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Another Vietnam?

Discussion in 'The OT' started by Halfsek, Apr 10, 2004.

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  1. JM Anthony

    JM Anthony Child of the 60's DBSTalk Gold Club

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    Nov 16, 2003
    For starters, how about because he has trashed just about everything our country stands for. Are we better off on just about any long term indicator you can think of than we were 4 years ago? No. Respect for our Country from others - couldn't be lower. Compassionate conservative? Horseshit! I feel sorry for the generations that are inheriting the bills this administration is running up. Unf-cking believable!
     
  2. freakmonkey

    freakmonkey Banned User

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    Sep 11, 2003
    It is ashame you have to cuss to express your POV :nono2:

    But the fact is unemployment down.
    The economy is rebounding.
    My pay checks are fatter my are taxes lower.

    Your mindless attack is just that.

    KERRY/BIN LADEN 2004
     
  3. HappyGoLucky

    HappyGoLucky Banned User

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    Jan 11, 2004
    To quote Penn & Teller: BULLSH*T. Spouting crap like that only makes you look like an ignorant fool. Statements like "his words were used by the North Vietnam Army to demoralize our troops which by default gave aid to the enemy. No if's ands or butts about it" are essentially a lie since it is NOT prima facie evidence, so saying there are "no if's ands or butts" is simply untrue. That is only your very biased opinion based on false assumptions. Hardly evidence of a crime as serious as treason.
     
  4. freakmonkey

    freakmonkey Banned User

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    Sep 11, 2003

    The same thing can be said about most of your posts on just about any subject concerning GW.

    Everything I have said is true the economy jobs interest rates and yes even JFK' statements. There were many Vietnam Vets who have spoken out against JFK and have said his words were used in the POW camps to show Americas weakening resolve in Vietnam. A country divided by politics is the best weapon of mass destruction that we can hand over to any of our enemies and YOU gladly hand out your rhetoric for just that purpose under the guise of caring for your country. So keep taking shots at GW and our boys over in Iraq. Aid the enemy its what you people are good at.
     
  5. RichW

    RichW Hall Of Fame/Supporter DBSTalk Gold Club

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    There were even more Vietnam vets who spoke out against the war after they returned home. Plus we were treated shabbily by the "right" as well as the "left". About the only politician that "shared our pain" at the time was Sen. Goldwater. Nixon understood the futility of that war and got us out. We lost the whole of Vietnam to the commies but we cut our tragic loss of life in the process, and guess what - Vietnam is not invading us or working for the downfall of the USA, proving the Domino Theory to be false.

    Furthermore, a country divided by politics that resolves those divisions by votes rather than bullets is the best example for the world. The worst examples are those that blindlly follow their leaders out of a false sense of patriotism.
     
  6. HappyGoLucky

    HappyGoLucky Banned User

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    Jan 11, 2004
    There you go again. Empty and unfounded rhetoric, that is all you can post. The day when it is illegal to have and voice an opinion contrary to the government or the president, that's the day this stops being America. And you tell the same old lie that I'm "taking shots at ... our boys over in Iraq" when that is simply not true. Does your mama know you lie so much? It is during wartime that opinons contrary to the government are needed the most, your philosophy is tantamount to fascism. If it weren't for faux-patriots like you perhaps we wouldn't be in Iraq to begin with.
     
  7. JM Anthony

    JM Anthony Child of the 60's DBSTalk Gold Club

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    Nov 16, 2003
    Yeah, I felt so bad after reading your post that I ran and washed my mouth out with soap. But I am heartened to hear that everything is just rosy on your end.
     
  8. FritzM

    FritzM Legend

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    Feb 2, 2004
    This occured to me while reading all these posts, a big difference between now and the Viet Nam era: Those yelling TREASON now most likely have never been in a war. Those bellowing LOVE IT OR LEAVE IT then were WWII or Korean veterans. Not sure if that means anything, might not.

    Of course the headline on today's Chicago Tribune could have appeared 35 years ago by substituting Westmoreland for U.S. Says the U.S. wants more troops to achieve success or such.
     
