Torn on whether or not to get D* [Archive]

leake79

03-09-07, 03:33 PM

I'm really having a hard time deciding on whether or not to get DirecTV, and I really don't know what to do. Here's my situation...

I recently moved out of my home state, and have the local cable with a S3 Tivo that I purchased in fall of 06. My cable company is ok, they are supposedly adding a few more HD channels this month and I have no complaints with the picture quality. However, the main reason I DO want to switch is the NFL and now MLB packages and the promise of more HD channels. But the the main reason I DON'T want to is my S3, which is amazing, imo. I've heard such negative comments on the H20, it's making me very reluctant to switch. But missing my Bears and Cardinals games might be too much to take.

Any advice is appreciated.

veryoldschool

03-09-07, 03:58 PM

DubMarc

03-09-07, 05:02 PM

I think on this one it's going to be hard for someone to steer you the right way because no one can tell just how much it's worth to you to be able to see your teams play.

Personally, if it were me, I would make the switch, but I also never had an S3 (although I do still have an older DirecTivo), nor have I had an HR20 for very long. Although in the short time I have had it, I've already needed to although I've already needed to reset a couple times -- once more than the past few years combined for the Tivo. Even so, years ago, I had to relocate for almost a year, and I missed my sports a lot. Wish I would've had the option to pick them up.

lwilli201

03-09-07, 05:09 PM

If you can afford it, get both. Get the basic service required by D* to get your sports packs. If you like D* then dump the cable. The quality of cable varies widely, so if you have good qualify cable, I can understand your problem.

harsh

03-09-07, 05:31 PM

But the the main reason I DON'T want to is my S3, which is amazing, imo. I've heard such negative comments on the H20, it's making me very reluctant to switch.You have to make the decision based on what is really important. Is it more important to reliably record the content that you get, or to have access to the content that you desire.

One thing I do recommend: don't jump based on promises. Jump because what you want is already where you're jumping to. Imagine all of those who bought S3s with the idea that some day their cable company would support them (or those who jumped to Comcast with the idea that they would roll out TiVo many moons ago).

If you're going to go there anyway, sell your S3 and use the proceeds to pay for the HR20 lease and an EI subscription. It is relatively certain that DirecTV will have a lock (even if it isn't exclusive) on the mostest NFL and MLB programming for a while. A DVR, regardless of what it cost or how wonderful you think it is, is of limited value without access to the content that you desire.

Taco Lover

03-09-07, 06:33 PM

I'll give you $200 for your S3. :)

boba

03-09-07, 08:49 PM

MLB EI isn't exclusive to D* so you really don't need to decide until NFL in Sept. be patient and see how the market develops.

terryfoster

03-09-07, 08:57 PM

... with a S3 Tivo that I purchased in fall of 06.

Don't forget that you're still probably under a 12 month commitment with TiVo.

Sneezy

03-09-07, 09:00 PM

Don't get an R15 unit. Mines a POS and all they have told me is to wait for a new software release. They expect it to be less than 3 months away.

nice.

leake79

03-09-07, 09:42 PM

Don't forget that you're still probably under a 12 month commitment with TiVo.

I've got a lifetime sub on my S3, so I don't need to worry about that. I'm hoping that if I do try to sell it, that will increase it's value.

MLB EI isn't exclusive to D* so you really don't need to decide until NFL in Sept. be patient and see how the market develops.

From what I've read today, EI is essentially going to be exclusive, it really comes down to whether or not my cable company agrees to whatever terms were negotiated in the MLB/D* contract. Another small problem I have with that is I can't get any PPV channels on my HDTV because Tivo can't receive those channels with the current cable cards.

I appreciate the reply's, I think it's just going to come down to how bad I want to watch my teams.

SDizzle

03-09-07, 10:13 PM

Compare the monthly costs between cable and D* as well (not counting any INTRO offers). I know I saved a great deal going from Comcrap to D* a few years back, and I am a ST/SF sub. I think D* offers great customer sevice as well, Comcrap was HORRIBLE. I have had a few D* Tivos, and the HR10-250, and I have really started to like the HR20 more, a few issues here, but, at least D* is working with us to correct the issues. Make the decision based on what D* currently has and what your cable company currently has, don't let what they "may" have sway you, cause it may not happen.

bidger

03-10-07, 08:30 AM

I appreciate the reply's, I think it's just going to come down to how bad I want to watch my teams.

IMO, that's part of the picture, but you'll have to decide how attached you are to your DVR platform.

I have to believe you bought the S3 for a reason. I personally have been with TiVo for over 7 years, but I'm not devout enough to spend between $620-$800 plus a Lifetime transfer fee on a machine whose future I'm not convinced on, but you did. I'd hazard a guess that any other DVR you might audition, you'd constantly be comparing to TiVo. I'm more of a DVR enthusiast who doesn't find a lot of TiVo's features that "must have", have found the HR20 to be reliable, and my priority is programming, not the DVR platform.

