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Audio dropouts?

Discussion in 'DIRECTV General Discussion' started by BKC, Nov 7, 2009.

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  1. Mar 26, 2010 #621 of 1365
    BKC

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    What's so funny? If you've followed his postings on this you would already know. He's covered it isn't DTV's fault, it's not software, it's the hard drive, it's the stations, Speed has been doing it for over a year so I'm wrong that mine started in Oct, the birrps have turned into audio drops, it's your audio equipment, it can't be the Oct. update, it started at the same time double play started, it's DTV's responsibility but may not be their problem, the software update may go to the encoder, turn off your DD. (I'm sure I've missed a bunch too)

    Get the picture? Throw enough things out there and sooner or later...... If VOS knows by all means he should let DTV in on it.

    What have I done? About a zillion emails and phone calls with DTV and shared about everything possible except my wife with them.

    Do you have a background in this? Yes, I have friggin audio dropouts for five months..... :lol:

    Don't get me wrong, I know VoS wants to be the one that discovers the cure and he wants to appear he knows what could be wrong but it boils down to he doesn't anymore than I do. What it could be doesn't cure the problem or the frustration.

    So, how long before this post gets removed or the thread closed? :D
     
  2. Mar 26, 2010 #622 of 1365
    veryoldschool

    veryoldschool Lifetime Achiever Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    If we stay civil it won't.
    Now as I've posted there are several problems that all end up being audio dropouts.
    Once you peel all of them down to what you can't do anything about, these are what are from the program provider and/or how the MPEG-4 encoders handle the corrupted bits in the audio/Dolby encoding.
    To say that every post in this thread comes down to only one problem isn't doing anybody a service, "IF" you actually read what they are and have the brains/where with all to to look at the trends/symptoms.

    I joined this thread late and fought with you to get you to realize where the problem was, but instead you've been the only one that "doesn't get it" and feels it the software in the receiver, even though there has been over a dozen versions under test and several different receivers, all running different software [DVR & non DVR] and the problem pre-dated the first time you found it, but hey you seem to be totally fix in your mind, which I can't help you with, so I'll post for others and continue to help them if I can.
     
  3. Mar 27, 2010 #623 of 1365
    JeffBowser

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    It would do you well to grant VOS a level of respect.

     
  4. Mar 27, 2010 #624 of 1365
    JeffBowser

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    Sony, here. Two since this issue started, and my newer one vastly changed the nature of the problem to nearly (but not quite) unnoticeable.

     
  5. Mar 27, 2010 #625 of 1365
    BKC

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    I don't get it? lol I just listed all the things you thought it was/is and I agree with you, it could be any one of those things but it could be something else too. The fact remains it came with the Oct update and got much better (for me anyway and you also told me and others there was no fix in this update) with the last update but it's still not fully repaired.

    Now if you would quit quoting me and more or less telling me I don't know wtf is going on with MY receiver in MY house I wouldn't be inclined to answer you. :) The people I've talked to at DTV seem to believe it's with the software and it will be repaired with an update. Now either they're blowing smoke which is entirely possible or........ :D

    Sometimes it's just best to say DTV is working on the problem than to throw out a thousand things it could be and none of which the end user can do anything about.
     
  6. Mar 27, 2010 #626 of 1365
    BKC

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    I have probably shown him more respect than he has me. I have never once told him he didn't know what he was seeing on his receiver in his house. We just disagree it's not a big deal. :lol:
     
  7. Mar 27, 2010 #627 of 1365
    garygaryj

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    Lots of audio drop-outs on a local Fox channel for me, but limited to the one channel.
     
  8. Mar 27, 2010 #628 of 1365
    veryoldschool

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    So with 628 posts here what has been posted:

    1. Those using AVRs seem to have more or longer lasting problems.
    2. Turning Dolby off [sucks] can reduce these.
    3. It seems to be only with HD channels.
      1. OTA is MPEG-2, which would mean it's either from the station or in the receiver, be it a hardware problem or the software.
      2. SAT feeds are MPEG-2 converted to MPEG-4, which adds another encoder, which is known to have issues.
      3. There are known/common channels that seem to have these problems more than others. SpeedTV, ESPN, National Geographic, TNT, to name just a few, but not all SAT channels seem to be the same. This would be hard to say these are the receiver's hardware or software, since it happens [at least here] with any HD receiver, running any software, be it a DVR or not and is only on "some" channels. How could some not have the problem and others have it and it still be a hardware/software problem?
    4. Some have had these problems with recordings or while in the live buffer, but not have these while watching "live TV". This would seem to be in the receiver and since it's not wide spread would seem to be the hardware [most likely a hard drive type problem].
    These may not be all of them but seem to be the ones that have been posted the most.
    The MPEG-4 encoders have been an ongoing problem, where they first would brriipp and now seem to have had a firmware update that blanks this [audio dropout]. From what I've seen, first they had problems syncing the audio with the video, then they "fixed" this and we had Briipps as the encoder would break lock, since the audio is how the video is kept in sync. Any missing or corrupted bit in the audio may not be noticed in the MPEG-2 feed, but causes the transcoding to MPEG-4 to glitch. This "glitch" sometimes will have a glitch in the video as well, since the encoder has to reset.
    The latest "fix" to the encoders seems to now blank out the brriipps.
    This is what I've seen over the past two years.
    There is very little we can do about problems in the SAT feed, other than letting DirecTV know which channels and when this is happening.
    CSRs aren't geared to help with this very much. The best I've been able to get them to do is to send an email to the network broadcast center, but their response normally is to wait until there are "X number" of these to look into it. I have gone down this path for months with my locals and never got anywhere, so I emailed ellen.filipiak@directv.com VP of customer services. Of course she didn't reply, but I did get a phone call from someone under her. It took several conversations before Ellen got involved and sent out a team to verify my system and have me show them recordings of the problems. This team agreed it has nothing to do with my system/hardware or software. This was when I got to talk directly to an engineer in the broadcast center to did explain what was happening with the MPEG-4 encoders. This took several months to happen and I'm posting this so others don't have to go through this themselves.

    In a "perfect world", each MPEG-2 feed would have zero errors and every MPEG-4 encoder would have zero problems.
    The real world isn't perfect, so the source of the problems can be from the MPEG-2 provider [as my own local station engineer has admitted was on their end] or that the MPEG-4 encoders isn't handling the MPEG-2 conversion properly.
    In an "ideal world" the manufacturer of the MPEG-4 encoders would make them tolerant to everything the MPEG-2 provider supplied.
     
  9. Mar 27, 2010 #629 of 1365
    BKC

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    Here is what the deal is with mine again

    1. Dropouts happen with or without sound system. With or without TOSlink
    2. Turning off DD has no affect on the dropouts on my receiver.
    3. Running my one local channel through the receiver I have way more dropouts than watching it without going through the HR-20
    4. Dropouts are there either live or recorded, every one can be repeated.
    5. Even after the last update making the dropouts better I have at least 10-20 times more dropouts than I ever had birrps.
    6. Some people have them and some don't. :D
     
  10. Mar 27, 2010 #630 of 1365
    veryoldschool

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    Everything you've posted seems to match what I've been posting, but #3 is interesting. It's a local which would be unique to your market.
    You say you have less dropouts by not using the HR20, but then you do have them, so these are from the OTA MPEG-2 feed to your TV? This would point to these being from the station, correct? [please correct me if this is wrong]. Now when you use the HR20, is this with the OTA tuner, or through the local SAT MPEG-4 HD feed? If the MPEG-4, then [again] this is right in line with what I've posted.
    Now if this was using the HR20 OTA tuner, it would still be MPEG-2, so it wouldn't be the MPEG-4 encoder, but either the crappy OTA tuner in the HR20 [these haven't ever been as good as the 5th gen Digital tuners], or that there is some bug in the software that could be improved.
     
  11. Mar 27, 2010 #631 of 1365
    Dazed & Confused

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    I've never been accused of being the most observant person around, but I didn't realize there was an audio dropout problem until just perusing this thread. I remember the dreaded bripppp being unbearable at times, but they just sort of went away. I certainly won't say I have zero dropouts, but I can say I have never noticed it as a problem. I am probably going to regret reading this thread, because now That I know about them they will start driving me crazy. :lol:

    I will be paying attention, and report back if I actually have the dropouts. I have an HR20-100 connected by TOSlink to an older Sony receiver (STR-DB1070), and an HR22-100 hooked directly to the TV via HDMI. I honestly haven't noticed a problem with either setup.
     