  9. freakmonkey

    freakmonkey Banned User

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    Sep 11, 2003
    Would you care to list some specific example of such rehtoric?
    You can not because what I have said is true

    I never said you can not have an opinion against the president or the USofA
    But the bottom line you and all the other liberal Democrats are spewing hateful venom for the sole purpose of winning an election. You people privately cheer each American soldier that dies in Iraq and add it to your political arsenal for the election.

    Nothing fake about me or my patriotism. My mother is very proud that after being a Clinton kool aid drinker for 8 years that I have grown to see the light of what is righteous and true. GW is the best thing to happen to America and you cant post one example of what GW has done in the last 3 years that has been bad for America. The war in Iraq was being planned by the Clinton's GW just picked up the ball and went with it. America has been hated by the world for decades and we are not isolated from the rest of the world as people like you would have believe.
     
  10. Timco

    Timco Woof! DBSTalk Gold Club

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    You sound like a Micheal Savage dittohead. What has GW done that has been bad for America? Misled the American people and started a war with no viable plan on how to exit.
    And of course, this is all Clinton's fault. :nono:
     
  11. Danny R

    Danny R Goblin the Pug DBSTalk Gold Club

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    My mother is very proud that after being a Clinton kool aid drinker for 8 years that I have grown to see the light of what is righteous and true.

    So you are saying that Clinton's actions were wrong? That sounds as if you are trashing the president. Doesn't that make you a traitor?

    Of course actually it sounds as if you were on Clinton's team while he was president. Thus are you actually the sort of person who defends the president no matter what their position? I didn't realize we elect an infallible pope.

    EDIT: I'd removed "So freakmonkey. I take it you supported every military action Clinton was involved in?" and replaced it with the above. freakmonkey beat me to the punch however.

    Either way I disagree with blindly following any president.
     
  12. freakmonkey

    freakmonkey Banned User

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    Sep 11, 2003
    Yes I did. I would argue with my conservative friends that we need to stand behind our president. I would tell them you may not like the man but he holds the office and the office needs to be respected. I even admired the man he was young and a fresh change of pace for such a stodgy office. Funny how every one states we went to war with no exit strategy. What was our exit strategy for Bosnia? What about our exit strategy For Germany or Japan. Oh wait we still have forces in all those countries.

    Who is Michale Savage?

    And I never blamed Clinton don't know where you got that from.
     
  13. Danny R

    Danny R Goblin the Pug DBSTalk Gold Club

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    You stated you had "grown to see the light". That implies you were in the dark before and that Clinton's actions were not "righteous and true".
     
  14. RichW

    RichW Hall Of Fame/Supporter DBSTalk Gold Club

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    That is probably the most disgusting and hateful thing ever said on this forum!!

    Who in the hell do you think you are?
     
  15. freakmonkey

    freakmonkey Banned User

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    Sep 11, 2003
    Seems to have struck a nerve the truth often times does that. I call them like I see them and more and more the press and the DEMS are flaunting those boys as political bait. Each time one dies JFK puts another notch on his belt for he knows he is that much closer to the prize.


    Into the mind of a mad man!

    From Jihad Watch.org as reported by newsmax

    http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/001478.php

    In an interview broadcast Wednesday morning, Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry defended terrorist Shiite imam Moqtada al-Sadr as a "legitimate voice" in Iraq, despite that fact that he's led an uprising that has killed nearly 20 American GIs in the last two days.

    Speaking of al-Sadr's newspaper, which was shut down by coalition forces last week after it urged violence against U.S. troops, Kerry complained to National Public Radio, "They shut a newspaper that belongs to a legitimate voice in Iraq."
     
  16. JM Anthony

    JM Anthony Child of the 60's DBSTalk Gold Club

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    You must be watching some news sources that I've missed. Either that or your perceptions of what people are saying are different from mine. I've never heard Kerry, other Dems, or the media flaunting the tragic loss of our brave combat forces.

    In terms of the tragic loss of lives, one of the things I find most troubling is how hard Bush seems to have worked so long to avoid any contacts with the memorial services. Nice touch. Another nice touch was his press conference tonight. I'll sleep a lot better knowing he's our Commander in Chief.
     
  17. RichW

    RichW Hall Of Fame/Supporter DBSTalk Gold Club

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    "Seems to have struck a nerve the truth often times does that."

