View Full Version : O for 6 with new HR 20s...any ideas?
I purchased three HR20s from Crutchfield.
All are on quality UPSs and plugged in to new Sony TVs via HDMI. They all have plenty of ventilation and last time I looked my home isn't sitting on a giant electromagnet.
All of the cabling is new. I have swapped HDMI cables with other devices and all work. The units get power so the power cables should be good and the satellite feed cables also check out. The TVs all receive cable programming without any issue (digital and analog).
We have had no other issues with any electronic equipment in the house .
All of the units receive the 120 update shortly after being turned on...that's pretty much when the problems seem to begin...but that may have nothing to do with it.
I have a new 5LNB dish installed and all of the outlets appear to be getting great signal (95+)
1. Living Room - Installed went through setup and left it on the DirecTV info channel.
2. My Office - Installed went through setup and left in on the DirecTV info channel
3. MBR - Installed and it locked up after satellite screens (on screen where you choose language. Called DirecTV they had me do a reformat and there was no change.
Called Crutchfied and they sent out a replacement. I did not register any of the DVRs as I wanted to do all three at the same time. The two that were working were left powered on turned to the DirecTV info station.
A few days later the replacement comes from Crutchfield and I go to check the receiver in the Living Room. it's still on (I can feel its warm and the HD is spinning), but there are NO lights whatsoever on the panel and no output to the TV. I tried rebooting several times and a reformat...no luck.
I then take the replacement unit and install it in the Master Bedroom. Go through the setup and tune to the info channel and leave it on while I go check the unit in my office.
When I return the channel is gone and there is a blue DirectTV screen. The unit does not respond to the remote or any of the switches on the front panel. Multiple resets and a reformat do nothing.
I call Crutchfield and then send out two more replacements. (They haven't arrived yet).
Today, I go to my office and tune the TV to the DVR input and instead of the DirecTV info channel I'm greeted with the blue screen again. Multiple resets do nothing the unit won't respond to the remote and/or the panel and outputs nothing to the TV. There are no lights on the front panel now other than a brief blink of the blue power light if I reset the unit.
I'm really quite frustrated and looking into alternatives.
Anyone have any ideas...should I just give up on DirecTV DVRs? The people at Crutchfield have been very nice but they have got to think I'm out of mind or up to something with all these bad units.
Calling DirecTV support has been no help other than to tell me I just activate the units and then they could send me refurbs. (Gee...isn't that nice...I get to start paying for a service and get a used machine back).
I have installed a lot of components including several TIVOs in my life and build high-end gaming computers...so I'm not clueless on this stuff...although maybe I am.
So...any thoughts?
Thanks in advance for any help you may give me.
Earl Bonovich
02-12-07, 07:18 PM
1 - Welcome to the forums
2 - What multiswitch are you using (as you have at leat 6 feeds here)
3 - What happens if you try component connections
veryoldschool
02-12-07, 07:23 PM
What Earl said & try pulling the power cord for 10 min on each.
1 - Welcome to the forums
2 - What multiswitch are you using (as you have at leat 6 feeds here)
3 - What happens if you try component connections
1. Thank you very much. I've been a reader for awhile.
2. Zinwell WB68 installed by the DirecTV installer when he put up the dish. All of the other cabling in the house is brand new and done and checked by a reputable cabling company. The DirecTV tech verified signal at each location.
3. No difference with component or even an RG 6 connection.
Thank you for taking the time to help!
What Earl said & try pulling the power cord for 10 min on each.
Tried pulling the cord and letting it sit (while I was writing the initial post) and the power light comes on briefly and then all dark. I can hear the units fan and HD working though...but no output
Earl Bonovich
02-12-07, 07:30 PM
RG 6 connection.
RG6 ? The HR20 doesn't have an RG6 output....
Try goign one system at a time... and force the latest software download (do a search on 02468)
If that doesn't work... try to do a front panel full system reset:
RESET the unit, hold the down arrow and record at the same time, till the system reboots itself again (This formats the hard drive).
See if you are connected via an S-Video connection, if you can get at least through the SAT setup screens.
Also disconnect anything extra... such as network, and ota.
Also try with a direct cable connection to the DISH... (by pass the multiswitch).
If any of these above combinations can get you at least to the DirecTV screen, I think you will be good to go.
veryoldschool
02-12-07, 07:31 PM
Tried pulling the cord and letting it sit (while I was writing the initial post) and the power light comes on briefly and then all dark. I can hear the units fan and HD working though...but no output
Ahhh, been there. I had some luck by pressing the power light when it was on dim. Others say it will come on later. I've had it give me a great pause. The drive I think is doing something before the boot.
veryoldschool
02-12-07, 07:43 PM
FYI: the hard drive doesn't act like a normal drive if it is connected to a PC. Someone did this & found from a cold boot it would only be on-line 50% of the time. Warm boots were about 80-90%.
Let's take this to basics: no UPS, connect with s-video, power it up. If it doesn't, go for a red button reboot [under the card access door].
One unit at a time.
Perhaps the long "up time" without activation has cause your problem as I don't think anybody has waited this long before.
Sorry...I'm losing my mind...I meant to say S Video cable.
I disconnected the network and I don't have OTA. Bypassing the multiswitch would be a nightmare because of its location, but I do have two units that I know that are good from my previous home that I'll try later.
