before it moved to 110, so they should have available capacity.
iii) 105 (SuperDish). Dish's original plan was to put all HD programming on the 105 slot, but apparently some fringe locations in the US (e.g. parts of Minnesota) cannot receive 105 at all, and many existing customers balked at having to purchase a new dish, so this plan appears to be on hold or scrapped.

2) HD programming used to be on 61.5 and 148, before it moved to the core 110 location. What is left on the wing satellites is CBS-HD, and apparently 148 still has a mirror of some of the 110 content.

3) I did not specifically mention Sky Angel (possibly someone else did). If Sky Angel is removed, this would provide more bandwidth on 61.5 for HD content.

4) The 148 satellite is received the same was as 61.5, via a second Dish 300. Generally 148 is for the west coast and 61.5 is for the east coast. At your location, in New Jersey, you would probably only be able to receive 61.5, since 148 might be below the horizon or otherwise not able to be received (although I'm sure someone will come back with the elevation and azimuth and correct me).

This is great information.
You are making it more apparent that I am going to have to bite the bullet about having two dish especially if I want to prepare for the future.

a) I think someone stated that Dish500 and Dish300 are a part of the free installation?
b) Oops. It was not you that mentioned Sky Angel . . .Now, that I think about it. It might have been the TV show Angel. My bad.

[Un-lucky]

This is great information.
You are making it more apparent that I am going to have to bite the bullet about having two dish especially if I want to prepare for the future.

a) I think someone stated that Dish500 and Dish300 are a part of the free installation?
b) Oops. It was not you that mentioned Sky Angel . . .Now, that I think about it. It might have been the TV show Angel. My bad. as long as you get your lacals from philly..second dish is free(fcc mandate)

[Un-lucky]

This is great information.
You are making it more apparent that I am going to have to bite the bullet about having two dish especially if I want to prepare for the future.

a) I think someone stated that Dish500 and Dish300 are a part of the free installation?
b) Oops. It was not you that mentioned Sky Angel . . .Now, that I think about it. It might have been the TV show Angel. My bad. as long as you get your locals from philly..second dish is free(fcc mandate)

[BigKB1]

Yeah, it looks like I will be bitting the bullet . . .

Thanks.

[JohnH]

3) I did not specifically mention Sky Angel (possibly someone else did). If Sky Angel is removed, this would provide more bandwidth on 61.5 for HD content.



This is incorrect. If Sky Angel is removed, EchoStar loses the lease on 6 other frequencies at 61.5(leased from Dominion), plus the 2 frequencies that would be vacated by Sky Angel are owned by Dominion(Sky Angel). It seems Sky Angel will be around for awhile. :)

[Slordak]

My statement was more about the overall bandwidth available at 61.5, not specifically about who owned what and what the legal ramifactions were of carrying or not carrying the Sky Angel stations.

Nonetheless, you are correct. It seems the bandwidth on 61.5 is somewhat conditional in nature.

[Jacob S]

I am surprised at the number of SuperDishes that I have found on roof's of people's homes. I saw one not far from me that is mounted on TOP of a pole that the Dish500 used to be on (the Dish500 that was on that pole did not have any skew to it). I do not put them on roofs unless there is already a big pole on the roof to U-bolt the mount to, or a mount on the roof that it would fit on, and if that pole is sturdy. Otherwise it is put on a pole, deck, or wood pole that is supporting a porch if sturdy.

[Mike123abc]

Sky Angel owns their 8 transponders at 61.5, they are not going anywhere. They happen to lease 6 of them to Dish.

Dish has not shown any movement on what they are going to do long term with the wing satellites. If they want to commit to using them long term they will need to order new satellites. They are already down 1 transponder on 61.5, and 148 is E1 and E2 very old satellites. Plus the E1/E2 were made for 119, so they do not do the best at 148.

With a new spot beam satellite on order for next year for 110, they will probably be able to move all the wing satellite locals to 110, move some of the bigger market superdish DMAs to 110 (save on expensive/big superdishes). Then they could put more small markets up on superdish. The question then becomes what of the wings, international seems to be moving towards 121, locals to 110, that leaves not much on the wings, perhaps just add a bunch of less popular HDTV to the wings? Sell the wings to VOOM?

Many questions to be resolved.

[James Long]

My statement was more about the overall bandwidth available at 61.5, not specifically about who owned what and what the legal ramifactions were of carrying or not carrying the Sky Angel stations.
Unfortunately those legal ramifications are VERY important. Without SkyAngel, E* has 11 transponders of bandwidth available, which could be filled with 132 SD QPSK channels or 33 HD 8PSK channels. Without Sky Angel they could even move E*2 over to 61.5, since all they own license for all the even TPs.

Beyond that, you are talking about E* buying out SkyAngel or Voom. There are no other transponders at 61.5 that E* has in their inventory, even if they are currently leasing them.

With a new spot beam satellite on order for next year for 110, they will probably be able to move all the wing satellite locals to 110, move some of the bigger market superdish DMAs to 110 (save on expensive/big superdishes). Then they could put more small markets up on superdish. The question then becomes what of the wings, international seems to be moving towards 121, locals to 110, that leaves not much on the wings, perhaps just add a bunch of less popular HDTV to the wings? Sell the wings to VOOM?
61.5 is of questionable value, but there is still some value in having that location available, even if they end up on a new bird on just 11 transponders. Selling the licenses to Voom and the satellite to Sky Angel seems on the edge of possible. (Lease 11 TPs of service and sell the licenses to Voom, then sell the bird and lease to Sky Angel. Voom orders a new bird and SkyAngel milks the life out of E*3.)

I don't see E* giving up 148 without a fight. We will know more later this year when 157 and the other west are auctioned. If E* wins 157 their orbital real estate at 148 becomes very important. 64 TPs on one dish is really good .. better than Superdish in many ways. It won't be the same 148 picture that we have today, but it should be good.

After the auction for 157 ends expect E* (if they win) to order a pair of new satellites for the west. They really cannot make a move on 148 until they know what else they have going for them. I expect DirecTV will also try hard to get 157 ... the loser get 166! And a smaller company will try and fail at 157 and end up owning 175.

See you later this year when they, and we have more real data. :D

JL