Blowing in the wind?

[Shrunken Head]

I recently switched from HR10 to HR20 and the bigger dish.

One odd problem I'm having is occasional dropouts.

Pixelation and green sheets. Reminds me of what happens in very heavy rain.
It is not raining, and I'm looking for another solution.

I went up on the roof and watched the dish and pickup arm in a fairly low wind.

The dish was moving slightly and the arm was moving noticably.

I thought these dishes had to be mounted "rock solid".

Is the new dish more forgiving?

I think the DTV installer used the same mounting bracket, but the old dish didn't move in the wind.

Thanks for your input.

[dhaakenson]

I think the dish definitely benefits from being mounted rock solid. Others here can let you know for sure. Mine is chimney mounted and doesn't move at all.

That said, I still see the problems you report on some channels (mainly the mpeg4s, but others as well).

[Tom Robertson]

I recently switched from HR10 to HR20 and the bigger dish.

One odd problem I'm having is occasional dropouts.

Pixelation and green sheets. Reminds me of what happens in very heavy rain.
It is not raining, and I'm looking for another solution.

I went up on the roof and watched the dish and pickup arm in a fairly low wind.

The dish was moving slightly and the arm was moving noticably.

I thought these dishes had to be mounted "rock solid".

Is the new dish more forgiving?

I think the DTV installer used the same mounting bracket, but the old dish didn't move in the wind.

Thanks for your input.

I sure hope he didn't use the old mount--the pipe is too small. And I hope he used the monopoles to sturdy the dish (normally two are used, giving a tripod-like base).

One of the reasons the new dish is larger is that the new frequencies are less forgiving, so the dish must be mounted rock solid. The house should fall down before the dish should move. :)

I'd suggest calling Directv and have the installation done correctly. And have the dish aligned using the correct procedure: http://www.solidsignal.com/dtvkuka/

Good luck,
Tom

[tawnee]

I had the installer come back and add another monopole, I have 3 on the new installation. The dish is very solid. Still get pixelation on the local HDs from time to time. Nothing major, but still annoying.

[Shrunken Head]

Thanks for the info.

The installer used a new mount in the same location.
It is just the one pipe, no monopoles.

The mount is solid, but that dish is waving in the wind.

I will request monopole reinforcement.

[armophob]

Thanks for the info.

The installer used a new mount in the same location.
It is just the one pipe, no monopoles.

The mount is solid, but that dish is waving in the wind.

I will request monopole reinforcement.


The new dish is much heavier. It requires thought in how it is mounted.
You need to post pics on the install and wide angle. That way we can bombard you with good and bad ideas. ;)

[hasan]

Thanks for the info.

The installer used a new mount in the same location.
It is just the one pipe, no monopoles.

The mount is solid, but that dish is waving in the wind.

I will request monopole reinforcement.

The side struts are MANDATORY...and no the new dish is NOT more forgiving...if anything it is LESS forgiving. Larger dish = higher gain = narrower beamwidth = more critical pointing.

The real issue is "wind area"...it's catching more wind and moving as a result.

Make him install the dish correctly and you won't have a problem with wind. (and don't pay any more money...he didn't do the job right the first time)

[GBFAN]

The side struts are MANDATORY...and no the new dish is NOT more forgiving...if anything it is LESS forgiving. Larger dish = higher gain = narrower beamwidth = more critical pointing.

The real issue is "wind area"...it's catching more wind and moving as a result.

Make him install the dish correctly and you won't have a problem with wind. (and don't pay any more money...he didn't do the job right the first time)

I don't have any side struts on my dish and believe me it is very windy here. I have my dish mounted on the back of my house just above the deck. I had the small dish mounted in the same place. When I had my house re-sided I had them build a mounting spot for the dish. They don't call Chicago the Windy city for nothing. Is it possible that the alignment is just on the edge, so that any slight movement there is a problem?