As of now all of the units are acting the same. They power up, but other than a brief blink of the power light nothing happens. There's no output to the TV either with HDMI or Component output. I tried a RBR on one and held the switch for a full system reset...that seemed to do something as the record light came on briefly...but still no output. I took my DVD player and plugged it into one of the TVs with both the HDMI and the component (at different times) and both worked.
FYI: the hard drive doesn't act like a normal drive if it is connected to a PC. Someone did this & found from a cold boot it would only be on-line 50% of the time. Warm boots were about 80-90%.
Let's take this to basics: no UPS, connect with s-video, power it up. If it doesn't, go for a red button reboot [under the card access door].
One unit at a time.
Perhaps the long "up time" without activation has cause your problem as I don't think anybody has waited this long before.
Trust me...I didn't want to wait this long to activate. But, in my dealings with DirecTV customer service I have found the fewer calls I make the better. I was hoping to have three units up and operating and then activate.
veryoldschool
02-12-07, 07:50 PM
Oh yeah: :welcome_s to the forum.
You will find many here that want to help.
24 starts in 10 min, so I might have to come back. :)
Tom Robertson
02-12-07, 07:51 PM
Oh yeah: :welcome_s to the forum.
You will find many here that want to help.
24 starts in 10 min, so I might have to come back. :)
VOS, ummm... don't you have a DVR? :)
veryoldschool
02-12-07, 07:51 PM
But, in my dealings with DirecTV customer service I have found the fewer calls I make the better..
That's why a lot of us are/came here. :D
veryoldschool
02-12-07, 07:54 PM
VOS, ummm... don't you have a DVR? :)
Are you talking about my flawless twins? :D
OK, except for dinner, I'll be "hanging" .:)
Okay...
I'm working on the one on my desk...that seemed to operate the longest.
1. I am plugged directly into a wall outlet...no UPS. The outlet works as it powers a lamp.
2. I am connecting with component cables. I have several of them and I know they work. I don't trust the one S-Video cable I have here. It should be good..but can't be sure.
3. I have unplugged the unit for 15 minutes from everything. Network, phone, satellite feeds, power and TV and let it sit.
4. Plugged back in the component cables, sat feeds, power and phone (no network).
5. Powered the unit on. Power light came on. Then nothing.
6. I can hear the units fan running.
The TV I'm using is a brand new Sony Bravia 32 LCD. The other set is a 40 inch and LR is a 70 inch Sony XBR2.
Once again..than you all for reading all this and trying to help.
veryoldschool
02-12-07, 08:10 PM
Once again..than you all for reading all this and trying to help.
I jumped to gun on 24. It's still an hour to go.
Your power light: did it come on full or dim?
What happens if you press it again & hold for a moment?
bonscott87
02-12-07, 08:53 PM
I'm gonna say right now it's probably because they aren't activated. The receivers are probably freaking out.
I wouldn't be worried about customer service when it comes to activating receivers. That's about the only painless thing you can get done by them, it's what they do all day. :D
veryoldschool
02-12-07, 08:59 PM
I'm gonna say right now it's probably because they aren't activated. The receivers are probably freaking out.
I wouldn't be worried about customer service when it comes to activating receivers. That's about the only painless thing you can get done by them, it's what they do all day. :D
Well you may be right, but the Ken would need to read the receiver ID number from under the card access door, the serial number off of the shipping box, & off the access card to have D* activate the unit.
Seems like a long shot for a "boot issue", but longer shots have paid off before. :D
Okay...just working with the one on my desk because running up and downstairs and crawling in and out and behind TVs isn't all that much fun :)
I am able to get the one on my desk to power on. The power light comes on, the blue circle comes on and it appears to do something. BUT there is no video output with HDMI and when I use it on component the screen flashed once...and nothing.
When I get the other two replacements I will try activation. If that doesn't work. I'm not sure what I'm going to do. I really wish they hadn't split with Tivo.
Anyway...it's bed time for me.
Thanks again for all the help. I'll report back
brittonx
02-12-07, 09:39 PM
How is your dish grounded?
jbrasure
02-12-07, 10:10 PM
Here's a wacky idea, but it's probably not what you had in mind. Find a used Tivo HR10-250 on eBay, and see if it works at your location.
carlsbad_bolt_fan
02-12-07, 11:10 PM
Okay...just working with the one on my desk because running up and downstairs and crawling in and out and behind TVs isn't all that much fun :)
I am able to get the one on my desk to power on. The power light comes on, the blue circle comes on and it appears to do something. BUT there is no video output with HDMI and when I use it on component the screen flashed once...and nothing.
When I get the other two replacements I will try activation. If that doesn't work. I'm not sure what I'm going to do. I really wish they hadn't split with Tivo.
Anyway...it's bed time for me.
Thanks again for all the help. I'll report back
What resolution setting are you at? 480i? 720p? 1080i? Just a hunch, but I'm wondering if the TV you're using might be the hitch on the receiver that appears to work.
veryoldschool
02-12-07, 11:20 PM
I think the initial boot screen is 480 since you aren't even into the setup guide to select resolutions yet.
How is your dish grounded?
I'm not sure...I didn't install it. I'll check
What resolution setting are you at? 480i? 720p? 1080i? Just a hunch, but I'm wondering if the TV you're using might be the hitch on the receiver that appears to work.
