UPS - Monster Conflict?

[kvitense]

I have a Monster HTPS 7000 balanced power unit. It is a high-end (so I'm told) and expensive ($1000-$1200) component. I have all of my living room equipment (audio/video, access.) plugged into it. It acts as a surge protector, balances the power to each component, filters out noise to/from digital devices, as well as some other things I'm sure. I do not at this point use a UPS. I am planning on getting one, but I do not want to bypass the Monster unit to utilize the UPS. Are there any experts out there that see a problem with plugging the power cord to the Monster unit into the UPS and then the UPS into the wall?

Kurt

[Earl Bonovich]

I have a Monster HTPS 7000 balanced power unit. It is a high-end (so I'm told) and expensive ($1000-$1200) component. I have all of my living room equipment (audio/video, access.) plugged into it. It acts as a surge protector, balances the power to each component, filters out noise to/from digital devices, as well as some other things I'm sure. I do not at this point use a UPS. I am planning on getting one, but I do not want to bypass the Monster unit to utilize the UPS. Are there any experts out there that see a problem with plugging the power cord to the Monster unit into the UPS and then the UPS into the wall?

Kurt

Other then you are going to want to get a VERY big UPS to do that...

You are drawing a lot of power, and will need to get a UPS of the same magnitude. Probaby one on par that would be used with a Computer Server Rack.

They make them... so if you get the correct one, there shouldn't be an issue.
Is there a particular component that you want on the UPS?

[bobojay]

I've had this same setup for 3 years now with not a problem at all......Just make sure you buy a UPS, mine is an APC, that has enough wattage capability to handle all the components.
Keeps mine running with no break for the time it takes to get the TV shut down & cooled down when the power goes out.....

[kvitense]

Other then you are going to want to get a VERY big UPS to do that...

You are drawing a lot of power, and will need to get a UPS of the same magnitude. Probaby one on par that would be used with a Computer Server Rack.

They make them... so if you get the correct one, there shouldn't be an issue.
Is there a particular component that you want on the UPS?

Earl,

Based on your (and other's) posts in another thread, I got the impression that the higher end components owned should be on a UPS. From what I understand though, my DLP and HR20 (when I get it installed on Monday) really should be balanced and filtered (through the HTPS 7000) to get the best quality picture and life out of the components, especially on digital components, so I'm told. I don't see how to accomplish that without plugging those components into the Monster unit before going to the UPS. How big of a UPS (price-wise and model if you got it) do I need to make this work? I'm not interested in dropping $800 (or really big coin) on a UPS though. Am I forced to choose between backup power & the features the HTPS 7000 provide? Thanks.

Kurt

[kvitense]

I've had this same setup for 3 years now with not a problem at all......Just make sure you buy a UPS, mine is an APC, that has enough wattage capability to handle all the components.
Keeps mine running with no break for the time it takes to get the TV shut down & cooled down when the power goes out.....

bobojay,

You have the same setup as mine? What UPS by APC are you using? Is your HTPS 7000 plugged into it, thus providing backup power to EVERYTHING plugged into the Monster unit? (also, read the post I just placed to Earl for more insight)

Thanks!

Kurt

[Ed Campbell]

Back in earlier TiVo days -- someone on that other forum suggested www.refurbups.com to me. There were several other folks who endorsed the firm -- and I have to say the refurbed APC UPS I bought a few years back has served me well.

Folks suggested remembering to change the battery within the usual life parameters and I've done it once, now. Served me well.

[houskamp]

I have a apc br1500 running all my stuff ..will run all of it for 22 minutes plus it has the option of a second battery unit that will tripple the time.. it can output 875 watts and costs about 200$ anywhere

[Jeremy W]

Why not plug the UPS into the Monster unit? Almost all UPSes have multiple plugs.

[Earl Bonovich]

Earl,

Based on your (and other's) posts in another thread, I got the impression that the higher end components owned should be on a UPS. From what I understand though, my DLP and HR20 (when I get it installed on Monday) really should be balanced and filtered (through the HTPS 7000) to get the best quality picture and life out of the components, especially on digital components, so I'm told. I don't see how to accomplish that without plugging those components into the Monster unit before going to the UPS. How big of a UPS (price-wise and model if you got it) do I need to make this work? I'm not interested in dropping $800 (or really big coin) on a UPS though. Am I forced to choose between backup power & the features the HTPS 7000 provide? Thanks.

Kurt

Yes.. .that is what I said...

But you don't want to power ALL of yoru components via UPS.
The Stereo/Amp; DVD Player, CD Player, ect.... those things really don't need to be on the UPS.

The DVR is a good thing to avoid brown outs and voltage drops that could cause the unit to reboot. And for that, you can spend about $50.

