bad sub contractor service

[ronfelder]

I have just received what I might consider the worse service ever from a
Dish subcontractor. This is my third in a month and am unhappy. First was
for a second dish install. Went well. Second is for an upgrade to a 522 dvr.
Third and the one I'm complaining about is for a replacement 522. CSR's were
ok btw.

It seems that I have a defective 522. The tech tried fixing it with a new
separator with no luck. It seems I only receive channel 343 on one of the
two tuners and it comes back saying no signal. I went through the normal
troubleshooting over the phone with no, and was told someone would come
out. I figured they'd come with a new separator and receiver for not knowing
which was bad. Well the tech today tried the separator with no luck. He
wouldn't change out the receiver for he said he had no spare 522s. The ones
on the truck were for new installs and he wasn't about to give them up for
me. I'm sure that's because he would have lost money on a new install and
I'm just warrantee work. I complained and wanted to talk to his boss but he
wouldn't let me talk to him. He left claiming he'd order me a replacement
one. Well I don't want to or feel I should have to wait for another unit.
Plus I truly don't trust him to place the order for a replacement unit. I
called Dish and eventually was told that installers don't carry extra
receivers. That makes no sense for he could have a bad one when he does his
new install. In fact this will make my third 522 for my first one when
installed was an out of box failure which was replaced immediately. I don't
know how you can make repairs with out all the parts.

The outcome of this is that Dish is sending directly to me a replacement
522. It's supposed to take 4 days to arrive. The alternative would be to way
another week when I could have another tech out here and have him replace
the unit. I don't feel I should have to do the install or setup either. BTW
I'm using the word tech for the person who came out here very loosely for I
don't feel he could trouble shoot his way out of a wet paper bag., and I've
been an electronic tech for some 30 years.

Opinion comments. Dish if you are monitoring this newsgroup I'd love to hear
your thoughts on this.

Ron Felder

[Skates]

I can sympathize. I moved and had a standing appointment to get everything installed on Jan 10th. Three visits later, on Jan 30th, everything was done, but the installer refused to attach my OTA antenna even though all previous installers had done so with no questions asked. I was without service for almost three weeks.

Not a great way to win any fans, that's for sure...:mad:

[Nightlife1970]

Skates,

When you say refuse to attach my OTA. Do you mean they would not plug in a line that was already there, or would they not run a line from your antenna to your receiver. If it was the later, it is not the installers responsibility nor is he paid to install your OTA antenna.

[Skates]

I did use the word "attach"...I would have been willing to pay had additional cabling been needed.

All he had to do was attach the existing cables - and as noted - all previous installers have done so without argument or question. It's called pure laziness...nothing more.

[StarTech]

I did use the word "attach"...I would have been willing to pay had additional cabling been needed.

All he had to do was attach the existing cables - and as noted - all previous installers have done so without argument or question. It's called pure laziness...nothing more.

Skates

Please allow me to ask:
If it were simply the act of making the connection, couldn't you have done that your self?

You know you wouldn't work overtime for free, would you?:confused:

[Skates]

Yes, I could have done this simple, five minute job myself, if it wasn't for the fact that I just got out of the hospital and am unable to go out on the roof right now...

Thanks for asking...

Please continue to ignore my statement that all other installers in the past have had no problem doing this because you want to engage in a debate over nothing...

[StarTech]

I have just received what I might consider the worse service ever from a
Dish subcontractor. This is my third in a month and am unhappy. First was
for a second dish install. Went well. Second is for an upgrade to a 522 dvr.
Third and the one I'm complaining about is for a replacement 522. CSR's were
ok btw.