All of the TVs work at all of the different resolutions. At least Sony says they do. They all seem to display different resolutions coming off the digital cable without an issue...but that is a different input than the DVR is using.
Here's a wacky idea, but it's probably not what you had in mind. Find a used Tivo HR10-250 on eBay, and see if it works at your location.
I would have done this but the coming changes and enhancements to the DirecTV system are going to cause issues no?
I am going to bring over my old receivers Sony T60 and a Sony HD receiver and see if they work today.
dallascontractor
02-13-07, 07:49 AM
I think you do need to bring over a receiver you know works. It may multi switch. You showed 95+ but never got to watch any channels. Did you try removing B Band conveters a lot of them seem to be out in public?
veryoldschool
02-13-07, 07:59 AM
I think some of us need to re-read the first post. This isn't a SAT feed problem, but a boot/ powering up problem, from what I read. Let's go back to "the basics" since the box needs to boot before we start to go down SAT feed problems.
Ken: you mentioned you have a questionable s-video cable & are using component. Try using a "simple" composite [RCA] cable [non HD]. I would like to focus on just the simplest setup to see some video displayed on your TV. Even with NO coax you should see something, maybe it won't show anything but an error message, but it should show that.
paulman182
02-13-07, 08:05 AM
Ken: you mentioned you have a questionable s-video cable & are using component. Try using a "simple" composite [RCA] cable [non HD]. I would like to focus on just the simplest setup to see some video displayed on your TV. Even with NO coax you should see something, maybe it won't show anything but an error message, but it should show that.
This is good advice. I also wondering how long he is waiting before deciding it won't work?
I would try it on the composite cable and make sure to wait several minutes for something to happen.
mtnagel
02-13-07, 08:09 AM
Don't play the lottery :)
Sorry I got nothing for you, but it sounds like you have no luck :(
nick1817
02-13-07, 08:27 AM
You don't have to register the unit to boot it. It should go through the boot sequence and take you to channel 100 or whatever, then you have to register it. This is how mine was done.
Then again, mine isn't working anymore....
But, I'd think it would be silly to register a unit that isn't working.
Okay...an update.
I waited for a free Saturday afternoon.
I took two brand new HD DVR20-700s and installed them. All went fine. I activated them and was able to watch TV. All during this time I kept telling the software download to delay installation. After I was sure they were working properly I gave in to the constant software download reminder and let it install.
1 of the units is locked up on Step 1 of 2: Checking satellite settings... Almost done.
the other unit just has a Directv HDDDVR blue screen with no other data.
Both were activated and working fine.
I brought over an older unit and they work fine so there is no problem with the satellite feeds.
I now have gone through 7 units and not a one of them has worked after getting that download.
I'm about done. I'm sorry...I'm not usually this negative, but this is a consumer device....you should be able to plug it in and it should work. Since they control the units there should NOT be a question about software compatability...and they should be tested thorougly.
If anyone has a suggestion...I'd love to hear it.
Thanks again for all your help
jbrasure
02-24-07, 01:18 PM
You might consider switching to cable. It worked for me:
http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=77068
You might consider switching to cable. It worked for me:
http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=77068
BOOO! HISSSSS!!:uglyhamme
:listenup: I HATE COMCRAP CABLE!!!
I'm considering it...and the only reason I haven't is the MLB package. Well, that and we had Adelphia until recently and the Comcast takeover has been anything but smooth.
I am now on the phone with Directv support...they're telling me the problems in the DVR units relate to a virus in the software on the machines that is not allowing the 012 software to install properly.
Well, she had me do a reboot and press 02468 to reinstall the software. All three boxes locked up after the install on the final step of satellite settings....Almost done.
They're going to send a tech out on Monday with 3 new boxes.
veryoldschool
02-24-07, 01:49 PM
I'm considering it...and the only reason I haven't is the MLB package. Well, that and we had Adelphia until recently and the Comcast takeover has been anything but smooth.
I am now on the phone with Directv support...they're telling me the problems in the DVR units relate to a virus in the software on the machines that is not allowing the 012 software to install properly.
Well, she had me do a reboot and press 02468 to reinstall the software. All three boxes locked up after the install on the final step of satellite settings....Almost done.
They're going to send a tech out on Monday with 3 new boxes.
FWIW: I've had a lockup after a download. Once the software DLs [and it locks] what happens after you press the red button?
Mine will then boot [with the new software] & work.
You can also try to format the drive if you need to.
Tried on all 3 no change. BTW, I notice that there appear to be at least two different manufacturers of the unit. Mine have all been 700s. I wonder how much that has to do with the issue.
It's clear to me that Directv is well aware of these issues and may be working on a fix...but to continue to allow customers to waste their time and money on this unit at present is really a customer disservice. It's time for a real apology and reimbursement for the trouble they have caused.
pappasbike
02-24-07, 02:35 PM
I'm going to make a simple suggestion that you may actually have already done but it was something that threw me at first. I've actually had two units, the second one has been fine for months but with both whenever I unplugged them and plugged them in again I had to wait about 5 or 10 minutes-go make some tea or go to the bathroom- then come back and push the power button on the front. The screen would then come up showing what stage of the set up it was on and then operated normally. Each time I had plugged them back in the lights would come on, rotate and then go out completely, some times an image would come on the screen and then go black other times the screen would just be black, but each time If I just left it alone for a few minutes and then come back to press the front power button everything worked. When I first got the units I thought I had doa boxes so I was upset until I tried doing it that way. Try it and see if you haven't, either way good luck.
veryoldschool
02-24-07, 02:37 PM
I notice that there appear to be at least two different manufacturers of the unit. Mine have all been 700s. I wonder how much that has to do with the issue.