Long story short, to this point, I don't regret my choice of the HR20, but I can see how a die-hard TiVotee might. If there's a D* retailer or other B&M retailer in your area with connected D* equipment you can sample, you might want to go and play with a HR20 before you make the leap.

Good luck with your decision.

finaldiet

03-10-07, 08:56 AM

GO FOR IT!!!! I have had 2 for about a month now. No problems at all and found it easy to operate. Going on 66 and if I can do it, anybody can!:D :lol:

leake79

03-10-07, 09:17 AM

IMO, that's part of the picture, but you'll have to decide how attached you are to your DVR platform.

I have to believe you bought the S3 for a reason. I personally have been with TiVo for over 7 years, but I'm not devout enough to spend between $620-$800 plus a Lifetime transfer fee on a machine whose future I'm not convinced on, but you did. I'd hazard a guess that any other DVR you might audition, you'd constantly be comparing to TiVo. I'm more of a DVR enthusiast who doesn't find a lot of TiVo's features that "must have", have found the HR20 to be reliable, and my priority is programming, not the DVR platform.

Long story short, to this point, I don't regret my choice of the HR20, but I can see how a die-hard TiVotee might. If there's a D* retailer or other B&M retailer in your area with connected D* equipment you can sample, you might want to go and play with a HR20 before you make the leap.

Good luck with your decision.

I'm a huge fan of Tivo, but mostly because of the reliability factor. I almost never watch anything live, unless it's sports, and because of this I count on my DVR recording my programs reliably. I don't use too many features on the Tivo other than season pass and the wishlist. I assume the HR20 has something like a season pass feature, but I don't know about wishlist.

I'm definitely going to try to check the HR20 somewhere before I decide to switch. Where is the best place to go check one out?

bidger

03-10-07, 10:34 AM

IMO, an exclusive satellite retailer who would be tolerant and obliging of letting you play around with the equipment. I mean as far as using the remote, let you view any recordings already on the unit, and maybe let you set up & view a half-hour recording of something current in the Guide. I don't know if Best Buy or Circuit City would be that understanding to let you fool around with their setups.

veryoldschool

03-10-07, 10:40 AM

I'm a huge fan of Tivo, but mostly because of the reliability factor. I almost never watch anything live, unless it's sports, and because of this I count on my DVR recording my programs reliably. I don't use too many features on the Tivo other than season pass and the wishlist. I assume the HR20 has something like a season pass feature, but I don't know about wishlist.
I'm definitely going to try to check the HR20 somewhere before I decide to switch. Where is the best place to go check one out?
What you call..... "season pass", we call.... "series link".
Now remember: don't listen to me....:lol:

dhaakenson

03-10-07, 12:48 PM

When making decisions like this, it's always good to also include the opinions of a respected website, such as CNet.com, into the mix of opinions, rather than merely listening to all the bstalk.com parrots who gleefully chirp, "gee, mine works great!"

When CNet recently lowered its rating of the HR20 (due to worsening bugs it experienced on a test box), it noted that the many customer reviews on its site actually rated the HR20 even lower. They added an editor's note about that. Here are some excerpts:

"The bottom line is that more users have suffered more serious complaints with the HR20 than we've seen on any other HD DVR we've reviewed in the past."

"I also think, given the range and consistency of user complaints on our site and other places online, that prospective HR20 buyers need to think twice about upgrading."

"If you do decide to upgrade, you might get a unit that functions well, or one that does not."

"The more complaints the company receives from actual subscribers, the more likely it is to address the issues in future software updates."

http://help.cnet.com/9602-12576_39-0.html?messageID=2509294

So, you be the judge. The parrots will say don't listen to that noise. The HR20 is improving, with repeated software updates. But the parrots have been saying that for months. And the bugs just keep on biting.

My advice to you: Get an HR20. As the reviewer said, you "might get a unit that functions well". If you don't, there are folks on this forum who will try to help you work through the bugs, and D* will work with you if you do get a bad unit (to get you a replacement) and has said it will offer programming and lease credits if the HR20 mangles your entertainment experience. The HR20 is great when it works. But be prepared for some possible bumps. And be aware that it will never, ever match the experience of your S3 TiVo (in my opinion).

JLucPicard

03-10-07, 05:54 PM

I'm not just trying to be contrary and the points dhaakenson makes are very valid.

I don't follow the S3 thread at tivocommunity or anything, but I thought I heard the S3 had it's own problems? If that is/was true, they could certainly have worked them out, too. Sounds like your S3 experience is great, so I could be thinking wrong. I also thought I read in another thread here that there are possibly some compatability problems with Cable Cards and some things that TW is doing with HD. Not sure if TW is your cable company, though.

