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0x0290 Feature Discussion: Support for 1080p/24

Discussion in 'DIRECTV HD DVR/Receiver Discussion' started by Stuart Sweet, Oct 2, 2008.

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  1. shedberg

    shedberg Icon

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    I have the same TV and would also like to know if this will be an issue.
     
  2. schneid

    schneid Godfather

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    If one is looking for new iron, I'd make sure it was 1080p and 24fps capable and ran at 120hz (120 divides evenly by 24). There is much more to this 24fps than meets the eye. It has been an obscure feature but my discontinued Blu-ray player supports it, my 16 month old plasma TV supports it, and my mid-range AGP card in my old school HTPC support it. And now, D* supports it.

    To me the fact that 1080p/24 takes up less than half the bandwidth than 1080i/60 is the key. It's just simple economics.
     
  3. Podkayne

    Podkayne Legend

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    It looks like we're SOL with DTV on this one.

    1080p from a Blu Ray player will work fine on our TVs provided the Blu Ray can be set up to output 1080p/60fps, which I think all do.

    I don't think there is a converter
     
  4. rahlquist

    rahlquist Hall Of Fame

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  5. shedberg

    shedberg Icon

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  6. rsonnens

    rsonnens Legend

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    Nov 7, 2006
    The box should be the the HR20. There is not really an excuse for not doing this from a 'product' perspective. This is what BlueRay players do when they have 1080p/24 material for 1080p/60 sets.
     
  7. RAD

    RAD Well-Known Member

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    Dripping...
    The box can't do it because the chip set that D* (and from what I've seen E* also) only supports up to 1080p/24.
     
  8. rsonnens

    rsonnens Legend

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    Nov 7, 2006
    Notice I said from a product perspective, not because of an engineering limitation. ;) I knew that from what others have said. However, truth is I do not this to be true statement. It may well be possible to update the chip firmware to do this since we know it can output a 60hz signal for 1080i.
     
  9. rahlquist

    rahlquist Hall Of Fame

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    If you dig through the first look documents you can find the Broadcom chip model # and go look at the docs for yourself (much like I did) you will note that 1080p isnt event mentioned. 1080i is, so somehow they have managed to produce something from chips that until very recently nobody thought they were capable of at least publicly. 1080p24 is also the mode that Dish is using I believe. Doing 60hz isnt just a matter of changing the output clock, the dvr would have to produce data for every clock cycle vs every other clock cycle for 1080i it may not be able to do that at all.

    In the end maybe Broadcom and DirecTV and Dish will find a way to do 1080p/60 but I dont think from what I have read that it will be possible with this chipset. However I wouldnt mind them proving me wrong.
     
  10. rsonnens

    rsonnens Legend

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    Nov 7, 2006
    Only Broadcom could answer the question, and you would likely not find the answer in docs. But if they have a framebuffer/s that is large enough, which they must if the support 1080p/24 and they support 60hz (which is what is used for all other formats) then I suspect the raw hardware can support this. ll that would ned to be done is a 3:3:2 pulldown from the data stream, which is not a complex operation, and would mean that thru most of the system they won't be busing any more data.

    However, the only reason for this would be to make people feel better because they think they need to select 1080p--and to avoid support cases. Fact is that their sets likely will do better de-interlacing. Also DTV could also help more by clearly saying that 1080p is actually 1080p/24 which the UI does not say.
     
  11. Mike Bertelson

    Mike Bertelson 6EQUJ5 WOW! Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    Don't know if this is what your are looking for....

    HR21 - Broadcom BCM7401

    From the BCM7401 pdf file
    "HDMI 1.1/DVI 1.0 Mac and PHY with HDCP 1.1"
    "481i/480p/576i/576p/720p/1080i/1080p 24/30 output formats"


    http://www.broadcom.com/collateral/pb/7401-PB04-R.pdf

    HR20 - Broadcom BCM7411

    http://www.broadcom.com/collateral/pb/7411-PB07-R.pdf

    Mike
     
  12. rsonnens

    rsonnens Legend

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    Nov 7, 2006
    Thanks.

    The BCM7411 doc does not say anything about 1080p support but clearly it supports 1080p/24 so it may support 1080p/60, or may with new firmware. Again, only Broadcom could answer that. I was just saying that it seems likely that it could.

    It is also possible that it is an artificial limitation allowing Broadcom to have a broader range of chips some with lower price points that differ only in firmware. This is a common practice amongst chip vendors. I am not saying this is true in this case, only that it is possible.
     
  13. p010ne

    p010ne p010ne

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    Miscellaneous options lists support for: 720p 1080i 1080p/24 1080p/28 1080p/30 1080p/50 1080p/60 and the 1080P Bucket List I had downloaded from VOD 1080p sometime ago plays just fine with the two blue lights lit!!
     
  14. toneman

    toneman Legend

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    Oct 23, 2007
    Exactly; it is up to the display to send the proper EDID info (in this case, 1080p/24) to the source. Sure it would be nice if D* would implement a "force" option but they are not "required" to do so under HDMI specifications, as far as passing EDID info is concerned. If your display can't/won't properly tell the HR2x as to whether or not it (the display) supports 1080p/24...how is that necessarily the fault of the HR2x?
     
  15. toneman

    toneman Legend

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    Oct 23, 2007
    Wouldn't that defeat the purpose of wanting to watch movies in 1080p/24 to begin with--namely, to watch them at 24 frames/second? You might as well watch the non-1080p/24 version instead...

    Edit--I didn't take into account the bandwidth difference between 1080p/24 and 1080p/60, so now understand why there would be a want/need to have the HR2x internally convert 1080p/24 to1080p/60 for output to a display that doesn't support 1080p/24.
     
  16. DarinC

    DarinC Hall Of Fame

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    If 1080p/24 DID take up less than half the bandwdith of of 1080i, that indeed would be a big deal. But I believe it tends to closer to 10-15%.
     
  17. shedberg

    shedberg Icon

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    Well, I saw a thread this morning that VOD had some 1080p content and downloaded it. I "tricked" my box and succsessfully set it to 1080p. When I went to view the content, both the 720 and 1080 lights lit up - meaning 1080p content. However, the film only displayed on part of my TV and had a bit of stutter. I messed with some settings to no avail. 1080i is the best we will get on this TV. If you figure something out that ends up working, let me know!
     
  18. rahlquist

    rahlquist Hall Of Fame

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    If you have another hdmi cable try it. Also consider checking with your TV set manuf for updated firmware and any tips they may have. Some have had to disable certain cinematic display modes to get it to work.
     
  19. dennisj00

    dennisj00 Hall Of Fame

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    I would also list the TV make and model - and any AV receiver you're going through.
     
  20. shedberg

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    Jan 20, 2007
    Sorry, I am using a Panasonic Viera TH-50PZ700U HDMI from H20-700 direct to the TV and audio to Onkyo receiver using digital audio cable.
     
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