Only one manufacturer..-700..PACE.
None of my steps help?
VOS,
I'm afraid not...tried on all three sets/units. Sheesh am I disgusted.
We'll see what their tech has to say. Hey. maybe I'm missing something...maybe the guy that installed my satellite dish is a secret agent for Comcast and snuck a special DTV eliminator unit onto the line.
The units all work (well, at least from the little time they're on) fine until they receive the software download. Then none work. Resetting, Reformatting, redownloading all have proven ineffective.
veryoldschool
02-24-07, 02:53 PM
VOS,
I'm afraid not...tried on all three sets/units. Sheesh am I disgusted.
We'll see what their tech has to say. Hey. maybe I'm missing something...maybe the guy that installed my satellite dish is a secret agent for Comcast and snuck a special DTV eliminator unit onto the line.
The units all work (well, at least from the little time they're on) fine until they receive the software download. Then none work. Resetting, Reformatting, redownloading all have proven ineffective.
Weired... All are stuck on the "welcome" or one of two page?
WTF: pull the power cords for ten min or longer.
Earl Bonovich
02-24-07, 02:53 PM
Ken...
Do you have a friend or a family member that has a DirecTV dish installed?
Even if it is just an 3LNB if not a 5LNB..
That you could take one of these units too, to see if you can rule out your wiring?
I know you said you hooked up an "older" unit, but you didn't say what kind of unit it was.
Having 7 bad units... It is so far out there on the statistical probability.
7 units manufactured at 7 different times...
veryoldschool
02-24-07, 02:58 PM
What Earl said...
What cable are you using for video?
Networked?
Back to basics:
Unit worked before software. connect it up with the video cable that you used to test the non HD box. Connect one or both SAT feeds. Connect the power cord last. No other cables connected.
What happens now?
Ken...
Do you have a friend or a family member that has a DirecTV dish installed?
Even if it is just an 3LNB if not a 5LNB..
That you could take one of these units too, to see if you can rule out your wiring?
I know you said you hooked up an "older" unit, but you didn't say what kind of unit it was.
Having 7 bad units... It is so far out there on the statistical probability.
7 units manufactured at 7 different times...
Earl,
Just got back from trying that. Went to my old house and plugged in 2 of the units (one after another). reset them both...they both locked up at the same place as before. Then I brought back my trusty T60 and installed it here...it's working without a hitch. Signal strength is 95 and above on all applicable sats and transponders.
I don't think it's a statistical improbability that the same flaw in software is causing the same problem with every unit. Actually, it sounds like what a software flaw should/would do. I very much doubt this is hardware related.
I know they're not a great source...but the DirecTV phone support rep was not at all surprised. She did say I could continue to try and redownload the software over and over and I may get it to work.
DirecTV is sending over a "level 2" tech on Monday...hey I'll be delighted if I've been doing something wrong...or the wiring is incorrect and he can fix it. I'd be happy to pay for that service.
So...here's what I know.
1. It's not power related. I've tried them with and without various high-quality UPSs that have and continue to work well with other components. I have tried the units at another location.
2. It's not TV related as these units have failed to work on three separate TV sets directly as well as when they were hooked up through my Denon 4306 receiver.
3. It's not the cabling. I have tried the HDMI cables that came with the DVRs, Separate HDMI cabling that I purchased (higher quality). The HDM I cabling that I tried on the DVRs DOES work when used with a DVD player here. In addition, I have tried the DVRs with Component cabling an Svideo cable (although I didn't test all 7 with that cable)
4. It's not likely it's my inhouse cabling or the dish. The cabling in the house is all new and was tested thorougly by the installer and with me in attendance. Other cabling they installed (Cable TV, Sirius Satellite, Network and phone) all has worked without an issue. The Splitter and Dish were installed by Directv folks. They work with my older receivers.
5. I doubt it's the environment. All three locations have decent ventilation. I have no large electromagnets on or around them....and most importantly my two-year old can't reach them.
6. I have tried to install with and without the filters. Doesn't seem to make a difference.
7. I have connected them to my network and they show up on my router. When I began having issues I held off on that connection...just in case.
The similarities (other than what's above)...
1. All units were purchased from Crutchfield.
2. All units have worked well until the the software download begins
3. All of the TV sets that the units are attached to are manufactured by Sony. Two are LCD and one a rear projection...all are new.
What Earl said...
What cable are you using for video?
Networked?
Back to basics:
Unit worked before software. connect it up with the video cable that you used to test the non HD box. Connect one or both SAT feeds. Connect the power cord last. No other cables connected.
What happens now?
Locks up on the "Almost Finished" screen. Although it has only been about 45 minutes now.
veryoldschool
02-24-07, 04:17 PM
I have never ever heard about "ones" this bad.
You seem to have "the basics" down. Never has this been posted to this extreme.
No body else has posted a software issue like this. I find it hard [impossible] to see that it is software per se.
I don't normally use : never, impossible, or for that matter extreme...
And I work on the one in a thousand/million problems..........
Keep me posted.
I sure will. For now at least my trusty TIVO T60 is working.