Also, the article cited above while certainly worth reading and considering, is almost two months old now, and there have been some changes for the better with the HR20 since then.

Good luck with your decision!

veryoldschool

03-10-07, 06:18 PM

I'll still go for: Don't listen to me.

cnmsales

03-10-07, 06:37 PM

Dont know about you but in my neck of the woods cable is crap. I love D* it is by far and above better then anything else out there. As far as customer satisfaction goes I have to tell you that I have NEVER called D* with a complaint and not been satisfied to the fullest. Now on to the hr20. Its not a tivo thats for sure, but it does some things tivos dont. That being said now that I have started getting used to the hr20 its pretty good. Its only gunna get better with time. If you do decide to call D* let them know your currently with X company and thinking of switching. Once you do that you can probably get some extras thrown in to sweeten the pot.

leake79

03-10-07, 08:14 PM

For those that do have the HR20, I'm wondering a bit about it's functionality.

It sounds like it does have a season pass function (series link), but does it also have options to record only first run shows, or first run and repeats? Does it allow to record shows at different quality levels?

I haven't been able to find any retail stores that would let me play around with one, and I'm just curious about the functionality differences between the two. Again, thanks for all the reply's, you guys are definitely helping me make an informed decision.

veryoldschool

03-10-07, 08:19 PM

For those that do have the HR20, I'm wondering a bit about it's functionality.
It sounds like it does have a season pass function (series link), but does it also have options to record only first run shows, or first run and repeats? Does it allow to record shows at different quality levels?
I haven't been able to find any retail stores that would let me play around with one, and I'm just curious about the functionality differences between the two. Again, thanks for all the reply's, you guys are definitely helping me make an informed decision.
it also have options to record only first run shows, or first run and repeats? yes
Does it allow to record shows at different quality levels? no

heisman

03-10-07, 09:48 PM

You do realize that the S3 will be a doorstop in the near future.

leake79

03-10-07, 09:59 PM

You do realize that the S3 will be a doorstop in the near future.

Please don't try to hijack this thread, I've been very impressed with the informed and non-biased responses so far. But I guess it was only a matter of time before the trolls came out.

heisman

03-10-07, 10:41 PM

Huh??? It's called SDV, jackass!

veryoldschool

03-10-07, 11:05 PM

Huh??? It's called SDV, jackass!
Well this was a classy reply.
Do we really need this? :)

heisman

03-10-07, 11:18 PM

Well this was a classy reply.
Do we really need this? :)

He called me a troll when I was trying to help. I don't know what a troll is, but it doesn't sound like a compliment. :)

veryoldschool

03-10-07, 11:31 PM

He called me a troll when I was trying to help. I don't know what a troll is, but it doesn't sound like a compliment. :)
Not directly, but I see your point...:)

Troll & jackass aren't the same [in my book] but still.....
This forum does show class [for the most part] even when I don't. :D

Harold Brown

03-11-07, 12:20 AM

Dolly

03-11-07, 12:27 AM

If you want Sports, D is what you want :sunsmile: Even if they won't carry The Tennis Channel :beatdeadhorse:

leake79

03-11-07, 10:39 AM

He called me a troll when I was trying to help. I don't know what a troll is, but it doesn't sound like a compliment. :)

I'm not sure how you were helping, if you have some information that I'm not aware of then I'd love to hear it. Sorry for calling you out, I should have just not responded. No hard feelings. :)

harsh

03-11-07, 10:56 AM

Does it allow to record shows at different quality levels?Current satellite DVRs from both DirecTV and Dish Network record the satellite feed at 100%; they do not re-compress it.

arxaw

03-11-07, 11:25 AM

leake79,
In your first post, you mentioned an H20. Be sure to not confuse the H20 HD Receiver with the HR20 HD DVR.

heisman

03-11-07, 01:33 PM

I'm not sure how you were helping, if you have some information that I'm not aware of then I'd love to hear it. Sorry for calling you out, I should have just not responded. No hard feelings. :)

No, none at all. The cable companies are switching to SDV, which allows them enough bandwidth to compete with D* in HD. The S3 will not work with SDV. So, it depends on where you live, but where I live, they have said that by the end of the year, their current cable cards will be obsolete.

TheRatPatrol

03-11-07, 01:55 PM

No, none at all. The cable companies are switching to SDV, which allows them enough bandwidth to compete with D* in HD. The S3 will not work with SDV. So, it depends on where you live, but where I live, they have said that by the end of the year, their current cable cards will be obsolete.
Actually from what I've heard thats true.

To the OP, you can always keep your S3 and use it for recording OTA only and use the HR20 to record pay channels, or use both to record 4 OTA channels at once. :D

BTW, you said that you had a lifetime subscription, was this transferred from another Tivo box, or was this a new lifetime subscription? I'm asking because I thought Tivo didn't have lifetime subscriptions anymore, that no matter what you still had a $12.95 to $19.95 a month fee.

arxaw

03-11-07, 02:01 PM

heisman,
What is SDV?

