Still no OTA channel 2?

[raramaker]

I still receive no signal on WWMT-DT (channel 2) from Kalamazoo, MI even though my TV can display it. Is this a known guide problem, a receiver problem or something else. I show a signal level of 0% so I don't think its a reception problem.

No one seems to be discussing the OTA issues, so either no one else is having OTA problems or have given up on a fix.

Thanks.

Russ

[bonscott87]

It's still a problem with the HR20. It can't right now tune in VHF 2 or VHF 3 OTA signals for some reason. It's been an issue since OTA was turned on but hasn't been fixed yet. Luckily for us WWMT in MPEG4 has been 1000% better in the past 2-3 weeks. I don't know what DirecTV did but they tweaked the MPEG4 encoders to better handle WWMT's many OTA problems. Hopefully that holds up.

[raramaker]

Anyone know if the problem is hardware or software?

[hasan]

No, but it's going to be VERY bad news if it is hardware.

I'm very surprised that the low VHF channel problem has been going on this long. It should be quite easy to test...I've not heard of anyone who doesn't have the problem (that needs those channels).

While I don't have the issue, the silence from D* on this issue is deafening, and somewhat concerning.

[bonscott87]

And it's another reason why I'm keeping my old Hughes E-86 HD receiver hooked up to OTA only. It's old enough that you don't need it subbed to DirecTV for the OTA to work. :D

[houskamp]

I still receive no signal on WWMT-DT (channel 2) from Kalamazoo, MI even though my TV can display it. Is this a known guide problem, a receiver problem or something else. I show a signal level of 0% so I don't think its a reception problem.

No one seems to be discussing the OTA issues, so either no one else is having OTA problems or have given up on a fix.

Thanks.

Russ

Welcome to the club :(
At least they are offering the mpeg4 version.. even tho I would love to see it fixed.. I'm also afraid it is a hardware problem, just not much they can do (and not high on the list) :(

[hasan]

IF it is a hardware problem, D* is in deep, deep trouble. Replacing them all would be a logistical and economic nightmare...and failure to do so would not be very "pretty" either.

[n3ntj]

I can't get my local CBS affiliate WHP - 21.1/21.2 using the HR20. They broadcast HD on VHF channel 4. They only run 1.5 KW (pep) but don't know if the issue may also be with the HR20. Does this low VHF issue also exist on channel 4? Can't get it on my TV tuner either. Maybe I happen to have 2 problems.

[terryfoster]

I can't get my local CBS affiliate WHP - 21.1/21.2 using the HR20. They broadcast HD on VHF channel 4. Can't get it on my TV tuner either.

Since you can't get this with a second tuner, my guess is you have some kind of "global" reception problem not a problem isolated to your HR20.

[aramus8]

I still receive no signal on WWMT-DT (channel 2) from Kalamazoo, MI even though my TV can display it. Is this a known guide problem, a receiver problem or something else. I show a signal level of 0% so I don't think its a reception problem.

No one seems to be discussing the OTA issues, so either no one else is having OTA problems or have given up on a fix.



D* fixed two of the three channel problems in the Salt Lake City market. I encouraged the other station with a reception problem to contact D*. Two different times in the past 6 weeks someone from D* told the station engineers that the problem was fixed. I get e-mails from the station asking me to run the antenna setup again because its fixed and despite what D* has told the station, the issue is not fixed. If someone from D* is listening "KJZZ IS NOT ON 99-1, THEY ARE ON 14-1 AND ITS NOT WORKING!!!". Some sample zip codes having this issue are 84121, 84083, 89883.

[Supervolcano]

Actually I don't believe anyone has said that it's limited to ONLY frequency 2 and 3.

I wouldn't be surprised if the bug affects all of television's "Low VHF Frequencies", which I think is defined as channels 2 thru 6.

Here's a quote from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Very_high_frequency

30–46 MHz: Licensed 2-way land mobile communication
30–88 MHz: Military VHF-FM, including SINCGARS
43–50 MHz: Cordless telephones, "49 MHz" FM walkie-talkies, and mixed 2-way mobile communication
50–54 MHz: Amateur radio 6 meter band
54–72 MHz: TV channels 2-4
72–76 MHz: Remote Control devices
76–82 MHz: TV channel 5
82–88 MHz: TV channel 6
88–108 MHz: FM radio broadcasting (88–92 non-commercial, 92–108 commercial)
108–118 MHz: Air navigation beacons VOR
118–132 MHz: Airband for air traffic control, AM, 121.5 MHz is emergency frequency
132–144 MHz: Auxiliary civil services, satellite, space research, and other miscellaneous services
144–148 MHz: Amateur band 2 Meters
148–156 MHz: "VHF Business band," the unlicensed Multi-Use Radio Service (MURS), and other 2-way land mobile, FM
156–174 MHz: VHF Marine Radio; narrow band FM, 156.8 MHz (Channel 16) is the maritime emergency and contact frequency. The 160 and 161 areas are AAR 99 channel railroad radios issued to the railroad (Sample, AAR 21 is 160.425 and that is issued to TVRM and other railroads that want AAR 21)
162.40–162.55 MHz: NOAA Weather Stations, narrowband FM
174–216 MHz: TV channels 7 through 13, and professional wireless microphones (low power, certain exact frequencies only)
216–222 MHz: reserved for future use
222–225 MHz: Amateur "1¼ Meter" band (really closer to 1.33M)
above 225 MHz: Federal services, notably military aircraft radio (225–400 MHz) AM, including HAVE QUICK, dGPS RTCM-104