Ed Campbell
02-24-07, 04:30 PM
[QUOTE=Ken S;846433]3. It's not the cabling. I have tried the HDMI cables that came with the DVRs, Separate HDMI cabling that I purchased (higher quality). The HDM I cabling that I tried on the DVRs DOES work when used with a DVD player here. In addition, I have tried the DVRs with Component cabling an Svideo cable (although I didn't test all 7 with that cable)
The HR20-700 doesn't come with HDMI cables.
veryoldschool
02-24-07, 04:33 PM
I sure will. For now at least my trusty TIVO T60 is working.
From your post: The Splitter and Dish were installed by Directv folks. They work with my older receivers.
This is the only thing I could dispute.
1) can't be a splitter.
2) could be a multi-switch.
3) must be a multi-switch that is for the NEW system & not the OLD.
4) the 5 LNB dish needs a Zinwell WB68 multi-switch
IF you haven't.... remove the "splitter" & connect straight to the dish, you only need one cable & connect it to SAT 1
reset --RBR
tell me what....
You may be hanging on not having all of the SATs come on-line through the "splitter".
Here waiting...
veryoldschool
02-24-07, 04:34 PM
The HR20-700 doesn't come with HDMI cables.
new ones do now.
One thing I learned, never do an update with the HDMI output as your display. It seems to miss the initial screens before it gets to the "1 of 2" page. I usually hook up component cables and switch my plasma over to the component from DVI. That way I can watch the download progress.
veryoldschool
02-24-07, 04:50 PM
One thing I learned, never do an update with the HDMI output as your display. It seems to miss the initial screens before it gets to the "1 of 2" page. I usually hook up component cables and switch my plasma over to the component from DVI. That way I can watch the download progress.
Good for some & not an issue for others. I use HDMI & never need to change.
Ken is getting "hung" much later in the sequence, FWIW & tried non HDMI connection.
From your post: The Splitter and Dish were installed by Directv folks. They work with my older receivers.
This is the only thing I could dispute.
1) can't be a splitter.
2) could be a multi-switch.
3) must be a multi-switch that is for the NEW system & not the OLD.
4) the 5 LNB dish needs a Zinwell WB68 multi-switch
IF you haven't.... remove the "splitter" & connect straight to the dish, you only need one cable & connect it to SAT 1
reset --RBR
tell me what....
You may be hanging on not having all of the SATs come on-line through the "splitter".
Here waiting...
My mistake it is a Zinwell multiswitch. I listed it earlier in the thread. Remember the units work fine and get good strong signal before the software update. It is also working fine with my T60 in all 3 locations...well for 5 mins each in 2 of them and for the last several hours in the 3rd.
It may be worth a try, I'll have to make some cables to do so.
I'll try to update this thread again on Monday if/when the Directv tech shows up.
veryoldschool
02-24-07, 06:13 PM
I'll try to update this thread again on Monday if/when the Directv tech shows up.
If you have a barrel connector that should work for a jumper. Your T60 isn't HD right?
Still trying to figure......my nature until I fix something.
Good for some & not an issue for others. I use HDMI & never need to change.
Ken is getting "hung" much later in the sequence, FWIW & tried non HDMI connection.
I use an HDMI>DVI cable. Maybe it has something to do with the display itself not being able to display the first few screens on DVI? I just recall sitting there for like 15 minutes wondering what was going on.
veryoldschool
02-24-07, 06:44 PM
I use an HDMI>DVI cable. Maybe it has something to do with the display itself not being able to display the first few screens on DVI? I just recall sitting there for like 15 minutes wondering what was going on.
You're not the only one. I don't think it's the HDMI>DVI but all of this does depend on "what's on the other end" [TV]. I didn't have the problem with my Sony DVI & don't with my Sony HDMI, but others do with their TVs......FWIW
I use an HDMI>DVI cable. Maybe it has something to do with the display itself not being able to display the first few screens on DVI? I just recall sitting there for like 15 minutes wondering what was going on.
I'm not sure about the tv you have jaybee but a lot of the first tv's equipped with HDMI could not accept a 480i signal. I think that the first few screens in the boot sequence on the hr20 are 480i. I'm sure this is intentional because you can use this DVR for SD. But I'd be willing to bet that your TV cannot accept 480i over HDMI.
Back on topic. I hope you get this problem fixed. By the way I don't remember seeing whether or not you have bbc's connected or not. My HR20 exibited the same behavior with broken bbc's connected. It would not boot up all the way. I still haven't attached 2 working bbc's yet. I had them send me new ones but they were both broken again.
jmschnur
02-24-07, 08:33 PM
Seems like its the switch or the sat. What does 12a do differently?
veryoldschool
02-24-07, 08:40 PM
Seems like its the switch or the sat. What does 12a do differently?
It would very much depend on what the "old" software was.
I downloaded 12a today on a new HR20, first try, no problems.
Carl
I'm not sure about the tv you have jaybee but a lot of the first tv's equipped with HDMI could not accept a 480i signal. I think that the first few screens in the boot sequence on the hr20 are 480i. I'm sure this is intentional because you can use this DVR for SD. But I'd be willing to bet that your TV cannot accept 480i over HDMI.
