DVD ripping...

[Halfsek]

I have a plan. It's a dorky plan. Yet, I think it's efficient and, well, everybody else is doing it. ;)

I'm going to ultimately have a media server. I just started looking into DVD rippers to get my collection ripped. I actually haven't even purchased the computer yet. As an aside, I'm planning on a Mac Mini core duo. It'll be playing on a 50" plamsa. So if anyone can convince me that the Mini is a bad choice, let me know.

Anyway, I'm brand new to this ripping thing. My girlfriend and I did a test rip on her brand new Dell last night. The ripped quality was okay; probably about the same level as an iTunes video download. But it definitely wasn't DVD quality.

Is it too much to expect DVD quality watching a ripped movie? I know there are different ways the ripped files can be saved. Which is better than the other in terms of quality and playability?
Any other suggestions woule be very helpful.

[Bogy]

This is a great place to start if you want to learn all about DVDs. The site not only has many explanations about ripping, etc., but also has a number of free downloads that can make the process much simpler.

[Halfsek]

Thanks... but I'm assuming that there was supposed to be a link in there somewhere?

[ibglowin]

I have had exactly the set up you are seeking for several months now.

Mac mini core duo. Hooked into 60" Sony Grand Wega RPLCDTV. 500GB external hard drive. I rip using Hand Brake. PM me if you want more details on settings. Suffice it to say if you want a good picture on your set you will need to have your final movie around 1.5 to 2GB in size. This is still quite an improvment from the 4-6GB file size on a standard DVD. This will get you 300+ movies this way and they all play very nicely with Front Row via iTunes.

I also have an external OTA HD Tuner (EyeTV). The Mini handles HDTV as well as HD movie trailers quite easily.

Sweet little machine that will also do Windooze if need be.

[Halfsek]

Very cool.
Okay, as this is still in the developmental stages, I'll keep posting it here. I'll PM you for settings when I'm all set.

So I'm assuming that I can specify file size when ripping the DVD. I'm not too worried about space as drives are relatively well priced and I don't have too much to rip.
Is there a noticeable difference in image quality between playing a DVD and viewing a ripped file at 2GB?

As to Front Row. I've read that it won't play ripped DVD's.

I'm glad about the HD. I'm using an HD Tivo right now. I've heard that it's pretty much impossible to dump from the Tivo to the Mac. Althought dumping HD from that would be great.
I'll be sticking with the Tivo (or the new DTV box) as it's the only thing which will record satellite HD- and I can't get OTA- there's a big tree in the way.

[ibglowin]

You can specify a file target size or an average bitrate (which is what I use) That way shorter movies end up being proportionately smaller in size than longer ones.

It is only slightly softer than watching the DVD (and I'm a stickler for PQ). The trade off is in the convenience. Also Quicktime does not currently handle DD5.1 so what you get is actually 2 channel 5.1 mix. It still sounds pretty good. Almost like the old Dolby ProLogic. From what I hear through the grapvine, the next major rev of Quicktime will support DD5.1 mixes.

Front Row will not play VOB files as of today (possible future upgrade)

EyeTV has an export right into iMovie that allows you to cut the commercials out and burn to DVD. i do this all the time with my episodes of Lost etc. You can also export right to iPod if you like. Very handy features. One of the other EyeTV models has a video encoder built in so you could dump from a PVR (analog) into the encoder and straight into EyeTV. Then export to iMovie and burn with iDVD. A few more steps than using a straight DVD burner but more (much more) control of things for sure (chapters, backgrounds, editing commercials, etc.)

[harsh]

So if anyone can convince me that the Mini is a bad choice, let me know.Not a bad choice, just not the most economical. You perhaps noticed that ibglowin has had to resort to external storage and external tuner. I'd be looking for something that I could install a lot of internal storage and any number of tuner cards. I'd be surprised if multiple USB tuner cards are supported in a single machine. I would go with Network Attached Storage (NAS) if I were going to go with external storage (as opposed to USB or Firewire).

If you're interested in any kind of satellite tuner cards or hardware encoders, I'd head in the Windows direction.