    You have struck a nerve alright, but its far from the truth. You are just being a jerk!

    I am done with you, you WPOS!
     
  18. Stosh

    Stosh Godfather

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    Dec 16, 2003
    freakmonkey has said many ridiculous things here, but this tops them all. First he lumps everyone that disagrees with him into one like-minded group ("you people"), then he invents an absurd idea that they all hold, and bases his responses on his fantasies. This says a lot more about him than anyone else that has expressed a view different from his. There is no arguing with a True Believer; their blinders conveniently keep them from having to face anything that may require them to actually think.

    I felt sad when I read that comment above. It means freakmonkey really doesn't know what patriotism is, and that he is incapable of listening to other views. There is no use in arguing with him further - there are none so blind as those who will not see.
     
  19. Bogy

    Bogy Hall Of Fame

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    Mar 23, 2002
    From the Forum Rules:
    What you have stated above is not "the truth", it is your personal opinion, and it is a personal opinion that serves the purpose of spewing hateful venom and certainly does not show respect for others here. Not only is your statement your personal opinion, it is also an evil lie. To say anything else is to further deny the truth. You owe a lot of people an apology.
     
  20. jonstad

    jonstad Hall Of Fame

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    Jun 27, 2002
    I shouldn't even dignify your earlier slander with a reply. Suffice it to say there are no cheers, or cheer, from me at sight of the conflicts in Iraq, not the charred bodies hung from a bridge, not the RPGs fired by insurgents, not the tank, rocket and small arms fire ricocheting off mosques and apartment blocks, and not widows whose husbands will never return or sisters whose sibling and twin will not either. It literally makes me sick to my stomach. I force myself to watch because I will not ignore it. I do try to avoid watching with others because the inner-macho in me still is embarrassed to tear-up or have my voice crack in public.

    And we don't see any of the Iraqi casualties in US media. I guess the "liberal" press deems them unimportant or not newsworthy. Besides, one is likely to be labeled as traitor or giving aid and comfort to the enemy to report on that reality. Or maybe they feel it's just counterproductive to the war effort?

    Here's some numbers. At least someone is trying to keep count even though the administration prefers nobody would. http://iraqbodycount.net
    Current estimates are 8-10 thousand BTW.

    Really? It looked to me the current "uprising" was a direct result of closing "al-Sadr's newspaper, which was shut down by coalition forces last week" and issuing a warrant for his arrest on murder charges.

    The whole idea of "free speech and the press" is to protect speech that is unpopular or which you don't agree with. Even Herman Goerring was in favor of free speech for "speech" he agreed with. It's significant that al-Sadr is a Shiite. And until we decided to shut down his paper because it "urged violence against U.S. troops", the Shiite section of Iraqi society had been fairly peaceful and cooperative with the coalition. So even if al-Sadr WAS advocating violence against the coalition, most Shia were ignoring or dismissing it. They are no longer. Now we must not only deal with the Sunni triangle, we've pissed off the Shiite south, the largest, and up 'til now fairly pacifist section or Iraqi society. Once again, this tactless, bumbling administration has cut off its nose to spite its face. We've transformed a marginal Shiite mullah with a modicum of followers into a potential martyr. And there's NOTHING the Shia love more then a martyr.

    As for the murder charges. AFAIK, there are little police investigative powers(little police actually) and NO civil judicial system in Iraq yet. What was the rush to arrest this mug for murder? Because of our actions, we have elevated this bearded midget far beyond what he was capable of acheiving on his lonesome, given the majority Shia the idea they too are targets of the coalition(up 'til now they were satisfied we were just after the Sunnis), and spread serious doubts as to the "freedoms" we intend to "liberate" them to, at least in the areas of speech and press. Here what one of our brilliant generals had to say about freedom of information in Iraq.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2004/04/12/i...200&partner=GOOGLE&pagewanted=print&position=

    A poll posted elsewhere on this forum indicated 25% trust in the coalition, lower then an other institution listed. Bush, Bremmer, and the Interim Authority have just handed that 25% ample reason to reconsider. Way to go guys. As if things weren't tough enough already.
     
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