Back on topic. I hope you get this problem fixed. By the way I don't remember seeing whether or not you have bbc's connected or not. My HR20 exibited the same behavior with broken bbc's connected. It would not boot up all the way. I still haven't attached 2 working bbc's yet. I had them send me new ones but they were both broken again.
I have BBCs connected...but have tried a few times without.
I downloaded 12a today on a new HR20, first try, no problems.
Carl
Carl,
Just wondering...if you open the card door. What's the model number? Is it a 700?
veryoldschool
02-25-07, 08:03 AM
Carl,
Just wondering...if you open the card door. What's the model number? Is it a 700?
They're all made by PACE & -700.
Correct, it is a -700, the only available model right now.
I also agree that the odds of having six new HR20's exhibit the exact same problem are pretty slim, and that the source of the problem may be elsewhere. I would absolutely go back to the very basics: Nothing connected except the two sat feeds and a SD video connection. Straight coax feeds to the dish, bypassing any multiswitches. At that point if it doesn't work, swap the two coax feeds, or if another pair of coax is available, switch to those. Eliminate every other possible factor or variable. If for some reason you can't use two coax feeds directly to the dish, unplug (don't just turn off) every other receiver in the house while trying the software download. Doing all this, and still have the same problem on two consecutive HR20's, I'd replace the LNB assembly.
Carl
Monday report.
Directv technician came by the house pretty early. I showed him the problem and we decided to get all of the DVRs out and set up a test station in my garage (by the cable cabinet and multiswitch.
1. Signal tested great behind and infront of the multiswitch in all locations. So he discounted the dish/multiswitch being the issue.
2. We then took the three latest and set them up using a little monitor I had available.
3. Plugged in all applicable cables (sat feeds, network, phone and a standard video connection (old style was all this monitor would accept).
4. All three of the boxes locked up again after displaying the 2nd "Almost Done" screen.
5. We then took my sole remaining unopened DVR (thanks again Crutchfield!) and tried a fresh install. Install worked, TV channels showed, download happened...DVR locked up.
6. We then had 4 DVRs all setup and tried different cable configurations. 1 with all, 1 with phone no network, 1 with network no phone, 1 with 1 sat feed, 1 with filters, 1 with no filters.
HERE'S WHAT WE FOUND:
If you plug in all cables (including network) with the older software it will install and work properly. When the new software downloads the box will lock up.
If you reset the box with the network installed it will continue to lock up
If you reformat with the network cable installed it will continue to lock up
If you remove the network cable, redo the download and allow the box to reset the box will work
So, it appears after about 2.5 hours of more testing it is the network cable that is causing the issue.
Strangely, even though the boxes locked up they were logging into the network and working properly in that regard as I could see them on my router.
So...we reinstalled the units at the three locations without network...did re-download and reformated all of the boxes and they seem to be working (I haven't done anything more than watch some channels).
I don't mind not having the network at the present time as it didn't seem to do anything. Only reason they were hooked up was because a DirecTV tech rep told me to do it that way.
A little more data:
There are 8 DVRs here...we tested them all. Without the network issue it appears 5 work (show TV...I can't speak for DVR functions yet), two had bad tuners (tuner 2 on both). One powered up and worked for about 10 mins and then locked up with all lights going out. The tech didn't want to open it but thought it was an overheating issue as the fan just didn't sound right.
Anyway...hopefully...I'll now get to deal with the little annoying bugs for awhile that you're all fighting with. Thank you for all of your help and support.
So, despite what the quick setup guide says...just say no to the network connection.
bonscott87
02-26-07, 09:24 AM
Having the network connected is a known issue for some people when booting up the box. You can simply plug it in after you have booted up. Most don't have an issue but there might be something unique on your network causing the issue. In any case, glad you got it tracked down.
I'm sorry I didn't notice if you mentioned network cable before but would have suggested to not have it connected. I do think others have suggested to only have the most basic connections (coax to dish and video cable only) to see what happens. Must not have tried before with sat and video cables only?
Anyway, glad you got it figured out and good luck!
So, it appears after about 2.5 hours of more testing it is the network cable that is causing the issue.You had been counseled early on not to hook up the network cable. It was, and still is, good advice.
Generally, the less extra (or exotic) stuff you have connected, the less likely that you'll have trouble. All that is required to get going is a connection to the satellite and a simple connection to a television. Because there may be machines out there that don't understand networking, USB, eSATA and OTA, they probably should not be connected when trying to fire up a receiver for the first time. HDMI may be a problem with some Walmart house brands and Samsung televisions.
Once the software is updated, you can try adding things back one at a time.
veryoldschool
02-26-07, 09:40 AM
See post #44
I knew.....
judson_west
02-26-07, 09:53 AM
While it appears that the network connection was the culprit, just disconnecting it did not solve the problem. Once disconnected, you have to re-download the software to get the DVR back to a working state.
Judson, correct. We had to disconnect the network, redownload the update and reformat the HD to get it all to work correct. The reformat might not be necessary but since that procedure worked on the first we just replicated it on all three.
I have not reconnected the network cables.
Harsh,
By the time people said to not connect the network they had already been done. Unless and until you do the whole recovery process above it won't work.
BTW, I was also told it was my Dish, the LNBs, TV connections, cables, Multiswitch, etc. Obviously, it took setting up an entire test environment and plugging through everything step by step to get this consumer device to work. The tech support at Directv was of no assistance and they have not made any mention of this type of issue to their reseller partners like Crutchfield.