[Danny R]

The ripped quality was okay; probably about the same level as an iTunes video download. But it definitely wasn't DVD quality.

Obvious legal disclamer: Note that copying DVDs is considered illegal almost everywhere, even for home or personal use, as the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) states that it's illegal to break the CSS copy-protection mechanism employed by most commercial DVD movies. Objections that "fair use" portion of copyright law protects individuals may not have merit since DMCA is the more recent law and congress obviously has the right to rewrite its own laws.

In any case, whatever software you are using is recompressing the video. DVD video is already in digital form, and its possible to pull it off without touching the quality at all.

Of course size is an issue, as most movie DVD's are about 7-8 GB in size if they are double layered (most are nowadays). So a terabyte server would only hold ~125 movies in their raw state. I just don't see the advantage in time/money to have so few movies on such an expensive computer. Much cheaper to pick up a DVD changer that holds 300 or so DVDs.

Now its possible to compress a movie quite a bit as DVDs are usually in MPEG2 format (VOB files) and compression technology has advanced a bit since that was developed.

I've found that using some of the more recent DIVX compression you can compact 1 hour of video into about a 350MB avi file and still get a watchable movie thats barely different from the original on my TV. I use this quite frequently to record TV shows and am able to store 12 or so episodes on a single DVD-R disc.

Thus you could probably get most movies down to 700MB or so and still have good quality, allowing the above terrabyte servier to have ~1400 movies, which is a pretty good collection.

Of course I still think its far far easier to just pop the original DVD into the player rather than mess with a media server, as compressing DVD's takes an awfully long time.

[juan ellitinez]

The ripped quality was okay; probably about the same level as an iTunes video download. But it definitely wasn't DVD quality.

Obvious legal disclamer: Note that copying DVDs is considered illegal almost everywhere, even for home or personal use, as the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) states that it's illegal to break the CSS copy-protection mechanism employed by most commercial DVD movies. Objections that "fair use" portion of copyright law protects individuals may not have merit since DMCA is the more recent law and congress obviously has the right to rewrite its own laws.

copying is illegal..how about just "backing up" dvd's?;)

[Halfsek]

I'll actually be using it as a computer as well. It won't be solely as a media server; hence the Mac part.
But that helped, Danny. I'm not a huge movie guy. I might have a total of 25 DVD's now (most of which were gifts) and would rip maybe 50% of them. I'll add ripped movies as slowly as I've purchased DVD's over the past 8 years.
I like the convenience feature of it and the fact that the mini is just so freakin' small that the room wouldn't be a problem.

It's also a matter of just testing it and see which file sizes I like.

When it comes down to it. I eventually need a new computer (my laptop is crapping out). So if I'm going to get a mini anyway (not a big game guy), I might as well hook it up to the media portion of my living room.

[Bogy]

Thanks... but I'm assuming that there was supposed to be a link in there somewhere?
Dang, I hate when I do that. :sure:
http://www.doom9.org/

[Nick]

Dang, I hate when I do that. :sure:
http://www.doom9.org/:thats:

Good save, Preacher. Getting a tad 'feeble' are we? :D ;)

[ibglowin]

[i] Much cheaper to pick up a DVD changer that holds 300 or so DVDs.

I had a 300 disc CD changer once upon a time. The problem is once you put things in it you can't easily nor quickly find them. It turned out to be just a big $300 Black Hole. I was never more happier to get rid of that thing and rip all my CD's into iTunes. Talk about easy to find your music and make custom playlist. I will never go back to that.

That's whats great about ripping your movies into iTunes as well. If you have a collection of any size you won't be able to find things quickly unless you use something that has a search or filter capability.

[Danny R]

IThe problem is once you put things in it you can't easily nor quickly find them. It turned out to be just a big $300 Black Hole.

I think technology has updated since then. I've found it quite easy to use a friends Sony 400 DVD. Finding titles was easy, both directly and via search. Adding new titles was a snap as well, as the DVD player actually identified most of them automatically with no need for user input.

