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Audio Inconsistency

Discussion in 'General DISH™ Discussion' started by Blowgun, Apr 2, 2011.

  1. Apr 2, 2011 #1 of 16
    Blowgun

    Blowgun DHMO User

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    Hello,

    The audio levels for the premium channels are atrocious. Not only are the audio levels inconsistent between different companies, they are inconsistent from within the same company. Also, something else that was brought to my attention was the audio levels between the SD and HD channels. Apparently some receivers have some sort of possible Dynamic Range squishing limiter function, and that's wonderful if you have that option and the resulting sound quality is acceptable to you. However, why aren't the wildly different audio levels controlled better before the sound ever reaches the customer?

    In addition, far too often I've seen at the beginning of a premium channel movie that it will be presented with Dolby Digital 5.1 audio, only to find out it's not. Yet, inconsistently a movie will be presented with DD5.1 audio, so apparently the capability is there. It's not only the premium channels, but other channels, including locals, which should be, but are not presented with DD5.1 audio. Since audio plays such an intricate part of the experience and on a completely digital system like DISH, why, when DD5.1 is available, is DISH not providing the content with DD5.1 audio?

    Thanks.
     
  2. Apr 2, 2011 #2 of 16
    Wilf

    Wilf Legend

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    How do you know it's Dish's fault?
     
  3. Apr 2, 2011 #3 of 16
    Blowgun

    Blowgun DHMO User

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    DISH is who I do business with.
     
  4. Apr 2, 2011 #4 of 16
    klang

    klang Hall Of Fame

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    Perhaps Dish is just passing along what is provided to them?
     
  5. Apr 2, 2011 #5 of 16
    CCarncross

    CCarncross Hall Of Fame

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    Dish, like Direct, only passes on what is provided to them by the stations themselves. They are not able to provide DD5.1 audio for a station that is not providing it to them. On another note, myself, and many of my fellow DBS'ers, do not want them to touch the audio in any way as it may adversely affect the audio quality. The real issue here is that the stations themselves need to provide more consistent audio to the providers, so in essence you are barking up the wrong tree.
     
  6. Apr 2, 2011 #6 of 16
    Blowgun

    Blowgun DHMO User

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    Then who is HBO, Showtime, Starz, etc., providing their DD5.1 audio to? Which audience, which service, is getting that feed? It sure isn't consistently DISH. What about the local channels which are sending DD5.1 audio OTA, which DISH scoops up and sends back over the Internet to Cheyenne or wherever?

    Now I could understand if there is limited bandwidth issue at play here and that there's some sort of shared rotation of space taking place, which allows a handful of movies presented in DD5.1 audio to reach my receiver. Perhaps a contract that prevents DISH from providing DD5.1 on a consistent basis. Of course I'm guessing, but the DD5.1 audio is there and every once in awhile it's allow through.

    The audio quality is already adversely affected. What you probably mean is that you don't want it to get any worse.

    If a newly purchased carton of milk is half empty, I don't blame the cow. :)
     
  7. Apr 2, 2011 #7 of 16
    scooper

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    If it's that much of a concern - I think dishquality@dishnetwork.com is where you need to send an email to.

    But I honestly think that the problem is all the different content providers are not using the same settings in their programming (see "DialNorm" , etc.).
     
  8. Apr 2, 2011 #8 of 16
    Blowgun

    Blowgun DHMO User

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    Eventually I had planned to possibly do that, but wanted to see if DISH IRT would offer any assistance first or that others had an idea why these audio issues exist with DISH. Then if necessary, I could send a better expressed e-mail.

    That could explain the audio level being all over the place. Let me provide a none scientific example to make the point. My receiver uses dB for volume control units. When I compare the audio levels between HBO-E (300) and HBO2E (301), 300 is set to 31.5 dB and 301 to 45dB to get nearly the same volume level. That makes channel 300 nearly 5 times lower. Definitely not a small difference.