I'm going to disagree with you on your other statement. Directv controls the box and controls the feed. They should put out boxes that work per their manuals. Plugging a network cable into a computer IS NOT exotic in 2007.
Certainly, this is an issue that a QA department should have found. Even if the problem couldn't have been found there should have been information on the issue and...this is a wild one...error recovery or warning messages in the software/firmware.
Now, early on if I knew that might be a problem (like in the manual or on their website, or when I talked to their reps) I wouldn't have done it. I wasn't looking for problems...just the functionality advertised.
As for having to install with one type of connection to a tv and then go to others...that also is not something any consumer device should require.
Anyway...perhaps what we should do in this forum is sticky an "Installing a new HD DVR20" post and send it to Directv. I'd be happy to participate if you all think it's a good idea.
VOS, I suspected this early on...the mistake I made was not thinking it was causing a problem after it appeared to be working properly...the network access.
Should have gone back to my QA roots and done what I did this morning earlier...as ridiculous as that is for a "released" consumer device.
veryoldschool
02-26-07, 02:29 PM
VOS, I suspected this early on...the mistake I made was not thinking it was causing a problem after it appeared to be working properly...the network access.
Should have gone back to my QA roots and done what I did this morning earlier...as ridiculous as that is for a "released" consumer device.
It's not like I've never "gotten lost" with my troubleshooting before.
At some point the upgrade [with network added] did cross my "one in a thousand" check list.
It's working....great & I learned that "re-downloading" could be needed. I don't have the network connected so I didn't know that. I like learning more each day. :)
litzdog911
02-27-07, 12:58 AM
That DirecTV installer/technician also deserves an award. Awesome troubleshooting job!
Supervolcano
02-27-07, 04:04 AM
A little more data:
There are 8 DVRs here...we tested them all. Without the network issue it appears 5 work (show TV...I can't speak for DVR functions yet), two had bad tuners (tuner 2 on both). One powered up and worked for about 10 mins and then locked up with all lights going out. The tech didn't want to open it but thought it was an overheating issue as the fan just didn't sound right.
Re: The bold print in that quote.
Hehehe :D
Glad you got those 2 units replaced that had a bad tuner #2.
And really glad you had 8 receivers sitting there at one time with a great installer to PROVE BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT that those 2 tuners were HARDWARE MALFUNCTIONS.
Some people around here still believe this tuner #2 problem is a software issue, even after all the posts about people's replacement receivers fixing it immediately.
:nono2:
finaldiet
02-27-07, 06:27 AM
:D :D [QUOTE=Ken S;846433]3. It's not the cabling. I have tried the HDMI cables that came with the DVRs, Separate HDMI cabling that I purchased (higher quality). The HDM I cabling that I tried on the DVRs DOES work when used with a DVD player here. In addition, I have tried the DVRs with Component cabling an Svideo cable (although I didn't test all 7 with that cable)
The HR20-700 doesn't come with HDMI cables.
ED
Both of my units came with HDMI cables and thats how I have them hooked up. Works great!!
Re: The bold print in that quote.
Hehehe :D
Glad you got those 2 units replaced that had a bad tuner #2.
And really glad you had 8 receivers sitting there at one time with a great installer to PROVE BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT that those 2 tuners were HARDWARE MALFUNCTIONS.
Some people around here still believe this tuner #2 problem is a software issue, even after all the posts about people's replacement receivers fixing it immediately.
:nono2:
Well, it could be a software/firmware problem...but it wasn't one that was going to be fixed by re-downloading, formatting, rebooting or me standing on my head while wiggling my toes during the remote control programming session :)
Here we go again. Went down to the set in my living room to check the recordings and they're all blank. I then notice that Tuner 1 is not receiving any signal. I swap it with the cable going into Tuner 2...no change. Alhough, strangely with no cable in Tuner 2 at all on some Transponders Sat was receiving a 43% signal.
Tried with and without the filters. Tried the other two units..they're fine for now.
Tried yet another reboot..no luck.
Directv really has released a load of crap to some of its best customers. They should be ashamed.
Sorry to bitch at you folks...just hoping that someone at DirecTV reads this and understand how much hassle they are putting their customers through...although in releasing this unit...my guess is they don't much care.
veryoldschool
02-27-07, 10:25 AM
Here we go again. Went down to the set in my living room to check the recordings and they're all blank. I then notice that Tuner 1 is not receiving any signal. I swap it with the cable going into Tuner 2...no change. Alhough, strangely with no cable in Tuner 2 at all on some Transponders Sat was receiving a 43% signal.
Tried with and without the filters. Tried the other two units..they're fine for now.
Directv really has released a load of crap to some of its best customers. They should be ashamed.
There is a lot of "shame" to be passed out. This looks more like it should go to PACE, the builder under contract to D*.
Have you activated them yet, if not I would return them and same your self a ton of frustation.
I did activate them as DirecTV informed me the problems early on were being caused by them not being activated. I can return them either way as Crutchfield treats their customers very well. I can't say enough good about Crutchfield or bad about DirecTV at the moment.
Seriously, if it weren't for the MLB package DirecTV would have lost a long-term customer. I'm seriously considering putting a PC in my cabinet and using the mlb.com package on my big screen. It's cheaper and they don't cut games off in the bottom of the ninth inning because someone is too lazy to look at the game and just assumes it's over.