Note how channels 2, 3, and 4 are grouped together in the list.
Note how remote controls come next.
Then channels 5 & 6 come after.
;)
Maybe there simply aren't many frequencies 4, 5, and 6 broadcasting HD signals since SD broadcasts are so much more prevelant on these, therefore we maybe assume it's only limited to 2 & 3?

But if n3ntj can't get frequency 4 on his tv, then like terryfoster said, sounds like an antenna issue for you.

[Supervolcano]

IF it is a hardware problem, D* is in deep, deep trouble. Replacing them all would be a logistical and economic nightmare...and failure to do so would not be very "pretty" either.
Can we say "REFURBISHED".
:lol:
ROFLMAO, ohhh I can hear the complaints already.
No company likes to issue recalls.

And like any other recall, if it happens, it would be up to the customer to KNOW there's a recall before that customer will get his fixed.
:rolleyes:

[Just J]

IF it is a hardware problem, D* is in deep, deep trouble. Replacing them all would be a logistical and economic nightmare...and failure to do so would not be very "pretty" either.

The longer it goes on, the more likely that it is a hardware problem. At the momemt I'm laying odds at around 80% hardware, 10% software, 10% other/combo. I hope I'm wrong, as I don't want a refurbed box of unknown provenance in exchange for my current box, which is otherwise pretty well behaved.

I hope D* gets in front of this - this is the kind of thing that turns into a class action lawsuit, and those only benefit the lawyers.

[hasan]

Let's separate the two issues:

Low Band Malfunction: Ch 2 or 3 (for sure), perhaps up to 6 as per the other poster.


Bad mapping/Bad Database Info: Can and does affect any channel for which the data is wrong.

These are TWO DIFFERENT PROBLEMS.

No one's receiver works on Ch 2 or 3 (I think) that is actually on VHF Low and not remapped.

Many people are missing channels (me included) that are a result of wrong channel mapping/bad database issues.

Not working on Ch 2 or 3 is what has some people worried about a hardware problem (especially since there has been no progress in resolving those two channel issues.)

Be careful not to get trapped into the mapping issue. Just because a channel says its 2-1, doesn't mean it's actually using VHF Low...the one thing that is certain is NO ONE who is trying to actually receive a station broadcasting on VHF Low Channels 2 or 3 is able to receive them with the HR20. (at least that's how I remember the reports. If I'm wrong, someone PLEASE point it out.)

Something is seriously wrong, and for the amount time this has been the case, we should receive some feedback from D* as to the nature of the problem and if/when it's going to be fixed.

Again, I have no horse in this race...yet. I will be able to test it on Channel 5 in about a year...but until then, all my HD channels are on UHF.

[RCinFLA]

I had the thought that no LB HD transmissions were assigned because the low band channels would not support HD transmissions reliably due to the percentage bandwidth is so great it is difficult to avoid significant amplitude and phase distortion of the transmission.

ATSC is a very bandwidth efficient transmission and requires much less power then the old NTSC. It is however less tolerant of distortion.

All my local stations with analog transmission in low band (2,4, & 5 in my location) have their HD transmission in the UHF band.

[Goodwrnch03]

I am not sure what frequency Channel 2's HD signal is transmitted on here in Atlanta, but i get the OTA channel with no problem.

I do not know about everyone else but my OTA HD picture is still better than the satellite HD signal.

Bo

[kaminsco]

Let's separate the two issues:

Low Band Malfunction: Ch 2 or 3 (for sure), perhaps up to 6 as per the other poster.


Bad mapping/Bad Database Info: Can and does affect any channel for which the data is wrong.

These are TWO DIFFERENT PROBLEMS.

No one's receiver works on Ch 2 or 3 (I think) that is actually on VHF Low and not remapped.

Many people are missing channels (me included) that are a result of wrong channel mapping/bad database issues.

Not working on Ch 2 or 3 is what has some people worried about a hardware problem (especially since there has been no progress in resolving those two channel issues.)