I don't have much experience on the size for a DLP, so I really couldn't help you there.

[kvitense]

Why not plug the UPS into the Monster unit? Almost all UPSes have multiple plugs.

I never thought of that. Sometimes I have a tendancy to overlook the GLARING OBVIOUS!:lol: With the way the UPS units work, do you see any reason why your suggestion would prevent any of the HTPS 7000's features from functioning as advertised? ie. noise filtering & balancing the power to the end component if the battery unit is in-between the Monster component and the end component.

Kurt

[kvitense]

Yes.. .that is what I said...

But you don't want to power ALL of yoru components via UPS.
The Stereo/Amp; DVD Player, CD Player, ect.... those things really don't need to be on the UPS.

The DVR is a good thing to avoid brown outs and voltage drops that could cause the unit to reboot. And for that, you can spend about $50.

I don't have much experience on the size for a DLP, so I really couldn't help you there.

Thanks Earl, and I totally understand and agree with not needing to power several of my components. And, if Jeremy W's suggestion will work, then it should be an easy "fix".

Kurt

[Jeremy W]

With the way the UPS units work, do you see any reason why your suggestion would prevent any of the HTPS 7000's features from functioning as advertised?
Nope. Depending on the UPS unit, when there is AC power it will either pass the power through untouched, or do it's own filtering and balancing. So either way, you're going to end up with clean power. And when the UPS is on battery, it will produce clean power.

[kvitense]

Nope. Depending on the UPS unit, when there is AC power it will either pass the power through untouched, or do it's own filtering and balancing. So either way, you're going to end up with clean power. And when the UPS is on battery, it will produce clean power.

Excellent! Thanks a lot Jeremy.

Kurt

[matto]

Nope. Depending on the UPS unit, when there is AC power it will either pass the power through untouched, or do it's own filtering and balancing. So either way, you're going to end up with clean power. And when the UPS is on battery, it will produce clean power.

Actually, the inverters in most cheaper UPSes don't produce real sine wave AC, but clipped triangle waves. Whether or not thats good for your equipment is questionable, but its certainly ironic to use that once you've dropped a kilobuck on your MONSTER surge supressor deluxe.

[kvitense]

Actually, the inverters in most cheaper UPSes don't produce real sine wave AC, but clipped triangle waves. Whether or not thats good for your equipment is questionable, but its certainly ironic to use that once you've dropped a kilobuck on your MONSTER surge supressor deluxe.

Which APC (or other brand) devices will not degrade my Monster performance then? Otherwise, I will have to get a unit that can handle at least 5 to 10 minutes of EVERYTHING, as I will then have to plug the Monster into the APC to avoid above scenario, right? Or will I still have the issue you mentioned, as I still need to go through the UPS?

Kurt

[Jeremy W]

Actually, the inverters in most cheaper UPSes don't produce real sine wave AC, but clipped triangle waves.
Well seeing as he spent a grand on a power conditioner, I didn't expect him to go out and buy the $19.99 UPS special at Staples.

[k0rww]

Line conditioners should power the UPS. This is the recommendation by UPS manufacturers.

The main purpose of a UPS for home theaters is to avoid the slamming of power off-and-on repeatedly which often happens during thunderstorms. This can be very detrimental to TVs, especially TVs that have bulbs for projection which need to be cooled down via fans when turned off. DVRs are another great use for UPSes.

Size the UPS for enough Wattage and ensure you have several minutes of run time so that you can shutdown. Run times vary by the load on the UPS. UPS run times are generally rated at half power where they're more efficient.

A good example of a sinewave UPS is the APC Smart 1500:
http://www.apcc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?base_sku=SUA1500
Price is around $450.

You can compromise and run the amplifier and subwoofers off the line conditioner.

[glennb]

Just my 2 cents.

I don't have a $1000 - $1200 monster unit or a UPS and I've never had any problems with any of my equipment. No hard drive failures, no burned up equipment, no flaky acting equipment.

[kvitense]

[QUOTE=k0rww;670469]Line conditioners should feed the UPS. This is the recommendation by UPS manufacturers.QUOTE]

Thanks k0rww. Just so I'm clear, what you are saying is to run my components to my Monster conditioner, plug the Monster into the UPS, then the UPS into my wall outlet, right?

Kurt

[k0rww]

[QUOTE=k0rww;670469]Line conditioners should feed the UPS. This is the recommendation by UPS manufacturers.QUOTE]

Thanks k0rww. Just so I'm clear, what you are saying is to run my components to my Monster conditioner, plug the Monster into the UPS, then the UPS into my wall outlet, right?

