How Many Legacy Switches?

[alebowgm]

Hey,

How many legacy switches can I use at one time? Is it possible to use a SW21, SW21x and a SW64 all at the same time?

Thanx

[SimpleSimon]

That depends on how they're hooked up.

Why not post your OBJECTIVES (number of satellites, receivers, etc.)?

[alebowgm]

Legacy 2800 Reciever

Coax runs from Reciever into SW21. Then another Coax goes from the SW21 into a SW21x. 2 Coax Run, 1 into a KU FSS for 105' W and another 1 into a KU FSS for 121' W. The open spot on the SW21 would have a coax that runs to a SW64. Then I would have 2 lines running into that from 110/119/61.5

I am also looking into even trying to get the 148' W as well. I need to find myself another large dish, probably at least 36 inches, to get an acceptable signal from where I am, especially with the lack of elevation in where I am located...

Is this possible? I just want to hit as much as I can in the air...

[SimpleSimon]

I doubt it will work, but it's definitely an interesting project! :)

Please post your results - and see if you can lay hands on a modern receiver at least for testing. Also, posting your results in: Mad Scientist Hooks up 5 Satellite Locations!!!! (http://www.satelliteguys.us/showthread.php?t=24582) would als be appreciated. :)

[alebowgm]

Will do...

Need to setup the FSS Dish's first, but I don't want to set them up and then not have them work... May have to do it anyway...

[alebowgm]

My understanding of the Legacy Switches was you could use as many as you wanted as long as they were different models of each one... Is there any truth to that?

[alebowgm]

An Idea that just came to me. The main concern is that you may not be able to have more than 2 Switches in a Legacy Combination (can anyone confirm or deny this). From my research, no one is sure if the TwinLNB for the Dish500 with the built in Switch counts in this combination (confirm?). Wouldn't this work perhaps instead. A SW21 with one input just from the TwinLNB (As per my current setup of 110/119 Twin LNB in one port and 61.5 in other), and then the other going to a SW64 with 61.5/105/121 (I would need to get a FSS LNB with a Vertical and Horizontal Output seperately, they do exist). ?

[SimpleSimon]

Well, that's xactly what we're trying to figure out. :)

Someone else is working on a SW64/SW44/SW21 combination.

[alebowgm]

Who is working on a combo like that?

I ask because that would probably do the job for me. The SW21x uses the SW44 commands. Also the TwinLNB works like a SW44...

Now I just wonder if the reciever will handle it...

I guess I will have to get some money together and try this thing out...

[SimpleSimon]

I think it's larrystotler. Go check out the thread mentioned in post #4. :)

[Nick]

Go here (http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=30114) for a multiplicity of manifold switching configurations.

Just don't knock out power to the neighborhood! :eek:

[larrystotler]

An Idea that just came to me. The main concern is that you may not be able to have more than 2 Switches in a Legacy Combination (can anyone confirm or deny this). From my research, no one is sure if the TwinLNB for the Dish500 with the built in Switch counts in this combination (confirm?). Wouldn't this work perhaps instead. A SW21 with one input just from the TwinLNB (As per my current setup of 110/119 Twin LNB in one port and 61.5 in other), and then the other going to a SW64 with 61.5/105/121 (I would need to get a FSS LNB with a Vertical and Horizontal Output seperately, they do exist). ?

I ask because that would probably do the job for me. The SW21x uses the SW44 commands. Also the TwinLNB works like a SW44...

The SW21X uses the SW42 command set, which is basically what the 500Twin/Quad use.

Interesting. I see where you are going with this, and I missed that one. Just keep in mind that the SW21 MUST be placed in the line between the receiver and the power inserter or you will fry the switch. The power inserter sends about 28 Volts down the line. WAY too much for an SW21 to handle.

Most of the P* LNBs were of the seperate H/V ports.

I will see what I can do. I will try hitting the 61.5 and the 148 on the SW64, and use a 500 Twin for the 110/119.

[JohnH]

It will be interesting to see if anyone comes up with a Legacy configuration which includes 105 and 121 as well as other slots. Previous attempts have failed.

[alebowgm]

I am sure it is possible. If you look at the Signal Strength Screen, there are options for
Superdish 3
Superdish 4
Superdish Full

Wouldn't that be a 3 Satellite, 4 Satellite and 5 Satellite Solution?

Even under the help, it says that you need to select the proper one if you have the 105 and/or 121 satellite installed....

HMM

[JohnH]

The Keyword is Legacy.

[alebowgm]

What do you mean by that?

[JohnH]

SuperDISH is DISH Pro Technology, not Legacy. Some Legacy configurations have been able to do 121 or 105 but none have been reported to get both 121 and 105 in the same configuration.

[larrystotler]

I am sure it is possible. If you look at the Signal Strength Screen, there are options for
Superdish 3
Superdish 4
Superdish Full

Wouldn't that be a 3 Satellite, 4 Satellite and 5 Satellite Solution? HMM

No, that means IF you have BOTH the 105 & 121, you check full. That would assume 4 sats without a wing. It's the wings that cause the problems.

[larrystotler]

SuperDISH is DISH Pro Technology, not Legacy. Some Legacy configurations have been able to do 121 or 105 but none have been reported to get both 121 and 105 in the same configuration.

I can get the 121 & 105 on a legacy system with no problem. run the 105/121/110 into an SW64, and the 119 into that with an SW21. No big deal. It's the 61.5 & 148 wings that cause the problems.