It seems that I have a defective 522. The tech tried fixing it with a new
separator with no luck. It seems I only receive channel 343 on one of the
two tuners and it comes back saying no signal. I went through the normal
troubleshooting over the phone with no, and was told someone would come
out. I figured they'd come with a new separator and receiver for not knowing
which was bad. Well the tech today tried the separator with no luck. He
wouldn't change out the receiver for he said he had no spare 522s. The ones
on the truck were for new installs and he wasn't about to give them up for
me. I'm sure that's because he would have lost money on a new install and
I'm just warrantee work. I complained and wanted to talk to his boss but he
wouldn't let me talk to him. He left claiming he'd order me a replacement
one. Well I don't want to or feel I should have to wait for another unit.
Plus I truly don't trust him to place the order for a replacement unit. I
called Dish and eventually was told that installers don't carry extra
receivers. That makes no sense for he could have a bad one when he does his
new install. In fact this will make my third 522 for my first one when
installed was an out of box failure which was replaced immediately. I don't
know how you can make repairs with out all the parts.

The outcome of this is that Dish is sending directly to me a replacement
522. It's supposed to take 4 days to arrive. The alternative would be to way
another week when I could have another tech out here and have him replace
the unit. I don't feel I should have to do the install or setup either. BTW
I'm using the word tech for the person who came out here very loosely for I
don't feel he could trouble shoot his way out of a wet paper bag., and I've
been an electronic tech for some 30 years.

Opinion comments. Dish if you are monitoring this newsgroup I'd love to hear
your thoughts on this.

Ron Felder


Ron sounds like a bad deal all around.
522's have had their issues, but so has every other reciever. So what are we to do? You may very well get another BOOB; Bad out of the Box, receiver from Dish.
Who knows? My opinion of the 522 is that it is a good solid SD DVR system. But if handled roughly during shipping or during transit to your home or tossed around while "On" during install, it could go south on you. It has a Hard Drive like a computer .
I feel there may be other behind the scenes issues with your system.
When you get your DVR from Dish, install the seperator out of the new box onto the DVR you are going to replace. See if that clears up the issues.
If not install the new DVR. Check it? Work?
If you still have the same issues, you may be having a line or connection problem.
You were not real clear on what the issues were, but yopu may even have a tune issue.
As far as extras on truck rolls, well it's not a huge issue, but when it occures most contractors either have extras or can get one. Contractors don't get paid unless the work is completed. Roll backs are "FREE" so it is in the best interest of the contractors to fix or replace all known issues and get service up and running on the first visit. Sounds like you may have a hourly wage earner on your hands not a contractor.
I do have a questions? What kind of dish do you have, have you checked for satellites lock and strength?

Startech

[StarTech]

Yes, I could have done this simple, five minute job myself, if it wasn't for the fact that I just got out of the hospital and am unable to go out on the roof right now...

Thanks for asking...

Please continue to ignore my statement that all other installers in the past have had no problem doing this because you want to engage in a debate over nothing...

Sorry...! Hope you feel better soon.

Well then, maybe he should have helped you out. It would have been the kind and christian thing to do.

But then again maybe he was the one in a million who just didn't care! Sorry about him, but there are far more concerned and well mannered installers out there that would have done that without a second though.

But then again and once more, maybe he didn't like being expected to do it for free! Maybe it wasn't the request but its delivery that caused the issue!

Again ...sorry about you situation, happy viewing

[Skates]

I see, so without any information on your part, let's just blame the 'greedy' customer while we ignore that it took the company three visits to complete an install that only required one, and left me without any satellite service for three weeks because installer #1 refused to travel 1/4 mile back to his office to pick up a Dish1000 when he mistakenly brought a Dish500 and installer #2 arrived with the proper dishes, but a DP34 switch instead of a DP44 so he couldn't attach my wing satellite to receive 148...:rolleyes:

What a greedy guy I was when I tipped all three installers $10 each when they didn't even finish the job...

Give it up, StarTech, you're just making a fool of yourself...I love those who would be apologists for that level of incompetent service.

[StarTech]

I see, so without any information on your part, let's just blame the 'greedy' customer while we ignore that it took the company three visits to complete an install that only required one, and left me without any satellite service for three weeks because installer #1 refused to travel 1/4 mile back to his office to pick up a Dish1000 when he mistakenly brought a Dish500 and installer #2 arrived with the proper dishes, but a DP34 switch instead of a DP44 so he couldn't attach my wing satellite to receive 148...:rolleyes:

What a greedy guy I was when I tipped all three installers $10 each when they didn't even finish the job...

