Johnstown/Altoona Locals

[shilton]

I know this one is a long shot...but does anyone have ANY info as to when (or IF) Echostar will launch local service to the Johnstown/Altoona Pennsylvania market (DMA #95)???

I know Dish is looking to get into some of these smaller DMA's and a few of the broadcasters in the area have confirmed to me that they HAVE already reached retransmission agreements with Dish, so you would think that our area is coming sometime soon.

Dish has told me before that their new satellite fleet can handle 90+ markets eventually and that we "should" go up "SOMEDAY" but what the heck is someday??? I am sort of hoping for early 2003, as I know we didn't make the cut to be added anytime by the end of the year.

I ask because I am anxious to cut the cable cord and get locals if I can. Can't receive them with an antenna...already tried that. Plus, the Altoona market may be attractive to Echostar given the fact that the Altoona cable system is ready to go belly up and if it does, that is a whole market that Dish could tap into to basically offer a Dish to every household who wants one.

Does anyone have any inside info on this market? Dish isn't talking...but we know there is some free spot beam space that hits us so we could fit into the picture somewhere (Plus, there are only like 5 stations that would have to go up if that...we don't have a lot of independents or anything...pretty much just the Nets). The whole thing sort of sucks right now, as I could theoretically receive Pittsburgh, Harrisburg or Philly, as all 3 of those spot beams hit me quite strongly, but of course, I AM NOT ELIGIBLE...Thank you SHVA!!! So here I am holding my breath and waiting hopefully.

[gcutler]

Without the Merger, I think the smaller markets like yours have little hope. You might get lucky if some of the bigger markets are difficult in getting agreements.

[bryan27]

I would say it is very slim.

With the "Ohio" Beam on E8 carrying Pittsburgh, Detroit, Cleveland, Cincinnati, & Buffalo on 3 TPs it is jam packed. The "NorthEast" Beam doesn't look good either with 2 TPs for Philadelphia and Washington.

On E7 the beam doesn't look much better either with Boston, Burlington, Harrisburg sharing 2 TPs.

[jrbdmb]

Originally posted by bryan27
I would say it is very slim.

With the "Ohio" Beam on E8 carrying Pittsburgh, Detroit, Cleveland, Cincinnati, & Buffalo on 3 TPs it is jam packed. The "NorthEast" Beam doesn't look good either with 2 TPs for Philadelphia and Washington.

On E7 the beam doesn't look much better either with Boston, Burlington, Harrisburg sharing 2 TPs.

Although I'd like to see D.C. and its 7 major stations have a transponder all to itself (good PQ for a change!), I expect that Dish will probably squeeze one more market onto the Philly / D.C. spot - any thoughts on who this could be?

Also, there is that unused spot 14 covering Pennsylvania, New York, and New England - do you really think they'll keep this dark as opposed to adding one or more markets like Altoona / Scranton / Syracuse / Rochester / Albany?

[JavaMark]

I would also like to see the Johnstown DMA added, as I live in State College, and do not really like dealing with Adelphia! However, I think the chances are pretty slim due to the physical size of the DMA compared to its subscriber base.

Look at this link for one of the local TV stations: http://www.wtaj.com/events.html

I am making an assumption that the area shown in the graphic is the total DMA. I don't even know if any of the spotbeams cover 100% of the area. E* certainly would not want to duplicate coverage on more than one spotbeam, nor put us on a CONUS beam. I currently have 'moved' to the Philly market and have no problem seeing the northeast spotbeam, but I am at the northeast edge of the DMA. I don't know if people at the bottom edge of PA can see the northeast beam or not.

Its amazing with the mountain/hilly terrain around here that people can get any signal at all via OTA antennas, I actually can get the networks pretty well off air, but it does require a big roof mounted antenna.

Oh and another thing, take a look at the community events shown on the page. How many of those activities seem to coincide with the type of people who demand quality cable service. Its all about where E* would get the best bang for the buck, and I don't think this market would generate enough subscribers to warrant the investment..... Now, if E* made a deal with Penn State to transmit all PSU sports on the dish, people would sign up in droves, but I don't see that happening!

[Darkman]

bryan - that Fargo or Grand Forks - that we discussed, are they as slim?
or better, or worse chances?

[vinny d]

Hey, I keep hearing all this talk about people who can't get locals "moving". How does one "move"? Don't you have to prove that you have relocated and where does your bill get sent to?

I fail to understand the whole thing.

[TopCat99]

I would LOVE to get 6 and 8 back. Even my cableco dropped them some time ago :(. (10 was always iffy for me--kinda hard to pull over the ridge).

I'm curious, how do <insert media provider here> get around must-carry for these types of locals? Do they only have to pick up one station of a network (and independents)?

[Mike123abc]

Looking at where Echostar has capacity...

Markets in
Georgia
Louisianna
Texas
California
Washington, Oregon
Alaska
Florida

The spots over the North East and Mid west are essentially filled to the gills.

Now it is possible Dish could put some of the smaller NE/Midwest markets on 61.5... But, I do not see them using up national transponders on 110/119 for LIL any more.