[hasan]

I don't have any side struts on my dish and believe me it is very windy here. I have my dish mounted on the back of my house just above the deck. I had the small dish mounted in the same place. When I had my house re-sided I had them build a mounting spot for the dish. They don't call Chicago the Windy city for nothing. Is it possible that the alignment is just on the edge, so that any slight movement there is a problem?

Yes, in fact it is VERY likely.

[txtommy]

My Slimline moved in the wind on its 6 ft pole. I shoved a couple lengths of rebar into the pole and filled it with concrete. Problem solved.

[Tom_S]

Mine is mounted on my roof with no Monopole support. It vibrates in the wind noticeably but I have not lost any signal strength because of it. Some people act like this dish is large enough to receive pictures from Voyager 2, I mean come on, it's not that big.

Take a deep breath, relax, and just point your dish properly and securely mount the footpad and you'll be fine.

[White_Horse]

My Slimline moved in the wind on its 6 ft pole. I shoved a couple lengths of rebar into the pole and filled it with concrete. Problem solved.

hmm..may have to do that. Our AT9 can move sometimes if we get a strong enough wind. It too is mounted on a 6' pole.

[txtommy]

hmm..may have to do that. Our AT9 can move sometimes if we get a strong enough wind. It too is mounted on a 6' pole.

We are in a windy coastal area. So far no hurricane to test it but we have had measured 40-45 mph winds (and higher unmeasured during thunderstorms) with no signal loss. I used two 6 ft lengths of rebar and a partial bag of Quickrete to do the job.

[Shrunken Head]

I had DTV add some stabilizing poles.
Excellent installer.
Fewer dropouts.
Thanks for the info.

[Jason Whiddon]

My AT9 sits on top of a 6 ft pole the installer quikcreted in the ground. It has no side bars(I have since seen an install near me that has a tripod at the bottom of the pole) and sways about 1-2" each way in wind. I currently have no signal problems.

[simonkodousek]

I recently switched from HR10 to HR20 and the bigger dish.

One odd problem I'm having is occasional dropouts.

Pixelation and green sheets. Reminds me of what happens in very heavy rain.
It is not raining, and I'm looking for another solution.

I went up on the roof and watched the dish and pickup arm in a fairly low wind.

The dish was moving slightly and the arm was moving noticably.

I thought these dishes had to be mounted "rock solid".

Is the new dish more forgiving?

I think the DTV installer used the same mounting bracket, but the old dish didn't move in the wind.

Thanks for your input.

The problem is that the installer used the same bracket. It's too small for the new dish, which needs much more support. You should probably get some monopoles.

~Simon :grin:

[IneedCCs]

I had my HR20 and Slimline dish installed a few weeks ago. My signal strength readings look good on all satellites and transponders (except 103(a), which isn't very good, but it is my understanding that that is pretty normal).

My reception is fine, but I do get occasional brief pixellation and black-outs when it's breezy (i.e., winds of about 15 or 20 mph). It hasn't been windy yet, but I felt I was gonna have more substantial problems when it does get windy (25-40mph).

I read the posts here and called DTV to have a third monopole installed. Before the installer came, I PMed two people who had had additional monopoles installed to ask if their dishes had to be removed to install the additional monopoles. I was told by both that it was not necessary to remove the dish to add a monopole.

The installer just left. He was reluctant to add a monopole because, in his words, the dishes come with two monopoles and if he gave me an additional monopole a dish would be short a monopole. He also said he'd have to remove the dish to add a third monopole and that he never heard of adding a third monopole.

I told him about this site and what I had learned here and he added the third monopole.

Hopefully I will now have rock solid reception, barring gale force winds. Time will tell. But I wanted to share my experience with others who might be having this problem and publicly thank the two members who answered my PMs. (I've already thanked them privately.)

[veryoldschool]

I had my HR20 and Slimline dish installed a few weeks ago. My signal strength readings look good on all satellites and transponders (except 103(a), which isn't very good, but it is my understanding that that is pretty normal).