Give it up, StarTech, you're just making a fool of yourself...I love those who would be apologists for that level of incompetent service.

Sorry again for your bad experence.....! I'm sure with your situation being what it is, you felt wronged.

You do seem to add more to this case as we progress through it. Hummmm?

Anyway, I'm not trying to to solve your issues, just attempting to help explain them so you can make a better informed decision on what steps you may take to resolve it.

Have you made a call to Dish CSR's and stated your case? Interuption of service is looked upon as very serious. Give dish a chance to remedy your situation and help identify a customer relations issue for correction.

By the way, have your OTA been connected.?

Startech

[Skates]

I added to the story because you continued to prod. I didn't think it was required to disclose every specifc aspect of this disastrous install until someone out there (you) decided to be an apologist for the installer and tried to blame me - the customer.

As for Dish, they absolutely acknowledged that the service was unacceptable. In fact, the CSR at Dish was extremely upset that the installer refused to go back and pick up the Dish1000 but instead rescheduled me for almost three weeks later. So, in the end, the CSR gave me a credit for three weeks on my bill (which is completely fair, since I couldn't receive any programming during that period).

As for your final question - the antenna is not up yet - I will do it myself when I'm able.

Now, this thread was not about me, this was about "ronfelder"'s issues. Can we please move on?

[StarTech]

I added to the story because you continued to prod. I didn't think it was required to disclose every specifc aspect of this disastrous install until someone out there (you) decided to be an apologist for the installer and tried to blame me - the customer.

As for Dish, they absolutely acknowledged that the service was unacceptable. In fact, the CSR at Dish was extremely upset that the installer refused to go back and pick up the Dish1000 but instead rescheduled me for almost three weeks later. So, in the end, the CSR gave me a credit for three weeks on my bill (which is completely fair, since I couldn't receive any programming during that period).

As for your final question - the antenna is not up yet - I will do it myself when I'm able.

Now, this thread was not about me, this was about "ronfelder"'s issues. Can we please move on?

Really, Great! Dish Network Took care of you ! That is good news. Your another satisfied customer!

My proding was purposful in understanding your issues with your service and what information I might be able to offer you. It should be obvious I ment no harm and was not defending anyone.

Apologist? Hummmmmm! Okay....if that means I look for answers and attempt to solve rather than cause problems.....that's me! You say it as if it were a bad thing.

Oh well good luck, and I hope you find some pro-bono installers to help you with your OTA.

By the way OTA " over the air" is better known a FTA " Free to Air"...Hummm?
Did you know FTA is going to be turned off in a few years? No more FTA, you will have to purchase it.

As far as Ronfelder goes, I have responed to him and I hope to hear back soon. You chose to chim in with an opinion and I chose to respond with my opinion.

I 'm sorry.......no you wont allow me to say that.......so Please forgive me for expressing my thoughts on an issues you posted in an open fourm. My intent was not to in-flame you but to offer simple informative response.

I hope you have a better day

Startech:p

[Skates]

StarTech - I think those who read your posts know full well your true intentions...please continue to hide your cowardly attacks against me in your posts (pro-bono OTA install) - they are very clear to everyone.

Too bad you can't just let it go...but I'm done responding to your childish, sarcastic posts...please feel free to continue making a fool of yourself if you wish...you're doing a terrific job!

[StarTech]

StarTech - I think those who read your posts know full well your true intentions...please continue to hide your cowardly attacks against me in your posts (pro-bono OTA install) - they are very clear to everyone.

Too bad you can't just let it go...but I'm done responding to your childish, sarcastic posts...please feel free to continue making a fool of yourself if you wish...you're doing a terrific job!