Kurt

Hi Kurt,

Hope this is understandable:

1. Decide what going to use the UPS, e.g. TV and TIVO or everything.

2. Plug Line conditioner into the wall outlet.

Plug all the components that are NOT going to use the UPS, into the line conditioner, if any.

3. Plug the UPS into the line conditioner's outlet that is always on.
Plug the components that are going to use the UPS into the UPS' outlets.

Richard

[bobojay]

[QUOTE=k0rww;670469]Line conditioners should feed the UPS. This is the recommendation by UPS manufacturers.QUOTE]

Thanks k0rww. Just so I'm clear, what you are saying is to run my components to my Monster conditioner, plug the Monster into the UPS, then the UPS into my wall outlet, right?

Kurt

That's the way mine is plugged. All the components go through the UPS. Not intended, but it worked out best that way for my setup. They're never all on at the same time.
I have a refurbed APC, the only way to buy one I feel, much cheaper, "Smart-UPS Model 1200". It'll run the components for about 15mins. or so if need be. Never needs to though, because they get turned off before the battery dies.

[bobojay]

In other words, my UPS is plugged to wall, then the Monster, then everything into the Monster.
Again, it worked out best for me that way.......

[k0rww]

Just my 2 cents.

I don't have a $1000 - $1200 monster unit or a UPS and I've never had any problems with any of my equipment. No hard drive failures, no burned up equipment, no flaky acting equipment.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but you may just be lucky.:)

Surges occur more now than ever before.

I strongly believe that everything in a home theater should have, as a minimum, surge protection.

UPSes add another level of protection if they can be afforded.

Richard

[k0rww]

In other words, my UPS is plugged to wall, then the Monster, then everything into the Monster.
Again, it worked out best for me that way.......

This is not the recommended configuration by APC.

They contend if the line conditioner is connected after the UPS, the UPS may become confused. See their website for more information.

Richard

[matto]

This is not the recommended configuration by APC.

They contend if the line conditioner is connected after the UPS, the UPS may become confused. See their website for more information.


I agree. The line conditioner will look like a giant inductive load to the UPS, and by design, UPSes don't like inductive loads.

[kvitense]

[QUOTE=kvitense;670663]

Hi Kurt,

Hope this is understandable:

1. Decide what going to use the UPS, e.g. TV and TIVO or everything.

2. Plug Line conditioner into the wall outlet.

Plug all the components that are NOT going to use the UPS, into the line conditioner, if any.

3. Plug the UPS into the line conditioner's outlet that is always on.
Plug the components that are going to use the UPS into the UPS' outlets.

Richard

Richard,

Thanks for step-by-stepping me! And again, just so I'm clear, as long as I use a UPS like you mentioned above, I will NOT degrade any of the Monster's features, right? Also, if I don't use the specific model you suggested above, what "specs" do I need to be sure the UPS I get DOES have, so as not to "negate" my Monster features? Thanks again!

Kurt

[k0rww]

[QUOTE=k0rww;670836]

Richard,

Thanks for step-by-stepping me! And again, just so I'm clear, as long as I use a UPS like you mentioned above, I will NOT degrade any of the Monster's features, right? Also, if I don't use the specific model you suggested above, what "specs" do I need to be sure the UPS I get DOES have, so as not to "negate" my Monster features? Thanks again!

Kurt

Your line conditioner is providing good clean electricity to the UPS.

The UPS, in turn, provides brown out and black out protection.

The UPS does not degrade the functionality of the line conditioner.

They work together to protect your system.

The better grades of UPSes provide a simulated sinewave output, but cost a little more.

[kvitense]

[QUOTE=kvitense;671162]

Your line conditioner is providing good clean electricity to the UPS.

The UPS, in turn, provides brown out and black out protection.

The UPS does not degrade the functionality of the line conditioner.

They work together to protect your system.

The better grades of UPSes provide a simulated sinewave output, but cost a little more.

Thanks again Richard.

Kurt

[matto]

Just make sure the UPS isn't going to draw more current than your power conditioner is rated to provide.

[kvitense]

Just make sure the UPS isn't going to draw more current than your power conditioner is rated to provide.

Good point! Thanks.

[carl6]

Except for very high end UPS equipment, the UPS is simply passing the line input power to the output until there is a loss of input power. Then it rapidly switches on and provides inverted output until either the battery dies, or line input is restored.

Very few low-end (read affordable) UPS's are continuously providing inverted power.

So, with the UPS connected after the power conditioner, you are feeding fully conditioned power to the unit(s) plugged into the UPS until such time as you have a power outage. Then you are going to be shutting stuff down anyway, so it really doesn't matter.

If you spend anywhere from $5K to $150K for a UPS that provides continuously inverted output power, then you probably don't need the power conditioner anyway.

Carl