My reception is fine, but I do get occasional brief pixilation and black-outs when it's breezy (i.e., winds of about 15 or 20 mph). It hasn't been windy yet, but I felt I was gonna have more substantial problems when it does get windy (25-40 mph).
You might want to improve your signal strength from the 103 SAT.
From this site, you can see that 103 spot beams are used in your area: http://www.sizethis.com/spotmap/index.php

This would suggest your pixilation & blackouts could be resolved with better alignment of your dish.
While the installer may think "it's normal", this might only be because they haven't done a great job aligning the dishes [so far]. FWIW

Here is another link for what SATs carry local HD in your area: http://www.dbstalk.com/hr20/html/DTV_LIL_CITY.html

[TomCat]

...Larger dish = higher gain = narrower beamwidth = more critical pointing...

Not exactly. That is an oversimplification and therefore a bit misleading. A larger dish does not necessarily imply higher gain, and the newer DBS antennae are no exception. The 5lnb dishes are designed to provide about the same gain (at least for the big 3) as the older Phase III. A larger dish would provide more gain if all else was held equal, but it is not in this case. Adding more focal points means that there is more compromise in how well the focal points can be focused, for one thing, which is a large reason that the newer dishes need larger reflectors to give the EQUIVALENT gain, as gain is offset by the compromise in the design.

The most efficient design is parabolic. Spherical is much less efficient, but has the benefit of multiple focal points. Modern DBS dishes are parabolic in the vertical dimension, and spherical in the horizontal, and are therefore a compromise. This is a good compromise, because while it only allows multiple focal points that intersect a straight line, that is pretty much how geostationary sats are berthed. When you stretch from 3 to 5 focal points, that means a bit more compromise, a bit more curve in that straight line, a less-defined focal point for each, and less gain, made up for by a larger reflector so that the receiver sees the same levels it saw with the older dish.

If 5lnb dishes could be designed with equivalent size and gain to a 3lnb dish, they obviously would, as it would solve the wind/monopole/structure/wife factor problems. But you can't put 10 lbs in a 5 lb bag, so the compromise to provide equivalent gain was to make the reflector larger, which increases wind load, which requires extra bracing.

[glennb]

I've got mine on the roof with no side struts even though hasan said it's MANDATORY.

It's been up there for a year now like that. We even had a 70 MPH wind storm come thru the area one night that broke large tree limbs and uprooted some trees in the area.

Everything is still working fine.

I agree with the guy that said the new dish isn't that big. It's bigger but it's not like having a 10 footer on the roof. He might have gone a little to far in saying take a deep breath, relax, just point your dish properly, etc... :eek:

[veryoldschool]

Not exactly. That is an oversimplification and therefore a bit misleading. A larger dish does not necessarily imply higher gain, and the newer DBS antennae are no exception. The 5lnb dishes are designed to provide about the same gain (at least for the big 3) as the older Phase III. A larger dish would provide more gain if all else was held equal, but it is not in this case. Adding more focal points means that there is more compromise in how well the focal points can be focused, for one thing, which is a large reason that the newer dishes need larger reflectors to give the EQUIVALENT gain, as gain is offset by the compromise in the design.

The most efficient design is parabolic. Spherical is much less efficient, but has the benefit of multiple focal points. Modern DBS dishes are parabolic in the vertical dimension, and spherical in the horizontal, and are therefore a compromise. This is a good compromise, because while it only allows multiple focal points that intersect a straight line, that is pretty much how geostationary sats are berthed. When you stretch from 3 to 5 focal points, that means a bit more compromise, a bit more curve in that straight line, a less-defined focal point for each, and less gain, made up for by a larger reflector so that the receiver sees the same levels it saw with the older dish.

If 5lnb dishes could be designed with equivalent size and gain to a 3lnb dish, they obviously would, as it would solve the wind/monopole/structure/wife factor problems. But you can't put 10 lbs in a 5 lb bag, so the compromise to provide equivalent gain was to make the reflector larger, which increases wind load, which requires extra bracing.
After reading this I think I'll stay with my AT9 over moving to the AU9 as the AU9 seems to be more like what you've described.