Skates

You addressed your displeasure with several installers. Your issue was one that could not be resolved ; even though Dish credited your account for those three weeks. The installers did nothing wrong by declining to connect your OTA.
What a person in your position should know is that their are serious liability issues when installers step out of there area of training and resposibility. Therefore OTA is considered NOT a part of a standard install. End of story. You can claim historical evidence of previous installers actions but there are no grandfathering policies wherein you are entitled to continued like install practices when those past practices would be considered not within the policy of Dish. You may complain of the issue, but you have no right to complain about the installers reluctance to perform work they are prohibited from doing without proper documenmtation, authorization and compensation. All of which were avaiable for you at any time with any of these installers and/or theire managers. Your complaint and the member originally posting an issue are not alike. You wanted to press your displeasure with the installers, and you have. I am making my displeasure with your issues clear, that is all. No attacks here, just attempts to put a bad situation to rest and send you to the proper authority for resolutiuon; which you already have done and have been compensated for you pain and suffering, and therefore you have no right to continue with this unfair pressure on installers who only did as they were told by their managers.
Startech

[CCarncross]

Based on my personal experiences with SAT installers, going back to 1997, I'll hedge my bets that the customer was an a** almost every time...It all gets based on your personal experiences with installers, I've never had a problem, so why should I blindly believe the customer everytime? Especially when I firmly believe the customer is RARELY right, all I have to do is go to any retail store and see customers abusing store employees trying to get something for free, etc...we all see it, almost every day.

This is nothing against anyone in this thread, but its just another point of view...especially since a good percentage of posts in many of these forums are about supposedly poor installs. People will scream to high heaven if they arent happy, they rarely speak up when everything goes well...

[Skates]

from CCarncross:

This is nothing against anyone in this thread

Who are you trying to kid?

[StarTech]

Based on my personal experiences with SAT installers, going back to 1997, I'll hedge my bets that the customer was an a** almost every time...It all gets based on your personal experiences with installers, I've never had a problem, so why should I blindly believe the customer everytime? Especially when I firmly believe the customer is RARELY right, all I have to do is go to any retail store and see customers abusing store employees trying to get something for free, etc...we all see it, almost every day.

This is nothing against anyone in this thread, but its just another point of view...especially since a good percentage of posts in many of these forums are about supposedly poor installs. People will scream to high heaven if they arent happy, they rarely speak up when everything goes well...
:eek2: Wow !!

A very insightfull response.

This type of situation plays out two or three times a day around here!

If only more folks were as thoughtful as you.

Startech

[Skates]

Enjoy your love fest, you two.

Of course, sometimes the apologists for incompetent installers are the a**es...

[StarTech]

from CCarncross:



Who are you trying to kid?
:nono: Truth

A pill better swallowed quickly than chewed on too long!

[Skates]

see previous post for your response...

Geez...normally, right about now, James Long scolds everyone and deletes the whole thread!

[StarTech]

see previous post for your response...

Geez...normally, right about now, James Long scolds everyone and deletes the whole thread!

Skates

Do you agree? That is , was your experence with CSR's what it should have been?

Did you or did you not get 3 weeks of programing FREE from Dish to help you recover from your distress?

What else can anyone do for you?

We are in the business to feed and House our families. Please don't expect us to complete work for you without compensation. Anymore than you would work for free yourself.

Getting something for free is great. But it should never be expected and when not delivered you should not ever be angry. After all, your not out anything!

I'm not sure if you really understand what I am trying to rfelate to you.

Let it be said that you called installers Lazy because they wouldn't work FREE for you. Then complained to Dish who in turn compensated you for your suffering. Now you want to complain here about........what? Not getting something for free.

What has our country come to?

[Skates]

I didn't get 3 weeks of programming FREE because I DIDN'T RECEIVE ANY PROGRAMMING FOR THREE WEEKS!!! Get that through your head!

It was so obvious that you were an installer from your first post, but rather than be upfront about that, you decided to hide behind smarmy, sarcastic, childish innuendo - so typical.

The fact that you continue to whine and cry about a process that would have taken a total of 5 minutes says more about you than it does about me. And the fact that you use terms such as "pain and suffering" just make you sound more and more like a fool.

Indeed, what is this country coming to with so many lazy people? I am willing to wager that if you take 100 dish customers, tell each one that they have an appointment on January 10th to have their equipment installed, then tell them that they will have to wait until January 30th for their install and will be without any service for 20 days, 99% of them will probably be extremely angry about it.

But please, continue with your fantasy that this is excellent service - in the end, you know full well that it is not. This whole OTA thing is nothing more than a red herring.