Be careful not to get trapped into the mapping issue. Just because a channel says its 2-1, doesn't mean it's actually using VHF Low...the one thing that is certain is NO ONE who is trying to actually receive a station broadcasting on VHF Low Channels 2 or 3 is able to receive them with the HR20. (at least that's how I remember the reports. If I'm wrong, someone PLEASE point it out.)

Something is seriously wrong, and for the amount time this has been the case, we should receive some feedback from D* as to the nature of the problem and if/when it's going to be fixed.

Again, I have no horse in this race...yet. I will be able to test it on Channel 5 in about a year...but until then, all my HD channels are on UHF.



I agree. The silence and the fact no one can get these low band channels makes it sound like a hardware issue. If it is a hardware issue, a recall would have to be done and this is propably why we have this long silence.

[hasan]

I am not sure what frequency Channel 2's HD signal is transmitted on here in Atlanta, but i get the OTA channel with no problem.

I do not know about everyone else but my OTA HD picture is still better than the satellite HD signal.

Bo

Better PQ in OTA is the norm, it is expected. If you are getting Ch 2, it is probably a remap from a UHF channel, which the HR20 gets just fine. (if the database is right)

Example: What shows up as 8-1 on my HR20 is really channel 31 on RF. I'm betting the same thing is happening with your Ch 2. That's why I said "really" Ch 2, and put the disclaimer. You can see this happen in a channel scan with your regular TV...it will count through the channels and as it reaches 31 in my example, it will "change" to 8-1, then continue counting up at 32, 33, etc. as it scans. It will do this for every "remapped" channel. Channel 17-1 in my area is not remapped, it is the actual RF channel in use, so when the regular tv scans, it shows 17-1 right after counting up from 13, 14, 15 etc.

[bonscott87]

I am not sure what frequency Channel 2's HD signal is transmitted on here in Atlanta, but i get the OTA channel with no problem.

I do not know about everyone else but my OTA HD picture is still better than the satellite HD signal.

Bo


Digital channels are different from their analog counterparts.

In my area for example:
CBS is channel 3, digital channel 2
NBC is channel 8, digital channel 7
Fox is channel 17, 20 (or 39 I forget) in digital
and so forth.

[finaldiet]

The HR20 tuner is weak. I get all my OTA channels with my HR10, but 2-1 I can't get with the HR20 with same antenna. All channels above 2-1 come in great on either receiver.

[bonscott87]

The HR20 tuner is weak. I get all my OTA channels with my HR10, but 2-1 I can't get with the HR20 with same antenna. All channels above 2-1 come in great on either receiver.

It's not that it's weak. *Nobody* gets digital channel 2 or 3. It's a bug.

[Tim Powell]

The FCC maintains a list of channel assignments at http://www.fcc.gov/dtv/

If I read the list correctly, Atlanta channel 2, for example, is actually digital channel 39.

[amigq]

I might be able to shed some light on one of the low-VHF channels under discussion here-

KETS-DT 2.1 PBS LITTLE ROCK AR 161° 24.4 5

This is our PBS station broadcasting on Ch. 5-remapping to ch. 2. I can receive this channel through my HR-20's tuner, but intermittently. I have several series links on subchannel 2-4, and they record sometimes and not others. I also randomly check on these channels for live broadcasts, and sometimes the HR-20 gets them, sometimes not. Its never glitchy, like a low signal; rather its great or else its the 771 Error. This channel always is received by my tv's tuner.

Just wanted to chime in because I don't think Ch. 5 suffers the same "no reception at all" problem as Ch. 2 and Ch. 3. I definitely think my problem is something different. FWIW.

[houskamp]

I might be able to shed some light on one of the low-VHF channels under discussion here-

KETS-DT 2.1 PBS LITTLE ROCK AR 161° 24.4 5

This is our PBS station broadcasting on Ch. 5-remapping to ch. 2. I can receive this channel through my HR-20's tuner, but intermittently. I have several series links on subchannel 2-4, and they record sometimes and not others. I also randomly check on these channels for live broadcasts, and sometimes the HR-20 gets them, sometimes not. Its never glitchy, like a low signal; rather its great or else its the 771 Error. This channel always is received by my tv's tuner.

Just wanted to chime in because I don't think Ch. 5 suffers the same "no reception at all" problem as Ch. 2 and Ch. 3. I definitely think my problem is something different. FWIW.

you got that backwards it's channel 2.1 broadcasting on 5....

[Just J]

you got that backwards it's channel 2.1 broadcasting on 5....

Yep. And, as noted above, the Atlanta channel 2.1 is broadcasting on channel 39.

So neither of these two digital channel 2's is broadcasting in the "54–72 MHz: TV channels 2-4" range that seems to be problematic for this box.

[jal]

This same problem (no reception of 2-1) exists on the h20-100. When I had an h20-600, the channel came in just fine. It also comes in just fine on my hr10-250. I think this is a hardware issue.