[JohnH]

It figures, the SW64 has to be reconfigured to accomplish this apparently. Wonder why they just don't allow it to work whatever way the inputs are configured?
I use 119, 110 and 61.5 on the SW 64 and like to add either 148, 105 or 121 with the SW21's. :)

[larrystotler]

It comes down the the fact that most P* dishes had the dual LNB lines, and the SW64 is needed to line lock the sats. You could also use a 500Twin/Quad w/ an SW44 and SW21s. The SW44 would line lock the 105 & 121. It's the 5th sat that creates the problem with the legacy setup, but I am working on a way that might work. Will post results when I know.

[James Long]

I am sure it is possible. If you look at the Signal Strength Screen, there are options for
Superdish 3
Superdish 4
Superdish Full
What receiver has such options?

JL

[JohnH]

All of my LNBFs are duals. Even if I had a P* separate out LNBF I would run it through a Multiswitch and convert it to standard 13/18 volt operation.

[JohnH]

What receiver has such options?

JL

It's the 2700/2800/3700.

[alebowgm]

Where would I be able to find an old KU FSS LNB (primestar?) that had different Horizontal and Vertical Outputs?

Because I would run those into the SW64. Then add the 61.5

Combine that with a SW21 and then either a SW21x with 119 and 110 or just a TwinLNB.

And yes, it is the 2800 I have that has that option...

If it was Dishpro Technology, then why would they upgrade the firmware to support the locations? I understand the Superdish is Dish Pro technology, but DNet must assume people with Legacy will want to be able to get the 105 and 121...

[MaintMan]

I bought a dual KU lnb off of e-bay from one tchan that works great for 105/121. He does not always have them, though. They are used, but mine worked fine. Cost is very reasonable. This lnb perfectly fits the triangle bracket on a P* dish.
On the 2800 screen, the 3 boxes are for different lnb configs witha Dish Pro adapter or legacy. I have to do the full test to get a 2800 to work with a legacy twin and sw21 for 105. If using a Dish Pro adapter, you use the 6 test setup. Don't know what other box is for. As far as I presently know, 4 is max satellite on legacy system on one cable, sw64 and sw21 as stated earlier.

[larrystotler]

Dish is attempting to convert all equipment to DP. However, they also have to be able to support legacy hardware. That's why they have a DP Adapter and that's why the DP+ switches incorporate lthe adapter. However, all the new LNBs that E* is manufacturing are basically DP. Therefore, the DP & DP+ switches only support DP LNBs(except in that one rare case with the FSS LNB being 90 degree off and working on the odds only). Since they are only producing 1 type of LNB it is more cost effective for them. They still refurbish legacy stuff, and most D* LNBs will work as well. The reason that there is a both sat check on the 2800 is that you can have 2 SDs with the 110/119. That gives you the SW21 4-sat config, which is what the DP+44 is reported as on a legacy box. It doesn't take into account the wings.

[Lance Advance]

Switch diagram for four sats into one IRD

Twin ________
110/119 ----| |
| |
| SW21 | ________
| |----| |
Single | | | |
61.5 ----|________| | SW21X |______\
| | /
Single | |
121 ------------------|________|
I should add that the lnbf's are legacy, and the 121 lnbf is legacy-compatible as well.

Thanks,

LA

[alebowgm]

Is that your current setup and does it actually work?

If anything, I would think that is one of the few setups we have thrown out there that wouldnt work because a Legacy Twin and SW21x both uses the same command set as a SW-44.

[SimpleSimon]

Well, maybe - but the Twin also has a couple of commands of it's own, so it MIGHT work. But in any event, there just might be a way with what you've got there.

Just off the top of my head, this might have a better chance of working:


121 ________
Single ----| |
| |
| SW21X | ________
| |----| 2 |
Single | | | |
61.5 ----|________| | SW21 |______\
| | /
Twin | |
110/119 ------------------|_1______|
Note that the Twin is in port 1 of the SW21.

No matter what! - PLEASE let us know what you try and what works.

[Lance Advance]

Thanks SimpleSimon - I'll try that tomorrow. Using a 301.010 at P226. When I run the check switch, does it matter if I check the superdish check box? The check is 50 steps if the box is checked, and 37 if it's not.

Thanks again,

LA

[SimpleSimon]

Well, I don't quite know, but the fact that there's a different number of steps means that the box is looking for more and different kinds of switches.

If you're willing, please try it first without, and than with it checked, noting how many of the steps it ACTUALLY does of each (lots of times it'll stop short of the end).

It's difficult to gather all the necessary information, but overall, these forums probably know more about switch cofigurations than E* themselves. :)

Some of us are gathering the data into one place for future reference - "coming soon" as they say. :)

[Lance Advance]

Thanks again - looking forward to contributing to the knowledge base you're helping to build :)

LA

[Lance Advance]

I was not able to get the legacy twin / sw21 / sw21x combo to work. Opted instead for a microyal sw41 for four sats on the living room ird, and an sw21 for 110 and 119 upstairs. The sw41 works as promised. I had to replace the twin with a pair of dual lnbf's, but it's always good to have a spare legacy twin around....

Cheers,

LA

[SimpleSimon]

Well, that's a bummer, but at least the good ole SW41's cover the base.

[larrystotler]

Ok....now all they need is an SW51, and everyone would be happy.... :D

[Lance Advance]

Which raises the question - can you cascade the sw41 with an sw21 or sw21x?

(No plans to try it - just curious....)

LA

[SimpleSimon]

Hey - you're the guy with the switches in hand - try it! ;)

[alebowgm]

It also may depend on which port you put it in, especially on the SW21. Try using different ports...

[larrystotler]

What does the receiver report the SW41 as?