Do you want to go all night debating this? I'm certainly willing - but I've been waiting for you to make a salient argument and guess what? I'm still waiting...

[James Long]

see previous post for your response...

Geez...normally, right about now, James Long scolds everyone and deletes the whole thread!I've been enjoying a quiet evening.

Obviously those reading this thread have not enjoyed quiet. :D

[Skates]

There you are! Please, just scold me and delete me - I can take it...:D

[Nightlife1970]

Wait a min. here.

You say it was a 5 min job to hook up cables that were there. It's just you can't go out on the roof and do it yourself.

You are telling me that you have an antenna on your roof, and that cables are just sitting up there waiting to be connected?


It is still not laziness, as it is not the installers responsibility to hook up your OTA antenna.

[Skates]

You're entitled to your opinion - although I will continue stating ad nauseum that every other installer since 1998 has done so without question or complaint...and they did so because it was no big deal - the only people who are trying to make it so are the ones posting in this thread.

Funny how no one wants to comment on the fact that it took them twenty days to do a half-day job...it wouldn't have anything to do with the service-level of this particular installer, would it?

I think the real problem was that they didn't even know what a diplexer was...:rolleyes:

So there you have it - either I'm the devil incarnate who asked an installer to do something for FREE (notwithstanding the fact that due to their incompetence, I had to be home on three separate occasions to meet three separate installers, the last of which missed his 8-12 time block and showed up at 1pm - I wonder how much money came out of my pocket because of that? How does my 15 hours of wasted worktime compare to his five minutes?)

- or -

I asked him to do something so simple that all other installers since 1998 said "sure" and just went ahead and did it. I also tipped all three installers $10, even when they didn't finish, which included leaving all my wallplates open and hanging and in one case running a cable out of the middle of my closet and just leaving it there (installer #3 was nice enough to finish that one for me).

Take your pick, but this has grown boring - maybe James can create a poll :D

P.S. Just kidding, James. Please don't create a poll ;)

[rickc]

Ok Skates and StarTech, the complaint has been well aired and responded to. I am actually surprised that James has not shut this thread down, as I cannot think of anything positive that can be gained by continuing in this diatribe.

Please, let's give it a rest now.:)

[Skates]

...you didn't vote...:lol:

[StarTech]

You're entitled to your opinion - although I will continue stating ad nauseum that every other installer since 1998 has done so without question or complaint...and they did so because it was no big deal - the only people who are trying to make it so are the ones posting in this thread.

Funny how no one wants to comment on the fact that it took them twenty days to do a half-day job...it wouldn't have anything to do with the service-level of this particular installer, would it?

I think the real problem was that they didn't even know what a diplexer was...:rolleyes:

So there you have it - either I'm the devil incarnate who asked an installer to do something for FREE (notwithstanding the fact that due to their incompetence, I had to be home on three separate occasions to meet three separate installers, the last of which missed his 8-12 time block and showed up at 1pm - I wonder how much money came out of my pocket because of that? How does my 15 hours of wasted worktime compare to his five minutes?)

- or -

I asked him to do something so simple that all other installers since 1998 said "sure" and just went ahead and did it. I also tipped all three installers $10, even when they didn't finish, which included leaving all my wallplates open and hanging and in one case running a cable out of the middle of my closet and just leaving it there (installer #3 was nice enough to finish that one for me).

Take your pick, but this has grown boring - maybe James can create a poll :D

P.S. Just kidding, James. Please don't create a poll ;)

Good afternoon Skates

I will address your 20 day wait:
It has been my experience that NO ONE ever has had to wait more than a day or two for an equipment problem. Exceptions would be very rare. Rescheduled work orders are agreeed to by both parties in advance of the tech's arrival.
The only exception would be a NO CONTACT. That meaning no contact with the customer on the need to reschedule. Why that would would ever happen you might ask, the customer is not home when the tech arrives to perform the scheduled work. All attempts are made to contact the customer and a tenitive date is set for a follow-up visit just in case no contact is ever made, or if the customer never calls back in about his missed appointment. Your situation appears exceptional and rather complicated. I must disagree with you and say that you may have had a hand to play in your own wait time being longer than you would otherwise prefer. Dish just will not ignore a customers need on a mover connect, period!!