    Now imagine watching a recording on channel 300 at night and falling asleep and when the receiver switches back to LIVE mode, if that channel happens to be 301, the whole house shakes and people get upset for being woken up.

    However, the DD5.1 audio is a different matter. Channels that ARE providing DD5.1 audio are not always available with DD5.1 on DISH. Do you have any idea why a channel would say, and I'm paraphrasing, that 'the following programming is in DD5.1' and when it comes to DISH that is not always the case? Like I said, some are, most aren't. Unless I'm not seeing the pattern.
     
  9. Apr 2, 2011 #9 of 16
    CCarncross

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    To put this into perspective, these audio inconsistencies exist with all providers, so again that points toward the broadcasters(HBO, etc.), not the providers(Dish, Direct, Comcast, etc..)
     
  10. Blowgun

    Blowgun DHMO User

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    So you're saying that the feed that DISH receives from HBO is the same feed that is provided to Direct, Comcast, etc. IF that's the case, again, then who is HBO, Showtime, Starz, etc., providing their DD5.1 audio to? Which audience, which service, is getting that feed on a consistent basis?
     
  11. Wilf

    Wilf Legend

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    I subscribe only to locals and HBO. I have not noticed the "inconsistencies" you talk about. I do have a 5.1 setup, but I am not a fan of what Dolby does to the sound.
     
  12. gtal98

    gtal98 Godfather

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    What receiver do you have? Is it connected to your home theater receiver by HDMI or toslink (optical)? Do you have your Dish receiver set to output Dolby Digital or just PCM?
     
  13. Blowgun

    Blowgun DHMO User

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    With the exception of the difference in the audio level between SD and HD which I can't attest to as it was brought to my attention, the difference between the premium's audio levels (see example in previous post) and the somewhat randomness of DD5.1, do happen here.

    Were you always "not a fan" of Dolby? The reason why I ask is because apparently select DISH receivers have a sound limiter and perhaps your opinion of Dolby sound is based on that option being enabled. This might also explain why you don't notice the inconsistencies.

    The DISH receiver is a 508 and it's connected to a Denon AVR using a TOSLINK cable. The 508's external decoder setting is set to Dolby Digital/PCM. Since I do get random DD5.1 audio from only the premium channels (otherwise the audio is DD2.0 (and that's true for nearly all of the channels that are available on DISH's AEP)), it appears to be setup correctly.
     
  14. Stewart Vernon

    Stewart Vernon Roving Reporter Staff Member Super Moderator DBSTalk Club

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    HBO, for example, has an HD feed and an SD feed.

    I believe most of the time the HD feed has 5.1 surround, though there are sometimes perhaps when an older movie is on that it is only 2.0.

    The SD feed, however, does not always have 5.1... even when the HD feed does.

    But HBO has the same bump before the movie that says "5.1 where available" and in some cases that means the HD feed has the 5.1 and the SD does not.

    Perhaps HBO should be clearer about that... but I think that might explain the "randomness" you are talking about.
     
  15. scooper

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    Dolby Digital depends on both your equipment being able to handle it AND the source material (program) being in DD.

    By definition - just about all HD programming should be in DD5.1. At worst - you will see DD2.0 when the source wasn't in 5.1 .

    For Dish in SD - (like with the OP's 508) - DD5.1 will be limited to Premium channels and PPV movies. Most other SD channels will come out in PCM digital stereo, and you may find some of those have Dolby Pro Logic encoded on that, depending on what your A/V receiver is capable of.

    And yes - I've seen this on both a 4900 and a 510 (both TOSlink / DD capable).

    Volume levels are another matter, however. usually depending on what the channel provider is sending.
     
  16. Wilf

    Wilf Legend

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    I am not a fan of Dolby because of the compression artifacts. Mostly, because I hear three discrete speakers in front. I have read that Dolby compression removes the phasing information, which results in this. I will take a well recorded CD any day, that give a more of a "wall-of-sound experience."
     

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