  12. Mar 27, 2010 #632 of 1365
    BKC

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    Trust me on this, you would know it if you had them. :lol:
     
  13. Mar 28, 2010 #633 of 1365
    txfeinbergs

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    Well, I had an audio drop out on Spartacus at the 42 minute mark during the Party Favor episode with my Onkyo receiver. I had also recorded it upstairs. Upstairs I have a Sony receiver and there was no audio drop. Of course, to truly rule things out such as house wiring and the HD-DVR itself, I really need to take the downstairs receiver upstairs and run it through the Sony receiver to see if there is an audio drop-out - I am just not that motivated.
     
  14. Mar 28, 2010 #634 of 1365
    txfeinbergs

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    After thinking about it some more, I am pretty much down to the problem being inside the DirecTV receiver, or the Audio Receiver. The problem is:

    A. Definitely within my house and not the network
    B. The problem is not with the wiring or dish because certain channels work fine downstairs whereas other channels are more problematic (but only on the downstairs receiver). (both of my DirecTV receivers are HR21-100's).

    Interesting observances: most of us coming to this thread have Onkyo receivers.

    Once I get another program with audio issues recorded on both receivers, if the upstairs receiver does not exhibit the problem, I will move it downstairs and see if the problem is noticed. If yes, the problem is the Onkyo. If no, there is something wrong with my downstairs HR21-100 and I will call for a replacement.
     
  15. Mar 28, 2010 #635 of 1365
    veryoldschool

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    HBO The Pacific part 4, recorded from the first airing.
    As with last week's episode, there were audio dropouts/loss of Dolby 5.1.
    14 of them during the 1 hour show, on my new HR24.
    Some were slightly longer/larger than others, but I watched my Sony receiver lose 5.1 at a given rate/time. So much so that I could wait and watch for them to come. At first they seemed to be every 5 mins, but by the 1:00 mark, with 14, this was refined to every 4.28 mins.
     
  16. Mar 29, 2010 #636 of 1365
    Coca Cola Kid

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    I've been having audio dropouts on Animal Planet for the last week. :mad:
     
  17. Mar 29, 2010 #637 of 1365
    njfoses

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    Same here.
     
  18. Mar 29, 2010 #638 of 1365
    vthokies1996

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    I don't think it is the Audio Receiver. When I lost all sound on my Onkyo the PCM light was lit up. It is never lit up. I had 2 shows recording so I did all the trouble shooting I could without turning off the box.

    I had no problem receiving sound on my Blu-Ray player which is hooked up to the other HDMI input.

    I switched HDMI cables.

    I hooked up the Directv receiver to the input that the Blu-Ray player was using.

    I switched the sound to come thru optical audio instead of HDMI.

    I finally did a facotry reset on the Onkyo receiver.

    None of the steps I took fixed the problem.

    The sound didn't return until I did a red-button reset of the Directv receiver. After it rebooted, the sound immediately came back. I even had sound for the shows that were recording while the sound was out.
     
  19. Mar 30, 2010 #639 of 1365
    hdtvluvr

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    You are ahead of me somehow. Part 3 was broadcast on HBO Sunday night at my house.

    Anyway, I didn't have any audio or video problems from the recording. Using a Yamaha receiver and HR20-700 with optical for sound.

    However, I did have a problem with Cold Case (recorded OTA). I had video /audio skips/freezes all during the show. I could hear the hard drive chatter.

    I do have some recordings that have audio issues and no video issues but there aren't many.

    I also had the problem that others had last week where they turned everything on and none of the MPEG4 HD channels had sound. It took a reset to get it back.

    Oh, this HR20 was a replacement (about 4 - 6 weeks ago) since what it replaced was doing the same thing. All D* wanted to do when I called was replace the unit.

    I've thought about getting an external drive but there doesn't appear to be a consensus on which drive/enclosure always works on the HR20. Also those that have externals are seeing the same issues I have. Therefore, I don't know if it is the signal (D* and OTA), firmware, hardware (power supply, etc.) or hard drive.

    BTW, I have another HR20 in the house that is connected to a Sony soundbar using HDMI (still DD). Wife watches recordings on it and she hasn't noticed any audio/video problems.

    Both HR20's record approx the same number of hours of material especially now with MRV. I got the HR20's at the same time but as stated above got the one in our theater as a replacement recently.
     
  20. Mar 30, 2010 #640 of 1365
    veryoldschool

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    You're right. I don't know why I thought it was pt 4.
    I watched pt 1 with HDMI to my TV.
    During pt 2 I started noticing what I thought were dropouts, still with HDMI, and changed over to the Sony AVR, which did show that there were dropouts.
    Pt 3 I used the AVR for the whole show and was able to monitor/time them better.
     
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