But, that's a discussion for another forum. I'll stop the whining at least until I get in trouble for chucking one of these units out a window...cause knowing my luck with them they'll hit my wife. Then not only won't I have satellite TV...I won't have a home or kids :)
So you had 3 out of 8 bad, I had 3 out of 4 (if you can consider the one I have now working, I don't), two relatives of mine are 1 out of 2 and some one else here said they are on their 4th also :eek2:
I wonder where all the people on here saying theirs work perfectly got one from :nono2:
bonscott87
02-27-07, 11:47 AM
Here we go again. Went down to the set in my living room to check the recordings and they're all blank. I then notice that Tuner 1 is not receiving any signal. I swap it with the cable going into Tuner 2...no change. Alhough, strangely with no cable in Tuner 2 at all on some Transponders Sat was receiving a 43% signal.
Tried with and without the filters. Tried the other two units..they're fine for now.
Tried yet another reboot..no luck.
Directv really has released a load of crap to some of its best customers. They should be ashamed.
Sorry to bitch at you folks...just hoping that someone at DirecTV reads this and understand how much hassle they are putting their customers through...although in releasing this unit...my guess is they don't much care.
How many receivers in total do you have connected to the one dish? And how long are your cable runs, in particular the length on the receiver(s) that have the problem? Reason I ask is that once you reach a certain point in number of tuners and a lot of cable the system can be underpowered which will exibit the issues you are seeing. There is a long thread about powering your dish with a $50 Sonora power booster/signal locker that has solved this problem for several other people. I planned on buying one myself but I'm gonig to wait for the new powered FTM switch to be released instead.
treehugger165
02-27-07, 12:01 PM
hello all,
long time listener, first time caller:-).
its is all so important with long cable runs that the installer use "solid copper core" cable and not just "copper clad". if the right cable is used, this will save to subscriber having to purchase a power booster. just fyi...
How many receivers in total do you have connected to the one dish? And how long are your cable runs, in particular the length on the receiver(s) that have the problem? Reason I ask is that once you reach a certain point in number of tuners and a lot of cable the system can be underpowered which will exibit the issues you are seeing. There is a long thread about powering your dish with a $50 Sonora power booster/signal locker that has solved this problem for several other people. I planned on buying one myself but I'm gonig to wait for the new powered FTM switch to be released instead.
There are three receivers and the cable runs are maybe 75 feet at the longest. The cabling is all new copper core RG6. I really doubt this has anything to do with the cabling. BTW, signal to all receivers on all applicable satellites and transponders is always over 95.
I also doubt that the receiver telling me it's getting 43% signal on a tuner that has no cable attached whatsoever is a bit questionable. I guess it's possible that inside the cabinet the F jack could be picking up signal...more likely it's another software bug or some nasty bleed through from one tuner to the other.
The score right now is 7 receivers...All that locked up with the software/network cable problem and 3 with bad tuners.
Pace made some very shoddy equipment (lowest cost bidder?) and DirecTV accepted it and either didn't bother to test, did wholly inadequate testing or didn't care about the test results before making this item available. It's also not like we're talking brand spanking new technology here. For some reason the folks at Tivo have been able to make fairly stable (they have their bugs too) machines.
veryoldschool
02-27-07, 01:46 PM
I won't go into my "pet peeve" but to say....the end user is the only one that does any "testing" of these units. The current "state" of manufacturing has deemed "testing" to be a waste of resources. As the "spreadsheet boys" look to improve the bottom line, QA/QC and final testing are one of the first things that go.
I'm going to disagree with you on your other statement. Directv controls the box and controls the feed. They should put out boxes that work per their manuals. Plugging a network cable into a computer IS NOT exotic in 2007.Hooking up the network cable is not one of the installation steps in the manual. In fact, there is no mention of LAN or networking anywhere in the manual. The Ethernet jack is explained as being "For future use".Certainly, this is an issue that a QA department should have found. Even if the problem couldn't have been found there should have been information on the issue and...this is a wild one...error recovery or warning messages in the software/firmware.Don't get the impression that I'm a D* apologist. I have lots of issues with the way they are doing business.Now, early on if I knew that might be a problem (like in the manual or on their website, or when I talked to their reps) I wouldn't have done it. I wasn't looking for problems...just the functionality advertised.This is one big reason why they demand "professional installations".As for having to install with one type of connection to a tv and then go to others...that also is not something any consumer device should require.I don't think anyone will dispute that, but as long as Walmart and Samsung offer HDMI connected televisions, it is good advice to start small and work your way up.Anyway...perhaps what we should do in this forum is sticky an "Installing a new HD DVR20" post and send it to Directv. I'd be happy to participate if you all think it's a good idea.As the installations are supposed to be done by professionals, I'm not sure it is a good idea to get involved in the process. I wince every time someone says "I did it myself... piece of pie".
Near the top of my list of DirecTV beefs is that if you ask three DirecTV reps a question (like how to install a receiver), you may get as many as four conflicting answers... and they may all be wrong. There is a thread here titled " What the Deals are, and what are you being told by CSR?" which is approaching 1,300 messages. DirecTV's left hand doesn't seem to have a clue what the right hand is doing.
I only wish that more people did their due diligence here before getting hogtied into a commitment with a satellite programming provider. I have to take a deep breath every time I see someone saying "my first post" together with something about how it isn't what they thought it would be.
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