[Bogy]

:thats:

Good save, Preacher. Getting a tad 'feeble' are we? :D ;)
Just a temporary memory purge. :D It's my knees that are feeble. :(

[ajiuO]

I have a plan for a DVD server but it doesn’t involve compression. I would use a raid array. I would rip all DVD’s to ISO files that are an Exact copy of the DVD. And use something like demond tools to run the iso directly. There are actually companies that make a DVD servers and they are very expensive… your mostly paying for their proprietary software though.


Keep in mind. If your not serving DVD images its not a DVD server. Sounds like your looking to build an XVid server or something

[Danny R]

I have a plan for a DVD server but it doesn’t involve compression. I would use a raid array.

Thats what I was thinking he was originally planning on building. I considered it, but again, 1 TB of disk space would only hold 125 DVDs or so in uncompressed ripped format.

I'd need something like a 10TB server just to hold all the DVD's and TV shows I've compiled over the years thus far. Even with the latest 500gb drives, thats still 25 or so hard drives spinning, just eating up electricity. You'd need a dedicated server room in your house so that you weren't bothered by the constant noise of all the drives whirring and the cooling fans buzzing. The expense just isn't worth it compared to just buying a CD cabinet and keeping them on a shelf.

Besides, even with RAID, the possibility of files getting corrupted does exist, due to virii, human error or other problems. Think of how much you'll cry if your house gets hit by lightning and your precious server goes bye bye.

As it is, I backup only the movies I lend out, and then give that person the burned copy rather than the original. This also works great for those Disney films that might disappear at any moment into the Vault, never to be seen again.

[Halfsek]

EyeTV has an export right into iMovie that allows you to cut the commercials out and burn to DVD. i do this all the time with my episodes of Lost etc. You can also export right to iPod if you like. Very handy features. One of the other EyeTV models has a video encoder built in so you could dump from a PVR (analog) into the encoder and straight into EyeTV. Then export to iMovie and burn with iDVD. A few more steps than using a straight DVD burner but more (much more) control of things for sure (chapters, backgrounds, editing commercials, etc.)

Now that sounds good. I'd much rather prefer to rip PPV movies than buy DVD's and them rip them.
I'll look into that.

So I'm assuming that if I'm dumping from the PVR to EyeTV, I have to do it via component rather than the DVI connection?

[ibglowin]

So I'm assuming that if I'm dumping from the PVR to EyeTV, I have to do it via component rather than the DVI connection?

The EyeTV PVR only has RCA (composite) connections. The best you'll ever get is S-VHS via a camcorder or some other type of video converter (MPEG-2).

You won't find any DVI connections or component input on anything like this.

Only a handful of DVD recorders ever had component inputs (I happen to have one). And they only handled 480i material.

[Halfsek]

Oh well. I can wait. Hopefully something in the future will come out.
Have you checked out any of the movie download services? I can't test drive them now since they only work with Windows.
But I will be able to use them once I get the mini. I don't mind paying a reasonable amount $10.00 or so to download a DVD quality movie and be able to keep it forever.

[harsh]

I have a plan for a DVD server but it doesn’t involve compression.If it is a store-bought DVD, it is compressed (MPEG2) and encrypted. Digially storing an unencrypted version is in direct violation of the DMCA.

Your scheme would also require a file player that was capable of decripting the copy protection.

[harsh]

You won't find any DVI connections or component input on anything like this.Not on the Mac, but there are a handful of DVI input cards on the Windows side of the aisle.

[Bogy]

If it is a store-bought DVD, it is compressed (MPEG2) and encrypted. Digially storing an unencrypted version is in direct violation of the DMCA.

Your scheme would also require a file player that was capable of decripting the copy protection.
I don't know how I would know this, since it is illegal, but you would not want to store DVDs without compression, because an uncompressed/unencrypted DVD takes up over 6 gigs of space.

[ntexasdude]

.................Digially storing an unencrypted version is in direct violation of the DMCA.................
Are you sure about that? I thought the DMCA made it illegal to circumvent encryption schemes. Thus, a copy of an unencrypted DVD or audio CD is fair game under the fair use doctrine.