TheRatPatrol

03-11-07, 02:05 PM

heisman,
What is SDV?
Switched Digital Video. But I'm not sure how it works exactly.

Yo1

03-11-07, 02:16 PM

I'm switching to Cable starting Tuesday.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I finally did it.I switched to cable.I finally got so fed up with D* that I'm having a cable installer come over this Tuesday.I purchased a Tivo series 3 HD DVR I can't wait.I believe I'll have no problems compared to the HR20-700.I like what everyone is trying to do on here but I'm going to check this out for a little while.I'm getting Time-Warner out of Milwaukee for my service provider.I''ll let you know how it is.

arxaw

03-11-07, 02:22 PM

Switched Digital Video. But I'm not sure how it works exactly.Maybe it works similar to AT&T's IPTV? It only sends the channel(s) to your house that you are watching at any given time.

heisman

03-11-07, 02:26 PM

Maybe it works similar to AT&T's IPTV? It only sends the channel(s) to your house that you are watching at any given time.

Yeah, pretty much. The headend decides what channel you receive. So, current cable cards don't have two way communication capabilities. It is different hardware also, so no amount of software or firmware upgrading will help either. Thus, any device using current cablecard technology will not operate properly.

leake79

03-11-07, 03:12 PM

BTW, you said that you had a lifetime subscription, was this transferred from another Tivo box, or was this a new lifetime subscription? I'm asking because I thought Tivo didn't have lifetime subscriptions anymore, that no matter what you still had a $12.95 to $19.95 a month fee.

I transferred it from a S2 tivo that I had lifetime sub on, that's the only way tivo allows lifetimes subs now, and I think it was only valid on S3's purchased through the end of last year.

Heisman, thanks for the info, I was not aware of any of that information. I was actually planning on getting Uverse, until I realized it did not work on my S3. Factoring in that, and the new MLB package, it really only leaves me with switching, or going without seeing my teams. I'm a sports nut, so the decision is probably already made, I just have to come to terms with it. :lol:

TheRatPatrol

03-11-07, 06:31 PM

Yeah, pretty much. The headend decides what channel you receive. So, current cable cards don't have two way communication capabilities. It is different hardware also, so no amount of software or firmware upgrading will help either. Thus, any device using current cablecard technology will not operate properly.
So what happens when everyone in one area are tuned to the same channel, say for the Superbowl? I'm guessing that it wouldn't make a difference if everyone was on the same channel, but if everyone was on different channels, would that make a difference? Just trying to figure out how it all works.

veryoldschool

03-11-07, 06:53 PM

So what happens when everyone in one area are tuned to the same channel, say for the Superbowl? I'm guessing that it wouldn't make a difference if everyone was on the same channel, but if everyone was on different channels, would that make a difference? Just trying to figure out how it all works.
With some "cable background": they use fiber to a node, where they shift to copper [RF].
So the channels available [limit] would only be within the node [or neighborhood], as they would all be on the fiber(s).
Then again I could be completely full of it. FWIW

arxaw

03-11-07, 07:06 PM

So what happens when everyone in one area are tuned to the same channel, say for the Superbowl? I'm guessing that it wouldn't make a difference if everyone was on the same channel, but if everyone was on different channels, would that make a difference? Just trying to figure out how it all works.I was told the way AT&T's works is all the channels are sent to the neighborhood node. From there to your house is a private non-shared connection on twisted pair copper. There has to be a limit to how many channels you could simultaneously watch from your single twisted pair connection though.

brianct1972

03-11-07, 07:34 PM

I have had an S3 for about 3 months, and the HR20 for the last two weeks. I thought for sure I would hate the HR20 after all the negative comments about it on here, but shockingly its just as good as the S3!! I know its not a Tivo, but I am extremely pleased with it. So pleased my Lifetime S3 may be seeing eBay in the very near future.....my CableCards worked perfectly when I had Adelphia. Since the switch to Comcast, I have had nothing but problems with the cards. At one point they were both down for over two weeks (hence my call to D*). One card is at about 90% now, the second card at about 50%.
Heisman is correct, SDV is real, Comast will roll it out by years end. It wont make the S3 a doorstop right away, you just wouldnt be able to get any new channels, or channels they decide to switch over.

heisman

03-11-07, 09:18 PM

So what happens when everyone in one area are tuned to the same channel, say for the Superbowl? I'm guessing that it wouldn't make a difference if everyone was on the same channel, but if everyone was on different channels, would that make a difference? Just trying to figure out how it all works.

They aren't going to put local channels on it. They'll keep them in the clear.

For the channels that will use SDV, the more homes (from the same headend) that are tuned to that channel, the lower the picture quality--from what I have been told. Should be interesting to say the least.