ASK Dish: Digital OTA - analog map number?

[Mikey]

One station in my area has a strong digital signal. When I go to Menu -> 6 -> 1 -> 5 and try to add it as a local digital, I get the green bar, but there is no analog channel in the box below the bar.

At that point, the 811 locks up. I can't cancel, move the cursor, or do anything except power down. When I power back on, I get the Acquiring Satellite test, and Download Guide. At that point, everything is back to normal, but I still don't have that digital station.

Does the 811 require an analog map number in the station's PSIP to save it as a digital OTA?

[Jason Nipp]

Mikey, could you please re-explain what it is your explaining. I may have missed your question. From what I see now your asking about converting an analog OTA to Digital? Analog NTSC channels are different animals from Digital ATSC. On the 811 map, all digital channels should show up as a x.1, x.2, x.3 format, analogs and LIL should show up as x.0 numbers. I could be wrong, but I am not aware of any NTSC analogs carrying PSIP or TVCT info.

[Mikey]

Mikey, could you please re-explain what it is your explaining. I may have missed your question. From what I see now your asking about converting an analog OTA to Digital? Analog NTSC channels are different animals from Digital ATSC. All digital channels should show up as a x.1, x.2, x.3 format, analogs and LIL should show up as x.0 numbers. I could be wrong, but I am not aware of any NTSC analogs carrying PSIP or TVCT info.Thanks Jason. No, that's not the issue. All I want is to get the 811 to save the setting for that digital (ATSC) channel.

Up to now, every digital station that I've been able to add to the 811 has had an analog equivalent channel number (e.g. digital 27 == analog 4). That number shows up in the Add Digital screen when I get a lock.

This particular station doesn't have an analog equivalent number in it's PSIP. I got an email from the station engineer confirming this. He said that the equipment is being repaired. No analog number shows up in the Add Digital screen, even though I get a green bar on the digital signal.

The question is: does the 811 require an analog number in PSIP in order to save a digital channel? Mine locks up without that analog number.

[Jason Nipp]

I think I may know what your talking about. I have several channels I can scan, but not lock into a TVCT assignment number. In my case, some of these frequencies are being broadcast as just an assignment with no actual television broadcast included. Sort of a placeholder for an upcoming channel, or one that only broadcasts emergency weather updates, etc. Also some ATSC stations do not have an NTSC sister transmission. My UPN is ATSC only, no analog broadcast.

Some channels have opted to remap the channel assignment to match it's analog counter part. This is done thru TVCT contained within PSIP. If a remap is supposed to exist but doesn't this is a PSIP error. But first you would have to check with the station to see if they are indeed remapping with virtual channel tables.

Hope I got closer, if not don't take it personally, I am kinda preoccupied today and my train of thought included.

[Mikey]

...My UPN is ATSC only, no analog broadcast.
...But the 811 still lets you save that channel, and tune to it? Mine locks up when there is no analog channel number associated with the ATSC that I'm trying to add.

[Jason Nipp]

OK, got it. Sorry it took so long Mikey.

Yes this did happen to me a couple times with P284.

It is a sw bug, were it locks up while trying to add a channel assignment. I haven't seen this bug occur in the newer software version.

[Mikey]

OK, got it. Sorry it took so long Mikey.

Yes this did happen to me a couple times with P284.

It is a sw bug, were it locks up while trying to add a channel assignment. I haven't seen this bug occur in the newer software version.OK, that's what I've got, P2.84.

Thanks. :)

[Mike Johnson]

I got an email from the station engineer confirming this. He said that the equipment is being repaired.
It sounds like the station's PSIP equipment is down for repair. They are likely sending no PSIP data at all. The 811 requires that some minimal PSIP data be present to tune in the signal.

The ATSC encoder that the station is using should be capable of at least inserting the TSID and VCT, which is required to have receivers tune the signal. The station should have found a temporary work around while their PSIP is down. You could ask the station engineer if he knows how to do this. He may not realize there is a problem. I'm sure his PSIP vendor could help him resolve this.

[Mikey]

It sounds like the station's PSIP equipment is down for repair. They are likely sending no PSIP data at all. The 811 requires that some minimal PSIP data be present to tune in the signal.

The ATSC encoder that the station is using should be capable of at least inserting the TSID and VCT, which is required to have receivers tune the signal. The station should have found a temporary work around while their PSIP is down. You could ask the station engineer if he knows how to do this. He may not realize there is a problem. I'm sure his PSIP vendor could help him resolve this.He does know there's a problem. Here's the message string between me and the station so far (read from the bottom up):

No, I can't get the station. It sees the signal, but the receiver won't let me save the setting (maybe because the channel mapping isn't there).
----- Original Message -----
From: Jack Mills
To: Mike D
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2005 10:51 AM
Subject: RE: KSBI-DT PSIP


Mike: The equipment that maps our channel is in for repair. Should be back soon. Sorry for your troubles. Can it recieve CH 51? We are on the air right now but not mapped. Jack
-----Original Message-----
From: Mike D
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2005 8:48 AM
To: jmills@ksbitv.com
Subject: KSBI-DT PSIP


I have a Dish 811 receiver that can receive digital signals, but when I try to use it to map to your station (digital channel 51), the box that would contain the analog channel mapping (to channel 52) is empty.

Without that mapping, my receiver won't save the setting, and I can't tune to your channel. Is there a problem with your signal, or is it my receiver.

I can map to other digital stations (7, 24, 27, 32, 39, 50, ...) but not KSBI-DT.

Thanks,
MD

[olgeezer]

This is a little off base, but our 811 at work identifies one of the local PBS digital signal by its assigned digital channel number, while the HDTVs show the digital station with the analog station number. Any clues, as too why?