[Darkman]

Mike - no capacity for North Dakota?
or South Dakota?

[Mike123abc]

There is a spot that covers the SE corner of South Dakota that is serving the Minneapolis/St Paul markets.

Given that Sioux Falls/Mitchell DMA is number 112 and the spot does not really cover the market, I would say it is unlikely.

Check out http://wvjw.info/dbs-beam/ to see the maps. The Dakotas do not have enough people in them to put a spot on them.

You are not alone... Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, and the Dakotas do not have any spots on them.

[TNGTony]

TopCat,

Most of the time the DBS providers don't have to get around must carry rules. Usually the locals in question either waive the must carry right or do not qualify for must carry in the first place. Take a look at http://ekb.dbstalk.com/19.htm#MC


YO Vinny! :)

When you "move", you tell the CSR you want to change your SERVICE address. Make sure to tell them that you DO NOT want to change the billing address. You need a VALID physical street address (notice I didn't say it has to exist...a street may have a valid range of street numbers that aren't all being used even though the street is fully developed). They will ask for a phone number, but a cell phone will do. I've "heard" this works just fine.

See ya
Tony

[JavaMark]

Moving is pretty simple, actually. Just call and give the service provider a new 'service address' Say it is a hunting cabin, or whatever. And they don't check the phone number the receiver is calling from. They really have NO incentive to actively try to catch you, since you have to pay $6/month, and it would make you a less likely churn candidate. The address of a friend/relative that doesn't already get sat. service is proably the best candidate.

[Darkman]

hey Mike: "You are not alone... " - never said i was there :). Was just wondering - lol

[Mike123abc]

Well in some parts of North Dakota you might think you are alone... Areas north of Minot for example appear to be abandoned when you drive through them.

[Darkman]

ahaha - tell me about it :)
Imagine Canada now - with Territory a bit larger then United States and 10 times less people...One would have to pay there to be able to see "someone" :)

[TNGTony]

When I drove to Alaska from Cincinnati last summer, I was astounded at how few towns there were on the yellowhead trail (TC16) from Winnipeg to Saskatoon and then from Saskatoon to Edmonton. It made central Illinois and Iowa (Danville...corn--Urbana Champaign--Corn--Peoria--Corn--Galesburg--corn...OH LOOK Wheat!--Davenport, Corn....Des Moines...) seem like a continuous metropolis!

See ya
Tony

[Darkman]

hehe - must have been "picturesque" site-seeing (driving to Alaska, etc)
Was that this summer, when you were away (with no updates)?
:)

[bryan27]

jrbdmb, Spot 14 is just like the spot on 119 in Mexico. It can't be used. The reason it is there is to provide back-up in the event of a failure of one of the 110 or 119 spot TPs in that area. The last thning E* needs is a failure of one of the "Megalopolis" beam TPs and have no back-up for it.

Darkman, Fargo and Grand Forks are the same market. I would say it has a good chance of being one of the CONUS delivered markets because of the land area it covers, however Sioux Falls probably has the same chance. It will probably depend on which market has "Charlie Friendly" stations. Oh, and Canada is much larger than the US. It is the 2nd largest country in land area in the world, the US ranks 5th :)

[Karl Foster]

Originally posted by Mike123abc

You are not alone... Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, and the Dakotas do not have any spots on them.

Actually, there are areas of both Wyoming and Idaho that are in the Salt Lake City DMA and can receive Salt Lake City locals from Directv and Dish Network. Southwestern Wyoming (Rock Springs, Evanston, Afton), southeastern Idaho (Preston, Monpelier), and eastern Nevada (Elko, Ely) are all in the Salt Lake DMA which also covers all of Utah. It is a huge DMA geographically.

I know that is completely off-topic. Back to your regularly scheduled Pennsylvania locals chat :)

[JohnH]

Originally posted by TNGTony
It made central Illinois and Iowa (Danville...corn--Urbana Champaign--Corn--Peoria--Corn--Galesburg--corn...OH LOOK Wheat!--Davenport, Corn....Des Moines...) seem like a continuous metropolis!


Gee!! You missed the soybeans. :)

[Darkman]

bryan..i hear you...
but even though Canada is 2nd and US is 5th - the difference is not as great as between Canada (2nd) and Former Soviet Union (or even present Russia) (1st) :)

[Mike123abc]

Originally posted by karl_f


Actually, there are areas of both Wyoming and Idaho that are in the Salt Lake City DMA and can receive Salt Lake City locals from Directv and Dish Network. Southwestern Wyoming (Rock Springs, Evanston, Afton), southeastern Idaho (Preston, Monpelier), and eastern Nevada (Elko, Ely) are all in the Salt Lake DMA which also covers all of Utah. It is a huge DMA geographically.

I know that is completely off-topic. Back to your regularly scheduled Pennsylvania locals chat :)

Actually it looks like half of Wyoming gets to have LIL. This is because 4 counties are in the Salt Lake DMA and 6 counties are in the Denver DMA. The other 11 counties do not get LiL.