I think you have other issues that are being withheld, and/or you are dealing with a local retailer and not directly with Dish.

You continue to increase the issues and add issues and situations as each and every one is addresssed or done away with. Therefore you either in a real bind never before seen in history and deserve a huge break, or you are busting our chops for fun, just to us to react.

Very funny,

have a nice day

[StarTech]

Ok Skates and StarTech, the complaint has been well aired and responded to. I am actually surprised that James has not shut this thread down, as I cannot think of anything positive that can be gained by continuing in this diatribe.

Please, let's give it a rest now.:)

The positive aspect of this thread is that Dish will respond in a positive manner to a customer in most if not all cases. The information this thread provides is that no matter your issue, call in to Dish. Allow Dish to resolve your problems. You, the customer, writes that check to Dish every month. I'm sure they would be very happy to hear from you and happy to help you in any way they can.

So yes there are many Positives to be gleemed from this thread, one of them is your right to express your opinion about it and my right to respond.

Thanks for the opportunity

Startech

[Skates]

StarTech:

It has been my experience...

Then why don't you stick to talking about your experience and quit making up facts about MY experience. Notice how my posts contain facts and yours contain every phony theory you can come up with to defend the incompetent installer.

You have nothing to add but theory - you're extremely light on fact - you opened your mouth and immeditaly went after me because you don't believe ANY install is inadequate and now that the full facts are coming to light you can't eat crow and admit that this is unacceptable service.

And you should have already known that this was a local sub-contractor - look at the title of this thread - didn't stop the fact that Dish Network apologized and credited me for three weeks of service I didn't receive. So even though you continue with your 'theories', for some reason Dish sided with me and agreed the installer's service was unacceptable.

All I can say is, if you service your customers like these people did - and think that it is acceptable service - I feel sorry for your customers...

Now, with apologies to rickc, et al, I am done with this thread - please feel free to return with the theory that my installer was captured by aliens on his way to my house and that's why he didn't show up on time - that would hold as much water as the various 'conspiracy theories' you've come up with so far...:lol:

[StarTech]

StarTech:



Then why don't you stick to talking about your experience and quit making up facts about MY experience. Notice how my posts contain facts and yours contain every phony theory you can come up with to defend the incompetent installer.

You have nothing to add but theory - you're extremely light on fact - you opened your mouth and immeditaly went after me because you don't believe ANY install is inadequate and now that the full facts are coming to light you can't eat crow and admit that this is unacceptable service.

And you should have already known that this was a local sub-contractor - look at the title of this thread - didn't stop the fact that Dish Network apologized and credited me for three weeks of service I didn't receive. So even though you continue with your 'theories', for some reason Dish sided with me and agreed the installer's service was unacceptable.

All I can say is, if you service your customers like these people did - and think that it is acceptable service - I feel sorry for your customers...

Now, with apologies to rickc, et al, I am done with this thread - please feel free to return with the theory that my installer was captured by aliens on his way to my house and that's why he didn't show up on time - that would hold as much water as the various 'conspiracy theories' you've come up with so far...:lol:

Skates

There you are!

I knew your installer (s) were local contractors, I said LOCAL RETAILERS. Dish uses contractors as well their own installers, who all answer to DISH headquarters on all issues surrounding work orders.

Local Retailers and their installers and contractors don't answer to Dish. At least not directly. Therefore things can get drawn out with a retail situation.

I didn't need any theory here, I use only facts, experience, and all my senses to conclude you are not happy. That being the case, you will extend the bounds of reasonablness and explore what ever area meets your needs at that momant.

I will end this thread with an agreement in two parts:

a. I won't ever perform work for you, can't afford it.

b. We both reitire and go watch the Super Bowel.

Startech

[James Long]

And *CUT*

If you want to watch two sides that won't give up their position and will bash each other until one actually does come out victorius try watching the SuperBowl ... tonight a 6PM ET/3PM PT only on ABC!

-closing-

James